Superman vs Mangog

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BlitzSikes

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Poll Superman vs Mangog (95 votes)

Superman wins any Difficulty 29%
Mangog wins any Difficulty 71%

So in my other thread, New 52 superman was the winner by a vast margin over War Thor.

So now, to go from there, can New 52/ Rebirth Supes using only feats from new 52 and up contest with the great Mangog ?

I'll make this into a poll. If Superman wins again, he'll move on to another more powerful opponent

Battle takes place in Tournament of Power Arena ( Assume yellow sun is the light being provided just like on earth)

Distance - 10 meters

Both are aiming to royally beat down the other / kill but both are in character

Superman is fighting Mangog thinking that Mangog is a threat like Doomsday

Mangog thinks Superman is a god and is going to kill him

There is no prep and no knowledge from either side.

Who wins?

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brucerogers

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@wonderwomanfan3: I dont have the faintest idea as to what you are trying to say there.

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SuperGoku17

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brucerogers

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The_Badman

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I don't know what to say after reading all that.

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Wonderwomanfan3

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@xzone that says it all..lol

but still, unlike you I am conditioned to show respect for differing opinions so I'll let it slide.

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SuperGoku17

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Mangog stomps

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Wonderwomanfan3

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@brucerogers@supergoku17 yes because it is the guys who post 1000s of times on the internet that need attention...oh wait.

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jrupert1

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Dormammu is by no means "well above" Odin. He himself has admitted to being the equal of Zeus and Odin.

He wasn't specifically talking about power, but it's also worth mentioning that when he made the comparison he was far from full power. And if we're to go by statements he made in that arc then he also said when he reaches full power that he would burn down the Celestials and replace them as the greatest being in Strange's universe. So in the same story he placed himself well beyond Odin or Zeus in power.

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miekskywalker

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@blitzsikes Since superman loses does Mangog get the next fight?

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SuperGoku17

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@brucerogers@supergoku17 yes because it is the guys who post 1000s of times on the internet that need attention...oh wait.

What does post count have to do with attention seeking?

You need to work on your roasting skills pal.

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Wonderwomanfan3

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@jrupert1 what was he talking about if not power? I also think for someone as arrogant as Dormammu, the arrogant statements are not as reliable as the ones which are humble/realistic. I think Odin and Dormammu are roughly equal. In full cry, Odin probably shades it.

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Wonderwomanfan3

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@supergoku17: I am happy I have to work on my roasting skills (I didn't try to roast at all but whatever!) rather than on having a life outside the internet!

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BlitzSikes

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@miekskywalker: maybe

Put Mangog in a fight and use the first and second thread as criteria.

Idk who to put him against though for a first opponent.

you can take over if you want

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echostarlord117

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Not going to bother with the speed argument. Its been explained and debunked far too many times.

I've never seen it debunked or explained. Where has that happened?

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Noone1996

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Mangog effortlessly stomps.

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miekskywalker

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@blitzsikes: Give superman a rematch since mangog is hard to match.

Best off keeping combatants under skyfather level

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BlitzSikes

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@miekskywalker: I'd have to figure what's above war Thor and below Mangog then.

He murdered war Thor here but lost here.

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miekskywalker

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@blitzsikes: Not to sure myself maybe one of the weaker heralds?

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jrupert1

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#70  Edited By jrupert1

@wonderwomanfan3: Generally he does that (makes comparisons) when speaking of renown, which is likely what he was talking about when mentioning "an equal of Odin and Zeus." But even if he were talking about power (which is why I chose to say him not "specifically" talking about it) he was referring to himself in the present which as I mentioned was not at full power.

He may be boastful but he's not ignorant. He was actually planning for the Celestials in that story, commenting how they would begin to take notice of his presence before he was ready so he summoned aid to buy him time to reach his peak. This wouldn't be his first time conquering a universe after all. But more importantly he wouldn't both believe he's Odin's equal and able to take on the Celestials, that would be nonsense, which is my point. And he's far less likely to say someone else's power is as great as his. So that earlier statement has no more credit than his later one. Plus his second claim was actually affirmed by Strange stating "before too long he'll be able to challenge the Celestials themselves," this a person who knows Dormammu very well (even before it was his job) and not one for empty fears or boasts.

Besides, Dormammu has higher level feats, even before yet another permanent amp after that storyline.

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SuperGoku17

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@supergoku17: I am happy I have to work on my roasting skills (I didn't try to roast at all but whatever!) rather than on having a life outside the internet!

So you think people with multiple posts have no life?

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deactivated-5b0845740eb0b

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@jrupert1 said:

@wonderwomanfan3: Generally he does that (makes comparisons) when speaking of renown, which is likely what he was talking about when mentioning "an equal of Odin and Zeus." But even if he were talking about power (which is why I chose to say him not "specifically" talking about it) he was referring to himself in the present which as I mentioned was not at full power.

He may be boastful but he's not ignorant. He was actually planning for the Celestials in that story, commenting how they would begin to take notice of his presence before he was ready so he summoned aid to buy him time to reach his peak. This wouldn't be his first time conquering a universe after all. But more importantly he wouldn't both believe he's Odin's equal and able to take on the Celestials, that would be nonsense, which is my point. And he's far less likely to say someone else's power is as great as his. So that earlier statement has no more credit than his later one. Plus his second claim was actually affirmed by Strange stating "before too long he'll be able to challenge the Celestials themselves," this a person who knows Dormammu very well (even before it was his job) and not one for empty fears or boasts.

Besides, Dormammu has higher level feats, even before yet another permanent amp after that storyline.

Yeah, I even debunked that instance along time ago as well:

Also it seem like a reasonable assumption based on the story arc, Dormammu after being born on earth himself stated his power is closer to Odin or Zues, and as his power was growing he also vowed to replace the celestials themselves as the greatest power in earth dimension, which he never did but given he had to vow something like that sort of shows Celestial are above Dormammu.

I've already answered this in my first post to you, but anyway...Said statement was made before Dormammu arrived at his full power and received at least two permanent amps. You shouldn't have a problem understanding the basic reasoning of Marvel launching new comics, which can indeed entail in characters becoming more powerful or weaker. Your pathetic example comes from Doctor Strange, Sorcerer Supreme#1 when Dormammu fused with Strange's body, but later becomes even more powerful throughout the series/volume, starting by creating a new and superior physical form for himself inDoctor Strange, Sorcerer Supreme#22 compared to when possessed Strange(Basically months and issues after himself comparing to Odin and Zeus):

No Caption Provided

This is without counting how Dormammu later created ANOTHER new body with the energies of Mordo and Umar, which made him again FAR MORE POWERFUL:

Which was confirmed by Marvel - Absolutely Everything You Need To Know to be a permanent amp:

No Caption Provided

Your analogy is basically the same as saying Grey Hulk is as powerful as World Breaker Hulk, which is quite stupid. How about comparing when Loki absorbed Odin's power during Journey into Mytery#104 to when he absorbed an inferior Dormammu's power? You know...Loki's mind couldn't even comprehend the scope of Dormammu and basically had his mind turned into that of an infant, yet had no problems or any negative effects because of Odin's powers/abilities. Or when Mephisto said that a weakened Dormammu after conquering his and Satannish's dimension would be powerful enough again to kill ALL OF HELA'S FAMILY(Which includes Odin)? Or when the Living Tribunal recognized Dormammu's ultimate importance in the cosmic/mystical balance, but Odin's death was no more than a whisper for him? Another thing...Dormammu never said that his POWERS are equal to Odin, in fact, the word power wasn't even mentioned. If we're going to twist things then Dormammu's power equals that of ALL THE GODS TOGETHER:

No Caption Provided

After all, they've written "Gods" on plural and initiated with a capital letter. Does it make sense? No, but neither does your use of Dormammu's statements regarding Odin/Zeus within the context of that comics and yet you still use it. Dormammu never replaced the Celestials because it would still take days BEFORE could fully manifest his full-power:

No Caption Provided

And he got exorcised after being weakened even more in a battle against Strange, who used the Wings of Needless Sorrow(Created to absorb mystical energy), but guess what? We were given a situation in another comic when Dormammu DID succeed in taking over the universe:

No Caption Provided

Dormammu may not have done that at first, but accomplished his feat later.

Besides, Dormammu's arrogance is being way overblown here and is a misinformation to say that's always present on the character's personality. It's easy to say "Someone as arrogant as Dormammu" without giving even one example and contextualizing the same, Dormammu has shown to back down at some opponents when wasn't powerful enough/weakened at the moment or when the enemies are indeed more powerful. Such as the Godness, Eternity and so on.

Dormammu is arrogant when facing specific people, such as his archenemy Doctor Strange...Someone Dormie has a long-time story with it and why behaves like that against him. When Dormammu made that statement, I don't see how his arrogance(Which isn't even all that to begin with) comes into play.

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deactivated-5b0845740eb0b

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@wonderwomanfan3 said:

what was he talking about if not power? I also think for someone as arrogant as Dormammu, the arrogant statements are not as reliable as the ones which are humble/realistic. I think Odin and Dormammu are roughly equal. In full cry, Odin probably shades it.

Another thing.

Please enlighten me why the statement regarding Odin is a humble/realistic one and the ones with the Celestials are arrogant(You actually got way more proof for the later with Strange and another Guidebook backing up his statement regarding the Celestials). Which basis, facts, events or words in that comic alluded such idea, friend? In fact, did you even write the comic to know such thing? For me what you're doing seems no more than nitpicking, really. I also expect way more than just a simple"Because I think as so" or "Because it should be so".

I even addressed below why could and should be more than empty words:

I know it seems no more empty words without nothing to backup at all, but there's no reason for the characters to lie in the first place and there actually some pieces of information that help to at least partially fundament those statements. One of them is the guidebook Marvel- Absolutely Everything You Need to Know and it has some quite interesting things to add here...Dormammu's Bio in there has a list of his main/primary enemies, which one of them are nonetheless than the Celestials themselves:

No Caption Provided

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jrupert1

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@andromeda101: Yeah, @wastelandman and I both have debunked it before as well. It's hard to make a quality post on my cell phone so much appreciated on the assist. ;)

And good point on the whole arrogant issue. It really is something a lot don't know, he's never needlessly confident unless he has reason to be. Although with the Goddess incident his reason for backing away was mainly due to being in a position where he couldn't do anything. After Strange blew his chance to beat her by rejecting his essence.

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Stellaris

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@wonderwomanfan3: CaV me. Superman vs Mangog, or Superman vs Odin, or really any skyfather tier character. If you really believe this that is.

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dami24434

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mangog have fun eating superman bones

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higherpower

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#77 higherpower  Moderator

Honestly surprised this isn't locked yet.

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KanyeCosby

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I learned something new today. Apparently, Rebirth Superman is on the level of a guy that can casually bust galaxies and affect reality on a universal scale.

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Laiks Stake

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#79 Laiks Stake  Online

Mangog eats him.

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blackpantherisb

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The_living_tribunal_24

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@undefined: current mangog is a b****. Hv kills him.

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The_living_tribunal_24

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@blitzsikes: that's current odin that uses mini guns. He gets injured by rocks.

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TifaLockhart

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Even with the low end sun showing, Mangog has feats that lead me to believe he takes this.

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deactivated-5c8fd6cb3e4f4

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Oh My God, Rebirth Superman is Odin tier because of speed.

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deactivated-5b2121a0a9a00

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This is actually more hilarious than the time TOWK argued that Superman can beat Dr Strange and Wonder Woman can beat Green Scar.

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BlitzSikes

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BlitzSikes

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@all-father: noob question considering I know little about comic strange.

Aside from the obvious bfr, how does strange beat Superman? I swear this is legit me not knowing anything about strange. I tried reading his comics but they weren't that good to me so I stopped at like the second issue I had.

Does strange beat superman because of Superman's weakness to magic or can strange just obliterate superman easy?

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deactivated-5b2121a0a9a00

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@blitzsikes:

Doctor Strange is well above Superman's level. Strange is used to fighting beings far more powerful than Superman (Dormammu, Umar, Nightmare, In-Betweener, Galactus etc.). His almighty Speed Blitz won't work due to Stranges auto shields. There are numerous ways. Turning his insides into ice, BFRing him to another dimension etc. Strange has a counter to everything Superman has.

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BlitzSikes

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@all-father: I see. Turning insides to ice sounds like it could heat a lot of people.

What's the limit to that?

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brucerogers

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ProteusXManRxis

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Mangog stomps hard.

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santiagomormon

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So Mangog who dies in the sun can beat Superman who can live in the sun no problem?

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phillip33

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The_living_tribunal_24

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deactivated-5b0845740eb0b

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@blitzsikes said:

I see. Turning insides to ice sounds like it could heat a lot of people.

What's the limit to that?

It worked on Dormammu.

Someone whose magical resistance has been to shown to have him be unaffected by mystical blasts of other Sorcerer Supremes and a word-shattering anti-magic bullet that took down every mystical on Marvel Earth.

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ThEBeStOfTheBeST

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Superman is nigh-Omnipotent, he blitz.

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SmoothSanta

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New 52 Supes is just a tier below Elder God tier in Marvel terms. He takes this for me.

Wtf!?

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Chimeroid

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@xzone said:

@wonderwomanfan3: SA Superman vs Odin thread is still up, as it should be. Regular Superman vs Odin is a ridiculous match up and you know that

Odin has been nerfed to shit in Aaron's run. So, when you look at it with context, Mangog is nowhere near as impressive as people are trying to show him to be. Jane Thor came and beat him rather quickly actually. Not to mention that he is super easy to BFR, and Superman does consistently consider throwing his enemies into the sun.

Superman takes this mid diff.

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brucerogers

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@chimeroid: That has less to do with nerfing and more about Aaron admittedly not giving a hoot about power levels. I dont think its really fair to judge Mangog based on that alone, any more than it is to judge Supes based on his feat against that steamroller or Batman's whistle.

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BlitzSikes

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@andromeda101: does that equate to Thor having his inside turned to glass by Malekith?

Thor kept going after and spit out the glass but I still it on that leve or higher?