V2 masked ichigo (FKT arc) vs Ulqioria

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Undre

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#1 Undre  Online

R1 Ulqioria first release

R2 Ulqioria second release

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TheVivas

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Unless I’m missing something, Ulquiorra still thrashes him.

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Raziel2014

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#3  Edited By Raziel2014

ulquiora trashes him the same way he did before, the mask after full hollow never got mastered and only dragged ichigo leg due to his own fear when he fought yammy you get a look at it he says that the mask feels heavy.

half reaitsu bankai ichigo with mask was able to injure Yammy while full power ichigo prior was not even able to tickle ulquiorra first form

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Galactic_1000

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Ichigo dies Again

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alextheboss

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Round 1 could go either way, Ulquiorra still schools him round 2.

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ourmanuel

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Round 1 could go either way, Ulquiorra still schools him round 2.

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Senpapi

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Ulquiora both rounds

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Jack_Hart

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Ulquiorra sweeps.

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ovy7

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R1: Ichigo 5-7/10

R2: Ulquiorra still

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SkySanji

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We as in everyone who has debated Undre know why this thread exist.....

Ulquiorra beats him But can't blitz him.

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FaradaySloth

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WorldofRuin6

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Ulq mid diffs R1 and stomps in R2.

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TheVivas

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SkySanji

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@thevivas: Basically Undre and a couple of other Bleach debaters Scale Ulquiorra to being over mach 1000 because he blitzed Ichigo who reacted to Gin's Bankai But here is the problem with scaling Ulq to The Ichigo that reacted to Gin's Bankai, The Ichigo that reacted to Gin's Bankai is more powerful from when he fought Ulq so it makes no sense saying Ulq is at that speed because he blitzed a weaker Ichigo.

To sum it up Undre is using backwards scaling and is trying to use this thread to justify his reasoning, no one's falling for the bait.

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Man_of_Miracles

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#16  Edited By Man_of_Miracles

Ichigo should take R1 and lose R2

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TheVivas

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deactivated-5d5d8c614fa9a

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Where's under at?lol

Ulquiorra beats him But can't blitz him.

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EcoBlitz

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Iirc the ichigo that dropped Yammy wasn’t even fully clothed thus his bankai was even weaker...

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TheEmperor95

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@skysanji: not saying I necessarily agree with undre but he base bankai ichigo reacted to the mach 1000 attack. Even if he got stronger it wouldn't be enough to put his base over his previous vizard form meaning he would still get blitzed by ulquiorra. I don't really see anything wrong with him being that fast though

OT: ichigo gets stomped again

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ourmanuel

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@skysanji said:

@thevivas: Basically Undre and a couple of other Bleach debaters Scale Ulquiorra to being over mach 1000 because he blitzed Ichigo who reacted to Gin's Bankai But here is the problem with scaling Ulq to The Ichigo that reacted to Gin's Bankai, The Ichigo that reacted to Gin's Bankai is more powerful from when he fought Ulq so it makes no sense saying Ulq is at that speed because he blitzed a weaker Ichigo.

That’s not why some people call Ulquiorra Mach 1000...

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SkySanji

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#22  Edited By SkySanji

@theemperor95 said:

@skysanji: not saying I necessarily agree with undre but he base bankai ichigo reacted to the mach 1000 attack.

Had to get the viz translation so there is no refuting what I say anyway, No he didn't.....

He was barely able to Dodge Gin's pre Buto Renjin(Mach 500)without the Use of Aim dodging he even states he's looking at the tip of the blade and acting accordingly.

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And When Gin uses Buto Renjin(Mach 1000 since it double his speed)he puts his mask on:

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Even if he got stronger it wouldn't be enough to put his base over his previous vizard form meaning he would still get blitzed by ulquiorra. I don't really see anything wrong with him being that fast though

Only it would as seen throughout the Grimmjow and Ulquiorra fights where Round 1 Ulquiorra completely fodderizes Ichigo(as seen in the pic in Op) then Round 2 we have this:

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OT: ichigo gets stomped again

Agreed but not through the use of blitzing, Lanza or Cero Oscuras spam should do the trick.

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SkySanji

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@skysanji said:

@thevivas: Basically Undre and a couple of other Bleach debaters Scale Ulquiorra to being over mach 1000 because he blitzed Ichigo who reacted to Gin's Bankai But here is the problem with scaling Ulq to The Ichigo that reacted to Gin's Bankai, The Ichigo that reacted to Gin's Bankai is more powerful from when he fought Ulq so it makes no sense saying Ulq is at that speed because he blitzed a weaker Ichigo.

That’s not why some people call Ulquiorra Mach 1000...

Why is it then?

And just so we are clear I'm not saying Ulq isn't Mach 1000 just that he isn't vastly above that because "he blitzed Ichigo who reacted to Mach 1000"

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ourmanuel

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#24  Edited By ourmanuel

@skysanji said:

Why is it then?

And just so we are clear I'm not saying Ulq isn't Mach 1000 just that he isn't vastly above that because "he blitzed Ichigo who reacted to Mach 1000"

It’s because ulquiorra was blitzing masked ichigo in just his R1.

Normal bankai ichigo reacted to both buto and buto renjin, However he needed to put on his mask to actually counter/avoid buto renjin.

And before you say “he was stronger”, well there isn’t much proof that ichigo‘s bankai actually grew stronger. Only his mask was confirmed to have gotten stronger due to his vasto lorde transformation. And his fight against Gin was right after the ulquiorra fight so it’s not like he got much experience like he normally does.

Even if you say that his bankai grew a bit stronger, it would make no sense for his bankai to have gotten stronger than his former masked form.

Same masked form that ulquiorra lolblitzed.

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Saxz

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V2 ichigo wouldnt get stronger than ulquiora in just under a day without unlocking a new mode or without any sort of training.considering how massively he was getting stomped by ulquiora prior,even if ichigo got stronger.... ulquiora still takes round 1 mid diff and ichigo still gets laughably stomped in round 2

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TheEmperor95

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@skysanji: 1. Ichigo literally dodged the first strike of but renjin without the mask and then puts the mask on. It wasn't even a complete aim dodge since ichigo was surprised by it.

2. Ulquiorra never faced bankai ichigo. Ichigo went straight from shikai to hollow mask bankai. His hollow mask broke and he was exhausted afterwards. It happens every time his mask breaks from the time limit.

3. People have misinterpreted that translation. Ulquiorra didn't shatter his hollow mask with a basic cero. Ichigo at that time couldn't use his hollow mask again so it would break immediately after he tried to use it which is what happened

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SkySanji

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@skysanji: 1. Ichigo literally dodged the first strike of but renjin without the mask and then puts the mask on. It wasn't even a complete aim dodge since ichigo was surprised by it.

>That wasn't Buto Renjin He dodged.....

>By using Aim dodge Gin is literally In a stance to fire it off....

>Ichigo even say's "What's that stance"

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And then he puts his mask on to dodge Buto Renjin

This is Buto Renji by the way.

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2. Ulquiorra never faced bankai ichigo. Ichigo went straight from shikai to hollow mask bankai. His hollow mask broke and he was exhausted afterwards. It happens every time his mask breaks from the time limit.

......

you do realize you are countering your own point, right?

If Ulq fodderized a mask Ichigo and now a regular Bankai Ichigo can fight on par with him what is that telling you?

3. People have misinterpreted that translation. Ulquiorra didn't shatter his hollow mask with a basic cero. Ichigo at that time couldn't use his hollow mask again so it would break immediately after he tried to use it which is what happened.

Headcannon....

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He used the mask again but it shattered from the force of the cero, doesnt change the fact that Ichigo with His mask barely tanked it but then Later without the mask he's fine:

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Ulq even confirms he had his mask on the first time around.

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SkySanji

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#28  Edited By SkySanji

@ourmanuel said:
@skysanji said:

Why is it then?

And just so we are clear I'm not saying Ulq isn't Mach 1000 just that he isn't vastly above that because "he blitzed Ichigo who reacted to Mach 1000"

It’s because ulquiorra was blitzing masked ichigo in just his R1.

Barely Ichigo still had time to fire off a Getsuga point blank to avoid getting his head cut off.

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Granted Ichigo said he couldn't react but the fact that his synapse went off and he fired off a getsuga when Ulq was at point blank range ready to cut his head off shows that Ulq barely blitzed him.

It's even worse when Ichigo's Regular Bankai during the Gin fight is stronger than his Hollowfied mask during the Ulq fight.

Normal bankai ichigo reacted to both buto and buto renjin, However he needed to put on his mask to actually counter/avoid buto renjin.

Using Aim dodge.....

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Hes looking at the tip of Gin's sword and acting accordingly in other words aim dodging he even gets tagged in the very next panel

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And before you say “he was stronger”, well there isn’t much proof that ichigo‘s bankai actually grew stronger. Only his mask was confirmed to have gotten stronger due to his vasto lorde transformation. And his fight against Gin was right after the ulquiorra fight so it’s not like he got much experience like he normally does.

His base gets stronger as well as confirmed by Ulquiorra:

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Next.

Even if you say that his bankai grew a bit stronger, it would make no sense for his bankai to have gotten stronger than his former masked form.

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Next.

Same masked form that ulquiorra lolblitzed.

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deactivated-5c9e122a6bc32

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@ourmanuel: It's the exact reason why Leo and Undre think he's mach 1k.

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TheVivas

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@skysanji: You gotta learn how to stack images together in a row or use spoiler blocks.

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SkySanji

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@thevivas: I do know how to, its just Bleach debaters have selective reading and choose to ignore scans.

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TheEmperor95

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@skysanji: 1. Ichigo moved his entire upper body. He wasnt uneven in a ready stance and was taken off guard. Though this doesnt matter since this isnt the mach 1k attack.

2. I'm talking about their first fight ichigo never used only bankai against ulquiorra. After his mask broke he was fodder before that he was pressuring ulquiorra

3. No it's not headcanon

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/235/11

You can clearly see ichigo trying to put on his mask and it shatters immediately.

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SkySanji

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#33  Edited By SkySanji

@theemperor95 said:

@skysanji: 1. Ichigo moved his entire upper body. He wasnt uneven in a ready stance and was taken off guard. Though this doesnt matter since this isnt the mach 1k attack.

He's looking at his stance and the tip of his sword to dodge at this point you are indenial if you think he legit dodged Gin's attack.

2. I'm talking about their first fight ichigo never used only bankai against ulquiorra. After his mask broke he was fodder before that he was pressuring ulquiorra

I never said he used an unmasked Bankai.

3. No it's not headcanon

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/235/11

You can clearly see ichigo trying to put on his mask and it shatters immediately.

Irrelevant this is during his fight with Grimmjow his first time ever using it of course he'll have trouble trying to put it on again it was premature we see when he gets stronger the mask last longer and he can put it back on again, not only that but it makes no sense for Ichigo to go to Hueco Mundo knowing his mask won't last long as seen with the Grimmjow fight he obviously did some form of training with the mask, also there is Ulquiorra saying he had the mask on twice and he shattered it with Cero confirming he had the mask on via "When you went to block the doom blast (Cero)....That mask appeared again.The transformation was very fast,BUT it shattered right away, didn't it" he's literally telling us Ichigo had the mask on and he did it fast but the Cero shattered the mask there is no refuting it.

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He said in the first scan that it shattered Ichigo's mask has never "Shattered" even with a failed attempt to put it on

Even in the Grimmjow scan it didn't "shatter" it never even formed.

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>Grimmjow fight,the mask doesn't form

>Ulquiorra fight, Ulquiorra says the mask appeared again

>Ulquiorra Said it appears again when he went to block to Cero

>Ulquiorra says it shattered via Ichigo tanking the Cero with his mask on

>Ichigo mask has never shattered unless someone broke it by force

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TheEmperor95

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@skysanji: 1. You have no idea what an aim dodge is. Ichigo wasnt even ready for an attack

2. Right after his fight with dordonii. Dordonii even explains how ichigo is soft for using his mask despite it draining his stamina. Something that only happens when he doesnt have full mastery of his mask.

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/254/15

3. Ichigo used the mask to momentarily block the cero but it shattered because he didn't have control if it again.

4. Ichigo didn't have any time to sit around and train more with his mask because the soul society abandoned orihime so he went to save her. The visoreds even said ichigo wasn't ready yet. Right after his fight he leaves without any further training

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/230/15

5. It's almost like ichigo had a slow progression with his mask and each time he put it on he could use it for longer until he finally mastered it in his final fight with grimmjow.

>doesnt appear in his fight with grimmjow

>gets stronger and uses mask again against dordonii becoming more proficient

>uses mask twice against ulquiorra but the second time it shatters immediately after appearing

>finally masters it for his fight with grimmjow

You're delusional if you think ichigo suddenly got his bankai to be equal to his hollow mask form. That logic is how people came up with mach 6 million rukia

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helloman

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#35  Edited By helloman

Ichigo wins both rounds.

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deactivated-5c9e122a6bc32

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@theemperor95: Ichigo aimed dodged, he noted that if the tip was pointed at him it was over, so he avoided the tip being pointed at him.

Aka he's dodging the aim not the attack.

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SkySanji

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@skysanji: 1. You have no idea what an aim dodge is. Ichigo wasnt even ready for an attack

Yes he was you are trolling now he is literally telling us he is looking at the tip of his Blade and acting accordingly....

2. Right after his fight with dordonii. Dordonii even explains how ichigo is soft for using his mask despite it draining his stamina. Something that only happens when he doesnt have full mastery of his mask.

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/254/15

Again irrelevant Same Thing happens later with Yammy and this is Post Ulquiorra fight, Grimmjow mentions it it the fight where he says "It would be ashamed if that mask of yours comes of" and then Ichigo says quit messing around it would be ashamed if you couldn't fight in your ressurecion form I'll get scans of these instances as well if need be.

3. Ichigo used the mask to momentarily block the cero but it shattered because he didn't have control if it again.

Thank you, conversation over He had his Mask on and still could barely thank the cero then later with out the mask he tanks it

4. Ichigo didn't have any time to sit around and train more with his mask because the soul society abandoned orihime so he went to save her. The visoreds even said ichigo wasn't ready yet. Right after his fight he leaves without any further training

Chad and Uryu had enough time to train though, Ichigo should've trained as well And again it makes sense that he did.

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/230/15

5. It's almost like ichigo had a slow progression with his mask and each time he put it on he could use it for longer until he finally mastered it in his final fight with grimmjow.

Irrelevant once again I'm not talking about how long he can keep his mask on I'm talking about him having his mask on and barely tanking a Cero from Ulq and then later without the mask tanking a cero, he clearly got stronger and gets stronger with each Mask amp/Mask design.

Therefore him dodging Gin's Ban Kai can't be scaled to Ulq blitzing him since he became more powerful after the Ulq fight.

>doesnt appear in his fight with grimmjow

>gets stronger and uses mask again against dordonii becoming more proficient

>uses mask twice against ulquiorra but the second time it shatters immediately after appearing

>finally masters it for his fight with grimmjow

You're delusional if you think ichigo suddenly got his bankai to be equal to his hollow mask form. That logic is how people came up with mach 6 million rukia

>Shows him a scan with Ulquiorra saying he got stronger

>Ichigo fights Grimmjow in regular Bankai in round one and gets toyed with round 2 Grimmjow's base is equal to an unmasked Ichigo

Again No you are just indenial go rewatch The Grimmjow and Ulquiorra fights...

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ourmanuel

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#38  Edited By ourmanuel

@skysanji:

Barely Ichigo still had time to fire off a Getsuga point blank to avoid getting his head cut off.

He was wearing his mask, so his reactions would have been better. And based on how bad that blitz was, it definitely still counts.

It's even worse when Ichigo's Regular Bankai during the Gin fight is stronger than his Hollowfied mask during the Ulq fight.

Youve provided 0 proof to back this up.

Using Aim dodge.....

You posted one scan of ichigo possibly aim dodging. Are you forgetting the fact that he reacted to buto without aimdodging, considering the fact that he didn’t know what it was, and was only shown to move after gin has already completed his chant. Are you going to say that he aimdodged buto by dodging when Gin began his chant and said “ka I shinji”? And even if you somehow try and asspull that he aimdodged it, what about buto renjin that came right after?

Theres even another scan where gin tells him that he actually managed to block his sword. Are you gonna say he aim blocked a Mach 500 sword with his own sword?

I don’t even need to say much, ichigo reacted to buto renjin without his mask. That should clear up any doubt on buto and the other instance that I mentioned. But nevertheless, you’ll still come up with something I’m sure.

His base gets stronger as well as confirmed by Ulquiorra:

Base got unquantifiably stronger =/= base got stronger than his mask.

Ulquiorra says “damn, you withstood my attack without needing your mask”, and somehow you interpreted that as “wow, ichigo’s gotten stronger than his masked form”?

And once again, that was in a different fight.

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TheEmperor95

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@skysanji: 1. The yammy example doesnt help you at all. It's a new mask that he isnt used to so it drain his stamina because he hasn't mastered it yet.

2. Are you that delusional? He was bed ridden trying to heal up. Then he is suddenly better (because orihime healed him) and he leaves straight for hueco munson Chad and uryu could train because they weren't bed ridden from fighting the espada.

3. He barely tanked the cero because he couldn't use his mask more than once at that time.

4. Ichigo bankai never surpassed his hollow mask form so yes you can back scale ulquiorra.

5. You are clearly the one that needs to go back rewatch all of the arrancar arc. Ichigo couldn't control his powers in his first fight with grimmjow. This was made very clear in all of his subsequent fights. Rukia even took him to face a random fodder hollow and he was getting stomped by it. Did he suddenly become 5-10x more powerful when he beat that hollow? No he was just able to utilize his powers. His fight with yammy was the same way the inner hollow kept ichigo from being able to use his power.

5. There is 0 evidence to support ichigo base bankai being stronger than his previous vizard form. There is a great deal of evidence however to say that he isnt stronger.

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SkySanji

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@skysanji:

He was wearing his mask

Doesn't matter his Unmasked state is stronger than his previous masked state...

so his reactions would have been better. And based on how bad that blitz was, it definitely still counts.

I'm not saying it wasn't a blitz it most certainly was just that it was barely a blitz Since Ichigo still fired off a getsuga when Ulq was point blank ready to cut his head off.

Youve provided 0 proof to back this up.

>Continously shows him scans of Ulquiorra saying he got stronger

>Grimmjow ragdolls him while laughing during Round 1, Round 2 Ichigo gets his mask and he's still keeping up with Ichigo bUT gets overpowered due to him having one arm and then Round 3 comes around Ichigo unmasked is fighting on par with Base Grimmjow

>But you know let's ignore all of this evidence of Ichigo becoming stronger with Each Mask.

You posted one scan of ichigo possibly aim dodging.

No it was two, the tip of the blade and him looking at Gin's Buto stance

Are you forgetting the fact that he reacted to buto without aimdodging, considering the fact that he didn’t know what it was, and was only shown to move after gin has already completed his chant. Are you going to say that he aimdodged buto by dodging when Gin began his chant and said “ka I shinji”? And even if you somehow try and asspull that he aimdodged it, what about buto renjin that came right after?

You are so indenial right now he literally takes notes of his stance("What's that stance?") and he has his previous hint to go off as well looking at the tip of his Blade.

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Also I said Ichigo dodged it with his mask on Numerous of times, the arguement was you can't scale Ulquiorra to that since the Ichigo when blitzed was weaker than the one who fought Gin.

Theres even another scan where gin tells him that he actually managed to block his sword. Are you gonna say he aim blocked a Mach 500 sword with his own sword?

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If he knows where the attack is coming from via the tip of Gin's Blade why can't he block it? Come on this is pathetic now....

I don’t even need to say much, ichigo reacted to buto renjin without his mask. That should clear up any doubt on buto and the other instance that I mentioned. But nevertheless, you’ll still come up with something I’m sure.

No he didn't.....

>He has to get in his Buto stance

>Ichigo already has the hint for his tip of the blade pointing at him

>Ichigo puts the mask on when these first few things happens and dodges accordingly

His base gets stronger as well as confirmed by Ulquiorra:

Base got unquantifiably stronger =/= base got stronger than his mask.

Go rewatch The Grimmjow and Ulquiorra fights.

Ulquiorra says “damn, you withstood my attack without needing your mask”, and somehow you interpreted that as “wow, ichigo’s gotten stronger than his masked form”?

No. Ulq said he tanked his Cero without the use of his mask even though before Ichigo put his mask on and Ulquiorra completely shattered it with Cero hence why Ulq said he got stronger.

And once again, that was in a different fight.

Yes a fight with a weaker Ichigo.

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@skysanji: 1. The yammy example doesnt help you at all. It's a new mask that he isnt used to so it drain his stamina because he hasn't mastered it yet.

He had it under control when fighting Gin, When first arriving to Karakura town to try and snipe Aizen, To Getsuga Aizen after Yamma hit him with Itto Kaso, so I'm not trying to here that it was draining his stamina, not to mention that that Ichigo wasnt even fully clothed and just came from fighting Ulq.

2. Are you that delusional? He was bed ridden trying to heal up. Then he is suddenly better (because orihime healed him) and he leaves straight for hueco munson Chad and uryu could train because they weren't bed ridden from fighting the espada.

Scans please.

3. He barely tanked the cero because he couldn't use his mask more than once at that time.

He still had the mask on and Ulquiorra shattered it....Nothing you say will change that.

4. Ichigo bankai never surpassed his hollow mask form so yes you can back scale ulquiorra.

>you can never use backwards scaling....

>You have no counters to anything I say so you go back to your Headcannon

5. You are clearly the one that needs to go back rewatch all of the arrancar arc. Ichigo couldn't control his powers in his first fight with grimmjow.

Yes he did he just couldn't keep the mask on for extended periods of time.

This was made very clear in all of his subsequent fights. Rukia even took him to face a random fodder hollow and he was getting stomped by it. Did he suddenly become 5-10x more powerful when he beat that hollow? No he was just able to utilize his powers. His fight with yammy was the same way the inner hollow kept ichigo from being able to use his power.

Irrelevant all of this happens before his training with the Visoreds/Vizards.Which is the whole reason why he went to them in the first place to.

5. There is 0 evidence to support ichigo base bankai being stronger than his previous vizard form.

>Shows him a scan with Ulquiorra saying he got stronger

>Ichigo fights Grimmjow in regular Bankai in round one and gets toyed with round 2 Grimmjow's base is equal to an unmasked Ichigo

There is a great deal of evidence however to say that he isnt stronger.

Headcannon isn't evidence.

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HypeBeastCSB15

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#42  Edited By HypeBeastCSB15

Ichigo slaps. We get's WAAYYYYstronger after he fought Ulquiorra.

1.) Ichigo has shown to get stronger during fights. This apparent in his grimmjow fight where at the beginning his Bankai was a match for grimmjow's base, but by the end of the fight his Bankai was overpowering his strongest attack from his released form. (this type of thing happens in almost every fight.)

2.) His mask changed and grew much stronger after he used his VL form. This is stated in the form of ichigo stating that his mask feels different. Well you're probably thinking "His mask feeling different=/=stronger" right? well...

3.) He goes on to damage and fight characters much stronger than ulquiorra, such as: Yammy (did this with a weakened bankai), and Gin. Not to mention the fact that Ichigo can dodge mach 1000 attacks and Ulquiorra doesn't have any quantifiable speed feats on this level.

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The_God

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Ulquiorra fodderizes Ichigo.

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PhantomRant

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Ichigo slaps. We get's WAAYYYYstronger after he fought Ulquiorra.

1.) Ichigo has shown to get stronger during fights. This apparent in his grimmjow fight where at the beginning his Bankai was a match for grimmjow's base, but by the end of the fight his Bankai was overpowering his strongest attack from his released form. (this type of thing happens in almost every fight.)

2.) His mask changed and grew much stronger after he used his VL form. This is stated in the form of ichigo stating that his mask feels different. Well you're probably thinking "His mask feeling different=/=stronger" right? well...

3.) He goes on to damage and fight characters much stronger than ulquiorra, such as: Yammy (did this with a weakened bankai), and Gin. Not to mention the fact that Ichigo can dodge mach 1000 attacks and Ulquiorra doesn't have any quantifiable speed feats on this level.

1. That never happened, Ichigo was still hollowfied when he sliced through Desgarron. The Hollowfication powerup remains so long as the mask is still there, even if it's just a piece.

2. Yes, but all we know is that he's at least R1 Ulquiorra-level in stats. Ichigo still can't get past Ulquiorra's regen.

3. The damage was just a nick in the neck area, which Ichigo himself admitted was a more impressive feat on Yammy's part than it was on his own. Gin is not stronger than Ulquiorra, and Ulquiorra doesn't need quantifiable speed feats (most Bleach characters don't btw) because he's already speedblitzed Ichigo from 100 meters+ away and that Ichigo was already in the mach 100s.

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ourmanuel

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Jesus Christ, can @skysanji be in more denial?

This is just pathetic at this point. Now we’re debating whether or not ichigo reacted to buto renjin...

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SkySanji

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Jesus Christ, can @skysanji be in more denial?

This is just pathetic at this point. Now we’re debating whether or not ichigo reacted to buto renjin...

Go reread post #41 I said he reacted to it....

Also this coming from someone who can't see he aim dodged.

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HypeBeastCSB15

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#47  Edited By HypeBeastCSB15

@phantomrant said:
@hypebeastcsb15 said:

Ichigo slaps. We get's WAAYYYYstronger after he fought Ulquiorra.

1.) Ichigo has shown to get stronger during fights. This apparent in his grimmjow fight where at the beginning his Bankai was a match for grimmjow's base, but by the end of the fight his Bankai was overpowering his strongest attack from his released form. (this type of thing happens in almost every fight.)

2.) His mask changed and grew much stronger after he used his VL form. This is stated in the form of ichigo stating that his mask feels different. Well you're probably thinking "His mask feeling different=/=stronger" right? well...

3.) He goes on to damage and fight characters much stronger than ulquiorra, such as: Yammy (did this with a weakened bankai), and Gin. Not to mention the fact that Ichigo can dodge mach 1000 attacks and Ulquiorra doesn't have any quantifiable speed feats on this level.

1. That never happened, Ichigo was still hollowfied when he sliced through Desgarron. The Hollowfication powerup remains so long as the mask is still there, even if it's just a piece.

He actually lost the hollowfication effects in his eyes before he went to attack desgarron again, and that's whats supposed to show he's in his hollow form.

2. Yes, but all we know is that he's at least R1 Ulquiorra-level in stats. Ichigo still can't get past Ulquiorra's regen.

And what makes you say he's only R1 ulquiorra level? Also superior levels of reatsu can neg hax, although whether or not that's gonna work on ulq's regen is another discussion. Actually, he won't need that, considering ulquiorra can't regen his organs. So ichigo would just have to spam getsugas and that should do the trick

3. The damage was just a nick in the neck area, which Ichigo himself admitted was a more impressive feat on Yammy's part than it was on his own. Gin is not stronger than Ulquiorra, and Ulquiorra doesn't need quantifiable speed feats (most Bleach characters don't btw) because he's already speedblitzed Ichigo from 100 meters+ away and that Ichigo was already in the mach 100s.

Nicking the second hardest hierro from the physically most powerful espada and forcing him to the ground (in a weakened for no less) would be enough to vaporize Ulq's insides like the cero did, effectively killing him.

Gin is much stronger than all the espada. I don't know how you could think ulquiorra is stronger, when he isn't even the strongest espada

Blitzing a much weaker version of Ichigo isn't enough of a feat to compare to a much stronger version with an actual speed feat.

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ourmanuel

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#48  Edited By ourmanuel

@skysanji: if you agree that he reacted to buto renjin, then what’s all the fuss about? You claim he aim dodged buto even though he was only shown moving after the technique had already been chanted.

Yet in the next panel we then see him react to buto renjin without doing so.

So no matter how you try and deny buto, the fact that in the very next panel he reacts to renjin is supposed to clear any doubt still left in your mind that he didn’t aimdodge buto.

R1 Ulquiorra blitzed his masked form back on Las Noches.

Segunda etapa blitzed even harder.

You have no evidence whatsoever that the masked form that ulquiorra fought is weaker than the bankai form that gin fought.

Case closed. Mach 1000 R1 ulquiorra is almost completely certain. Mach 1000 segunda etapa is irrefutable.

There’s literally no way to dispute this without making yourself look dumb or biased on these boards.

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ourmanuel

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And yes, a Getsuga Tenshō from ichigo’s new mask would most likely kill R1 ulquiorra considering what it could do to yammy in released form.

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SkySanji

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Just to show you how repetitive this conversation is and your arguing without any real evidence I will put your previous quotes next to your new one, or just show how I already answered or debunked your claim.just to show you why I'm done here.

@skysanji: if you agree that he reacted to buto renjin, then what’s all the fuss about?

Me already answering this:

Also I said Ichigo dodged it with his mask on Numerous of times, the arguement was you can't scale Ulquiorra to that since the Ichigo when blitzed was weaker than the one who fought Gin.

Me answering it again in the same manner:

you can't scale Ulq to Ichigo dodging Mach 1000 when this is a more powerful Ichigo....

You claim he aim dodged buto even though he was only shown moving after the technique had already been chanted.

Previous quote:

Are you forgetting the fact that he reacted to buto without aimdodging, considering the fact that he didn’t know what it was, and was only shown to move after gin has already completed his chant. Are you going to say that he aimdodged buto by dodging when Gin began his chant and said “ka I shinji”? And even if you somehow try and asspull that he aimdodged it, what about buto renjin that came right after?

Me answering it:

You are so indenial right now he literally takes notes of his stance("What's that stance?") and he has his previous hint to go off as well looking at the tip of his Blade.

No Caption Provided

Me answering it again in the same manner:

Aim dodge, he looked at the tip of his word and stance and acted accordingly.

Yet in the next panel we then see him react to buto renjin without doing so.

No. Again he put his mask on using the same aim dodging hints given to him.

So no matter how you try and deny buto, the fact that in the very next panel he reacts to renjin is supposed to clear any doubt still left in your mind that he didn’t aimdodge buto.

Only that the manga is telling us he aim dodged......

R1 Ulquiorra blitzed his masked form back on Las Noches.

Me already answering this:

Barely Ichigo still had time to fire off a Getsuga point blank to avoid getting his head cut off.

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Granted Ichigo said he couldn't react but the fact that his synapse went off and he fired off a getsuga when Ulq was at point blank range ready to cut his head off shows that Ulq barely blitzed him.

It's even worse when Ichigo's Regular Bankai during the Gin fight is stronger than his Hollowfied mask during the Ulq fight.

Me answering it again in the sane manner:

Barely he still had time to use a getsuga when Ulq was point blank in his face ready to cut his head off.

Segunda etapa blitzed even harder.

Okay...

Ichigo's unmasked Bankai is more powerful than his previous masked State .

You have no evidence whatsoever that the masked form that ulquiorra fought is weaker than the bankai form that gin fought.

Me already answering this:

No Caption Provided

>Continously shows him scans of Ulquiorra saying he got stronger

>Grimmjow ragdolls him while laughing during Round 1, Round 2 Ichigo gets his mask and he's still keeping up with Ichigo bUT gets overpowered due to him having one arm and then Round 3 comes around Ichigo unmasked is fighting on par with Base Grimmjow

>But you know let's ignore all of this evidence of Ichigo becoming stronger with Each Mask.

Me answering it again in the same manner:

Only that Throughout the Grimmjow fights Ichigo has gotten stronger and Ulq stating he's gotten stronger.

Case closed. Mach 1000 R1 ulquiorra is almost completely certain. Mach 1000 segunda etapa is irrefutable.

Never said he wasn't mach 1000 just that he wasn't vastly above it for Blitzing an Ichigo who was weaker from the Gin fight.

There’s literally no way to dispute this without making yourself look dumb or biased on these boards.

I already did and it's only you and Emperor who are going against it on this thread, time and time again your claim will get shutdown I am done here I've done nothing but repeat the same thing over and over and over again because you post the same thing over and over again without having any evidence, anyone who takes the time to read our conversations will see how many times I've repeated myself.

Im mot going to go in circles with you Concession accepted.