The Sith Empire invades the Mass Effect galaxy

Avatar image for rowso77
Rowso77

193

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

No Caption Provided

Scenario 1#: The Sith Empire has been invading planets within the Mass Effect universe, this has gained the attention of the Systems Alliance who are trying to the bottom of this.

Scenario 2#: If they survive the first scenario then can they survive the invasion of the Reaper's too?

Mass effect galaxy takes place during the events of Mass Effect 2

Shephard and his full crew will take place in this war

SWTOR era Sith empire

Who wins?

Avatar image for paragonnate
ParagonNate

4713

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Even going that far back in Star Wars history, the Empire should have superior, if not equal fire power. They also make use of superior FTL, have access theater and planetary energy shields, have more brutal and ruthless tactics that the Systems Alliance may not be ready for, and have access to Force users to counter Biotics. Oh! and their main weapons are DEWs, which Mass Effect kinetic barriers struggle to deal with, so that's an edge.

If they plan their first strike the same way they did against the Republic, like building their power base out in the Terminus Systems beforehand, they can blitz the SA or Council Space and while they may not win the war out of the gate they'll do enough damage that their opponents will have to sue for peace so that both sides can recuperate.

What do you think?

@wut

Avatar image for jedixman
JediXMan

42943

Forum Posts

35961

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 16

#4 JediXMan  Moderator

The Mass Effect universe doesn't compare.

Avatar image for paragonnate
ParagonNate

4713

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@jedixman: Against the modern Star Wars factions, like the Galactic Empire, sure. But the True Sith Empire is a great deal less powerful than Sidious' Empire in pretty much every way.

Avatar image for jedixman
JediXMan

42943

Forum Posts

35961

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 16

#6 JediXMan  Moderator

@jedixman: Against the modern Star Wars factions, like the Galactic Empire, sure. But the True Sith Empire is a great deal less powerful than Sidious' Empire in pretty much every way.

I know which Empire this is. They're still stronger than the Mass Effect universe.

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#7  Edited By Wut

@paragonnate: I would back the Sith Empire for their industrial edge, tbh. Pound for pound, funny enough, the SA ships will pack more punch. But the Old Sith ones will have a faster firing rate, given the smaller size of SA ships, this is pretty good as there is less 'mass' they have to damage so the weaker individual shots won't matter too much and SA ships aren't all that durable. But the Sith Empire should be able to outproduce the SA and more easily replace losses. A war of attrition they will win. And the fact SA ship are so restricted in their long distance FTL and it won't be too long before the Sith find out about this and start to target the Mass Effect Relays.

I am not convinced the Sith Empire would beat the Reapers though, unless we do what many will do in this thread and give them hyper-competence and have them start mass producing their various tech of the weeks that they never did in-game. Outside of that, destroying the relays to slow them down as they work on building up their power would be the smartest thing to do, but given how dumb Sith can be, who knows if they will even do this. (Sad that the thing that holds the Sith Empire back is the Sith. XD)

@jedixman said:

The Mass Effect universe doesn't compare.

Yes, how in the world could they ever compare to the might and magnitude of the Sith Empire's Firepower!!!

Loading Video...

What?! What do you mean Sith Capital Ship firepower is hilariously weak!? It wasn't like he was trying to level that temple and so had no reason to not give it everything!? Oh, he was trying to level the temple? Weird... that's an outlier!

What? You mean even a ship that is even older, 300 years older, was more impressive and even that was still pathetically weak? What ship is that!?

Loading Video...

Pah, different materials! Obviously the temple was made out of some unknown super metal! And it doesn't matter if thermodynamics would mean that a larger concentration of heat would make for a larger explosion as it dispersed so even if it was a super metal it would still have given off larger light shows on impact! (Not that it matters since Turbolasers aren't actually lasers).

So, unless people start doing what they normally do, and that is give the Sith Empire an out of character hyper-competence and have them mass produce all their tech of the week, you know, like the Silencer, regenerating cybernetic parts, cloaked ships, etc, that they used one time and then never use, or mention, again during the entirety of the war showing an unwillingness or inability to do so, then no, Old Republic era is one of the only times Mass Effect does, in fact, compare.

Avatar image for thelocust619
thelocust619

8192

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#8  Edited By thelocust619

From what I recall about the SA vs the Reaper in ME, they fire about the same speed. The Death Star can be countered by repairing that planetary Reaper-killing cannon that hardly anyone knows about in universe (so the Empire def won't know and counter). SA ground troops would casually decimate the stormtroopers with biotics and Sheperd could easily solo a (original trilogy) movie sith since he's practically a walking biotic armory with the will to resist immediate indoctrination. I think it's closer than people are saying.

The Reapers would sweep pretty easily.

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#9  Edited By Wut

@thelocust619: Old Sith Empire. Not Galactic Empire. They didn't have the Death Star.

Avatar image for paragonnate
ParagonNate

4713

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@wut: The cloaking tech was standard for Imperial Intelligence agent ships I thought? At the very least it's more common to the Empire than it is to the Systems Alliance who gave their special snowflake ship to their special snowflake commander, because of course they did.

Also, doesn't destroying a Relay cause a huge explosion that might count as a weapon of mass destruction on its own? Once they figure that out I could see some Sith doing that purely for giggles.

Avatar image for thelocust619
thelocust619

8192

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@wut: Oooh, thought this was Galactic Empire, nvm. Thanks

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@paragonnate: I was referring to when they used the special crystals from Ilum to make an invisible fleet. Which they used once. And had it turned against them because Sith. And then never replicated it afterwards. Because reasons.

Also, the invisible fleet is invisible to the naked eye, unlike the SA's 'invisibility' which only cuts down on readable emissions.

Who says you need to park a fleet next to it and bombard it into nothingness? Much safer to destroy it by sending in teams and demolition it from the inside and from a safe distance. Or causing enough damage to rend it inoperable.

Avatar image for echostarlord117
echostarlord117

5619

Forum Posts

521

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@jedixman said:

The Mass Effect universe doesn't compare.

Avatar image for deactivated-5aba78567e8b5
deactivated-5aba78567e8b5

4502

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

SWTOR Sith use sun raisers to harvest the energy of certain suns to raise a fleet, then sends the Ascendant Spear out to decimate while invading planets with Force Wielders

Avatar image for deactivated-5dace575ce059
deactivated-5dace575ce059

17723

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Sith empire would win imo

Avatar image for paytience
Paytience

6031

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#16  Edited By Paytience

Star Wars factions are completely unable to invade other galaxies, because SW wars ships are basically on rails in hyperspace and can't plan or navigate their own routes. The hyperspace beacons do it for them and it takes an advanced navicomputer like the Carrion Spike had, just to be able to plan a route through multiple beacons. Couple this with the HARD CANON FACT that SW ships use chemical fuel sources per The Last Jedi and the Tarkin novels, which also go into depth on the hyperspace routes, lanes, and beacons..and it means that the Sith, not Mass Effect are the ones with laughable range, production and logistic issues.

Star Wars races don't even know who laid the beacons for them They're just using an mapping them. But it took thousand of years to do...so. Mass Effect basically stomps. Even if we magically transport the beacons to the ME galaxy, it doesn't change the huge problem The sith are going to have refueling their ships and repairing their turbo laser recoil system.

The first battle is a decent one...but every battle after that will result in a larger and larger margin of victory for Mass Effect.

Avatar image for paragonnate
ParagonNate

4713

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#17  Edited By ParagonNate

@paytience said:

Star Wars factions are completely unable to invade other galaxies, because SW wars ships are basically on rails in hyperspace and can't plan or navigate their own routes. The hyperspace beacons do it for them and it takes an advanced navicomputer like the Carrion Spike had, just to be able to plan a route through multiple beacons. Couple this with the HARD CANON FACT that SW ships use chemical fuel sources per The Last Jedi and the Tarkin novels, which also go into depth on the hyperspace routes, lanes, and beacons..and it means that the Sith, not Mass Effect are the ones with laughable range, production and logistic issues.

Star Wars races don't even know who laid the beacons for them They're just using an mapping them. But it took thousand of years to do...so. Mass Effect basically stomps. Even if we magically transport the beacons to the ME galaxy, it doesn't change the huge problem The sith are going to have refueling their ships and repairing their turbo laser recoil system.

The first battle is a decent one...but every battle after that will result in a larger and larger margin of victory for Mass Effect.

Every word in that part about hyperspace is wrong, at least when it comes to Legends. Even in Canon it isn't fully accurate.

Avatar image for paragonnate
ParagonNate

4713

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@wut said:

@paragonnate: I was referring to when they used the special crystals from Ilum to make an invisible fleet. Which they used once. And had it turned against them because Sith. And then never replicated it afterwards. Because reasons.

Also, the invisible fleet is invisible to the naked eye, unlike the SA's 'invisibility' which only cuts down on readable emissions.

Who says you need to park a fleet next to it and bombard it into nothingness? Much safer to destroy it by sending in teams and demolition it from the inside and from a safe distance. Or causing enough damage to rend it inoperable.

Oh yeah, forgot about those. Would have been deadly if they utilized it right.

Invisible to sensors and invisible in general are pretty much the same thing in space. To quote Douglas Adams, "Space. Is big." After all, at the distances Mass Effect ships claim to fight you simply can't see even their largest ships with the naked eye, even if they painted them all neon bright colors it wouldn't make a difference in being able to see them, so hiding from sensors is really all you need to do. Kind of like modern stealth planes or submarines really.

I meant that once the Sith figure out how damaging it is to the system it's in the Sith might blow up Relays just to do damage, because Dark Side. With the bonus of crippling the enemies FTL network.

Avatar image for paytience
Paytience

6031

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@paytience said:

Star Wars factions are completely unable to invade other galaxies, because SW wars ships are basically on rails in hyperspace and can't plan or navigate their own routes. The hyperspace beacons do it for them and it takes an advanced navicomputer like the Carrion Spike had, just to be able to plan a route through multiple beacons. Couple this with the HARD CANON FACT that SW ships use chemical fuel sources per The Last Jedi and the Tarkin novels, which also go into depth on the hyperspace routes, lanes, and beacons..and it means that the Sith, not Mass Effect are the ones with laughable range, production and logistic issues.

Star Wars races don't even know who laid the beacons for them They're just using an mapping them. But it took thousand of years to do...so. Mass Effect basically stomps. Even if we magically transport the beacons to the ME galaxy, it doesn't change the huge problem The sith are going to have refueling their ships and repairing their turbo laser recoil system.

The first battle is a decent one...but every battle after that will result in a larger and larger margin of victory for Mass Effect.

Every word in that part about hyperspace is wrong, at least when it comes to Legends. Even in Canon it isn't fully accurate.

No it isn't. If anything, legends support it even more so.

Avatar image for paragonnate
ParagonNate

4713

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@paragonnate said:
@paytience said:

Star Wars factions are completely unable to invade other galaxies, because SW wars ships are basically on rails in hyperspace and can't plan or navigate their own routes. The hyperspace beacons do it for them and it takes an advanced navicomputer like the Carrion Spike had, just to be able to plan a route through multiple beacons. Couple this with the HARD CANON FACT that SW ships use chemical fuel sources per The Last Jedi and the Tarkin novels, which also go into depth on the hyperspace routes, lanes, and beacons..and it means that the Sith, not Mass Effect are the ones with laughable range, production and logistic issues.

Star Wars races don't even know who laid the beacons for them They're just using an mapping them. But it took thousand of years to do...so. Mass Effect basically stomps. Even if we magically transport the beacons to the ME galaxy, it doesn't change the huge problem The sith are going to have refueling their ships and repairing their turbo laser recoil system.

The first battle is a decent one...but every battle after that will result in a larger and larger margin of victory for Mass Effect.

Every word in that part about hyperspace is wrong, at least when it comes to Legends. Even in Canon it isn't fully accurate.

No it isn't. If anything, legends support it even more so.

Except ships plot their own hyperspace jumps all the time, no beacons or other such tools required. I read the Tarkin novel, it's the odd book out in its depiction of how hyperspace lanes work, even in canon it doesn't match other books.

Avatar image for paytience
Paytience

6031

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#21  Edited By Paytience

@paragonnate said:
@paytience said:
@paragonnate said:
@paytience said:

Star Wars factions are completely unable to invade other galaxies, because SW wars ships are basically on rails in hyperspace and can't plan or navigate their own routes. The hyperspace beacons do it for them and it takes an advanced navicomputer like the Carrion Spike had, just to be able to plan a route through multiple beacons. Couple this with the HARD CANON FACT that SW ships use chemical fuel sources per The Last Jedi and the Tarkin novels, which also go into depth on the hyperspace routes, lanes, and beacons..and it means that the Sith, not Mass Effect are the ones with laughable range, production and logistic issues.

Star Wars races don't even know who laid the beacons for them They're just using an mapping them. But it took thousand of years to do...so. Mass Effect basically stomps. Even if we magically transport the beacons to the ME galaxy, it doesn't change the huge problem The sith are going to have refueling their ships and repairing their turbo laser recoil system.

The first battle is a decent one...but every battle after that will result in a larger and larger margin of victory for Mass Effect.

Every word in that part about hyperspace is wrong, at least when it comes to Legends. Even in Canon it isn't fully accurate.

No it isn't. If anything, legends support it even more so.

Except ships plot their own hyperspace jumps all the time, no beacons or other such tools required. I read the Tarkin novel, it's the odd book out in its depiction of how hyperspace lanes work, even in canon it doesn't match other books.

Ships don't plot their own hyperspace jumps, that's flat out wrong. They connect to hyperspace beacons or buoys, which plot jumps for them along the hyperwave routes. If it contradicts, then your gonna have to provide come source. Because right now your wrong, not only is the novel canon, it's been supported in rebels, and hey...The Last Jedi. Deal with it son.

Ships don't plot their own courses...an advance nacivomputer can plot multipl jumps at once, but they cannot plot their own courses. Period.

And even if you DON'T except that, it doesn't change the fact that SW ships use chemical fuels which they need to build logistic lines for which they cannot.

Avatar image for paragonnate
ParagonNate

4713

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#22  Edited By ParagonNate

@paytience: Ships don't plot their own hyperspace jumps, that's flat out wrong. They connect to hyperspace beacons or buoys, which plot jumps for them along the hyperwave routes. If it contradicts, then your gonna have to provide come source. Because right now your wrong, not only is the novel canon, it's been supported in rebels, and hey...The Last Jedi. Deal with it son.

Hey son drop the attitude.

Except that they do. Navicomputers throughout Legends plot their own jumps. No mention of buoys, and if they are mentioned they are only used as reference points as to where the most common or heavily trafficked routes are, not that they are needed to jump period, simply that it's safer to do so. The only other time they are brought up is when they are talked about as communication devices, used to send information through the Holonet, not for navigation. Also, the True Sith Empire is Legends, the Tarkin novel has no weight here.

Ships don't plot their own courses...an advance nacivomputer can plot multipl jumps at once, but they cannot plot their own courses. Period.

Except for the fact they constantly do throughout the franchise.

And even if you DON'T except that, it doesn't change the fact that SW ships use chemical fuels which they need to build logistic lines for which they cannot.

Why can't they?

The Tarkin novel is still the only book that talks about them, or uses them in the way it does. No other novel treats hyperspace travel like that, not a single one.

Avatar image for deactivated-5dace575ce059
deactivated-5dace575ce059

17723

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Lol we all seriously having a about how one or the other travels?? Seriously?

Avatar image for wolfrazer
Wolfrazer

19730

Forum Posts

2

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Why is Disney Canon being brought into this when the SE is a Legends faction?...

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#25  Edited By Wut

@paragonnate: Oh yeah, forgot about those. Would have been deadly if they utilized it right.

That sums up the entire 'Tech of the Week' thing the Sith had going. 'Man, that would be useful if used right.. Oh, its made by the Sith? Well, we will never see it again after this.'

Invisible to sensors and invisible in general are pretty much the same thing in space. To quote Douglas Adams, "Space. Is big." After all, at the distances Mass Effect ships claim to fight you simply can't see even their largest ships with the naked eye, even if they painted them all neon bright colors it wouldn't make a difference in being able to see them, so hiding from sensors is really all you need to do. Kind of like modern stealth planes or submarines really.

You're forgetting just how close the Sith Empire and Mass Effect Ships like to fight. They fight at knife-fighting ranges as far as space naval combat is going. The fact that someone at the window, and Star Wars ships have massive windows on the command deck, can see it and its bright blue gun, yeah, it gets noticed by someone. Unlike, say, a true invisibility ship where you are only going to see the occasional burst of firing coming from the middle of nowhere.

If they fought at 40k ranges, then yeah, it would be the same thing since you couldn't see them anyways. They 'claim' to fight at such distances. Every actual fight we see them engage in? Up close and personal.

I meant that once the Sith figure out how damaging it is to the system it's in the Sith might blow up Relays just to do damage, because Dark Side. With the bonus of crippling the enemies FTL network.

Eh, the Sith are.. so dumb though. You have a few intelligent ones, but the majority are just sooooo painfully dumb. I'd place money on an Imperial coming up with the plan and a Sith swooping in to steal credit.

Avatar image for deactivated-5dace575ce059
deactivated-5dace575ce059

17723

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@wut: but I'm pretty sure the humans in mass effect don't have that high of fire power do they? Because I could of sworn the best ships in the mass effect were dreadnought class which were the ones who could throw double digit kilotons worth of damage

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@killerwasp: Their firepower isn't amazing by most standards. But the main turbolaser batteries of the Sith Empire is piss weak.

Avatar image for deactivated-5dace575ce059
deactivated-5dace575ce059

17723

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@wut: I gusss yeah if still say they are equal to or greater than the mass effect side and considering this is again only humanity I don't see the sith having much issues

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@killerwasp: I said the Sith Side win because of things not related to firepower, but the main gun of their big ships outweigh the guns of the Sith capital ships by quite a bit. Because BioWare is bad with scale. (Funny that this is putting two factions created by them against one another).

Avatar image for deactivated-5dace575ce059
deactivated-5dace575ce059

17723

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@wut: mhhh idk man they both seem to suck lol

Avatar image for paragonnate
ParagonNate

4713

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@wut: That sums up the entire 'Tech of the Week' thing the Sith had going. 'Man, that would be useful if used right.. Oh, its made by the Sith? Well, we will never see it again after this.'

Lol, making the Sith sound like Trekkies.

You're forgetting just how close the Sith Empire and Mass Effect Ships like to fight. They fight at knife-fighting ranges as far as space naval combat is going. The fact that someone at the window, and Star Wars ships have massive windows on the command deck, can see it and its bright blue gun, yeah, it gets noticed by someone. Unlike, say, a true invisibility ship where you are only going to see the occasional burst of firing coming from the middle of nowhere.

If they fought at 40k ranges, then yeah, it would be the same thing since you couldn't see them anyways. They 'claim' to fight at such distances. Every actual fight we see them engage in? Up close and personal.

The Codex says one thing, the game says another. I guess the game wins.

Eh, the Sith are.. so dumb though. You have a few intelligent ones, but the majority are just sooooo painfully dumb. I'd place money on an Imperial coming up with the plan and a Sith swooping in to steal credit.

Well, the Sith at the top sort of have to be smart, if they aren't then they aren't at the top for very long. The same goes for Imperials really. Yes there are idiots, but the Citadel Council/Systems Alliance/everyone not named Shepard wasn't exactly brilliant either.

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@paragonnate: Lol, making the Sith sound like Trekkies.

In SWTOR, they pretty much were.

The Codex says one thing, the game says another. I guess the game wins.

Events win. I can say X people like to fight with fist, and then when you see them fight, every fight you see is with swords, you begin to wonder if what I said really had any bearings whatsoever.

If there was a single event that matched, then yeah, we could say that. But as all the space battles are close.... yeah, seems like that is more common then the farther range.

Well, the Sith at the top sort of have to be smart, if they aren't then they aren't at the top for very long. The same goes for Imperials really. Yes there are idiots, but the Citadel Council/Systems Alliance/everyone not named Shepard wasn't exactly brilliant either.

Lol the one who took the invisible fleet and went, 'HAR HAR HAR! I IZ REBELLING! COMING AT ME BRAH!' was one of those at the top.

Avatar image for jwwprod
jwwprod

21402

Forum Posts

967

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

@thelocust619 said:

@wut: Oooh, thought this was Galactic Empire, nvm. Thanks

If this was the Galactic Empire, this would be a stomp in favor of of Star Wars.

Reapers only fire kiloton rounds as well as going down to kiloton firepower. Galactic Empire ships fire gigaton firepower as well as tank gigaton firepower.

Avatar image for jwwprod
jwwprod

21402

Forum Posts

967

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

@wut: Is the firepower of the Sith Empire's ship on par with the Galactic Empire? if yes then the Sith stomp.

Avatar image for dawn_of_ages
Dawn_of_Ages

2537

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Even going that far back in Star Wars history, the Empire should have superior, if not equal fire power. They also make use of superior FTL, have access theater and planetary energy shields, have more brutal and ruthless tactics that the Systems Alliance may not be ready for, and have access to Force users to counter Biotics. Oh! and their main weapons are DEWs, which Mass Effect kinetic barriers struggle to deal with, so that's an edge.

This. Not to mention the SE has Vitiate. A guy who can destroy the surface of entire worlds and mind control the populace an entire planet.

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@jwwprod: Oh, no. Shot for shot, they are weaker then ME dreadnoughts.

Avatar image for paytience
Paytience

6031

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@jwwprod: Bullshit...the most powerful ship weapon in their inventory is 100 mt plasma bomb/missile used specifically for bombardment. FACT son...

Shown in TWC and Rebels which are BOTH pre-Disney, (rebels existed for both) and thus directly applicable to Legends, and hard canonized in episode 8. Legends canon is still subject to old canon rules, and thus the T-canon sources>>>C and N canon sources, many of which are contradictory sources.

So no...they are not even close to gigaton range. They aren't even close to MT range. They barely scrape at KT. In fact, in EU novel Before the Storm specifically states: Terajoules of laser energy...which comes out to half a kt. Fact.

The only numbers that are consistently supported even in the higher tiers of legends canon, are sub KT weapons for most ships, with capital ships pushing out low digit MT's...max.

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@paytience: Where has Disney stated that Legends falls under the old canon rules? As far as I am aware, their stance was: Disney Approved = canon. Everything else = Legends.

Point to a direct statement please.

Avatar image for paytience
Paytience

6031

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#39  Edited By Paytience

@wut said:

@paytience: Where has Disney stated that Legends falls under the old canon rules? As far as I am aware, their stance was: Disney Approved = canon. Everything else = Legends.

Point to a direct statement please.

I'll amend it. They never changed the canon policy either way. Even if it wasn't specified, what we are then left with is a HUGE number of contradictory sources. Thus, we are left with the task of proving who's source is most valid. Now, the ONLY sources that give any sort of gigaton claims are the Episode 1 ICS, which has since been amended, and fan calcs.

We can go and up and down with what the EU actually gives us, but there is no source in the EU even close to gigatons...however we are given terajoule statements; we know that a loaded down freighter acting as a "muiltimegaton" battering ram can one shot Corellian cruiser effortlessly; and these are solidified in the much more valid sources, as both TWC and Rebels were kept as canon under Disney.

Thus, to avoid the argument...I'll concede your point. But I'm also going to ask that someone actually PROVES that gigaton weaponry is in play. Because right now, even in the EU, things like that are fan calcd., and contradict the numbers actually given. People like to say "a SD can reduce a planet to molten slag" but once again, that description of a BDZ is only available in the ICS...examples of BDZ's have nothing of the sort happening. Indeed, the most popular people like to claim is Caamas-and they conveniently neglect to metnion that Caamas wasn't slagged, it's industry was destroyed....there were survivors...a new city formed...there was an evacuation of them later when a meteor hit Caamas...which is where the destruction we see comes from. They all neglect that part...for example.

The fact is, I don't think he or anyone else 99.99 percent of the time on this and other vs sites are actually FAMILIAR with the SW EU. I see off the wall quotes and statements being thrown around with no real knowledge of the circumstances behind them for people to have actually read the books...

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@paytience: On phone, off the top of my head, Twilight Company, talks about an ISD wiping out a continent, IIRC.

Avatar image for paragonnate
ParagonNate

4713

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@paytience: We can go and up and down with what the EU actually gives us, but there is no source in the EU even close to gigatons

Um yes....yes there are....like....so many.

Avatar image for dawn_of_ages
Dawn_of_Ages

2537

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

there is no source in the EU even close to gigatons

kek

Avatar image for paytience
Paytience

6031

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#43  Edited By Paytience

So...notice how absolutely nobody has actually supported that gigaton claim with evidence yet?

Avatar image for wut
Wut

8212

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#44  Edited By Wut

@paytience said:

So...notice how absolutely nobody has actually supported that gigaton claim with evidence yet?

Notice what? The only thing I have noticed is you have tried to use a canon stance that doesn't exist any longer, purposely cherry picked your desired feats and examples in order to prove some kind of point.. I assume to yourself, however, I will indulge you to some degree because, hell, I got time to burn:

No Caption Provided

^ From Catalyst: A Rogue One Novel. Single Star Destroyer stripping bare a continent.

Also, we both know of the Episode II ICS which has both the BDZ and 200 GT turbolasers (but those are for Acclamator, IIRC, not ISD IIs)

For other examples of BDZ (And it isn't just ICS, by the way), is found in New Jedi Order Sourcebook, p. 45 where it talks about what happened to Caamas.

As well as in Spectre of the Past, Scavenger Hunt, Planet of Twilight and Jedi Knight, but I am sure you knew about all of those novels that contained examples or mention of worlds that had been BDZ as well as their condition, didn't you tiger?

Now, I bet you are wondering, "Why don't you pull the examples out!" I could, but honestly, I don't care enough about SW to go to that length, if you want, of course, I can such as:

"I know that the Grissmaths shipped their political prisoners there, in the hopes that they'd starve to death, and set automated gun stations all over the planet to keep them from being rescued. I know that the prisoners not only didn't oblige them by dying but that their descendents -- and the descendents of the guards -- are still farming the water seams while the Grissmath homeworld of Meridian itself is just a ball of charred radioactive waste." - Planet of Twilight p.4

Or

To rendezvous at Dankayo and reduce the tiny base to molten slag. Even before the last of its atmosphere drifted away, before the dense clouds of atomized topsoil could begin to settle, Imperial transports Elusive and Timely, as well as a complement of TIE fighters, moved in to perform "mop-up" operations and a through search of Dankayo's now evenly-cratered surface" - Scavenger Hunt, p.3

So, yes, I could do it, but again, that is a lot of effort that I, frankly, don't feel you have warranted. You have acted more like an unruly child then someone presenting a coherent debate which is a shame as you have some solid ideas that would come off better if you knocked it out.

Do I, personally, think SW has that high of yields? No, no I do not. I believe the examples of such high firepower are extremely rare, and I do not believe the 200 GT one is realistic or even believable, however, in some threads I will use it, normally, in the effort to make the fight semi-interesting for myself (such as GE vs IoM threads). But I will note that I am using higher end examples when I do such.

Now, I bet you are thinking, "But!" But, you see, due to the lack of a strict canon policy thanks to Disney's take over (And no, just saying, 'Well, they didn't /say/ it is gone,' doesn't mean shit when they have taken the time to separate 'Disney' from 'Legends' which means, yes, they have changed the game, and no, the old canon policy was NOT part of the Legend's universe, it was a policy the people who once held power over the universe held and established but as they have no power and that rule was not reestablished, it means jack and shit.)

So, no, you do not get to place your own 'order' onto it as you, hilariously, mentioned in the other thread. What you do? Is you look at all the feats, you consider them, and then you decide. Personally? I take the ones that appear the most often. Ones that happen rarely? Outliers, both High and Low. Now, some people you will meet won't care about that and only care about making their verse win and purposely try to bend their rules to their favor such as people toting Episode II: ICS as the holy bible or, say, someone trying to use the new Star Trek: Discovery feats and applying that to the older shows because Discovery takes place before them as if that fucking works, which, you know, it doesn't because 'IN THE FUTURE!' has never, ever, ever, ever been acceptable proof. The ships of that era of Trek have never, ever, preformed deeds to that level, and I don't give a single care on this side of the bloody hemisphere, if that ruffles your feathers and ideas of continuity, deal with it. 40k has a person saying that a Lance shot has less energy then a human punch. Is it dumb? Sure. Could it be a typo? Maybe, but is it there? Hell yes it is and it is just as canon as anything else. Its almost as annoying as someone trying to excuse Phasers from being weighed and measured because 'its exotic' which is dumb. If you refuse to accept your method of attacking being weighed and measured by the available means to determine its powers, boo freaking hoo, get over it. You don't just get to say, 'EXOTIC!' and get a get out of jail free card.

So, what do you do? Act like a debater with a shred of self-respect and dignity, look at feats critically, understand the differences between high and low, understand the differences between eras and the inability to scale one of the other 'just because it makes you feel all happy inside'. This goes for all factions.

Sadly, there are some great SW experts here, Wolf, knowing more about Legends that I ever will, or will ever want to, but you presented yourself as a rabid trekkie that is on some Anti-SW crusade, I don't care if that is true or not it is what you have managed to establish, that those that could have given you an engaging discussion don't really want anything to do with you. Which, is a shame, as, again, I feel you have some solid ideas and insights which I feel should be looked at more.

TL;DR, Stop being a twat, stop cherry picking, stop mocking others for cherry picking as you cherry pick, be a level of civil, you may get the discussion you seek.