Toph vs Gaara

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whoisme

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#1  Edited By whoisme

Both in character. No prep. They fight in the city of Chicago. Who wins?

Edit

Whatever opinion you have coming into this, I would like everybody to have an open mind. I'm not asking you to pick one side or another, just read what people have to say and chew it over before responding. I believe that good debates should make you question your opinion in order to strengthen or discard it, make you think more deeply about something than just how it looks on the surface and change the way you view things. Have fun.

Edit

Deathbattle is making a video fro this . . . called it.

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juiceboks

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#2 juiceboks  Moderator

Been done. Gaara stomps.

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In Chicago? Really?

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Lunacyde

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#6 Lunacyde  Moderator

I'm not so convicned.

Why precisely does Gaara "stomp"?

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Gaara

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#8 Lunacyde  Moderator

@dondave said:

Gaara

But why?

Gaara can only control sand to my knowledge.

Toph can control sand, all Earth, and metal.

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@lunacyde: Big difference, gaara can fly lol.

/thread

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DBVSE7

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#10  Edited By DBVSE7

Omg.. Does speed not mean anything to Avatar Fans and Fanboys it's a stomp simply because Toph can't move counter or, react faster than Gaaras sand.. Toph can't bend sand and she's can't get through his defense.

It's a Stomp plain and simple.

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@dbvse7: Toph can bend sand, but it doesn't matter because Gaara can fly. Blitzing is also out of character for Gaara.

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DBVSE7

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#12  Edited By DBVSE7

@boringperson: I DOUBT she can control it better than Gaara.. who was talkin about blitzing? Gaara doesn't even need flight in this..

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Gaara has this. No way she would have survived the sh** he did to Kimimaro.

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Archanfel

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#14  Edited By Archanfel

Gaara should win.

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#15  Edited By StrictlyAnime
@lunacyde said:

I'm not so convicned.

Why precisely does Gaara "stomp"?

Because of this

Loading Video...

Gaara has more durable, he can control more sand than her, hes faster than her, has a fare better variety of moves. Gaara is literally the better version of Toph in ever conceivable way.

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SightlessReality

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@lunacyde said:

I'm not so convicned.

Why precisely does Gaara "stomp"?

Because of this

Loading Video...

Gaara has more durable, he can control more sand than her, hes faster than her, has a fare better variety of moves. Gaara is literally the better version of Toph in ever conceivable way.

He's only better then her when it comes to sand & his flying but Toph is better then gaara when it's actually earth.

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#17 Lunacyde  Moderator

@dbvse7 said:

Omg.. Does speed not mean anything to Avatar Fans and Fanboys it's a stomp simply because Toph can't move counter or, react faster than Gaaras sand.. Toph can't bend sand and she's can't get through his defense.

It's a Stomp plain and simple.

Speed? Show me proof that Gaara is faster to the point where Toph couldn't react, because in the video posted no one was moving faster than Toph could react to.

Toph can bend sand, she has done so in the series multiple times. In the Third book: Fire she was able to sand bend an intricate scaled model of Ba Sing Se down to the people, after she claimed she had been practicing.

I can see Gaara possibly winning, but you're kidding yourself if you think she's going to be stomped, especially in this environment.

@dbvse7: Toph can bend sand, but it doesn't matter because Gaara can fly. Blitzing is also out of character for Gaara.

Gaara can fly, but I don't see how this is considered an auto win?

@lunacyde said:

I'm not so convicned.

Why precisely does Gaara "stomp"?

Because of this

Loading Video...

Gaara has more durable, he can control more sand than her, hes faster than her, has a fare better variety of moves. Gaara is literally the better version of Toph in ever conceivable way.

Except that they are in a city environment and Toph can bend regular Earth and metal as well and this is an environment far richer in those two things than sand. She can also bend sand, and for durability she can encase herself in Earth or metal making her more durable than Gaara.

Once again Gaara MAY be able to win, but it's far from a stomp and he is far from better in every concieveable way.

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DBVSE7

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#18  Edited By DBVSE7

@lunacyde: You're implying that Toph is faster than Lee and Kimimaro than... ANNNND she's not Gaaras Sand has increased in speed since his fight with Lee.

If you didn't notice Avatar lacks speed Toph isn't known for her speed but her Earth Bending. YOU'RE kidding yourself if you think she can react to Gaaras sand. The massive speed gap, better defense and versatility with sand and flight make this a stomp

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SightlessReality

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I'm going with Toph here. Ordinarily flying opponents would be Tophs down fall but as Gaara uses sand to move around not to mention his sand armor coating I'd argue that she'd be able to detect him. It also helps that she's in an area where she has more earth at her disposal then gaara has sand at his disposal. Yes I'm aware that Gaara can grind up minerals till it becomes sand but Toph can do that and reverse it too.

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@sightlessreality: The amount of sand gaara holds in the cord is enough to take down toph. I mean its ridiculous how much it holds. How will toph counter sand burial? Or even sand coffin.

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whoisme

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@trueking95: She can encase herself in rock or metal easily and still move around fine. When has Gaara's sand breached metal?

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@sightlessreality: The amount of sand gaara holds in the cord is enough to take down toph. I mean its ridiculous how much it holds. How will toph counter sand burial? Or even sand coffin.

By getting out of the way. A simple stomp of the ground is enough to create a pillar launching her up out of burial and she can disperse the sand flouting in the air. I'm not underestimating Gaara here. I know what he can do but Toph is a good counter to him. Also, since their in character Gaara won't speed blitz since he's the type to hang back. If he tried making a sand clone she'd be able to tell instantly. It'd be a good fight none the less.

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@sightlessreality: I'm not 100% she could escape under the pressure of all that sand being pushed down on. And she wouldn't have a way to get out of sand coffin considering she has never been seen being able to earth bend without the use of her limbs unlike bumi. Who I think would've been a better match up.

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SightlessReality

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@sightlessreality: I'm not 100% she could escape under the pressure of all that sand being pushed down on. And she wouldn't have a way to get out of sand coffin considering she has never been seen being able to earth bend without the use of her limbs unlike bumi. Who I think would've been a better match up.

Like I said, she can disperse the sand in the air before it clings to her she's done it to boulders, no reason she can't do it to sand. & burials a flashy move that centers around the opponent. There's no way Toph is going to just sit there waiting for it to sink her into the ground.

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@dbvse7: uh tough can bend sand......

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No Earth bender bar the avatar in the avatar has Gaaras level of strength when it comes to there respective materials. Never mind Toph would be incapable of getting past his shield.

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No Earth bender bar the avatar in the avatar has Gaaras level of strength when it comes to there respective materials. Never mind Toph would be incapable of getting past his shield.

I disagree. Outside of the Avatar state(maybe) Toph easily surpasses Aang in Earth Bending. Also whats stopping Toph from simply bending his shield? Toph isn't restricted by Chakra limitations.

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@sightlessreality: Did I compare base Aang to Toph?

Toph has never displayed his level of strength in combat.

You can say otherwise but this would be a case of making avatar fans look bad. Naruto is a powerscaling manga, they don't operate on the same level and there is nothing wrong with that. Gaaras is a rubbish character liked purely for his strength, Toph has actual character.

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@sightlessreality: Did I compare base Aang to Toph?

Toph has never displayed his level of strength in combat.

You can say otherwise but this would be a case of making avatar fans look bad. Naruto is a powerscaling manga, they don't operate on the same level and there is nothing wrong with that. Gaaras is a rubbish character liked purely for his strength, Toph has actual character.

Are your serious?

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SightlessReality

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@sightlessreality: Did I compare base Aang to Toph?

Toph has never displayed his level of strength in combat.

You can say otherwise but this would be a case of making avatar fans look bad. Naruto is a powerscaling manga, they don't operate on the same level and there is nothing wrong with that. Gaaras is a rubbish character liked purely for his strength, Toph has actual character.

Why would trying to make a case for her look bad? In the setting given Toph has a much better chance of winning. If this were a desert their wouldn't even be a debate but it's not. And your right Toph is a better character in terms of development.

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#31 juiceboks  Moderator

@dextersinister said:

No Earth bender bar the avatar in the avatar has Gaaras level of strength when it comes to there respective materials. Never mind Toph would be incapable of getting past his shield.

I disagree. Outside of the Avatar state(maybe) Toph easily surpasses Aang in Earth Bending. Also whats stopping Toph from simply bending his shield? Toph isn't restricted by Chakra limitations.

You mean besides the fact that she's never displayed sandbending on the level that Gaara possesses? And what about Gaara utilizing chakra puts him at a disadvantage? What does that have to do with anything? If you're gonna argue that he'd run out of chakra then Toph could run out of energy just as quickly since humans need energy to..ya know..do stuff.

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@sightlessreality said:

@dextersinister said:

No Earth bender bar the avatar in the avatar has Gaaras level of strength when it comes to there respective materials. Never mind Toph would be incapable of getting past his shield.

I disagree. Outside of the Avatar state(maybe) Toph easily surpasses Aang in Earth Bending. Also whats stopping Toph from simply bending his shield? Toph isn't restricted by Chakra limitations.

You mean besides the fact that she's never displayed sandbending on the level that Gaara possesses? And what about Gaara utilizing chakra puts him at a disadvantage? What does that have to do with anything? If you're gonna argue that he'd run out of chakra then Toph could run out of energy just as quickly since humans need energy to..ya know..do stuff.

True enough but theres a difference here. Gaara uses movements and charka to manipulate sand. Toph only needs to move. And as for bending sand, she got so good at it eventually that she was able to make a fully detailed sculpture of Ba Sing Se out of sand.

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#33  Edited By sacredweapons
No Caption Provided

Ends in sex. Or she just drops the a skyscraper on him. Either on is fine.

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#34  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@juiceboks said:

@sightlessreality said:

@dextersinister said:

No Earth bender bar the avatar in the avatar has Gaaras level of strength when it comes to there respective materials. Never mind Toph would be incapable of getting past his shield.

I disagree. Outside of the Avatar state(maybe) Toph easily surpasses Aang in Earth Bending. Also whats stopping Toph from simply bending his shield? Toph isn't restricted by Chakra limitations.

You mean besides the fact that she's never displayed sandbending on the level that Gaara possesses? And what about Gaara utilizing chakra puts him at a disadvantage? What does that have to do with anything? If you're gonna argue that he'd run out of chakra then Toph could run out of energy just as quickly since humans need energy to..ya know..do stuff.

True enough but theres a difference here. Gaara uses movements and charka to manipulate sand. Toph only needs to move. And as for bending sand, she got so good at it eventually that she was able to make a fully detailed sculpture of Ba Sing Se out of sand.

Gaara actually doesn't need to move to do anything..

No Caption Provided

Hell, he doesn't have to think to defend himself. His mom's will does it automatically, that puts Toph at a very distinct disadvantage.

And that feat is a nice trick..but that doesn't mean anything in a combat situation. She's never even used sandbending in combat before so why would you assume she can outbend Gaara?

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@lunacyde: Levitating along with Toph being blind gives Gaara the win...

He throws a shuriken at her...

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#36  Edited By SightlessReality

@sightlessreality said:

@juiceboks said:

@sightlessreality said:

@dextersinister said:

No Earth bender bar the avatar in the avatar has Gaaras level of strength when it comes to there respective materials. Never mind Toph would be incapable of getting past his shield.

I disagree. Outside of the Avatar state(maybe) Toph easily surpasses Aang in Earth Bending. Also whats stopping Toph from simply bending his shield? Toph isn't restricted by Chakra limitations.

You mean besides the fact that she's never displayed sandbending on the level that Gaara possesses? And what about Gaara utilizing chakra puts him at a disadvantage? What does that have to do with anything? If you're gonna argue that he'd run out of chakra then Toph could run out of energy just as quickly since humans need energy to..ya know..do stuff.

True enough but theres a difference here. Gaara uses movements and charka to manipulate sand. Toph only needs to move. And as for bending sand, she got so good at it eventually that she was able to make a fully detailed sculpture of Ba Sing Se out of sand.

Gaara actually doesn't need to move to do anything..

No Caption Provided

Hell, he doesn't have to think to defend himself. His mom's will does it automatically, that puts Toph at a very distinct disadvantage.

And that feat is a nice trick..but that doesn't mean anything in a combat situation. She's never even used sandbending in combat before so why would you assume she can outbend Gaara?

What it shows is that shes gained precision control over sand. As to why she would be bending sand in the fight? To get it away from her or from gaara. & That's only from the sand in his gourd. Not the sand he has to use from the earth.

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#37 juiceboks  Moderator

@sightlessreality What it shows is that she knows a trick. What it doesn't show is that she can sandbend to a point that rivals Gaara. You can't prove that..because she's never sandbended in combat before. I know that..it doesn't matter though because she can't get around it. And you do realize how much sand there is in his gourd right?

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#39  Edited By jashro44

Can Toph match this kind of power?

Thats a city below. Garras sand seems to be much larger.
Thats a city below. Garras sand seems to be much larger.
The dot in the red circle is Deidara.
The dot in the red circle is Deidara.

I don't watch avatar so I don't know if Toph can match this power so I'll leave it to you guys to debate. I just see it seems people are using gaaras part one feats when his part 2 feats are much better IMO.

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whoisme

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@jashro44:

She was able to hold up a giant castle from sinking into the earth

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#41 juiceboks  Moderator

@whoisme said:

@jashro44:

She was able to hold up a giant castle from sinking into the earth

It was a library and she only slowed it's descent. Besides, A city>a large library.

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@whoisme And sand that's larger than an entire city won't be able to do the same?

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@whoisme said:

@jashro44:

She was able to hold up a giant castle from sinking into the earth

I believe I saw that feat. I don't think that compares to manipulating enough sand that dwarfs a city from what I saw/remember.

Keep in mind that Gaara isn't just holding the sand up, he's using it to attack.

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#44  Edited By SightlessReality

@jashro44 said:

@whoisme said:

@jashro44:

She was able to hold up a giant castle from sinking into the earth

I believe I saw that feat. I don't think that compares to manipulating enough sand that dwarfs a city from what I saw/remember.

Keep in mind that Gaara isn't just holding the sand up, he's using it to attack.

That's pre-Jinjuriki extraction though. If I'm remembering correctly, he hasn't done anything on that level since. But also, that's in the desert anyways.

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#45  Edited By DBVSE7

@killerwasp: already covered this.. It wouldn't matter if she could she has no sands bending combat feats.

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@jashro44 said:

@whoisme said:

@jashro44:

She was able to hold up a giant castle from sinking into the earth

I believe I saw that feat. I don't think that compares to manipulating enough sand that dwarfs a city from what I saw/remember.

Keep in mind that Gaara isn't just holding the sand up, he's using it to attack.

That's pre-Jinjuriki extraction though. If I'm remembering correctly, he hasn't done anything on that level since. But also, that's in the desert anyways.

Unless I'm forgetting something he wasn't using the shukaku's power at the time. So that feat would be under his own power.

And Gaara has grinded the hardest minerals in the earth into sand I don't see why he can't do that with a city.

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whoisme

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@juiceboks: it was a really big library. They saw only one tower that didn't even compare in size to the rest and thought it was a large castle.

This has been pointed out already, but when Gaara covered the city in sand he still had a tailed beast and was in the desert. He doesn't have that here

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I'll take Gaar he levitates in the air and throws a shuriken at her. Also giant Sand Burial,Toph hasn't shown anything to suggest that she can stop it nor the durability even with metal armor

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#49  Edited By jashro44

@whoisme said:

@juiceboks: it was a really big library. They saw only one tower that didn't even compare in size to the rest and thought it was a large castle.

This has been pointed out already, but when Gaara covered the city in sand he still had a tailed beast and was in the desert. He doesn't have that here

Gaara wasn't accessing the power of his tailed beast to do that though....See they specifically said the Shukaku wasn't unleashed and that they should maybe make preparations encase it did get unleashed:

No Caption Provided

And there is no evidence that Gaara got weaker without the Shukaku...Just that he can't turn into the shukaku which doesn't really matter since Gaara has better feats than the tailed beast he used to have.

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@jashro44: That's true but grinding up stuff to make sand requires more effort then to just use sand itself. Also, a problem with Gaara is that all his fights have been in the desert for the most part. We can't completely gauge how good he would do outside of one. Not saying he'd be back to the same level he would be when he fought kimimaru but he certainly isn't going to be doing any city level coverage.