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#151 Posted by Edgeworth_11 (5235 posts) - - Show Bio
@god_spawn said:
@Edgeworth_11: No he wouldnt be able to tell the difference, he is not even allowed to think before the match starts. He has no way of telling Peter is bloodlusted, if you want to pull out some BS reason that he can't die to "fodder" like Spider-Man who is one Marvel's most established iconic characters I won't even bother responding to you. What Cyclops is matters nothing here, he has no prep, no knowledge about Parker being  bloodlusted. yeah I'm sure his "spatial awareness tells him right? That he can tell Parker is bloodlusted even though he hides his face completely behind a mask? Right? Am I right? I'll break this down one more time just for you though I've repeated it for pages and paragraphs.   1) Scott has no knowledge. He cannot come up with a plan due to not having prep and he cannot even think before the fight starts. He has no knowledge of Parker being bloodlusted, he cannot tell, why should he? Because you say so? Even though Parker is hidden completely behind a mask. So no, he will start the fight like he always does. Slim beams of normal power and even if he has a chance to come up with a plan, he will try to use what he knows of what Parker normally does which already sets him at a disadvantage. Spider-Man is not an X-men, he does not know Spider-Man's limits like he does of everyone of his, he has no info, no basis, no profile on Spider-Man to keep up in his head, especially a bloodlusted one. 2) This whole one shot business you keep going on about. Scott respects Spider-man, he does not know his limits and will try and think and gauge his durability and go with the least amount of force to KO him, again he is not an X-men, he does not know his limits like he does of all the X-men. You read alot of X-men, now think about it.  3 )So you brought up blade which you used out of context. They start close due to no given starting distance, Scott can fire, Parker can dodge, don't even bother bringing up Quicksilver or Nightcrawler cause I already told you that about 2 pages full along with MZombieX. Scott does not start fights with a wide blast, he usually goes slim for a more powerful blast. And in that scene, he told blade to stand down constantly which gave him a chance to think and fire at Blade in order to keep his promise to Dracula.  4) No time to think. This fight starts close. You blab on and on about he will keep firing, he won't even get the chance. He will start with a slim beam, and by the time he fires, Parker can dodge, and one shot him.   Cyclops is cool and is one of my fave Marvel characters and has finally become the BA leader the X-men need thanks to Emma,  but you need to quit your fanboying. For the months you've been here you just fanboy the X-men and so far  I've put up with it, now it's just trolling. If you reply to me again fanboying Cyclops without contributing to debate other than Cyclops wins because of him being a mutant messiah and low browing other characters, I'm reporting you. This bs has gone on long enough.
I am not trolling. cyclops comes up with plans on the fly. he would tell a blood lusted enemy right away. he is that smart. you have your theories, I have mine. Being iconic and popular has nothing to do with it. 
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#152 Edited by God_Spawn (42823 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edgeworth_11: Yeah you are. You have no argument what so ever that I have not countered. He has no way to tell Spider-man is bloodlusted until it's too late, and what plan is he gonna come up with huh? "Something on the fly" right?  Spider-man won't be pulling punches Scott will, quit fanboying.
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#153 Posted by AtheneOwnsYou (119 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edgeworth_11 said:
@god_spawn said:
@Edgeworth_11: No he wouldnt be able to tell the difference, he is not even allowed to think before the match starts. He has no way of telling Peter is bloodlusted, if you want to pull out some BS reason that he can't die to "fodder" like Spider-Man who is one Marvel's most established iconic characters I won't even bother responding to you. What Cyclops is matters nothing here, he has no prep, no knowledge about Parker being  bloodlusted. yeah I'm sure his "spatial awareness tells him right? That he can tell Parker is bloodlusted even though he hides his face completely behind a mask? Right? Am I right? I'll break this down one more time just for you though I've repeated it for pages and paragraphs.   1) Scott has no knowledge. He cannot come up with a plan due to not having prep and he cannot even think before the fight starts. He has no knowledge of Parker being bloodlusted, he cannot tell, why should he? Because you say so? Even though Parker is hidden completely behind a mask. So no, he will start the fight like he always does. Slim beams of normal power and even if he has a chance to come up with a plan, he will try to use what he knows of what Parker normally does which already sets him at a disadvantage. Spider-Man is not an X-men, he does not know Spider-Man's limits like he does of everyone of his, he has no info, no basis, no profile on Spider-Man to keep up in his head, especially a bloodlusted one. 2) This whole one shot business you keep going on about. Scott respects Spider-man, he does not know his limits and will try and think and gauge his durability and go with the least amount of force to KO him, again he is not an X-men, he does not know his limits like he does of all the X-men. You read alot of X-men, now think about it.  3 )So you brought up blade which you used out of context. They start close due to no given starting distance, Scott can fire, Parker can dodge, don't even bother bringing up Quicksilver or Nightcrawler cause I already told you that about 2 pages full along with MZombieX. Scott does not start fights with a wide blast, he usually goes slim for a more powerful blast. And in that scene, he told blade to stand down constantly which gave him a chance to think and fire at Blade in order to keep his promise to Dracula.  4) No time to think. This fight starts close. You blab on and on about he will keep firing, he won't even get the chance. He will start with a slim beam, and by the time he fires, Parker can dodge, and one shot him.   Cyclops is cool and is one of my fave Marvel characters and has finally become the BA leader the X-men need thanks to Emma,  but you need to quit your fanboying. For the months you've been here you just fanboy the X-men and so far  I've put up with it, now it's just trolling. If you reply to me again fanboying Cyclops without contributing to debate other than Cyclops wins because of him being a mutant messiah and low browing other characters, I'm reporting you. This bs has gone on long enough.
I am not trolling. cyclops comes up with plans on the fly. he would tell a blood lusted enemy right away. he is that smart. you have your theories, I have mine. Being iconic and popular has nothing to do with it. 
Huh? By the time scott realizes that spidey is bloodlusted, scott would be dead i believe
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#154 Posted by OhItsThatGuy (798 posts) - - Show Bio

He probably stops at five, if morals are on. He stops at three, if off.
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#155 Edited by Thepowercosmic (955 posts) - - Show Bio
@demifiend: Thanx he is going to give AM a hell of a fight
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#156 Posted by Edgeworth_11 (5235 posts) - - Show Bio
@god_spawn said:
@Edgeworth_11: Yeah you are. You have no argument what so ever that I have not countered. He has no way to tell Spider-man is bloodlusted until it's too late, and what plan is he gonna come up with huh? "Something on the fly" right?  Spider-man won't be pulling punches Scott will, quit fanboying.
I don't have to agree with your counter argument do I? Nope, didn't think so. Doesn't mean I am trolling. I am not shoving my opinion down your throat so please don't do that to me.
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#157 Posted by Death Certificate (5720 posts) - - Show Bio

Stop at Aquaman. 
 
I'm too lazy atm to explain why.
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#158 Posted by OptimusPalm (2328 posts) - - Show Bio

i agree with everybody that said he stops at Aquaman. It starts off quite easy for him, but the last fight he has no chance of winning

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#159 Posted by MagnusTheMagnificent (263 posts) - - Show Bio

Spider-man would be able to dodge the initial blast from Cyclops thanks to his reflexes, agility and Spider-sense. 
That is, if Cyclops gets in the first shot. Spider-man is faster than Cyclops.
While dodging, he would be firing his webs at Cyclops.
A webbed-up Cyclops is easy pickings for Spider-man.

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#160 Edited by God_Spawn (42823 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edgeworth_11: No it's not that you don't have to agree, it's you won't because the X-man loses. This is a debate forum, and that's exactly what I am doing. You post and post the same irrelevant nonsense that you do in everyother X-men thread, X-man wins, X-man wins. Just like Namor vs Power girl a couple months back. You said Namor wins even though PG has more powers, is better, faster, and stronger than Namor and has shown better feats even while he was under water. You then retorted that Namor wins because you called PG a whore. Real mature, you just can't stand watching an X-man lose. 
 
Your points are the same constantly, Scott comes up with plans on the fly. Explain how. He will notice how Parker is bloodlusted as soon as it starts even though he wears a mask. Explain how. You assume he will one shot him. Explain why. You compared Spider-Man to Blade durability wise, then when asked for feats you didn't provide anything. You then stated Scott will keep firing and firing like he has some kind of distance advantage at the start that Parker can't clear. It's like you expect Spider-Man is just gonna stand there because you want Cyclops to win
 
I've provided a reason and counter to each of your points. It's like you just throw the OP out the window so the X-man can win. I'm not forcing you to debate, but I'm not giving you the satisfaction of just walking away with an agree to disagree. This is a debate forum, not a fanboy forum. We are debaters and so far you haven't given anything to thread that gives Cyclops a reason why he wins. No proof, no reasons, no nothing. If you want to keep responding to me, then provide some proof for once instead of X-man A B or C wins because you want him to.
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#161 Posted by Edgeworth_11 (5235 posts) - - Show Bio
@god_spawn said:
@Edgeworth_11: No it's not that you don't have to agree, it's you won't because the X-man loses. This is a debate forum, and that's exactly what I am doing. You post and post the same irrelevant nonsense that you do in everyother X-men thread, X-man wins, X-man wins. Just like Namor vs Power girl a couple months back. You said Namor wins even though PG has more powers, is better, faster, and stronger than Namor and has shown better feats even while he was under water. You then retorted that Namor wins because you called PG a whore. Real mature, you just can't stand watching an X-man lose.   Your points are the same constantly, Scott comes up with plans on the fly. Explain how. He will notice how Parker is bloodlusted as soon as it starts even though he wears a mask. Explain how. You assume he will one shot him. Explain why. You compared Spider-Man to Blade durability wise, then when asked for feats you didn't provide anything. You then stated Scott will keep firing and firing like he has some kind of distance advantage at the start that Parker can't clear. It's like you expect Spider-Man is just gonna stand there because you want Cyclops to win I've provided a reason and counter to each of your points. It's like you just throw the OP out the window so the X-man can win. I'm not forcing you to debate, but I'm not giving you the satisfaction of just walking away with an agree to disagree. This is a debate forum, not a fanboy forum. We are debaters and so far you haven't given anything to thread that gives Cyclops a reason why he wins. No proof, no reasons, no nothing. If you want to keep responding to me, then provide some proof for once instead of X-man A B or C wins because you want him to.
You can say you counter my arguement, but I don't see it this way. Spidy is a wisecracker. WHen he is not making jokes, Scott would realize something is different. Even before that, a blood lusted opponent is obvious to see. He would be trying different tactics and Scott would see it.  
 
It's just my opinion Cyclops wins. if he is tougher than Blade ( I dont think so) it is not by much. His durability is somewhere between Beast and Blade. Cyclops took out Beast, one of his best friends, with a single shot. 
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#162 Posted by God_Spawn (42823 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edgeworth_11
 

You can say you counter my arguement, but I don't see it this way. Spidy is a wisecracker. WHen he is not making jokes, Scott would realize something is different. Even before that, a blood lusted opponent is obvious to see. He would be trying different tactics and Scott would see it.

Have you heard nothing I have said? Scott has no time to analyze his opponent. Get it through your head, I've said this for 4 pages.
 

It's just my opinion Cyclops wins. if he is tougher than Blade ( I dont think so) it is not by much. His durability is somewhere between Beast and Blade. Cyclops took out Beast, one of his best friends, with a single shot.

Again I must repeat myself with you, twice in the same response. Spider-Man is not an X-men what Scott has done to any one of the X-men is irrelevant, post something that actually can provide a legitimate reason.
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#163 Posted by Edgeworth_11 (5235 posts) - - Show Bio
@god_spawn said:
@Edgeworth_11
 

You can say you counter my arguement, but I don't see it this way. Spidy is a wisecracker. WHen he is not making jokes, Scott would realize something is different. Even before that, a blood lusted opponent is obvious to see. He would be trying different tactics and Scott would see it.

Have you heard nothing I have said? Scott has no time to analyze his opponent. Get it through your head, I've said this for 4 pages.
 

It's just my opinion Cyclops wins. if he is tougher than Blade ( I dont think so) it is not by much. His durability is somewhere between Beast and Blade. Cyclops took out Beast, one of his best friends, with a single shot.

Again I must repeat myself with you, twice in the same response. Spider-Man is not an X-men what Scott has done to any one of the X-men is irrelevant, post something that actually can provide a legitimate reason.  
 
You making me repeat my reasons again? Well, this is getting boring. My opinion hasn't changed.
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#164 Posted by icec0ld (1048 posts) - - Show Bio
@god_spawn
 
 
Your problem is you are completely disregarding the characters you listed ability to defend themselves. Especailly in the case of Cyclops, lets say he can't tell Peter is blood lusted right away. Does he not know that he is in a combat situation? According to your rules he does is he really just going to let Peter hit him? No he isnt he is going to blast him. Maybe your right he doesnt hit him hard because he is in character and hits him with a simple beam. What you fail to acknowledge is that most all of cyclops beams are strong enough to at least knock Peter off his feet. How many times would Cyclops knock Peter off his feet before he realized Peter was trying to kill him. Wouldnt take much, a screaming spider man charging at you your going to take a litte more seriously and turn up the heat. Why dont you just say you staged this so that there would be no way anyone could win but failed at doing that. He dies at Cyclops.
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#165 Edited by demifiend (3761 posts) - - Show Bio

if spiderman is close enough to cyclops and hit him, can ko inmediately 
i dont know if cyclops would be fast enough to react a bloodlusted spidey!

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#166 Posted by Edgeworth_11 (5235 posts) - - Show Bio
@Pantherman said:
@god_spawn:   Your problem is you are completely disregarding the characters you listed ability to defend themselves. Especailly in the case of Cyclops, lets say he can't tell Peter is blood lusted right away. Does he not know that he is in a combat situation? According to your rules he does is he really just going to let Peter hit him? No he isnt he is going to blast him. Maybe your right he doesnt hit him hard because he is in character and hits him with a simple beam. What you fail to acknowledge is that most all of cyclops beams are strong enough to at least knock Peter off his feet. How many times would Cyclops knock Peter off his feet before he realized Peter was trying to kill him. Wouldnt take much, a screaming spider man charging at you your going to take a litte more seriously and turn up the heat. Why dont you just say you staged this so that there would be no way anyone could win but failed at doing that. He dies at Cyclops.
Respect.
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#167 Posted by Gnarly_Artist (66 posts) - - Show Bio

Deadpool has already gotten all kinds of beat up by Spider-Man in his own series and had could not manage to harm or slow down Spider-Man with bullets.  "Damn you're fast" were the words I believe.  He is a world class mercenary and knows how to shoot to kill,  Cyclops goes down before he gets a second shot off.  Slade is awesome but cannot outclass Spidey without prep.  After seeing earlier scans I would say Spidey goes down at Aquaman with a thought.  Physically though, I want to see that fight.

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#168 Posted by kheranlord12 (1304 posts) - - Show Bio
@Silver2467:  You do release that the way you respone to people arouse aggressive behaviour.
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#169 Posted by Edgeworth_11 (5235 posts) - - Show Bio
@warlord1234 said:
@Silver2467:  You do release that the way you respone to people arouse aggressive behaviour.
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#170 Posted by madrid_san (2199 posts) - - Show Bio
@demifiend said:
ISNT CYCLOPS just a human, i mean very prepared and has good training but his only power is his eyes beams, right? he is not as skilled or strong as captain america to say this is difficult to spiderman.
WTF? You seriously underestimate Cyclops don't you? His power is incredible. Did you know he is practically a walking nuke as Logan describes him? All it will take is one blast to end this fight. 
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#171 Edited by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@Pantherman said:

@god_spawn:   Your problem is you are completely disregarding the characters you listed ability to defend themselves. Especailly in the case of Cyclops, lets say he can't tell Peter is blood lusted right away. Does he not know that he is in a combat situation? According to your rules he does is he really just going to let Peter hit him? No he isnt he is going to blast him. Maybe your right he doesnt hit him hard because he is in character and hits him with a simple beam. What you fail to acknowledge is that most all of cyclops beams are strong enough to at least knock Peter off his feet. How many times would Cyclops knock Peter off his feet before he realized Peter was trying to kill him. Wouldnt take much, a screaming spider man charging at you your going to take a litte more seriously and turn up the heat. Why dont you just say you staged this so that there would be no way anyone could win but failed at doing that. He dies at Cyclops.

Setting aside the fact that you posted a complete strawman argument of everything God_Spawn said, you still are not acknowledging that Cylcops has no time for any of this. Spider-Man is too fast for him and can one-shot him effortlessly, and given that the OP provided no indication of how far apart the combatants start from one another, then they begin a short distance apart as per battle forum rules. Spider-Man can evade his blast and rush him. It is very simple. He could also just use his webbing to drag Cyclops to him or throw him with enough impact to kill him. You assume that a "screaming Spider-Man charging at you" grants enough time for Cyclops to actually respond. Even assuming he let off a first shot, Parker can dodge that and close the gap. This is also assuming that "morals off" is the equivalent of bloodlusted, which is not the case. Spider-Man has cut loose his morals in combat before, and what actually happened is that he spoke and shouted less, not more (as when he beat on Shriek and Carrion and on another occasion against Kingpin, as a couple examples). This does not afford enough of a warning that Spider-Man is operating without his usual moral constrictions, which is the only circumstance that would allow Cyclops to fire a shot powerful enough to one-shot him. He just is not prepared to do that under a normal situation where his own morals apply. And who would actually make the first move? The one with superhuman speed who can out-react bullets effortlessly and maintain pace with cars on foot? Or the physically non-metahuman one who needs to modify the intensity of his blast by manipulating settings on his visor? Hint: Spider-Man has blitzed physically non-metahuman characters before.
 
Spider-Man still beats him under this scenario.
 

@warlord1234

said:

@Silver2467:  You do release that the way you respone to people arouse aggressive behaviour.

You do realize (not "release") that the way you responded to this thread contributes nothing to the discussion and is just trolling. 
 
I really am not concerned with how my posts are interpreted by known fanboys. The point will never be set across in a way that they accept; so forgive my failure to dignify them with the same concern I would give a user who bothers to approach the topic reasonably. There are several users, myself included, who debate aggressively; that by itself is not a sign of disparagement or disrespect. And if you dislike that, you do not have to reply to me. What I have no respect for is users who adhere to a line of thinking that their own favorite character(s) win in every thread they are involved in and, in turn, spam nonsense that wastes the thread for users interested in logical assessment. On that note, you are not helping move this debate along and are only multiplying the number of meaningless posts on this thread. So if you have something pertinent to add to this discussion, please feel free. Don't just jump in here and whine about whatever problems you have with me. I will not take your complaining seriously anyway. 
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#172 Posted by kheranlord12 (1304 posts) - - Show Bio
@Silver2467 said:
@Pantherman said:

@god_spawn:   Your problem is you are completely disregarding the characters you listed ability to defend themselves. Especailly in the case of Cyclops, lets say he can't tell Peter is blood lusted right away. Does he not know that he is in a combat situation? According to your rules he does is he really just going to let Peter hit him? No he isnt he is going to blast him. Maybe your right he doesnt hit him hard because he is in character and hits him with a simple beam. What you fail to acknowledge is that most all of cyclops beams are strong enough to at least knock Peter off his feet. How many times would Cyclops knock Peter off his feet before he realized Peter was trying to kill him. Wouldnt take much, a screaming spider man charging at you your going to take a litte more seriously and turn up the heat. Why dont you just say you staged this so that there would be no way anyone could win but failed at doing that. He dies at Cyclops.

Setting aside the fact that you posted a complete strawman argument of everything God_Spawn said, you still are not acknowledging that Cylcops has no time for any of this. Spider-Man is too fast for him and can one-shot him effortlessly, and given that the OP provided no indication of how far apart the combatants start from one another, then they begin a short distance apart as per battle forum rules. Spider-Man can evade his blast and rush him. It is very simple. He could also just use his webbing to drag Cyclops to him or throw him with enough impact to kill him. You assume that a "screaming Spider-Man charging at you" grants enough time for Cyclops to actually respond. Even assuming he let off a first shot, Parker can dodge that and close the gap. This is also assuming that "morals off" is the equivalent of bloodlusted, which is not the case. Spider-Man has cut loose his morals in combat before, and what actually happened is that he spoke and shouted less, not more (as when he beat on Shriek and Carrion and on another occasion against Kingpin, as a couple examples). This does not afford enough of a warning that Spider-Man is operating without his usual moral constrictions, which is the only circumstance that would allow Cyclops to fire a shot powerful enough to one-shot him. He just is not prepared to do that under a normal situation where his own morals apply. And who would actually make the first move? The one with superhuman speed who can out-react bullets effortlessly and maintain pace with cars on foot? Or the physically non-metahuman one who needs to modify the intensity of his blast by manipulating settings on his visor? Hint: Spider-Man has blitzed physically non-metahuman characters before.
 
Spider-Man still beats him under this scenario.
 

@warlord1234

said:

@Silver2467:  You do release that the way you respone to people arouse aggressive behaviour.

You do realize (not "release") that the way you responded to this thread contributes nothing to the discussion and is just trolling.  I really am not concerned with how my posts are interpreted by known fanboys. The point will never be set across in a way that they accept; so forgive my failure to dignify them with the same concern I would give a user who bothers to approach the topic reasonably. There are several users, myself included, who debate aggressively; that by itself is not a sign of disparagement or disrespect. And if you dislike that, you do not have to reply to me. What I have no respect for is users who adhere to a line of thinking that their own favorite character(s) win in every thread they are involved in and, in turn, spam nonsense that wastes the thread for users interested in logical assessment. On that note, you are not helping move this debate along and are only multiplying the number of meaningless posts on this thread. So if you have something pertinent to add to this discussion, please feel free. Don't just jump in here and whine about whatever problems you have with me. I will not take your complaining seriously anyway. 

First of all i not a troll. A troll is someone who start trouble just for the sake to annoy other people. It not in my nature to do that. I notice that you respond aggressively when you deabte with people especialy when they being polite with you. Human being are emtional ceatures they will respond if you act in certain way. I see nothing wrong with being aggressive if the user your debating with is using willful ignorance or if the user is lying in order to support they claims.
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#173 Posted by Edgeworth_11 (5235 posts) - - Show Bio
@warlord1234 said:
@Silver2467 said:
@Pantherman said:

@god_spawn:   Your problem is you are completely disregarding the characters you listed ability to defend themselves. Especailly in the case of Cyclops, lets say he can't tell Peter is blood lusted right away. Does he not know that he is in a combat situation? According to your rules he does is he really just going to let Peter hit him? No he isnt he is going to blast him. Maybe your right he doesnt hit him hard because he is in character and hits him with a simple beam. What you fail to acknowledge is that most all of cyclops beams are strong enough to at least knock Peter off his feet. How many times would Cyclops knock Peter off his feet before he realized Peter was trying to kill him. Wouldnt take much, a screaming spider man charging at you your going to take a litte more seriously and turn up the heat. Why dont you just say you staged this so that there would be no way anyone could win but failed at doing that. He dies at Cyclops.

Setting aside the fact that you posted a complete strawman argument of everything God_Spawn said, you still are not acknowledging that Cylcops has no time for any of this. Spider-Man is too fast for him and can one-shot him effortlessly, and given that the OP provided no indication of how far apart the combatants start from one another, then they begin a short distance apart as per battle forum rules. Spider-Man can evade his blast and rush him. It is very simple. He could also just use his webbing to drag Cyclops to him or throw him with enough impact to kill him. You assume that a "screaming Spider-Man charging at you" grants enough time for Cyclops to actually respond. Even assuming he let off a first shot, Parker can dodge that and close the gap. This is also assuming that "morals off" is the equivalent of bloodlusted, which is not the case. Spider-Man has cut loose his morals in combat before, and what actually happened is that he spoke and shouted less, not more (as when he beat on Shriek and Carrion and on another occasion against Kingpin, as a couple examples). This does not afford enough of a warning that Spider-Man is operating without his usual moral constrictions, which is the only circumstance that would allow Cyclops to fire a shot powerful enough to one-shot him. He just is not prepared to do that under a normal situation where his own morals apply. And who would actually make the first move? The one with superhuman speed who can out-react bullets effortlessly and maintain pace with cars on foot? Or the physically non-metahuman one who needs to modify the intensity of his blast by manipulating settings on his visor? Hint: Spider-Man has blitzed physically non-metahuman characters before.
 
Spider-Man still beats him under this scenario.
 

@warlord1234

said:

@Silver2467:  You do release that the way you respone to people arouse aggressive behaviour.

You do realize (not "release") that the way you responded to this thread contributes nothing to the discussion and is just trolling.  I really am not concerned with how my posts are interpreted by known fanboys. The point will never be set across in a way that they accept; so forgive my failure to dignify them with the same concern I would give a user who bothers to approach the topic reasonably. There are several users, myself included, who debate aggressively; that by itself is not a sign of disparagement or disrespect. And if you dislike that, you do not have to reply to me. What I have no respect for is users who adhere to a line of thinking that their own favorite character(s) win in every thread they are involved in and, in turn, spam nonsense that wastes the thread for users interested in logical assessment. On that note, you are not helping move this debate along and are only multiplying the number of meaningless posts on this thread. So if you have something pertinent to add to this discussion, please feel free. Don't just jump in here and whine about whatever problems you have with me. I will not take your complaining seriously anyway. 
First of all i not a troll. A troll is someone who start trouble just for the sake to annoy other people. It not in my nature to do that. I notice that you respond aggressively when you deabte with people especialy when they being polite with you. Human being are emtional ceatures they will respond if you act in certain way. I see nothing wrong with being aggressive if the user your debating with is using willful ignorance or if the user is lying in order to support they claims.

Thank you.
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#174 Posted by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@warlord1234 said: 
First of all i not a troll. A troll is someone who start trouble just for the sake to annoy other people. It not in my nature to do that. I notice that you respond aggressively when you deabte with people especialy when they being polite with you. Human being are emtional ceatures they will respond if you act in certain way. 
You jump into a thread purely for the sake of trying to call me out on something irrespective to the subject at hand. Yes, you are trolling. 
 
I see nothing wrong with being aggressive if the user your debating with is using willful ignorance or if the user is lying in order to support they claims.
Then you should have no problem with the way I was conducting myself in this thread and thus should not have even replied to me. 
 
Like I said, you are multiplying the number of meaningless posts in this thread. 
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#175 Posted by kheranlord12 (1304 posts) - - Show Bio
@Silver2467 said:
@warlord1234 said: 
First of all i not a troll. A troll is someone who start trouble just for the sake to annoy other people. It not in my nature to do that. I notice that you respond aggressively when you deabte with people especialy when they being polite with you. Human being are emtional ceatures they will respond if you act in certain way. 
You jump into a thread purely for the sake of trying to call me out on something irrespective to the subject at hand. Yes, you are trolling. 
 
I see nothing wrong with being aggressive if the user your debating with is using willful ignorance or if the user is lying in order to support they claims.
Then you should have no problem with the way I was conducting myself in this thread and thus should not have even replied to me.  Like I said, you are multiplying the number of meaningless posts in this thread. 

I have seen you in the past respond aggressively before when the situation was not needed.
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#176 Posted by icec0ld (1048 posts) - - Show Bio

He dies at Cyclops who has survived far worse random encounters with no prep.  
 
1.) He was randomly attacked by the entire X-men team after waking up from a coma and they were all trying to kill him because they were under the influence of the Pheonix. Not only did he take a punch from Colossus but he outwitted and beat the entire X-men team Storm and Rouge included at the same time with no prep right after waking from a coma.  
 
2.) He has outsmarted both Black Tom and Juggernaugt and beat them both at the same time. 
 
3.) He was ambushed by over 100 men with guns but was still quick enough thinker to fire a beam with such accuracy that he was able to snap all of their guns without hitting the men.

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#177 Edited by Silver2467 (16759 posts) - - Show Bio
@warlord1234 said: 

I have seen you in the past respond aggressively before when the situation was not needed.

@Silver2467 said:

Like I said, you are multiplying the number of meaningless posts in this thread. 


 
@Pantherman said: 

1.) He was randomly attacked by the entire X-men team after waking up from a coma and they were all trying to kill him because they were under the influence of the Pheonix. Not only did he take a punch from Colossus 

I like how you think this is feasible. Based on what you described, the X-Men were manipulated by Phoenix into attacking Cyclops with the intention of killing him. Colossus, a Class 70-100 character, punches Scott under these circumstances, and he survived? Are you really passing that off as a legit showing? Cyclops, a hero absolutely devoid of superhuman physical traits, withstands a blow from one of the X-Men's powerhouses who meant to see him dead..... That does not compute. At all. If you want to cite instances of Cyclops' resiliency, there are myriads of perfectly decent showings you could bring up. This is a terrible representation.
 

but he outwitted and beat the entire X-men team Storm and Rouge included at the same time with no prep right after waking from a coma.  

If we were judging by this logic, then I could just say that Spider-Man has incapacitated an X-Men roster before, mainly by utilizing his webbing properly. Problem is, this was neither a display of good writing, nor is it relevant. You are attaching ABC logic into a completely different scenario. I have never read the comic in which this occurred, but if it is as impressive as you explained (which I doubt), then Cyclops should never have survived. The X-Men are a group of heroes with members who collectively can remove the air in your lungs to suffocate you, can tele-drop you from half a mile in the air, can cause matter to spontaneously explode, can lobotomize you telepathically, can kill you with a touch, etc. etc. Unless the X-Men suffered from incredible CIS during this encounter or unless environmental (or other circumstantial) factors played a part, then this is just hideous writing. If it is the former two, then it holds no bearing on this thread in the first place and as a result should not even be discussed. 
 

2.) He has outsmarted both Black Tom and Juggernaugt and beat them both at the same time. 

Good thing neither of these characters are fast as Spider-Man, hmm? 
 

3.) He was ambushed by over 100 men with guns but was still quick enough thinker to fire a beam with such accuracy that he was able to snap all of their guns without hitting the men.

This is just an accuracy feat. Honestly, how many street levelers can you name that have not defeated miniature armies of cannon fodder? 
 
See, the problem here is that you continually mention these battles Cyclops has engaged in and attempt to analogize them to the fight presented in this thread, when all of the examples you listed are completely incomparable to it. It is unsuccessful in actually take into account the stipulations provided in this thread. Cyclops is not fighting the X-Men. He is not fighting Colossus. He is not fighting Storm. He is not fighting Rogue. He is not fighting Juggernaut. He is not fighting Black Tom Cassidy. He is not fighting 100 men. He is fighting Spider-Man. And in this fight, Spider-Man will be able to abandon his usual CIS, start at relatively close range, and Cyclops will perform with his standard combat tendencies.  If the issue you want to argue is that Cyclops has fought more powerful characters, then this is true of Spider-Man as well. He has gone head to head with numerous characters well out of Scott's league. But none of that matters. Because he is not combating any of them. He is combating Cyclops. Spider-Man vs Cyclops with the scenario given is what matters. So I fail to see why you list these other fights as if they mean anything. The fact is, they don't.
 
You still have not answered the main points: 
  • Morals do not apply to Spider-Man, releasing him of his restraint over his powers.
  • Neither character has prior knowledge of the other, outside of their past encounters which have not incurred much information on each others' limits.
  • As no exact distance was entailed in the OP, they begin with a short gap between them.
  • Cyclops' morals do apply, meaning that he will not be aiming for an instant kill move and is not fast enough to contend with a Spider-Man only a short interval away who will be incorporating his speed to the fullest.
I have no problem with the idea of Spider-Man losing, but for all the support Cyclops has received in this thread, no one has given a good reason for why he should be the victor in these conditions.
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#178 Edited by MzombieX (975 posts) - - Show Bio
@god_spawn said:



                   

@Edgeworth_11

: No it's not that you don't have to agree, it's you won't because the X-man loses. This is a debate forum, and that's exactly what I am doing. You post and post the same irrelevant nonsense that you do in everyother X-men thread, X-man wins, X-man wins. Just like Namor vs Power girl a couple months back. You said Namor wins even though PG has more powers, is better, faster, and stronger than Namor and has shown better feats even while he was under water. You then retorted that Namor wins because you called PG a whore. Real mature, you just can't stand watching an X-man lose.   Your points are the same constantly, Scott comes up with plans on the fly. Explain how. He will notice how Parker is bloodlusted as soon as it starts even though he wears a mask. Explain how. You assume he will one shot him. Explain why. You compared Spider-Man to Blade durability wise, then when asked for feats you didn't provide anything. You then stated Scott will keep firing and firing like he has some kind of distance advantage at the start that Parker can't clear. It's like you expect Spider-Man is just gonna stand there because you want Cyclops to win I've provided a reason and counter to each of your points. It's like you just throw the OP out the window so the X-man can win. I'm not forcing you to debate, but I'm not giving you the satisfaction of just walking away with an agree to disagree. This is a debate forum, not a fanboy forum. We are debaters and so far you haven't given anything to thread that gives Cyclops a reason why he wins. No proof, no reasons, no nothing. If you want to keep responding to me, then provide some proof for once instead of X-man A B or C wins because you want him to.

                   

               

Several people here have given legitimate reasons as to why or how Cyclops could win. You may not share the same opinion and you obviously don't see it, but you say you have countered these arguments as if it is said and done. 
Not everyone agrees. I personally don't think you have countered many of these points as effectively and as clear cut as you give yourself credit for.  

Wether or not Spider-Man is bloodlusted, I think it's safe to assume that Scott realizes that it will come down to him or Parker. So he will do what is necessary to take him down, although without putting out the force to go for a kill.
This is a battle thread and the participants are fighting and are aware of this. It isn't as if the OP states that Spider-Man is blindsiding Scott out of nowhere.  
Scott can use his blasts in the same manner as when the output is lethal ... only use them to KO instead. 
 
Edgeworth gave an example of that with Blade, as many other examples have been given of Scott regularly using his blasts against opponents ranging from human to superhuman of various levels ... 
and applying the sufficient force necessary, as needed to take them out, without killing them.  

Nobody is expecting Spider-Man is just going to stand there. Are you under the impression, for some reason, that Cyclops is just going to stand there as well? 
Especially when he can launch an attack by simply looking in Spider-Man's direction.
Although there is going to be some distance between them at the start for simply the default purposes of this fight, according to Vine rules, since it wasn't stated in the OP.  
Granted they will be close to each other, but not necessarily on top of one another. 
Even so, Spider-Man wouldn't have an easy time dodging a wide point blank blast without room to maneuver. So close isn't necessarily even better. 
Although with all PIS aside ... Scott should rarely, if ever, miss most any target he is looking at based on his skill set and feats he has accomplished - outside of when plot intends for him to suddenly miss for the sake of story. 
But that's just my opinion.
 
It simply comes down to one of two things:  
Are you the kind of person who thinks Spider-Man is able to dodge Scott's gaze? 
Or will Spider-Man get tagged before he can get close enough to do anything about it?  

There truly isn't a "correct" answer to this, so if Edgeworth says (agree to disagree) then so be it. 
Who are you to say that you won't give him the satisfaction of walking away with that? 
It isn't as if you have backed down for the bulk of this thread. Even though you initially hadn't even decided if Spider-man could defeat Scott, back when you and I first started debating. 
Yet now that you are backing Spider-Man in pulling this off more definitively ... nobody can convince you otherwise. So leave it at that, if Edgeworth isn't convinced Cyclops will lose either.
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#179 Posted by Killemall (18972 posts) - - Show Bio

Stops at Deadpool =) .  
 
Man i love that deadpool character :D 

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#180 Posted by IZZR (4890 posts) - - Show Bio

Stops at Aquaman for sure

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#181 Posted by Edgeworth_11 (5235 posts) - - Show Bio
@MzombieX said:
@god_spawn said:



                   

@Edgeworth_11

: No it's not that you don't have to agree, it's you won't because the X-man loses. This is a debate forum, and that's exactly what I am doing. You post and post the same irrelevant nonsense that you do in everyother X-men thread, X-man wins, X-man wins. Just like Namor vs Power girl a couple months back. You said Namor wins even though PG has more powers, is better, faster, and stronger than Namor and has shown better feats even while he was under water. You then retorted that Namor wins because you called PG a whore. Real mature, you just can't stand watching an X-man lose.   Your points are the same constantly, Scott comes up with plans on the fly. Explain how. He will notice how Parker is bloodlusted as soon as it starts even though he wears a mask. Explain how. You assume he will one shot him. Explain why. You compared Spider-Man to Blade durability wise, then when asked for feats you didn't provide anything. You then stated Scott will keep firing and firing like he has some kind of distance advantage at the start that Parker can't clear. It's like you expect Spider-Man is just gonna stand there because you want Cyclops to win I've provided a reason and counter to each of your points. It's like you just throw the OP out the window so the X-man can win. I'm not forcing you to debate, but I'm not giving you the satisfaction of just walking away with an agree to disagree. This is a debate forum, not a fanboy forum. We are debaters and so far you haven't given anything to thread that gives Cyclops a reason why he wins. No proof, no reasons, no nothing. If you want to keep responding to me, then provide some proof for once instead of X-man A B or C wins because you want him to.

                   

               
Several people here have given legitimate reasons as to why or how Cyclops could win. You may not share the same opinion and you obviously don't see it, but you say you have countered these arguments as if it is said and done. Not everyone agrees. I personally don't think you have countered many of these points as effectively and as clear cut as you give yourself credit for.  Wether or not Spider-Man is bloodlusted, I think it's safe to assume that Scott realizes that it will come down to him or Parker. So he will do what is necessary to take him down, although without putting out the force to go for a kill.This is a battle thread and the participants are fighting and are aware of this. It isn't as if the OP states that Spider-Man is blindsiding Scott out of nowhere.  Scott can use his blasts in the same manner as when the output is lethal ... only use them to KO instead.  Edgeworth gave an example of that with Blade, as many other examples have been given of Scott regularly using his blasts against opponents ranging from human to superhuman of various levels ... and applying the sufficient force necessary, as needed to take them out, without killing them.  Nobody is expecting Spider-Man is just going to stand there. Are you under the impression, for some reason, that Cyclops is just going to stand there as well? Especially when he can launch an attack by simply looking in Spider-Man's direction.Although there is going to be some distance between them at the start for simply the default purposes of this fight, according to Vine rules, since it wasn't stated in the OP.  Granted they will be close to each other, but not necessarily on top of one another. Even so, Spider-Man wouldn't have an easy time dodging a wide point blank blast without room to maneuver. So close isn't necessarily even better. Although with all PIS aside ... Scott should rarely, if ever, miss most any target he is looking at based on his skill set and feats he has accomplished - outside of when plot intends for him to suddenly miss for the sake of story. But that's just my opinion. It simply comes down to one of two things:  Are you the kind of person who thinks Spider-Man is able to dodge Scott's gaze? Or will Spider-Man get tagged before he can get close enough to do anything about it?  There truly isn't a "correct" answer to this, so if Edgeworth says (agree to disagree) then so be it. Who are you to say that you won't give him the satisfaction of walking away with that? It isn't as if you have backed down for the bulk of this thread. Even though you initially hadn't even decided if Spider-man could defeat Scott, back when you and I first started debating. Yet now that you are backing Spider-Man in pulling this off more definitively ... nobody can convince you otherwise. So leave it at that, if Edgeworth isn't convinced Cyclops will lose either.

Great post. Well done ^__^
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#182 Posted by KainScion (2991 posts) - - Show Bio

deathstroke has too much skill even for his spidersense. of course, maybe with him being so focused he might be able to do it. if not deathstroke, artie for sure

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#183 Edited by icec0ld (1048 posts) - - Show Bio

Cyclops wins. 
 
http://scans-daily.dreamwidth.org/757369.html?thread=20761977&style=light

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#184 Posted by Blob (656 posts) - - Show Bio

Stops at Deathstroke but barely. If not then stops at Aquaman for sure.

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#185 Posted by Trackz (1037 posts) - - Show Bio

Cyclops stops him, cyclops has no reservations about putting a teammates down, let alone a bloodlusted one. Blade doesn't either for the record and has taken on a blood lusted Spiderman twice, first time he beat him second time he was drained and was still owning spiderman in hand-to-hand 
 

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#186 Posted by the_stegman (40015 posts) - - Show Bio

deathstroke MAYBE Aquaman PROBABLY the rest he clears 

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#187 Edited by spidey 15 (17883 posts) - - Show Bio
@Trackz  

Blade doesn't either for the record and has taken on a blood lusted Spiderman twice, first time he beat him second time he was drained and was still owning spiderman in hand-to-hand

Spidey being bloodlusted in these fights, does not really mean he was fighting at his best. Spidey was supposed to be bloodlsuted in one of his fights with DD but he lost because the fact that he was bloodlusted and out of his right state of his mind, made him to fight sloppy. In battle forums, when a character does not have his morals, we assume that he is fighting at his best. Just because spidey was trying to kill Blade in their fights, it does not mean he was fighting at the best of his ability. Actually he did not seemed to be focused at all. Hell, spidey has stated that Blade's punches helped him to concentrate and he was even asking himself what he was doing, something that proves that he was doing stuff out of his right state of mind, thus he was not really focused. Not to mention that spidey eventually beat Blade in that fight anyway. In their other fight, Blade somehow was able to shot him, even though spidey was able to dodge electrical attacks or even lasers in mid-air, but he was unable to do it in that fight? That sounds to wrong. 
 
Anyway, now to explain what i was trying ti say, Spidey here is supposed to use his powers at their best. Just because he was bloodlusted in their fights, it does not mean he was at his best as i explained in the above paragraph. IMO, Spidey at his best is way to good for Blade.
:)
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#188 Posted by icec0ld (1048 posts) - - Show Bio
@spidey 15
 
 
So when Spiderman gets beat like he has against Blade, DD, Morlun and dozens others he wasn't at his best? Why all the excuses and none of them concrete. Not only has blade beaten SpiderMan but he has saved his life before as well when he wasn't fast enough to escape a vampire chasing him. SpiderMan stops at Cyclops who is overwhelmingly the better fighter and far to quick of a thinker to be beaten by Spiderman. Spider man can't strategize to take on over 100 mercenaries at once and disarm them so fast that not one of them can get a shot off like Cyclops can after being ambushed. Spiderman cant wake from coma and be attacked by the X-men who are trying to kill him and devise an on the spot strategy to beat all of them without killing them. He could take on both Black Tom and Juggernaugt like Scott did when they ambushed him in Alaska and win. Scott is a tactical genius and doesn't get sloppy.
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#189 Posted by madrid_san (2199 posts) - - Show Bio
@Pantherman said:
@spidey 15:   So when Spiderman gets beat like he has against Blade, DD, Morlun and dozens others he wasn't at his best? Why all the excuses and none of them concrete. Not only has blade beaten SpiderMan but he has saved his life before as well when he wasn't fast enough to escape a vampire chasing him. SpiderMan stops at Cyclops who is overwhelmingly the better fighter and far to quick of a thinker to be beaten by Spiderman. Spider man can't strategize to take on over 100 mercenaries at once and disarm them so fast that not one of them can get a shot off like Cyclops can after being ambushed. Spiderman cant wake from coma and be attacked by the X-men who are trying to kill him and devise an on the spot strategy to beat all of them without killing them. He could take on both Black Tom and Juggernaugt like Scott did when they ambushed him in Alaska and win. Scott is a tactical genius and doesn't get sloppy.

Bingo.
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#190 Posted by Death Certificate (5720 posts) - - Show Bio

Wait wait wait, Morlun is being used as low point for spidey? LOL
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#191 Posted by spidey 15 (17883 posts) - - Show Bio
@Pantherman said:
@spidey 15:   So when Spiderman gets beat like he has against Blade, DD, Morlun and dozens others he wasn't at his best? Why all the excuses and none of them concrete. Not only has blade beaten SpiderMan but he has saved his life before as well when he wasn't fast enough to escape a vampire chasing him. SpiderMan stops at Cyclops who is overwhelmingly the better fighter and far to quick of a thinker to be beaten by Spiderman. Spider man can't strategize to take on over 100 mercenaries at once and disarm them so fast that not one of them can get a shot off like Cyclops can after being ambushed. Spiderman cant wake from coma and be attacked by the X-men who are trying to kill him and devise an on the spot strategy to beat all of them without killing them. He could take on both Black Tom and Juggernaugt like Scott did when they ambushed him in Alaska and win. Scott is a tactical genius and doesn't get sloppy.
In most occasions yes. When spidey truly wanted, he was able to beat DD in some of their fights and even in one of them, he did not have his spider-sense. If you have check his fight with Blade you will see why he was not at his best. I have also explained in my post why he was not at his best, so i doubt that you even bother to read it. The only time that Blade has beaten spidey was when he has shoot him on his legs. Yeah, the guy who consistently laughs at bullets, electrical attacks, lazers and several other as fast or faster projectiles, will be shot by Blade.... yeah, whatever. 
 
Seriously, i don't care about the gauntlet at all or even if he stops at Cyclops. But just to address a few things, Cyclops skills won't save him at all. Spidey fights and even beats as good or far better fighters, like DD, Shang chi, Iron Fist, Wolverine, Frank Castle etc... 
If there is anything that can save Cyclops from being one shotted, it's his tactical intellect and that's assuming if they start from a long distance, something that the OP has not stated.  
Also, just an advice, never try to use ABC logic. 
:)
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#192 Posted by spidey 15 (17883 posts) - - Show Bio
@Death Certificate said:
Wait wait wait, Morlun is being used as low point for spidey? LOL
Yeah, I LOLed as well. 
:P
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#193 Posted by Death Certificate (5720 posts) - - Show Bio
@spidey 15
Haha, =) 
 
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#194 Edited by Trackz (1037 posts) - - Show Bio
@spidey 15 said:

@Trackz  

Blade doesn't either for the record and has taken on a blood lusted Spiderman twice, first time he beat him second time he was drained and was still owning spiderman in hand-to-hand

Spidey being bloodlusted in these fights, does not really mean he was fighting at his best. Spidey was supposed to be bloodlsuted in one of his fights with DD but he lost because the fact that he was bloodlusted and out of his right state of his mind, made him to fight sloppy. In battle forums, when a character does not have his morals, we assume that he is fighting at his best. Just because spidey was trying to kill Blade in their fights, it does not mean he was fighting at the best of his ability. Actually he did not seemed to be focused at all. Hell, spidey has stated that Blade's punches helped him to concentrate and he was even asking himself what he was doing, something that proves that he was doing stuff out of his right state of mind, thus he was not really focused. Not to mention that spidey eventually beat Blade in that fight anyway. In their other fight, Blade somehow was able to shot him, even though spidey was able to dodge electrical attacks or even lasers in mid-air, but he was unable to do it in that fight? That sounds to wrong.  Anyway, now to explain what i was trying ti say, Spidey here is supposed to use his powers at their best. Just because he was bloodlusted in their fights, it does not mean he was at his best as i explained in the above paragraph. IMO, Spidey at his best is way to good for Blade.:)
Well that sucks seeing as Spiderman is pretty bloodlusted in this fight. Becoming a vampire doesn't cause one to fight worse. As seen in pretty much every depiction of  a character turning into a vampire they succomb to their blood lust but are still perfectly rational. Spiderman confirms this later when he states he could remember everything that happens and explains his actions. Blade was fighting a faster and stronger version of Spiderman and he won.  In the second fight, Blade had been drained of his power so that Fang could work on him. so he was already weak. Spiderman was under the same drug s othey were both on an equal footing. Blade beat Spiderman so badly (while weakened) that the drug temporarily lost its hold on Spiderman so he could help them escape, Spiderman then tripped Blade and he passed out, that should tell you how weak Blade was. Spiderman has never performed well against vampires and is usually overpowered and nearly killed.   
 
As for the "Spider-man can't be hit by bullets" nonsense, Blade kicked Spiderman into the air and shot him. There is no possible way for Spiderman to dodge bullets after he's been sent flying into the air. His webbing isn't faster than a bullet and he can't change his center of gravity no matter how he tries to flop around. Blade beat a faster/stronger version of Spiderman in about one-panel. Hell in the second fight when Spiderman saw he was fighting Blade he knew he was in trouble. 
 
However, Spiderman doesn't make it up to Blade because he stops at Cyclops. Cyclops essentially nerve tapped Blade with an optic blade. He takes Spiderman down fast. 
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#195 Posted by spidey 15 (17883 posts) - - Show Bio
@Trackz: Becoming a vampire does not make you fight worse, but it does not make you fight better either, which that was my point. Usually when morals are off, we assume that the characters are at their best,, and spidey was not fighting at his best in any of these fights. Spidey himself was questioning what he was doing, which proves my point that he was not in the right state of his mind. Also, later he confirms that he thought he was the Vampire Lestat( LOL ) and that Blade's hit helped him to concentrate. Blade was weakened, but spidey was not at any better condition. At first he was not trying to fight Blade and later he was doing stuff out of his mind( as we have seen ) and when he came back at the right state of his mind, he acted smarter and took the edge over Bade. That shows how different is to fight a vampire spidey than the real one. 
 
Spidey can still dodge projectiles even in the air by using his flexibility to change the position of his body. You do know that he can still move your limps even in the air, right? 
Here is what he can truly do even in  mid air 
http://www.comicvine.com/myvine/spidey_15/sm/108-385112/197874_727094_feat2speed2wp3/105-1287723/ 
 
Not to mention that even if he was unable to change his position, his reflexes are still good enough to react fast enough and web the bullets. 
 
As i said, i don't really care about the gauntlet nor if he can beat Cyke. I was just addressing your point of Blade beating a bloodlusted spidey( occasions very different than this one ). 
:)
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#196 Posted by Trackz (1037 posts) - - Show Bio
@spidey 15 said:
@Trackz: Becoming a vampire does not make you fight worse, but it does not make you fight better either, which that was my point. Usually when morals are off, we assume that the characters are at their best,, and spidey was not fighting at his best in any of these fights. Spidey himself was questioning what he was doing, which proves my point that he was not in the right state of his mind. Also, later he confirms that he thought he was the Vampire Lestat( LOL ) and that Blade's hit helped him to concentrate. Blade was weakened, but spidey was not at any better condition. At first he was not trying to fight Blade and later he was doing stuff out of his mind( as we have seen ) and when he came back at the right state of his mind, he acted smarter and took the edge over Bade. That shows how different is to fight a vampire spidey than the real one. 
 
Spidey can still dodge projectiles even in the air by using his flexibility to change the position of his body. You do know that he can still move your limps even in the air, right? 
Here is what he can truly do even in  mid air 
http://www.comicvine.com/myvine/spidey_15/sm/108-385112/197874_727094_feat2speed2wp3/105-1287723/  Not to mention that even if he was unable to change his position, his reflexes are still good enough to react fast enough and web the bullets.  As i said, i don't really care about the gauntlet nor if he can beat Cyke. I was just addressing your point of Blade beating a bloodlusted spidey( occasions very different than this one ). :)
So Spiderman was fighting normally only he was stronger/faster and Blade beat him in one panel.  
 
The second fight, they weren't on equal terms, Blade had been drained while Spiderman was fine, when they both went berserk, Blade completely owned him and knocked his sense back into him. Spiderman then tripped him and he collapsed (again that shows how weak Blade was and he still looked physically superior of the two).  
 
You can flail your limbs but you can't change your center of gravity, the minute you leap into the air you enter a set motion, not only that Spiderman didn't jump into the air, he got kicked. So he was recovering from the kick and Blade wasted no time shooting him down. Perfectly legit, Blade beat a stronger/faster spiderman in one-panel. Vampirism essentially took away Spiderman's morals, he still had his wits about him, and he lost. This is the exact scenario of this fight. In the second fight, they both lost their minds and a weakened Blade beat Spiderman to his senses. 
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#197 Edited by God_Spawn (42823 posts) - - Show Bio

Just thought I would check in since my break  it's the same batch of users who like to twist evidence out of context, fanboy and   make ridiculous claims they can't back  and one person I respect as a debater all going for Cyclops. Not one person  has provided proof for the 3 days I was gone that shows Scott can process all the info and plans to win people keep saying all while in character against a person who starts close and physcially outclasses by multiples and has no morals and will one shot him.
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#198 Posted by jojjimbo (2664 posts) - - Show Bio

Maybe Death Stroke, but definitely at Aquaman.

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#199 Posted by Trackz (1037 posts) - - Show Bio
@god_spawn said:
Just thought I would check in since my break  it's the same batch of users who like to twist evidence out of context, fanboy and   make ridiculous claims they can't back  and one person I respect as a debater all going for Cyclops. Not one person  has provided proof for the 3 days I was gone that shows Scott can process all the info and plans to win people keep saying all while in character against a person who starts close and physcially outclasses by multiples and has no morals and will one shot him.
Cyclops has no qualm with putting anyone down, be it friend or foe, without a moments hesitation. He put Blade down, sent Cable to his death, and was going to kill Wolverine when he went berserk. If Spiderman comes at him a quick blast like the one he delivered to Blade should end the fight. Cyclops has such fine-tuned control over his powers it wont take long for him to calculate how to put Spiderman down especially since he has most likely already thought about the scenario. 
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#200 Posted by spidey 15 (17883 posts) - - Show Bio
@Trackz
 No spidey, was not normal. Being stronger or faster means nothing if you don't act in a more concentrated manner. 
 
They have been in equal terms because even though Blade was weakened, spidey was not trying to fight him. Then, when he got berserk, he tried to attacked him but even during at that moment, he asked himself what he was doing, making him lose his concentration on the fight. Then when he got normal again, he easily found a way to beat Blade, instead of just attacking him like a brawler. Also, i love how he was able to dodge hit attacks, at the beginning but when the vampirism has taken control, he fought like a fool. 
 
That does not change my point, since i have already posted a scan where he was in a similar situation and he not just dodged bullets, but he has actually dodged f#cking lasers. If you want, i can post also a feat where he dodges electricity from mid air. Recovering from a hit is not an excuse. Spidey consistently takes hits from far stronger and recovers pretty fast. Hell, there was a time when he was fighting a team of villains and he was really tired during the whole fight. After beating a villain, he was forced to take a full attack from f#cking rhino. Even rhino states that he was barely alive and his attempt to attack him, failed since spidey was fast enough to dodge. I think it's fair to assume that a bloodlsuted, more serious and physically better version of spidey, should have no trouble dodging Blade's shots. 
:)