Starfire and Blackfire vs Captain Marvel

Rules

Starfire and Blackfire have pre-52 and new 52 feat

Carol Danvers is not binary

Vs

I’d assume without Binary the team would take it. But I’ll rep Carol for now until I see something for the Tamaranneans

Carol but only due to energy absorbing

@emmafrostxmen: I thought Star and Blackfire could absorb energy too.

@gmorto: I think just solar energy

If they start shooting their star bolts they only going to make her more powerful

I think Team can pull a win if they fight together, with Carol's recent upgrades it won't be easy tho

I doubt they'd fire more than one bolt after seeing her absorb one. After that, they simply beat on her.

@romancyborg: As far as I know Carol is still physically stronger and possible more durable then both of them though

Only as Binary. She is most likely not gonna get there. I don't think they will use their bolts on her when they see her absorb it.

She is going down unless she goes Binary, which she isn't gonna be able to do here. Although, she might now be able to go Binary without absorbing, in which case, she should win. Other than that, no she isn't.

That’s not true at all atleast I’m missing something neither of the team have feats to suggest they can lift one city sized object let alone do it several times over. Carol did that outside Binary

Also she has shown energy absorption without going Binary she did it in Mighty Avengers when she hit Sentry

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11124/111244877/6014771-20170820_031247.jpg

https://m.imgur.com/a/vnHxE

Team

Reasons?

@ecstaticgrace: I have none :)

@ecstaticgrace: tbh maybe because I get triggered Everytime I see Carol lol

Hm. I would argue that Carol could take them in a 1v1 for a majority, but 2v1 she loses more often than not, if the Tamaraneans don't feed her energy first

@hyoname:

@ecstaticgrace: thanks bro

@rac95: How Do they compete with her strength advantage?

@ecstaticgrace: Probably by slightly superior speed and the resulting chance of simultanous attacks due to the 2v1 advantage.

They won't win a 1v1 against Carol nowadays

@rac95: Whatre the speed feats for the team?

couldnt Carol counter 2 on 1 with AOE and energy blast?

@ecstaticgrace: Doing things like equally fighting Donna Troy and other persons in that weight class in terms of speed

I have never seen Carol actually using an AoE around her and a blast in one direction wouĺd leave her completely open to the other sister

@rac95: I feel like you could scale or make a lot of characters speedsters doing that.

In regards to speed though.

https://m.imgur.com/a/MVDHc

Ronan’s been able to

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11124/111244877/5621618-2313127-silver_surfer_1988__013_15.jpg

Surfer’s faster than Donna.

Carol also has showings blitzing people

or crossing cities within panels in fights

I don’t see the team having a speed advantage

I’ll look for some energy blast stuff for Carol but she has two hands and she’s fighting two people. Not to mention her danger sense, and the fact she’s fought multiple before in fights

@ecstaticgrace: I don't think that it is possible to argue Carol at constabt Silver Surfer speed though. There are a lot more instances against that. Her constant feats put her more at Iron Man+ speed.

BTW does she even has this danger sense nowadays? I've never seen it in use since she "became" Captain Marvel and even before that the use of it was potrayed less and less, unlike Peters spider-sense for example

@rac95: You could make the same argument for Superman, Troia, Starfire or Wonder Woman in regards to speed. If we weighed the amount of times they didnt fight at FTL to the amount of times they did. I dont even know if I’d agree on Kori or Donna being at that level of speed.

We’ve seen Carol fight at high speeds before too

Ironman isn’t a slow character either. He has nanosecond processing speed. As well as has fought at high speeds before in scans I’ve seen against a character called Mallen.

I think her danger sense is brought up every once in awhile as a reference or to pay tribute. But I can’t really remember it being used as Captain Marvel. I’ll see if I can find something though.

@ecstaticgrace: It was more in the direction that Starfire/Blackfire are "constantly" around persons like Donna, whilst Carol having comparable speed to Silver Surfer is (right now) more of an outlier.

The comment about Iron Man wasn't meant to discredit Carols speed, it's just that Iron Man<Norrin Radd on a constant basis.

What I wanted to say after all is that (right now) both sisters have a slightly higher base speed based on feats over the years (different versions). It'll change probably though if I look at the way Carol is portrayed nowadays

I just asked about the danger sense since I haven't seen it being used in a long time (I couldn't even think of a recent event)

@rac95: Do the sisters actually have any high combat speed feats outside having to rely on another character.

If you look at a lot of the Ironman fights it involve Carol’s dodging a lot of his attacks.

@ecstaticgrace: Got to look for non-scaling combat speed feats

I know that Carols fights against Iron Man are pretty good feats, but I just think that there is a big gap between dodging Iron Man and having comparable speed to the Silver Surfer

@rac95: There’s statements and instances like this as well

Dodging an attack the other Avengers failed too

https://m.imgur.com/a/XYitFC8

Second to Quicksilver in a training exercise

https://i.imgur.com/BSd3uAF_d.jpg?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

She’s also dodged Tachyon blast. I think having a villain fire it at her.

@ecstaticgrace: I can't find independet speed feats outside of travel speed right now, but I'll try to search for them.

Even if you rely on scaling though the constant level would allow to argue a 2v1 vicory at 5.5-6/10, but I agree that 1v1 is Carol in most of the fights

@rac95: I can’t really agree with the sisters having a speed advantage. They just have a luxury of having people in their universe that are speedsters (keypoint though is if they choose to be)

I could make a argument for Aquaman being light speed if I brought up all the times he dodged blows from S-Tiers or perceived hits. Battle Forums won’t have it cause he has no FTL combat feats on his own merit

I don’t see why there’d be an exception for the sisters here

I tried to look for feats for them to and unless RT’s missed something Carol honestly holds a speed advantage on top of her strength advantage. I don’t even think Starfire blitzes as often as Carol has

Could someone tell me how strong Starfire is, I've heard she has class 100 strength, and I've read a couple of comics she has appeared in and I have never seen something suggesting she's class 100.

@gmorto: she's a bit above Donna Troy

@gmorto: Her best strength feat I’ve seen was picking up a cruise ship or something along of those lines during a storm. Everything else is scaling off other characters who scale off other characters.

Currently Starfire is a NewGod though.

@cruelrain: are there any feats? What about Blackfire is she class 100 also?

@ecstaticgrace: an average cruise ship is 20,000 to 60,000 tons. That's an impressive feat for Starfire.

@cruelrain: @ecstaticgrace: So if Starfire is a class 100+ then shouldn't Blackfire be one also, I've read Blackfire is stronger and her bolts are more powerful than Starfire

@ecstaticgrace: a new god? When that happen!?

Carol lifted something city size though and did it repeatedly. As impressive as the Starfire feat is it doesnt match the below link

https://imgur.com/gallery/Lsv1fAT

Those bolts would just amp Carol she’s an energy absorber

Justice League Odyssey, I’m not sure what issue cause I’m behind on the series @ashrym is the one to ask

@ecstaticgrace: Surely they won't keep blasting if they see their bolts are not affecting her. They will just have to rely on h2h combat.

@gmorto: They power her up its game over right there. She turns Binary then the stat difference grows even moreso.

If their blast are stronger than their physicals I don’t even see what they do after giving her a power increase.

She also returns energy “with interest” after absorbing it

@edgelord91: The transformation started in JL Odyssey no. 2 and completed in JL Odyssey no. 12.

She represents power in Darkseid's ideology. Cyborg represents technology and Azrael represents faith. All three became New Gods.

@gmorto: Starfire's best lifting feat I have seen is an ocean ferry.

@ecstaticgrace: anyone have a scan for the cruise ship?

@edgelord91: Ashrym posted it in another thread I’d ask him or check his images

Wouldn’t they just power each other if they blasted one another?

@kasya_carey: Technically yes, but in the end Carol is the better energy manipulator if she reaches Binary-levels. At that point she converted 81% of a singularity into energy

@ecstaticgrace: Thank you

@kasya_carey: I think Starfire only absorbs Solar energy. Carol’s photon blast should be light based

Team Tamaran. They're Kryptonian level and thus above Carol.

@ecstaticgrace: I thought solar energy was light and heat from the sun?