The Daily Debater(Back in Business!!)

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New call-out list, let us know if you don't want to be included.

@viking1205 Is known in the Avatar community for their ingenuity in making threads, and this is another example of that creativity. Here, members of the Avatar community run through "gyms" of bending masters using their own custom bender, with a story on the side to boot. Given the unique applications of debating the series in-verse, strategies must constantly be considered as you look at each stipulation for every round. It's undoubtedly one of the best threads I've partaken in on the site.

Garou form the One Punch Man manga series has become perhaps the most popular character to debate on the forums over the past month as he has gone through multiple transformations within the story as well as redraws, with everything from anti feats to hyperboles. So, naturally, so many threads have been made with him that even trying to pick just one would be impossible. But it's still worth noting here, I like to think.

In this tournament matchup, we have Comicvine Hall of Famer @Darthjhawk taking on @Youngjustice. Darth is representing two verses that don't see that much attention in the CaV theater. Young Justice is using characters that don't see much attention as well. If your looking to find out about some characters you have never heard of or for a good read check this out! The first post has already been posted. The tourney is hosted by @Higherpower

In this match we once again have a Comicvine regular in @kaijuking taking on @the_hajduk. Their characters are not too popular on ComicVine. These verses are pretty popular off of the Versus Battle stage. So, if you're looking for some info on how some of your favorites stack up, check this out.

In this match, we have @darkrealm representing one of the most popular characters in Marvel Scarlet Witch. With the recent movie, her popularity has only increased. On the other corner, we have @nassergrant19 representing Zeus from Blood of Zeus. Both of these characters are god-like in their own verse. Which one will prevail? Got to tune in to find out!

@slash03 went on a rampage making tons of RTs on Black Clover over the last month (and maybe longer. Each has a fair amount of detail and together they’re a significant amount of info. This isn’t even all of them: Mereoleona Vermillion, Gadjah, Lolopechka, Damnatio Kira, Drowa, Ronne. Now I don’t know a darn thing about Black Clover, but that’s an impressive output in a fairly short time and the fandom should benefit from all this accumulated info. The only thing I would say is, more spoiler blocks. Easy navigation is always a plus.

@wastelandman’s RT is very well organized and sourced, with clean links and clear descriptions. A very straightforward and easy to understand RT. I'm not even sure what to say, it's just good.

Wiccan’s an easy character to not really understand, so it’s great to have an RT for him. He has both his basic “wishing” magic and a high-tier Demiurge state, both of which are kind of ambiguous. Nice work by @godlyshinigami.

@professorrespect is doing another of his decade by decade analyses of a major character, like the one he did for Dr. Doom. That one was quite revealing for how the character has changed over time, so I am looking forward to seeing how this one turns out as well. His earliest years were full of mystery and hyperbole, and definitely worth checking out as a group on their own.

@y3kthunder made this RT on the two Endless characters, Desire and Despair. I’ll be honest, I wish the writing was edited a bit, but the subject is a fun and unusual one, and worth a look. As noted in the thread, these aren’t characters that you’ll usually see in the Battle forums. It’s mostly just interesting to see exactly what their abilities really are and what scale they use them on.

@kaijuking made this comprehensive thread for the boundaries-pushing character, thoroughly going over his abilities. It’s straightforward and clear and should help people debate with Luther in the future. Kaiju also includes several other characters from the series in the same thread.

This is @alexandrioz’s first RT, and I’m including it here to reward the effort and encourage more in the future. It’s a huge and detailed look at Cade, with a lot of contextual detail given, which can be helpful, especially in a complex universe like Star Wars. But, holy damn dude, spoiler blocks! Like I said in the first RT above, easy navigation is a great thing in an RT. But, for a first effort this is very strong, and it’s worth it to give some cred (and context) to the EU’s post-OT era.

This week we've got two completely different battles from yesteryear to break down. One a cool, dramatic battle and one a festival of weirdness.

Luke Skywalker and Mara Jade vs Joruus C'Baoth and Luuke Skywalker

Dark Horse's Star Wars: The Last Command #6, the final issue in the miniseries based on Timothy Zahn's third Admiral Thrawn novel, was written by Mike Baron (whose Badger comic I showcased a few months ago) and drawn by Edvin Biuković. Biuković died young but was a fantastic artist who I'm sure would have created an amazing body of work if he had lived. His Grendel Tales: Devils & Deaths and Devil's Choices are longtime favorites of mine. His line quality is evocative and he had a great sense for dramatic poses and individual faces.

The battle is the finale between the rebels and a group of post-Empire remnants. While others deal with a space battle, Luke and Mara confront C'Baoth, the Big Bad of the Dark Jedi at the time. (This all takes place in what is now the Legends universe.) Here's them running in, with cool posing by Biuković, and a nice establishing shot of the area.

But when they confront him, they point out that actually, this isn't Jorus C'Baoth, who's been a thorn in their side for a long time, but Joruus (note the extra "u") C'Baoth, his clone. Now for those who were annoyed with The Rise of Skywalker for bringing the Emperor back as a clone, thinking that didn't seem very Star Wars-y, clone have actually been a pretty standard feature in the SW universe for some time, from the clone troopers to the Emperor's clone in the Dark Empire comics, to Starkiller's clone in Force Unleashed II. Anyway, the fight starts, with C'Baoth blasting Mara with debilitating Force Lightning right in the gut, and Luke defending against another stream of the same with his saber.

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But then Luke ends up facing...his own clone, "Luuke" Skywalker. Yep, you read that right. They cloned him from cells from his hand that was cut off in Empire Strikes Back, and he's using the lightsaber that hand was still clutching. (The current Marvel comics has a different history of this hand.) But honestly, goofy as this is, I think it's actually also kind of cool, and Biuković draws Skywalker doing a sweet roll over Skywalker (enlarged below). Luuke shows some nice Force fighting techniques by throwing his saber around a bit before pulling it back to himself. There's some more Force Lightning and C'Baoth keeps Han and Leia from being too much of a factor in the fight.

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Luke continues to fight Luuke, while C'Baoth pulls various weapons towards him with the Force. However, Mara intercepts her saber and uses it to stab Luuke in a nice reverse-grip move, which I'm again highlighting--Biuković's sense of motion and balance is captured really nicely here. (small scans read right to left)

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Now it's 2 on 1, so C'Baoth lets loose a Force Scream, collapsing part of the building, but the rebels move in. Leia uses the Force to help Mara, and Luke uses a saber throw to send a Vornskr at him. Mara makes a classic hero leap and stabs him in the chest. C'Baoth dies, releasing a big Dark Side Force blast as good bad guys should.

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Overall, the battle has some entertaining weirdness and also real dramatics, with Biuković's art really adding visual dynamism. It has a nice mix of saber combat and creative uses of the Force from all users. You can see the whole fight here.

Doom Patrol vs Dan Scram and His Gravity Pirates in the Scantoverse

And now, as they say, for something completely different. Doom Patrol is always weird, and Way's is particularly so. Here, the Patrol goes to the Scantoverse to fight Dan Scram and his Gravity Pirates. Why? Honestly it doesn't matter. It's just purely surreal fun, filled with moments like Robotman exclaiming, "I'm crying--but I have no tears! I'm in hell!" Because, you see, his violent actions have created a sensation of negativity, which reverberates back on the special metal his new body is made of. Now you understand. His arm gets blasted off.

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Dan starts eating the Uma Jelly, which...again, you don't really need to know, just wallow in the weirdness, but basically it's the epitome of mutating grossness. I also enjoy that Negative Man is supposed to defuse the bomb, but can't because Niles recently replaced his bandages with ones that are supposedly better, but...they have no fingers.

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So, after Dan turns into a monstrosity, Niles gives Casey and Negative Man some "protein bars" to turn them into "psychic werewolves" who save the day by...eating the monster. Because Niles is the kind of guy who gives you a protein bar and says it's fine, except it's not at all. However, he does have a pure McGuffin of a gun called a Reversion Ray that can (of course) reverse their condition just as easily. Then it's a quick ride home, no trauma at all, right team?

(Also, highlighted, Robotman smacks the monster with his own arm).

(read small scans 1-2-4-3)

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That fight is a quick and easy one, just purely entertaining silliness with Mike Allred's retro-graphic take on the art; Allred took the reins over temporarily from the main series artist Nick Derington, whose work is also fantastic. Here's the whole thing.

Battles take many forms--enjoy both!

@akz@darthor@hellothere5432:@ouroborik@battle123axe@geekryan:@rac95@frozen@mike_strike10:@sirkaboom15:@blackspidey2099

@godlyshinigami@pyrofn@kangconquers@terry2012@supremegeneration@higherpower

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@slash03@life_without_progress@destinyman75@mooty_pass@thealtone003@americanspeeddemon@sirkaboom15

New call-out list, let us know if you don't want to be included.

A group battle-royale by @geekryan involving some of the most formidable female warriors of Marvel's best known superhero groups. Captain Britain, Storm and Rogue representing the X-Men will go up against Captain Marvel, the Wasp and the Scarlet Witch of the Avengers, going against Medusa, Quake and Crystal of the Inhumans, with the fourth corner filled by the Eternals; Sersi, Thena and Ajak. There's far too many unique and versatile powers at play here, with each team having its own balanced strengths and weaknesses, and far too few responses relative to the amount of characters involved. Remember that you might not be well versed on every character in threads like this, but even if you can contribute with your knowledge on one of them, that's how the thread will turn out complete.

With Marvel's Love and Thunder out, and Percy Jackson getting a bit more representation these days, @cocacolaman shares a matchup between the former's big bad; Gorr the God Butcher, and the latter's title character. The battle pits two very different fighters against each other, but with some common traits that help make it balanced. A swordsfight, shadow and water manipulation, anything goes. It is quite the thematic threads, as Percy himself is a demigod, which is close enough to what Gorr would like to... butcher. There's been a request for arguments, but not really anything yet, so be the first one to!

Finally, we present an in-verse Avatar thread by @viking1205, which I find super interesting because we rarely see threads pitting human characters against hybrid beasts -- but the resulting discussions and speculation are always exciting. The sandshark is a perplexing species we came across in The Legend of Korra's third book, chapter "Long Live the Queen". They reside in the Si Wong Desert, which means any bender coming across them would have to stand their ground on the predator's home turf. Specialised bending styles, battlefield awareness, experience and output are all factoring in on the challenge. See this thread as well.

In @allstarsuperman's Street Clothes Tourney, where street level characters fight only with the gear they can hide under their street clothes, we have allstar himself against @chimeroid. Allstar is repping Sam Fisher from Splinter Cell and chimeroid has Nightwing. Whatever one thinks about the potential outcome of the battle, it's a fun and detailed debate, with Sam Fisher definitely being an unusual character to see in debates like this (one reason I appreciate this tourney concept is that it allows guys like him to have a chance), and Nightwing being someone who, as chimeroid notes, is sometimes more known than known about.

We're into round 2 in this tourney, with some pretty cool characters in some of the different segments. Here @thewatcherking uses Time Displaced Jean Grey and Shigaraki from My Hero Academia against @mass's Tyki Mykk from D.Gray-Man and Lloyd Saloum who I believe is from I Was Reincarnated as the 7th Prince, So I'll Take My Time Perfecting My Magical Ability? Anyway this debate features two excellent debaters both as prose writers and strategic thinkers, so it's a pleasure to read. The back and forth promises to be complex, so start reading now.

In this addition, I discuss the site and its future with long-standing user @thor-parker

1. What were the main reasons for why you joined the Vine in the first place? Was there anything in particular you were interested in?

The main reason I joined Comic Vine was the battle forums. Before creating my account, I had been lurking for maybe a couple months until I decided I wanted to join the discussions and interact with other users here. Another reason for creating my account was the Gen. Discussion forum, there was a lot of interesting discussion about several topics, back when it was actually about comics instead of the MCU and DCEU thread you find now most of the time, and so, it was a place where you could discuss comics and since I didn't know (and still don't know) anyone in real life that is an avid comic book readers, this seemed like a good place to be.

The web and forum design also helped a lot, it was clean and easy to follow, unlike many other websites whose forums look like they couldn't bother to hire a website designer.

2. You mention that your favourite runs are Ultimate Spider-Man by Bendis and Jurgens Thor. Why is that, and how were you introduced to these in the first place?

Contrary to what I believe most people think, Thor is not my favourite character, my favourite character is Spider-Man, by far.

I have always been a fan of Spider-Man since I can remember, I actually think the very first movie I saw on theaters or at least one of the earliest ones I have a memory of was the original Spider-Man movie with Tobey Maguire, I was 4 years old and remember being scared as hell in the scene where Green Goblin choked Doctor Stromm.

I played a lot of Spider-Man videogames since the PS1 all the way to Insomniac's Spider-Man, I just love the character and always have since I was very young.

My very first comic I read was the original Civil War (2006) event and many of its tie ins, I found a website that collected the main series and its tie ins in chronological order, of course I didn't read all the tie ins, I mostly focused on Spider-Man and the main event. I absolutely fell in love with comics after finishing the event and I was hungry for more reading.

So after that, as I assume most newbies do when getting into comics, I searched online where are the best places to start and what are the best stories for the characters I was interested in. In most of the lists I found, New Avengers by Bendis seemed to be like the starting point for modern Marvel, so that's what I did, went through all the Bendis era. After that I returned my focus on Spider-Man, and once again looked online for what to read, and Ultimate Spider-Man was almost in all of the suggestions I found, and since it was by the same writer I had been reading in New Avengers, I decided to give it a try, and I loved every second of it.

As for Thor, it was weird, because the first comic I read from his solo title was the Ragnarok arc, and it was that one because as I mentioned, modern Marvel seemed to start when Bendis took over the Avengers title, and that was in Avengers Disassembled, since Thor Ragnarok was under that banner as well, I started there. My only exposition to Thor before that was the Thor movie and The Avengers movie, so reading Ragnarok as my first Thor comic wasn't a really good idea, I was very confused, barely understood anything and didn't know any of the characters in there. Anyway, I just kept going with JMS' run and that was a better introduction to Thor without all the heavy baggage. After I finished JMS' run, I looked online and obviously everyone was suggesting Walter Simonson's run, but I didn't want to read an 80s comics, I wanted something more modern. So I kept looking and found a Thor run by Dan Jurgens, I probably wouldn't have picked it up because to be honest it doesn't get as much credit as it deserves, but I decided to give it a try because if John Romita Jr whose art I absolutely love.

I loved all the themes it touched, especially the religious aspect and Thor's involvement in Earth's affairs, on what should a god do to help humanity and how far should he go. At what point does he stop helping people by trying to solve every single problem in the planet instead of letting humanity find their own way ? To this day, I still haven't found a comic that touches those themes and in such a good and effortless way that run did.

3. How do you think comics these days compare to what was around 10 to 20 years ago?

There's always been and always will be great and horrible comics in any given time period, I think comics today rely too much on shock value and cheap gimmicks that generate clickbaits thanks to internet now playing the biggest part in our lives, on merchandise, on what we buy or we don't. So I feel comics are trying too hard to make headlines instead of telling good stories, and in that front I do think comics as a whole were better back in the 2000s era when writers actually focused on telling good stories rather than making headlines on Twitter.

That doesn't mean there aren't good comics now, quite the contrary, you can always find plenty of great quality storytelling in any company.

By the way, when I say comics might have been better in 2000s it's based on what I read, not what I experienced in that time, I was born in 1998 so I was really young back then, not to mention I started reading comics in 2012 or 2013 I think.

4. When it comes to CV, is there anything that you would personally change in terms of the site in general?

More articles, comic book news, movie news and discussions in the front page. When I first joined in 2014 the website front page had daily updates with interesting topics, nowadays there's one new article every 4-5 months. More front page articles invites more participation from users and would generate more traffic to Comic Vine.

5. Are you ok with the more comedic tones that MCU Thor has been written under for his last few LA appearances? I've heard some long-time fans not be impressed by said shift.

I am not "ok" with it but I understand the change, for some reason general audience wasn't really responding that well to Thor as they were to Tony or Steve, so something needed to be done. For that Feige brought Taika Waititi to try something new, and the results were really good for the most part, everyone loved Ragnarok and Thor as a character became more appreciated after that movie.

Then came Infinity War which gave us the best and most badass version of Thor, the movie where I have seen the second biggest cheer ever in a theater (it was the first, but No Way Home beat it) when Thor arrived in Wakanda, I was so happy after that movie, Thor rightfully placed as one of the most badass and coolest Avengers. The came the biggest disgrace that has happened to the character in Endgame where he was transformed into a joke, a petty god with no redeemable traits, just used as a comedic relief. I did love the more viking look with the braided beard he had at the final battle against Thanos, it's actually my favourite look he's ever had in the MCU, he genuinely feels like a viking god (I'd only remove the belly).

So yeah, since Ragnarok proved to be a success, it was expected that the more comedic tone was going to continue. As I explained, I don't like it, but I understand it and try to enjoy and appreciate this interpretation for what it is, I think Hemsworth has done a really good job. I do wish general audience would come to know more traits of the real Thor from the comics, regal, noble and larger than life, that I think Hemsworth could definitely bring if given the chance and right script.

As for Love and Thunder, I enjoyed the movie a lot, Gorr was great with the little screen time he had, Bale can do no wrong, I just wish he had been given more screen time to make him feel like an actual threat, he only killed one god on screen, and on his first fight with Thor he was overpowered and fled once he saw he had to fight Valkyrie, Jane and Thor at the same time, so right from the start he didn't feel like much of a threat. Again, when it comes to performance, Bale was excellent, he was terrifying and sympathetic, but Gorr himself just didn't feel like a big enough threat because we never really saw him doing any god butchery.

6. You've been debating on this site for a pretty long time on top of everything else. Do you feel like CV's debating has changed since you joined? If so, by what measures, and do you think it's better or worse compared to then?

To be honest I stopped debating in battle forums a long time ago, maybe I'll pop up here and there saying who I think wins and maybe engaging in a couple of posts, but not much more. I did use to debate a lot a few years ago but it can become hostile very quickly and I stopped enjoying debating because of it. Also, since I was so much into debating, there was a point where I just read comics for feats, couldn't really enjoy what I was reading as I was only looking for what to use in a debate and that's just not right. Comics are a storytelling medium, their goal is to tell a story, so just enjoy it for what it is and stop trying to look for explanations, feats or whatever else, just enjoy the story, that's what comics are for.

7. What hobbies/interests do you have outside of the website that are of particular interest?

I am from Mexico so obviously I love playing soccer, I'm a goalkeeper.

I also play guitar since I was 10 years old, I play mostly 80s rock and my favourite band is Guns N Roses.

I love watching movies and tv shows, always have

I am an architect.

8. Finally, what advice do you have for newer users of the site in general?

Just enjoy comics, movies, or whatever you like, and remember that this is a place to find people with similar interest and share it with them, to find someone to talk about these geeky things we love, do not approach this website with the mindset that you know everything and want to prove everyone else wrong. This place should be to make new friends and talk about the superheroes we love.

=========

Once again, thank you to Parker for the insightful responses.

I went to San Diego Comic Con last week (and got covid from it!). I thought this might be a good context to set up a semi-battle style argument about "which comic con is the best comic con?"

The classic comic con match-up (at least in the States--I'm not as familiar with non-US cons, so please feel free to throw out your opinion on any of those that you're familiar with) would be New York Comic Con vs San Diego. They're two of the biggest and they have the classic east coast/west coast rivalry.

My comparison between them:

SDCC is much longer-running (1970 vs 2006) and has the official trademark over the term "comic-con," which is of course ridiculous, so it has more of a sense of tradition, but also honestly a bit of elitism.

My experience with SDCC this year, vs NYCC in past years, is that there was less cosplay (in the halls) at SDCC, and it was less ambitious or over the top than I've seen at NYCC (and other cons). This observation was shared by others at the event. This may, however, have been some kind of post-covid effect. I could also imagine that most people have to fly to SDCC, and thus have to fit their cosplay in their luggage, while NYC probably gets more locals who can suit up at home.

The cosplay contests were quite different. NYCC is mostly people just walking out and doing poses, then moving on. All the participants at SDCC had a skit, or at least did a choreographed set of poses to music (which is why they call it a "masquerade" instead of a cosplay contest). My personal opinion here is that I'd rather see more costumes per minute than spend time on what are to me at best OK skits (I think this is true at any skit-based con; most cosplayers are costume makers, not actors and writers), and the posing style also allows the wearer to wear more complex cosplay, rather than having to limit yourself to something you can move in easily for your skit (obviously that's somewhat of an oversimplification).

Panel discussions were more or less equivalent. I've seen creative discussion topics and giants of the industry at both (like Sienkiewicz interviewing Miller at SDCC this year, for instance), which is always fun. I did like some of the interactive panels at SDCC--they had an "Unmasquerade" where the panel tried to guess attendees' obscure cosplays, and a "chocolate for trivia" contest.

I would say the vendors are basically the same at both, in terms of both number and composition. The quantity and quality of comic sellers--just folks selling longboxes of art--was probably even.

NYCC's artist alley, however, is typically much more extensive, with more top-level artists, than what there was at SDCC. Again, this may be due to artists being wary of travel during covid. And again, I can imagine that more comic artists are either in NYC or can get there more easily from Europe than the ones that live or get to the west coast. I usually look for some original art but didn't find any that spoke to me. San Diego had more re-sellers of original art than I recall from NYCC. Which is cool too, but I'd rather give my money directly to the artists than some random re-seller. Also, as an aside, who are these people who are willing to shell out $50,000+ for a single, fairly random, original cover from a few decades ago? I mean, I get collectability, I just don't get that people with that liquidity exist! Then again maybe if I wanted to be able to spend a lot of money buying art I shouldn't have been an artist.

Most of what I've said so far has been pro-NYCC. However, I was very impressed with SDCC's beep-in-and-out system, and their use of their back porches that look over the marina. The whole building felt very permeable--it was super easy to get in and out, and to find a space outside to eat. NYCC feels much more crowded and controlled.

Prop/weapon check was also WAY more casual at SDCC. My kid and I were literally unable to even find it for the few few days. It's stuck in a corner you don't have to pass by and had no sign, whereas at NYCC and most big cons, you have to go through a specific gauntlet of prop checkers just to get in. This could be a good thing or a bad thing depending on how you feel about it (you can sneak in your props without having to have distracting zipties on them in your pictures, which is cool, but on the other hand so can psychos, which is bad and not non-existent).

SDCC also has one particularly unique thing, which is the Eisners. I had no idea that anyone could just show up there. They have the gala dinner seating up front for the nominees and people in the industry, then any other attendee can sit in the back in standard panel seating. I was shocked at how few normal attendees were there--it seems like a pretty cool thing to be able to see the "Oscars" of your favorite industry in person. There were some emotional speeches, more heavyweights (Sienkiewicz, Miller, Jim Lee, Gaiman, Kevin Eastman, etc.) and a cool tribute to Mark Gruenwald, one of my favorites, by his wife. This is one thing that NYCC or any of the other cons will never have.

My overall thoughts? I'd go for NYCC in a fairly close contest. Partly this is because it's easier for me to get to based on where I live, but I think its advantage in cosplay and artists (even if perhaps due to recent context) made the decision for me. But San Diego's openness (and its shuttle system, which was very smooth) were big plusses on its side.

Of course, there are plenty of other major cons, some of which I would honestly take over NYCC.

DragonCon is very unique, because it's held in four different hotels, and has very specific threads of content that are a lot more wide-ranging than other cons. The cosplay there, even just in the halls, is also well-known to be fantastic and enthusiastic. And its nightlife is a completely different, much more adult-themed, beast than other cons.

Toronto FanExpo is honestly my favorite. It has pretty much everything I might find in New York, but it feels just a teensy bit more approachable, creative, and casual.

And of course I've left out anime-specific cons (which I don't follow) as well as other genres.

What do YOU think? Any preferences or opinions about NYCC or SDCC? Would you nominate any others as your personal favorite?

@akz@thor-parker@darthor@hellothere5432:@ouroborik@battle123axe@geekryan:@rac95@frozen@mike_strike10:@sirkaboom15:@blackspidey2099

@godlyshinigami@pyrofn@kangconquers@terry2012@supremegeneration@higherpower

@kevd4wg@punyaamrit@kaijuking@sar_annihilator@killerboi@ultraphoenix@maestromage

@chronicplane@thevoidofdeath@themadtitan6000:@teefurtree:@majinblackheart@princesscadenza@noone1996

@del_torro@jashro44@beatboks1@maalik@lettsplay10@god_spawn@sweatboy@koays

@byondeon@cheatcode@themidnightking@xthemanofmightx@blackpantherisb@novaprime2@vinervvvvv@eredin12

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@slash03@life_without_progress@destinyman75@mooty_pass@thealtone003@americanspeeddemon@sirkaboom15

New call-out list, let us know if you don't want to be included.

In this revived thread by @anjales_ii, Marvel comics' Frank Castle, A.K.A. the Punisher is up against Agent 47 of the Hitman titles. It's a unique, detailed setting tailor made for well known trained killers. Interesting to consider how, and if, opinions have changed over the years. Some interesting arguments throughout but there's room for a lot more. This matchup is espionage against military, and slickness against brutality. Who comes out on top is for you to decide.

In this thread, courtesy of our own @owie, Capter Carter of Marvel Studios' What If? takes on an accumulation type gauntlet, in that by defeating each opponent of the list, one more is added on the team she's facing off against next. Some nostalgic, fierce warriors will be up against the Super Soldier, including Hit-Monkey, Kim Possible, and Raphael. An exciting concept to debate; as always when it comes to threads involving so many characters at once, you can contribute even without having knowledge on all of them, simply by sharing on what and/or whom you do know about. This is how the community helps one another.

More Marvel? Yes. Two of Taika Waititi's Thor villains, the Goddess of Death and the God-Butcher, take on each other in a thread made by @killianduclark. Are you a fan of the MCU and the Thor mythos? Did you enjoy these films in spite of the criticism? Do you like today's live action debating, including posts composed of nothing but production statements and people quoting themselves over and over while nothing has changed? Then this thread is for you! Go nuts.

The end of the Hunger Games has been 6+ months in the making and it's been a pretty great ride with all of the twists and turns you'd expect, ending in this final big debate for the overall winner. Despite the debate being more or less finished, I would still say it's a good read with lots of good back and forth argumentation while being very accessible for the casual viewer as well. Obviously I'm going to hawk this because I was a part of reviving the HG to a successful tenure, but putting that to the side as much as possible I do still believe this was a fun enough debate to stick on here regardless.

The Jean/Wanda debate continues to bubble as we get a CaV between two characters that have been hotly debated throughout pretty much every major site worth much for those sort of things. Lots of unique points being thrown out at here and plenty to figure out as a winner must eventually be made....

I thought this was a fairly interesting example to be thrown out: the idea of having "multiple characters vs one person" is not a unique concept; this is the more successful utilization of the concept presented so far given these early posts. Now I have my own thoughts on how.....balanced (or lack of) the tourney as a whole is, but I won't deny that it makes for some great drama and experimentation, especially with this debate above and the hybrid debating of comic/manga formats. It's certainly not for everyone given the subject matter: however it's a good look into how debates these days are conducted.

Black Clover has become one of the most popular Shonen anime to debate on Comic Vine, with no shortage of characters with ludicrous hax, and Julius Novachrono fits that to T. @slash03 has done their part in compiling feats for the Wizard King that perfectly portray his threat level within his verse, using both the manga and anime to give a full picture of his versatility and power.

@kaijuking has always had a love for Kaijus, if it wasn't obvious enough. He continues his public displays of respect for these monsters with this respect thread for Zilla across multiple incarnations, including the original from the 90's, the Animated Series', Final Wars', and the Zilla from IDW Comics. If you need to debate with this monstrous Godzilla character, feel free to take a look!

Scar from Fullmetal Alchemist is a character that maybe isn't used quite as often as he should be used, just like the series itself, but @cryolancer47 has now crafted a respect thread for the murderous warrior, going in succinct detail over his basic stats and his Alchemy abilities. Make sure to give it a look!

I want to give respect to a truly epic battle that came to a culmination last week. It started in X-Men Red 5 and continued into issue 6 before coming to a conclusion in AXE Judgment Day 4.

This is the battle between Magneto and Uranos, one of the most powerful Eternals to ever exist.

Some backstory: Not only is Uranos incredibly formidable himself, he also created a huge arsenal of technological weapons that he hid within the Earth in a space between dimensions. He is genocidal and kicked a bunch of Eternal butt back in the day; he was only defeated because Druig betrayed him. When the Eternals wanted to gain access to his mind to learn about his weapons, Uranos fought a psychic war against all of them for a hundred straight years before finally being defeated. They have kept him isolated in prison for the last 600,000 years.

In modern time, Druig, who is normally the bad guy of the Eternals, managed to get himself elected as the Prime Eternal and started using Uranos as an enforcer in selected situations. When Druig starts a war on mutantkind, he sends Uranos to wipe out as many of the mutants on Mars as he can in one hour, then sends him back to prison.

Uranos proceeds to kill an enormous swath of mutants, including numerous Omega mutants on the Arakko Great Ring and even defeats Legion, one of the most powerful beings in Marvel (especially since Franklin Richards has been depowered and Owen Reece has been thought killed, although he was just revealed to have been a prisoner in the Microverse). Exactly how Uranos beat Legion is unknown since he did it off panel, which was kind of a cop-out.

Regardless, while on Mars, Magneto provides one of the biggest challenges to Uranos by linking up with another mutant who can generate metal. Others, especially Cable, also help, and drag the fight out for a little more than six minutes (Uranos beat Legion in about 30 seconds). The Eternal eventually punches Erik through the chest, leaving a gaping hole in his torso and seemingly killing him.

Some of the others keep fighting, but Uranos kills most of them, including Cable, Abigail Brand, and 98% of life within a 50-mile radius.

(See here for the main beats of this part of the story.)

This is a big deal, because while the mutants have found a way to resurrect themselves through mutant circuits, Magneto and Storm have sworn to give up the gift of resurrection in order to be members of the Great Ring, since the mutants of Arakko believe resurrection cheats ones’ attempts to be a perfect fearless warrior. So if Magneto dies, he dies for good. And I’m sure the writers would never resurrect him, unlike the multiple other times he has died in the past!

BUT.

Magneto, who has taken part in many epic battles in the past, begins one of his most badass moments in recent history. He gets up, THE HOLE STILL IN HIS CHEST, and prepares to fight on.

Hole in his chest, you say? How exactly does he do that? Because while Maggy is a fairly tough guy physically for someone who has a basically human body, that seems to be a little unusual.

And you are right, it certainly is. What Magneto is doing is using his magnetic power to control the circulation of his blood by controlling the iron in his blood. Basically he’s like, “heart? Who needs a heart? I can do that work on my own, why I don’t even know why I’ve bothered to have a heart all these years.” Is this totally crazy? I mean, yes, it is crazy, but it’s not completely beyond the pale for the Master of Magnetism. He has read or controlled people’s minds by controlling the iron of the blood inside it for decades, including even effecting a form of mind control by controlling the blood in the brain.

I should also mention that not only is this a cool feat for his powers, but it’s visually rendered in an awesome way in both series as a bright blue or pink arcing ball of energy centered in the hole in his chest.

So, taking advantage of a long-existing if not always prominent capacity of his powers, Magneto joins up with Storm, claiming that his seat on the Great Ring, the Seat of Loss, is now in control (definite foreshadowing here, but powerfully so, given Lensherr’s long-running narrative of fighting against overwhelming odds while sustaining loss, from his time as a prisoner of the Nazis, and afterward losing his beloved Magda and Anya, onward).

The writers again utilize a rarely-used capacity of Magneto’s and have Storm supercharge him with a lightning bolt which again is badass. Then the team teleports to Earth where Uranos has been unleashed once more.

(See the main gist of all this here.)

The Eternal is knocking everyone around with seemingly no one to stop him. However, he was not counting on a heartless supercharged Magneto. Despite the amp, Mags is in trouble from the start, because he has to simultaneously keep himself alive and fight one of the most dangerous Eternals ever. However, he has never been one to run from danger, and jumps in headlong, lashing out at Uranos.

Their second fight (which features Magneto and Storm together) is only a few panels but takes “minutes,” which might not sound like much but when you recall that Uranos beat Legion in about 30 seconds, is pretty good. Their attacks make even the Progenitor Celestial shade its eyes, and they bring Uranos to his knees.

Ultimately, the holder of the Seat of Loss is not able to beat his foe, who wields planet-destroying power (at least between his own abilities and those of his technological weapons), but he does distract and hold him off long enough for Iron Man and others to redirect all of Uranos’s own weapons against him, defeating him for the moment.

(See the main parts of the last chapter of the battle here.)

This battle was well written by Al Ewing and Kieron Gillen, with great dialog and pacing, which is important in something running across multiple series. The artists, Stefano Caselli and Valerio Schiti, both did a fantastic job rendering the action. While neither of the fights are Magneto alone, he is clearly the central figure, and all of it fits in and utilizes Magneto’s long-running narratives across almost all of Marvel history, taking advantage of the echoes of his arrogance, his majesty, and his tragedy from 1963 to today to build a story that just feels very Magneto in its very bones.

How does it end? What loss is Magneto in for? Check out the comics, which again are X-Men Red 5 and 6 and AXE: Judgment Day 4, with Uranos’s backstory coming from the preceding Eternals series, especially Eternals: The Heretic.

@akz@thor-parker@asgardianweapon@darthor@hellothere5432:@ouroborik@battle123axe@geekryan:@rac95@frozen@mike_strike10:@sirkaboom15:@blackspidey2099

@godlyshinigami@pyrofn@kangconquers@terry2012@supremegeneration@higherpower

@kevd4wg@punyaamrit@kaijuking@sar_annihilator@killerboi@ultraphoenix@maestromage

@chronicplane@thevoidofdeath@themadtitan6000:@teefurtree:@majinblackheart@princesscadenza@noone1996

@del_torro@jashro44@beatboks1@maalik@lettsplay10@god_spawn@sweatboy@koays

@byondeon@cheatcode@themidnightking@xthemanofmightx@blackpantherisb@novaprime2@vinervvvvv@eredin12

@achillesspawn@death4bunnies@deadmanwalkin@darthjhawk@kurt_saulenne@manofmanynames2@killianduclark

@slash03@life_without_progress@destinyman75@mooty_pass@thealtone003@americanspeeddemon@sirkaboom15

New call-out list, let us know if you don't want to be included.

The feat-a-rama that was Black Adam inspired many a battle thread, which in turn have started new rivalries with established fandoms. I decided to include a variety of them here:

DCEU Black Adam vs L&T Thor, created by @nassergrant19. We've run through all the possible variants on Superman/Thor, so let's switch in Black Adam and see how things fare.

Wonder Woman (DCEU) vs Hawkman (DCEU) made by @last0fth3risen. One of several Hawkman battles. What I think is interesting about things like this (and the one above, really) is how it takes a new character, whose feats are just starting to gel in people's minds, and compares it to an existing character whose feats are controversial, leaving ambiguity on both sides.

DCEU Dr. Fate vs MCU Scarlet Witch by @angeljaxis a match-up that surprises no one...but again, fairly ambiguous feats on both sides make this debatable.

And then finally, we of course get Justice Society (DCEU) vs Justice League (DCEU), created by @killianduclark, bringing together the two main DCEU super teams. There's a lot of factors here, who do you think wins?

There were also plenty of Namor battles but I'm not going to list a million of them. Let's go with the most obvious match-up, which is also the most in-depth debate. MCU Namor vs DCEU Aquaman by @misterkeyrush is actually at 46% to 46% in the poll at the moment. Vote (and post) and break the tie!

Bleach: Old Gen Captains Vs New Gen Captains, by @sixpathsofcapra, is actually one of at least three anime battles I looked at that weren't bait and flamewars! My faith in humanity is reborn. As you know I don't know a damn thing about anime, but I am heartened by the fact that multiple people in this thread say it contains possible scenarios for either team to win. Which is basically what every battle thread should be like. So congrats for making the battle and for the debaters who commented with judiciousness.

Normally I post battles that were recently made and have a lot of posts but I'll break both those rules to bring you two interesting battles. First, MCU: The Defenders vs Drax the Destroyer, made by our own @anthp2000, was made 4 years ago, but there's renewed interest and feats for Drax after the Guardians Holiday Special, so it's worth taking a look. Second, Thunderbird (The Gifted) vs. DCEU Batman, by @brocktonian, which is recent with almost no posts, but I give them credit for using a character from The Gifted, which you rarely see, and it's a decent battle with stats, skills, and gear as factors. Give 'em some comments.

This is a debate that needs no introduction. This is a battle between four of the most popular characters on ComicVine. This sees one of the biggest Naruto debaters @thenamelessone representing the Hero of the Hidden Leaf Naruto Uzumaki taking on one of the biggest One Piece debaters and new gen debaters in general @pics representing The Infamous Monkey D. Luffy. It isn't just them. They also have to worry about @wk_decaff who is one of the most prevalent Black Clover debaters on ComicVine and he is representing the series' main character Asta. Finally, we have a Bleach debater you might not have heard about but I assure you he knows his stuff @bruhmomento and he is representing Ichigo Kurosaki. Now that the first post is up, I can tell you this epic debate is not something you want to miss!

In this debate, we have Spawn who @sirfizzwhizz represents taking on Terra Branford who is being represented by @mass. Spawn is definitely someone you might have heard of. Now, his opponent is someone that you might not know. Terra is a Final Fantasy character. This debate already has an opener. Mass has set the stage. Check this out if you want to learn some new stuff.

In this debate, we have a fatal four-way match. This debate is between the four most popular main characters in Anime today. We have one of the best naruto debaters on this website @thenamelessone representing Naruto Uzumaki taking on one of the best new gen debaters @pics representing Monkey D. Luffy and one of the best Black Clover debaters on the site @wk_decaff representing Asta, and finally someone you might not have heard about @bruhmomento representing Ichigo Kurosaki. This is definitely going to be CaV to keep up with! All of these debaters know their respective series very well.

Finally, in this debate, we have False Avatar Yun represented by @viking1205 taking on Kuvira who is represented by @korraalone. It is always nice to see a series like Avtar have an inverse debate. The power system is very unique and this debate is a great example of that. Both of the debaters have their posts already out. Go ahead and check them out.

This a much-needed and respected thread. This goes over the areas of the Power Rangers and puts them in a neat manner. As a casual fan myself, I found it very informative. I believe it is well worth your time.

Respect thread by: @tighten_returns

With the recent release of Wakanda Forever, I think this is a good thread to check out after the movie has sunk in. Just make sure to avoid this until you see the movie if you are worried about spoilers.

Respect Thread by: @death4bunnies

This is an older thread but it seemed to get some relevance as of late. Besides, we can't do a respect thread section without featuring ComicVine's number one respect thread creator. Check it out if you want a read on a character you didn't have the slightest clue about.

Respect Thread by: @professorrespect

Let’s talk Crystar, the Crystal Warrior. You know I love me some crappy '80s comics, but this is digging kind of deep.

The Saga of Crystar, the Crystal Warriorwas one of several comics Marvel put out in the '70s and '80s based on toy licenses. Although toy comics have a bad reputation, some were pretty good and ran for a huge number of issues (Larry Hama is currently wrapping up his run on GI Joe, which started at Marvel before eventually moving to Image, at issue 300). Others, like Micronauts and ROM—both written by Bill Mantlo—were somewhat underground sleepers. Both of those series had unexpected depth of character and plot (with Peter Gillis taking over the writing of the second Micronauts volume), and sometimes felt like some of the most adult comics at Marvel at the time. However they never hit the IP bonanza like GI Joe and Transformers.

But for every GI Joe or ROM, there were also some not-so-amazing toy comics. I mean, I’ll be honest I never read Marvel’s Starriors, but I can’t imagine that there’s any gold to be found there. And hey, maybe I’m wrong, because Louise Simonson wrote it, and they had Bill Sienkiewicz covers if you can believe it! But still. Starriors.

Anyway, I always assumed Crystar was one of those not-so-great comics. I had some Crystar toys but couldn’t imagine it coming alive in comics format. However, I stumbled across the penultimate issue, number 10 of 11, in a 50¢ bin and figured what the hell. Crystar the character was in the Weird World series a few years ago, and Marvel has continued bringing him back for minor Weird World tie-ins, so I thought it might be worth seeing what his original Marvel continuity is all about.

Yes, this will eventually get to a battle.

Crystar actually has decent creatives working on it, like Starriors. Mary Jo Duffy was the writer throughout. It started off with Bret Blevins (a longtime artist on New Mutants among others, including one of my personal favorites, Epic’s Bozz Chronicles) and then eventually switched to Ricardo Villamonte, who I was not previously aware of but has a nice, somewhat Jim-Starlin-mixed-with-Art-Adams style. Crystar also features sexed-up Michael Golden covers of its crystalline characters (GI Joe also sported Golden covers for a stretch). [Like, what is this light blue lady here even doing? She’s just like…dance-fighting? Like, look at her hands…what are those gestures? There is no answer inside, she’s in literally only 2 panels in the whole comic.] They even crossed Crystar over with the X-Men and Alpha Flight. The first one of those was obviously to connect the comic with some extra readers (the Micronauts also crossed over with the X-Men) but I don’t know what the heck the point of the Alpha Flight crossover was, especially since it was the final issue. Going out on a mediocre note? But one way or another, Marvel actually put some effort into making Crystar happen.

While it’s hard to get a feel for the writing after one issue, it feels much more complex and humanized than I expected. For instance, there’s a B-plot where this guy Bekk, who was an important guy in some other place, gets turned into a crystal warrior and joins up with Crystar. He’s clearly a blowhard and keeps talking about how great he is to the populace. The ladies love ‘im. He’s obviously being set up as a foil who might challenge Crystar for leadership. And maybe there’s good reason for that, since when Crystar tries to give a political speech, he’s got nothin’. Still, when Crystar’s lady-friend says now maybe he can share power with Bekk, Crystar isn’t so sure about that. But then the thing is, when Bekk gets into battle, he freezes up. He starts realizing the horror of death. So now it looks like he’s actually a second stereotype, the paper tiger. Basically at this point he seems like the Starscream of Crystar. However, Duffy twists things again. Instead of everyone realizing what a coward he is, a female character helps him out, he gets over his ego and his fear, and he joins the battle after all, seemingly becoming an OK guy in the process. This plays with several cliches, but by putting them all together, it gives him depth.

Now we get into some more weird political territory for Crystar. He goes to see his own boss, who he assumes will take his side, but waffles. Now the normal macho warrior in a comic would insist on his hereditary rights. Crystar, though, is fine with it. He actually gives up his birthright just to make sure he understands the other guy’s point of view. What? Crystar, where is your toxic masculinity? But then Crystar turns into the waffler. Some of his followers hear he gave up, and they’re all like, “um, we really would like to fight after all.” Then Crystar, who apparently does not define himself by a clear and steady adherence to a particular philosophy of leadership, decides that’s fine too. Fight time! (Also, Bekk gets some more unprincipled waffling in of his own, transparently switching sides while pretending not to.)

So, the actual fight. This is a wacky battle. First let’s consider the teams. On the one side is Crystar’s crystal warriors, all of whom have crystal bodies and stand for Order. The enemies are the minions of Moltar and believe in Chaos. There’s also a couple of assorted wizards, who can just make swords that can cut through anything at a moment’s notice, as if that wouldn’t have been helpful to do earlier. They also apparently employ child soldiers on the good-guy team. The UN might want to know about that. Also, Bekk the arrogant guy? Let’s just look at his weapon-readiness. Is this sheath not the worst place you could possibly put a short sword? Like, imagine trying to draw that. I guess, as I sit here miming the motion, I could position my elbow down, reach my hand up to grab the handle, and then swing my hand out while keeping my elbow in place, thus curving it out? But c’mon. This is High Fantasy Scabbard Art Tomfoolery right here, where the challenge is almost like Scabbard Bingo—"O2, scabbard on the upper arm. G3, scabbard on the back of the neck. I12, scabbard diagonally on the chest pointing toward the left. Where have I not drawn a scabbard recently?” We’re just an art generation away from Cable and all his pouches here. Also, nice bikini pants.

Anyway, a bunch of Moltar’s goons attack. Moltar is honestly not that psyched about the attack but is pressed into it by his own lady-friend. The heroes are pretty clear that 90% of their army, who are humans, are basically useless and essentially tell them not to try too hard. The baddies attack, and a guy that Bekk thought was lame ends up being super-heroic. Soon, the forces of Order use their magic and magic sword hax to drive the bad guys off in a clear victory that honestly does make Moltar seem pretty prescient in not wanting to do the whole thing. They complain that the heroes were “too well prepared”—I mean, the crystal warriors literally barely finished talking to their army before the minions of Chaos attacked, so if the bad guys can’t handle that level of preparation, I’d hate to see how badly they’d lose against a team with real prep. Anyway Moltar's forces seem to make their decision to retreat almost at random, like they didn’t realize that they might lose some people during a war, and when they do, they’re kind of surprised and decide that’s enough for now. Way to decide to attack for no reason and lose a lot of your army for no apparent gain.

All in all, Crystar is no ROM, and was not lacking in cheesy parts, but it was definitely better than I expected due to solid art and more complex writing than the toy's content would have required.

@akz@thor-parker@asgardianweapon@darthor@hellothere5432:@ouroborik@battle123axe@geekryan:@rac95@frozen@mike_strike10:@sirkaboom15:@blackspidey2099

@godlyshinigami@pyrofn@kangconquers@terry2012@supremegeneration@higherpower

@kevd4wg@punyaamrit@kaijuking@sar_annihilator@killerboi@ultraphoenix@maestromage

@chronicplane@thevoidofdeath@themadtitan6000:@teefurtree:@majinblackheart@princesscadenza@noone1996

@del_torro@jashro44@beatboks1@maalik@lettsplay10@god_spawn@sweatboy@koays

@byondeon@cheatcode@themidnightking@xthemanofmightx@blackpantherisb@novaprime2@vinervvvvv@eredin12

@achillesspawn@death4bunnies@deadmanwalkin@darthjhawk@kurt_saulenne@manofmanynames2@killianduclark

@slash03@life_without_progress@destinyman75@mooty_pass@thealtone003@americanspeeddemon@sirkaboom15

New call-out list, let us know if you don't want to be included.

As always the endless feud between Jean and other big-wig Marvel females shows itself again, which is as always is entertaining and somewhat educational in how these tend to go. It's a lot of fun to go though and of course these sort of characters get a lot of productive discussion!

This is of course using fairly popular characters as well, but I think the duo stipulation mixes things up aplenty, and the addition of the new empowered Shulk alongside Thor is a interesting combination that pops off the page a lot more than, say, Superman amped version x vs Thor amped version y, which is all too much repeated these days.

Interestingly the IRL battle community has grown surprisingly active in recent weeks, with a lot of new users getting involved in debating from animals, famous people, boxers, groups, just about anything really. Even though these are technically against CV rules, I still think stuff like the above does have a place in the battle forums, even if it's certainly unconventional as this thread proves immensely.

Ok I'm obviously cheating somewhat here, but this is in the Battle Forums so......am I really? That's for you to decide. Anyway, this is a very rare comic thread that isn't about the big mainline characters, instead being a complex debunking of a obscure cosmological character, so inevitably I was the target audience for such a thing lol. Given I had discussed the idea with the user beforehand, it is interesting seeing this in action at last. It's certainly controversial but if you want to get a unique perspective on the guy, this is definitely rather helpful and informative.

This is a debate that needs no introduction. This is a battle between four of the most popular characters on ComicVine. This sees one of the biggest Naruto debaters @thenamelessone representing the Hero of the Hidden Leaf Naruto Uzumaki taking on one of the biggest One Piece debaters and new gen debaters in general @pics representing The Infamous Monkey D. Luffy. It isn't just them. They also have to worry about @wk_decaff who is one of the most prevalent Black Clover debaters on ComicVine and he is representing the series' main character Asta. Finally, we have a Bleach debater you might not have heard about but I assure you he knows his stuff @bruhmomento and he is representing Ichigo Kurosaki. Now that the first post is up, I can tell you this epic debate is not something you want to miss!

Next up we have a debate between two very well-known debaters. In one corner we have @thewatcherking representing the Prince of all Saiyans Vegeta taking on @higherpower representing the Alpha and Omega Jin Mori. Two very well-known characters, two very well-experienced debaters. I think you can expect some good things.

Finally, we have a very interesting debate with characters you might not know that much about. @cosmicemperor representing the monster that is Midora, taking on @estrelladeleon representing The Jade Emperor Okhwang. This is a very interesting debate. It has everything you would want. It is a mix of high-powered, very haxed, and extremely intelligent fighters.

Created by @professorrespect

It wouldn't be a respect thread section without the top Respect thread creator on Comicvine. The character in question is actually a very well-known character in Marvel...the Shadow King. He is actually an insanely powerful telepath. The professor has created a very well-detailed post for the King. Feel free to check it out.

Created by @wk_decaff

Here we have a thread from somebody that you might not have heard from. This thread explores an interesting meta for the Anime Series Black Clover. It is a simple and easy-to-understand read. I think if you have an interest in the series, you should check out this thought-provoking topic.

Created by @laufnyr

This is the type of blog that you would want to check out if you want to start debating Magi. It is a very informative read, not just on the character but the series itself. I don't think many people have checked out Magi, so I do suggest you check it out.

We’re going to run you through two blast from the past battles today, both from the pages of Fantastic Four. They face badass opponents each time, but at very different scales.

First, the FF vs Blastaar, the “Living Bomb-Burst” in issue 6 of the Fraction volume. Blastaar can be a major asskicker or kind of a paper tiger, depending on how he’s written. Here, he’s in full asskicker mode.

The FF is on a time travel trip to the past and accidentally picks up Blastaar along the way. He decides it’s time to slay and starts beating on all of them. Blastaar’s blasts are no joke and he heats up the Thing enough to make the cracks between his rocks glow. Blastaar takes a solid hit from the Thing but he’s a real brick himself and just blasts Thing back outside of the ship.

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Blastaar next trains his blasts on Sue, but her forcefield holds. Mr. Fantastic decides to try to get into the action but Blastaar starts tearing even his malleable body apart. It’s not easy to cause Reed pain from physical attacks, but Blastaar is a force of nature.

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Johnny moves in and subjects Blastaar to some of his hottest flames, with both of them contained within one of Sue’s shields. Blastaar just ignores it and returns the favor, taking the Torch down. The FF are forced into an embarrassing retreat under Sue’s shields as the HERBIEs of all things try to delay the Negative Zone warrior.

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Finally, the Fantastic Four are forced to let Franklin use his power to teleport the ship away in time, leaving Blastaar to die at the moment of the Big Bang.

I mean, when you've got the ultimate back-up, you're never really down for the count, I guess.

In our second battle, in issue 556/7, one of Reed’s friends was working on an alternate world for humanity to live in after Earth became uninhabitable. She created a robot, CAP, to police that world. However, predictably, CAP goes nuts and starts trying to destroy the most dangerous weapons in the normal world so as to make the world "safe." A team of 40 Avengers, their “biggest hitters,” attacks CAP and he takes them all out in minutes, off panel. The FF show up and we see that this Avengers team included Sentry, Carol Danvers, Hercules, Stature, Storm, Wolverine, Iron Fist, Spider-Man, Giant-Man, Vision, Doc Samson, Iron Man, Black Panther, Spider-Woman, Wasp, War Machine, Gravity, Doctor Strange, and Cannonball. And they’re all knocked out.

I want to repeat, a team that includes Sentry, Danvers, Strange, Gravity, and Storm was completely toasted. The FF jump right in but it makes short work of Thing and Torch.

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CAP breaks through A DOZEN of Sue’s forcefields that are nested inside one another like they’re tissue paper. Now Sue’s shields can vary in power depending on the story but that’s ridiculous.

The Avengers get back in the game but it doesn’t help; CAP shrugs them off and leaves in order to destroy more nukes.

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Reed now gets in the act and pulls out his anti-Galactus giant exosuit that causes a billion dollars to run for a second.

The Avengers want to help but Reed says they’ll basically just be a distraction; his machine is “far more” powerful than all the nukes that CAP has been destroying.

Gallery

Reed attacks the robot who wants to attack back, but is held back by a core command to never hurt Richards. This allows the anti-Galactus suit to go to town. It absolutely wrecks CAP, in part because it can’t fight back, but also through its own main strength.

Reed’s invention, in other words, easily outpowers the offensive capability of Sentry, Danvers, Gravity, Storm, and Strange and does so in moments. Just because the FF has Franklin in their back pocket doesn't mean they need to use him :)

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With the 6th season of Cobra Kai and the new television adaptation of The Last of Us, there has been a little bit of forum activity with these shows, and as a fan of the Last of Us game franchise I am very happy to see it whenever a character is used there. This thread features two of the most important figures from the original of both series, and I am here for it! I hope to see more content for both series in the future.

The 6th season of the Karate Kid-universeTV show has plenty of in-verse match-ups that get discussed around the Battles forums, but that doesn't mean that the original movies are left out, either. This thread pits Johnny, an older character from Cobra Kai, in his younger years from the movies against a youngster from the show, Miguel. Fans should be excited for this exposure and take the opportunity while they have it.

Back to the usual Battles forums shenanigans, this is a typical anime battle thread between three powerhouses in Naruto and Sasuke against one of the many forms of Saitama's greatest enemy, Garou. The Naruto vs One Punch Man rivalry has been a longstanding one in the community and this is one of the better threads I've seen within it, so if you like anime threads, check it out!

The God of War threads on this site have been among the most interesting ones the past year or so, and it always is at its best when the fights take place in-verse, in my opinion. This classic battle of thundering gods fighting is finally given the Kratos twist as two of his greatest enemies from the old and new games are pit against each other. If you're a fan of God of War, this is definitely an interesting one!

Given I've got a tourney of my own ongoing at the moment, it would be pretty obvious that they would include on here given I consider the matchups to be of particularly high quality. I mean that as well, I consider a good majority of the people involved in this to be pretty solid debaters and easily some of the most robust when it comes to CaV-formatted debates. Give them a watch if you want to see some enjoyable content.

Transformer content has of recent has had a small insurgence in popularity from the last couple of months, so much so that now we get frequent threads like this popping up. I'm not particularly a expert in that kind of stuff but I definitely enjoyed checking this out just to get more of a idea about how good the characters are, or at least a idea anyway. CV generally needs a shot in the arm once in a while and this definitely counts as such.

Created by @thenamelessone. This is one of many God of war blogs that he has made. While this isn't technically a respect thread, I do think it should be given some praise. It is a long post but it does cover a lot of information. It is very informative and I believe could definitely change your opinion if you give it a chance.

Created by @death4bunnies.With the release of Black Panther 2, this is a great way of informing people of how impressive Namor actually is. Simple to go through and easy to understand, this has all you need to get a great understanding. One thing I want to point out is how the thread is full of people helping create this great respect thread. Props to all of you.

Created by @cosmicemperor. For the Anime fans on the site, we have this short and concise Akainu blog. Cosmic is one of the fastest-rising One Piece debaters on the site. He is best known for his short and concise style. This is a very informative blog that will help you keep up with the current One Piece metas. I promise it is worth your time.

Echo, who recently starred in D+'s Hawkeye and will have her own show about a year from now (if it's not postponed any further), first appeared early in the 1998 volume of Daredevil. A Cheyenne, she grew up deaf, but because this is comics, she luckily had "photographic reflexes" and was able to instantly copy any movement she saw, similar to Taskmaster or Finesse. This led her to become an expert at every physical task, and she became a well-known concert piano player and dancer as well as a multi-gold medal winner at the Special Olympics and an excellent boxer. Echo's dad worked for the Kingpin but eventually Fisk killed him and took care of Echo, cultivating her as a tool he could eventually use.

Echo (whose real name is Maya Lopez) meets up with Matt Murdock and they have a romantic afternoon together.

However, Fisk manages to convince Echo that Daredevil killed her father, and so a hero-on-hero battle soon ensues, once they meet in their costumed identities. Echo prepped for the fight by watching Daredevil and Bullseye fighting, thereby gaining both of their moves, and then upped the ante by watching a bunch of kung fu movies, like those of Bruce Lee, Jet Li, and Jackie Chan.

Echo ambushes Daredevil and he is hard-pressed to fight against her, given that she fights just like him and Bullseye combined. He recognizes her as Maya, so he holds back a bit while she goes in for the kill. Regardless, she beats him squarely, and is about to shoot him in the face when they're interrupted by some local kids. Echo is sensitive to the trauma that murder can create in a child and runs off.

She tries again later, first shooting Black Widow by mistake, but Daredevil maneuvers the fight into a pitch-black warehouse. Echo is now unable to see or hear, while Daredevil can track her movements perfectly with his other senses. He makes short work of her and gets away.

Echo, who studied Sun Tzu and Miyamoto Musashi's philosophies of war as well as the physical aspects of martial arts, realizes that she can learn from this loss. She creates a scene of such noise and smell that when Daredevil comes to get her, his senses are overwhelmed and he can't track her location. She takes the initiative and fights him agressively once more. However, when they get close, Echo realizes that Daredevil has the same recent facial injury that Matt does, and believes him when he says he didn't kill her father. [This third fight was interleaved with a story about the Kingpin as a kid; I tried to cut those parts out as best I could to avoid confusion but the panels are pretty mixed together.]

While the second two fights certainly had context, the first one was pretty straight, although Daredevil was trying to avoid hurting her too badly. Still, he certainly would have preferred hurting her to getting shot in the face, so it's not like he let her win. Echo later took on the identity of Ronin and sliced and diced ninjas for the New Avengers for a little while. Then she teamed up with Moon Knight and was killed in a fight with Count Nefaria. She later inexplicably showed up alive with nary an explanation of how (unless they've said pretty recently) and eventually took on the power of the Phoenix as an Avenger alongside other major heavy hitters like King Thor and Star Brand.

Echo ought to be Taskmaster level in skill, although not as strong (she mentions the limits of "her frame" a couple times, but on the other hand she breaks a brick structure when she kicks Matt into it), since she's been around plenty of Marvel's best fighters at this point. However, Marvel hasn't really tested her against the rest of the upper levels of the street tier, and since Taskmaster himself runs from a top-tier fighter to a kind of lame jobber, that doesn't tell us a lot about where Maya's ceiling is. Hopefully, after she presumably eventually loses the Phoenix, Marvel keeps giving her appearances and lets her show off her streetlevel stuff like she did at the start.

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