Time Lords vs Beyonders

Avatar image for andreys1337
AndreyS1337

554

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#1  Edited By AndreyS1337
No Caption Provided

VS

No Caption Provided

Conditions:

- No morals

- No outside help

- No prep

- Random encounter

- Neutral multiverse

Avatar image for the_imperator
The_Imperator

2275

Forum Posts

170

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#2  Edited By The_Imperator

Beyonders as a group have better feats. They should win. They killed the LT, all abstracts, Celestials, etc. And could make Molecule Men.

I mean, with prep, the Time Lords could probably have pulled off what Doom did, since IIRC Bendis said that the Beyonders were like Kryptonite to abstracts which is why Doom could win, but that's kind of unquantifiable, so ignoring that for now.

Avatar image for citizensentry
CitizenSentry

12121

Forum Posts

56760

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 6

#3  Edited By CitizenSentry

Without prep: Beyonders stomp.

With prep: Time Lords roflstomp.

Avatar image for jwwprod
jwwprod

21495

Forum Posts

967

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

Beyonders

Avatar image for rubear
Rubear

4819

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Beyounders have [zero] abilities to navigate timeline and keep a close watch on Time Lords. They are linear.
That's how Doom found a way to beat them. Time Lords, race that know tumestreams like their own fingers? Mismatch. For Beyounders.

Avatar image for db_king
db_king

856

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#6  Edited By db_king

Like I said in another thread

Starbrand killed Beyonders

Some alt universe magic team stopped beyonders

Doom killed all the Beyonders and took their power. Keep in mind doom couldn't even do this to onslaught.

The beyonders have no powers over time and the time lords kill universe and multiverse destroyers through time manipulation.

The beyonders needed molecule man as a bomb to destroy the marvelverse

Time lords have weapons they wear on their hands that erase beings from reality and reality warp on at least a planetary scale. And their tardis has anti time, anti reality warping and anti matter manipulation shields. Not even omega could get past a tardis shields and he created a universe and controlled everything in it. And they held against two big bangs.

Time lords stomp with or without prep

Avatar image for deactivated-5cc9f423d4bb9
deactivated-5cc9f423d4bb9

1243

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Avatar image for masterofluck123
MasterOfLuck123

739

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Powerscaling is irrelevant for Marvel and DC due to hundreds of writers in these companies, causing godlike characters to suddenly become mooks in the blink of an eye.

With that said the Time Lords stomps. The Beyonders were killed by a bomb that destroyed a few thousand universes. Not to mention the Time Lords can create 10-dimensional transduction barriers and the TARDISes contain 11-dimensional matrixes. The Time Lords working together as a race would curbstomp.

Avatar image for the_imperator
The_Imperator

2275

Forum Posts

170

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@masterofluck123: The Barrier is 11 dimensional, the ten dimensional reference was from Quantum Archangel where there was an area that the security didn't watch so if you had to codes already you could get in. And it was fixed, AFAIK, after that book.

Avatar image for thanosii
thanosii

4110

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@the_imperator: beyond erst killed every 16 dimensional abstract so that's 5 levels above anything The timelords faced

Avatar image for masterofluck123
MasterOfLuck123

739

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@thanosii: They are quite inconsistent though. They killed LT who is 16-D but got wiped out by a blast that destroyed only a few thousand universes.

If not for their inconsistency they should curbstomp.

Avatar image for the_imperator
The_Imperator

2275

Forum Posts

170

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@thanosii: Ok? I was the first person to respond and said I thought the Beyonders would win. Why are you informing me the Beyonders win?

Avatar image for bachh2
bachh2

927

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#13  Edited By bachh2

too hard to call on this one.

Avatar image for lanhdongls
lanhdongls

18

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#14  Edited By lanhdongls

@db_king: Star Brand did kill A Beyonder but it costed his life and that was a child Beyonder

Doom Killed Beyonders WITH the help from billions of molecule man and his machine

Beyonders DIDN'T need Molecule men to destroy the multiverse.They could do it but they had to kill the cosmic entities so they let molecule men do the job.

Avatar image for coinbiter
CoinBiter

52

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@masterofluck123: Time Lords are hugely inconsistent as well. In Second Doctor days, they seem greatly superior to the Doctor, who is a just a renegade, and he has to ask them for help, after which they wipe his ability to operate the Tardis and exile him to Earth (War Games).

In Fourth Doctor days, one disembodied Time Lord is shown to be a significant potential threat, in all likelihood mentally stronger than the Doctor (The Brain of Morbius). Later, however, they are shown to be decadent and largely ineffectual, helpless before the machinations of the intellectually superior Master and Doctor (Deadly Assassin). They subsequently fall so far that they actually manage to succumb to an invasion by the techonologically massively inferior Sontarans (Invasion of Time). They've recovered a bit of credibility by the time of the Five Doctors, in that although they still seem to need the Doctor/Master's help, they can do things such as grant a new regeneration cycle.

In the new series, their record is mixed. The Doctor and Master are portrayed again as superior to the bulk of Time Lords, and they actually are on the brink of losing against the Daleks. Still, they were participants in a war which is supposed to have terrified, for example, the Eternals (who are theoretically beyond their power) into fleeing the Universe.

So they are at least as inconsistent as the Beyonders. Personally? I think the Beyonders win.

Avatar image for the_imperator
The_Imperator

2275

Forum Posts

170

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@masterofluck123: Time Lords are hugely inconsistent as well. In Second Doctor days, they seem greatly superior to the Doctor, who is a just a renegade, and he has to ask them for help, after which they wipe his ability to operate the Tardis and exile him to Earth (War Games).

In Fourth Doctor days, one disembodied Time Lord is shown to be a significant potential threat, in all likelihood mentally stronger than the Doctor (The Brain of Morbius). Later, however, they are shown to be decadent and largely ineffectual, helpless before the machinations of the intellectually superior Master and Doctor (Deadly Assassin). They subsequently fall so far that they actually manage to succumb to an invasion by the techonologically massively inferior Sontarans (Invasion of Time). They've recovered a bit of credibility by the time of the Five Doctors, in that although they still seem to need the Doctor/Master's help, they can do things such as grant a new regeneration cycle.

In the new series, their record is mixed. The Doctor and Master are portrayed again as superior to the bulk of Time Lords, and they actually are on the brink of losing against the Daleks. Still, they were participants in a war which is supposed to have terrified, for example, the Eternals (who are theoretically beyond their power) into fleeing the Universe.

So they are at least as inconsistent as the Beyonders. Personally? I think the Beyonders win.

That's actually addressed several times by authors, the reason that none of the competent factions show up in the show, ad why they don't really care, is that they are victims of their own success. They have proof that they, as a culture, will survive past a bunch of events, and thus don't really give a crap what happens because they know they will get through it.

They never succumbed to an invasion by the Sontarans. The Doctor, in order that no other Time Lord may decide to turn on their own race, gets chosen as President and then uses his presidential powers to let the Vardans and Sontarans onto Gallifrey. Of note, the Celestial Intervention Agency, mentioned in Deadly Assassin and again in the Two Doctors, the guys who were competent and got stuff done, never show up in the Fourth Doctor episodes, precisely because they don't care because they know that it'll all work out.

The Doctor is, in universe, basically a walking plot hole. The Daleks know it (novel Engines of War) and the Time Lords know it, that's why the Celestial Intervention Agency used him to do missions in his Second, Third, and Fourth personas.

The Time Lords were on the verge of winning the Time War. We know from Invasion of Time that the Quantum Force Field can't be turned off, only temporarily opened, and then only by the President. Rassilon had to have turned it off for his plan to end time, which is what allowed Daleks onto the planet in the first place. Rassilon was going to win by killing everything and making Time Lords all that was left, that's pretty much winning.

Sure, they are not always the most competent, but given they had a billion years of basically unchallenged rule of space and time, most people wouldn't be good at running a military operation.

Avatar image for coinbiter
CoinBiter

52

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@the_imperator: I defer to your greater knowledge on the subject of the Time Lords :) Purely on the topic of who would win, I agree with your earlier post that the Beyonders have better feats.

Avatar image for neongamewave
NeonGameWave

19333

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Beyonders but the Time Lords would win with prep.

Avatar image for andreys1337
AndreyS1337

554

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Bump