The Speed of Thor

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BuckshotWasHere

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Edited By BuckshotWasHere  Moderator

We've been having another one of our regular chats about how fast Thor is and during this latest round I came up with a new idea to reconcile some of the sorts of things we see when it comes to Thor's speed. Now, to be clear, I'm not suggesting that this is how Thor actually works or how anyone else should see him, this is just me trying to figure out a way to accept as many displays of Thor's speed as possible in the face of the inherent contradictions. I'm curious to see if what I'm thinking is supportable by on panel evidence or not and if any coherent system or organization of Thor's speed feats is possible, and I also want your help with the whole endeavor. But your help comes later, for now, the problem. In the simplest terms, Thor has some displays of speed at an extraordinarily high scale, and he has some displays that are more in the realm of street level characters. He also has a ton of displays that may be in the middle somewhere but are hard to pin down. My thought is that perhaps Thor has the sort of speed that characters like Deathstroke or Midnighter have, where for the most part they operate like high street level characters, but occasionally they operate at a level beyond that which approaches speed more like Flash and it's not a flaw of writing or excused by the plot, but it's firmly within their abilities.

That's what I want to see if I can support with clear displays. To aid the collection and sorting of data, and for easy presentation whenever I feel I've gotten a lot, I'm making some categories. Some, the ones with other characters, will be simply for comparison and some will be different sorts of displays from Thor. What I need from you is ALL THE SPEED FEATS YOU CAN FIND. I'm going to want them primarily for Thor, but to beef up one of the major points of comparison, send me what you've got for Deathstroke as well (I got Midnighter, no worries). I want good ones, great ones, bad ones, old ones, new ones, related characters (various mjolnir wielders, beta ray bill, jane foster, etc), everything. The only sort I don't want for Thor right now are pure travel speed feats. If he's doing something while traveling, sure, but I don't need a million images of him just flying through space. If you have anything that's not immediately clear, give me context or references or at least issue numbers so I can find things myself. Unfortunately I'm not able to start us off with images but I'll be back with some in a few hours or so. I'm going to be filling in areas myself and updating in general as I get the chance but anything you provide will just speed things up. And in case it needs to be said, yes, I'm going into this with some preconceived notions, but I'm open to them being challenged as I fill this post with examples.

Some clarifications for the images in general since I'm not going to be commenting on each one individually. I feel like I've been pretty particular about what feats I'm presenting here, there are definitely more for each character that could be presented. I'll get into more clarification on each section as I go. The reason I was so strict was to make sure, as best as possible, that the displays could be taken at face value without guessing what they're "really" showing. This is not an attempt to just look at what Thor does most often but to look at all he seems to be capable of and see what sort of picture that paints.

Comparisons

Flash Speed - A DC representative to demonstrate high speed

For Flash, there are of course a ton of feats, but so it's clear, the point is not necessarily the exact speed he's moving, since this thread isn't about pegging Thor's exact speed, but looking at what grouping he best fits in, so for that reason, with the Flash examples, take note of how his high speed is demonstrated.

Silver Surfer Speed - A Marvel representative to demonstrate high speed

Sentry

Adding this section because after mentioning him in the thread I realized he displays speed in the sorts of ways people say Marvel characters don't.

Midnighter Speed - Potential Thorspeeder 1

With Midnighter, separating pure speed from what is possible due to his combat computer is tricky, but I think I've picked well, using either instances where his combat computer is not a factor, or instances where high levels of physical speed are required even after the combat computer does its thing, or he makes clear references to his speed as the reason he is able to act the way he does.

Deathstroke Speed - Potential Thorspeeder 2

With Deathstroke, there are a TON of examples of him moving around while bullets or lasers are flying that I've seen presented as all examples of dodging bullets. If I were going into detail for him like I am for Thor, I'd probably put them in an "Unclear Speed" section because it's very hard to say for sure whether he's dodging bullet/lasers or just moving while being shot at or even aim dodging. Since I'm not separating his displays like that, I've simply dropped almost all of those kinds of displays.

Added here are displays against the Flash specifically.

And here is a display of the Flash showing his speed to Deathstroke which should serve as an example in the difference in how they use their speed (isolated actions vs continuous application). There is also an image of Impulse talking about how slow Deathstroke is before Deathstroke demonstrates his workaround for that, an area of effect attack, which we'll see again with Thor. (Wasn't originally going to put this here but if I only do one image it makes it big so I had to do two.)

Street Level - Cross-company Baseline (Wolverine, Batman, Captain America, etc)

You're going to see a lot of Captain America here, and that's not without reason. First, he's been around a long time and as, by some measures, the very best "non-powered" hero and poster child, he's racked up a ton of the sort of feats we're looking at. Second, his shield is about the closest thing a street level character has to Mjolnir (Iron Fist has a number of feats here for a similar reason), a tool that can just be put in front of anything to stop it. Third, there's an idea out there that Marvel doesn't demonstrate speed in a way comparable to DC characters, and with Deathstroke here as well (you know they both say they "see faster" than things like bullets and that's what lets them react quickly? if you didn't the images are here), I thought it was a nice comparison.

Thor Speed

High Operational speed

These are Thor's displays where he operates at anything clearly outside of the range of what can be considered street level. The term "operate" is being used to mean performing a series of systematic actions.

....Yeah, I'm still waiting too...

High Reflexive Speed

These are Thor's displays where he performs any action clearly outside the range of what can be considered street level but not as a series of systematic actions.

Unclear Speed - Blurs, potential metaphors, and other unclear displays

Speed displays that cannot accurately or reliably be measured.

Unclear Limits

Just to have a place to demonstrate the mirror of the previous section, this includes displays of Thor not overcoming unclear speed displays. Just as he blocks energy, he gets hit by it, and just as he tags fast moving characters, he gets hit by them when they're moving fast. This is just for balance and to show he's not always presented as faster than any unclear speed, but like the previous section, no definite information can be gleaned without stated values.

Hammer Spinning

I added this section because Thor's most impressive (dealing with multiple projectiles) blocking feats tend to involve him spinning his hammer. Personally I find this to be the equivalent of Captain America raising his shield, but decided to give it its own section.

Here are a couple really interesting hammer spinning ones. Interesting enough to look at separately. In these, Thor talks about spinning his hammer even when its spinning on its own, out of his hand. In one instance he throws it and it spins FASTER than it was in his hand. It's pretty common to attribute the speed Mjolnir flies, its ability to tow Thor through space, and even some fun tricks to the hammer, but perhaps even the spinning itself is more an attribute of the hammer than Thor himself.

Street Level Speed

I decided to split up the street level section so things wouldn't get muddled. This section has Thor performing feats that have been performed by other street level characters. I wasn't sure if random energy blocking should go here or in the Unclear Speed section, but I put them here because Captain America performs similar or identical displays with his shield.

Street Level Limits

Thor's displays where limits can be demonstrated that are purely or primarily a result of speed. Just like a clear reference to speed is needed to justify high end speed, a reference to speed is needed to support the idea of a lower limit. I think the only examples here without a clear reference to speed will be times he's hit multiple times in a row by characters who are street level or accepted as outright slow. There are PLENTY of examples I'm not using of Thor being hit when no significant speed at all is suggested and I could easily have more images of that than anything else, but this is not a list of any time Thor has been hit by anything or failed to hit something.

Direct Speed Comparisons

Decided to add this section to include direct comparisons for some of the feats most commonly used to suggest Thor has high speed to look at which things have been performed by street level characters, characters with speed on that level, or speedsters. Discussions about Thor's speed usually involve claims from some saying Thor's speed is being "lowballed" or that only his "bad displays" are being used. This section focuses on what he has done and the sort of other characters that have performed similar feats so we can determine what leel of speed is necessary for the sorts of things Thor does. For some of these, there will be only one display in a given section so I've added fun Midnighter image just so I can upload multiple small pictures instead of being forced to upload a single large image.

Reacting to Bullets - Figured I'd start low and work my way up. First up is Thor reacting to bullets:

And now street level characters reacting to bullets: (Included here are street level characters actually catching bullets as well. There are SO MANY of these, I'm just using a few.)

And just for further comparison, some examples of what it looks like when "verified speedsters" react to bullets.

Reacting to Random/Unspecified Energy - Thor:

Street level characters:

Further Comparison - Deathstroke: Take note of the explicit speed statements made when Deathstroke avoids energy attacks. It's something not really seen in Thor's displays.

Further Comparison - Midnighter: (In general, Midnighter is a tough character to use in this sort of thing because his combat computer means he knows things are coming ahead of time, but two things are making me use him anyway. First, there are some times when he attributes his ability to perform some action to his speed directly, at least one of those is below. Second, there are some times when knowing alone wouldn't be enough to perform a feat, and he'd need the actual movement speed as well, at least one of those is below as well.)

Reacting to "Light Speed" Energy - Thor: Thought Thor had a "clear" example of this but it turns out...not so much. Captain America and Hulk do though.

Street level characters:

Further Comparison - Hulk: (The first appearance of Hulk in this experiment.)

Reacting to Missiles - Thor:

This bit was actually difficult to find for street level characters for what I think are obvious reasons (strength and durability requirements which are blurred less for street level characters) but I think I did alright.

Further Comparison - Midnighter:

Further Comparison - Hulk:

"Lightning" Speed Descriptor - Thor:

Street level characters:

Further Comparison - Hulk:

Moving Faster than Sight -Thor: One of these says "almost faster than mere mortal eyes can follow", but I put it here anyway.

Street level characters: I've been sleeping on Batman so I'll put him here. There's also some of him reacting to bullets and reacting to or tagging a well known speedster. I guess this is the Batman section since I don't want to reupload the groups of images.

Further Comparison - Midnighter:

Acting at the Speed of Thought - Thor

Deathstroke:

Midnighter: This one is indirect, but in it, Impetus is said to move faster than two whole teams (including arguably the planet's best telepath) can think, and the telepath and his team are specifically asking for Midnighter to take him down because no one else can and the character with what they thought were the best reflexes just hurt herself trying to stop him.

Using AOE Attacks to Hit Speedsters - Thor:

Street level characters:

Tagging Speedsters - Thor:

Street level characters:

Further Comparison - Deathstroke: (The nice thing about these is that speed is specifically being mentioned along with these displays.)

Further Comparison - Midnighter: (The nice thing about these is that speed is specifically being mentioned along with these displays.)

Further Comparison - Hulk:

Thor/Black Panther subsection - Just because this particular image of Thor "surprising" Silver Surfer with his speed has been used to support Thor, here's an example of Black Panther surprising Surfer with speed. What's interesting is that Black Panther displays the reflexes to perform an action at a speed that surprises Surfer.

"Fighting Evenly" with Speedsters - Thor: This turned out to be a pretty disappointing section. Most of the support for Thor's speed comes from him "tagging speedsters" (which by now you've seen multiple examples of "street level" characters do) but when pressed for examples of him fighting them in any sort of extended battle at speed, very little is provided. I think I'll split these up.

First up, Thor vs Gladiator. This is actually multiple fights. Aside from the general lack of speed on display (aside from Gladiator successfully blitzing and disarming Thor), I'll point out that in the first fight, Gladiator specifically says he's going to stand his ground, which, if anything, suggests a lack of speed being used on his part.

Thor vs Surfer: These two have obviously fought plenty of times, but below is what I see a lot when on this subject so I'm putting it here, it's two different battles. I'll just say, I don't see much evidence of speed being used by either party (except at the very beginning when they don't even use it to fight each other).

Thor vs Angela: This is not one continuous fight. The first image is Thor "fighting evenly" with Angela. It's only one page but the fight ends on the next page with the pillar you see cut in the first page falling on her (I don't think that's a great testament to her speed, but its what we've got). Also, claims about Angela's own speed don't actually provide any measure and further rely on some dubious claims, so I'm a little wary of using her as an example of a speedster, but it's what we have. Following the first page though is another of Angela's fights with Thor, with comments on the speed displayed there. Not flattering for Thor, but I'll let you decide.

Street level character: Just showing one fight here, I think it's longer than any fight Thor has had with a speedster.

Eh, why not show another one. This is Majestic fighting 3 members of the Skein (he's killed one and is using her sword when these scans start) for an extended period of time. Their speed is on the level of Zealot (bullet blocking street level character, not a speedster).

Further Comparison - Ultimate Quicksilver: This is to display a difference between how characters with and without speed look when fighting characters with speed.

Explicit Speed Measures/Descriptions - Thor:

Street level characters: Not much here, which is what I always expected to be the outcome. This is the one area where Thor goes beyond what street level characters are capable of, though it does look like Iron Fist has performed at least one similar feat.

Further Comparison - Deathstroke: Sort of a weird one but there are several time statements in this one so I thought it should go here. Deathstroke's movements are described as him moving through frozen time and acting in instants.

Further Comparison - Midnighter: The blink of an eye is measured at 100-400 milliseconds

Further Comparison - Flash: I personally think Flash shows speed of an entirely different sort than what Midnighter, Deathstroke, or Thor demonstrate, and not just in how fast he goes but what he can do with speed that truly allows him to perform processes at a high level. But these are here for you to be the judge.

Thoughts

This section isn't set in stone and it will change as I go through the images. From what I've seen so far though, Thor does not demonstrate the sort of operational speed characters like Flash do and most of his quantifiable speed feats are within the wide range of street level speed. Or put another way, when the question is put forth, "Can Thor fight at high speed?" the answer seems to be no. If fighting is a continuous action, a back and forth of blows or movements, a two-sided exchange and physical combat, then Thor doesn't do that. Characters like Flash or Quicksilver fight at high speed. Thor seems to display only the ability to deliver a single blow or similar action at a high speed, which is the same that can be said for Deathstroke, Midnighter, and "street level characters". There doesn't actually seem to be anything Thor does that can't be replicated by street level or borderline street level characters, and there are displays from "true speedsters" that Thor does not appear to match, even in his decades-old showings, where most of his "high speed" displays come from.

This is a repost from elsewhere in the thread:

If just looking at all those images has shown me anything, it's that we REALLY need to get away from this idea that one character fighting another makes their speed equal. It's ridiculous and doesn't hold up to the slightest scrutiny. If Thor "fights evenly" with a character who has super speed, then some are quick to say Thor is just as fast. But then if Thor "fights evenly" with someone much slower, what are we to take from that? To my mind, there are only three options:

  1. This new character is now automatically as fast as Thor and thus as fast as the first FTL character in the example.
  2. Thor is as slow as this second character, which is now a contradiction
  3. Thor is holding back his speed to fight this slower character

Now if we can toss out 1) on the basis that we all know Wolverine isn't as fast as the Silver Surfer (though obviously Black Panther is, just go with it) and 2) on the basis that it's an outright contradiction, we're left with 3) (or some fourth option I don't know about). And 3) seems to be what I see from the Thor Speed Truthers, that Thor really is as fast as someone like Flash or Silver Surfer but he fights slower. But aside from the existence of examples of Thor saying he could fight faster if he weren't worried about hurting people (which is not a problem confirmed speedsters ever seem to have btw), the simple response is, "Why is it reasonable to think that Thor was holding his speed back but not that it was Surfer (or Established Fast Character X) that was holding their speed back to fight Thor?" Characters "fighting evenly" should have no bearing on greater speed unless speed is specifically mentioned or clearly depicted in some way. Even in the case of "blitzing", particularly with flying characters, I don't know how much that can be expected to factor in when we don't know how much faster than normal they're going. I think too much stock in placed in who can fight whom as an indicator for speed. I thought this was clear, but the preponderance of images says otherwise, and while it does seem to be more a thought process from the Thor Speed Truther camp, it's not exclusive to them.

There is another thing I keep seeing, though this isn't from everyone, and that is that there are lot of times Thor gets hit by an unknown enemy, projectile, or energy weapon, and seemingly to head off the idea that this makes Thor slow, the excuse is that "we don't know how fast it was going and it might have been light speed so it's not a bad display for Thor." Now, and I've stated this before, I don't think every hit means something bad for the character getting hit or necessarily displays a greater amount of speed, and there are plenty of reasons for this. I'll provide just a few:

  1. Everyone gets hit. It's comics, it would be dull if this weren't true.
  2. Super fast characters fight slow all the time for in character reasons as well. I'll use my boy Majestic as an example. Most fights where he takes on randoms or even characters he knows, he fights at their speed. Sometimes he does it because he's talking to them, sometimes he does it because he doesn't fear what they can dish out, sometimes he does it because he wants to show off, sometimes he does it just because he's not in a rush. Very few characters (usually just speedsters) default to high speed when they start a fight and even then it's pretty much never their max speed when they do. And even speedsters usually don't just blitz every enemy they see on a regular day.
  3. Characters of the same speed can dodge each others attacks or just miss. Every h2h street fighter in comics has fights where one or both of the combatants avoid getting struck, and usually they take turns dodging attacks, because it's (usually) not about a vast speed difference but about skill or just knowing how to dodge or block a punch even if one doesn't have a ton of skill.

So really, I don't think Thor needs excuses for getting hit by things he "shouldn't" if he were going at "full speed". But the excuses themselves raise a question. If the reason he got hit is because the attack was at light speed, but the claim is also that he's faster than light, he STILL shouldn't get hit. If anything, the attempt at an excuse just makes Thor look worse.

This is another bit I wrote in another thread about the idea that Thor doesn't necessarily pilot mjolnir through space so its travel speed isn't necessarily connected to his personal speed.

Any number of instances suggest Thor is not making moment by moment adjustments to Mjolnir's movements:

  • Thor not knowing where an enemy was and sending mjolnir to search underground for him
  • Mjolnir opening dimensional portals and flying through space to go find Thor when Thor didn't even know exactly what was happening
  • Mjolnir being released from Thor's hand and then moving in circles even faster when not physically controlled by him
  • The many times Mjolnir has not listened to Thor (his own words) and refused to be moved
  • Mjolnir not listening to Odin and refusing to be moved
  • Jane Thor having Mjolnir do her fighting for her (I really like it every time I see it)
  • Mjolnir pretending to be Jane without her knowing (interesting here is that at one point Jane/Thor can see through Jane/Mjolnir's eyes, clearly demonstrating that the hammer's perception can be shared, and suggesting yet another way that Thor could "pilot" at high speeds without innately having perceptions that would allow for it...though I personally still think its mjolnir doing the driving)
  • Mjolnir teleporting on its own
  • Mjolnir pulling Jane/Thor through space without her permission or guidance
  • Mjolnir pulling Odin all over Asgard and destroying it in the process without his permission or guidance

These are just off the top of my head. Mjolnir clearly has a "mind" of its own and is more than capable of flying on its own. And given that its also pretty firmly established that Mjolnir is aware of Thor's wants and needs without him needing to communicate them, Thor wouldn't need to be consciously piloting even if he suddenly wanted to go somewhere else. If midway through a cross-galaxy flight that only takes a few minutes he forgets that he left the light on in Avengers tower and he desires to go back and turn it off, his thought process isn't necessarily operating at the speed he's moving at. It's like getting on a train and thinking while it's moving. You don't need to be thinking at the same rate the train is moving. It will take you the same 2 seconds to come up with the answer to 235 x 2 whether the train is moving 1 mile an hour or 1 million. The distance traveled has no affect on your processing speed. Even putting aside the possibility that while flying, Thor relies on the clearly established ability of him perceiving things as Mjolnir does, he doesn't need to.

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Debelindzo

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#1  Edited By Debelindzo

Did the Jay Garrick vs Thor thread inspire you to do this? Because that thread was a bloody flame war. Nice work.

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Royal_Warrior

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This isn't going to end well.....

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Miss_America_

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So what your basically saying that Thor typically fights at slower speeds at his base but can speed them up over the course of a battle?

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BuckshotWasHere

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#4 BuckshotWasHere  Moderator

So what your basically saying that Thor typically fights at slower speeds at his base but can speed them up over the course of a battle?

Literally the opposite of that. The idea is that his "slow" speed is his base and he can occasionally move faster.

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brucerogers

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@buckshotwashere: Quick question: You think Deathstroke has above street level speed?. I personally don't think he is faster than Logan

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Miss_America_

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@buckshotwashere: Wait that's what I meant

His base speed is slow and he can speed them up.

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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@buckshotwashere: I hope this doesn't turn into a flame war.

mind if I PM you something I worked on?

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comicace3

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This isn't going to end well.....

It actually might.

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BuckshotWasHere

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#10 BuckshotWasHere  Moderator

Did the Jay Garrick vs Thor thread inspire you to do this? Because that thread was a bloody flame war. Nice work.

It inspired my latest go at this idea, but I've done a couple things like this before, just not with this thought behind it.

@buckshotwashere: Quick question: You think Deathstroke has above street level speed?. I personally don't think he is faster than Logan

I guess we'll see.

@buckshotwashere: I hope this doesn't turn into a flame war.

mind if I PM you something I worked on?

Go for it.

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Warlockmage

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this is gonna be great

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BuckshotWasHere

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#12 BuckshotWasHere  Moderator

I'm passing out free deleted posts to anyone not being constructive, and if I have to do it to you more than once, sterner discipline can be provided.

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Miss_America_

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@pansito said:

Thor moves in negative

Oh you savage xD

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BuckshotWasHere

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#14 BuckshotWasHere  Moderator

I'm getting some good stuff in private messages but feel free to post further stuff here. And to clarify, not every time Thor gets hit by a a character, even a "slow" one means its necessarily a "low" or "slow" display, so I don't need every single fist fight Thor gets into, but if you're unsure what exactly counts, go ahead and post it so it can be looked at.

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theawesomeflashsandiego32

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I a,ways thought that he has higher than Captain America speed but less than Mach 1 for combat speed. His travel speed is MFTL as shown multiple times. Although he usually does not operate at high speeds and rarely shows anything close to Flash or Silver Surfer speed he is more close to Deathstroke, Captain America, Batman, Nightwing, Wolverine etc. speed.

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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#16  Edited By ASGARDIANBRONY

Hey guys! I went through all the 50+ scans people use to say thor and you wouldn't believe how easily most are debunked just by reading the dialogue or looking at the obvious context. I hope you guys enjoy :D

1st Batch

1. Not only does thor tag mongoose in the first panel, but mongoose never even lands a hit on thor! Mongoose escapes thor's grip while he isn't paying attention then attacks thor and the god of thunder reacts to all his attacks as seen by thor spinning his hammer around himself causing mongoose to run away. Though not a great feat for thor it isn't nearly as bad as people say.

2. This scan has blatant context. Thor is distracted by a big piece of machinery then mongoose fills the area with smoke and attacks thor through the mist. this has nothing to do with thor being slow, thor just couldn't see through the fog.

3. We have no idea how fast the god was that thor fought, he could very well have had insane reflexes. you cant use this as a bad feat because its equally possible that he is super fast as it is that he has human speed.

4,5. Eric masterson and caught off guard. this has zero bearing on thor.

6. Thor was cut off mid sentence, he was going to say faster than I expected. also he was holding back as he knew wolverine was suffering from an illusion of some sort.

7. Editor and author statements mean nothing, especially since breevoort and others have claimed some stupid stuff before.

8. this feat is actually a great feat showing off Thor's AOE speed. in the top panel we see QS dodge lightning and in the bottom we see thor's AOE tag a moving QS, this simply means thor's AOE attacks are faster than lightning.

9. it was eric masterson thor AND he was distracted by creel and titania escaping, this has nothing to do with thor.

10. Editor and author statements mean nothing, especially since breevoort and others have claimed some stupid stuff before.

2nd Batch

1. Thor holds back against street levelers and new opponents and has said as much many times (including a bunch of these scans).

2. just a statement.

3. To use this feat in debate is stupid. Firstly, everybody gets tagged by laser beams and we have no idea how fast this one was, it could have been light speed. Secondly the robo-rex says he is locking on to thor, so even if thor tried to dodge he might not be able to escape especially because the laser could have been light speed.

4,5,6. we have no idea how fast the creature was, also thor holds back against new opponents even so far as to let them hit him to assess their power.

7. Thor was attacked from behind by energy of unknown speed.

8. Thor doesn't fail to react to anything here. IM was in front of Thor by several feat and simply moved in front. this feat has zero to do with thor's speed.

9. Thor cant react to the stomp because he was stunned.

10. the use of this scan to try and say thor is slow makes me really mad because it literally has nothing to do with speed! Thor in this scan PURPOSELY lets the energy beam hit him to see how powerful his foe is then proceeds to knock him down with a shockwave. Thor clearly says "i have thy measure now and I find thee lacking!" this is just another example of thor holding back.

3rd Batch

1. look at the scarlet witches own words, "Thor... he blind sided him!" thor got blindsided by a Kree he wasn't fighting, this feat is invalid in debate.

2. you can clearly see in the second panel that thor was frozen by some unknown energy and thus could not react.

3. this is kind of a low feat for thor. don't know how fast the bot was though.

4. In the top panel its clear as day that thor was blocking the energy blasts of some female and was distracted from tiger shark. tiger shark even says thor was distracted! wow, the things you can learn from just reading the dialogue.

5. I don't know who this purple cloaked guy is, so I guess this is a low feat for thor.

6. Its plain as day thor gets caught unawares by the diminutive wasp then everybody just starts attacking a stunned thor from all sides.

7. being tagged by IM does not make you slow as IM is a very fast character though few people know this.

8. Not only was thor unable to use both arms as he was holding cap, but cap even says thor was caught off guard.

9. GR was holding on to Thor's hammer as it returned to thor, thus he was moving at immense speeds likely surpassing light. this is not GR's normal speed.

10. Irelevant as when thor was tagged it was only because GR was holding on to thor's hammer.

5th Batch:

1. Thor was in really bad shape, in his own words he was racked with pain beyond reckoning from zeus attacks, so he would not be operating at peak condition. also Zeus threw the tree, it didn't just fall over, and as a skyfather I bet zeus can throw a tree pretty fast.

2. once again thor wasn't in good shape, also this was the power of Zeus, magical in nature. its unwise to judge skyfathers by things such as speed.

3. Iron man is actually pretty fast. there may be context to this but I don't know what it is.

4. this looks like another surprise attack.

5. statements mean jack squat.

6. the true speed of this god is unknown. "speed of a lion" sounds like metaphorical god speak. we cant say this is a bad feat as we don't know how fast the god really was.

7. kind of a bad feat for thor.

8. im disgusted they tried to use this as a low feat for thor! There is so much context behind this. Thor had been stripped of much of his power, had his arm and eye cut off, had just finished fighting hulk and thing for hours, the attack was a sneak attack, thor was emotionally distressed, ect.

9. kind of a bad feat but not really. thor usually purposely tries to tank stuff because he is sure of himself and likes to assess his opponents.

10. This one is legit.

6th Batch:

1. this is not a bad feat at all. Firstly thor would be holding back as it is the first time he fought Rachel and she is a teenage girl (thor holds back against girls), secondly she is an immensely powerful telepath/telekinetic and likely can use her TK extremely fast.

2. Namor says thor was caught unawares.

3. Apocalypse is a powerhouse character. there is no shame in being tagged by him, also thor was young here and less experienced.

4. not a bad feat. the champion is supposed to be the best fighter in the universe.

5. the guy thor is fighting is empowered by his faith and the fight was a battle of faith's. we don't know how fast this guy is so we cant say if its a bad feat.

6. Emma was amped by the PF in every way and was above heralds, there is no shame in being tagged by her especially because she is a very powerful telekinetic.

7. I think this is the first time thor fought mags so he would have held back, also isn't magnetism light speed?

8. This is a massive AOE attack thor wasn't prepared for and he didn't have his hammer.

9. LOL, hulk doesn't dodge thor, thor simply flies away and even says he is far faster than hulk.

10. kind of a low feat, but thor holds back.

7th Batch:

1, 2. Thor is actually fighting 8th day juggernaut who was amped immensely. I guess you could call this a slow feat though.

3. Thor isn't chained up before he can react, he gets chained up after he is stunned. also every thor fan knows thor holds back considerably against the wrecking crew as when thor gets even slightly serious he can stomp them all with ease.

4. dupe scan from earlier. wasp only hits thor because he doesn't notice her.

5. Ulik was amped by high evolutionary.

6. I don't think that's even the real thor. im pretty sure its a clone or something.

7. its a bad feat. you can say he was holding back, which he was, but ill say it counts.

after going through them all it seems only ten to around fifteen are actually slow showings for thor, the rest are either out of context, just statements or feats of other characters thrown in for some reason.

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TheKinfing

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LOL

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deactivated-5b60e98a8eb99

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Argh, not this again.

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Nicka...hahhaaaaa.

Grabs popcorn ?

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KrleAvenger

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#21  Edited By KrleAvenger

@asgardianbrony:

Thor is under the control of moondragon and when IM talks to him you can se he is fighting against his own mind. also IM was amped by thor's lightning.

Sorry but this is an Iron-man scan and I have to go over it. First things first, Iron-man's speed feats are ridiculous. Getting tagged by him is not bad at all.

Second thing, Thor wasn't fighting for control. Moondragon was fully under control and Thor wasn't resisting her at the time this fight took place. Iron-man was fighting full on Morals Off Thor. I know because I read the issue. It is Avengers #220.

Third thing. Energy Absorption does not boost Iron-man's combat speed. It boosts his traveling speed, durability, strength, striking power and damage output of his weapons.

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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#22  Edited By ASGARDIANBRONY
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ASGARDIANBRONY

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@buckshotwashere: Here are some feats hardly anybody talks about :D

you know how people say "thor has never fought Silver Surfer fighting at full speed" and how people say "SS always holds back his speed"? this is totally false, SS has used his FULL speed in battle on thor twice and thor has reacted to it just fine.

No Caption Provided

I would draw your attention to the word balloons circled in red. SS and Warlock agree to team up and hit thor from all sides as fast as they can in the hopes of beating him as that was the only way the believed they could beat him (this was WM Thor who is stronger but his reflexes are not amped):

1. Thor dodges around Warlock's attacks deftly and shows off surprising gymnastic skill in combat.

2. Thor reacts to and tags Warlock and SS attacking him from all sides. warlock even says Thor is fast as lightning.

3. Thor tanks a blast from a blitzing SS, then blitzes him and KO's him. on the next page thor reacts to warlock attacking him from behind, either pulls warlock over his back or moves behind warlock before he can react, then thor smashes him.

No Caption Provided

Here SS stops holding back aainst thor and is clearly bloodlusted, what happens next?:

1. Thor and SS both dodge around each others attacks while in mid air! SS dodges a bloodlusted hammer throw (showing he was using his speed) and thor dodges SS energy blast. SS starts blitzing towards thor...

2. Thor reacts to the blitz and KO's SS.

As you can see Thor has indeed fought SS using his speed to the fullest and thor has had no problem reacting to him and countering SS and warlock at the same time!

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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1. Thor fights in microseconds.

2. Thor reacts mid blitz to hyperion.

3. thor reacts to a bunch of gunfire.

4. Thor catches an artillery shell.

5. thor dodges a blast from SS.

6. Thor dodges a blast from bi-beast.

7. thor heatvision from Gladiator.

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Jonny_Anonymous

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Does mine eyes deceive me? When did Buckshot come back?

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Elijah_C_Washington

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I can scan bomb Deathstroke if that's indeed what you're asking for.

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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#27  Edited By ASGARDIANBRONY

1. Here a building is literally falling downwards on Thor. Thor doesn't move from his spot but instead hits so fast not a single brick touches him before he can smash it. (notice all this happens in the middle of a gladiator blitz)

2. hits glads before he can react.

3. hits gladiator many times before he can react.

4. masterson thor reacts to a gladiator blitz.

5. masterson thor reverses a blitz from glads into an rko.

6. thor reacts to lightning (bottom right panel)

7. Thor reacts to extremis IM's blitz (IM is actually very fast and has escaped a black hole with his speed)

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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1. Thor reacts to a tank blast from a few feet away.

2. thor reacts to meteors moving FTL towards him while he and his ship are moving towards them at MFTL speed.. so this is at least a light speed feat.

3. Thor reacts, strikes and BFR's sentry before he can hit him a second time.

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KrleAvenger

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@asgardianbrony: I don't think you should use Gladiator scans. Also Thor did not react to Iron-man's repulsors. He reacted to Iron-man's blitz. Although Stark only wanted to talk Thor down. Just saying.

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Green_Tea

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#30  Edited By Green_Tea

Jesus people, anotherthread about Thor's speed?

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HighAccuser

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#31  Edited By HighAccuser

@solid_snake97 said:

Jesus people, anotherthread about Thor's speed?

Thor is a speedster don't deny this.

If you deny it I'll never talk to you again on IGN.

nah im jk you're cool as hell and the only rational user on the comic threads there

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Green_Tea

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#32  Edited By Green_Tea

@solid_snake97 said:

Jesus people, anotherthread about Thor's speed?

Thor is a speedster don't deny this.

If you deny it I'll never talk to you again on IGN.

nah im jk you're cool as hell and the only rational user on the comic threads there

No Caption Provided

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P00TY

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Thor DOES have super human combat, reaction speed. I hope people are joking by saying he doesn't.

That said, the extent of his combat speed is unknown. And is no where near those of DC speedsters. That is mostly when Thor is called slow. Flashs(plural), Superman,WW all have faster combat speed. And agile characters like Spidey or very good fighters make it difficult for Thor to hit.

Saying since Thor has hit SSurfer, Gladiator etc makes him their equal in speed is false. Even when blood lusted or serious, characters still don't use their powers to the fullest. Thor has never god blast Thanos. Flash has never phased through Darseid. Surfer doesn't just trap people in his board.

Same with speed. Characters ONLY get credit for tagging mftl people when it is CONFIRMED that the person is going that fast.

Thor is NOT as fast as most Speedsters who fight in picoseconds. but he is in the microsecond combat speed range. Maybe even faster

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mickey-mouse

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@p00ty: I really doubt his microsecond...not that I want to get drawn into a debate about it. As far as I can tell he's street level speed and isn't any faster than Hulk...

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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Here's a showing for Flash, I can get more, but this is one that I easily remember the issue number for.

Flash (Wally West)

Flash deactivates Mirror Master's (McCullouch) Mirror Gun in one pico-second.

From: The Flash #133 - Through the looking Glass!

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RabumAlal

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Thor blitzstomps. /thread

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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@asgardianbrony: I'd like to discuss something you said.

4,5. Eric masterson and caught off guard. this has zero bearing on thor.

While this might appear that it's unrelated to Thor (and that Masterson is just caught off guard) Captain America explicitly states the following: "What's with you Thunder Gods and this particular practice drill? Your predecessor also had problems with it. It sharpens combat instincts and increase reaction time... and it's painfully obvious you need help in both those areas!"

So while Cap is indeed talking to (and scolding) Masterson about his speeds, he makes note that Masteron's predecessor (Thor, I'd assume, unless someone became before Masterson?) whom was also a Thunder God struggled with this SAME practice drill -- one that is designed to sharpen combat instincts and increase reaction time.

Thus, it's implying that Thor struggled during this very same drill, a combat instinct and reaction time centered drill.

At least, that's what I'm getting from this.

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P00TY

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@lukehero: Look at post 24. The first scan. He punched a guy and caught his hammer in a few microseconds

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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@asgardianbrony: I don't think you should use Gladiator scans. Also Thor did not react to Iron-man's repulsors. He reacted to Iron-man's blitz. Although Stark only wanted to talk Thor down. Just saying.

I personally still think glads is a lightspeedster.

silly me, ill fix the context.

@asgardianbrony: I'd like to discuss something you said.

4,5. Eric masterson and caught off guard. this has zero bearing on thor.

While this might appear that it's unrelated to Thor (and that Masterson is just caught off guard) Captain America explicitly states the following: "What's with you Thunder Gods and this particular practice drill? Your predecessor also had problems with it. It sharpens combat instincts and increase reaction time... and it's painfully obvious you need help in both those areas!"

So while Cap is indeed talking to (and scolding) Masterson about his speeds, he makes note that Masteron's predecessor (Thor, I'd assume, unless someone became before Masterson?) whom was also a Thunder God struggled with this SAME practice drill -- one that is designed to sharpen combat instincts and increase reaction time.

Thus, it's implying that Thor struggled during this very same drill, a combat instinct and reaction time centered drill.

At least, that's what I'm getting from this.

That's true cap made that statement, but that's all it is, a statement. Statements like that especially when the character being spoken about wasn't even in the comic should not be taken seriously.

what did you think of the rest of the post?

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TheKinfing

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@asgardianbrony: Gladiator has far too many low-showings to be considered a Light Speeder.

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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@thetruebarryallen said:

@asgardianbrony: I'd like to discuss something you said.

4,5. Eric masterson and caught off guard. this has zero bearing on thor.

While this might appear that it's unrelated to Thor (and that Masterson is just caught off guard) Captain America explicitly states the following: "What's with you Thunder Gods and this particular practice drill? Your predecessor also had problems with it. It sharpens combat instincts and increase reaction time... and it's painfully obvious you need help in both those areas!"

So while Cap is indeed talking to (and scolding) Masterson about his speeds, he makes note that Masteron's predecessor (Thor, I'd assume, unless someone became before Masterson?) whom was also a Thunder God struggled with this SAME practice drill -- one that is designed to sharpen combat instincts and increase reaction time.

Thus, it's implying that Thor struggled during this very same drill, a combat instinct and reaction time centered drill.

At least, that's what I'm getting from this.

That's true cap made that statement, but that's all it is, a statement. Statements like that especially when the character being spoken about wasn't even in the comic should not be taken seriously.

what did you think of the rest of the post?

It might be a simple 'statement' but I don't think it should be discredited when Thor's speed is as controversial as it is.

As for the rest of the post, I don't mean or intend to offend, but with something like this I'd need issue numbers for each of those instances to go and check the context. There were times in our Flash v. Thor debate where I feel you misrepresented certain scans or showings, so I don't feel comfortable taking your word 100% on subjects such as this.

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Theorder14

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#43  Edited By Theorder14

@p00ty said:

@lukehero: Look at post 24. The first scan. He punched a guy and caught his hammer in a few microseconds

Iron Fist also react in microseconds so that still fall in street lvl tier

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Just_Banter

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Oh look, another Thor speed thread. Don't you think this has been played out by now?

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risingtide

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#45  Edited By risingtide

Avengers Vol. 4 #1

  • Thor is able to blitz Kang the conquer with a blast even though Kang have the drop on the Avengers.

Avengers Vol. 4 Annual #1

  • Thor teleports everyone away from the battlefield without them knowing. Thor has to spin his hammer in order to teleport which makes it all the more impressive.

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P00TY

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@theorder14: Someone said they doubt Thor has microsecond speed. I was showing that he does

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Theorder14

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#49  Edited By Theorder14

@p00ty: meowkay

None of those feats r combat speed though. We all agree that Thor can travel and blitz at FTL but he's not fast combat speed-wise

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theawesomeflashsandiego32

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So Thor is a speedster?