Qui Gon Jinn vs Ven Zallow

Vs.

> Elimination via Death or Knock-out.

> Random encounter.

> Starting distance: Close quarters.

> No prep time.

Setting: The Mustafar Planet. Unpopulated area.

Either way honestly.

Qui-Gon.

Qui Gon jinn

Qui-Gon Jinn

Honestly, either way.

Qui Gon Takes This!

bump...

I think this is fairly close.

Thoughts? @SilentBat@themuser@shootingnova@thevivas@wollfmyth209@i_like_swords@dadivineking@georgewbush

I think a case can certainly be made for Zallow coming out on top here. I may be willing to try.

I say Jinn takes it 7/10 times.

50-50.

Honestly Jinn.

I'd say Zallow in a brilliant fight

Qui-Gon Jinn; he's the more powerful Force user, and his hype and feats as a swordsman do surpass Zen's.

The ease with which Zallow was cutting down the Empire's strongest warriors and the fact that he was contending so closely with Malgus leads me to believe that he can replicate any of Qui-Gon's dueling feats.

I'd like to THINK it could go either way, but the simple fact of the matter is that Ven got beaten by Malgus on a light side nexus, and Qui-Gon got killed by TPM Maul (for whatever reason, whether he was caught off-guard or merely slow or weak), whom I like to consider NEAR Deceived Malgus, on neutral ground.

Either way or Qui Gon.

Qui Gon for a slim majority.

Also, I disagree that Zallow's fight against Malgus was particularly a "close" one.

@kigretheviking: zallow

considering malgus needed to use trickery to beat him, it was pretty close

@kbroskywalker: Malgus didn't trick him; he outsped him, used a spin to build momentum, then stabbed him right through his chestplate.

Deception is a natural facet of lightsaber combat.

Objectively, all Zallow did in his fight with Malgus was to last for 8 seconds, more or less. Never in the novel it was stated that Malgus was hard pressed or something like that, only that he could defend everything Zallow threw at him but couldn't find an opening to counterattack...until he did, some seconds later.

I never said Malgus stomped Zallow...I said I don't consider their battle particularly "close" as some others did. You're free to argue otherwise if you consider that fighting Malgus for 6 seconds before being killed is a good showing on Zallow's part.

Qui Gon, in what could be a decent fight.

Objectively, all Zallow did in his fight with Malgus was to last for 8 seconds

I suppose we're excluding when he took all of malgus's force attacks and came out unfazed?

In other words they were evenly matched before malgus used ingenuinity to create an opening

Deception is a natural facet of lightsaber combat.

I never said it wasn't or tried to say malgus's win wasn't fair and square, but when dealing with someone who isn't close to you, you shouldn't need it

@th310rbit:he created the opening because zallow was able to land a hit on him, malgus then used ingenuinity. That wasn't a blunder on zallow's part, that was malgus being clever.

I was explicitly stating about the lightsaber engagement. But yes, while quickly recovering from a force blast from Malgus is a good feat, it's irrelevant to the discussion and Zallow was explicitly on the disadvantage, being thrown around like that.

A disadavantage that proved to be irrelevant in the fight as it didn't lead to anything.

The problem is right here. You focus on the part where Zallow exchange blows with Malgus evenly for some seconds and ignores the part where he dies rightly after. You cannot nitpick to analyze their fight.

And you're ignoring that zallow's death had nothing to do with a deficiency in martial skill or force power.

@kbroskywalker: He could have prevented it if he'd swung in time while Malgus had his back turned.

@geistalt: malgus made it look like he was vulnerable, so zallow commited to efinish him off

@kbroskywalker: I really wouldn't count that as Malgus tricking him. When he said, "you were deceived", he wasn't talking about their lightsaber duel.

I'd back Qui-Gon. Likely more powerful, more masterful and more skilled as a duelist.

@alextheboss: actually per the novel, he feinted getting hurt more than he actually was when zallow punched malgus's cybernetic mask to get him to leave himself exposed with a finishing strike.

How? When Aryn used her master's blade in a tricky maneuver Malgus was quick and skillful enough to not be impaled by her. Zallow, on the other hand, fell for the first unorthodox maneuver Malgus used against him, after 6 seconds of duel.

Thats tactical intelligence and the ability to adapt to the unorthodox, not pure martial skill.

@kbroskywalker: The mask isn't cybernetic, IIRC; it's a simple, non-integrated respirator.

Anyways, all Malgus did after getting his respirator pummeled was back up. He actually EXPOSED HIS BACK to Ven when the latter stepped out of his spin. Then he stabbed him in the chest before he could parry/react.

And that ALL took place IN THE JEDI TEMPLE.

@geistalt: He per the novel was feinting weakness to get zallow to leave an opening, before he was being pressed and while zallow's strikes were all being dealt with, malgus couldn't launch a counter attack.

Until afterwards, sure. I guess that might count as deception, if he knew Ven wouldn't be able to parry in time. But that still doesn't change the fact that Ven fell for it (and couldn't even beat him on the Jedi Temple's Force nexus).

You meant "feigning," by the way.

Eh....ill come out and defend my boy zallow here.......

Ven.

@geistalt: you're going to need to provide something indicating it was a force nexus, if anything the jedi all being killed should have strengthened the sith.

But that still doesn't change the fact that Ven fell for it

Fine but that says nothing of his martial skill or force pwoer. All it says he i can be outwitted, something qui gon has also shown vs maul.

@kbroskywalker said:

Because killing Jedi in the Jedi Temple immediately makes it a dark side Force nexus. /sarcasm

@geistalt: i never said it was a darkside nexus, but sith have gotten stronger through death. Sidious for example grew in power when he killed plagueis.

As far as we know, only Force wounds grow stronger by causing/experiencing death.

@geistalt: sidious is not a force wound, that statement is false.