Superman vs Gladiator

PhoenixSouvenir says:

""Much, if not all of Gladiator's abilities are entirely dependent on his level of self-confidence. The more confident he is in being able to complete the task at hand, the more powerful he becomes. Consequently, if Gladiator ever has the slightest hint of doubt that he is unable to accomplish something, then his powers quickly weaken." - Marvel.com

"

Is there a lot of comic (or handbook) support is there for this or are we just going by Nimravus?

@Phoenix Souvenir: Gladiator does indeed have super visions he can see across galaxies and has hurricane strength breath which can freeze, his eye beams unleash terrible radiations [who knows could even be the same wavelenght as Kryptonite] that burn hotter than suns, so they do have the same[ish] powers. Why would someone not going down in a fight make you lose confidence? When he fought Supreme he didnt get disheartened at all, and Supreme was doing what you basically described. So what if Superman keeps coming, he could still be getting hurt just like the Thing when he fought the Champion. Anyway you assume Superman can come back after getting his face pounded in by a guy who moves faster than him and can become stronger than him. Remember the guy is a soldier i doubt he would actually duke it out with the dude. He is gonna do something very military like, say breaking Supermans neck.

As to the confidence thing. I do believe his powers increase with his confidence. Many bio's say this for one and in comics people state that if he puts his mind to something he can more or less do it. Before he 'fought' Cassandra Nova he did say his confidence based Super powers would be enough, meaning his confidence would give him the ability to take whatever is thrown at him and dish out his own damage. Furthermore consider the Vulcan fight, he made himself untouchable with his belief in it, basically added a new application of his power to himself by believing it so. It does seem that if his confidence increases his powers do to.

Logic Mark III says:

"Why would someone not going down in a fight make you lose confidence? When he fought Supreme he didnt get disheartened at all, and Supreme was doing what you basically described. So what if Superman keeps coming, he could still be getting hurt just like the Thing when he fought the Champion. Anyway you assume Superman can come back after getting his face pounded in by a guy who moves faster than him and can become stronger than him. Remember the guy is a soldier i doubt he would actually duke it out with the dude. He is gonna do something very military like, say breaking Supermans neck.

Trust me. It can happen. Reed Richards tested this himself, with Captain America rendered invisible by Sue. Gladiator came at Reed full-force, but Captain America was blocking his shots with his shield while he was invisible (if Gladiator could do anything he put his mind to, he would have broken the shield, but he could even do that) to make him think that Reed was invincible. Then, Gladiator began to doubt himself, causing his powers to weaken, and leaving Sue to knock his @$$ out.

Like I said earlier, there are ways for Superman to make Gladiator lose confidence. I already stated one way earlier. Also, I seriously doubt that Superman would allow Gladiator to break his neck... Superman isn't that much of a pushover.

Logic Mark III says:

As to the confidence thing. I do believe his powers increase with his confidence. Many bio's say this for one and in comics people state that if he puts his mind to something he can more or less do it. Before he 'fought' Cassandra Nova he did say his confidence based Super powers would be enough, meaning his confidence would give him the ability to take whatever is thrown at him and dish out his own damage. Furthermore consider the Vulcan fight, he made himself untouchable with his belief in it, basically added a new application of his power to himself by believing it so. It does seem that if his confidence increases his powers do to. "

Can you provide evidence to prove that his powers increase due to his confidence instead of saying that many of his unofficial bios say it?
Post Edited:2008-05-19 10:51:21

Okay 1. Its a comic and has all the writer fluff crap that allows Gladiator to lose in that situation. 2. He didnt know he was punching an Adamantium/vibranium shield. 3. Cap would have died and been bowled over into the next Universe by that punch there is no way enough Vibranium in that shield to stop the kind of city levelling punches he was throwing or the excess heat that burnt hotter than stars. 4. Superman isnt Reed Richards.5 Who said anything about Superman letting him break his neck? The guy is faster than him he can just do it, he broke Hyperions back nicely.

Logic Mark III says:

"Okay 1. Its a comic and has all the writer fluff crap that allows Gladiator to lose in that situation. 2. He didnt know he was punching an Adamantium/vibranium shield. 3. Cap would have died and been bowled over into the next Universe by that punch there is no way enough Vibranium in that shield to stop the kind of city levelling punches he was throwing or the excess heat that burnt hotter than stars. 4. Superman isnt Reed Richards.5 Who said anything about Superman letting him break his neck? The guy is faster than him he can just do it, he broke Hyperions back nicely. "

1) The writers made to where Gladiator's weakness could be exploited effectively. No worries here.

2) It doesn't matter. If he could put his mind to anything, the shield would have been shattered, and then the plan to test his weakness would have failed.

3) Read #2.

4) Superman is not an idiot.

5) You say that Gladiator could do that, and I say Superman wouldn't allow it to happen. And, Hyperion isn't Superman.

Superman would take down Gladiator. You can't defeat Superman.

mantoid says:

"Superman would take down Gladiator. You can't defeat Superman."

Smiles

That's why I like you so much...

So the fact that he is faster than Superman means nothing? means that he cant outmanouver him? yeah that makes sense! The whole shield thing is stupid, the writer was smoking crack. Anyone with brains can see that the forces being applied would have killed Cap...the whole plan falls apart, it doesnt matter if he cant break the actuall shield: fact of the matter is Cap is not made of the same thing as the shield he will feel the effects and go flying back and die. If Silver Surfer can fly through several foot thick vibranium walls then i see no reaosn why Gladiators city levelling punches wouldnt send Cap into the next solar system. I didnt say Superman is an idoit but do you really think he is going to discern the psionic nature of Gladiators powers like Reed did?

Logic Mark III says:

"So the fact that he is faster than Superman means nothing? means that he cant outmanouver him? yeah that makes sense! The whole shield thing is stupid, the writer was smoking crack. Anyone with brains can see that the forces being applied would have killed Cap...the whole plan falls apart, it doesnt matter if he cant break the actuall shield: fact of the matter is Cap is not made of the same thing as the shield he will feel the effects and go flying back and die. If Silver Surfer can fly through several foot thick vibranium walls then i see no reaosn why Gladiators city levelling punches wouldnt send Cap into the next solar system. I didnt say Superman is an idoit but do you really think he is going to discern the psionic nature of Gladiators powers like Reed did?"

That's not a fact. That's what you want to believe. You still haven't provided evidence of Gladiator's strength increasing due to his confidence. I'm only lead to believe that it decreases when he doubts himself. Other than that, it's at a normal state. And, it's not stupid. You just said that Gladiator can do what ever he puts his mind to. But, he couldn't get past that shield. Says a lot about his strength. Silver Surfer flying through vibranium walls is different. He's more powerful than Gladiator, is he not? And, I explained how Superman could effectively lower his confidence a few pages back. Go back and read them. I'm not gonna repeat it...
Post Edited:2008-05-19 11:55:01

I did read them and it makes no sense. Look at the scans you have shown REALLY look at them. It doesnt make sense at all. Take the example of a bullet proof vest. You can get shot and not be hit by the bullet, but you can be bowled over from the force thats just hit you, and feal pain and suffer bruises on your skin even though the bullet didint get through the vest. Its the same thing here, it doesnt matter if the shield gets broken or not, fact is Cap would not have been able to stand there and take that punishment. When the first hit landed Cap should have went flying to Alaska, shield intact but Cap battered and broken then landing as a puddle of sploodge. IN FACT IN THAT SAME COMIC THE SKRULL THAT IS IMPERSONATING COLOSSUS MANAGES TO SEND CAPTAIN AMERICA FLYING BACK INTO A WALL, WHEN HE HIT HIS SHIELD, PAGE 17.I used Silver Surfer flying through Vibranium walls to display the fact that Vibanium has limits to the amount of force it can repel, and Gladiator only in terms of base feats [Surfer would ruin him as he knows the wavelength of radiation he is vulnerable to] such as speed, sight, and strength they are probably quite even. Gladiator is faster than Superman, he doesnt need to think he is for this to happen, he just is. As for the confidence it has been stated by himself, other characters, bios, and it can be SEEN in some comics, i.e the fight with Vulcan how he made himslef untouchable.

Logic Mark III says:

"I did read them and it makes no sense. Look at the scans you have shown REALLY look at them. It doesnt make sense at all."

Yes, they do... The shield absorbs kinetic force, which is why Cap isn't getting knocked back. But, note that Vibranium has a limit to the force it can absorb. It can be overloaded. You can't use a bulletproof vest to prove your point, because they don't sap kinetic force like his shield does. In any case, Gladiator was unable to do any with the shield, despite your claims of him being able to do anything that he puts his mind to. Also, who's to say that at the same time, Sue wasn't protecting Cap with her invisible force field? And, if she was, Gladiator should have been able to take it out, according to you. I haven't seen anything proving this claim yet, though.

Logic Mark III says:

Gladiator is faster than Superman, he doesnt need to think he is for this to happen, he just is.

No, he's not. Superman moves much faster than he does.

Logic Mark III says:

As for the confidence it has been stated by himself, other characters, bios, and it can be SEEN in some comics, i.e the fight with Vulcan how he made himslef untouchable."

Then if it has been stated, provide evidence from those comics. Word of mouth isn't enough.
Post Edited:2008-05-19 12:10:19

You have admitted that Vibranium has a limit yet you dont think Cap should have been thrown back by punches that could level a city!?!?!? Again if Silver Surfer can break through Vibranium walls MUCH thicker than Cap's shield [regardless of it breaking or not] why would'nt Cap be thrown into next week by Gladiators almost 'imeasurably powerfull' [as described in that issue] punches? That issue also brings up an interesting bit of support as to why Gladiator wouldnt lose confidence in this fight. The skrulls in that comic were using the specific radiation that harms him, that can even KILL him. Now if there was ever a point at which you were going to lose confidence surely its one where you are outnumbered by opponents with weapons that exploit your Achilles heal? But did he wuss out? NO. He was more determined. As for Sue keeping Cap stable i dont think so, in the comic before that she couldn’t contain his force in one of her force bubbles, he punched it 3 times and she passed out, so all of a sudden she could contain the several dozen blows he laid down? Also they didn’t state that she was holding him up. Yes Gladiator should indeed have been able to tackle Reed's little trick with ease; Captain America has been knocked back by much lesser force than Gladiator can muster [Captain America vol 5 issue 13 page 12 and issue 21 pages 4 and 15].I haven’t claimed he can do anything he puts his mind to, that’s the way he has been described by other characters , I merely used this to support the idea that he gets stronger with increasing confidence [Uncanny X-men 480 page 13: New X-men 125 page 19 Uncanny X-men 341]. Furthermore in Gladiator/Supreme when Supreme psionically probes Gladiator he could feel Gladiators aura adapting, suggesting that it changes to suit the task, which i think backs up the ability to get stronger. Also in that comic Gladiator managed to bond his aura with Supremes aura, who knows what havock he could play with Supermans powers that way? Regardless he is of a planet smashing level [Marvel Comics Presents 49] and he states he can move planets [the guy can break them I don’t think its too much of a stretch of the imagination to see him moving them]. How fast is Superman? [Not sun dipped or some crazy whack job version of Superman] I thought it was light speed; Gladiator is faster than light speed [fantastic four 339-340], people agree that Silver Surfer‘s speed gives him an advantage over Superman, what’s the problem with believing the same for Gladiator ? He could blitz Superman nicely and indeed break his neck or back.
Post Edited:2008-05-21 10:53:40

Logic Mark III says:

"Garbage....

Not gonna address this again...

Logic Mark III

Regardless he is of a planet smashing level [Marvel Comics Presents 49] and he states he can move planets [the guy can break them I don’t think its too much of a stretch of the imagination to see him moving them]. How fast is Superman? [Not sun dipped or some crazy whack job version of Superman] I thought it was light speed; Gladiator is faster than light speed [fantastic four 339-340], people agree that Silver Surfer‘s speed gives him an advantage over Superman, what’s the problem with believing the same for Gladiator ? He could blitz Superman nicely and indeed break his neck or back."

Superman can move faster than light even if he isn't sun-dipped (and if he was, he could probably move faster). He can even move 10 times faster than humans can think... He can even think and react at those same speeds. So, no, Gladiator isn't gonna blitz Superman with success, because he has the reaction time on his side. He says he can move planets, but that's different from actually doing them. If he hasn't done it, there there's nothing to support this claim...
Post Edited:2008-05-21 11:00:38

How much faster than light speed? Who said Gladiator doesnt have the reaction speed, why bring up human reactions does a purple dude with a mohawk and cape look human to you? please provide evidence, not hearsay.

When did i say 'Garbage'? to what do you refer? did you check the issues? why not just admit fanboyism now? Seriously i dont see whats wrong with what i had posted i gave you examples. It should be plain to see Reed's plan was stupid and should not work. It should be plain to see the guy isnt going to be intimidated like some 13 year old by Superman [HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEH...thats for you Ace High]. End of the day this is a veteran soldier, on steroids v.s a good willed man with some adventuring skills. My money is on the veteran. Superman is not Super when fighting a Superman, he is just a man. Screw the legend.

Logic Mark III says:

"When did i say 'Garbage'? to what do you refer? did you check the issues? why not just admit fanboyism now? Seriously i dont see whats wrong with what i had posted i gave you examples. It should be plain to see Reed's plan was stupid and should not work. It should be plain to see the guy isnt going to be intimidated like some 13 year old by Superman [HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEH...thats for you Ace High]. End of the day this is a veteran soldier, on steroids v.s a good willed man with some adventuring skills. My money is on the veteran. Superman is not Super when fighting a Superman, he is just a man. Screw the legend."

Not being a fanboy... I would ask you to speak for yourself, but I'm not going to because it isn't worth it. I can't check the issues if I don't have them. What about scans? Don't have those, do you? Aight, then... All I'm saying is that Reed's plan proves that Gladiator's weakness can be exploited. I refuse address everything because I've been over it, and most of it (besides Gladiator being unable to break the shield) is irrelevant anyway. People claiming that his powers increasing due to his confidence isn't anything either... It's what people claim. Gladiator being a soldier doesn't mean a thing here. Superman has defeated (who has wartime experience, right?) before...

Logic Mark III says:

"Who said Gladiator doesnt have the reaction speed, why bring up human reactions does a purple dude with a mohawk and cape look human to you?

I was speaking for Superman, not your favorite character. Tell me where I said Gladiator was human. Tell me where mentioned human reactions. Tell me where I said Gladiator doesn't have the reaction speed. Please, tell me...

Logic Mark III says:

"How much faster than light speed? Please provide evidence, not hearsay."

Hearsay, my foot....

It's dubbed that Superman can move faster than light in space... Just like Gladiator

This next scan has to be light-speed, if he's able to move so fast in space it makes a BOOM sound. LOL. I wish I could show you the ones before it, though. He managed to take Darkseid to the Sun is a few seconds, when it takes light 8 minutes to reach the Earth...

Okay, If he is in the sun surely he gets a boost? You did say, and have shown me Superman moves 10 times faster than the speed of thought, i merely eluded to the fact that Gladiator isnt human so Superman being faster than HUMAN thought is redundant. In the Gladiator Supreme comic Gladiator makes a comment about the flaw that terrans [Earthlings]apply their biology to all other creatures, so i assume he is even more alien on the inside as he is on the outside. Okay Superman can move faster than light but how much so? Also for how long since he needs light, if he is going faster than it for any extended period of time he is soon going to tire. Why would you ask for proof if you werent going to look it up? I have given you the issues the statement i made stands...whether i post scans or not. The issues are there go do your end of it. Reed's plan proves not a dam thing. It makes no sense. How can a guy be at risk for his life and not lose confidence yet not being able to knock some fool on his ass, makes him cry like somebody killed his favourite puppy?!?! ITS JUST STUPID. The way writers have exploited his weakness is nonsensical. Like i said confidence is something that can be wrapped up in other emotions, like anger. I dont think its at all easy to make him lose confidence...anyway how would Superman do that? Superman has not been proven to be superior to the guy in any way that would make me think his confidence would be shattered. See you are a fanboy. Rather than coming up with a rebuttle to what i said about vibranium and his confidence you just brush it away. Destroy my idea and make me see that Superman wins otherwise your just being a fanboy refusing to see that Superman doesnt take this. Okay this is the same link as before in this thread, it isnt everything but it should give you something nice to look at.

http://www.comicvine.com/myvine/Logic%20Mark%20III/images/

Logic Mark III says:

"Okay, If he is in the sun surely he gets a boost? You did say, and have shown me Superman moves 10 times faster than the speed of thought, i merely eluded to the fact that Gladiator isnt human so Superman being faster than HUMAN thought is redundant. In the Gladiator Supreme comic Gladiator makes a comment about the flaw that terrans [Earthlings]apply their biology to all other creatures, so i assume he is even more alien on the inside as he is on the outside. Okay Superman can move faster than light but how much so? Also for how long since he needs light, if he is going faster than it for any extended period of time he is soon going to tire. Why would you ask for proof if you werent going to look it up? I have given you the issues the statement i made stands...whether i post scans or not. The issues are there go do your end of it. Reed's plan proves not a dam thing. It makes no sense. How can a guy be at risk for his life and not lose confidence yet not being able to knock some fool on his ass, makes him cry like somebody killed his favourite puppy?!?! ITS JUST STUPID. The way writers have exploited his weakness is nonsensical. Like i said confidence is something that can be wrapped up in other emotions, like anger. I dont think its at all easy to make him lose confidence...anyway how would Superman do that? Superman has not been proven to be superior to the guy in any way that would make me think his confidence would be shattered. See you are a fanboy. Rather than coming up with a rebuttle to what i said about vibranium and his confidence you just brush it away. Destroy my idea and make me see that Superman wins otherwise your just being a fanboy refusing to see that Superman doesnt take this. Okay this is the same link as before in this thread, it isnt everything but it should give you something nice to look at. http://www.comicvine.com/myvine/Logic%20Mark%20III/images/ "

Got this from IGN Board

In Superman #54, (and continued in Adventures of Superman #477), an atomic bomb blew up in his hands and Superman didn't bat an eye.

In Superman for all Seasons, Book Two, he survived, without any injury, a Lexcorp thermonuclear missile, capable of destroying Metropolis, at point blank range. He smiled immediately after the explosion.

In Superman #9, John Byrne's "weak" Superman endured at ground zero (the bomb was in his hands) a 40 megaton thermonuclear bomb. Then he fell to Earth (he was in outer space at the time of the explosion). Superman was knocked unconscious for a half hour; he suffered no physical damage. 40 megatons is more than 3000 times as powerful as the blast that destroyed Hiroshima. Superman also endured a 30 megaton blast without losing consciousness, though I?m presently lacking the issue reference.

To further cement Superman's nuke-proof status, in the recent Man of Steel #131, Superman easily shrugged off a massive nuclear blast, while literally sitting in kryptonite.

In Action Comics #649, Superman withstood without injury, Braniac?s "clean" (non- radioactive) city-destroying bombs.

In Superman Man of Steel #52, Superman withstood 3 particle beams, each powered by the core of a planet, fired at him by the Cyborg. One of these planet-powered beams was a plasma beam capable of leveling a city

In War of the Gods #4: Superman used his body as a shield to block a magical bolt capable of destroying an entire Island (Themyscira, Paradise Island). So effective a shield was he, that he weakened the bolt such that only a single casualty occurred on the island. Despite experiencing pain, Superman survived without any medical attention.

In Superman #23, Superman endured without visible harm, a magical explosion that destroyed most of an island, but was unconscious after the blast.

In Superman Man of Steel #66, he once again acted as an effective shield, protecting cities around the world by blocking numerous "atom-smashing" force beams with his body. At one point he had 6 such beams trained on him simultaneously.

In Superman Man of Steel #30, Superman survived a so called "force twelve disintegration beam" fired from a ship the size of a small moon, with absolutely no effect at all.

In Adventures of Superman #581, Superman allowed Adversary, a powerful magical foe, to hit him as hard as he could, without retaliation. Superman was literally punched halfway across the planet- from Metropolis, he literally landed in China- without any injury or loss of consciousness.

But forget about being punched across the planet to China, how about through the planet to China? In Superman #181, Superman and Bizarro (his magically-created, brain damaged, "imperfect" duplicate) switched bodies. Superman (in Bizarro?s body) punched Bizarro (in Superman?s body) completely through the Earth and out the other end. Bizarro (in Superman?s body) was slammed in through the ground in Metropolis and came out two panels later in China. He was shown ripping straight through the Earth?s crust, mantle, and core, and coming out on the other side of the planet. Superman?s body was fully conscious and completely unharmed by the blow (Bizarro was smiling as usual).

In Man of Tomorrow #13, Superman harmlessly shrugged off a blast from Orion?s Astro-Harness that blasted him across the planet from the North Pole to India.

Action Comics # 762: Superman harmlessly shrugged off a blow from the magical demon Etrigan. The blow actually knocked Superman from Earth's surface all the way to the moon (239,000 miles), a distance that is about 10 times the diameter of the Earth. Superman was virtually unfazed. In this issue he also shrugged off magical demon-fire (which he did previously in Action #589), and his super-lungs harmlessly inhaled the demon's magical gases.

At times, Superman has faced impossibly powerful foes with strength even greater than his own. Though outmatched in strength, he still endured these beatings impressively. In Superman #22, he withstood several blows from Quex-El, a pocketverse Kryptonian whose strength seemed comparable to Pre-Crisis levels. In Action Comics # 591, he withstood blows from the Pre-Crisis Superboy (a being who could juggle planets and tow a solar system) without visible injury, but this may have been artistic license.

In Superman/Doomsday: Hunter/Prey, Superman survived, at ground zero, a blast equal to "a million nuclear bombs" (according to the energy being Waverider). The explosion was caused by the destruction of the power generator for the entire planet of Calaton; the energy was drawn from the planetary core. Superman did not suffer any physical damage, but was momentarily rendered inert, and stated that he felt concussed. He then got up and boxed a little more with Doomsday, who also survived the blast.

In Superman #3, Superman survived the dreaded fire pits of Apokolips, but suffered a spell of amnesia. Each fire pit takes up a large portion of Apokolips? surface; Apokolips is a much larger planet than Earth. On Earth, a fire pit would be a continent-sized blast furnace.

In Adventures of Superman #478, as part of the Time and Time Again storyline, Superman survived- without so much as batting an eye- the nuclear destruction of the entire moon in the year 2995. The moon had been lined with sufficient nuclear devices to disintegrate it in one shot. When the moon was obliterated, Superman was actually within the moon (structures had been built beneath the surface of the moon). He did not suffer any harm and did not lose consciousness.

In Superman #171, with three seconds to act, Superman flew from an about-to-explode Pluto. It's not clear from the depiction how far away from the planet he was when it exploded (although he was shown to be caught in the shockwaves from the explosion). He was unharmed by the blast, which obliterated the planet. He suffered only "ringing in my ears" (very curious since there is no sound in space). This is either an invulnerability feat, or a flight speed feat, depending on how fast he got away and how far away he was from the planet when it exploded. Take your pick.

Superman's ability to survive immersion in the sun is well documented by now. In Adventures of Superman #480, Superman survived immersion in the sun for the first time, but with great difficulty. This was actually a RED sun at the time, due to the Eradicator's interference. In both the Superman: Last God of Krypton one shot and Superman Man of Steel #50, Superman survived immersion in the outer layers of the Earth's yellow sun enjoyably, received extra power from the sun, and effortlessly escaped the sun?s gravitational pull. Furthermore, in both Action Comics # 782 and Superman Man of Steel #64, Superman survived the core of the sun without any problems. The pressure at the core of the sun is equal to 250 billion Earth atmospheres.

In JLA #41, Superman absorbed the energy of the Mageddon Warhead, a device capable, at the minimum, of vaporizing half a galaxy. Writer Grant Morrison intended Mageddon to be "the primordial annihilator" capable of literally destroying everything. Visibly distressed by the absorption, Superman still suffered no harm whatsoever, and even smiled afterwards.

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Strength and Movement power:

Man of Steel #30: Standing on Earth?s surface, Superman punched Lobo into orbit and beyond with one uppercut.

Nuclear Submarines: These typically weigh between 10,000 and 20,000 tons. In Adventures of Superman #599, Superman raised a Russian nuclear submarine from the ocean floor (swamped with water as it was, it must have weighed more).

In Superman For All Seasons, book two, he casually held a nuclear submarine overhead with one hand.

Adventure of Superman #473: From Earth, Superman threw an alien space craft clear of Earth?s gravity and into outer space. This craft was larger than an aircraft carrier and over a mile long (a typical aircraft carrier is about a 1/4 of a mile long and weighs about 100,000 tons, so this ship was about 4x that size)

In Man of Steel #131, after taking a hit from a nuke (while sitting in kryptonite), Superman vortexed the thousands of tons of radioactive debris into the upper atmosphere by spinning around the debris at high speeds. He then used his heat vision to fuse and condense the debris into a manageable mass, then casually tossed the lump 93 million miles into the sun. After kryptonite, no less.

Action Comics # 585: Superman muscled overhead a magically animated mountain, not quite big enough to "crush Metropolis with one step." He achieved flight with it and flew the massive chunk of earth into outer space. Once there, he tossed the mountain into orbit around the sun.

Action Comics # 793: Superman plugged up an active volcano by very casually dropping a mountain on top of it.

Justice League of America (old series) # 65 (early nineties): Embedded in the core of the planet Almerac, Superman dug free (without flying) through countless tons of rock all the way to the planet?s surface. This was after Starbreaker had drained nearly all of Superman?s power. In the B13 storyline, Superman circumnavigated the Earth's surface by burrowing 20,000 miles through the Earth's crust in an hour.

In Action Comics #762, Lois asked Superman to not bring her another hand-forged diamond (by squeezing a lump of coal) for Christmas this year.

JLA: World War Three story-line: Superman was chained to the endless millwheels of the Mageddon machinery. His strength was used to move the gears of a weapon whose size dwarfed the entire Earth/Moon system.

In Superman: The Earth Stealers, Superman propelled a massive space station, cylindrical in shape and stated to be 600 miles in diameter (the length of the cylinder, judging by the depiction, had to have been about 2500 miles ) by pushing against it. The weight was inestimable- it was constructed from all the natural resources gleaned from an entire solar system. A hyperspace portal was opened and Superman not only pushed it, he propelled it for 20 minutes through hyperspace (it was stated that they reached the halfway point at 10 minutes). He had to exert the power to move it at the same time that he had to deal with the stresses of hyperspace unprotected. Note that the space station was also towing both the Earth and the Moon in a stasis field, however, I do not factor this weight into the feat as Superman himself theorized that the stasis field was neutralizing the planet?s mass. Hence he merely resisted the space station?s weight, not the Earth and Moon?s.

Several events show Superman as a moon-mover. In JLA # 7, as Electro-Superman, he halted the fall of the Moon towards Earth (caused by Neron?s magical machinations), then moved the Moon back its proper position in orbit. He later commented that he's more powerful as "regular" Superman. Writer Grant Morrison and artist Howard Porter had originally intended the moon-moving event in JLA #7 be done by "regular" Superman , but DC forced them to use Electro-Supes. This event is butressed by several more. In JLA: The Century War, ancient "alchemical engines" were causing the moon to fall towards the Earth. Superman and Green Lantern took turns holding the moon back against the "geometrically increasing force" that was causing it to fall. Superman got the last "moon-bracing" shift. In Superman Man of Steel #30, Superman grabbed, easily broke the forward movement of, and easily threw in the opposite direction, a space ship the size of a small moon. In JLA # 58, Superman , Wonder Woman and Green Lantern collaborated to tow Earth?s moon a distance of 238,900 miles in mere seconds, indicating a fantastic acceleration, and then pulled the moon out of Earth's gravity (which increases its weight tremendously). As he is universally regarded as the JLA?s most powerful member, I?m inclined to give Superman more than one-third, and - conservatively - about one-half, the work effort. In the Lex 2000 special, with a single strike, Superman split one of Saturn?s moons in half. Saturn?s moons are small moons.

In Man of Tomorrow #13, it took the combined effort of Orion, Martian Manhunter, Big Barda, Steel, Supergirl, and Wonder Woman to physically restrain Superman. They dogpiled him, but admitted, "we can't hold him for long!".

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Extreme Displays:

Action Comics #782: After emerging from the sun energized, Superman physically pushed WarWorld, (a small, Pluto-sized planet) across the solar system and into a boom tube. WarWorld did engage a "full throttle countermeasure" in resistance Superman?s push. We can see WarWorld?s engines (which encompass nearly an entire hemisphere of WarWorld?s surface) firing in resistance, to no avail. WarWorlds? engines allow WarWorld to travel at faster than light speeds through space, so they generate the power to accelerate a planet beyond light speed. "How is he moving my planet! The Kryptonian does not have that power!" Braniac?s disbelief is reasonable since WarWorld?s engines had no shortage of power ; WarWorld had just pirated the energy of Imperiex - energy gleaned from the devouring of many galaxies. (Hence Imperiex?s reputation as the "Devourer of Galaxies.") Please note that Superman was energized beyond his usual power levels at this time.

Action Comics Annual #7: Fighting in space, Superman successfully resisted the pull from a black hole that had opened up directly below (inches from) his feet. The miniature black hole had been induced by advanced alien (Ht?ros) war technology.

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Speed:

Superman #13: Flew around the equator in a matter of seconds, indicating a speed of well over 1,000,000 mph, or roughly 1350 times the speed of sound.

Man of Steel #110: Standing in one spot, Superman used his super speed to vibrate his body invisible.

Superman #175: Taking another speed trick from the Flash?s book of tricks, Superman used his super speed to vibrate his body intangible, thus allowing Doomsday?s punches and fire-breath to pass harmlessly through him. A body moving at light speed within an atmosphere will become intangible (that?s how the Flash does it).

Return of Superman: Superman used his speed to vibrate his arm so fast, it shattered the Cyborg?s body into hundreds of fragments.

After racing the Man of Steel, Impulse stated that Superman travels at 99% of the speed of light.

War of the Gods #4: Superman actually out-raced an energy beam to its target. In JLA: Heavens Ladder, it is stated that Superman can race a photon to its target.

Lex 2000 special: Superman made the trip from Earth to Saturn in well under 4 minutes. By comparison, light takes about 19 minutes to make this trip.

In JLA # 51, Superman apparently made the trip from Saturn to Earth in a matter of seconds.

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Heat Vision:

Superman #167: His power waning under a red sun, Superman still summoned enough heat vision to successfully power Jor-El?s planet-moving ion engines. The planet in this case had a mass 16 times that of Earth's.

Superman?s heat vision has a maximum range of at least 239,000 miles (the distance from the Earth to the Moon). In Superman #101, he let out a beam from Earth?s surface that scorched the surface of the moon; In Man of Steel #112, he shot a beam that bounced off the surface of the moon. Krypto did, too.

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Senses:

In John Byrne?s Man of Steel revamp, it was shown that Superman?s microscopic vision can see on the subcellular level, as he analyzed Bizarro?s cellular structure; and even on the molecular level, as he analyzed the molecular composition of Magpie?s acid-gas.

In the JLA: Earth 2 graphic novel, the Martian Manhunter and Superman mulled over the abnormalities at "every eighth angstrom" in the DNA of the anti-matter Earth?s version of Lex Luthor. An angstrom is about the size of a large atom.

Superman #152: Superman?s telescopic vision allowed him to peer across the galaxy to WarWorld.

In Man of Steel #121, Superman?s super-hearing allowed him to pinpoint a single person in a city of 11 million based on such distinctive sounds as the rustle of that person?s clothing and the sound of their heartbeat.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Fighting prowess and other miscellaneous stuff:

Soul Search: Fighting alone in Hell (literally), Superman single-handedly defeated Blaze, a death goddess, in her own realm. This had never been accomplished before by anyone; Blaze has magical control over the very reality of her realm. The attacks that Superman fought off included magical transmutation into a demon, which he shook off through sheer willpower ; magical energy blasts from Blaze ; a magical spell that encased him in stone, which he subsequently shattered; and immersion in the lava lakes of this magical dimension.

Alone against the Daxamite Lar Gand, (Daxamites are the genetic cousins to, but reputed to be more powerful than, Kryptonians), Superman soundly KO?d Lar, despite the fact that Superman was operating on empty lungs on the airless surface of the moon (Lar had air in his lungs however).

Action Comics Annual #7: Alone, Superman twice defeated alien armadas, each capable of destroying a planet.

Superman #153: Superman became the first being ever in the history of the Universe to defeat an Imperiex probe. He used a combination of super speed and super strength to destroy an Imperiex space construct ; said construct was capable of annihilating our solar system.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

During Superman's Kryptonite poisoning, he was taking out his frustration on the moon. The Martian Manhunter walks out, and tells him that if he keeps that up the moon will go out of orbit. Clearly, due to his other feets, that would be well within his ability. Did I mention he was sickened and weakened by Kryptonite?

Superman was able to reach light speed in a non-vaccum, in a gravitationally distorted field (I, and others, believe he alters gravity fields which lets him effectively, though not truly, fly faster than light), rendering his speed from near-light to 0 instantly (meaning he hit the light barrier).

Superman has repeatedly used the famed Dragonball "after image" technique. On Doomsday (yes, the creature that killed him), and on Mongul II (just as powerful as his father, who nearly killed Superman in a fight on the original Warworld), along with other less impressive examples.

Superman's heat vision was able to slag over the remaining parts of his own fortress (constructed of highly invulnerable Kryptonian allows), sealing it under several feet of solid rock and molten metal. Being pure, disspelled solar energy, his heat vision can quite easily reach the heat of the surface of the sun.

Superman was able to repel an entire army and invasion armada, single handedly, under a red sun on a planet with 40 times Earth's gravity.

Superman was able to pull an entire island (Stryker's Island) into orbit.

Logic Mark III says:

"Okay Superman can move faster than light but how much so? Also for how long since he needs light, if he is going faster than it for any extended period of time he is soon going to tire.

There isn't an exact number on how much faster her moves past the speed of light. But here's some thing else... Superman got pissed and was able to fly to a moon of Saturn in four minutes, after he found out that Lex was elected to be president.... It takes light 19 minutes to get Saturn. There you have it.... It's even in the caption on the side. That's almost 5 times the speed of light. He could probably move faster, depending on how he's written. This may not even be his limit, so you're asking the wrong person how much faster he moves past light... Just know that he does...

Logic Mark III says:

Why would you ask for proof if you werent going to look it up? I have given you the issues the statement i made stands...whether i post scans or not. The issues are there go do your end of it.

Where do you expect me to look for these issues? Or I'm guessing you want me to go out and buy these right? You got the money for me to go buy them?

Logic Mark III says:

Reed's plan proves not a dam thing. It makes no sense. How can a guy be at risk for his life and not lose confidence yet not being able to knock some fool on his ass, makes him cry like somebody killed his favourite puppy?!?! ITS JUST STUPID. The way writers have exploited his weakness is nonsensical. Like i said confidence is something that can be wrapped up in other emotions, like anger. I dont think its at all easy to make him lose confidence...anyway how would Superman do that? Superman has not been proven to be superior to the guy in any way that would make me think his confidence would be shattered.

I've addressed this way too many times. It's not that it's nonsensical. Maybe Gladiator is known for being written inconsistently. Who knows? And, I even gave an example of it a few pages back on how Superman would do it. All you say is that it doesn't make sense, and that isn't possible for someone like Superman to make him lose confidence. You must think Superman is pushover....

Logic mark III says:

See you are a fanboy.

Well, I guess that makes both of us...

Logic Mark III says:

Rather than coming up with a rebuttle to what i said about vibranium and his confidence you just brush it away.

I've already done this. I'm not repeating myself. You can go back to the other pages and read it.... Why do you think I decided to brush it away?

Logic Mark III says:

Destroy my idea and make me see that Superman wins otherwise your just being a fanboy refusing to see that Superman doesnt take this."

I could say the same about you, but haven't done that...

Static Shock says:

"Logic Mark III says:

"Okay Superman can move faster than light but how much so? Also for how long since he needs light, if he is going faster than it for any extended period of time he is soon going to tire.

There isn't an exact number on how much faster her moves past the speed of light. But here's some thing else... Superman got pissed and was able to fly to a moon of Saturn in four minutes, after he found out that Lex was elected to be president.... It takes light 19 minutes to get Saturn. There you have it.... It's even in the caption on the side. That's almost 5 times the speed of light. He could probably move faster, depending on how he's written. This may not even be his limit, so you're asking the wrong person how much faster he moves past light... Just know that he does...

Logic Mark III says:

Why would you ask for proof if you werent going to look it up? I have given you the issues the statement i made stands...whether i post scans or not. The issues are there go do your end of it.

Where do you expect me to look for these issues? Or I'm guessing you want me to go out and buy these right? You got the money for me to go buy them?

Logic Mark III says:

Reed's plan proves not a dam thing. It makes no sense. How can a guy be at risk for his life and not lose confidence yet not being able to knock some fool on his ass, makes him cry like somebody killed his favourite puppy?!?! ITS JUST STUPID. The way writers have exploited his weakness is nonsensical. Like i said confidence is something that can be wrapped up in other emotions, like anger. I dont think its at all easy to make him lose confidence...anyway how would Superman do that? Superman has not been proven to be superior to the guy in any way that would make me think his confidence would be shattered.

I've addressed this way too many times. It's not that it's nonsensical. Maybe Gladiator is known for being written inconsistently. Who knows? And, I even gave an example of it a few pages back on how Superman would do it. All you say is that it doesn't make sense, and that isn't possible for someone like Superman to make him lose confidence. You must think Superman is pushover....

Logic mark III says:

See you are a fanboy.

Well, I guess that makes both of us...

Logic Mark III says:

Rather than coming up with a rebuttle to what i said about vibranium and his confidence you just brush it away.

I've already done this. I'm not repeating myself. You can go back to the other pages and read it.... Why do you think I decided to brush it away?

Logic Mark III says:

Destroy my idea and make me see that Superman wins otherwise your just being a fanboy refusing to see that Superman doesnt take this."

I could say the same about you, but haven't done that... "

Nice scan

Superboy-Prime 10000 says:

"He did that once in the "green lanturn vs Superman" thread.(And I purposedly type "lanturn" because that's the typo on the title of the thread.)"

Really? What did he say about it? Because, clearly, Superman is moving 5 times faster than light in that scan. I don't think there's anything to say he isn't. It doesn't matter what anyone tells me about this scan here.

Static Shock says:

"Logic Mark III says:

"Okay Superman can move faster than light but how much so? Also for how long since he needs light, if he is going faster than it for any extended period of time he is soon going to tire.

There isn't an exact number on how much faster her moves past the speed of light. But here's some thing else... Superman got pissed and was able to fly to a moon of Saturn in four minutes, after he found out that Lex was elected to be president.... It takes light 19 minutes to get Saturn. There you have it.... It's even in the caption on the side. That's almost 5 times the speed of light. He could probably move faster, depending on how he's written. This may not even be his limit, so you're asking the wrong person how much faster he moves past light... Just know that he does...

By the time you post this pic static,there are 60-80% that Satyrquaze are going to rebutt you about Superman's speed in that issue.

He did that once in the "green lanturn vs Superman" thread.(And I purposedly type "lanturn" because that's the typo on the title of the thread.)

Static Shock says:

"Superboy-Prime 10000 says:

" He did that once in the "green lanturn vs Superman" thread.(And I purposedly type "lanturn" because that's the typo on the title of the thread.) "

Really? What did he say about it? Because, clearly, Superman is moving 5 times faster than light in that scan. I don't think there's anything to say he isn't. It doesn't matter what anyone tells me about this scan here. "

This is what he posted:

No, what I was getting at was he left Earth 14 minutes before that scene took place, so slightly slower than the speed of light.10 minutes before announcement + 4 minutes since announcement = fourteen minutes

I thought it would fit in the discussion.

Well, did he post evidence, proving that he left Earth 14 minutes before Lex was elected? If not, then what he's saying doesn't mean squat...

Danko says:

"http://tn3-1.deviantart.com/fs14/300W/f/2007/036/9/1/Gladiator_Vs__Superman_by_toze_barnabe.jpgI thought it would fit in the discussion."

LOL.

Gladiator would anihalate Superman, Superman is good but come on being able to fly into the sun, lift ? tons, and the mohawk... well he wins

Slight says:

"Gladiator would anihalate Superman, Superman is good but come on being able to fly into the sun, lift ? tons, and the mohawk... well he wins"

Superman could all that, as well. Your point? You know what? Never mind. You think Wolverine always wins a battle....

Logic Mark III says:

" Regardless he is of a planet smashing level [Marvel Comics Presents 49] and he states he can move planets [the guy can break them I don’t think its too much of a stretch of the imagination to see him moving them].
Post Edited:2008-05-21 10:53:40"

Actually it is a big jump to belive that Gladaitor, who was shown once to smash a planet, can actually move a planet.

In the 2 images that you have in your image gallery that deal with Gladator destroying a planet they are a 2 key points to note,

1. We don't know the size of the planet being destroyed, or for that fact it's age and compiosition (molten core, tectonically unstable, etc). This is relatively important as a smaller planet or a planet of a less durable nature will be easier to destroy.

2. He is shown to repeatidly hit the planet surfce, cracking the crust, resulting in the planet exploding.

Depending upon the nature of the planet and it's age, the crust thickness will vary dramatically.

If we base it on a planet similar in size and composition to Earth, the Crust can vary between 5 - 70km thick. The Crust is of made up from relatively low density materials (by comparison to other layers) - Silicates mainly, that are hard but usually brittle.

It would take a sizable force to catastrophically crack the Crust over a wide area, to result in a chain reaction, as the next layer below the Crust is the Upper Mantle, that is a highly viscous sea of molten material, would also need to be severely distrupted to carry the distrucptive force lower in to the Mantle layer itself.

All this pre-supposes that the planet is still young enough to have a molten core.

Anyway, scientists have calculated that focussed energies equivalent to a few megatons of TNT or an earthquake of magnitude 7 on the Richter scale, would be sufficient to crack the earths crust (in this case for a probe lauch). So if the force delivered was siginificantly greater and repeatidly delivered, then it may be sufficient to get the effect of a chain reaction going.

Can Gladiator hit this hard. I think so as I believe that he hits as hard as Thor does when wielding Mjolnir. We know that Thor can destroy secondary Adamantium with blows from the hammer and of conventional weaponry, only a nuke can destroy secondary adamantium.

However, this energy is an insignificant fraction of that needed to move a planet weighing in at 6,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 Tonnes (again using Earth as an example). Even a moon (our Moon) sized planet, weighing 7,350,000,000,000,000,000 Tonnes (rougly 1/80th the weight of the Earth) requires colossal amounts more energy to move.

Have we all issed spinning off in to space when various Governments have conducted Nuclear tests ?

No, so the force of a nuke is in sufficient to move a planet.

So unless the planet in fact happens to be a very small moon, I don't see Gladiator moving it.

Slight says:

"Gladiator is stronger, can fly faster and has lazer eyes, no super breath of vision. Superman gets his power from the sun but when there is none IE when Gladiator causes it to go super nova by flying through it Superman has no powers. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. Oh and Woverine does win every battle"

Why are you still talking to me? I said never mind. And everything you said (besides Superman getting his powers from the Sun) was wrong anyway...

You really are 15 years old. And you lack the knowledge and efficiency to argue effectively. I'm done with you. :)
Post Edited:2008-05-21 14:02:50

Gladiator is stronger, can fly faster and has lazer eyes, no super breath of vision. Superman gets his power from the sun but when there is none IE when Gladiator causes it to go super nova by flying through it Superman has no powers. THANK YOU VERY MUCH

Oh and Woverine does win every battle

Oh another thing, if they are both moving light speed/faster...its going to take a while for the sound to reach Gladiators ears so Superman's supposed psychological warfare isnt going to be at all instantaneous...if he finds out to use it at all that is.

@ Static Shock: there is this AMAZING thing called the internet, you can use it to get pictures and even [although its very naughty boys and girls] DOWNLOAD COMICS FOR FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So thats where you can get the issues i mentioned. I still dont get your view on the vibranium, you have said it has a limit, i have said it has a limit, i have given examples of Cap being knocked back by lesser force, thus surely blowing that scan out of the water. Anyway, all of the feats you have displayed for Superman are all well and good, he has several of his own comics makes sense he would have loads. Superman having loads of different survival/strength feats dont take away from Gladiator's as few as they may be. He has survived Solar system ravaging explosions too, he has been shown to be a planetary threat too. So in no way is he being outclassed there. Gladiators sense seem to be better as well, which means he should have no problem tracing Superman, he sees across several Galaxies to find Glactus and hears a signal several lightyears away. You are right Gladiator is written badly, because how much sense does it make for the leader of the most elite group, the defender of their monarchy, a veteran soldier to be so easily jarred by minor things? And things that dont even make sense? Gladiator still seems faster to me normally;some of your instances have Superman being boosted, and Gladiator accelerated himself into Reeds timebubble no problem, which seems to be better than anything you had shown. I have looked at your examples of Superman demorilising Gladiator, and as with the Cap shield example it doesnt make sense. 1. What does Superman know about Gladiator that he could use against him? [he seemed to know what was bothering Doomsday in the post you sent] 2. You make out like Superman instantly knows how Gladiators powers work, so the instant the fight starts he is using psychological warfare, this is stupid unless you extend the same courtesy to Gladiator in which case he comes with a mountain of Kryptonite. So again how is a guy faster than Superman, as tough as him, as srong as him, a better warrior than him, more ruthless, with the added bonus of being able to make himself untouchable? UNTOUCHABLE!?!!?? What is Superman's strength going to do then, when it cant hit him? How are his eye beams going to hurt him then? and if he is in such a state as to believe himself untouchable what will Superman say then? OH YOU HAVE BAD SHOES!...

Logic Mark III says:

"@ Static Shock: there is this AMAZING thing called the internet, you can use it to get pictures and even [although its very naughty boys and girls] DOWNLOAD COMICS FOR FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So thats where you can get the issues i mentioned"

I don't know any site that has old comics for free, unless it's a torrent. And, I live on campus right now, so torrents are blocked. Even if I wanted to find these sources, I couldn't. The same goes for pictures. I've tried looking for pictures. No luck. Anyway, I'm pretty much done here. We can't agree on anything; all we're doing is one-uping each other with the same argument over and over.... You stick by Gladiator... I'm sticking by Superman...

Superman.

UM.....I THINK SUUPERMAN. GLADIATOR WAS EASILY DEFEATED BY PHOENIX WHOSE HOST IS JEAN GREY.(IN DARK PHOENIX SAGE.)BUT SUPERMAN....I THINK SUPERMAN DOESN'T LOSE LIKE GLADIATOR.(OF COURSE, SUPERMAN WILL DIE TO THE END.)

spekqj says:

"UM.....I THINK SUUPERMAN. GLADIATOR WAS EASILY DEFEATED BY PHOENIX WHOSE HOST IS JEAN GREY.(IN DARK PHOENIX SAGE.)BUT SUPERMAN....I THINK SUPERMAN DOESN'T LOSE LIKE GLADIATOR.(OF COURSE, SUPERMAN WILL DIE TO THE END.)"

That's a horrible explanation.

At least she's backing Superman.

Logic Mark III says:

"Why is it that the Hulk has LIMITLESS strength because he gets angrier and the Gladiator doesnt? [replace anger with confidence] The Gladiator is EASILY as powerfull as Superman. The fact that for every good showing of Gladiator there is a bad showing should tell you writers dont know how to handle the character, but going by his bio you can't brush away showings that display his planet crushing strength, resistance and speed [with regards to speed i dont give a dam about this going into hyperspace for faster than light travel balls, the guy managed to move fast enough to interact with the Fantastic four who were moving so fast they were invisible and unaffected by time, and he didnt need to go into hyperspace for this, and he did say he was moving at hyperspeeds, so please believe he is faster than Superman]. As stated before it is my belief that, unless stipulated, we arent going off of how a character is written for the sakes of a comic. Of course Superman has more feats he has SEVERAL comics and is the HERO. Gladiator isnt, he is indeed a plot device to make others look better even though it flies in the face of his bio. I dont understand how his confidence is going to be affected in any way here. He is a veteran soldier and he gets scared of a little fight?!?!?!?!!? WTF! That stuff is all silly writing."

because hulk fanboys are not the sharpest hammers in the box.

the human Juggernaut says:

"Logic Mark III says:

"Why is it that the Hulk has LIMITLESS strength because he gets angrier and the Gladiator doesnt? [replace anger with confidence] The Gladiator is EASILY as powerfull as Superman. The fact that for every good showing of Gladiator there is a bad showing should tell you writers dont know how to handle the character, but going by his bio you can't brush away showings that display his planet crushing strength, resistance and speed [with regards to speed i dont give a dam about this going into hyperspace for faster than light travel balls, the guy managed to move fast enough to interact with the Fantastic four who were moving so fast they were invisible and unaffected by time, and he didnt need to go into hyperspace for this, and he did say he was moving at hyperspeeds, so please believe he is faster than Superman]. As stated before it is my belief that, unless stipulated, we arent going off of how a character is written for the sakes of a comic. Of course Superman has more feats he has SEVERAL comics and is the HERO. Gladiator isnt, he is indeed a plot device to make others look better even though it flies in the face of his bio. I dont understand how his confidence is going to be affected in any way here. He is a veteran soldier and he gets scared of a little fight?!?!?!?!!? WTF! That stuff is all silly writing."

because hulk fanboys are not the sharpest hammers in the box."

Hammer's aren't sharp....

Vance Astro says:

"the human Juggernaut says:

"Logic Mark III says:

"Why is it that the Hulk has LIMITLESS strength because he gets angrier and the Gladiator doesnt? [replace anger with confidence] The Gladiator is EASILY as powerfull as Superman. The fact that for every good showing of Gladiator there is a bad showing should tell you writers dont know how to handle the character, but going by his bio you can't brush away showings that display his planet crushing strength, resistance and speed [with regards to speed i dont give a dam about this going into hyperspace for faster than light travel balls, the guy managed to move fast enough to interact with the Fantastic four who were moving so fast they were invisible and unaffected by time, and he didnt need to go into hyperspace for this, and he did say he was moving at hyperspeeds, so please believe he is faster than Superman]. As stated before it is my belief that, unless stipulated, we arent going off of how a character is written for the sakes of a comic. Of course Superman has more feats he has SEVERAL comics and is the HERO. Gladiator isnt, he is indeed a plot device to make others look better even though it flies in the face of his bio. I dont understand how his confidence is going to be affected in any way here. He is a veteran soldier and he gets scared of a little fight?!?!?!?!!? WTF! That stuff is all silly writing."

because hulk fanboys are not the sharpest hammers in the box."

Hammer's aren't sharp...."

yea. I pwned myself.

Anyway, scanning over all the evidence and summing it in 2 words - Superman wins.

The_Creator says:

"Anyway, scanning over all the evidence and summing it in 2 words - Superman wins."

Did you see my explanation on how Superman would lower Gladiator's confidence? Do you think it would work?

Static Shock says:

"The_Creator says:

"Anyway, scanning over all the evidence and summing it in 2 words - Superman wins."

Did you see my explanation on how Superman would lower Gladiator's confidence? Do you think it would work?"

Yes and the idea has some merit.

My on belief is that Superman is many times more powerful (in strength, durability and speed) than Gladiator so this battle is not that close.

I will say it again and again. Marvel heavy-weights strength characters (Hulk, Juggernaut, Thor) are weaker than DC's (Superman, Wonder Woman, Captain MArvel. That's just the way the comics differ. I assume when they do crossovers, they have to put them on even ground. If Superman was in the Marvel U, he wouldn't be as strong because Marvel isn't tha over-the-top. The only Superman-like character that's equal (if not more powerful) from another company would be Majestic or Supreme, in my opinion.

No there are characters in Marvel just as strong if not stronger than those in DC. The 100 ton thing just allows us to rank the characters who are under 100 tons, of which there are many. Think about it. Take Sasquatch for instance. By no means is he the absuloute strongest in Marvel but he has been shown to move and lift a section of a destroyer class vessel[they are in a 10'thousand ton range of weight] and throw around Jumbo Jets like nothing. Do any of those feats sound like somthing that could be done by someone who only benches 100 tons? So there is no point in talking about Marvel characters being weaker like its some kind of rule Marvel follows 'Oh no better not make that character as strong as anyone in DC Bob or you get fired!!!!'.

Seriously i dont see how Superman makes Gladiator doubt himself. WHAT DOES HE KNOW ABOUT GLADIATOR?!!? When Cassandra Nova did it [despite her being some next hench telepath] she was talking about the destruction of the Imperium etc, which is something which would weaken his resolve, where does Superman get this knowledge from? Gladiator has punched people who have taken his punches before and been punched by people with strength he wasnt expecting and hasnt had his resolve weakened. He saw most of his team get killed by Vulcan and his resolve only got BETTER, it made him stronger. Add to that the fact that he is a soldier fighting is what he does i dont see how any type of engagement could make him scared; heck just look at the recent Emperor Vulcan comic [i find it strange how Vulcan and Alex seemed to fare better than Gladiator in that fight but whatever] he got his arm broken by the Eldest dude with ease and Gladiator still fought the guy later on, he wasnt lacking in confidence there. You have made assumptions that knows his weakness, knows how to exploit it and has the chance to.

Go Gladiator!

M

mantoid says:

"http://www.marvel.com/universe3zx/images/thumb/1/18/Gladiator442.jpg/440px-Gladiator442.jpg Go Gladiator! M"

Not even in 100,000 millinea that Gladiator wish to fight a guy who can do this and survive to tell the tale.

Reads the comic strip.

Superman is that strong!?

I go for Superman than. :)

M

Thats all good and well, but i still Gladiator as being in the same league, i know he hasnt done it in a comic but he has stated he can move planets too. Now if you think about his powers being confidence based how confident would he be if he was lying about stuff like that? Liars lie to others and themselves, do they seem like the most confident of people? Not really, so i dont see it as a lie. Not only has he destroyed a planet his strength has been described as planet destroying and in his fight with Supreme he states that their fight would have destroyed worlds had it continued. So i dont think he is trumped in strenght terms. Regardless his level of strength is enough to hurt Superman, vastly lesser foes can sock Superman good, and foes who may not moved planets [or moved planets by themselves] Lobo, Doomsday, Martian Manhunter, Black Adam, Wonder Woman, Redemption, Subjekt 17 etc etc. So dont take Superman's feats to mean Gladiator isnt a threat to the guy physically, i still maintain he is faster, add to that his martial skills and he can give Superman a serious hurting.