TLA/TLK: Katara and Zuko vs Azula and Korra

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RLM2018

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Poll TLA/TLK: Katara and Zuko vs Azula and Korra (34 votes)

Azula and Korra 74%
Katara and Zuko 26%

Team 1: as of the end of TLA

  • Katara
  • Zuko

Team 2: as of the end of TLA/TLK

  • Korra (water only)
  • Azula (sane/not crazy)

Location: Full moon, at the beach with the comet overhead. In character (no blood bending)

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geekryan

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#2  Edited By geekryan  Online

With or without the Comet amp, a sane Azula would beat Zuko.

Katara vs Korra is close. Katara has better full moon feats. Actually, I don't even recall Korra having any full moon feats. That being said, although Katara would beat Korra, Azula would beat Zuko first and then they 2v1 Katara.

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deactivated-5eeb201d11f2c

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Leaning team two. I think Zuko and Azula would stalemate under the Comet, but I'd back Korra over Katara with this much water. Furthermore, team two is significantly more mobile than team one is (Azula has better fire jets then Zuko and Korra's spout >> Katara's slides). This probably won't make a difference to the individual match ups, but it means that Azula and Korra can more easily support each other than Katara and Zuko can.

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thebluedragon20

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I see a sane azula defeating zuko after a decent fight, while I see Korra and katara as a little bit of a stalemate with only water. I think katara will get double teamed more often than not.

Both of the firebenders have too much raw power to take on either of the water benders and lose, if it happened than it would be zuko vs azula where azula would come out on top.

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thebuckaronatr

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@mialthefencer: Zuko can not stalemate a not crazy Azula and team two comfortably wins without blood bending.

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JDogg

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Team 1. Zuko would last longer against Azula then Korra would Katara. Katara then beats Azula for the third time.

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thebuckaronatr

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#8  Edited By thebuckaronatr

@jdogg said:

Team 1. Zuko would last longer against Azula then Korra would Katara. Katara then beats Azula for the third time.

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Are you a bit tired or have you not read the rules? Azula would destroy Katara even if Zuko could last longer than Korra which he could not.

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deactivated-5eeb201d11f2c

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@mialthefencer: Zuko can not stalemate a not crazy Azula and team two comfortably wins without blood bending.

He can under the Comet. A Comet fight isn't going to hand to hand combat like their S&S duel did. Azula's advantages are either irrelevant (H2H skill, agility) under the Comet, or not applicable against a prepared Zuko (lightning).

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JDogg

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#10  Edited By JDogg

@thebuckaronatr: That's why she lost twice to Katara in a 1v1. One of those times Azula lost was when she was a hundred times more powerful while Katara had little amount of water to use and no moon amp. So yeah, Katara wins for a third time in a row.

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marvelfan1992

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While I have Katara just ever so slightly above Korra, their fight wwould be really close and would go on for a long time, longer than it would take for Azula to beat Zuko so Katara gets 2v1 and gets stomped

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vengefulshot

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Leaning towards team 2, I think Zuko is a weak link.

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chloros

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#13  Edited By chloros

The comet boost is greater than the full moon boost without bloodbending. But then again the waterbenders have a whole ocean to work with. In these versions, Azula does not have her lightning redirection yet, so if she tries to use lightning, Zuko could counter it and maybe aim it towards Korra. However, Azula is sane here so she is not going to be baited and played easily. This is a close one.

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BigDreamer48

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Very close, and hard fight, but Team 2 for a majority.

Katara vs. Korra is close with an edge towards Korra, and Zuko vs. Azula is a tough fight with the end result making Azula the victor for the majority.

If Katara fights Azula and Korra fights Zuko, Azula solidly beats Katara due to being sane, Sozin's Comet, and no bloodbending. Katara is probably the most powerful bender here by a slim margin, with Azula being very close behind in their base forms, but Sozin's Comet boost is way bigger than the Full Moon, and Azula is sane here, so she will beat Katara in this scenario. Zuko maybe beats Korra due to Sozin's Comet but it's pretty close. I could even see Korra winning due to the water spout but Sozin's comet is pretty ridiculous. If Zuko wins, then he proceeds to lose to Azula after a hard fight. If he loses, then obviously Team 2 wins. If they stalemate, he'll end up getting double teamed.

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chloros

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#15  Edited By chloros

@bigdreamer48: I think the air ice flying (not sure what to name it lol) has some benefits over the water spout. You can travel higher, and you don't have to worry about being connected to a ground source or having a huge supply, since she can bend water out of the air. Katara has zipped all around the rocky mountains at fast speeds using this move. Her control is good enough that she can carry other people with her on it. What do you think in comparison?

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BigDreamer48

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#16  Edited By BigDreamer48

@chloros: That's true but this is EoS version so those feats don't apply. However, I can see her being able to do that since she did something like that during the finale and with the full moon boost. I just back normal Korra against normal Katara slightly due to superior physicals and almost equal waterbending power. She does have less technique though.

Also, since they are in character, a sane Azula would likely beat either Zuko or Katara faster than anything happens to Korra in her battle, so I still lean towards Team 2.

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chloros

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@bigdreamer48: Oops! I even remembered this was end of show versions in my first post and then later forgot when I saw your water spout comment lol! I was caught up in thinking of the comparisons between the two means of mobility. I see Katara over Korra in a tough fight here, and Azula being over Zuko. But I think Azula is mvp. So for this thread I'm leaning towards team two also.

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Stormdriven

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#18  Edited By Stormdriven

Zuko and Azula stalemate, Katara beats Korra. Team 1 in a close fight,

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EmmaFrostXmen

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#19  Edited By EmmaFrostXmen

Okay hear me out....

Katara should be able to defeat Azula in this environment even with the comet. Without the full moon she can already make near building sized tidal waves and knock ships a hundred feet away. With the full moon she’s far stronger, and therefore would quickly overwhelm Azula’s defenses with the amount of water she had access to. I don’t see Azula having the necessary power to break Katara’s offense, and Katara has reacted to and blocked comet enhanced lightning so that’s not at all a problem.

Korra does not go for big water attacks in a 1v1 (the colossus feat was extremely circumstantial due to the size of it and Korra has never made a tidal wave as a go to move in a 1v1) and often just goes for a typical water spout or water arm technique which will not work here as Zuko is extremely amped. Anyway I see Katara overwhelming Azula faster than Korra can defeat Zuko therefore allowing Katara to help Zuko overwhelm Korra.

My take is a little odd, but I honestly think the comet is overhyped. Katara and Korra have both manipulated more water during the day than they have fire while using the comet. Additionally lightning means noting because as previously mentioned Katara has reacted to after it was fired.

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EmmaFrostXmen

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@chloros: actually glad you brought that up.

I don’t think many people noticed that Katara has gotten so good at manipulating air moisture that she can now perform pseudo flight with ice

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@mialthefencer: Lies, Azula is not just a better Hand to Hand fighter than Zuko, and the Comet gives Zuko not a bigger buff than Azula.

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Captain_Narlowe

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#22  Edited By Captain_Narlowe

@emmafrostxmen: The Azula lowball in this thread is dumb, neither is Zuko on par with her nor has Katara any chance to beat a Comet amped Azula with just the full moon, and her defenses are nowhere close to unbreakable for such a far more powerful Azula.

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Captain_Narlowe

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#23  Edited By Captain_Narlowe

A not complete lowballed Azula that is sane with Comet is going to beat Zuko, and would even a lot easier beat Katara who has just a full moon.

Katara fighting Korra is very close, so much that the winner don't even matters.

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Captain_Narlowe

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#24  Edited By Captain_Narlowe

@bigdreamer48: What makes Katara a more powerful bender than Azula when sane if they are in base, I don't see Katara winning if both can go all out without Plot decisions?

And are you talking about the series or the comics, because for the comics i strongly disagree.

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deactivated-5eeb201d11f2c

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@mialthefencer: Lies, Azula is not just a better Hand to Hand fighter than Zuko, and the Comet gives Zuko not a bigger buff than Azula.

Wait, this is series Azula. So she and Zuko definitely stalemate then. He doesn't need a bigger buff then her, they're already equals as firebenders without the Comet.

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Captain_Narlowe

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#26  Edited By Captain_Narlowe

@mialthefencer: Zuko was never Azula's equal until her mental state took a nose dive, Azula is quicker, more agile, more versatile, and had better feats in most other categories too.

And you even talked about smoke and shadow, which made the lie even worse.

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#27  Edited By BigDreamer48

@captain_narlowe: Oh, no. In terms of bending, they are about the same. It's just that waterbending is the most versatile element. I just think that in terms of bending abilities, Katara can do more when given an enormous water source like here in her base form. I actually do think that Azula could beat Katara for a majority in a 1 vs. 1 fair fight.

But for this fight, I agree that Azula beats either Zuko or Katara in this scenario before anything happens to Korra, so Team 2 for a majority.

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Captain_Narlowe

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@bigdreamer48: Oh, i totally agree then, in that category is Katara the most powerful for sure.

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@mialthefencer: Zuko was never Azula's equal until her mental state took a nose dive, Azula is quicker, more agile, more versatile, and had better feats in most other categories too.

And you even talked about smoke and shadow, which made the lie even worse.

Smoke and Shadow isn't in this fight, so that was my mistake.

Zuko was equal to sane Azula in S3. They stalemated at the Boiling Rock and again at the Western Air Temple. They performed comparably against Aang and Katara in the Catacombs.

Azula isn't quicker, as shown by the fact that her and Zuko repeatedly stalemated.

Her agility didn't help her beat Zuko in their S3 fights and is completely irrelevant under the Comet when both are slinging building-sized fireblasts at each other.

She only appears more versatile because she has more feats at a high level; Zuko only reached her level in S3 and didn't really fight between the Catacombs and the Western Air Temple. In their actual fights, Azula wasn't able to leverage that versatility into an advantage. Both have different skillsets and know moves the other lacks (Zuko has stronger fire shields, more spammable explosive blasts, fire whips, and redirection, Azula's got lightning, fire jets and a bunch of other miscellaneous stuff). She doesn't have anything that can break the stalemate under Sozin's Comet.

Zuko vs Sane Azula under the Comet would go like the beginning of Zuko vs insane Azula under the Comet; both stalemating each other's blasts and defending, and neither one able to gain an advantage. The difference is Azula wouldn't exhaust herself, so the stalemate wouldn't break.

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Captain_Narlowe

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@mialthefencer: Wrong.

They had not even a fair fight in boiling rock, it was a 2 on 1 and Azula was standing on an edge towards boiling water. And on the air temple had Azula's mental state already taken a bit of a nose dive, and without Appartements would have Zuko died and Azula still live. Zuko even performed better if you mean the crystal catacombs, but that was shady and seemed to be more Plot than anything else.

Azula is quicker, as shown by the fact of having better feats.

Her agility would have helped her in a fair fight with proper mental state, and her bending amped agility even helped her to survive at the air temple without help, and as Zuko shot a big Comet blast at her as her mental state was even worse.

What is that for a dumb argument? If Azula has more feats on a high level is she more versatile on a high level, there is nothing to discuss. And i consider Azula's shield in that Village against all of them as better than Zuko's, but there could be a case with his Twitter in smoke and shadow. Azula's explosive blast are better for sure, and whips are a technique even the Circus directer and Azula's goons in smoke and shadow have shown, and Azula has better fire techniques than that either way. There will be no stalemate without a Plot saying there must be.

The fight began with Zuko need Ing more effort to match Azula's first blast than her, and there is no reason to assume that Azula will not just use her several advantages to just beat Zulo instead of stalemating him.

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EmmaFrostXmen

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@captain_narlowe: No you’re highballing the comet amp. Katara barely had any water and she still blocked her lightning and matched its power as shown by it not going through her defenses. Azula wasn’t “weaker”, she was “slipping”. That doesn’t diminish her power therefore the power Katara blocked is the same power she’ll be blocking in this fight except this time she’ll have unlimited water and an amp (I’m not saying Katara would have defeated Azula in the finale without her being crazy, but that was different circumstances (less water, and no full moon)). Katara can already manipulate more water than Azula can fire, here she’ll just abuse that advantage.

Show me a scan of Azula evaporating a wave that can knock back battleships (beginning of book 3 Katara without the use of the full moon during the day) oh yea you can’t. You’re assuming she can do this shit with no evidence or proof. Katara can block her attack with the comet amp without the full moon already, here she has access to way more power and more water.

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FuneralMen

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@tektonic:

This is a great debate

Katara a blood bender and Zuko a lightning redirector vs Azula and Korra

But I’m getting triggered when is the next Avatar installment coming out, in a book Korea was writing to the next avatar because he won’t get the past lives, what the hell is up with that. From what it seems this guys is an earth bender, as in he was born that way. Also do avatars commit suicide so the next one comes sooner since they age, we never did see Aang as an old man. Also Korra didn’t flesh out enough lore, we see Zuko in Korra but not Azula why not, Korra should get more books before they start any other new stories.

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vengefulshot

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Actually changed my mind. Series Zuko and Azula stalemate and Katara beats Korra extreme difficulty.

Azula still wanked. She beats Zuko through H2H and physicals which are entirely irrelevant here considering the locale and comet.

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Tektonic

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@tektonic:

This is a great debate

Katara a blood bender and Zuko a lightning redirector vs Azula and Korra

Unfortunately Katara's bloodbending is prohibited in this matchup.

But I’m getting triggered when is the next Avatar installment coming out, in a book Korea was writing to the next avatar because he won’t get the past lives, what the hell is up with that.

Not sure how seriously to take the avatar chronicles. But it's all speculative, based on Wan, Korra's life should at least be accessible to the next Avatar.

From what it seems this guys is an earth bender, as in he was born that way.

It will definitely be an earth bender but we won't know anytime soon.

Also do avatars commit suicide so the next one comes sooner since they age,

No lol the Avatars tend to try and live as long as possible before the chaos in between raising the next one.

we never did see Aang as an old man.

We see him middle aged in flashbacks, and in his older years in Tenzin's visions. Also a lot of commentary of him as a father.

Also Korra didn’t flesh out enough lore, we see Zuko in Korra but not Azula why not,

We still got Katara, Toph, and Sokka(some flashback) at the end of the day it's a new story with a new avatars journey so they only can be included so much as they develop new lore. Azula's fate is still in development in the ATLA comics so we don't even know if she is alive by Korra's time, so they probably wanted to keep it secret.

Korra should get more books before they start any other new stories.

LOK is getting many comicbooks coming up that will include a visit to the fire nation and different comic book formats.

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deactivated-5eeb201d11f2c

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@captain_narlowe:

They had not even a fair fight in boiling rock, it was a 2 on 1 and Azula was standing on an edge towards boiling water.

It was less a 2v1 and more Sokka and Zuko taking turns attacking Azula. Sokka never actually helped in the fight (because he's a swordsman in a show where he can't cut someone, and he needed Zuko to protect him). Zuko's movement was limited just like Azula's by the need to protect Sokka.

And on the air temple had Azula's mental state already taken a bit of a nose dive, and without Appartements would have Zuko died and Azula still live.

Azula's actual fighting wasn't hindered at all at the Western Air Temple. Under Sozin's Comet Zuko realized Azula was "slipping" in seconds just from talking to her, but even after the actual fight he had with her at the Western Air Temple, he never notes that she's slipping or off her game, and when he's discussing fighting Azula again with Iroh, he doesn't say that he can beat her because she's weakened.

Zuko even performed better if you mean the crystal catacombs, but that was shady and seemed to be more Plot than anything else.

It's only shady if you assume a priori that Azula > Zuko by EOS. If you accept what we're shown, repeatedly, on the show, it's perfectly normal.

Azula is quicker, as shown by the fact of having better feats.

Except they scale to each other. Azula isn't any quicker then he is because they fought each other and stalemated on speed. And Zuko ran down lightning under Sozin's Comet, if anyone has better stand alone feats it's him.

Her agility would have helped her in a fair fight with proper mental state,

Except it didn't at the Western Air Temple. Under Sozin's Comet, Azula was much more mobile then Zuko thanks to her fire jets, and yet he had no issues dealing with that.

and her bending amped agility even helped her to survive at the air temple without help, and as Zuko shot a big Comet blast at her as her mental state was even worse.

And yet it wasn't enough to beat Zuko at the Western Air Temple or even stalemate him under Sozin's Comet. Zuko can handle Azula's agility, both bending-amped and not, as shown in the show.

What is that for a dumb argument? If Azula has more feats on a high level is she more versatile on a high level, there is nothing to discuss.

Scratch this. I don't actually think Azula even has more shown versatility then Zuko has at all. Zuko's shown a whole bunch of moves that Azula hasn't: fire whips, heat bending, redirection, stronger fire shields, more spammable explosive blasts, charging swords and more. Most of that isn't relevant against Azula, but most of Azula's versatility isn't relevant against Zuko. And if Azula's versatility actually gave her an advantage over Zuko, she would've won their S3 fights with it, and she didn't.

And i consider Azula's shield in that Village against all of them as better than Zuko's, but there could be a case with his Twitter in smoke and shadow.

A combustion blast >>>> the attacks Azula blocked at the village. It's not even close. There's also the time Zuko blocked ship-busting bomb, but that's less relevant to the fight.

Azula's explosive blast are better for sure,

Zuko's are more spammable and can be done on level ground without bars.

and whips are a technique even the Circus directer and Azula's goons in smoke and shadow have shown,

So? Random fodder have shown lightning, doesn't mean that isn't a move that Azula has and Zuko doesn't. Likewise, Kemurikage being able to perform fire whips doesn't mean it's not a move Zuko has and Azula doesn't.

and Azula has better fire techniques than that either way.

What better fire techniques does Azula actually have then Zuko does, that are actually relevant to a fight with Zuko?

There will be no stalemate without a Plot saying there must be.

But they stalemated on the show, twice, and were shown to be comparable a third time and equal in power on a fourth occasion.

The fight began with Zuko need Ing more effort to match Azula's first blast than her, and there is no reason to assume that Azula will not just use her several advantages to just beat Zulo instead of stalemating him.

Azula's only actual advantage is agility, which is irrelevant under the Comet and which Zuko has already handled in the past. If she couldn't beat him on the show, she can't beat him here.

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Masma94

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Team 2 wins with Azula beating Zuko, before she alone or together with Korra beat Katara.

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Stormdriven

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Azula can't do anything more than stalemate Zuko, while Korra can't beat Katara. On the other hand, I see Zuko lasting longer against Korra than Azula against Katara, since Katara has Azula's number. Not to mention, Zuko and Katara will have perfect teamwork, while Azula and Korra don't know anything about each other.

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thebuckaronatr

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#38  Edited By thebuckaronatr

Threads like this is what i mean with that Azula is or was underrated on comicvine, by overrating Zuko. Even more so Katara and in her case to a loony degree.

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vengefulshot

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Azula is the most overated character in avatar, its actually just laughable- her stans have no real place complaining about the over or underrating of other characters considering they wank their own to a ridiculous degree.

OT i think team 1 win because Zuko is a weak link, but the above comment is just a huge kekw.

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KlarionKnight

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@masma94 said:

Team 2 wins with Azula beating Zuko, before she alone or together with Korra beat Katara.

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#41  Edited By KlarionKnight
@vengefulshot said:

Azula is the most overated character in avatar, its actually just laughable- her stans have no real place complaining about the over or underrating of other characters considering they wank their own to a ridiculous degree.

OT i think team 1 win because Zuko is a weak link, but the above comment is just a huge kekw.

No way is Azula the most overrated character in avatar, nearly any place i saw overrates Zaheer, Iroh, Toph almost certainly or in the newest arguably even Rangi far more.

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Viking1205

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EoS Zuko and Azula are close matchups under the comet, and if Azula tries to shoot a lightning, she's going to end up roasted. Katara takes on Korra with extreme difficulty. Katara and Zuko gang up on Azula later.

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Azula and Korra.

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freestyler1999

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Azula obviously takes either, Korra loses to Zuko but could hold her own against Katara, and Azula and Korra win.

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Scarlet_Wiccan

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@geekryan said:

With or without the Comet amp, a sane Azula would beat Zuko.

Katara vs Korra is close. Katara has better full moon feats. Actually, I don't even recall Korra having any full moon feats. That being said, although Katara would beat Korra, Azula would beat Zuko first and then they 2v1 Katara.