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#201 Posted by dark-sith123 (5033 posts) - - Show Bio

Okay, I won't bother. It's telling how deep the bias is when you have to use Legends to prove your point in a Canon only thread.

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#202 Posted by Wolfrazer (16286 posts) - - Show Bio

These are Legends, not Disney Canon, which is being used.

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#203 Posted by Thoromdil (1842 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark-sith123: @wolfrazer: cut these two out if you want to. Argument still stands as I've made plenty more statements.

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#204 Posted by fairtrade (780 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll choose the man who is one of the greatest duelists and most powerful beings in galactic history thanks.

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#205 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

Lol at the guards being able to 'distract' Dooku

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#206 Posted by dark-sith123 (5033 posts) - - Show Bio
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#207 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark-sith123: The guards last no chance - this is Joke vs Dooku. I feel like I've said this many times already.

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#208 Posted by dark-sith123 (5033 posts) - - Show Bio

@anonymousjedi:

With no proof.

The guards can absolutely hold Dooku for the three seconds it takes for "Joke" to obliterate the old man. They could hold him for longer than that, actually, but it doesn't matter.

And even if it was a 1v1, Snoke would win.

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#209 Edited by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark-sith123: Let me go back and watch that tragic scene before commenting.

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#210 Posted by King_Majestros (1929 posts) - - Show Bio

The Guards are fairly skilled, and I don't see how they're considered fodder. They held their own really well against Rey and Kylo. Dooku seemed pretty proficient in the use of the Lightsaber, but Force Powers? Nah, he's not that great. The Guards will put up a hell of a fight; Snoke has no combat prowess, and his mind games weren't that impressive... this is coming from someone who only watched the movies and not read the books or comics.

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#211 Posted by dark-sith123 (5033 posts) - - Show Bio
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#212 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark-sith123: Oh, yeah - every scene was tragic... allow me to be more specific: The 'throne room' fight scene, where Rey and kylo confront Joke

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#213 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros: The guards can challenge Rey and Kylo, but cannot challenge Dooku, who is leagues above them in terms of duelling ability

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#214 Posted by dark-sith123 (5033 posts) - - Show Bio

@anonymousjedi:

Oh, the throne room scene. Yeah, since the only tragic scene in Last Jedi happens on Crait and doesn't involve Snoke or the guards, then I was confused.

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#215 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark-sith123: Upon rewatching the scene (first time since December, when it came out), Snoke can likely ragdoll. However, the Guards are still fodder.

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#216 Posted by In-sidiousvader (2536 posts) - - Show Bio

@anonymousjedi:

Oh, the throne room scene. Yeah, since the only tragic scene in Last Jedi happens on Crait and doesn't involve Snoke or the guards, then I was confused.

Are you a TLJ Fan? I have long suspected but this is almost confirmation.

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#217 Posted by dark-sith123 (5033 posts) - - Show Bio

@in-sidiousvader:

I absolutely am, and also surprised that you didn't figure that out earlier.

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#218 Posted by Dawn_of_Ages (2527 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: That's not what the official novel says

Anakin launched himself at Dooku's back—and the Count half turned, gesturing casually while holding Obi-Wan at bay with an elegant one handed bind. Chairs leapt up from the situation table and whirled toward Anakin's head. He slashed the first one in half contemptuously, but the second caught him across the knees and the third battered his shoulder and knocked him down.

He snarled to himself and reached through the Force to pick up some chairs of his own—and the situation table itself slammed into him and drove him back to crush him against the wall.

Source: Revenge of the Sith

That "official" novel written by Stover isn't part of canon. It's Legends. The quote I posted stating Obi-Wan could've countered but was caught off-guard is from the Junior novel released in 2014 which is part of Canon.

Obi-wan was struggling and unable to break free considering Dooku was multi tasking as he held Obi-wan at bay

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/124590/3937589-a1tjd.gif

Credit to ShootingNova

Here Dooku force pushes Anakin

I don't remember a rage amp powerful enough to rag doll two beings stronger than you

How the hell is Force pushing indicative of vast superiority? Going by that logic Ahsoka is more powerful than Vader.

Snoke literally tore through Rey's defenses and was tossing her around, not merely shoving her a few feet, lmao. It's completely different.

Also Maul has rag dolled Obi-wan casually as well and he doesn't have feats to surpass Obi-wan

After Kenobi had just finished fending off both Maul and Savage at once and beating on Savage. Maul is hellbent on trying capture Kenobi. If he could just easily incapacitate him with TK with the flick of a wrist he would've done so.

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#219 Posted by In-sidiousvader (2536 posts) - - Show Bio

@in-sidiousvader:

I absolutely am, and also surprised that you didn't figure that out earlier.

I don't hate the movie but I like TPM More only because it has Sidious and Maul. But I can't get behind Kylo Ren he just is too soft to me. It is above AOTC and Below ROTS doesn't touch the originals.

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#220 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio
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#221 Posted by In-sidiousvader (2536 posts) - - Show Bio
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#222 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio
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#223 Posted by bdelloidgrain2 (1988 posts) - - Show Bio

@sirfizzwhizz By the way, I love your profile picture. The Violator is so cool!!

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#224 Posted by WhatamIseeing (1690 posts) - - Show Bio

the guards arent even a distraction its dooku vs Snoke and dooku wins

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#225 Posted by Dawn_of_Ages (2527 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah, Canon Dooku obviously wins cause reasons 👍

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#226 Posted by King_Majestros (1929 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros: The guards can challenge Rey and Kylo, but cannot challenge Dooku, who is leagues above them in terms of duelling ability

Okay, but that's your opinion, so...

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#227 Posted by King_Majestros (1929 posts) - - Show Bio
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#228 Edited by In-sidiousvader (2536 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros said:

@dark-sith123: @in-sidiousvader: Nothing wrong with being a fan of The Last Jedi (not that you're saying it). I enjoyed it, too.

It just doesn't deserve the hate it gets for anything but Luke Skywalker. Other than Jake Skywalker the movie is fun but not great.

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#229 Edited by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros said:
@anonymousjedi said:

@king_majestros: The guards can challenge Rey and Kylo, but cannot challenge Dooku, who is leagues above them in terms of duelling ability

Okay, but that's your opinion, so...

You disagree?

I mean, when you compare their feats, the difference is... pretty substantial.

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#230 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@in-sidiousvader: It's a remastered Episode V, though - just like TFA is a remastered ANH?

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#231 Posted by In-sidiousvader (2536 posts) - - Show Bio

@in-sidiousvader: It's a remastered Episode V, though - just like TFA is a remastered ANH?

Yeah your right about that. I was refferring to the hate Rose Tico and Admiral Holdo get I just don't know why people hate them. They both make dumb decisions but its Star Wars. Luke and Leia should have gone in together in order to save Han from Jabba, or just bring the lightsaber and slaughter all of their enemies, but the plot demanded them to sneak in one at a time and stupidly each get caught in order for an action scene to occur. Literally the same thing TLJ did with their stupid character moments.

But yes I agree it is just like ESB but without any limb amputations.

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#232 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio
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#233 Posted by King_Majestros (1929 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros said:
@anonymousjedi said:

@king_majestros: The guards can challenge Rey and Kylo, but cannot challenge Dooku, who is leagues above them in terms of duelling ability

Okay, but that's your opinion, so...

You disagree?

I mean, when you compare their feats, the difference is... pretty substantial.

Yes, I disagree. Thought that was obvious with my stating "I've only seen the movies," and compared the Guards to Dooku.

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#234 Edited by King_Majestros (1929 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros said:

@dark-sith123: @in-sidiousvader: Nothing wrong with being a fan of The Last Jedi (not that you're saying it). I enjoyed it, too.

It just doesn't deserve the hate it gets for anything but Luke Skywalker. Other than Jake Skywalker the movie is fun but not great.

Right? There was no reason for Luke to fade away. The writing and story was crap, but the graphics and combat was pretty decent. Who's Jake Skywalker? Luke's son? =3

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#235 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros: Oh - you disagree with the part regarding the guards. I mistakingly assumed you disagreed that the gap between Dooku and Rey + Kylo's duelling skills is big.

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#236 Posted by King_Majestros (1929 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros: Oh - you disagree with the part regarding the guards. I mistakingly assumed you disagreed that the gap between Dooku and Rey + Kylo's duelling skills is big.

Correct. I believe that Guards would wreck Dooku in a good fight.

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#237 Posted by Thoromdil (1842 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark-sith123: Im still waiting for a reply. Or did I scare you by presenting actual arguments that prove Dooku stomps this and debunked your counter? Cmon dont disappoint me like that.

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#238 Edited by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros said:

@anonymousjedi said:

@king_majestros: Oh - you disagree with the part regarding the guards. I mistakingly assumed you disagreed that the gap between Dooku and Rey + Kylo's duelling skills is big.

Correct. I believe that Guards would wreck Dooku in a good fight.

So you believe they would also 'wreck' the likes of Maul or Kenobi, whilst also defeating Mace and coming close to Anakin-tier personnel?

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#239 Edited by fairtrade (780 posts) - - Show Bio

Not seeing how the Praetorian Guard are much more skilled than the large group of Nightbrothers Dooku stomped in SOD, before one-shotting the leader.

The Count can just fry them all...

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#240 Posted by King_Majestros (1929 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_majestros said:

@anonymousjedi said:

@king_majestros: Oh - you disagree with the part regarding the guards. I mistakingly assumed you disagreed that the gap between Dooku and Rey + Kylo's duelling skills is big.

Correct. I believe that Guards would wreck Dooku in a good fight.

So you believe they would also 'wreck' the likes of Maul or Kenobi, whilst also defeating Mace and coming close to Anakin-tier personnel?

Maul, yes. Kenobi, no. Mace, yes and no. No one is on Anakin's tier.

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#241 Posted by Erkan12 (8435 posts) - - Show Bio
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#242 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@anonymousjedi said:

@king_majestros said:

@anonymousjedi said:

@king_majestros: Oh - you disagree with the part regarding the guards. I mistakingly assumed you disagreed that the gap between Dooku and Rey + Kylo's duelling skills is big.

Correct. I believe that Guards would wreck Dooku in a good fight.

So you believe they would also 'wreck' the likes of Maul or Kenobi, whilst also defeating Mace and coming close to Anakin-tier personnel?

Maul, yes. Kenobi, no. Mace, yes and no. No one is on Anakin's tier.

1. How does this work? Dooku, Kenobi and Maul are all in the same tier, lol.

2. ???

3. Sidious and Yoda are both in his tier

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#243 Posted by RGR (420 posts) - - Show Bio

@fairtrade said:

Not seeing how the Praetorian Guard are much more skilled than the large group of Nightbrothers Dooku stomped in SOD, before one-shotting the leader.

The Count can just fry them all...

Wouldn't that create an opening for Snoke? Not that it's needed either.

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#244 Posted by Dawn_of_Ages (2527 posts) - - Show Bio

@anonymousjedi said:

@king_majestros: Oh - you disagree with the part regarding the guards. I mistakingly assumed you disagreed that the gap between Dooku and Rey + Kylo's duelling skills is big.

Correct. I believe that Guards would wreck Dooku in a good fight.

What feats to they have to suggest they're skilled enough to beat Dooku, let alone wreck him? I don't see anything stopping Dooku from just doing this again:

No Caption Provided

These guys are known for enhanced durability and pain tolerance and Dooku one-shots all of them.

Not that Snoke needs the guards to win anyway.

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#245 Posted by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: This is a 'movies only' fight, I think. Regardless, the guards haven't done anything noteworthy.

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#246 Posted by Dawn_of_Ages (2527 posts) - - Show Bio

@anonymousjedi: It would be pretty unfair to the Count it's restricted to canon, let alone the movies. Legends Dooku wins though, if not maybe even stomps.

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#247 Edited by AnonymousJedi (1211 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages: Nm - there are no restrictions. Yeah, Tyranus loses canon; wins legends.

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#248 Edited by Erkan12 (8435 posts) - - Show Bio

@dawn_of_ages said:
@king_majestros said:
@anonymousjedi said:

@king_majestros: Oh - you disagree with the part regarding the guards. I mistakingly assumed you disagreed that the gap between Dooku and Rey + Kylo's duelling skills is big.

Correct. I believe that Guards would wreck Dooku in a good fight.

What feats to they have to suggest they're skilled enough to beat Dooku, let alone wreck him? I don't see anything stopping Dooku from just doing this again:

No Caption Provided

These guys are known for enhanced durability and pain tolerance and Dooku one-shots all of them.

Not that Snoke needs the guards to win anyway.

Snoke's Praetorian guards have blaster and lightsaber resistant armors. Force lightning wouldn't do anything to them.

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#249 Posted by dark-sith123 (5033 posts) - - Show Bio

No, I'm not scared about any counters in this thread. It's just telling how deep the bias is when you use Legends in a canon thread- and if something is unfair, it's having Snoke, a canon only character, face Tyranus, one of the most powerful characters in Legends. I'm also not dealing with ignorance on the level of Snoke's feat being Sith Sorcery, lmao.

As for the Nightbrother comparison, it's flawed. Sure, the Zabraks are durable, but the Praetorians are fully clad in partly lightsaber reistant armor. Not to mention that their training is superior to the Nightbrothers, so yes, they're "much more skilled". Furthermore, the leader of those Nightbrothers, Brother Viscus, later managed to last a few seconds against Dooku in single combat. Dooku saberblitzing or zapping them all to death at once is, to say the least, a bit silly, and Snoke doesn't need the guards regardless.

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#250 Posted by Dawn_of_Ages (2527 posts) - - Show Bio

@dark-sith123: @erkan12: What's the material that makes them resistant? Vader's armor was resistant to blaster fire and lightsabers but not lightning. Though obviously Sheev's lightning>>>>Dooku's but it would still likely have an effect.