Which striking feat is better? Thor (MCU)or Zod (DCEU)

lol it the People trying to Lowball the Feat by saying "oh its Lightning" anyway Thor by Light year

@jayc1324:

It's mind baffling. 'The shockwave is just thunder' LMFAO! Are you flipping shitting me?!

Zod’s tbh

I could literally say Thor's strikes producing shockwaves is solely because of the lightning behind it and show every instant a shockwave was produced and show the lightning being involved and then ask why shouldn't I think lightning's properties has something to do with it. That is my burden of proof and I can/have presented it.

Your refutations don't align for reasons I've already stated.

If your claim is that Thor producing shockwaves is of his own power, then that burden of proof is on you. So, you're the one that needs to prove it.

I wanna ask, if we remove the shockwave and lightning from all of Thor's strikes that has had one, what would be the difference in the effect on the intended target and not the surrounding area?

@batman242: that ice bridge in jotunheim won't crumble, sokovia remains intact, no shock wave in the arena

Thor, shockwave was present and the damage from the attack being blocked (seemingly partly absorbed) was much greater. Although to be fair Superman took most if the impact force from Zods.

"Can you show at least one instance of Thor producing a shockwave without lightning involved?"

"How and why does lightning amp the potential force of a strike when it's actual properties naturally produce shockwaves and possibly even explosions".

The only answers I recall getting pertained to the lightning not being natural, therefore different, to which I drew the conclusion that it must be much less hot than natural lightning and has less pressure.

@batman242: Really? I gave you more then one example of why it's not lightning that makes the shockwaves, you even went so far as to say you "partly agree" sure lightning might help in some minimal form but it's not the cause altogether, the strike was still more impressive regardless. So again, Thor hits harder when his hammer is imbued with lightning, this has always been the case, that's why there's shockwaves when he strikes with his lightning covered hammer. like I said be he shrouds it for a reason and it's not for the special affects.

Thor

Why do you think Thor shrouds his hammer in lightning sometimes and not others? It amplifys it's power, there are feats and circumstances that back this up.

This is the exact statement I said I agree to to some degree. When I said that I agree I meant that that's the obvious part, but it gets hazy as to how/why it amplifies power. Why can't we think that it's just explosive force from the sudden pressure caused by collision and propagated even more so due to the force of the strike itself?

How I look at it, I think Thor's fist or Mjolnir once lightning charged could just be a bomb ready to explode and produces a shockwave because of it.

Here, here.

@batman242: I could literally say Thor's strikes producing shockwaves is solely because of the lightning behind it and show every instant a shockwave was produced and show the lightning being involved and then ask why shouldn't I think lightning's properties has something to do with it. That is my burden of proof and I can/have presented it.

You could say that sure, but you'd be wrong. Seeing as Thor's lightning dosn't produce shockwaves. It certainly doesn't produce them on the scale of the Arena strike of the Malekith strike. See the Avengers lightning bolt as evidence.

Your refutations don't align for reasons I've already stated.

Except they do.

If your claim is that Thor producing shockwaves is of his own power, then that burden of proof is on you. So, you're the one that needs to prove it.

I already did. Thor's lightning doesn't produce shockwaves. See the Avengers lightning bolt for evidence, or hell see the one he hit Hela with. No shockwave in either of his two largest lightning bolts, ones far more massive and powerful than the ones he generates in his melee strikes. We see his lightning not producing shockwaves. Therefor his lightning doesn't produce shockwaves. Full stop. End of discussion.

@batman242: If that's what you think it does, then ok, think that, maybe that's what the writers intend. One things for sure though, he hits harder when his lightning is shrouded in lightning, fact. Trying to take away from it simply because of the lightning will not get you anywhere here. I'm not saying your totally wrong, because you have a point, it's just more or less a lost cause running around debating people about it.

Who knows? Maybe.

Trying to take away from it simply because of the lightning will not get you anywhere here.

This is the problem I have. I'm being repeatedly accused of this when I'm giving points that show as inconsistencies in the film and even some consistencies.

it's just more or less a lost cause running around debating people about it.

I agree, but I'd at least appreciate not being called bias or being told that I'm actively trying to downplay a feat.

@paragonnate: Full stop. End of discussion.

You've said this multiple times in more than one thread, yet we're still here discussing.......

Why can't we think that it's just explosive force from the sudden pressure caused by collision and propagated even more so due to the force of the strike itself?

@batman242: Thor's Lightning doesn't produce shockwaves (at least no visible ones) naturally and natural lightning doesn't produce pressure waves very similar to Thor's.

Plus the writers are obviously trying to show the power of the strike which is why not all of Thor's lightning amped attacks produce shockwaves. He doesn't hit the berserkers as hard as he hit the Hulk and therefore he doesn't produce shockwaves.

@batman242: As someone who is actively called biased just for having an opposing views, I understand. To be fair, when first hearing it, it sounds like you're just trying to take away from the feats, however there is science and a measure of consistent showings that support it. Although I don't think in most cases it's enough to say that his striking is lower then another because of it, again, just by what's presented.

Sorry for my initial attack, you had a point, it just seemed like a desperate reach at face value.

What do you mean not hit as hard? How does lightning amplify the physical force of a strike?

Force is mass x acceleration. Lightning doesn't add to any of those factors.

@batman242: How does lightning generate suits of armor? Thor's lightning is a visual representation of increased power in his strikes also force doesn't work that easily in fiction if it did all of Hulk's punches would be like supersonic.

@batman242: whether or not lightning amps his strike is irrelevant. It is a part of his strike.

It is within his power.

@americanspeeddemon: How does lightning generate suits of armor?

I'm not sure I quite understand the question. Are you asking how does it generate power to a suit of armor? As in the instance where it powered Tony's suit? If so, it gave a boost in power capacity. Lightning after all is electricity. If this wasn't what you meant, then I'm lost.

force doesn't work that easily in fiction if it did all of Hulk's punches would be like supersonic.

Hulk's body mas changes and he'd at least be able to move his arms faster. Lightning does none of this to factor into adding sheer force to a strike. This is why I'm trying to understand it.

Yes, I never said that it doesn't amp the strike. I'm asking "how does it."

It's all good. I think calling someone bias on a forum where we can all get familiar with each other can be counter-productive. Eventually other people will cling to the same belief.

It's real funny, because I never outright said that Zod's strike was better, just trying to truly understand the power behind Thor's.

The same way Thanos or Silver Surfer charge their punches with cosmic energy, or Goku and Freeza charge their punches with ki energy.

Now I really want Thanos to punch with cosmic energy

@apex_pretador: Doesn't really answer the question at hand. Are any of those forms of energy adding sheer force to a strike?

Thor stomps.

Most likely yes, because otherwise they won't do that

Zod's uppercuts > MCU/DCEU

@batman242: Thor uses his lightning to create his armor. Though tbf the shockwave of lightning is pretty minimal i mean one of the theories for the unique scarring of individuals struck by lightning is that the pressure wave bursted capillaries. Thor's shockwaves are way way way like hundreds of times more powerful.

Also Hulks hand probably weighs what like 20-25 pounds at most to generate enough force to stop a 6,000 ton object he'd need to swing his arm at absurd speed.

Now to original question; how?

You can't get an answer to everything. It has just been like that since forever in almost all forms of fiction - energy amps strikes.

If I had to explain - Let's say 10 J = Energy of the unamped strike, and 10 J = Energy which is used to ampstrike, then total energy behind the strike = 20 J

Consdering that Thor didn't do that feat all by himself. I'd say Zod.

Thor

The reason Zod's punch didn't create a shock-wave is because Superman's body took all the damn force, and it sent him flying away "the distance of a Skyscraper" through reinforced concrete. It would've created a larger shock-wave had Superman blocked it with an equal amount of force (this is what happened when Superman punched Zod, later). However, Thor strike on the other hand was blocked by Malekith hence why it caused a powerful shock-wave, Malekith body didn't take the entire force of Thor's strike so it was disrupted around them, breaking curbstone in the process, which is far lesser than breaking reinforced concrete "one of the vital components that make up Skyscrapers". My answer is still Zod.

@thebestofthebest: the only time zod and superman created notable shockwaves was when they were bullrushing towards each other, supes blocked one of zods punches and that never made a shockwave like thors strike on malekith

@darkseidthanos Good for you. Superman/Zod physicality still outclass Thor's by infinite miles.

@thebestofthebest: I dont see the relevance of that in this thread, you answered the thread question and from a logical stand point I proved you wrong, then you say good for me and you just choose to shoot your wank all over, what's wrong with you?

Well that escalated quickly. Maybe it is because I have no interest in arguing with you ?

Edit: Nice, editing your post.

you answered the thread question and from a logical stand point I proved you wrong,

Hardly.

@thebestofthebest: escalated to what? You seem to be a very hostile person, I apologize for proving you wrong

Your definition of "hostile" is quite odd. I simply have no interest in arguing with you, how's that considered "hostile" ?

I apologize for proving you wrong

Why apologize for something you didn't do ?

@thebestofthebest: this seems like an altercation over fictional characters rather than a debate over them so I'm done here, what you originally said was wrong tho cause supes blocked one of zods attacks and it didn't create a shockwave, and yes supes out classes Thor, I don't know why you found the need to say that tho

@darkseidthanos: this seems like an altercation over fictional characters rather than a debate over them so I'm done here

What part of "I have no interest in arguing with you" you don't understand ? But hey since you want to debate so badly, let me give you the satisfaction:

what you originally said was wrong tho cause supes blocked one of zods attacks and it didn't create a shockwave,

Isn't it obvious ? The punch in the OP was clearly more powerful than the said ones. Plus, few seconds later, the results of Superman punching Zod destroyed a good portion of the Skyscraper without actually having to touch the Skyscraper. All in all, Superman striking force is measured by the amount of collateral damage he caused while interacting with Zod and other individuals.

and yes supes out classes Thor, I don't know why you found the need to say that tho

Like you said, that's out of topic.

@thebestofthebest: you think I wanna debate with you badly?

Like I said this seems like an altercation over fictional characters so I reserve my right to no longer engage in this

@darkseidthanos: Well then, good talk.