Superboy Prime vs Avengers, Annihilators, Justice league

Round 1: Superboy Prime (Solar Suit allowed)

Round 2: Superman Prime

vs

Annihilators:

Silver Surfer, Quasar, Gladiator, Beta Ray Bill, Ronan the accuser

Avengers:

Thor, Banner Hulk, Hyperion, Iron Man, Cap

Justice League: (new 52/rebirth)

Superman, Barry Allen, Martian Manhunter, Wonder Woman, Batman (Justice buster)

Rules:

• Prime is bloodlusted
• Team is morals off but not bloodlusted
• Random Encounter, fight on indestructible planet
• Win by any means
• Superboy prime is at full power but he is still wearing the solar suit
• No TP, no red sun radiation

Who wins and why?

Previous threads:

Surfer solos.

How?

I'm gonna back the team, that's a lot of powerhouses going against SBP at the same time

Molecular Manipulation/Transmutation, Energy Draining, vast speed advantage.

I think Surfer has other hax type advantages, but for now those 3 are good enough.

Both rounds?

Well, to be fair his suit will help him in resisting draining.

Any feats/statements that back up said statement?

If not, then Prime gets drained quite quickly.

And then there is Quasar on team as well, who is Marvel's ultimate energy drainer.

@lord_spectrum: Well, the solar suit supplies him solar energy. Superman and co said they needed to remove the suit and to make red sunlight bombardment work.

Not bad....but not good enough...considering that that suit simply absorbs insane amount of solar energy and stores it, the reason the RS wouldn't have been that effective would be because of the stored energy within the suit and Prime combined, which would take some time to vane, or maybe his suit can absorb and store solar energy from way vast distances than any Kryptonian biology, thus countering RS while absorbing solar light from stars far away, but that's just speculation from my part.

But as i can see, he doesn't have feats/statements of him being able to resist direct energy manipulation, especially someone of Surfer's caliber, who was capable of absorbing solar sytem level energies from Uni-Lord nigh-instantly, and then there is Quasar, who is better in energy draining area than Surfer.

Emoboy isn't winning this IMO. He more than likely gets drained

@apex_pretador: Is there really a noticeable difference between Superboy Prime and Superman Prime?

Superman prime looks noticeably older and better.

Emo boy will loose but unless you have OF Thor or above man prime will clear this.. He is too strong and powerful against anything less.

Have you seen Surfer's speed feats?

I know that Prime has quite an impressive ones, but still not on Surfer's caliber.

So travelling like 500.000 years in second or travelling to the end of the universe is not impressive?

He also can go so fast that his speed defies description in human terms and breaks the time barrier to time travel, which Prime can't even dream of being capable of.

Though, i am no Surfer expert, so i don't really know all of his feats and how fast he can really go or what he can do with his speed as well as many other things about Surfer.

@firsthunter:

It is impressive indeed.

But Prime is not faster than Flash, not even close.

He doesn't have speed to break time barrier and so on...

And was handily being blitzed by them, as well as consistently being speed tagged by Supermen.

If telepathy and energy draining of quasar/surfer is of prime should take this. Surfer is vulnerable to physical beating if punch is hard enough as preimperative gave him the beating. Although draining is kinda meh when it comes to prime as he was not drained by someone during coie, infinite crisis, legion of 3 worlds Only thing that drained him was superman pushing him into red sun which he didnt know was his weakness. Likes of monarch didnt drain him either. Not saying he couldnt, just saying he was never really been drained by someone that absorbs energy.

manprime was amped by guardian energy, although he tanked universe blasting attack even when energy had worn of. So it was never really specified how guardian energy affects him.

Its imprssive indeed. Sure it is

Depends on what flash you are talking about, secondly it took 5 speedsters to push prime into speed force and he was not having solar absorbing suit yet. Jay garrick, wally west and bart allen couldnt speed blitz him. Even when bart allen absorbed whole speed force he couldnt put prime down and in terms of speed still prime held his own.

"he doesnt have speed to break time barrier" Im dying of laughter. he is far above that. Per crisis superman stated that prime was way faster than himself that surely dont matter. Besides one punched and broke reality itseld and changed timelines brought back robin back to life.

"handlidly blitzed by them" When? beeing speed tagged by superman? when? He only fought post crisis superman and nearly murdered him before lanterns came for safe, killed of golden age superman and that was after he got red sun dipped.

He soloed pretty much everyone on good side on earth including manhunter, powergirl, supermen, lantern corps and list goes on. During legion of 3 worlds nobody could stop him and they tricked his stupidity to punch timetrapper and alter reality of himself.

@supermanforever: That is correct.

why is thor here he can't even hit daredevil

Morals off Cap solos

@supermanforever: Wally could stomp SBP alone without PIS.

Wally couldn't blitz SBP because he was running as fast as Jay Garrick, all the fights against Flash characters were PIS. Having more Speed Force doesn't make characters faster as we have seen from before. Wally mainlines Speed Force, he has the strongest connection to it, no Speed Force user can be ever faster than him, he achieved Speed Force Nirvana. Bart was slow in "Fastest Man Alive" story where he also absorbed the entire Speed Force. Speed comes from the ability to manipulate Speed Force and draw more speed from it where Wally is the best of the Flashes.

On Topic:

SBP gets stomped both rounds. Especially second round where Quasar and SS can just drain him instantly.

SBP could stomp all of these characters 1v1, but this team is just way too much, he has been beaten by less.

Thor isn't fighting daredevil.

The teams win but take a lot of deaths

Surfer and flash MVP he either get drained from surfer or thrown in the speed force by flash

Team both rounds with lots more casualties in round 2

@firsthunter:

Then why has he blitzed them

He didn't blitz them, this is what he did, he simply started randomly punching at super-speed.

And Flashes weren't using their FULL speed.

And consistency shows that he is way slower than them.

Flash stated he wasn't fast enough for Prime?

You need to recheck the comic, Wally West never stated that he was not fast enough for Prime. Also most of the fights against Flashes was PIS, Prime had thick plot armor. And the comic was contradicting many things about Flashes, like how speed force works for example and etc...

Prime has been bltized by Post-Crisis Supes and Earth 2 Supes.

Was blitzed again in Sinestro Corps arc by Superman:

Gallery

And this time in SC arc, he couldn't do what he did to Flashes(who were not running at full speed) during Infinite Crisis, he couldn't outpunch them in superspeed punching, so used his flight to get into another location, since he wasn't fast enough to fight them on their own turf a.k.a superspeed:

Was blitzed by Flashes who were running at SpeedForce barrier speed.

http://imgur.com/a/fzbJS#0

Was blitzed by Bart Allen, who returned as Kid Flash, and was at his Kid Flash power-level again.

Gallery

Consistency shows Prime being way slower than Flashes, but faster than Supermen, but not fast enough to break time/dimensional barriers via speed, unlike Surfer, who has done that.

And Prime has never even attempted to break the time barrier via speed.

Nor he has any showings to support that he can do that.

@supermanforever:

@sirneko: replied to your post, i agree with what he was saying about Flashes.

@firsthunter:

He counter blitzed them and forced them away

They were not using their full speed, so it's not that really matters. And in another instance during SC arc he couldn't do that to Flashes while they were blitzing him, and considering Jay was keeping up with Flash, which shows that Flashes were not using full speed, again.

Proof?

Simple, Jay was keeping up with Flashes quite handily, which shows that they were not using full speed, and far from it, since it taxes Jay to move at fast speeds, and in those instances he was not taxed at all. And Jay, while fast, is among the slowest Flashes.

My bad, just another Flash stated that.

Parrallel version, who hasn't known Wally West long enough to full determine his speed powers, and that parallel version literally contradicts how speed force works, you don't need more speed force to move faster, but your skill with it makes you faster, and there are other contradictions as well.

That's more like being bullrushed and restrained.

At first he was blitzed then the rest.

And Supeman replicated blitzing during SC arc.

Seems more like your own Interpretation. It never states he couldn't have fought them, he just didn't choose to.

Nor does it state that he could.

He didn't choose to because he couldn't, if he was fast enough or at least close to their level of speed he would have thrown some superspeed punches like before, but he couldn't, because this time Flashes were moving faster, plain and simple.

Proof?

It's up to you to show scans of Prime breaking time/dimensional barriers in order to prove that he can accomplish such feats.

And as far as i know he hasn't done any of that, and that's my proof.

Based on what?

@firsthunter:

Where does it state this?

It doesn't state, but it is kinda obvious, and i already explained that.

Let's be fair, Jay is one of the Flashes and at his peak has been portrayed as on par with the other Flashes (although slower)

Jay is not on par with other Flashes, far from it.

And he was far from his peak during his fights against Prime.

This is not valid proof to prove he was wrong.

It is actually, just deal with it.

There's a difference between being blitzed and bullrushed.

Still involved SuperSpeed, still Prime couldn't use his speed to evade those attacks from Superman, TWICE, and that's consistency.

Nor does it state he couldn't.

Yet, it was shown that their speed overhelmed him in the scan, same thing happened in Lo3W when Bart did the same thing to Prime, and he couldn't counterpunch him.

Where does it state this?

It doesn't state.

It is simply clear from the scan.

Or he just choose to bullrush them.

More like trying to go airborne, so they wouldn't get him. And it was not the speed that made Flash nigh-fall, it was Prime's strength which left a crater around them, and if writers didn't ignore physics, probably a shockwave too.

Also the same thing happened during Legion of 3 World, Bart was easily blitzing the hell out of Prime, while he couldn't land an attack on him, which kinda showcases that he is not really that fast.

I want proof, not your opinion.

Just look at the scans, all the proof is there.

How much speed does this require? It is completely unquantifable.

How much? The speed that literally can't be measured by science.

@lord_spectrum:

It doesn't state, but it is kinda obvious, and i already explained that.

So just your interpenetration.

Jay is not on par with other Flashes, far from it.

At his peak he is somewhat.

And he was far from his peak during his fights against Prime.

Proof?

It is actually, just deal with it.

It isn't actually, just deal with it.

Still involved SuperSpeed, still Prime couldn't use his speed to evade those attacks from Superman

That's true, he didn't avoid the bullrush.

Yet, it was shown that their speed overhelmed him in the scan

They were punching him for one panel and then he bullrushed them using speed.

It is simply clear from the scan.

So just your interpenetration.

which kinda showcases that he is not really that fast.

That's a low-showing, need I bring up Surfer's low showings?

Just look at the scans, all the proof is there.

It doesn't show half the things you claim.

The speed that literally can't be measured by science.

Proof and what kind of speed is that?

@lord_spectrum: Bart is the fastest Flash. Being blitzed by him is not a low showing.

That's bart as kid flash though, not flash. He was slower as kid flash.

That isn't what happened. Surfer was already combined with a blackbody and infused with the soul of millions when he took on Uni-Lord, after Pradda Fol took his place in the congregation.

Gallery

@apex_pretador: Eh true. But for both instances, Prime was either:

A) In close range of Bart.

B) Suffering from Flashphobia.

@firsthunter:

So just your interpenetration.

Dude, no offence, but use your logic, one of slowest Flashes(garrick) was keeping up with Flashed in those scans, it by default shows Flash were not using their full speed.

At his peak he is somewhat.

Lightspeed, and that's his MAX speed.

At regular basis he is around Mach 500 or so, without taxing himself.

Proof?

Because he was old, lol. Jay Garrick's peak is when he was young. His old age doesn't allow him to run fast because it taxes him and might even give him heart attack/kill him, according to him.

And I can clearly see you don't have enough knowledge about Flashes especially Garrick.

It isn't actually, just deal with it.

Then prove it, lol.

That's true, he didn't avoid the bullrush.

Twice.

Not so fast after all.

They were punching him for one panel and then he bullrushed them using speed.

Yet, if he was fast, he would simply go into superspeed punchfest with them, but he didn't.

And considering Jay was keeping up quite handily again, it shows that Flash were moving far from their full speed.

So just your interpenetration.

Not really, the scan shows that he is overhelmed by their speed, and he chooses to use flight and strength to get out of it.

That's a low-showing, need I bring up Surfer's low showings?

Prime doesn't have many appearances, and considering what showings he had, it is consistent, since he was overhelmed him by their speed in SC arc, and Flash was moving at Jay-level speed, who is essentially matched by Pre-52 Superman in running speed(yep, that happened), that's already twice of him being overhelmed by blitzes from Flashes, that's consistency, deal with it.

While Surfer has decades worth of showings, he obviously has inconsistent low-showings.

It doesn't show half the things you claim.

Oh really?

Then why does Prime looked overhemled by their speed, and the only to get out of it used strength and flight.

Proof and what kind of speed is that?

Immeasurable by science.

But if he was as fast as flash, he won't have any "flashphobia".

@citizensurfer:

My bad, i already said that i am no Surfer expert and far from it.

But anyways, thanks for clarification.

@apex_pretador: Um... What?

I don't think you get why he has Flashphobia. He was trapped in the Speedforce by the entire Flash Family. Even being equal in speed if you have one or more characters with speed equal or close to your own you don't have much of a chance.

@lord_spectrum:

it by default shows Flash were not using their full speed.

Or Jay was being portrayed at a very high level. There's no reason they would hold back.

Lightspeed, and that's his MAX speed.

At his max he's moved within Nanoseconds.

Because he was old, lol. Jay Garrick's peak is when he was young. His old age doesn't allow him to run fast because it taxes him and might even give him heart attack/kill him, according to him.

You misunderstood me, I meant Jay was at his peak at the time.

Then prove it, lol.

Disprove it, lol.

Yet, if he was fast, he would simply go into superspeed punchfest with them, but he didn't.

They held his arms so he couldn't punch.

Not really, the scan shows that he is overhelmed by their speed, and he chooses to use flight and strength to get out of it.

Never shows he was "overhelmed" (it's overwhelmed lol)

Prime doesn't have many appearances, and considering what showings he had, it is consistent

Not really when you look at all his feats.

Then why does Prime looked overhemled by their speed, and the only to get out of it used strength and flight.

It's just your interpretation that he looked "overhelmed" and the only way he could get out was via strength and flight.

Immeasurable by science.

Proof and how fast is that?

He was trapped by not being as fast as them. Even Jay Garrick was able to keep up for some time with Bart and Wally trying to trap him in speedforce.

And kid flash Bart was taking him solo, blitzing him around in legion of 3 worlds and didn't get tagged once.

Who has superboy prime overwhelmed with speed to say he is as fast as flash? Or against who has he remained untagged?