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#1 Posted by Cjdavis103 (10010 posts) - - Show Bio

assume the Imperils won the Civil war and all fractions are at full strength and working together

do they hold Skyrim against the attackers

round 1. the forces of the alliance in LOTR

round 2 the hordes of Solomon

round 3, Solomon and Saurons army's

round 4. Saurons army led by the ring wraths and witch king

round 5. same as above + the mercenaries

round 6 Sauron himself leads the army from round 5

round 7 all forces mentioned before

if Skyrim louses they can try again with

first lose The Graybeards bloodlusted

second The Dragonborn maxed out staus no Soul steal or slow time or insta win artifacts + grey breads bloodlusted

how far do they go

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#2 Posted by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103: The forces of Tamriel kick the crap out of Middle-Earth.

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#3 Posted by Cjdavis103 (10010 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai:

with or without the bonus help

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#4 Edited by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103: They don't need the Dovahkiin and Graybeards for it. Tamriel has bigger armies, better fighters, and a slew of magic users. LotR only has a small handful of magic users. Five, in fact. Most of those not that good either. Even counting in Sauron and his forces, Sauron in a Physical Form isn't that big a deal. Not when Tamriel has an army of Mages and Conjurers who can effectively obliterate Mordor's forces pretty easily.

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#5 Posted by Cjdavis103 (10010 posts) - - Show Bio
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#6 Posted by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio
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#7 Edited by Cjdavis103 (10010 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai:

whit if I included frist age Sauron

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#8 Edited by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103: I'm not seeing a difference. The level of magic users in TES are rather impressive. Plus there are the more disreputable figures with backing by the Daedra. Such as the Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood. Besides, Tamriel has been attacked multiple times by the more despicable Daedric Princes, like Molag Bal and Mehrunes Dagon. They're much bigger threats than Sauron. Though the only thing that stopped Mehrunes Dagon when he actually entered Tamriel was Akatosh when Martin Septim sacrificed himself with the Amulet of Kings.

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#9 Posted by Cjdavis103 (10010 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai:

how many people are in TES though? the Hords have tens of thousands of solders at minimum I assumed that would balance out the magic .

and for the intents of this fight lets assume that no divines /daedra are going get involved here

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#10 Edited by Cream_God (15519 posts) - - Show Bio

LOTR 4 da win #stormcloak4life #freedomofreligion #highfashion

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#11 Posted by Wolfrazer (16281 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai: Argonians solo due to bad***ry. /Insert trollface.

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#12 Edited by Pistolwhip1 (1238 posts) - - Show Bio
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#13 Posted by thelocust619 (7854 posts) - - Show Bio

Ralof solos. Guy's a beast.

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#14 Posted by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103: Many thousands of years earlier, before the 1st Era, during the Dragon Wars, just Nords alone were being killed by the thousands by the Dragons. The number of Argonians is incalculable because no one has ever dared to go deep enough into Black Marsh to even figure it out. Khajiit also come in 20 rumored varieties, half of those are confirmed. Not all of them humanoid.

Numbers aren't different, and wouldn't make up for a difference in magic users as Bretons, Altmers and Dunmers are very magic heavy races, and every race is capable of using magic. And while the Divines/Princes won't get involved, there will be lesser daedra and dremora summoned by magic users and conjurers. Conjuration Magic is the art of summoning and the summoners can call forth Atronachs, Dremora and the undead. Anyone that dies can be raised as an undead, so Tamriel's ranks may not diminish nearly at the same rate as Middle-Earths.

Just be glad the Dwemer are gone and that the Psijics keep out of worldly affairs for the most part. By and by, Tamriel's races are just too much.

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#15 Edited by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

Stop at 4 due to witch king.

If it was 1st age, stop at 1 due to Earendil.

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#16 Posted by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: They've dealt with far worse than the Witch-King of Angmar. Manimarco for instance, and Potema the Wolf Queen.

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#17 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai: Depending on age, they might not even reach there..

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#18 Edited by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1

: Won't make any difference. Unless you also wanna go back to Mythic Era with Dragons with their Dragon Priests and Miraak and the Tongues and Voice Masters and basically just things that steamroll LotR.

The "what if I used this" argument just makes things worse.

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#19 Edited by Fodder76 (1951 posts) - - Show Bio

You know LOTR has dragons and other such creatures that you're mentioning. I think it would be more fair if you added Melkor and his forces maybe even throw in the Noldarian elves and some of the Maiar. Also reikai sorry to say but your wrong when you say that Gandalf and the other Istari are the only wizards. They are the only Maiar wizards though but there are many such sorcerers wizards and necromancers in Middle Earth.

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#20 Posted by Anal_Vomit (798 posts) - - Show Bio

Argonians Solo LOTR.

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#21 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai: I was talking about Earendil's feats. Where would you scale him against witch king/gandalf/glorfindel? Honestly, I have no idea where to put him. But he's definitely below sauron.

I mean.. how would skyrim team deal with ancalagon? Earandil pretty much solo'd him

(Remember ancalagon, right? he blocked the light of sun even when he was flying from far away, and crushed thangorodrim.. three volcanic mountains scaled by tolkein around 35000 feet high and hundreds of miles across.. how the hell do you even fight something that huge? And the battle took place for 24 hours.)

Now.. gandalf is arguably more powerful, and we know witch king ran away from glorfindel. If we can balance out witch king and earandil somehow..

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#22 Posted by Fodder76 (1951 posts) - - Show Bio

PrinceAragorn1: It depends on which version of Earendil you're talking about his mortal version could never have taken on Ancalagon. his resurrected as the guardian of the silmarillion of the sky version can and did destroy Ancalagon albeit with aid of a silmarillion and a large ship blessed by the Valar. The Witch King is a powerful Wraith with one of the rings of power and it is likely that he could beat Earendil's human form. He is leagues away from Earendil's resurrected form. Also Glorfindel did not scare the Witch King off the combination of Elrond Eurnur Glorfindel the armies of Gondor and Rivendell and his master calling him back to Mordor was why he fled. I would put the Witch King ahead of Glorfindel even though it is fairly even between them. Anyways if you want further explanation I can give it but this is the order.

Resurrected Guardian of the Silmaril Earendil >= Gandalf >= Witch King >= Glorfindel >= Mortal Earendil

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#23 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

@beezlebub: that looks like a good order.

What about Gothmog and sauron, though? Both were above ancalagon in morgoth's army.. could earendil beat one of the two?

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#24 Posted by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: The fight between Miraak and Vahlok shattered landscapes and ruptured the land, tearing Solstheim of from the regions of Skyrim and Morrowind. Their fight lasted for three days. Magic users in TES tend to be rather absurd. Even more recently the Thalmor claimed they restored the two moons, Masser and Secundus, to get the Khajiit back on their side to reform the Aldmeris Dominion (I actually think they kept up a mass illusion for 2yrs to make it look like the moons had vanished. Which is, either way, an insanely impressive feat).

If we were including baddies we'd have to look at all the Lichs and Necromancers and Battlemages that've been such a huge pain in Tamriel. Such as the one responsible for Umbriel, the Flying City of the dead, which he used to literally crush other cities beneath it and raise the newly dead to feed his armies.

No Caption Provided

Let's just be glad Sheogorath isn't on vacation in the world. He'd solo both sides, then invite them for dinner with cheese wheels and cream tarts. (He is my favorite Daedric Prince too)

@beelzebub: Even account for other mystics in LotR, they're still outnumbered 1000/1. Tamriel just has tons more to offer with official places of study, like the Magic Colleges, and numerous Noble Houses of elves in both the Summerset Isles and Morrowind who're all magically proficient.

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#25 Posted by Wolfrazer (16281 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai: "Oh and the cheese! To die for."

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#26 Edited by Fodder76 (1951 posts) - - Show Bio

Prince Aragorn1: Gothmog was dead by the time Ancalagon cam to be. I imagine them to be pretty equal in strength though.

Souron with the Ring > Guardian Elendil

Souron without the Ring = Guardian Elendil

Ancalagon = Gothmog

Guardian Elendil >= Ancalagon/ Gothmog

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#27 Posted by Fodder76 (1951 posts) - - Show Bio

If you think about it actually almost all the elves in Middle Earth have magical capabilities. Also many of the battles such as the one between Fingolfin and Melkor changed landscapes too.

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#28 Posted by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolfrazer:

"You know, you remind me of myself at a young age. All I cared about was riding narwhales and sleeping in honeycombes and drinking babies' tears...

Word of advice if you ride a Narwhale. Mind the pointy end."

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#29 Edited by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai: Well, we seem to be turning it into middle earth vs tamriel lol.. but creating moons doesn't have anything on ungoliant, who ate the sap of two trees of sun and moons.. apparently earendil slew it. Some say it ate itself, though..

but Crushing a city? what kind of city is around 200 miles long and about 35000ft tall? it was destroyed by falling over it.. the two don't really compare.. 0_0

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#30 Posted by Fodder76 (1951 posts) - - Show Bio

No it ate itself.

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#31 Edited by NeonGameWave (19333 posts) - - Show Bio

I think Skyrim holds more of the advantages with that said:

Bump!

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#32 Edited by Pope052 (3540 posts) - - Show Bio

Skyrim, rather easily.

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#33 Posted by OpCharybdis (190 posts) - - Show Bio

I support Skyrim, but question. I never read that flying undead city book, but was the one who did it just an above average mage (if that was what the average mage can do, then Sauros Aren is a country buster), or some once in a millenia powerful mage?

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#34 Posted by Eisenfauste (17366 posts) - - Show Bio

Skyrim stops at 7.

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#35 Posted by i_like_swords (26231 posts) - - Show Bio

I support Skyrim, but question. I never read that flying undead city book, but was the one who did it just an above average mage (if that was what the average mage can do, then Sauros Aren is a country buster), or some once in a millenia powerful mage?

Oh. My. God.

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#36 Posted by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@opcharybdis: Actually a guy who got blasted into Clavicus Vile's realm of Oblivion and jacked the power from the sword Umbra, which contained a portion of Vile's power, and used it to connect himself with the flying city of Umbriel, effectively making him a minor god and he couldn't be killed unless that power was drained from the city back into the sword.

Umbriel became a pocket section of Vile's plane of oblivion so it was technically still part of Oblivion and it killed and sucked the souls of any living thing beneath it, and then create larvae to host inside the bodies of the dead to create an ever-growing army.

Vuhon, calling himself Umbriel, wasn't a once in a lifetime mage, he was a guy who managed to jack a portion of Vile's power through a sword Vile had created, which then believed itself sentient and made a deal with Vuhon in order to escape from Oblivion and Vile's control. So it was a specific event.

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#37 Posted by Chibi_cute (5157 posts) - - Show Bio

eru Illuvatar steps in.. then he solos.

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#38 Edited by reikai (7476 posts) - - Show Bio

@chibi_cute: Then Sheogorath steps in and Eru...has no idea what to do. Have the cake? Eat the cheese? And/or wonder why his existence is made entirely of cabbage.

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#39 Posted by Chibi_cute (5157 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

@chibi_cute: Then Sheogorath steps in and Eru...has no idea what to do. Have the cake? Eat the cheese? And/or wonder why his existence is made entirely of cabbage.

HEY i haven't seen you around for a long time.. where have you been in animevice.?

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#40 Posted by KingOfAsh (3935 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

@princearagorn1: The fight between Miraak and Vahlok shattered landscapes and ruptured the land, tearing Solstheim of from the regions of Skyrim and Morrowind. Their fight lasted for three days. Magic users in TES tend to be rather absurd. Even more recently the Thalmor claimed they restored the two moons, Masser and Secundus, to get the Khajiit back on their side to reform the Aldmeris Dominion (I actually think they kept up a mass illusion for 2yrs to make it look like the moons had vanished. Which is, either way, an insanely impressive feat).

If we were including baddies we'd have to look at all the Lichs and Necromancers and Battlemages that've been such a huge pain in Tamriel. Such as the one responsible for Umbriel, the Flying City of the dead, which he used to literally crush other cities beneath it and raise the newly dead to feed his armies.

No Caption Provided

Let's just be glad Sheogorath isn't on vacation in the world. He'd solo both sides, then invite them for dinner with cheese wheels and cream tarts. (He is my favorite Daedric Prince too)

@beelzebub: Even account for other mystics in LotR, they're still outnumbered 1000/1. Tamriel just has tons more to offer with official places of study, like the Magic Colleges, and numerous Noble Houses of elves in both the Summerset Isles and Morrowind who're all magically proficient.

I've read that book! Anyway looks like Tambriel wins. And best that the Daedra arn't used. Cladrius Vile can kill everyone in Skyrim just by snapping his fingers if he wished.

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#41 Posted by rogueshadow (29365 posts) - - Show Bio

First age armies [especially Morgoth's] would be better.

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#42 Posted by CaptainGanon (290 posts) - - Show Bio

assume the Imperils won the Civil war and all fractions are at full strength and working together

do they hold Skyrim against the attackers

round 1. the forces of the alliance in LOTR

round 2 the hordes of Solomon

round 3, Solomon and Saurons army's

round 4. Saurons army led by the ring wraths and witch king

round 5. same as above + the mercenaries

round 6 Sauron himself leads the army from round 5

round 7 all forces mentioned before

if Skyrim louses they can try again with

first lose The Graybeards bloodlusted

second The Dragonborn maxed out staus no Soul steal or slow time or insta win artifacts + grey breads bloodlusted

how far do they go

Who is Solomon?

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#43 Edited by CaptainGanon (290 posts) - - Show Bio

@cjdavis103:

Round 1) Elves and Men march together! The kingdom of Arnor has better warriors than the Empire of Tamriel. Arnor also has some o the greatest elite units. Elves pour down arrows to the enemy. Arnor can hold the front lines for long before getting cut down. The Elves have great reflexes and inhuman stamina and durability! They will put up a great fight! In the end, they will manage to destroy probably about triple their number.

Round 2)Solomon? You mean Saruman? Unless this is the ruler of Umbar or Harad, there is no Solomon in Lotr!

The Uruk-Hai(anyway!), have a great armor, similar to the dwarves. They have their warg riders, a fierce cavalry unit. They are excellent pikemen and they mostly use crossbows and swords. They are all together about 60k troops, maybe more. Tamriel is left with 380k-390k men (assuming the total number was 400k).

Round 3) Sauron's army and Saruman's Uruks are 1.000.000+ troops. They have Trolls and all kinds of warriors. This will be a 4v11 to 4v13! Tamriel COULD prevail, but if it did, it would be with some few thousand men (probably 12k-20k, if the mages play smart!)

Round 4) Sauron still outmatches them at least 4 to 11. The ring wraths will spread chaos in the legions of Tamriel! The battle would be over soon!

Trying again with Dragonborn would get them to Round 5), tops! And in this case, the Mumukil would stomp! The Mumukil, the Nazgul, the Balrog and the Trolls combined would make the legions tremble!

Greybeards won't help much either! Even if they somehow manage to get to Round 6) after Shouting spams, Sauron can take them all by himself!

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#44 Posted by Dygoboy (4161 posts) - - Show Bio

@karaf said:

@cjdavis103:

Round 1) Elves and Men march together! The kingdom of Arnor has better warriors than the Empire of Tamriel. Arnor also has some o the greatest elite units. Elves pour down arrows to the enemy. Arnor can hold the front lines for long before getting cut down. The Elves have great reflexes and inhuman stamina and durability! They will put up a great fight! In the end, they will manage to destroy probably about triple their number.

Round 2)Solomon? You mean Saruman? Unless this is the ruler of Umbar or Harad, there is no Solomon in Lotr!

The Uruk-Hai(anyway!), have a great armor, similar to the dwarves. They have their warg riders, a fierce cavalry unit. They are excellent pikemen and they mostly use crossbows and swords. They are all together about 60k troops, maybe more. Tamriel is left with 380k-390k men (assuming the total number was 400k).

Round 3) Sauron's army and Saruman's Uruks are 1.000.000+ troops. They have Trolls and all kinds of warriors. This will be a 4v11 to 4v13! Tamriel COULD prevail, but if it did, it would be with some few thousand men (probably 12k-20k, if the mages play smart!)

Round 4) Sauron still outmatches them at least 4 to 11. The ring wraths will spread chaos in the legions of Tamriel! The battle would be over soon!

Trying again with Dragonborn would get them to Round 5), tops! And in this case, the Mumukil would stomp! The Mumukil, the Nazgul, the Balrog and the Trolls combined would make the legions tremble!

Greybeards won't help much either! Even if they somehow manage to get to Round 6) after Shouting spams, Sauron can take them all by himself!

If we're counting in Lore Feats One Greybeard can solo.

But with pure game instnaces they barely clear.

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#45 Posted by Reno117 (2932 posts) - - Show Bio

Skyrim wins here..

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#46 Posted by CaptainGanon (290 posts) - - Show Bio

@dygoboy said:
@karaf said:

@cjdavis103:

Round 1) Elves and Men march together! The kingdom of Arnor has better warriors than the Empire of Tamriel. Arnor also has some o the greatest elite units. Elves pour down arrows to the enemy. Arnor can hold the front lines for long before getting cut down. The Elves have great reflexes and inhuman stamina and durability! They will put up a great fight! In the end, they will manage to destroy probably about triple their number.

Round 2)Solomon? You mean Saruman? Unless this is the ruler of Umbar or Harad, there is no Solomon in Lotr!

The Uruk-Hai(anyway!), have a great armor, similar to the dwarves. They have their warg riders, a fierce cavalry unit. They are excellent pikemen and they mostly use crossbows and swords. They are all together about 60k troops, maybe more. Tamriel is left with 380k-390k men (assuming the total number was 400k).

Round 3) Sauron's army and Saruman's Uruks are 1.000.000+ troops. They have Trolls and all kinds of warriors. This will be a 4v11 to 4v13! Tamriel COULD prevail, but if it did, it would be with some few thousand men (probably 12k-20k, if the mages play smart!)

Round 4) Sauron still outmatches them at least 4 to 11. The ring wraths will spread chaos in the legions of Tamriel! The battle would be over soon!

Trying again with Dragonborn would get them to Round 5), tops! And in this case, the Mumukil would stomp! The Mumukil, the Nazgul, the Balrog and the Trolls combined would make the legions tremble!

Greybeards won't help much either! Even if they somehow manage to get to Round 6) after Shouting spams, Sauron can take them all by himself!

If we're counting in Lore Feats One Greybeard can solo.

But with pure game instnaces they barely clear.

I know they have great power, and even in the game they can make the earth tremble when they call you. That's the reason I said that they have a chance of going to round 6. But Sauron can take them all by himself. The shouts don't affect him.

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#47 Posted by imperialbuttlicker (233 posts) - - Show Bio

If we take lore feats, Skyrim stomps. Dragonborn and Greybeards are at least Mountain level. Dragonborn itself has too much hax and versatility that would give Imperial the edge. Not to mention there are races with their unique capabilities that could overthrow the LoTR armies. Argonian with their hist tree would drive LoTR armies nuts, since they're capable of sending back atronachs and dremoras from oblivion that are very powerful with combat and magic.

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#49 Posted by i_like_swords (26231 posts) - - Show Bio

Skyrim's armies and magic definitely impress me more than Middle Earth's... and if you start adding in Greybeards, let alone the Dragonborn, this becomes one sided real fast. Even in the final round.

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#50 Posted by Ysmir (259 posts) - - Show Bio

Dragonborn speaks and the entire verse goes bye bye.