@alextheboss: Nope. If you're using filler then those scenes are legit. Using canon Vegeta still takes it. As I said, TK alone fodderized a Saibaman who're = Raditz > casual moon busters. Saitama has no answer for it.
Saitama vs Vegeta
So you have no sources, that is confirmed. All that mattered.
Anybody who knows anything about gravity or physics would know that it was more than 100x gravity. That's all that's needed since Vegeta can't even handle 100x gravity.
Or Vegeta destroying someone with the durability of Raditz with just the point of his fingers?
Dragon ball characters have high durability against ki attacks, but low durability to physical attacks. It's the only way being able to tank planet level ki attacks but geting hurt by mountain level physical attacks makes sense.
How is it not faster when it took Saitama more than 15 real time seconds to reach Earth?
Going around the Earth 7 times is a shorter distance than going from the Earth to the moon. Goku didn't even go half way around the Earth. Do the math.
You've still yet to prove how the random scan doesn't hold any precedence over the anime, lol.
What? I said the anime also said they were nearby... All official translations of every single media say they were nearby...
Or they were, obviously, in shock that Cell could use the same techniques as them? Considering it was Krillin and Trunks' first time ever actually meeting him?
So what if they were in shock? They knew it was coming but didn't dodge it. Nobody has ever dodged the solar flare. Goku saw it coming once and got sunglasses to protect himself, but that's the closest anyone has ever done to dodging it. Frieza wasn't shocked, he just saw light coming at him but couldn't dodge because he isn't lightspeed.
Mostly everyone knows this.
Mostly every knows this, again.
Ok then you should know that a scan doesn't hold more weight than the manga or anime.
I'm still waiting for you to post a source that confirms my random scan is just a random scan.
You are the one who needs to prove it isn't a random scan. That's how evidence works... You have to back it up. That's like saying God's real until you prove he isn't. No, he isn't real until you prove he is. Same thing with this. For me to believe your scan is canon, you need to prove it. It's simple debating and logic.
At least you acknowledge that you won't find a source that confirms or denounces my scan as just some random scan.
That's because anyone who knows anything about dragon ball knows there is no official canon.
And?...
And I know every dragon ball feat and none of their physical strength and speed feats reach Saitama's level until the Buu saga. Their DC were above his since the saiyan saga, but DC doesn't equal physical strength. Vegeta's only chance is flying high in the sky and spaming ki attacks.
Your posts beg to differ.
You are obviously deluded into thinking you are right. I can post all of the top tier dragon ball feats and compare them to one punch man feats if you would like.
What the hell makes you think that? Lol. Surely you have some sources for a claim like this.
Goku thought Frieza's blast was going to destory Namek... It didn't... He thought he was safe after it didn't blow up... He wasn't.... It's pretty apparent. The better question is why in the hell would Goku, someone with little to no education know how much energy is needed to destroy the Earth? Surely you would have some source backing your claims that he does since saying he knows how much energy is needed to destroy Earth is far more outlandish than saying he doesn't know exactly how much energy is needed.
Because Freeza was actually going to destroy the planet, but held back at the last possible second. This statement is meaningless.
You just made this up. Show me a source that Frieza held back at the last second. How do you know his attack just wasn't charged up enough, or that he just didn't put enough energy into it from the start?
Several other users and I were referring to your claim that Boros could potentially destroy the planet.
One Punch Man's manga isn't even the original source material, so saying it holds more weight than the anime is kind of silly. With dragon ball the original source created by Akira Toriyama is the manga, which is why it holds more weight than the anime. Not all manga are automatically more canon than the anime. In fact, the Gurren Laggan anime is more canon than the manga.
Boros has demonstrated no combat abilities that could even hold a candle to Vegeta. Vegeta was capable of toying with a fighting genius and overpowering him with his tactical intelligence with absolute ease, casually destroyed Nappa, whose durabilitiy was several times greater than Raditz, casually, survived a chi blast that was more powerful than a moon buster with no signs of fatigue and damage, destroyed someone with the same physicality as a Saiyan just by pointing his fingers at them, survived a planet buster to the face and continued to battle, and, finally, survived an even more powerful planet buster and lived to tell a tale about it. Please.
That's all power scaling. None of them have the feats to back any of the durability statements up. The best durability feat from a non regenerating character was Frieza tanking a continent level spirit bomb and tanking a planet exploding. Also ki attack durability doesn't equal physical attack durability as I already stated.
Super Anime is the main canon, so I'm not even sure why you would bother bringing this up. Base Vegeta wore a suit that sunk through the planet indefinitely, and was calculated at being about as heavy as a White Dwarf Star or so in the Super discussion topic.
There is no main canon. If there was one it would just be the original manga. The super anime has filler characters in it that are anime only and half of it isn't even written by Akira. However I agree with Vegeta not being able to pick up 1,000 tons is BS.
Also entirely false.
Prove me wrong with feats. Boros kicking Saitama to the moon is only matched by Super Buu knocking a ki attack through Earth in a couple seconds.
Nothing goes against Vegeta being a planet buster, and I don't share your that CV feats or gtfo mentality nonsense you're giving me. Vegeta is a planet buster on introduction, point blank and simple.
Anime Vegeta is a planet buster, manga Vegeta is unknown. There are many people here who think he isn't, or at least shouldn't be considered one, so you shouldn't say he is a planet buster in a debate. Vegeta also claimed he was the strongest warrior in the universe even though he knew he wasn't. He said that right before he said he was going to destroy the planet. If you want to believe him that's on you, but I don't believe liars unless they prove they are telling the truth.
It doesn't, point blank and simple.
"Save yourself, and doom the Earth"
Now you just have to be trolling me. Vegeta clearly said Goku could save himself in your scan.
Alex, are you trolling me? Or do you really want me to explain how core busting is a greater accomplishment than planetary busting?
Considering any attack that would outright vaporize a planet would also have to vaporize the entire core along with the planet, then yes I would like you to explain that... How could destroying the core be harder than destroying the planet and the core... You have to be trolling.
If this isn't the saddest reach I've ever seen, lmao.
How does it not look casual? He wasn't fatigued in the slighest after firing the move, or after having his teeth smashed together by Krillin. He wasn't charging the attack at all. He literally announced the name of his attack, did a dance, and shot the attack. That was literally the Ginyu's Squad trademark.
Lol I never said he put a lot of effort into it. You must really not know what causal is.
Casual: "relaxed and unconcerned."
Did Recoome look relaxed and unconcerned?
*peeps at your last claim* Do you?
I just proved my last claim was right. Just because someone didn't put a lot of effort into something doesn't automatically make it casual.
Comicvine is the only site I know that uses this mentality.
Considering Frieza also said he was going to destroy the planet but ended up failing is a good indicator on why you can't always take a characters word. Yes Frieza was holding back, but he still though that was enough energy to destroy Namek. How do you know Vegeta didn't miscalculate like Frieza, or that he wasn't lying like he did 5 seconds earlier. Since you believe everything you read, you must also accept saiyan saga Vegeta was the strongest warrior in the universe.
Nothing in King Cold's statement points to them not being able to planet bust in one shot with planets much larger than the Earth.
That's a straw man argument. I never said they couldn't bust planets much larger than Earth with one shot. King Cold's statement that they can't destroy at least a few extremely massive plants somewhere in the universe. There could be planets thousands of times bigger than Earth.
The logical reasoning to this would be, because the planet is small, there wouldn't be a need to leave the ship and do the inevitable. Instead, they could just destroy all of the fighters and inhabitants in one shot and call it a day. Nothing hints or even leads to them needing to use full power to destroy any planet.
Another straw man argument. I never said King Cold or Frieza needed there full power to destroy Earth or other small planets. I said even at full power there are some massive planets they can't destroy in one blast. Even in his first Form Frieza could destroy small planets. His final form could most likely casually destroy all mid sized planets and still destroy almost any large planet. There are probably just a few the can't destroy with one blast. There has to be at least one planet they can't destroy with one blast if you go by King Cold's statement.
Super Anime is the confirmed continuation of the manga, and my statement, once again, was referring to your usage of Boros planet busting statement.
Then why does super have Gregory in it? He was never shown in the manga, but he is on King Kai's planet with no introduction like everybody knows him already. Also Bulma makes a reference to the frog Ginyu filler.
You're responding to this, so I'm going to assume you found some calculations or sources from a site, correct?
You asking me this leads me you aren't very knowledgeable on physics or gravity. That's like asking for proof that is was more than 2x gravity. Any adult with an understanding of science and gravity could figure out that Saitama was under more than 100x gravity just by looking at what was happening. Some guy calculated and he said Saitama was under 8,000x normal psi, but I don't trust fan calcs since they don't know what they are talking about, and the guys in the comments of his post even said there was more to it than what he was calculating.
This doesn't make sense at all, because there is no split durability or whatever in Dragonball.
Then why are dragonball characters constantly hurt by physical attacks that aren't even close to the level they can bust with ki blasts? The only explanation is punches do less DC but all the energy is concentrated into a fist so they hurt their opponent. Saitama has better punching feats than dragon ball characters though so his punches should hurt them.
You do the math since you're set on arguing travel speed.
Goku racing from one end of the planet to the next in an instant, versus Saitama jumping from the moon to the Earth in 15-19 seconds.
Goku's travel speed was instant, but I'm talking about the couple seconds it took for him to grab Roshi's glasses and come back. Goku went 10,000 kilometers (a quarter of the Earth) and then came back. To grab Roshi's glasses it took lets say 1-2 second. To go there and back would be 20,000 kilometers. That's half way around the planet. So Vegeta can't go half way around the planet in a couple seconds. they way he looked so mad, it would obviously take him much longer. The moon is about the distance of 7x the Earth's circumference. Goku went the distance of halfway around the planet in 1-2 seconds (he only took that long to grab the glasses) so 7 times 2 is 14. Saitama went 14 times the distance as Goku did. So if Goku actually did that feat with pure speed they would be almost exactly the same speed, but that wasn't Goku's speed it was IT and Vegeta was much slower than that. So from that we know that Saitama is faster than Vegeta at that point.
And my random scan said he was on the other side of the planet, so I'm requesting that you prove how my scan doesn't hold precedence over the anime, and manga.
Do I really need to start tagging people to explain why the manga and anime hold more weight than a scan? Even the Daizenshuu is chalk full of misinformation and contradictions.
Krillin and Piccolo were the only ones who knew of the technique, and no evidence points to Trunks knowing of the Taiyoken. Again, they were literally in shock that Cell could use their techniques, which is why none of them avoided it. You can't place a decent argument against DB characters being lightspeed in any of your posts.
Piccolo already saw Cell use the kamehameha. He shouldn't of been that surprised. And who cares about Trunks? Krillin and Piccolo not dodging it is all I need for my argument. And I could give you more evidence dragon ball characters aren't light speed. Goku's speed across snake way was calculated as way lower than light speed. It took Krillin and Gohan hours to go across Namek. It took Buu saga Gohan around 30 minutes to go to school. Like I said before, the speed of light can go around Earth 7 times in a second. No dragon ball character before the Gods showed that type of travel speed. You could argue they have light speed combat speed, but they don't actually have any quantifiable combat speed feats so it would just be speculation.
Ironically enough, Saitama witnessed Boros, a massively hypersonic character, coming at him before being punched in the face, yet this is never brought to discussion whenever his speed is being conversed.
What's this have to do with anything? Saitama let Boros hit him. Saitama could of one shot Boros at anytime and Boros admitted that Saitama was holding back that whole time.
And you should give sources that would say the scan isn't canon, but you're incapable of doing that for some odd reason.
-_- It contradicts the official manga and anime... There is no source that mentions canon about anything dragon ball. In the dragon ball community the dragon ball manga holds the most weight out of anything. Scans made by a random company don't hold as much weight as the official manga.
Religious example?..
It works here. It doesn't matter who is right or wrong, the person who bring up the claim needs to bring the proof. You even said this earlier in your own post. So you are being a hypocrite.
I posted the scan, and you claimed it wasn't canon but haven't supplied any sources that would make your claim correct. It isn't up to me to argue that the scan is canon, it's you, the one who believes the scan to be random, to supply a source of some sort that would confirm the scan has no precedence as you've been arguing for the past several comments.
So I can post any random scan I want without fact checking them and everyone else has to check their validity? LOL That's obviously not how it works. That scan would be fine if it didn't contradict the manga. Goku said they were nearby, that scan said they were across the planet. You choosing the scan over Toriyama, Goku, the manga, and the anime, shows the type of person you are. You are willing to wank dragon ball at any chance. If Goku said they were across the planet in the manga, and the scan said they were nearby, you would obviously go with them being across the planet. I would too but for a different reason. You would do it because you are a dragon ball wanker, and I would do it because it was in the actual manga.
It's simple debating and logic, as you stated, so give me a source.
You must either be a kid or someone who isn't educated in how research works. All research needs to be backed by sources or it disregarded. If you were a scientist and brought evidence for something and told others that they have to prove it isn't real they would laugh at you.
Anyone with a basic understanding of Dragonball would also realize that the manga and Super Anime are the only logical canon.
You mean besides all the filler characters and references and the fact it aired right after dragon ball Kai and has Kai flashbacks? Or maybe all of the plot wholes and inconsistencies in it. Canon means continuity. continuity means: "the unbroken and consistent existence or operation of something over a period of time." "the maintenance of continuous action and self-consistent detail in the various scenes of a movie or broadcast." Super doesn't flow well with the manga. It might be the main accepted canon as of now. But anyone logical would realize that super anime doesn't flow well with the original manga. The fact they mentioned a Ginyu filler scene that wasn't in the manga at all is the very definition of a lapse in continuity.
Coming from you, I'll pass.
The difference between you and me is I'll accept when I'm wrong, but I only do so when there is evidence. I used to think Vegeta was a planet buster but I changed my mind. I'll also believe Vegeta can beat Saitama if you can prove it, but you have yet to back up any of your claims.
Why does Toriyama have to hold the hand of CV debaters?
He doesn't, but it's obvious for anyone who read the manga that Goku doesn't know the exact amount of energy needed to destroy a planet. You are the one making outlandish claims that some country bumpkin knows exactly how much energy is needed to destroy a planet, even though that's shown not to be true in the Frieza arc.
Goku literally states the reasoning as to why Freeza didn't destroy the planet in one go, do I need to post the actual scan for this because, again, there is no reason Toriyama has to elaborate on every single move and decision his characters make in the manga.
In my scan all Goku said is Frieza got scared and blew it. He never mentioned about Frieza holding back at the last second. Maybe he does in your scan, idk. I would like to see it.
ONE confirmed that the Yuusuke's redrawn version of the manga was the official canon of the Onepunch Man and that Yuusuke was allowed to add in slight changes and details a while back. It's not silly at all.
If that's true, you are right. But I would like a source for that. People also say ONE said Saitama can destroy half the universe with a punch, yet I have never seen the source so I don't believe it.
It's all logical, considering this is what Toriyama was portraying with power scaling the first half of Dragonball Z.
Toriyama's power scaling has never been logical.
Only on Comicvine will you find asinine posts like these.
Except there is plenty of evidence to back it up. Krillin was terrified of planet warping power, but if you used power scaling he should be able to tank multi moon level attacks. Goku was afraid of a planet being cut down the middle, when he should be able to casually survive planet level attacks.
This was enough power to impress saiyan saga level characters.
Toriyama confirmed with his very own words that the anime would be taking place right after the Boo arc, and later confirmed in a recent April interview that the Anime > Manga for Super. The only filler Super character was Greg, who is now apart of the actual canon continuity.
I know the anime takes place after the Buu arc... When else would it take place? Show the the interview that says anime>manga. Also Mr. Satan's filler minions were also in it.
Kicking someone to the moon is nothing more than a mountain level feat of strength.
Show me a dragon ball character destroying a mountain with a kick.
I can, because nothing denounces or contradicts Vegeta from being anything lower than a planetary buster.
You mean besides all of the times dragon ball characters were scared and impressed by feats way lower than planet level? Or how the second time a character claimed they would bust the planet they failed?
You're really going to use that as reasoning? Vegeta made that statement out of the fact that he was one of the very last few survivors of the Saiyan race, and also the strongest Saiyan at the time. This was more than obvious.
You just made that up. He just said he was the strongest warrior to ever live.
Vegeta wasn't a liar.
Yes he was. Back then he was a liar and a cheater and would do anything to win. For example he threw dust in Zarbons eyes to help beat him.
If Goku evaded the blast, he would have only prolonged the inevitable, because the planet would have been destroyed from Vegeta's GG.
It's a possibility.
This is where I drop the debate after this post.
That's because you can't possibly win this.
About the planet core busting you could only have 1 of 2 arguments. Both are terrible.
1. You thought planet busting meant destroy the planet but not the core. This is wrong. When someone says planet busting they mean destroying the crust, mantle, and the core. All parts of a planet. Last time I checked planet busting didn't mean destroying all parts of a planet except the core.
2. You actually think busting the core is harder than busting the core, mantle, and crust at the same time. I'm pretty sure this isn't the one you are thinking of because it's just to insane to think that.
Yes, he did look relaxed and unconcerned. Look at the scans again.
This one is more of a matter of opinion.
Or, as Goku reasoned, and Freeza later stated in his 100% form, he didn't want to be caught in the explosion of the planet.
He still wanted to blow the planet, he just didn't' want to make the explosion too big. He was also only afraid because he already took a lot of damage.
Considering Freeza casually destroyed a planet with 10x the gravity of Earth, which was calculated as Star Busting from several sites with calculations that weren't proved incorrectly, I'm inclined to disagree and will continue to stand by my statement.
King Kai's planet was also x10 Earth's gravity but I wouldn't call destroy that small star level. I also wouldn't trust those fan calcs.
@watcher_killer4: Vegeta was almost killed by this.
Saitama wasn't even phased by this.
Which looks extremely close to this.
@alextheboss: Jumping from* the moon is not actually that better. The gravity is 6 times lower than earth gravity, and when you are at vaccum you have no resistence against you.
Also, being faster than Nappa> jumping from the moon in a few seconds.
Nappa is fast enough to dodge Piccolo's best attack. While he was distracted I might add.
Piccolo before training for the Saiyans is able to instantly destroy the moon (or in roughly 2 secs going by the anime).
And that's just a regular blast, so regular pre-training Piccolo blast = roughly light speed. Light takes about 1.5 secs to reach moon from the Earth.
Raditz was also able to do the same feat with a little more trouble.
I really can't see how Saitama isn't going to be blitz here.
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