Saitama vs Naruto

Nah, I jusr wanted you to have a ball reading his arguments. those made me smile and chuckle for hours. Don't worry for anything.

@purple_d_dragon:

Look I am really getting tired of your arguements which sounds nothing but a desperate call without any logic which again fueled by your biased thought and double standard self.

The Artificial Sun was actually an energy barrier surrounding the core, the castle was around the Core, and I think you already know a Core alone doesn't have enough mass to produce a strong gravity pull, but Kurama fell down as Naruto and the others were able to fly up, so the gravity pull is stronger in the lower part of the moon, or the damaged core is closer to the lower part than to the upper part, or maybe it is just Ninja magic, either way, it does not disapproves the already clear evidence of gravity coming from the crust.

Make it clear, whether you want to debate using logic or you just gonna said its just ninja magic for things you can't explain, coz I see no point in debating a guy who try to use physics when he think can downplay and when someone explain things in physics, he just replied everything is magic and stay in denial.

Sorry about being rude, yeah I really had a rough day that day. That morning my GF was insisting to meet her parents after returning from my trip, and I really don't want to, so we had a fight. After that you comment something That I have already addressed in my first post without even reading/understanding it which got me really annoyed. Anyway, I am taking her to a date this evening, hope she won't give me any suprises and things go to normal.

Well I see your point of sea surface being curve, but can be explained with the fact that moon was rotating thus water climbing up the surface curve. Take a transparent ballon fill with water and with some air. Rotate it in an exis, you will see curve surface. That is the reason, sea level in equatorial region is higher than the sea level of other region in the globe except water in the moon is inside.

Now then, you really don't have any other argument that can counter mine.

And Look I am not even interested in this debate, what actually got me into this is PPD's life long struggle to downplay Naruto. Whether moon was hollow or not(which I really don't care), the feat that was displayed in the movie was moon level and thats what I really care about.

@great_black_star: really man? A whole week and that's what you come up with?

I explained my comment about "Ninja magic" already.

And now the moon's rotation is making the water warp? . . . at this point I am not sure if you even care for your credibility in the site.

Saitama, even by feats

@purple_d_dragon:

Well I got through every post you make and realised you didn't even bring anythig that I haven't debunked already. So I see no reasons to further go into trouble uploading scans.

1. You said moon was hollow and centre of gravity was at crust as in Hollow moon theory. I already debunked that by showing how kyuubi and golem were standing on the artificial sun on the other side but fall when they cross the opposite side. If you are getting hard to undersand the logic, let me explain it for you-

a) If he gravity was coming omni-directional from the crust towards the sun, then he only possible explaion to them being able o stand is that the artificial sun has its own gravity powerful enough to hold on ninjas. Now if it had gravity then it doesn't make any sense why kyuubi and golem fall from it. Only reasonable reason is gravity was coming from only one side and they were able to stand coz the sun was in between the CoG and the ninjas.

b) Another part of the prove is that way kyuubi fall and Sai's bird fly. Well every single evidence there proves gravity wasn't coming from omni-direction as you are trying to make it out.

2. You try to say that the hole make by Naruto wasn't as long as I said just by saying it doesn't look that long to you. Seriously? Tell me how should it look if it were that long first. This is where you are just proving your inability to give any reasonable explanations.

3. You try to prove the cyclone of Toneri was hitting the upper shell of the moon. Then again you didn't even bring any frame of reference o show it was actually the upper shell not the down part coz view reference can make all difference from point of reference. Am I making it too hard for you to understand it?

4. Then the other guy bring the curve of water, which makes perfect sense that Moon was rotating at is own axis.

Still Saitama.

@great_black_star said:

@purple_d_dragon:

Well I got through every post you make and realised you didn't even bring anythig that I haven't debunked already. So I see no reasons to further go into trouble uploading scans.

-You haven't debunked crap. the only thing you have done is embarrass yourself.

1. You said moon was hollow and centre of gravity was at crust as in Hollow moon theory. I already debunked that by showing how kyuubi and golem were standing on the artificial sun on the other side but fall when they cross the opposite side. If you are getting hard to undersand the logic, let me explain it for you-

-You keep talking about the artificial sun, but, are you aware the Artificial sun was the barrier around the core? no one ever stand on the barrier.

a) If he gravity was coming omni-directional from the crust towards the sun, then he only possible explaion to them being able o stand is that the artificial sun has its own gravity powerful enough to hold on ninjas. Now if it had gravity then it doesn't make any sense why kyuubi and golem fall from it. Only reasonable reason is gravity was coming from only one side and they were able to stand coz the sun was in between the CoG and the ninjas.

-Or, as I mentioned before, the castle around the core was closer to the lower side of the moon, meaning the pull would make it look like the gravity comes from below. by the way, your graphic makes no sense compared to what I just said.

b) Another part of the prove is that way kyuubi fall and Sai's bird fly. Well every single evidence there proves gravity wasn't coming from omni-direction as you are trying to make it out.

-On the contrary, every single evidence proves the gravity comes from the crust. talking ridiculous crap is hardly a way to debate, so address the points or stop denying what I am posting from the movie.

Kurama and the statue falling down towards the inner face of the crust. (and yeah, spare me the super long tunnel and perception BS, because anyone can see that hole is not that deep)

And the warped sea that goes up to the horizon, and your BS theory about the rotating moon is crap, it is the moon, not the damn Tasmanian devil. the sea doesn't look sniping at all, as your pathetic attempt of an argument says.

2. You try to say that the hole make by Naruto wasn't as long as I said just by saying it doesn't look that long to you. Seriously? Tell me how should it look if it were that long first. This is where you are just proving your inability to give any reasonable explanations.

-You mean like this at least?

As you can see, it looks nothing like the hole Naruto's chakra made. the longer the tunnel, the smaller the other side of the hole looks. and the hole up there is not miles and miles long as you claim the hole in the below image is.

3. You try to prove the cyclone of Toneri was hitting the upper shell of the moon. Then again you didn't even bring any frame of reference o show it was actually the upper shell not the down part coz view reference can make all difference from point of reference. Am I making it too hard for you to understand it?

-I linked you the damn fight, when the cyclone didn't change directions in any moment, as well as explaining how impossible it is for Hinata, Sai and Shikamaru to survive being blasted trough miles and miles of moon rock, as well as explaining how by your theory, Kurama (who was in the inner forest) blasted the statue to the sky and somehow the statue could come from another miles and miles long imaginary tunnel? even so, coming from the exact opposite direction where Kurama blasted it.

or maybe you will try to explain it with your graphic? I would love to see you try.

4. Then the other guy bring the curve of water, which makes perfect sense that Moon was rotating at is own axis.

And you are just suggesting the dumbest thing I've heard in the battle forum, you officially beat DarkRaiden in the talking crap competition.

But yeah, according to you the Moon is spinning many many times in a minute and the water is moving because of the spins as well. . . except neither of those are correct.

Now, at least try to make an effort to save yourself from that. Because I enjoy seeing you trying so hard and coming with such joke arguments.

@purple_d_dragon: Why this being debated again? I mean, using the Hollow Moon theory with a thin crust and ignoring the GBE it was already more than enough to destroy 2,5x of our world moon lol (Still Moon Busting to small planetoid level, Kishimoto probably was only thinking about how cool the scene would be).

Well if you have read his post, you should know his intentions. I just find it funny that his attempts in downplaying Naruto by trying to prove moon was hollow actually is working in favor of Naruto. LOL

And about the calc, I want to make you clear that that calc was purely base on Kinetic energy cause by the concussive force produced by the blast. I haven't included anything about how much energy actually it used to cut through the moon. Thats just the testament of Naruto's strength, he can overpowered 80 exatons of Tnt concussive force with his punch which means he can bust our real moon with that punch.

I was just making it clear, coz I see you were doubting that that was a strength feat or energy resistance feat.

@purple_d_dragon:

You haven't debunked crap. the only thing you have done is embarrass yourself.You haven't debunked crap. the only thing you have done is embarrass yourself.

I see you are still in denial.

You keep talking about the artificial sun, but, are you aware the Artificial sun was the barrier around the core? no one ever stand on the barrier.

Now you are just nit picking, when I said the artificial sun you should have realised tha I was talking about the toneri castle and other flying islands inside the sun.

Or, as I mentioned before, the castle around the core was closer to the lower side of the moon, meaning the pull would make it look like the gravity comes from below. by the way, your graphic makes no sense compared to what I just said.

LMAO, now the castle was closer to the lower side of the moon. So you just throw hollow moon theory out the window coz its not serving your purpose, wow.

-On the contrary, every single evidence proves the gravity comes from the crust. talking ridiculous crap is hardly a way to debate, so address the points or stop denying what I am posting from the movie.

Acually every single evidence proves gravity come from only the lower part of the moon, graviy was never shown to come from omni-directional as you are suggesting. And I just provide you proves, I can't help it if you think thats a crap just coz it debunked your point *sigh*

And the warped sea that goes up to the horizon, and your BS theory about the rotating moon is crap, it is the moon, not the damn Tasmanian devil. the sea doesn't look sniping at all, as your pathetic attempt of an argument says.

Now you are just reaching. Look at the scan again it was warped but not going full 180 degree as you want o prove.

And I am not even quoting further quotes anymore, it just seems you are just ****hurt and resorting to insults in an attempt to agitate me. Well thats not going to work coz only thing you are capable of is making me giggle with your dedication in downplaying Naruto.

EDIT: Naruto is moon level, whether the moon was hollow or not, so sorry if that hurts you. Anyway I am quiting from this pointless debate coz my goal in proving Naruto's strength is already accomplished.

-Yeah? I couldn't care less about the calc, I am not debating that, I am debating the Hollowness of the Moon, the rest depends on other factors I am not arguing here, maybe in the future I would talk with @mudamudamuda about it, because I do respect him as a reasonable and good debater who at least puts effort on providing evidence.

@hiddenlight: what's enough to destroy 2.5x of our moon?

The energy required to destroy Narutoverse hollow moon.

Been done before, Naruto gets one-shotted

@hiddenlight: Nobody destroyed the moon in Naruto though.

If that moon was equal to our world moon, then Toneri's attack would be more than enough to disintegrate it.

For reference, that attack packed 80 Exatons of energy (And that's being pessimistic, ignoring things like the GBE who would make the number even bigger), while the energy required to obliterate our world moon is roughly 30 Exatons.

@hiddenlight: how did you come up with these numbers? Shouldn't completely disintegrating the moon use more energy than cutting it in half?

Hey Hidden, do you really believe in that calc? I mean, I always have my doubts because of this:

Every time I search for the GBE thing, it says it states the energy required for the mass to be separated to the point of no return, and the Moon obviously got closer to the point where the gap was no more than 15 meters apart.

I mentioned Muda's that same doubt and after searching for the formula and feeling overwhelmed by the complexity in calculating the Earth's GBE, I decided to show you this page. There you can see how there are more formulas involved and needed to calculate Earth's GBE, one of them is calculating it layer by layer, which I think it would be a better method to calculate Toneri's feat as the moon is hollow. I really hate maths, so If you could do it I would be most grateful.

Edit: oh wait, you came out with that number with out the GBE?

Narutoverse moon for instance had way more mass than our world moon as it had the same gravity as Earth, even ignoring the GBE of that moon and using the kinetic energy required to make the halves move a few kilometers, that would still be way above the amount required to destroy our world moon.

The calculation puts that in the account and it's from there that this number came up. Making their Moon hollow actually makes the problem even worse.

The answer for that is simple: Kishimoto sucks at physics and probably never thought about that when making the movie and the novel, but the damage is done.

@purple_d_dragon said:

@alextheboss said:

@hiddenlight: Nobody destroyed the moon in Naruto though.

Hey Hidden, do you really believe in that calc? I mean, I always have my doubts because of this:

Every time I search for the GBE thing, it says it states the energy required for the mass to be separated to the point of no return, and the Moon obviously got closer to the point where the gap was no more than 15 meters apart.

I mentioned Muda's that same doubt and after searching for the formula and feeling overwhelmed by the complexity in calculating the Earth's GBE, I decided to show you this page. There you can see how there are more formulas involved and needed to calculate Earth's GBE, one of them is calculating it layer by layer, which I think it would be a better method to calculate Toneri's feat as the moon is hollow. I really hate maths, so If you could do it I would be most grateful.

Edit: oh wait, you came out with that number with out the GBE?

Yes, we needed to ignore the GBE and only considered the energy required to make the halves move away from each other, in other words, the kinetic energy involved as the only data that we had was the gravity pull of the moon and it having possibly the same radius of our world moon.

With the GBE involved the number would be a lot bigger as I was discussing with Muda in the previous pages, but I can't prove my point as there was no evidence that the moon was becoming whole once again by the end of the movie. IMO It wasn't and Toneri fixed it in some way as himself hinted, but that's just speculation of my side.

@hiddenlight: How do we know their moon is bigger than ours?

There are two possibilities, and the result is the same, or their moon is bigger (Improbable) or it is denser (The one used in the calculation). The results would be above our world moon in any of those two possibilities, even if their moon was hollow.

@hiddenlight: Ya, but why do you think it has more mass?

It is not, it just have more gravity, even though it is hollow, with the crust being basically all of his mass.

Two reasons:

1. It had the same gravity pull of Earth, both in its interior and in its surface.
2. It had enough gravity to keep a thin atmosphere on its surface.

how is this not an absolute stomp for saitama

Well, Saitama is outclassed in speed

durability (See the calcs above, that was concussive force) and versatility.

@hiddenlight: Versitality yes.

But speed is debatable. Saitama was dodging Genos, who was outracing his own Blast may not be light speed but it is close and is better than anything in seen in Naruto

As for Durability, Saitam punched away an attack that was going to destroy the surface of the Earth and he was still holding back. Naruto isn't surviving multiple punches like that.

We of CV argue over the dumbest things. This Thread got extremely Off-Topic

@purple_d_dragon: @purple_d_dragon: Ok, I see what you guys are saying. I doubt the writers thought about it though, lol.

(1) Based on...? I mean, how this is better than Naruto closing the gap on Madara even before his lightning finished touching the ground? Remembering that even Raikage outpaced lightning and as KCM Naruto was faster than him. And finally, Kakashi also outpaced a lightning jutsu in the beginning of Shippuden, you could argue that the attack was slower than natural lightning, but couldn't I say the same about Genos attack?

(2) That was a statement, not a feat, we don't know how truly powerful that attack was, and he overpowered it with a serious strike, I agree that he was holding back, but he wasn't also goofing around. Still not as impressive as Naruto tanking an attack with enough concussive energy to destroy our moon 2,5 times tbh.

One sided, One Punch Man wins, with ease.

Based on the fact that lasers move at light speed. Also theres fact that lightening jutsu is not as fast as actual lightening

Well considering he can kick people to the moon, an Earth surface wiping attack is not far fetched and in the webcomic it doesn't even specify the surface. Also the fact is one of those serious punches will be able to do significant damage. Also that attack cut the moon in half, it never destroyed the entire moon.

@hiddenlight: Why GBE is bring up in this debate? Calc never included GBE to begin with.

This is really embarassing.

@emperorthanos: Kid Goku, Batman, Cap America and Peter Parker had dodged lasers. Unless stated otherwise, lasers in fiction are not light-speed or every street level character should be able to react at those speeds.

@hiddenlight: @great_black_star: Oh, look who is back, want to give actual arguments using evidence or you are just going to run away from the proves.

:)

Hey Hidden, what do you think of his spinning Moon argument?

@great_black_star: @emperorthanos: How do we know that those were lasers and not just energy attacks? By this logic any fodder jedi in Star Wars is MFTL+. And where it was stated that lightning jutsus move slower than actual lightnings?

And there's a massive difference between kicking people to the moon and destroying the surface of a planet, the former would require mach 40+ movement speed and the latter would require dozens of exatons.

As for black star, just commenting on why it wasn't used.

@caped_baldy: except none of those characters also have feats of going from the moon to the Earth instantly

Why would characters need to have same feat o prove superiority when the they have entirely different storyline? By that logic of yours Saitama is faster than Flash coz Flash never have feats of going from moon to earth right?

This is really childlish, do you even have any diginity?

Why are you using travel-speed, do you know the difference between travel-speed and reaction speed right? Saitama doesnt have light speed feats reaction wise. If you are going to claim that Saitama is LS bc he outraced and dodged some energy lasers that move at an unknown speed, go ahead, but then you'll have to accept that Batman and Spiderman can react to light-speed attacks...

@emperorthanos: Sorry man, but those beams were not lightspeed, because Genos was faster than the attack but unable to tag Sonic, those beams would be hypersonic at best.

@great_black_star: phfff, says the guy who can't even debate using evidence or logical arguments.

Naruto.

Seriously, says the guy who don't even listen to logic and resort to everything is magic crap.

@purple_d_dragon: @caped_baldy: @great_black_star:

I was never arguing that Saitama was light speed originally. I was just telling Hiddenlight where people get the argument from because he said people just randomly stated it.

That being said Saitama's speed is more than enough to keep up with Naruto. And there is no proof that Naruto can survive Saitama's punches

he parried an attack that split the moon and was able to tank the jubbi bijuu dama which destroyed mountain ranges as big as islands.

@dawnone: which is great but Saitama was able to punch away an attack that could wipe the surface of the planet

*stands and gives a round of applause*

Well done ladies and gentlemen. This was the finest piece of Saitama wank I've seen in a while. And it seems you are not done yet.