Thor and Beta Ray Bill vs Superman and Wonder Woman

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ghostrider fan1

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#1  Edited By ghostrider fan1

 battle is in a desert all have no limits the battle is out of 10 times who would win? i go for team 1

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WindCloud2

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#2  Edited By WindCloud2
@ghostrider fan1 said:
"  battle is in a desert all have no limits the battle is out of 10 times who would win? i go for team 1
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"
You went with the wrong team.  If there are no BFR's in this fight.  Team 2 wins at least 7 times out of 10.
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sexy_merc

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#3  Edited By sexy_merc

Team 2 wins 9/10.

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The Mjolnir Wielder

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@Sexy Merc said:
"Team 2 wins 9/10. "
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ghostrider fan1

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#5  Edited By ghostrider fan1
@WindCloud: hows that? i guess theres bfr's but i said no limits thor could us Odin force if he wanted too and superman is vulnerable to magic no "he was granted power to resist magic" thats not in this and im sure thor beat him in the crossover and somehow wonderwoman, even though i thought it was bull, lost to storm
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lagoon_boy

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#6  Edited By lagoon_boy
Team Two. superior strength, speed and durability
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spidey 15

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#7  Edited By spidey 15
@lagoon_boy said:
"Team Two. superior strength, speed and durability "
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The Mjolnir Wielder

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@ghostrider fan1 said:
" @WindCloud: hows that? i guess theres bfr's but i said no limits thor could us Odin force if he wanted too and superman is vulnerable to magic no "he was granted power to resist magic" thats not in this and im sure thor beat him in the crossover and somehow wonderwoman, even though i thought it was bull, lost to storm "

1. No, he used all of it to repair Mjolnir in Thor #601 
2. Yeah, but that certainly doesn't mean that he would lose to Thor  
3. Superman ended up winning their fight at the end
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ghostrider fan1

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#9  Edited By ghostrider fan1
@The Mjolnir Wielder: oh i did not know that i mean i heard he picked up mjolnr but i dont know for what i didnt see the whole series but out of 10 battles i still think team one can win at least 6/10 times because i know thor is even stronger now
@lagoon_boy: i dont think there faster or have better durability stronger probably but not the other two i still think its pretty even fight
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slimj87d

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#10  Edited By slimj87d
@ghostrider fan1: 
 
Thor has never been shown at fighting at speeds that Superman has. I personally think if a comic book writer wrote them fighting each other they would show Thor fighting at high speeds too if Superman started to but that would be PIS.
 
A lot of people are going to give to to Superman and Woner Woman because DC characters sleep, poop and eat at FTL.
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capall

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#11  Edited By capall

supes and diana would beat the blondie and donkey face 10/10 here, not only they are physically superior in strength, reflex, speed but diana is also a master tactician that would teach the thunder god of asgard and his counter part a lesson in art of war here

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King_Saturn

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#12  Edited By King_Saturn
Superman and Wonder Woman for the win
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Maikel

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#13  Edited By Maikel
@SlimJ87D: Thor did manage to hurt superman, but was beaten, later in a sequal comic he mentions that he would now be able to beat him using the right tactics. Superman(and wonder woman), were "temorary" declared worthy(anyone who is worthy in the eyes of Odin can lift the hammer!), the only unworthy creature ever seen lifting the hammer on pure strength is the green Hulk.
 
Horseface can definetely hurt wonder woman, he just has to look her deep in the eyes, ask for a sugarcube, lick her with his tongue and she'll faint from disgust. Then they could both concentrate on superman, then they -might- be able to keep hitting on him so hard he gets knocked out. 
 
But DC's team would win this 8 out of 10.
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lagoon_boy

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#14  Edited By lagoon_boy
@Maikel:  Most Cross-Overs  are not cannon, so i would not use a Cross-Over feat in a debate.
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Baldy

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#15  Edited By Baldy
@ghostrider fan1 said:

" @WindCloud: hows that? i guess theres bfr's but i said no limits thor could us Odin force if he wanted too and superman is vulnerable to magic no "he was granted power to resist magic" thats not in this and im sure thor beat him in the crossover and somehow wonderwoman, even though i thought it was bull, lost to storm "

 This is the strongest version of each of these characters? Then team two stomps as it'd be Superman with the sword of Superman who was pretty much TOAA.
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Maikel

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#16  Edited By Maikel
@lagoon_boy: I wasn't going to include this in the debate, but when facts from the crossovers are used, they should at least be used right; Thor didn't win that fight, and the ability for the DC characters to lift Mjolnir was temporary granted by Odin.
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lagoon_boy

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#17  Edited By lagoon_boy
@Maikel:  Yes. But Cross-Overs are Non-Cannon, Odin giving permission to lift the Mjolnir is very out of character.
 
Facts from Cross-Overs are not accurate and should not be used.
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-Unseen-

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#18  Edited By -Unseen-
@capall said:
"supes and diana would beat the blondie and donkey face 10/10 here, not only they are physically superior in strength, reflex, speed but diana is also a master tactician that would teach the thunder god of asgard and his counter part a lesson in art of war here "
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bumnut

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#19  Edited By bumnut

Thor and Bill, 8/10.  Supes might be stronger, but not by much, Diana certainly is not.
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Neon_Nemesis

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#20  Edited By Neon_Nemesis
@bumnut said:
"Thor and Bill, 8/10.  Supes might be stronger, but not by much, Diana certainly is not. "

Wrong and...wrong again
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lagoon_boy

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#21  Edited By lagoon_boy
@bumnut:Actually, Wonder Woman is far stronger than any of the Asgardians, If i remember Correctly it Was Wonder Woman, Superman and Martian Manhunter that moved the earth.
 
Thor And Beta Ray Bill may have more Weapons in Their Arsenal but Again as i Stated here before, Team Two Is Stronger, Faster and more durable.
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bumnut

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#22  Edited By bumnut
@lagoon_boy said:

" @bumnut:Actually, Wonder Woman is far stronger than any of the Asgardians, If i remember Correctly it Was Wonder Woman, Superman and Martian Manhunter that moved the earth.
 
Thor And Beta Ray Bill may have more Weapons in Their Arsenal but Again as i Stated here before, Team Two Is Stronger, Faster and more durable."


Your average asgardian, yes, but not Thor or BRB even.
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-Unseen-

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#23  Edited By -Unseen-
@bumnut said:

Not Thor, BRB or even Hercules. "


Yes, Yes, and Yes.
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#24  Edited By bumnut
@-Unseen- said:
"@bumnut said:
Not Thor, BRB or even Hercules. "
Yes, Yes, and Yes. "

No, no and no.  Thor is closer to Superman in power, both Superman and Thor>WW in strength and power!
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-Unseen-

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#25  Edited By -Unseen-
@bumnut:
Wrong again.
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lagoon_boy

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#26  Edited By lagoon_boy
@bumnut:Really? can you show me proof that suggest Wonder Woman is weaker than Thor? Can you show me Thor lifting an object similar to One-Third of the Earth's ? weight   or Even BRB and Hercules.
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Neon_Nemesis

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#27  Edited By Neon_Nemesis
@-Unseen- said:
"@bumnut said:

Not Thor, BRB or even Hercules. "

Yes, Yes, and Yes. "


 

@bumnut said:

"@-Unseen- said:
"@bumnut said:
Not Thor, BRB or even Hercules. "
Yes, Yes, and Yes. "
No, no and no.  Thor is closer to Superman in power, both Superman and Thor>WW in strength and power! "

Beta Ray Bill barely defeated Iron Man, Thor just got his ass kicked by Osbournes Initiative and and Herc got knocked on his ass by Daredevil 
 
So yeah, Wonder Woman is easily stronger then any of those 3, come back when they can tug 1/3 of the entire planet 
 
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slimj87d

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#28  Edited By slimj87d

Posting to clarifying the towing or tugging planets.
 
Weight = Mass * gravity
 Mass = Volume * Density.
 
 The gravitational pull on objects because of the earth is 9.81 m / sec^2, this is a 1G.
 
From  Science Forum:
A Thousand Pardons
 
The Gravitational pull our sun pulling the earth follows these equations:
 
Using 150 million km as the radius

ω²r

or

(2 pi/(365.2564*24*60*60))² * 150000000000

which is

0.006 m/sec²

or about .0006 g, same as Yorkshireman
 
 
Therefore, if there was some kind of magic encasing the earth such as Green Lanterns power ring, and with the mass of the earth which is  
 
5.9 x 10^24 Kg (kilo Grams alone)
 
Then the weight equivalent to what we are use to is according to Gs is
 
3.47 X 10^22 of Kgf (Kilograms in forces) or  7.64 X 10^22 lbf
 
1. If Wonder Woman can pull 1/3 of a planet in the suns orbit where the earth is she is actually lifting a weight of 76 400 000 000 000 000 000 000 lbf
 
No one in marvel is this strongBUT
 
2. if Wonder Woman is not pulling the planet within the Sun's space then there are even less Gs and she is actually towing or tugging much less weight, so she may not be as strong as many of you guys come to think.If she is actually pulling it back towards the sun then she is even pulling much much much less weight.

So depending on your scans of towing and tugging planets, be careful when comparing.
 
One of the greatest strength feats I can verify truthfully on the top of my head is Hulk lifting a weight of 150 billion tons, which is 3 X 10^14  lbf or 300 000 000 000 000 lbf. Not as much as Wonder Woman tugging the planet, but I really don't know what conditions she was towing it, away or towards the sun? 
 
Meh, Debate on, I still don't think Thor and Beta Ray Bill have ever at very high speeds. If they were capable than Thor would have been able to tag Pietro easily in mighty Avengers.

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jacobyLIVE

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#29  Edited By jacobyLIVE

I love the Asgardians here, but they can't compete with DC's resident powerhouses 

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OmegaDynasty

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#30  Edited By OmegaDynasty

I heard Supes isn't vulnearble to magic anymore, is this true? If so then this fight might be a little off balanced.
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slimj87d

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#31  Edited By slimj87d
@OmegaDynasty: 
 
He still is, only Prime is immune to magic attacks.
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OmegaDynasty

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#32  Edited By OmegaDynasty
@SlimJ87D said:
" @OmegaDynasty:   He still is, only Prime is immune to magic attacks. "

How dare you speak that reched name! You should be ashamed! lol
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Maikel

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#33  Edited By Maikel
@SlimJ87D: you mean clockwise or counter-clockwise related to the orbit, yes that is simply adding your own momentum to the the momentum the planet alreay has, so pushing it in out of orbit requires a lot less strength. But when you choose to apply the laws of physycs, in any form, the whole idea of tying a chain to a planet and pulling it is ridiculous! Objects in space are attracted to larger objects, the moon around the earth, the earth and other planets around the sun, it's thesame as Chuck Norris not doing push-ups but pushing the earth down. You would need an enormous mass(not strength) to pull this off. Logicly only the Juggernaut could do this. Even if you were to pull against the orbit you would still be incredibly stupid, because using the momentum any three of those(supes, WW, and MM) could have done it on their own. 
 
And If earth was to be relocated, I think the only character to come up with a giant chain and pull it would be Bizarro.(even though I know it was drawn and considered canon)
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OmegaDynasty

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#34  Edited By OmegaDynasty

I think that horse face gets a face lift with two fist, he may not look like George Clooney but he'll be on his way.

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slimj87d

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#35  Edited By slimj87d
@Maikel: 
 
I'm talking about away from the sun, no clockwise or nothing.
 
Don't get upset that I'm trying to engage something for us to relate to. The fact is with recent canon Superman needed Greenlantern to create some sort of safe encasing of a planet for him to tow and tug it. 
 
I only mention these things for use to be able to analyze things more clearly. If we go by your examples, it will only confuse the debate more and open a big loop hole again with comic physics. 
 
I just want this topic to end, and for people to not compare the strength of the characters because of the ambiguity when it comes to strength in comics, but rather acknowledge that speed is the key factor in this fight and this is why Bill and Thor lose, because this is not ambiguous, we know that Superman and Wonder Woman fight at very very fast speeds that Thor and Bill have not been able to display. But we can not directly prove strength feats because of ambiguities that go unexplained.
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Maikel

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#36  Edited By Maikel
@SlimJ87D: I won't be upset, but when it comes to speed and durability, all characters have been known to move faster then the human eye, if someone wrote down a speed factor X, while the other side has none, or states a lower number that does not have to be their  "maximum" (how do you draw a person who is moving so fast you can't see him anyway), this numbers issue was promoted heavily by the DBZ fanboys. 
 
And how fast is a speeding bullet compared to lightning? And superman is slower then the Flash is, so he does not have the ultimate speedfactor here. And could not Mjolnir harnass energies? How about kryptonite? that would even the odds a lot in Thor's favor, still making Wonder Woman the bigger thread.   
 
This fight would turn in Favor of DC easily, also for manouverability(Thor and Horseface have only limited flight through their Hammers)
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xan84

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#37  Edited By xan84

Sups solos.
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Jack Hammer

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#38  Edited By Jack Hammer

Superman and Wonder Woman win this fight.
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WW-Fan

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#39  Edited By WW-Fan

team 2 wins!
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ThanosIsMad

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#41  Edited By ThanosIsMad
@SlimJ87D said:
" @ghostrider fan1:   Thor has never been shown at fighting at speeds that Superman has. I personally think if a comic book writer wrote them fighting each other they would show Thor fighting at high speeds too if Superman started to but that would be PIS.  A lot of people are going to give to to Superman and Woner Woman because DC characters sleep, poop and eat at FTL. "
It wouldn't be PIS if Thor fought at super speed.  He's outpaced Quicksilver before and has been stated to move faster than lightning by Hela.  But Thor holds back out of not wanting to kill his foes and will even take a loss if it means not killing an opponent.  And he tends to fight his enemies using the same tactics they do, which is why he'll slug it out with the Hulk and grapple with Hercules.  Superman rarely fights at high speeds unless a writer wants someone to job.  Now if Thor was meeting or exceeding the FTL speeds Superman can reach in combat, that would be PIS. 
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Manchine

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#42  Edited By Manchine

Very Very tough battle but got to give it to Team Superman.  Thor Loses to Superman or Beats Wonder Woman.  Beta Ray Bill Loses to Superman bad or Barely loses to Wonder Woman.
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Maikel

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#43  Edited By Maikel
@ThanosIsMad: That is true, Thor always like to fight his opponents on their own grounds.. Superman thesame, the bigger the victory is! Also neither would kill eachother. I say the match goes to DC 7 or 8 out of 10 times, but there is no stomping here.
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#44  Edited By slimj87d
@ThanosIsMad: 

@Maikel:


 I still don't buy it. I know he's capable of fighting far in excess of the human capability, but fighting at Superman and Wonder Woman's speeds is highly questionable.
 
Superman's speed is something he is consistently shown to do. Thor moving quickly and Hela saying something about it is PIS. It is not something consistent you can use as a fact.
 
Superman is much faster than a speeding bullet during a fight, I can say that confidently. Thor is much faster than a speeding bullet during combat, I feel a little iffy about stating that as a fact.
 
Sure the bullet isn't as fast as lighting, but the user that is trying to summon it isn't as fast as lightning. Thor's use of thunder is like me firing a gun. I sure the hell don't move as fast as the bullet, and the bullet will only hit something that my reflexes and action can match.
 
If Superman moves anywhere near his high speeds, when Thor launches the thunder Superman isn't going to be there.
 
Lastly, Pietro isn't anywhere near Superman's speed either, and Thor still has trouble tagging him.
 
I do not claim curb stomps, I only claim that speed plays the key factor to the DC characters winning.
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Maikel

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#45  Edited By Maikel
@SlimJ87D: A common feat is swatting a bullet with a hand(superman), Wonder Woman using her bracelets to block them, and thor blocking them With Mjolnir, those feats you can compare 1=1. How much faster one is towards the other you do not know.  
 
Ofcourse superman is an "original hero" who is never supposed to be completely surpassed in brawn and physical prowess.
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xan84

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#46  Edited By xan84

I realy don t see the point of all this. Can Thor hit with the power of a supernova ? Because Sups can survive those ..
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slimj87d

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#47  Edited By slimj87d
@Maikel: 
 
Well I hope I didn't give off any impression that I have fallen for the "original hero" thing. Haha. To be honest, I really don't like Superman, he's just too powerful it makes things uninteresting. They had to depower him on many occasions, throw in Kryptonite all the time and revive his whole race of Kryptonians to make him look vulernable during plot devices.
 
He is no Spider-man or Captain America to me. Someone that knows they are physically no match for most of the encounters that they face and must rise up to the occasion because of their indomitable wills. And even if he is ever portrayed as someone of the character, his overpowering history just ruins it for me.
 
This is just my opinion though. I just don't want to come in here sounding like a Superman fanboy.
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Maikel

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#48  Edited By Maikel
@SlimJ87D:  
That's because he's too cheesy a character to portray, even in the 70's(though Superman I is a really great movie, like part V is), he was originally to powerfull as it was, but you can't change the character anymore, he is suppossed to be near invulnerable and have infinite strength and he can fly. I do like the smallville adaption of him where he is not yet all-powerfull, and shows his darker side more often. Most of my favorite comics of him actually have the character end up powerless, near death or beaten do death(possibly some writers got fed up with him too). 
 
Mjolnir might be able to recreate kryptonite radiation.. but, what is Wonder Womans weakness? Really? 
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xan84

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#49  Edited By xan84
@Maikel said:
" @SlimJ87D:  That's because he's too cheesy a character to portray, even in the 70's(though Superman I is a really great movie, like part V is), he was originally to powerfull as it was, but you can't change the character anymore, he is suppossed to be near invulnerable and have infinite strength and he can fly. I do like the smallville adaption of him where he is not yet all-powerfull, and shows his darker side more often. Most of my favorite comics of him actually have the character end up powerless, near death or beaten do death(possibly some writers got fed up with him too).  Mjolnir might be able to recreate kryptonite radiation.. but, what is Wonder Womans weakness? Really?  "


 
First off Smallville Clark is NOTHING like Sups, he is a idiot that would leave the world burn just so he could be with Lana Lang. Morals are all fuked up.

 
WW weakness is sharp objects :P As long as she is not bloking them with her wrist things she is getting cut. 
 
Mjolnir can't crate K, hell he has no idea of what K even is to begin with. 
 
Curent Thor (not clasic) can't do much of nothing but hit stuff with his hammer. Perhaps i am exagerating but i can see curent Thor go down from 1 (that is one) Superman level punch (all out not holding back). 
 
Sups is FTL, lighting is not even close to light speed so there ..

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Maikel

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#50  Edited By Maikel
@Xan: You missed the past 3 seasons I believe, where MM regains his powers, and he and GA meet up with Hawkman, Stargirl, Dr. Faith? He is less perfect, but his moral issues(unless infected with Red K.) are thesame. He's on different grounds then normal with Metallo, but he is not yet the person to be Superman(likely next year, final season, and he'll probably put on the traditional costume too...) 
 
Mjolnis can harness and recreate energy, but this would also put it to much in thors favor. And since WW is vulnerable to sharp objects, BRB would have to use the sharp end of Stormbreaker to damage her(or just bite her!)
 
Classic thor's hammer had more abilities, but they were temporaly disabled, he can still control lightning and the weapon itself is still "magic". As for taking a punch from Supes, who knows. Thor can take punches from the Hulk... 
 
Sups is capable of flying FTL, but he is only "faster then a speeding bullet", moving at a certain speed and fighting are two different things.