Revan vs Count Dooku and General Grievous

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Black_Of_Shadow

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Rules

  • Everyone at their primes
  • Standard Morals
  • Location : Kashyyyk - Rwookrrorro
  • Distance : 20 Meters
  • Legends / Canon all are available

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Bat_Siri

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Team......

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DarthAnt66

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#4  Edited By DarthAnt66

Revan definitely. He can discard Grievous off the bat (especially given the sixty feet gap) and then proceed to dominate Dooku without really any difficulty.

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decaf_wizard

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#5  Edited By decaf_wizard

Sabers only I could see the team taking it every time, but otherwise Revan wins every time because of the force advantage

I honestly see Grevious getting oneshot with force lightning or somthing

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Emperordmb

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DarthAnt66

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@bat_siri said:

Team......

How does the team have a chance to stand against Revan in an all-out battle?

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Bat_Siri

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@darthant66:

How does the team have a chance to stand against Revan in an all-out battle?

Grievous distracts Revan by Dying then Dooku sneaks Behind him and Cuts down Revan :P

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Sirfizwhiz

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Team. Dooku is not far off in force, and both himself and Grievous crush in dueling.

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Jonez_

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Grievous is a very weak link, and Dooku loses a solid majority.

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WollfMyth209

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Team stomps in sabers, honestly.

And, given how Grievous would get murked by Revan's Force powers, Revan can take all out.

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freesid_stf123

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Revan definitely. He can discard Grievous off the bat (especially given the sixty feet gap) and then proceed to dominate Dooku without really any difficulty.

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JarJarBinks

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#13  Edited By JarJarBinks

@darthant66: I have a question.

Why do you think Revan could dominate Dooku?

Especially when Dooku was stated to have been equal to Windu and able to beat nearly every opponent?

Dooku carried a lightsaber with a curved handle and practiced an elegant fighting style; he could outclass nearly any opponent except for Yoda.

Source: Insider #113

The Count's blade was quick as a viper striking. Among the other Jedi, perhaps only Mace Windu would have been his equal on neutral ground: but here on Vjun, steeped in the dark side, his bladework was malice made visible—wickedness cut in red light.

Source: Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

Was stated as one of the most powerful Jedi and history, yet got even stronger as a Sith Lord.

He was one of the most respected and powerful Jedi in the Order's twenty-five-thousand-year history, yet at the age of seventy Dooku's principles would no longer allow him to serve a Republic in which political power was for sale to the highest bidder.

Source: Revenge of the Sith

This is Dooku, Darth Tyranus, Count of Serenno:

Once a great Jedi master, now an even greater Lord of the Sith, Dooku is a dark colossus bestriding the galaxy. Nemesis of the corrupt Republic, oriflamme of the principled Confederacy of Independent Systems, he is the very personification of shock and awe.

Source: Revenge of the Sith

Credit to ShootingNova's and WollfMyth's respect threads.

I personally am not too sure who'd win, but I find it unlikely that Revan would just dominate Dooku without any difficulty.

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DarthAnt66

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#14  Edited By DarthAnt66

@jarjarbinks said:

@darthant66: I have a question.

Why do you think Revan could dominate Dooku?

Especially when Dooku was stated to have been equal to Windu and able to beat nearly every opponent?

I personally am not too sure who'd win, but I find it unlikely that Revan would just dominate Dooku without any difficulty.

Revan's complete and utter domination of the Beniko / Marr / Shan trio (telekinetic 'ragdolling' and then maintained incapacation) suggests he can do the same to just one individual (i.e. Dooku) who isn't even substantially more powerful than the latter two members (i.e. Marr and Shan). And then when we later see the Force disparity between Revan and any individual protagonist is such that Revan can "discard" them with the Force in the Temple of Sacrifice, I fail to see why he can't do the same to Dooku when, say, Darth Nox is casually backhanding Darth Thanaton's lightning, the Barsen'thor is blasting through massive doors and defeating Sith with the power of hundreds of Jedi, etc. Like Dooku, the four protagonists are some of the most powerful beings in history and virtually unmatched in their era save a select few.

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echostarlord117

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I'll pretty much reiterate what's already been said. Because this is an all-out battle, this basically comes down to Revan vs. Dooku which would result in Revan winning.

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Erkan12

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Team everytime.

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reikai

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People greatly overestimate Dooku's power. He's really not all that strong at all and most we hear of his accolades are in reference to his saber skills, not his Force powers. Revan is an absolute beast when it comes to the Force. Heck, Satele trumps Dooku in Force power and she couldn't hope to face Revan alone. Going by the gameplay, she wasn't just fighting either, she was using Battle Meditation to amp the entire team. And it was still a monumental struggle against what was essentially 1/2 Revan.

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JarJarBinks

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#18  Edited By JarJarBinks

@darthant66:

Revan's complete and utter domination of the Beniko / Marr / Shan trio (telekinetic 'ragdolling' and then maintained incapacation) suggests he can do the same to just one individual (i.e. Dooku)

Except it's not like the trio were combining their force defenses together when he broke through them right? He still only got through each of their force defenses individually, even if he got through all of them at once right? You understand what I'm saying? Feel like I'm not exactly explaining that well, but I'm sure you get what I mean.

who isn't even substantially more powerful than the latter two members (i.e. Marr and Shan).

Really? What have they done that suggests they're approaching Dooku's level? Shan I can somewhat understand, but not really Marr.

I fail to see why he can't do the same to Dooku when we have beings like Darth Nox who is casually backhanding Darth Thanaton's lightning

Thanaton isn't really Dooku material, tbh. Even so, wasn't Nox amped by the force ghosts at the time?

the Barsen'thor who is blasting through massive doors and defeating Sith with the power of hundreds of Jedi,

Blasting doors isn't anything above Dooku, but as for the Sith thing, when did this happen? :o I've played through the Consular twice and I don't remember this.

virtually unmatched in their era save a select few.

Perhaps, but I think this means more when it comes to Dooku, considering his era consists of people like Windu, Obi-Wan, Anakin, Yoda, Sidious, Grievous etc. All top tier duelists.

On a side note though, was curious do you think the HoT could beat Satele Shan? And could the Barsen'thor beat Satele?

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noobsnowman

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Team stomps in sabers, honestly.

And, given how Grievous would get murked by Revan's Force powers, Revan can take all out.

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DarthAnt66

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#20  Edited By DarthAnt66

@jarjarbinks:

Except it's not like the trio were combining their force defenses together when he broke through them right? He still only got through each of their force defenses individually, even if he got through all of them at once right? You understand what I'm saying? Feel like I'm not exactly explaining that well, but I'm sure you get what I mean.

Surely, but I never argued otherwise. Of course there's a distinction to be made between dominating Darth Marr and Satele Shan at the same time, and then dominating a Force user with the combined power of Darth Marr and Satele Shan. However, Revan's still dispersing his power across multiple extremely powerful individuals and is incapacitating them all simultaneously. That's a feat well beyond what Dooku has any hope of showing.

Really? What have they done that suggests they're approaching Dooku's level? Shan I can somewhat understand, but not really Marr.

Darth Marr is Satele Shan's equal, in all honest. That's the way they are portrayed in the game, the way their roles work, and was specifically stated by the two in Knights of the Fallen Empire. So if you're placing her relatively close to Dooku, do the same to Darth Marr as well, that's the only common sense approach there. Even besides that, Darth Marr's position as being the most powerful Sith in the Sith Empire short of the protagonists, Vitiate, Darth Malgus, and the Dread Masters is certainly impressive given how there are thousands upon thousands of warriors there. He's additionally stated to have routed entire armies in combat, deflected assaults more thoroughly than any planetary shield, absolutely dominated Darth Larchis, etc.

Thanaton isn't really Dooku material, tbh. Even so, wasn't Nox amped by the force ghosts at the time?

Darth Thanaton isn't on Dooku's same level, sure, but to suggest Dooku is literally backhanding his lightning and then telekinetically forcing him to kneel like Darth Nox did is pretty silly. He's one of the most powerful Sith Lord in the galaxy with extensive knowledge on extremely deadly and ancient Sith rituals. And yeah, but the Force Ghosts are always present within Darth Nox. She's forever amplified by their power.

Blasting doors isn't anything above Dooku, but as for the Sith thing, when did this happen? :o I've played through the Consular twice and I don't remember this.

Lord Vivicar's plague allowed him to siphon the power from the "hundreds" of Jedi infected since they were all bound to him. Their power was so deeply connected that if you were to kill him, all the Jedi under his influence would be killed as well. He tells you this before and after you defeat him. Barsen'thor did this shit way before her prime.

And eh, the feat is certainly comparable to Dooku's most impressive telekinetic showings. And Barsen'thor did this feat far, far before her prime as well.

Perhaps, but I think this means more when it comes to Dooku, considering his era consists of people like Windu, Obi-Wan, Anakin, Yoda, Sidious, Grievous etc. All top tier duelists.

Why? We know he's on the same level as Windu and Kenobi, inferior to Skywalker, and head-over-heals inferior to Yoda and Palpatine. What relevance does that knowledge hold other than that we know he's on Windu's level? His lightsaber skill should be meaningless next to Revan's command of the Force and the ninety foot gap that he has to cross before he can even reach Revan according to the description. Dooku's mastery of Makashi isn't going to be important against a wave of telekinetic power.

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DarkDefender

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Team.

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Black_Of_Shadow

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bump

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JarJarBinks

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#24  Edited By JarJarBinks

@darthant66: I think you've raised some very good points and I'm starting to agree with you.

Still, I want to address a few things.

However, Revan's still dispersing his power across multiple extremely powerful individuals and is incapacitating them all simultaneously. That's a feat well beyond what Dooku has any hope of showing.

Didn't really think of it like that before :o Good point! From what I've gathered people seem to be trying to suggest that they were mounting up a combined defense that Revan casually got through, which is why I mentioned it.

Darth Marr is Satele Shan's equal, in all honest. That's the way they are portrayed in the game, the way their roles work, and was specifically stated by the two in Knights of the Fallen Empire. So if you're placing her relatively close to Dooku, do the same to Darth Marr as well, that's the only common sense approach there.

This is reasonable. Even if he may not have the same quality/quantity of feats that Shan has, his position and authority would be an implication of his power. Sometimes you can't just go by feats, but what roles the characters are supposed to fill. Agreed here.

Why? We know he's on the same level as Windu and Kenobi, inferior to Skywalker, and head-over-heals inferior to Yoda and Palpatine. What relevance does that knowledge hold other than that we know he's on Windu's level? His lightsaber skill should be meaningless next to Revan's command of the Force and the ninety foot gap that he has to cross before he can even reach Revan according to the description. Dooku's mastery of Makashi isn't going to be important against a wave of telekinetic power.

Eh, I just consider those folks to be better than the top fellas around in those times. Obviously excluding Vitiate. But agreed, Dooku's skill with the blade doesn't mean much if Revan chooses to use his powers.

Don't really have much else to say other than why u no answer my question? :(

On a side note though, was curious do you think the HoT could beat Satele Shan? And could the Barsen'thor beat Satele?

Other than that I think you've raised some good points and I'm pretty convinced now.

Jar Jar approved!

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DieHard200904

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General Grievous definitely goes down early. The big advantage he ever had on Jedi is that hardly any of them had any willingness to use force lightning or force crush on him. Dooku, I am not so sure because Dooku I can see pulling some tricks or letting Grievous be an expendable diversion to get at Revan. It's not always raw power that wins either, such as Anakin Skywalker vs. Obi-Wan Kenobi on Mustafar.

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SithRevenant

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Revan stomps.

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ParagonNate

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Team, every time.

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Erkan12

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#28  Edited By Erkan12

@reikai said:

People greatly overestimate Dooku's power. He's really not all that strong at all and most we hear of his accolades are in reference to his saber skills, not his Force powers. Revan is an absolute beast when it comes to the Force. Heck, Satele trumps Dooku in Force power and she couldn't hope to face Revan alone. Going by the gameplay, she wasn't just fighting either, she was using Battle Meditation to amp the entire team. And it was still a monumental struggle against what was essentially 1/2 Revan.

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My eyes hurt just from reading this... That's just wrong.

Yoda had taken a personal interest in Dooku for his extraordinary connection to the Force.

Source: The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia

Dooku's strength in the Force made him enigmatic for even Yoda.

Source: Attack of the Clones: The Ultimate Illustrated Guide

Aware of Dooku's power and his dark side leanings, Sidious took Dooku as his new apprentice and Darth Tyranus was born.

Source: Insider #34 (Relaunched)

Thanks for @shootingnova for this respect thread ; https://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/shootingnova/blog/count-dookudarth-tyranus-respect-thread-part-2/130930/

On the contrary, I find Dooku's Force powers more threatening than his lightsaber combat skills. He started the fight with his Force powers against AotC Anakin and Kenobi. He would lose to Savage + Ventress, and he would lose to TCW S4 Anakin if not for his Force powers. Same goes to the duel with RotS Kenobi at the Invisible Hand.

That doesn't mean he is at the same level with Revan in the Force though. But saying that Dooku's Force powers aren't a huge factor is blatantly wrong.

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Lord_Tenebrous

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Team wins every single time in a decently difficult fight unless Revan one-shots Grievous, in which case, Revan wins in a great duel.

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BreakOfDawn

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#30  Edited By BreakOfDawn

Team. Considerably more skilled swordsmen and Dooku's definitely got enough power on his side to hold his own against any incarnation of Revan. Now if it was the Outlander, I might side with him/her.

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dark-sith123

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#31  Edited By dark-sith123

Revan

(dies)

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ArkhamAsylum3

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Revan.

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Necromancer76

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#33  Edited By Necromancer76

Revan quickly dispatches Grievous with the force and proceeds to defeat Dooku. It's likely that a lightsaber duel doesn't occur.

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decaf_wizard

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Sabers only I could see the team taking it every time quite easily, but otherwise Revan wins every time because of the force advantage

I honestly see Grevious getting oneshot with force powered up force lightning or somthing

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ParagonNate

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Seriously? Team stomps 10/10

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DeutschKurzhaar

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Prime Revan is pretty scary, I don’t think his saber ability is good enough to beat both at the same time, he definitely would beat them separate tho. He’s better known for his force skills

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happyconformist

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Revan one-shots Grievous. Dooku's out of ragdoll range, but he still gets dominated.

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AnonymousJedi

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#38  Edited By AnonymousJedi

Lmfao - Revan is humiliated in a duel, but wins force and probably all-out, though I'm not 100% sure

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DarthAnt66

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Team. Considerably more skilled swordsmen and Dooku's definitely got enough power on his side to hold his own against any incarnation of Revan. Now if it was the Outlander, I might side with him/her.

I think it was you who discussed Revan vs Dooku with me a couple months back. Did you ever respond back to me on that?

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BreakOfDawn

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#40  Edited By BreakOfDawn

@darthant66: I'm not sure to be honest. If it was me and I didn't reply, sorry about that. I've got a habit of taking ages to reply to things.

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Laurus

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Dooku solos.

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happyconformist

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@anonymousjedi: That's debatable, but it's also irrelevant. A 20 metre starting distance gives Revan ample time to crush Grievous ala Mace, arguably to a far greater extent. He can then telepathically dominate Dooku, continually teleport away and hurl infinite objects at his adversary, or near-instantly kill him with lightning.

Grievous is a non-factor, and Dooku simply can't handle Revan in a force bout.

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AnonymousJedi

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@happyconformist: Which part is debatable? Revan being humiliated in a duel? If so, I am not sure why you are mentioning force powers - I already stated Revan wins that round. He isn't winning 'Sabers-only at all, though

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xolthol

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Revan stomp

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deactivated-5cae4704c27f5

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Revan decimates these guys with his hands tied behind his back.

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Helloman

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Revan wins.

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deactivated-5c359ed39a233

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Team takes sabers. Dooku solos.

All out: Revan takes it with the force. Grievous would get dispatched right away, then Dooku dies not long after

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Void_Reborn

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Grievous can honestly close 20 meters of distance before Revan abuses his force.

In sabers Revan gets murked. An argument can be made for Count soloing in this regard but Grievous makes it a stomp.

Dunno about all out, Revan could win.

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Void_Reborn

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Grievous can honestly close 20 meters of distance before Revan abuses his force.

In sabers Revan gets murked. An argument can be made for Count soloing in this regard but Grievous makes it a stomp.

Dunno about all out, Revan could win.

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ScotticusRex

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Revan loses in sabers. All out, he could eliminate Grievous pretty quickly. Dooku would give him the business Force-wise and if it came down to sabers, Dooku takes it.