Alright we've got an animated CAV here between The East and The West, and between some of the most iconic series in both hemisphere's. So, which style will reign supreme?
Representing the West and cartoons, the big, the bad, the animated antagonist, DARKSIED!
Monkey D. Luffy, also known as Straw Hat Luffy, Straw Hat, and just Luffy. Luffy leads a crew of pirates called The Straw Hats and is in search of the legendary One Piece, a legendary treasure that contains everything the world has to offer. The treasure was hidden by Gol D. Rodger the father of Luffy's adopted brother Portgas D. Ace (who's the leader of one of the White Beard pirates regiments), Luffy's father was Monkey D. Dragon the revolutionary, greatest rival to the world government, and is the grandson of Monkey D. Garp who's a vice admiral of the marines. Dang, now that's an impressive bloodline, and an insane shadow to overcome. Luckily Luffy has quite the set of feats himself, feats of which will be displayed throughout the debate.
So know you know a bit about Luffy' life and backstory let's get in to his combat prowess.
Powers/ abilities.
The Basics -
Upon eating one of the mystical devil fruits (in this case the Gum Gum fruit) Luffy gained the ability to stretch and have a rubbery anatomy, much like you would see from Mr. Fantastic or Plastic Man. But also, quite different. Luffy can stretch on command like a gooey type substance but he follows the basic laws of how rubber works. He slings his arms back to create tension and then rockets them forward at high velocities. Along with this principle of elasticity he has gained the following powers.
Hypersonic speed levels
Luffy can throw dozens of punches nearly simultaneously.Luffy can intercept mid air bullets. Just so you know, most hand gun bullets travel between mach 1-2.
These feats are accomplishable with in the first arc. So this isn't even coming close to scratching the surface of Luffy's current speed.
Multi-ton strength
One Shotted
This is yet another episode one feat where Luffy is one shotting a creature hundreds of times his won size/ weight.
He does the same against giants...
Enhanced durability (especially towards blunt/ explosive damage)
Bullets do nothingCanon balls do nothing
And any kind of blunt punch will do even less than this.
Haki -
The basic enhanced physicals. Luffy also has what's known as Haki. Haki is much like Ki (dragonball) or Chi/ Qi (ironfist/ Chinese lore) or Chakra (Naruto) etc. It's a kind of energy that people can tap into with training, here's what Luffy can do with these abilities.
Armament Haki
Creates a metal coating around a given part of the body to increase offensive and defensive capabilities
Conquerors Haki
Allows the user to dominate the wills of others. The most common usage in the series so far is knocking those with weak wills unconscious
Sensory Haki
Psudeo spidersense/ precog.
The gears -
The gears are self invented transformations that Luffy can use that give him varying abilities.
Gear second - When Luffy pumps air into his body he achieves Gear Second. Gear second increases Luffy's speed ten fold but can only be used a limited amount of time.
Gear third - Luffy blows a large amount of air into any given part of his body and that body grows massively in size. Unlik gear second he doesn't gain any speed but he massively increases offensive potential.
Summary.
So know you know...
Who Luffy is
What he can do
Some of his lower end feats
The match up.
It's been a while since I have seen the DCAU (but I have seen every episode of each series), i would say it's safe to assume Luffy has a much higher level of durability, speed, and versatility. Damage output and strength are closer, but I'm fully confident in Luffy ftw.
And now I don't want to seem like a jerk but I just wanted to make something clear. When In a CaV and you vote there is gonna need to be some form of elaboration on why you voted. And this is expected from everyone not just newer/ lower post count users.
Again this doesn't mean I think your less capable of making decisions just wanted to make sure Incase you were new. Hope you understand bro! :)
This man...er...dictator needs no introduction. And today, he is here to introduce Luffy to his fist.
Loading Video...
Now let's begin.
Abilities
Darkseid has many abilities, including:
Omega Beam:
His Omega Beam is his most versatile and most famous move. Darkseid shoots lasers out of his eyes that will follow the target it's after. It can go as fast as the Flash, hurt even Superman, and sometimes KILL a person, such as:
Dan Turpin:
Loading Video...
Or even his own henchmen Desaad:
Loading Video...
Super Strength:
Sort of like Bane, except 5 times worse, Darkseid has super strength, which can break Orion's Back:
Loading Video...
And hurt Superman. Don't throw Batman at this guy.
That's really the main stuff in his animated version. His comics version is worse.
Conclusion
There's more coming. But this is just a start at Big D's arsenal.
First of all I would like to get into the feats you have displayed and why/ how Luffy can overcome all of what was shown.
Superiority -
Point #1 The Omega Beam.
His Omega Beam is his most versatile and most famous move.
While yes, the Omega Beam is really all DS can do besides brawl, it really isn't very versatile. It's just a homing energy blast, nothing more, nothing less. This pales in comparison to the incredibly diverse arsenal Luffy has under his belt.
Yes, it has hurt Superman, to some degree, but it never went past a nuisance.
Superman could even hold the beams in his hand and redirect them on to Darksied. Seemingly doing little to the Man of Steel. And this is DCAU Superman, a version of Superman well known for being much weaker than almost any incarnation and a version that doesn't portray him very well.
I mean random Tasers and Anti-air craft missiles have brought him to his knees.
sometimes KILL a person
... Come on man... Really?... That's the omega beams major call to power? Ya, they can kill a random, non super powered, side character. So can just about any attack Luffy chooses to use...
Point #2 Fisticuffs.
Now I think strength is Darksied's greatest advantage here, but I don't think being able to do minimal damage to DCAU Superman is enough to put him on par with Luffy. The most destructive capacity I can recall from DS/ Supes and taking from your video is that they are in the upper skyscraper level (being generous) in terms of punching power. Luffy is even better than this very early on in the story. Especially in G3.
And incase you forgot Luffy can throw these punches MUCH faster than the terribly slow DS.
Winning the battle -
I'm fully confident Luffy will take a solid victory of Darksied simply because he has nearly every conceivable advantage.
Luffy's speed is undoubtedly superior to Darksieds and in G2 I doubt Darksied will be able to stop an all out blitz.
Luffy hits just as hard and in G3 much harder.
Durability wise Luffy Is vastly superior in tanking blunt force, which is pretty much all of which Darksied can dish out.
Luffy is far more versatile with his varying forms, skills, and Haki powers I have yet to dive in too.
The aforementioned Omega Beam is reduced to a non-factor by Luffy's speed and precog.
Game plan: let Luffy do what Luffy does. Brawl it out. And if push comes to shove... Luffy's eyes are covered by the hat... Trust me when I tell you, that's the last thing you want...
That's really the main stuff in his animated version. His comics version is worse.
Too bad, that's all you get bro ;)
@zeezee123 there ya have it bro. Good luck, your gonna need it! Btw you want to respond, then I respond, then you respond to that, then we go to conclusions?
Sure, we've seen Luffy taken hits from left to right, but have you seen what Darkseid has taken!
He's taken things that would make Chuck Norris pee his pants like:
A GIANT EXPLOSION ON BRAINIAC'S SPACE SHIP!
Loading Video...
Can Luffy take that? That's something like DBZ characters could take..maybe.
He also took Superman at his most powerful(not including comics, obviously).
Loading Video...
Feast your eyes, Luffy!
Points
-Luffy's Haki is powerful, sure and it can take down a bunch of people. But Luffy fights almost all normal people. Darkseid can take on groups of superheroes, like Flash, Batman, and Superman. or even the Justice League
-Another obvious flaw is that Luffy is long armed. Darkseid has very good durability, which it will probably just bounce off him at best. Darkseid can sponge hits from Superman at his most powerful for god's sake. And we all know that Superman would kill Luffy.
-Another point you will probably throw in is that Darkseid missed his omega beam against Batman. Sure Darkseid missed his accurate omega beam against the Batman, AKA DC's Chuck Norris, Darkseid was not trying. Also, Batman had to use one of Darkseid's parademons to take the hit so he wouldn't be laser bait.
Loading Video...
Conclusion
Darkseid will take this battle against Monkey here. He is stronger, more durable, and faster and wins in everyway possible.
@zeezee123: I know. My next response won't be up as quickly as my others. I'm gonn ve busy this weekend and I have training/ another match to respond to this week.
@zeezee123: hey man, CV ate one of my posts and I've had some real life stuff to attend to, but I'm back and my response will be up hopefully tomorrow night if not Sunday at the latest
Alright! @zeezee123 I know that this is long since overdue, but I had some technical difficulties and family things that hindered my post consistency. But I'm back now, and better late than never right?! Good. So without further ado, Lets do this thing!...
"This New God see your challenge, straw hat boy."
This just got real...
Overwhelming Superiority.
So I stressed this in the past, but I really don't think it got through to you and so I would like to display Luffy's supremacy and drive it home.
But first there are some things to cover in terms of rebuttals.
Rebuttals/ counterarguments -
Sure, we've seen Luffy taken hits from left to right, but have you seen what Darkseid has taken!
Yes as a matter of fact, as of recently I have seen the entire DCAU! Gotta be honest, some great writing in their.
He's taken things that would make Chuck Norris pee his pants like:
A GIANT EXPLOSION ON BRAINIAC'S SPACE SHIP!
It's not really that large of an explosion to be frank. It's an undefined sized space ship and the explosion is only the size of that ship. The ship wasn't much larger than the Justice Leagues transport ship so I wouldn't say its much bigger than multi (2-3) skyscraper level in surface area? Not that large of an explosion, certainty not his most impressive showing considering he was down for the count for a while after this incident, so he didn't even really "take" that blast because he would've been KOd and lost.
Can Luffy take that? That's something like DBZ characters could take..maybe.
He can, and has tanked (not just survived) far greater
Here we see Luffy get punched through an island resulting in the island collapsing on top of him. (Notice the amount of trees and skyscrapers on the island, its not just a small land form).
I would very much say that this at a bare minimum is on par with Darksied's feat displayed above. But not only is the amount of destruction superior, the condition of Luffy after the fact is better as well. Not only did Luffy remain conscious, but he actually got back up and bested Moria (the giant guy that island busted). As opposed to Darksied getting knocked out.
Secondly, to say a Dragonball Z character couldn't tank this is a laughable statement. DBZ characters are on the level of planet busting and are typically on the Superman+ level (comics Superman), this really isn't relevant to the debate because DBZ is irrelevant here, it's worth noting so people don't upball this feat.
He also took Superman at his most powerful(not including comics, obviously).
It seems you haven't come to terms with the fact that Superman is VASTLY, weaker than his comics counter part, your aware he's weaker, but honestly the amount of decrease between these versions of the characters makes this feat entirely unimpressive. (See above for some of what Superman has got taken out by above). Superman hitting Darksied through a few buildings is hardly comparable to the level of striking power seen by Moria, who as you've seen, was on the island busting level strength.
Feast your eyes, Luffy!
Luffy's unimpressed.
-Luffy's Haki is powerful, sure and it can take down a bunch of people. But Luffy fights almost all normal people. Darkseid can take on groups of superheroes, like Flash, Batman, and Superman. or even the Justice League
This statement if entirely flawed in all regards.
Luffy doesn't fight only normal humans. In all my feats shown Luffy is fighting superhumans and gian creatures, every major villain has superhuman abilities in One Piece. Sure Luffy HAS faced normal humans, but because he has fought normal humans, doesn't take away from the other feats of him facing the actual antagonists.
Peak humans in One Piece are enormously above any real life person or even comics peak humans like Batman.
Sanji kicks a monster (hundreds of times his own mass) dozens of feet into the air.
Normal people in One Piece can have superhuman qualities because logic.
The DCAU Justice League is impressive to take on all at once, he never directly did, and also the animated versions are very similar to the levels of power you would see from various members of the Straw Hat Crew. In reality Superman alone has been more than a match for Darksied.
DS after one of his encounters with Superman in the DCAU.
And we've established that Clark is very underwhelming in this incarnation.
Your above image is only reffering to one stlye of Haki, his other two are far more practical In combat, Precognition, and metal armor that increases damage output and durability. These were entirely unaddressed and it makes me think you just googled haki, saw that image, and assumed things about One Piece and the foes Luffy fights... :/
-Another obvious flaw is that Luffy is long armed. Darkseid has very good durability, which it will probably just bounce off him at best. Darkseid can sponge hits from Superman at his most powerful for god's sake. And we all know that Superman would kill Luffy.
Not sure if long armed is a saying or something, but taking it literally. So how is having long arms a flaw? In real fighting a superior reach is awesome, and here its the same concept, larger range is good.
Saying it will bounce off is a baseless claim. The most amount of offensive power DS has taken, without being KOd, (that you've displayed) was getting punched through a building. See my Fistacuffs section (above) for feats comparable to this, without Haki enhancements. Plus Luffys punches come MUCH faster than Darksied could even react. Seeing as Superman (holding back, because he only used his full power in the skyscraper punc) from the DCAU has bloodied and defeated DS, Luffy will put him down as soon as he gets serious.
I wouldn't say sponge, Superman was kinda overwhelming him, and his record against Clark is pretty bad.
DCAU Superman wouldn't defeat Luffy, and neither will Darksied.
-Another point you will probably throw in is that Darkseid missed his omega beam against Batman. Sure Darkseid missed his accurate omega beam against the Batman, AKA DC's Chuck Norris, Darkseid was not trying. Also, Batman had to use one of Darkseid's parademons to take the hit so he wouldn't be laser bait.
I will say plot had something to do with this, but I still don't think they'd hit Luffy. Superman has been hit by anti air craft rounds in the JLA cartoon, so he isn't nearly on the reaction level of Luffy and Batmans no where close. Also, Luffy has precognition. And the parademon only proves that any random object can be used to trip up the beam and evade it, so any debris can be used in a similar way. Now, going back to an old point, the Omega Beams honestly aren't even that devastating, considering what I've already showed you Superman can deflect them with his hands (see Omega Beam section in my previous post). Luffy's more durable than this version of the man of steel, thus Luffy could do the same and deflect them. You haven't even given any feats of the beams besides them being DS trump card (means nothing) and it can kill a normal human.
Conclusion
Darkseid will take this battle against Monkey here. He is stronger, more durable, and faster and wins in everyway possible.
Based on what logic/ evidence are you making these claims? You've given zero lifting or striking feats as opposed to Luffys skyscraper level punches. Durability feats that pail in comparison to Luffy's. And zero speed feats (honestly Luffy has speed taken in spades, no question about it).
So, now that you've been debunked to kingdom come and back ;p it's time to bring up some new points regarding Luffy's ability to overwhelm Darksied.
Strength/ Speed/ Durability -
Now I have already gone over your own claims on your stats and I have displayed some of Luffy's abilities, but since this is my last opportunity to bring up new points (because your next post will be counters, then ill do a closer and youll do a closer) I figured I would drop it all on the table here and drive home why Darksied is inferior to Luffy in a bare knuckle brawl.
My strength/ speed vs your durability.
I have shown Luffy to be able crush large structures with a single fist, a level of power that has seemingly over whelmed (admittedly not put down immediately) DS. But this merely the tip of the ice berg. Luffy has faced foes of similar physical prowess to someone like DS or Superman.
So here we see a character Aarlong who can stop canon balls (and crush them) with his mouth and survive getting nailed through large buildings. Similair to what you've displayed of DS. But Luffy put him down (without Haki OR the gears) relatively flawlessly.
And with your lack of speed feats Luffys ability to put durable characters down along with his rapid attacks DSs defenses wont hold up for long.
My durability vs your strength/ speed.
Well, Luffy is very resistant to explosives and blunt force (as weve established) and considering all that's been shown I would say in physical combat DS is too slow to tag Luffy especially with his precog. and his Omega Beams can be dodged or just tanked.
Wrap up
Luffy has all physical advantages on lock
Luffy is far more versatile with his wide array of forms, techniques, and powers that Darksied has never encountered
Darkseid is back baby! And he's here to kick some One Piece ass!
Intelligence
Unlike his Marvel counterpart Thanos and your character Luffy, Darkseid is not considered one the most feared dictator just because
he has good combat skills. He is also one of the most intelligent DC characters, alongside Lex Luthor and Batman.
He was able to manipulate Superman, Batman and the Justice League into going after Brainiac, whom he had made an alliance with to kill the Justice League.
Loading Video...
After then, he still had an impact, making Superman and Batman hate each other for quite a while.
Army
Darkseid sometimes likes to rely on his vast Apokolipitian Army to fight his enemies instead of him going himself, like your character does.
His army is SO big, that it required the Justice League and the Legion of Doom to defeat, or at least hold back.
Loading Video...
Now let's look at Luffy.....
*Luffy is just a straw hat pirate that has the ability to make his arms become big. Darkseid has dealt with Plastic Man, who has the same trait luffy has.
*Plus, not even the help of his Straw Hat crew could help him against Darkseid's army.
*Luffy has not shown that much in intelligence, so he can become easily manipulated by Darkseid
*He can also be defeated by Darkseid's telepathy.
Conclusion
With his vast army, higher intelligence, and mental manipulation, Luffy doesn't stand a chance.
Log in to comment