Superman vs Hulk (Hand to Hand)

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#1 Edited by TheHercules (1363 posts) - - Show Bio
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  • In Character
  • Morals Off
  • Only Strength, Speed, Durability, Healing and Stamina!
  • Knockout/Death/Incap count as Win
  • No BFR
  • Speed and Healing Equalized
  • Post Crisis/New 52/Rebirth
  • All Incarnations below World Breaker (basically Pre and Post Core Breach)
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#2 Posted by baph (2952 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk wins.

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#3 Posted by TheHercules (1363 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump!

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#4 Posted by TheHercules (1363 posts) - - Show Bio

@baph: Reasons? Both are nerfed, but you already read it, I asume.

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#5 Edited by termiteone4ever (13142 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman all day .

There is no way HULK can win. Based on these condition. For those of you who doesnt understand speed. I will rub this in. Any character that has the ability to do more damage faster than your body or mind can comprehend or heal will be too much. In simple terms If some one dishes more damage faster than you can heal. You stand no chance.

Doesnt matter what version add World breaker times 2 its the same results

Superman STOMPS

Based on the OP superman in character has done many things what considered no Morals. Including ripping characters in half . I dont see the Hulk having any counter for that.

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#6 Posted by TheHercules (1363 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman all day .

There is no way HULK can win. Based on these condition. For those of you who doesnt understand speed. I will rub this in. Any character that has the ability to do more damage faster than your body or mind can comprehend or heal will be too much. In simple terms If some one dishes more damage faster than you can heal. You stand no chance.

Doesnt matter what version add World breaker times 2 its the same results

Superman STOMPS

Speed and Healing are Equalized

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#7 Posted by RandyButterNubs (1152 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman

Online
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#8 Edited by King-Ragnar (5166 posts) - - Show Bio

That's some great reasoning there. Anyway, Hulk wins due to better durability. The scenario favors him more than it favors Clark.

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#9 Posted by baph (2952 posts) - - Show Bio
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#10 Edited by termiteone4ever (13142 posts) - - Show Bio

@thehercules said:
@termiteone4ever said:

Superman all day .

There is no way HULK can win. Based on these condition. For those of you who doesnt understand speed. I will rub this in. Any character that has the ability to do more damage faster than your body or mind can comprehend or heal will be too much. In simple terms If some one dishes more damage faster than you can heal. You stand no chance.

Doesnt matter what version add World breaker times 2 its the same results

Superman STOMPS

Speed and Healing are Equalized

So let me see . The better fighter is superman. The more experience with speed is superman. The faster thinker and ability to analyze the entire scenario under second i am going with the guy with experience. Plus stronger and more durable. The Hulk will still be torn apart. Due inexperience and no skills.

Healing been equalized in a speed fight doesnt work for the Hulk. Moving at speeds beyond Hulk healing and perception is not even fair. Accuracy skills and other senses enhanced to operate at this level effectively the hulk doesnt have. Now you will have to enhance the hulk.

I forgot to add superman durability is beyond the hulk on all levels. Hulk durability sucks his healing saves him most of the time.

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#11 Posted by TheHercules (1363 posts) - - Show Bio

That's some great reasoning there. Anyway, Hulk wins due to better durability. The scenario favors him more than it favors Clark.

Even Clark being more Skilled, which would make a major importance here, I maybe could see Hulk winning it.

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#12 Posted by Bossmonster (3150 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman is the better trained fighter here in regard to martial arts.

He should win under these conditions

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#14 Posted by King-Ragnar (5166 posts) - - Show Bio

@thehercules: High tiers/low Heralds seldom use their skill in fights against other high tiers.

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#15 Edited by ITouchedTheBoat (3761 posts) - - Show Bio

@thehercules said:
@termiteone4ever said:

Superman all day .

There is no way HULK can win. Based on these condition. For those of you who doesnt understand speed. I will rub this in. Any character that has the ability to do more damage faster than your body or mind can comprehend or heal will be too much. In simple terms If some one dishes more damage faster than you can heal. You stand no chance.

Doesnt matter what version add World breaker times 2 its the same results

Superman STOMPS

Speed and Healing are Equalized

I had this discussion a long time ago with another user, I think taking away Hulk's healing is a lot more of a step back than taking away Superman's speed.

Superman has fought people with his level of speed before and still come out on top, but last time he fought somebody with his speed and a healing factor up to par (or slightly less than Hulk's)...he died or had to BFR his opponent.

So yeah, Superman wins. He's got skills, and with these particular versions he's got superior stats aside from durability.

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#16 Posted by TakenStew22 (5874 posts) - - Show Bio

Damn, this could really go either way tbh.

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#17 Posted by Battle123axe (9680 posts) - - Show Bio

@itouchedtheboat: I really don't think he has the superior strength stat, striking is arguable but not really when you consider that hulk's strength increases multiple times very quickly (punch to punch in fact), putting him down fast is absolutely necessary, a option superman really doesn't have. Hulk is literally built for this kind of battle, and superman is intelligent, sure, maybe enough to ensure the win, but hulk's as ruthless as superman is skilled, and he's also intelligent enough to counter superman. The fight gets worse for supes with every blow thrown.

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#18 Posted by Supermanthor (22700 posts) - - Show Bio

Could go either way

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#19 Posted by termiteone4ever (13142 posts) - - Show Bio

@thehercules said:
@termiteone4ever said:

Superman all day .

There is no way HULK can win. Based on these condition. For those of you who doesnt understand speed. I will rub this in. Any character that has the ability to do more damage faster than your body or mind can comprehend or heal will be too much. In simple terms If some one dishes more damage faster than you can heal. You stand no chance.

Doesnt matter what version add World breaker times 2 its the same results

Superman STOMPS

Speed and Healing are Equalized

I had this discussion a long time ago with another user, I think taking away Hulk's healing is a lot more of a step back than taking away Superman's speed.

Superman has fought people with his level of speed before and still come out on top, but last time he fought somebody with his speed and a healing factor up to par (or slightly less than Hulk's)...he died or had to BFR his opponent.

So yeah, Superman wins. He's got skills, and with these particular versions he's got superior stats aside from durability.

Heavier Hulk fans doesnt like to hear that . I think in recent Hulk comics proves this. IM Hulk been melted / WW Hulk the same he can easily be damaged skin been ripped apart. Way too easily. I dont see what he will do if superman removes a limbs or dices him with heat vision on a molecular level or even atomic . I dont think these Hulk fans know who is superman as a character.

Doomsday i assume you are referring too. Doomsday speed was on Par with superman for sure. Along with his claws that did superman a lot of damage. Doomsday healing out of this world as well because he does heals faster. Not in all cases. I see you point but doomsday is an adaptive creature from the start even Dos doomsday. General Eling and few others to list Masscre lobo and those guys speed are way above any Hulk.

As far as durability i dont see the hulk been more durable when he can be easily cut ripped and penetrated. I could easily make case for superman. When it comes to durability. Save that for another day.

These conditions are more benefiting to the Hulk because he is the one who is lacking in speed and power. Even with this benefit he still loses. Even going WB levels which just energy short burst explosion which has no effect on kryptonians because its gamma energy. Gamma energy does not hurt Kryptonians. You can check out legions of Super heroes for that and supergirl.

Isnt this the same Hulk that fought the Sentry . Yeah he loses after he uses up all his energy he changes back to Human and loses again. ( i may hear excuses like sentry power calms him down )

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#20 Posted by Battle123axe (9680 posts) - - Show Bio

"gamma energy does not hurt kryptonians"

"sentry's power having proven to calm him down in literally the same event is an excuse"

"hulk getting melted by acid specifically designed to counteract him means superman can do it with heat vision"

>slugfest with onlyspecific powers

>mentions heat vision

never change termy, never change

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#21 Edited by termiteone4ever (13142 posts) - - Show Bio

IF you got something to say Quote me :) and we can talk like men.

B- Axey :)

Why are you jumping to conclusion. When did i state Heat vision can mimic the acid ? I said use it on a molecular level as in dice Hulk up like a tomato

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#22 Posted by Battle123axe (9680 posts) - - Show Bio

IF you got something to say Quote me :) and we can talk like men.

B- Axey :)

Why are you jumping to conclusion. When did i state Heat vision can mimic the acid ? I said use it on a molecular level as in dice Hulk up like a tomato

Wow. good thing he's not allowed to use it in this battle then. I would hate to get into how that wouldn't work, as it'd be falling on deaf ears.

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#23 Posted by ITouchedTheBoat (3761 posts) - - Show Bio

@itouchedtheboat: I really don't think he has the superior strength stat, striking is arguable but not really when you consider that hulk's strength increases multiple times very quickly (punch to punch in fact), putting him down fast is absolutely necessary, a option superman really doesn't have. Hulk is literally built for this kind of battle, and superman is intelligent, sure, maybe enough to ensure the win, but hulk's as ruthless as superman is skilled, and he's also intelligent enough to counter superman. The fight gets worse for supes with every blow thrown.

I would completely agree with everything you just said except, when you say Hulk's strength increases very quickly; you're not wrong, but you're nat taking into account all the times he was given the opportunity to carry on in a fight (while his strength was increasing) only because his healing factor helped him. The idea behind Hulk is that he gets stronger as he gets angrier, but with Superman being morals off there's no way Hulk would be able to get as angry as he would need to be to put Superman down.

You can look at Superman's fight against DD in Rebirth, ofc all the stats are different but the mind set was still the same. One can make the argument that DD is just as if not more reckless and destructive than Hulk, and Superman's secondary goal was to end the fight asap while his primary goal was to get DD out of the city. It was even stated that DD was adapting to each hit instantly, yet Superman still put up a proper fight. Morals Off Superman takes away the primary goal of caring about civilians and just lets Superman go for the KO, while Hulk wouldn't be able to adapt and become stronger.

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#24 Edited by termiteone4ever (13142 posts) - - Show Bio

@battle123axe said:
@termiteone4ever said:

IF you got something to say Quote me :) and we can talk like men.

B- Axey :)

Why are you jumping to conclusion. When did i state Heat vision can mimic the acid ? I said use it on a molecular level as in dice Hulk up like a tomato

Wow. good thing he's not allowed to use it in this battle then. I would hate to get into how that wouldn't work, as it'd be falling on deaf ears.

Finally we can talk like men.

Well i am not sure why you jump to conclusion. Now back to the main facts. There is no morals in this fight . Also in character. With all superman capabilities been used . There is nothing the Hulk can offer or replicate that superman cant reproduce two times over. If you want to live on the concept madder Hulk gets . He been known to revert back to human. Also the madder wont save him in this fight. This will be quick fight. Hulk intelect is no where on superman level. Clearly he doesnt think or plan half the level of superman. I could list at least 10 ways for superman win in an instant.

I would like to hear one sure win for the Hulk.

I wonder if you know there is sunshine in the sky and superman can still absorb sunlight.

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#25 Posted by King-Ragnar (5166 posts) - - Show Bio

Jesus....

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#27 Posted by Battle123axe (9680 posts) - - Show Bio

@battle123axe said:
@termiteone4ever said:

IF you got something to say Quote me :) and we can talk like men.

B- Axey :)

Why are you jumping to conclusion. When did i state Heat vision can mimic the acid ? I said use it on a molecular level as in dice Hulk up like a tomato

Wow. good thing he's not allowed to use it in this battle then. I would hate to get into how that wouldn't work, as it'd be falling on deaf ears.

Finally we can talk like men.

Well i am not sure why you jump to conclusion. Now back to the main facts. There is no morals in this fight . Also in character. With all superman capabilities been used . There is nothing the Hulk can offer or replicate that superman cant reproduce two times over. If you want to live on the concept madder Hulk gets . He been known to revert back to human. Also the madder wont save him in this fight. This will be quick fight. Hulk intelect is no where on superman level. Clearly he doesnt think or plan half the level of superman. I could list at least 10 ways for superman win in an instant.

I would like to hear one sure win for the Hulk.

I wonder if you know there is sunshine in the sky and superman can still absorb sunlight.

i have no intentions of debating with you because it'd never go anywhere, you'd wank superman and lowball hulk, and i have a snowball's chance in hell of convincing you of anything. Or understanding you.

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#28 Posted by skywalker95 (5915 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk

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#29 Posted by from_beyond (968 posts) - - Show Bio

Under these conditions Superman wins. He has comparable strength but has better skills as a fighter.

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#30 Posted by ByondEon (2943 posts) - - Show Bio

Supes only wins due to BFR, and that is without these conditions.

Since it is gone, Hulk absolutely thrashes Superman.

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#31 Posted by The_Surgeon_ (408 posts) - - Show Bio

Under these conditions Superman wins. He has comparable strength but has better skills as a fighter.

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#32 Posted by Ready_4_Madness (18797 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk has no business fighting Superman, he has no chance.

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#33 Posted by Consciouskeeper (2596 posts) - - Show Bio

superman

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#34 Edited by Battle123axe (9680 posts) - - Show Bio

@itouchedtheboat said:
@battle123axe said:

@itouchedtheboat: I really don't think he has the superior strength stat, striking is arguable but not really when you consider that hulk's strength increases multiple times very quickly (punch to punch in fact), putting him down fast is absolutely necessary, a option superman really doesn't have. Hulk is literally built for this kind of battle, and superman is intelligent, sure, maybe enough to ensure the win, but hulk's as ruthless as superman is skilled, and he's also intelligent enough to counter superman. The fight gets worse for supes with every blow thrown.

I would completely agree with everything you just said except, when you say Hulk's strength increases very quickly; you're not wrong, but you're nat taking into account all the times he was given the opportunity to carry on in a fight (while his strength was increasing) only because his healing factor helped him. The idea behind Hulk is that he gets stronger as he gets angrier, but with Superman being morals off there's no way Hulk would be able to get as angry as he would need to be to put Superman down.

You can look at Superman's fight against DD in Rebirth, ofc all the stats are different but the mind set was still the same. One can make the argument that DD is just as if not more reckless and destructive than Hulk, and Superman's secondary goal was to end the fight asap while his primary goal was to get DD out of the city. It was even stated that DD was adapting to each hit instantly, yet Superman still put up a proper fight. Morals Off Superman takes away the primary goal of caring about civilians and just lets Superman go for the KO, while Hulk wouldn't be able to adapt and become stronger.

Fair enough, but his attitude towards doomsday was specifcally because he was previously cognizant of doomsday's danger and ability. Of course, it would take him less time than other DC heroes to realize how to take down a doomsday like enemy like the hulk is, but in almost every (if not every) fight where he fought doomsday or what he thought was doomsday after his death, he specifically made note of the necessity of using overwhelming speed and power in the battle, even in the rebirth battle you cited. As per the rules of this battle, he doesn't have that ability, and i would give it to him in a very hard fought battle if he did. Sans flight he'd be fighting at exactly the same speedhulk is. If it's equalized to superman's speed, i'd give clark the win though, hulk doesn't know what do do with that. However this means that he'd be trading blows, and that literally never works for anybody around hulk's strength, which clark is.

You may argue that clark starts of on a higher level (which is actually false considering that there is no "base" hulk and hulk can be as strong as clark from the first punch), but it is not high enough to take him out with one or two punches, which is what he needs to do before hulk starts drastically outstripping him. Also saying he relies on his healing factor in fights, is a 'well yes but actually no' type situation,as for the majority of hulk's career his HF was a very minor ability, with it only really being relevant to Pak, Ewing, and David. Otherwise, what functioned as his "healing factor" for most of his publication was his rapidly increasing anger and tenacity and straight up strength. And whilst yes, many of his most impressive feats come with his healing factor, his feats are such that he doesn't need it in a slugfest with clark, as clark just doesn't have the potency to do enough damage that someone who stayed conscious through being skeletonized several times and all sorts of different wounds would fall.

Thor, zom-strange, Thor+hercules, hercules, a blast that had thor floored in pain, thor ordinance weaponry, continental blows, beings amped with the enegry of skyfathers and a skyfather himself, nebulon, weapon h, black bolt's scream, avengers teams, and more has been unable to hurt him to the point where he needs healing to save him, in fact he goes from shrugging them off to outright no-selling some.

I know we can go for a while about whether superman hit as hard as the above, which i actually don't doubt he can, though i'm fairly certain he can't hit harder than a good deal of them, the point remains that hulk shrugs these impacts off, sure a skilled dozens to hundreds of these impacts like a speeded up superman can do may do the trick, but blow by blow superman cannot unleash enough damage to take hulk out before the fight goes from the tussles that happen every issue to badly damaging impacts that superman can't shrug off, while the opposite happens to bruce.

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#35 Posted by CaptainMarvel11 (960 posts) - - Show Bio

Under these conditions Hulk does win. I mean you gave him WWH, Indestructible Hulk and Immortal Hulk incarnations.

The thing that a lot of people forget is that even without the healing factor, Hulk has way better damage soak than Superman, he has had his healing factor turned off in the past and he survived some horrific injury, even in the last issue of Immortal Hulk, he has all his limps melted away by acid and his heart ripped out and that's with his healing factor turned off and he is still alive and conscious and this is the level of damage Superman wouldn't even be able to afflict anyway.

So yea, Hulk wins due to better damage soak, Clark has been taken out by less than Hulk can dish out on numerous occasions, WWH/Immortal Hulk/Indestructible Hulk are way tougher.

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#36 Posted by TheHercules (1363 posts) - - Show Bio

@battle123axe If only Speed were Equalized, would you say that Hulk would win?

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#37 Posted by Battle123axe (9680 posts) - - Show Bio
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#38 Posted by 20damon (6582 posts) - - Show Bio

To what level are speed and healing equalized? If both are equalized to Hulk's level for example, chances are it'll be an endless stalemate. Need to be a bit clearer about this

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#39 Edited by Battle123axe (9680 posts) - - Show Bio

@20damon said:

To what level are speed and healing equalized? If both are equalized to Hulk's level for example, chances are it'll be an endless stalemate. Need to be a bit clearer about this

true.

if both are equalized to superman's level, Superman wins

if speed is at hulk's level and healing at superman's, Hulk wins

If speed's at superman's and healing at hulk's, probably an endless stalemate.

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#40 Posted by Buckwheat (2488 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman is equal or better than Hulk in every department, except for flight, which gives Supes a huge advantage.

Kal FTW

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#41 Posted by Supermanthor (22700 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman is equal or better than Hulk in every department, except for flight, which gives Supes a huge advantage.

Kal FTW

  • In Character
  • Morals Off
  • Only Strength, Speed, Durability, Healing and Stamina!
  • Knockout/Death/Incap count as Win
  • No BFR
  • Speed and Healing Equalized
  • Post Crisis/New 52/Rebirth
  • All Incarnations below World Breaker (basically Pre and Post Core Breach)

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#42 Posted by CaptainMarvel11 (960 posts) - - Show Bio

@buckwheat: Hulk edges him out in strength and striking(from standing position, Clark has better striking if he is bullrushing/flying), their durability is roughly the same, however Hulk has WAY better damage soak which is very important here, Clark is a more skilled fighter and Hulk has better stamina, also Clark gets weaker as the fight progresses while Hulk gets stronger, so if we are to make this a pure h2h fight with speed and healing equalized Hulk should take it, as i have no idea how Clark is suppose to put down Hulk with his damage soak.

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#43 Edited by TheHercules (1363 posts) - - Show Bio
@battle123axe said:
@20damon said:

To what level are speed and healing equalized? If both are equalized to Hulk's level for example, chances are it'll be an endless stalemate. Need to be a bit clearer about this

true.

if both are equalized to superman's level, Superman wins

if speed is at hulk's level and healing at superman's, Hulk wins

If speed's at superman's and healing at hulk's, probably an endless stalemate.

Well, I was not concerned about it, I wanted a Fair battle... and only opened questions!

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#44 Posted by Buckwheat (2488 posts) - - Show Bio
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#45 Posted by Supermanthor (22700 posts) - - Show Bio
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#46 Posted by ITouchedTheBoat (3761 posts) - - Show Bio

Fair enough, but his attitude towards doomsday was specifcally because he was previously cognizant of doomsday's danger and ability. Of course, it would take him less time than other DC heroes to realize how to take down a doomsday like enemy like the hulk is, but in almost every (if not every) fight where he fought doomsday or what he thought was doomsday after his death, he specifically made note of the necessity of using overwhelming speed and power in the battle, even in the rebirth battle you cited. As per the rules of this battle, he doesn't have that ability, and i would give it to him in a very hard fought battle if he did. Sans flight he'd be fighting at exactly the same speedhulk is. If it's equalized to superman's speed, i'd give clark the win though, hulk doesn't know what do do with that. However this means that he'd be trading blows, and that literally never works for anybody around hulk's strength, which clark is.

That's actually a good point! I didn't realize Flight was taken out. My whole argument is pretty much taken out now. I can't possibly side with Supes under these circumstances tbh

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#47 Posted by Battle123axe (9680 posts) - - Show Bio

@battle123axe said:

Fair enough, but his attitude towards doomsday was specifcally because he was previously cognizant of doomsday's danger and ability. Of course, it would take him less time than other DC heroes to realize how to take down a doomsday like enemy like the hulk is, but in almost every (if not every) fight where he fought doomsday or what he thought was doomsday after his death, he specifically made note of the necessity of using overwhelming speed and power in the battle, even in the rebirth battle you cited. As per the rules of this battle, he doesn't have that ability, and i would give it to him in a very hard fought battle if he did. Sans flight he'd be fighting at exactly the same speedhulk is. If it's equalized to superman's speed, i'd give clark the win though, hulk doesn't know what do do with that. However this means that he'd be trading blows, and that literally never works for anybody around hulk's strength, which clark is.

That's actually a good point! I didn't realize Flight was taken out. My whole argument is pretty much taken out now. I can't possibly side with Supes under these circumstances tbh

hey, no prob man.

Good debate! Those are rare nowadays.

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#48 Posted by Buckwheat (2488 posts) - - Show Bio

@captainmarvel11: Superman outmuscles base Hulk in more ways than you give him credit for.

Granted Hulk can grow exponentially in power but he will get knocked out before reaching WWH and without his HF won't come back to the fight in time for it not to count as a win for Clark.

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#49 Posted by Buckwheat (2488 posts) - - Show Bio