PYP R1: TheTrueBarry vs Tparks (Need Votes)

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IndieComicsFTW

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#1  Edited By IndieComicsFTW

Rules

No Caption Provided

Master Hands jobs include in the list below.

  • Master Hand will make sure matches are made to give, for example, a all Kryptonian Team magic brass knuckles to help them beat a Ghost Rider Team that would otherwise stomp. Same for Psykers vs a non Psyker team.
  • Master Hand is also in charge of BFR. You can BFR a foe, teammates, or yourself for a total of 5 minuets. after that Master Hand forces you back to the arena where said BFRed person cannot be BFR again for 10 seconds. Anyone who played Smash Brothers understands this concept.
  • Master Hand also keeps Reality Warping and Time Traveling from happening with the mighty wag of his finger. You can slow time or speed it up. You can even Freeze time in certain a 100 foot radius for 10 seconds. But that is it. Molecule Manipulation and Transmutation are all allowed.
  • Master Hand makes sure each match give a 10 second No Rush policy. Your characters will have time to set up spells, force fields, ect before the fight starts. Speed Blitzing will come after 10 seconds.

Additional rules to know.

  • DC characters are all Pre 52 Unless stated otherwise.
  • All other characters are current unless stated otherwise.
  • All characters have standard Gear and no Prep Gear unless stated otherwise.
  • All characters are in character with morals on.

@thetruebarryallen

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Dr. Light, Mirror Master, Captain Atom

@tparks

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Darkness, Invincible, Spawn (First Age)

Conditions

  • Win by Death or KO.
  • BFR and Time Freezing lasts 10 Seconds only before Master Hand Returns all to Normal.
  • All are In Character.
  • 10 Seconds of No Rush.
  • Battlefield: Earth and to the Moon. Both tart 1 Mile away in the Mountains.

Perks from Master Hand

1 Member on BarryAllen's team has a Holy Blessed Sword from Heaven.

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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May I ask what the Holy Blessed Sword from Heaven does for me/what it's abilities are before I assign it to a specific member?

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tparks

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#3  Edited By tparks
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IndieComicsFTW

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@tparks said:

@thetruebarryallen: I'm assuming so you have a way to hurt Spawn.

Yes. Spawn cannot be harmed permanently in any way except Decapitation with a Heaven Forged Weapon or Draining Spawn of his 9999 Necro counter.

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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Alright, cool, I'm getting some scans together since I've never actually used the 3 I have for my team in a Battle, if you'd like to post first feel free, it might take me a day or two.

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tparks

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Pokergeist

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@tparks: There is whole respect threads on these characters.... well TheAcidskull (Hulk) vs Stider92 (Darkness) has Darkness scans.

Alright, cool, I'm getting some scans together since I've never actually used the 3 I have for my team in a Battle, if you'd like to post first feel free, it might take me a day or two.

KMC forums have tons of scans for your characters I do believe on their Respect threads.

Game On. any questions contact this account.

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tparks

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@cadencev2: Thanks for pointing out the strider92 feats. I found a respect thread on KMC for Darkness, but I really don't like using that site if I have to. I also have read the one @cadencev2 wrote for Spawn a while back. That one is pretty solid.

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tparks

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#9  Edited By tparks

@cadencev2: Wait, you're cadencev2. lol. I figured you were indiecomicsftw when I saw the avatar. I'm assuming you are both the same person though and am starting to feel stupid the more i ramble on. lol.

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Pokergeist

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@tparks said:

@cadencev2: Wait, you're cadencev2. lol. I figured you were indiecomicsftw when I saw the avatar. I'm assuming you are both the same person though and am starting to feel stupid the more i ramble on. lol.

:)

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tparks

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#11  Edited By tparks

@cadencev2: This is like the Batman of comicvine just unmasked himself and @indiecomicsftw was under the mask.

Anyways, on to our debate @thetruebarryallen.

I'll post feats of my characters to start.

Darkness

Jackie Estecado has a wide variety of powers that come from his Darkness powers. While wrapped in his darkness armor for example, he has a very high durability.

Durability

Jackie is shown to survive some punishing hits. He will be tough for your team to put down.

Here, he is hit with a tanks shell at point blank range and tanks it (no pun intended).

He's also tanked a bomb explosion and a direct hit from an RPG.

I'm going to need to see feats for your team to see if I need to dig up more durability feats because I'm not sure if it will even come down to this.

On to some more exotic feats of the Darkness power

Constructs

Jackie can form constructs out of darkness. These constructs are only limited by his imagination and have been proven to be very strong. He has so many tools and options for killing your team. For example, weapons.

  • Scan 1: Jackie constructs throwing blades
  • Scans 2 & 3: Powerful guns made from darkness

Here's Jackie using the Darkness for the first time to kill some Angelus warriors. There's also a nice scan of him dodging a shotgun blast from point blank to show off his incredible reaction time

Here Jackie uses Shadows to kill someone while not even being present in the same area.

Here's a scan to show that Jackie is capable of using this on more powerful characters. Here he uses the darkness in the corner of a room to reach out and kill an Angelus. No matter where your team is, they are in danger with Jackie being in the battle. Jackie can control the Darkness from all areas of the field and tear apart your team.

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Jackie can tap into darkness in any location. For example, inside of a body there is no light, so Jackie can tap inside of the darkness inside of a person's body from the inside out and do this. This is a great option for a cheap and easy win for my team. All he has to do is tap into the darkness inside your players bodies and explode them from the inside out.

  • Scan 1: Uses darkness inside of a person to rip their skin off from the inside out.
  • Scan 2: Uses darkness inside of someone to decapitate them

There is also his ability to touch someone, and tap into their darkness to rip them apart.

I'm going to post one more scan of Jackie tapping into someone, but it also demonstrates on of his other powers...

Summoning

Jackie can summon creatures from the darkness. For Example, Jackie taps into the darkness inside this Angelus body to create this serpent creature to explode out of his chest. Jackie will be able to create a small army of darkness creatures to aid the rest of my team against your team. He can also just make one inside your characters bodies and have a very easy victory as well.

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One more power before I move on.

Flight

Jackie can use his darkness armor to grant him flight. This ability gives my team another added edge. Jackie can keep mobile to avoid Dr Light's attacks. This will be a big help in putting Jackie in good positions to use his Darkness powers to his full potential.

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I'm going to need to see your opener before I post anything else. I need some more info on your team before I decide what feats will be meaningful in this debate. As you can tell, Jackie has tons of powers and I don't want to fill this page with just Jackie feats if they are not needed. This should be enough for us to get started though.

Invincible

Invincible has all the stereotypical powers that you'd think of when you think of a super hero. Strength, Speed, Flight, and Endurance. He is also an excellent fighter, and has some of the best will power of any character in comics.

Strength

Invincible is easily the strongest character in this match up consistently. He is a beast when he uses his strength in fights too. Your team better have some great durability feats to counter him, because when he hits, it could easily one shot characters on your team.

Here Invincible is bench pressing 400 tons with ease. He has gotten stronger from these workouts, and is even stronger now then what is shown in this scan.

One of the defining characteristics of a strong superhero is the ability to do a thunderclap. It seems like no one really respects a characters strength/speed until they do a thunderclap. lol. Well, as you can see, Invincible has a pretty good one. The creatures he is thunderclapping away are called sequids. They are incredibly strong and durable for their size due to alterations to their genetics, but Invincible has no problem with them.

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In these scans, Invincible is fighting another Viltrumite named Conquest. Conquest is one of the most deadly and ruthless of all the Viltrumites. Their fight uses so much strength, that a gigantic trench is formed from their fighting along with a giant crater.

One last strength feat. This one speaks for itself.

Durability

Unless you can prove your team has some serious heavy hitters, there is not much you can do to damage Invincible.

In these scans, the dinosaur guy, named Dinosaurus (original, right?) creates a bomb that is so destructive, that when it explodes, it turns Las Vegas into a giant mirrored surface. It was so hot that it melted all of Las Vegas into this material. Anyways, Invincible is standing right in the center of it, and takes no damage.

Here's a few more of him soaking up laser damage and heat damage.

  • Scan 1: Invincible is not even phased by the full power of a magma blast to his face.
  • Scan 2: Invincible is left unharmed by a blast that kills an entire army of Mauler Twins. These Twins are superhuman in durability.

In these scans, Invincible tanks an entire nuclear explosion that he personally sets off because he knows he will be survive it.

The last scans show Invincible being hit by another Viltrumite so hard that a giant crater is formed from the impact. Invincible jokes with her immediately after the impact taunting her for not hurting him.

Speed

I'm not 100% positive because I don't know everything about your team, but I'm pretty sure all of the feats I am providing in this section show that Invincible is capable of moving, fighting, and reacting much faster then your team. I know he can't speed blitz because of the 10 second no speed blitz rule, but once the ten seconds is up, your team is in trouble.

Invincible is capable of more then Mach 10 speed, and can fly at FTL in space. He has reaction times to match this speed too.

Invincible is able to fly from North America to Antartica in less then 39 seconds before the bomb he is carrying explodes.

Invincible's fight with Conquest had them traveling and fighting at such high speeds, that the only way he could be tracked was by satellite. He was moving across the globe to fast for anyone to keep up. No other superheros could help Invincible because no other heroes on earth can travel and fight at this speed. By time they would have shown up to the fight, they could be in a different continent.

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Here's a few final scans to show his speed.

  • Scan 1-2: This shows Invincibles strength, speed, and amazing reaction time. Him and his dad are playing catch with a baseball that flies around the world at supersonic speeds. He even has the reaction time to fly back up and make the catch after he forgets about it. The perfection in strength, speed, accuracy, and reaction time in this has to be completely precise for this to be possible. This is at his weakest version in every ability too.
  • Scan 3: Invincible is able to fly to a different country before a hot dog can fall from his hand and hit the ground. This is also at Invincible' weakest.
  • Scan 4: Not even a teleporter can keep up with Invincible.

I'm going to take this next part word for word right from cadencev2, because his write up is perfect for demonstrating his speed.

1-4) Omni Man Bio states FTL speeds and he proves it by searching the galaxy for another habitual planet to conquer while flying through Space. He can only hold his breath for 2 weeks. Massively FTL.

5-6) Omni Man, Kid Omni Man, and Invincible within less than a hour of the battle on the Coalition of Planets main world had flown from one world in another Solar System to there. That is FTL by alot.

7-8) Viltrumites within one week time frame traveled across the Galaxy to find the planet Omni Man was hiding on after beating on Allen for info. Seems FTL to me lol.

Same thing with Invincible as with Darkness, I don't really want to fill this with too many more scans until I know more about your team.

Spawn

I'm going to take a bit of a minimalist approach with Spawn for now. He has soooooo many powers that I don't want to list a bunch if they are not needed for this fight. I'll post some basic Spawn feats, then I'll post some more after you get your opener up and I know a little more about your team.

Anyways, Spawn's powers come from his power source, Necroplasma. It's a magical energy that let's Spawn perform feats based on how much energy he has. Here are scans that explain Necroplasma, his suit, and magic. This explains how Spawn is a reality warper with his magic. This isn't unlimited, he can only do as much as he has the energy he has in reserves can provide.

Suit, Cape, and Chains.

Spawns suit is a living being. It is capable of attacking and defending Spawn all on it's own. It does not even require Simmon's thoughts to control it. This means that even if Simmons doesn't see one of your characters trying to attack him from behind of sneak up on him, Spawn's suit will compensate and attack for him.

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One of Spawn's main abilities is the use of his chains.

The chains can attack in a huge area. This leaves little room for your team to dodge.

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The chains can also be razor sharp for slicing your team to ribbons.

Here's a scan that shows the speed of Spawn's chains and their reaction time. It easily blocks the machine gun fire from two people. Your team is going to have to be incredible fast to attack through Spawn's chains while he is using them to block.

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Spawns Chains are also incredibly strong and durable. Here he is throwing around at least 10 tons of trees.

They also proved nigh unbreakable as seen here.

On to Spawn's cape. His cape is also a great weapon and defensive tool that will be used in this fight.

  • Scan 1: Here, Spawn's cape reacts and moves quickly enough to block laser fire. That shows it's speed, reaction time, and durability
  • Scan 2: The cape tosses Redeemer around and even cuts his hand off. This shows the shear size the cape can expand too and it's strength.

The suit itself even has a danger sense. It will warn Spawn of danger and act to protect him. It's not going to be easy for your team to get a shot in on Spawn.

Strength

Spawn Strength on average is in the ton+ range. This might not always be enough to really hurt your team. But he can amp up his strength with his necroplasma if need be.

1) Spawn bends steel bars.

2) Smashes through Birck easy.

3-4) Catches a blow that drives his feet into the earth and then flips this large Violator easy.

Spawn can amp himself to 1000+ ton strength. This should be enough to one shot your team.

1) Throws a Thousand tons of Building at Urizen.

2) Hold up the stomping foot of a 100+ meter tall Planet Wrecking God.

Durability

This is where spawn is going to shine on my team. Only one member of your team will really be able to hurt him (whoever you give the holy sword). Spawn has lived with organs like his heart being removed from his body with no effect on him. Only one member of your team is going to be able to do any damage at all to Spawn. You better hope he's pretty incredible with a sword too, because it won't be easy to land a shot on Spawn.

1) Spawn is dismembered and shows he can control severed body parts.

2) Spawn is Electrocuted by whips with many studs, each stud is 50,000 Volts. Spawn gets groggy but no totally out.

3) Spawn can waltz through Lava.

4-5) Spawn shot with a Anti Tank Round through his chest, he gets right back up.

6) Spawn proves by being rammed by a 50MPH Car that he can increase his Durability to the point where this Car does not even Budge him!

Speed

Spawn is another member of my team that is capable of hypersonic speed. After that ten second window is up, my team is coming full force and fast!

1) Spawns Cape moves faster than this Laser Beam! Near Light Speed!

2-3) Spawn moves so fast that he gathers over 11 Shotguns from the very Cops there and Cop Cars faster than Cops can see!

4) Collects 8+ Shotguns from the trunk of Cop Cars faster than the Cops could see.

5) Spawn Suit moves so fast that it causes the very air to set fire from friction! Hyper Sonic+

6) Spawn himself moves faster than the human eye can see!

I'm going to stop here. Spawn has tons of magic powers, but I'll save those for later after I get a better feel for your team.

Your move. I think this is going to be a fun debate, good luck!

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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Lights, Mirrors, Quantum Energy

This should be interesting, I've never used any of these three characters in a debate, nor have I even seen anything that Doctor Light or Captain Atom could do. However, I'm quite confident that with their abilities I should be able to give you one heck of a debate. So without further ado lets get this show on the road!

Doctor Light

Doctor Light is one interesting character, most commonly known for his cruel acts of rape and insanity during the events of Identity Crisis, Arthur Light is the master of all things 'Light'. Commonly seen and used as a 'joke' character, Doctor Light actually possess an incredibly unique set of power that can devastate entire teams of meta-humans and trained heroes.

Before I post scans I'd like to attempt to explain what his powers actually are. Doctor Light is a light manipulator, and because of this he is able to control light for a rather large variety of purposes.

  • Doctor Light can bend all light around him in order to make him invisible
  • Can generate blasts of light energy to hurt and burn his foes
  • Can create force fields to protect himself or others from harm
  • Can generate light constructs for a variety of purposes, sort of like a Green Lantern but without the 'will'.
  • He can Fly
  • He can drain areas of light, thus creating darkness but also increasing his own powers
  • Can take control of anything based on Light ( Heat Vision, Lantern Constructs, Wonder Girl's Lasso)
  • He can also absorb light from the eyes, thus blinding his targets.

Enough talk however, I'll post some of the relevant scans that I found for our master of Lights, though it was rather difficult seeing as he isn't that popular of a character.

Feats

Creates an illusion out of Light Energy
Uses Light Constructs to bind Green Arrow & prevent him from moving
Scan (1) shows him blinding a target via light absorption whereas Scans (2) & (3) show him creating a force field out of Light Energy
Combats 3 different teams of heroes, defeats them with relative ease, and escapes

So with this is appears that Doctor Light will be one of the perfect tools against 'The Darkness'.

Mirror Master

Evan McCulloch is the second Mirror Master and is one of the most dangerous Rouges in the DCU. Originally an assassin the UK, McCulloch moved to America after a business proposition obtain his interest, turning McCulloch from a normal villain into what we would call a super villain. With a deadly mind, and even deadlier set of gadgets, Mirror Master is one foe who always manages to catch his foes off guard.

Mirror Master has the ability to travel through any reflective surface into a dimension known as the 'Mirror World'. Within this world he can accomplish a wide variety of feats, thus making him a jack of all trades. Enough discussion, time to show off what the Master of Mirrors can truly do!

Feats

Mirror Master is able to create a large amount of duplicate versions of himself with seemingly no limit. It also should be known that his duplications can cause harm to his foes and don't act only as distractions.
Scan (1) shows him using his laser gun to turn a foe into a flat piece of glass and shatter him. Scans (2) & (3) show him stealing from a bank by placing the money into the mirror dimension. As it's shown, he's able to move large quantities of objects throughout the Mirror World with ease.
Scan (1) shows him appearing in a reflective surface on 'The Flashes' costume, showing he can appear in pretty much ANY reflective surface. Scans (2) & (3) show him killing someones reflection in the Mirror World and showing that it kills that person in the real world.
Scans (1) & (2) show him casting illusions in his Mirror World where he is essentially a God. Scan (3) shows him using the 'Mirror World' versions of 'The Flash' and summoning them into the real world with ease.

Mirror Master will work wonderfully with Captain Atom, seeing as how his entire body is made of a reflective surface that he can travel through.

Captain Atom

Nathaniel Christopher Adam is the force known as Captain Atom. Captain Atom has been said to be one of the 5 elementals in the DCU, whereas Swamp Thing is the Earth Elemental & Firestorm is the Fire Elemental, Captain Atom is the Quantum Elemental. Captain Atom is probably the most powerful member of my team, and his powers come from a force known as the 'Quantum Field' thus granting him incredibly large amounts of energy. Since his power set is so incredibly diverse I find it necessary to explain a bit of what he can do before I go and post scans galore.

Captain Atom is capable of various things, including:

  • Flight
  • Molecule/Matter Manipulation
  • Energy Absorption on MASSIVE scales
  • Quantum Leap Travel (sends him a week or so into the future)
  • Super Human Strength (on par with Martian Manhunter)
  • Durability to withstand multiple Nuclear Blasts without harm
  • Energy Blasts
  • Energy Force Fields
  • Manipulate ALL forms of energy (he has used this to stop people form using their own powers, he did this to Firestorm)
  • Absorb Matter

Alright, now that I've talked the talk with Captain Atom, it's time to give some proof of my words.

Feats

Absorbing the energy of 'Major Force'
Scans (1) - (4) show him creating an entire Universe whereas Scans (5) - (8) show him destroying that Universe
Creating new heroes for the Universe he created
Manipulates the Molecules of 'Maul' to revert him back into his Human Form. Maul is a 'Hulk-Like' character who grows stronger as he gets angrier. He then takes on several heroes from the Wildstorm universe with ease.
Uses his Quantum Leap abilities to travel into the future and then back to the present
Defeating Firestorm
Defeating Hal Jordan
Defeats Mr. Majestic with ease
Tanking a Nuke with no damage done
A display of his Travel Speed

Alright, now that my team has been displayed, it's time to attack your team!

The Battle

I've been given a Holy Blessed Sword which has been given to Mirror Master to use throughout this fight. Though this is the weapon that will be used to slay Spawn, I assume that it also works just like any sword would against other foes.

Since we're given 10 seconds before we're allowed to attack each other, Mirror Master will take Doctor Light and pass into the Mirror World via Captain Atoms reflective Dilustel Body. Once inside of the Mirror World, Mirror Master will begin to create a large quantity of duplicates of himself.

While Mirror Master & Doctor Light travel into the Mirror World, Captain Atom will have been instructed by Mirror Master to transmute one of the Mountains nearby into an incredibly large prism that can be used to direct light & reflections in all sorts of directions. Thus creating a weapon that will be used by both Mirror Master & Doctor Light.

Once your team makes its way to attack my own they'll be ambushed and dispatched of quickly, here are the steps to the defeat of your team.

1.) Blind Invincible

Since eyes are reflective surfaces, Mirror Master will appear within the eyes of Invincible, thus blinding him instantly. Mirror Master will leave some of his duplicates within the eyes to keep Invincible blinded and swinging wildly. The duplicates will also be taunting Invincible in order to anger/distract him.

With Invincible blinded it'll be easier to focus on the other two members of your team and dispatch of them.

It's also entirely possible that Mirror Master could just have Doctor Light & himself come out of the Mirror World via Invincible's Goggles and then have Mirror Master shoot him with his laser. When this happens it'll turn Invincible into a glass version of himself who can be shattered with ease, thus effectively bringing him out of the fight.

2.) Ignite the Darkness

This may be false, but when I did my reading up on 'The Darkness' it was said that he has a weakness to the light. Thankfully I have a team member who can manipulate all forms of light (not just visible light) thus being the kryptonite to 'The Darkness'.

With the large prism that Captain Atom created he'll be able to direct light into a multitude of directions. Doctor Light will first absorb the Light from the eyes of The Darkness to blind him, distracting him for a quick matter of seconds. Then Doctor Light will absorb energy from the light around him and will focus it into the prism. The prism will then send light in various directions, creating a weapon of mass destruction.

If this alone isn't able to defeat 'The Darkness' then Captain Atom will use his abilities to manipulate ALL forms of energy to manipulate his own control over The Darkness, thus wrestling for control over the power and making 'The Darkness' weaker. A couple blasts of quantum energy combined with the impact of Doctor Light's energy should be enough to KO 'The Darkness'.

3.) Slay the Spawn

Spawn is probably the most feared foe on your team for me, this being due to the fact that he can only be killed by decapitation via the Blessed Sword.

With Invincible & Darkness out of the fight it'll allow my team to focus on bringing Spawn down. Using the giant prism Mirror Master will display the duplicates of himself that he has been creating in the Mirror World, now Spawn wouldn't know who to attack or who the real Mirror Master is, the entire time Mirror Master would still be within the Mirror World. If all of this has taken 5 minutes than he will be kicked out of the Mirror World for 10 seconds, though his duplicates should take the hits & Captain Atom will put a quantum field around the true Mirror Master to protect him. Once the 10 seconds are up he'll go right back into the Mirror World to wait for the destruction of Spawn.

Doctor Light might actually die during this, but it'll be his job to try and protect Captain Atom while he flies towards Spawn for a wicked H2H battle. Once Captain Atom gets up close he'll begin smashing Spawn, taking blow for blow. All while this is going on Mirror Master will poke his hand though the chest of Captain Atom while holding the sword and will swing to decapitate Spawn.

So yeah, that's the current plan. I can't wait to see your counters because this'll be one fun match :)

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tparks

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@thetruebarryallen: Great post! I'll try to get mine up later today. Sorry I didn't really give a strategy in the first post, but I needed some more info on your team before I could have an idea of what's going on in this battle. This should be a good one, each of our teams has some nifty counters that should make this a pretty interesting round by time we're through.

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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@tparks said:

@thetruebarryallen: Great post! I'll try to get mine up later today. Sorry I didn't really give a strategy in the first post, but I needed some more info on your team before I could have an idea of what's going on in this battle. This should be a good one, each of our teams has some nifty counters that should make this a pretty interesting round by time we're through.

Thanks!

I tried to get a 'sort of' strategy in there but I'll wait until you pull out the big guns and try & counter the best I can :)

You've got some cool team members & I've never battled at such a high tier.

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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Oh wait, I just realized that BFR & Time Freezing only lasts 10 seconds before everything returns to normal.

I think that means that MM is only allowed to go into the Mirror World for 10 seconds at a time, which is still enough time to create tons of duplicates & bring them back into the real world, and he can travel from place to place easily in 10 seconds, so it doesn't really change my plans all that much.

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tparks

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#16  Edited By tparks

@thetruebarryallen said:

@tparks said:

@thetruebarryallen: Great post! I'll try to get mine up later today. Sorry I didn't really give a strategy in the first post, but I needed some more info on your team before I could have an idea of what's going on in this battle. This should be a good one, each of our teams has some nifty counters that should make this a pretty interesting round by time we're through.

Thanks!

I tried to get a 'sort of' strategy in there but I'll wait until you pull out the big guns and try & counter the best I can :)

You've got some cool team members & I've never battled at such a high tier.

I usually stick to the street level stuff also.

Oh wait, I just realized that BFR & Time Freezing only lasts 10 seconds before everything returns to normal.

I think that means that MM is only allowed to go into the Mirror World for 10 seconds at a time, which is still enough time to create tons of duplicates & bring them back into the real world, and he can travel from place to place easily in 10 seconds, so it doesn't really change my plans all that much.

Quick question on this. Are you planning on using the BFR right from the start of the match, or after the 10 second no speed blitz buffer?

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@tparks said:

@thetruebarryallen said:

@tparks said:

@thetruebarryallen: Great post! I'll try to get mine up later today. Sorry I didn't really give a strategy in the first post, but I needed some more info on your team before I could have an idea of what's going on in this battle. This should be a good one, each of our teams has some nifty counters that should make this a pretty interesting round by time we're through.

Thanks!

I tried to get a 'sort of' strategy in there but I'll wait until you pull out the big guns and try & counter the best I can :)

You've got some cool team members & I've never battled at such a high tier.

I usually stick to the street level stuff also.

@thetruebarryallen said:

Oh wait, I just realized that BFR & Time Freezing only lasts 10 seconds before everything returns to normal.

I think that means that MM is only allowed to go into the Mirror World for 10 seconds at a time, which is still enough time to create tons of duplicates & bring them back into the real world, and he can travel from place to place easily in 10 seconds, so it doesn't really change my plans all that much.

Quick question on this. Are you planning on using the BFR right from the start of the match, or after the 10 second no speed blitz buffer?

Due to me mixing up the rules

It will happen at the 9th second of the 10 second buffer. Thus preventing Doctor Light & MM from getting blitzed.

Captain Atom should be fine due to his speed & durability.

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#18  Edited By tparks

@thetruebarryallen:

Rebuttal

Dr Light

The feats you posted for Dr Light were pretty rad, but none of those feats were against anyone on the level of my team.

Uses Light Constructs to bind Green Arrow & prevent him from moving

This one for example, Green Arrow is pretty strong for a street level character, but my characters can push 600-1000s of tons with combinations of their powers and physical strength.

For Example,

No Caption Provided
  • Correct me if I'm wrong, but Doc Ock has carbonadium arms. Dr Light's constructs should shatter in seconds when Invincible touches them

His constructs will definitely not hold up if Jackie does this.

  • Here, Jackie transforms into a giant creature. I don't think Dr Light's constructs can hold up to this.

Even if he does wrap up Spawn, Spawn can send his chains out to hunt down Dr Light and rip him apart. Spawn also has sufficient strength to break that construct, but chains are more fun. Just because Spawn is standing still, does not mean he is not a threat.

No Caption Provided

1.) Blind Invincible

Since eyes are reflective surfaces, Mirror Master will appear within the eyes of Invincible, thus blinding him instantly. Mirror Master will leave some of his duplicates within the eyes to keep Invincible blinded and swinging wildly. The duplicates will also be taunting Invincible in order to anger/distract him.

Invincible is super durable. His goggles pretty much shatter every time he gets in a fight anyways. Robert Kirkman has actually made jokes about Invincible only wearing goggles because he thinks he looks cooler even though they offer no purpose. All Invincible will have to do is smack his eyes and shatter Mirror Master. This is no problem for Invincible. Also, do you have any scans of Mirror Master appearing in someone's eyes? This seems like a pretty exotic ability that he has never used before.

It's also entirely possible that Mirror Master could just have Doctor Light & himself come out of the Mirror World via Invincible's Goggles and then have Mirror Master shoot him with his laser. When this happens it'll turn Invincible into a glass version of himself who can be shattered with ease, thus effectively bringing him out of the fight.

See above about Invincible's goggles. That really is not that big of a deal. It also puts Doctor Light right in front of Invincible, which is a very bad place to be. Nothing you have shown so far makes me think Dr Light can even hurt Invincible. At best he will be a mere distraction.

Mirror Master

Just like Dr Light, Mirror Master hasn't really done anything to any high level caracters in the scans you provided. Sure he showed up in Flash's costume, but that's about it. It didn't really do anything to Flash.

You also have Mirror Master creating dupes.

Mirror Master is able to create a large amount of duplicate versions of himself with seemingly no limit. It also should be known that his duplications can cause harm to his foes and don't act only as distractions.

The Darkness can easily counter this with his own dupes.

  • Here he creates dupes to fake his own death.

2.) Ignite the Darkness

This may be false, but when I did my reading up on 'The Darkness' it was said that he has a weakness to the light. Thankfully I have a team member who can manipulate all forms of light (not just visible light) thus being the kryptonite to 'The Darkness'.

He used to have a weakness to light. Any of his darklings will be destroyed by light, but his powers have grown to where they do not effect him personally.

No Caption Provided
  • So here you can see that Jackie himself is immune to light. It really didn't do much to him but slow him down for a second. His Darkness armor did not disappear.

Captain Atom

Captain Atom is the only one on your team I really have any concern with. He is the only one shown that can hang with the level of characters my team has. I have a great counter to this, but I'll put it in my strategy, which is....right now!

Strategy

Peace out, boy scout! (BFR Cap Atom)

While your team is BFRing themselves, my team is going to be getting ready to BFR your most powerful character, Captain Atom. As soon as Dr Light and Mirror Master return, Spawn will do this.

This is a black hole to hell. With Captain Atom out of the picture for ten seconds, your other two characters are really out of their league. BFRing Captain Atom will also not allow him to create a giant mirror. Has he ever done anything like that anyways? This sound like another exotic power that I don't see him using.

7 years of bad luck for Invincible (Mark shatters the mirror master)

Invincible will be taking on Mirror Master. Invincible has plenty of experience dealing with characters who can teleport who are much more powerful then Mirror Master. Angstrom Levy for example. Angstrom Levy is a genius with the ability to travel through dimensions. He used this ability to travel to an alternate dimension where technology is much more advanced. He used the tech from this universe to give him super human abilities besides his inter-dimensional travel like enhanced strength, durability, and speed. It didn't work out that well for him.

No Caption Provided

I feel bad for Mirror Master.

No more Dr Light

Spawn and the Darkness can take care of Dr Light.

Spawn can teleport around the battlefield. This will help him keep his distance from the Holy Sword. It will also help him get into position to kill Dr Light.

  • Here is Spawn teleporting faster then light.

Jackie will be summoning Darklings all around Dr Light. I'm positive Dr Light can easily dispatch these guys with his light powers, in fact I'm counting on it. The Darklings are there as an alternative. Dr Light can either focus on the Darklings, or focus on Spawn. He isn't going to have time for both, but both are very capable of killing him. Jackie also isn't going to just be standing around waiting. Jackie is going to summon some darkness powered guns and start spraying bullets at Dr Light to keep him even more distracted.

I'm assuming Spawn will be the one to kill Dr Light, since he will have an easier time dealing with Dark powered beings. HE will have no such time with Spaw. Spawn will teleport in range of Dr Light while he is distracted with Darklings and Dark powered bullets. When he is in range, he will be using his magical energy attacks along with his chains to finish off Dr Light. He will continue closing the distance and will finish of from close range if Dr Light is not dead already, which he should be. Here's Spawn's magical energy projection at work.

1-2) Blasts vs Redeemer.

3) Blasts blast hole in Violator.

4) Hell Blast that could melt the Gates of Heaven.

All of this should take less then 10 seconds with the speed my characters can move at. That will be about the time Captain Atom comes back from his 10 second vacation in Hell. He's going to wish he stayed.

The Death of Cap Atom

This is a 3v1 scenario. Cap Atom has no chance against something like this and with Mirror Master gone, there really isn't anyway to hurt Spawn.

I see this going down with Invincible getting the final win. Invincible has tangled with guys at Cap Atom's levels. Invincible is fast enough and strong enough to get the job done. He also isn't afraid to do what ever it takes to win. Here's an example of him battering his own face over and over to beat a very brutal Viltrumite called Conquest. Conquest has durability near Superman levels, but Invincible manages to turn his skull into jelly using his own head as a weapon.

No Caption Provided

I'm looking forward to your reply. This is turning into a pretty fun one, hope your enjoying it too!

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@thetruebarryallen: Post is finished, I don't know if you caught the half post I had when my internet crashed, but I have it complete now.

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wow I am going to have an uphill fight if I reach either of you 2

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@tparks:

Lovely post, though it appears as if you're selling some of my team short! No problems though, I'll just have to fix that!

"The feats you posted for Dr Light were pretty rad, but none of those feats were against anyone on the level of my team."

I won't lie, the characters that Doctor Light fought against weren't exactly the cream of the crop. When I posted the construct feats it was mainly to show that Doctor Light has the potential to create solid light constructs. The more light energy he absorbs, the more powerful his constructs would be. He can also drain the light from any 'light based' characters on your team, which I don't believe you have any.

However it should be noted that his powers will hurt Darkness a lot more than a simple magnesium flare, and if he were to absorb light from Captain Atom who has near infinite energy due to being the Quantum Elemental he'd be able to increase his powers by an INCREDIBLY large amount. Thus he'd be able to seriously hurt Darkness.

I had posted a set of scans in which Doctor Light takes on 15 + heroes at once and survives, and even though they're 'Kid Heroes' it still doesn't take away from how experienced and powerful some of them were. A couple that got KO-ed during that fight were:

  • Superboy - Has Kyrptonian level Super Strength & Durability
  • Wonder Girl - Olympian Powerhouse
  • Starfire

He was also tanking hits from multiple Titans along with dodging hits. Doctor Light may not have incredibly large muscles or be able to bench thousands of tons, but his light fields are powerful, his energy beams pack a bunch, and his ability to blind everyone on your team with ease makes him an incredibly deadly foe.

"His constructs will definitely not hold up if Jackie does this."

Jackie is much stronger than Doctor Light. However like I mentioned earlier in my plan, Mirror Master can appear within the eyes of Jackie, not just the goggles.

If MM appears in the eyes then Jackie is prevented from seeing anything, he can leave some of his duplicates there and then while Jackie is occupied and afraid because he just got blinded out of nowhere Doctor Light and Mirror Master can fly out in front of him through his Goggles ( Doctor Light can fly ) and then MM can fire a blast at Jackie the moment he leaves the goggles, thus turning your 'Invincible Warrior' into a shard of glass who breaks with the slightest touch.

"Even if he does wrap up Spawn, Spawn can send his chains out to hunt down Dr Light and rip him apart. Spawn also has sufficient strength to break that construct, but chains are more fun. Just because Spawn is standing still, does not mean he is not a threat."

Doctor Light was never really attacking Spawn, Spawn is being saved for Captain Atom because they're the only two that can go toe to toe. It's also true that those chains pose quite a threat.

I assume Spawn would be afraid the moment he saw THOUSANDS of Mirror Master duplicates all holding a Heavenly Blessed Sword charging towards him, especially since Mirror Masters duplicates aren't just holograms or dull images, they're physical beings that can attack. Spawns chains might be a bit too busy going after all the MM dupes while he tries to save his own skin than to attack Doctor Light who isn't seen as that great of a threat.

"Invincible is super durable. His goggles pretty much shatter every time he gets in a fight anyways. Robert Kirkman has actually made jokes about Invincible only wearing goggles because he thinks he looks cooler even though they offer no purpose. All Invincible will have to do is smack his eyes and shatter Mirror Master. This is no problem for Invincible. Also, do you have any scans of Mirror Master appearing in someone's eyes? This seems like a pretty exotic ability that he has never used before."

I'd hope he's durable or else his name would be a lie! The goggles shattering doesn't really put that much of a damper in my plan, as the main target is his eyes, the goggles are just there as an escape route & Invincible wouldn't have the time to get in a fight and break them before MM & Doctor Light did their thing.

If Invincible punches his own eyes I don't believe he'd shatter Mirror Master, he's just in the reflection, so Invincible would just be gouging out his own eyes, and that's probably not something you'd want him to do.

As for scans of MM appearing in the eyes of his foes, I do happen to have the scan.

No Caption Provided

As you see, his duplicates are all capable of sitting in the reflection of the eyes and blinding his foes. Mirror Master may have a goofy name but he is fully capable of appearing in ANY reflective surface.

See above about Invincible's goggles. That really is not that big of a deal. It also puts Doctor Light right in front of Invincible, which is a very bad place to be. Nothing you have shown so far makes me think Dr Light can even hurt Invincible. At best he will be a mere distraction.

It does put Doctor Light directly in front of the BLINDED Invincible. Also, don't forget that with Doctor Light is Mirror Master who has a gun capable of turning people into glass and killing them with ease. So the moment that they exit the goggles Mirror Master would be ready to shoot.

It's also worth mentioning that Mirror Master has INCREDIBLE reflexes considering his main target has always been 'The Fastest Man Alive' (The Flash) and he's fought Jay, Barry, Wally, and Bart. He knows how to deal with speedsters and considering Invincible won't know what's going on he's going to be caught off guard and defeated with ease. Doctor Light isn't even there to attack Invincible, he's just there to grab MM when they fly out since Doctor Light can fly and Mirror Master cant.

He used to have a weakness to light. Any of his darklings will be destroyed by light, but his powers have grown to where they do not effect him personally.

Alright, so his Darklings get destroyed instantly by Doctor Light.

So here you can see that Jackie himself is immune to light. It really didn't do much to him but slow him down for a second. His Darkness armor did not disappear.

Well, that was only a small flare, not a full blown attack from a man whose powers revolve around Light. Plus Doctor Light is able to move around the photons around his body to create his attacks, he doesn't just need a visible light source, he can work with the entire spectrum. Light will be drawing his power from thin air to focus it on Darkness.

Plus the light from Doctor Light isn't just like a small flashlight shine. It actually hurts and is capable of killing people, heck, he killed Sparkler from the team 'Force of July' with a Light Blast to the chest.

No Caption Provided

Tore a hole right through his chest. I do believe that Darkness will be hurt by this considering Light is one of his said weaknesses, he was stunned by a tiny flare, and Doctor Light will have a much more focused blast.

While your team is BFRing themselves, my team is going to be getting ready to BFR your most powerful character, Captain Atom. As soon as Dr Light and Mirror Master return, Spawn will do this.

This is a black hole to hell. With Captain Atom out of the picture for ten seconds, your other two characters are really out of their league. BFRing Captain Atom will also not allow him to create a giant mirror. Has he ever done anything like that anyways? This sound like another exotic power that I don't see him using.

I'd be much more worried if Captain Atom didn't have the ability to Quantum Leap/Teleport. He's able to move through the time-stream with this ability and I had several scans above that displayed it.

QUANTUM LEAPING IS THE BEST

So I don't know how long he'll actually be gone for, plus Captain Atom being gone for 10 seconds (if for some reason he CAN'T quantum leap outta' hell) isn't really that big of a deal.

Also, you're undermining the powers of Doctor Light & Mirror Master. Though they're not physically strong they're some of the most dangerous due to their unique powers. As I mentioned earlier Mirror Master can actually kill people THROUGH their reflections. So if he kills their reflection he kills them.

Mirror Master can also send out Mirror World versions of your team to fight for him, so you'll have to fight distorted versions of your own team members. He's done it to Flash before so he could easily do it to these guys.

No Caption Provided

See, Mirror Master is able to control these duplicates and they'll fight for him. So your team is going to be fighting twisted versions of themselves along with all of Mirror Masters own replicas, Doctor Light, and Captain Atom.

As for the 'Giant Mirror' which is actually a prism used to reflect light in every which way, Captain Atom WILL be able to create it. I don't believe you're allowed to attack my team for the first 10 seconds, this is plenty of time for Captain Atom to transmute the matter of a Mountain into a large Prism.

And yes, he can do that. He created an ENTIRE universe by himself once and then populated it with his own versions of the Justice League.

Entire Universe, less then 10 seconds too.

Invincible will be taking on Mirror Master. Invincible has plenty of experience dealing with characters who can teleport who are much more powerful then Mirror Master. Angstrom Levy for example. Angstrom Levy is a genius with the ability to travel through dimensions. He used this ability to travel to an alternate dimension where technology is much more advanced. He used the tech from this universe to give him super human abilities besides his inter-dimensional travel like enhanced strength, durability, and speed. It didn't work out that well for him.

The problem I see here is that Invincible first has to lay a hand on Mirror Master, which I just don't see happening. As I mentioned earlier Mirror Master is teleporting DIRECTLY into his eyes to blind him, then he's leaving a small handful of duplicates in Invincibles eyes to keep him blinded.

Invincible won't be able to see MM and MM will have a TON of duplicates running around the field. The Mirror World is a dimension that MM uses to move from reflection to reflection but Invincible won't be able to enter the Mirror World, Mirror Master isn't bringing him there. Mirror Master is just traveling through the Mirror World to reach the reflections in Invincibles Eyes.

Plus, Mirror Master isn't getting into a punching contest with this guy. He's teleporting INSIDE of his eyes, then leaving through the Goggles with Doctor Light while Invincible flails around being all blind & whatnot. Then the moment he leaves he's blasting Invincible with his gun to turn him into a giant shard of glass, thus killing him. Yes, he can do that too.

No Caption Provided

See, Mirror Master just has to pop his hand out and pull the trigger, easy as that.

I feel bad for Mirror Master.

I feel bad for Invincible ^_^

Spawn can teleport around the battlefield. This will help him keep his distance from the Holy Sword. It will also help him get into position to kill Dr Light.

Don't forget, the one with the sword is Mirror Master, who can appear in any reflection. Plus the duplicates from Mirror Master can attack Spawn and they'll all be holding Swords too, so Spawn has to keep away from all of them while trying to focus on Doctor Light.

It should also be noted that the Prism that Captain Atom created earlier is going to help create duplicates EVERYWHERE on this battleground.

No Caption Provided

See, the Prism will be sending duplicates all through the field, Mirror Master has done it before and now he has an even LARGER Prism because Captain Atom has some incredible powers & can create some pretty neat stuff with his whole 'Molecule Manipulation'.

Jackie will be summoning Darklings all around Dr Light. I'm positive Dr Light can easily dispatch these guys with his light powers, in fact I'm counting on it. The Darklings are there as an alternative. Dr Light can either focus on the Darklings, or focus on Spawn. He isn't going to have time for both, but both are very capable of killing him. Jackie also isn't going to just be standing around waiting. Jackie is going to summon some darkness powered guns and start spraying bullets at Dr Light to keep him even more distracted.

Doctor Light will be absorbing Light energy from everything around him. His shields should work just fine and his Light Blasts should destroy the Darklings like you said. Plus if Doctor Light were too create a Light Bomb with himself at the Center I see Jackie getting quite hurt. Doctor Light did it in the scans I posted earlier when fighting the Teen Titans in order to practically KO their entire group.

I'm assuming Spawn will be the one to kill Dr Light, since he will have an easier time dealing with Dark powered beings. HE will have no such time with Spawn. Spawn will teleport in range of Dr Light while he is distracted with Darklings and Dark powered bullets. When he is in range, he will be using his magical energy attacks along with his chains to finish off Dr Light. He will continue closing the distance and will finish of from close range if Dr Light is not dead already, which he should be. Here's Spawn's magical energy projection at work.

Spawn might be able to, but remember Spawn will be fighting off the Mirror Master duplicates (probably with his chains) that all have the sword mentioned earlier that can kill Spawn. Plus Captain Atom is still in this fight and he'll be charging right into Spawn and manipulating his powers. Captain Atom can manipulate any form of energy, magic or not. If it's energy he can absorb it and manipulate it.

All of this should take less then 10 seconds with the speed my characters can move at. That will be about the time Captain Atom comes back from his 10 second vacation in Hell. He's going to wish he stayed

He'll be back before the 10 seconds are up due to Quantum Leap or Mirror Master could save him through reverse BFR and bring him back into the fight quicker.

This is a 3v1 scenario. Cap Atom has no chance against something like this and with Mirror Master gone, there really isn't anyway to hurt Spawn

Unless you can counter what I've posted, then it's either a 3v1 or a 3v2 (my team still standing, Invincible Dead, Darkness either dead or close to death).

Plus if Mirror Master DID die SOMEHOW then Captain Atom could just go and grab the sword, not that big of a deal. However Mirror Master isn't dead and I don't see him dying in this scenario due to how safe he's playing it.

I see this going down with Invincible getting the final win. Invincible has tangled with guys at Cap Atom's levels. Invincible is fast enough and strong enough to get the job done. He also isn't afraid to do what ever it takes to win. Here's an example of him battering his own face over and over to beat a very brutal Viltrumite called Conquest. Conquest has durability near Superman levels, but Invincible manages to turn his skull into jelly using his own head as a weapon.

Well Invincible SHOULD be dead at this point. If he somehow survives than Captain Atom should still be fine. Captain Atom has tanked Nukes & can change the physical makeup of Invincible to make him a weakling. He was able to do it to Maul from Wildstorm & turn him back into a weak human form.

Captain Atom is incredibly durable, especially since he has a Dilustel shell, something that only X-Ionizer technology can break through. He might take a beating but I don't see Invincible breaking him, especially since Invincible is dead at this point in time.

This means that once Invincible dies Mirror Master will continue creating duplicates. These duplicates will combat the Darkness duplicates that Jackie is creating to help give Doctor Light some space & time to fight Darkness. Darkness vs Doctor Light should end in Doctor Light's victory, especially since Light > Dark.

Mirror Master will also be able to summon the Mirror World versions of your own team, so you'll be fighting twisted versions of yourself.

This entire time Spawn will be fighting Captain Atom, and Captain Atom can't actually kill Spawn but he can hold him down/distract him. Once the Darkness is taken care of Doctor Light will use all of his power to create constructs to hold Spawn down.

The Mirror Master duplicates will rush Spawn while he's being held down and will pile on top of him to hold him down and to attack his head with the Swords. Once his head is gone the duplicates will all disappear and my team shall be victorious!

I can't wait to see what you come up with as a rebuttal ^_^

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#24  Edited By tparks

@thetruebarryallen:

This is turning into a fun one. You had some great counters in this post. I'll get right into re-countering your counters to my counters. (I'm getting dizzy).

However it should be noted that his powers will hurt Darkness a lot more than a simple magnesium flare, and if he were to absorb light from Captain Atom who has near infinite energy due to being the Quantum Elemental he'd be able to increase his powers by an INCREDIBLY large amount. Thus he'd be able to seriously hurt Darkness.

Dr Light is definitely going to be the tough for the Darkness. Dr Light can very much weaken Jackie and keep him from using some of his more extreme powers, but Dr Light still has to be able to hit him.

  • Each one of these scans show how easily Jackie can react to bullets. I know bullets don't travel even a fraction of the speed of light, but Jackie was well ahead of every bullet. Look where the bullets would hit as compared to Jackie's body. This tells me that Jackie is moving before the shot is even fired. It doesn't matter how fast Dr Light's projections and constructs will fire, if Jackie is not even in the location of the shot.
  • The last two scans are the most impressive. He dodges a shot gun blast that is point blank range. It is pretty much touching his head when he shoots.

Jackie can also open up poratals to hold Dr Light in place. Dr Light will probably be able to eventually use his light attacks to get out of the portal, but remember, Jackie is just keeping Dr Light distracted to allow Spawn to put the coup de grace on Dr Light.

I had posted a set of scans in which Doctor Light takes on 15 + heroes at once and survives, and even though they're 'Kid Heroes' it still doesn't take away from how experienced and powerful some of them were. A couple that got KO-ed during that fight were:

  • Superboy - Has Kyrptonian level Super Strength & Durability
  • Wonder Girl - Olympian Powerhouse
  • Starfire

He was also tanking hits from multiple Titans along with dodging hits. Doctor Light may not have incredibly large muscles or be able to bench thousands of tons, but his light fields are powerful, his energy beams pack a bunch, and his ability to blind everyone on your team with ease makes him an incredibly deadly foe.

All of these characters do not compare with the way Spawn attacks. Spawn's magical attacks are going to be too much for anything Dr Light has ever seen.

Here's a battle between Spawn and the Redeemer. The Redeemer has attacks that can actually do damage to Spawn, yet Spawn toughs it out, tanking shot after shot that can do more damage then anything your team can do. He eventually punches a whole through his head and finishes him off with a deadly Hell magic blast. I don't see how Dr Light can counter this.

I know this is a lot of scans, but it's worth clicking through. It's a great fight.

This also brings me to my next point, I don't think Mirror Master has what it takes to take on Spawn. Even if you make dupes of him, he still is not really that physically threatening to someone like Spawn. Just because he has a holy sword, doesn't mean that he is that big of a threat to Spawn. Spawn has taken on plenty of Holy characters who are much more dangerous like Redeemer or Angela and survived. I don't see any of the Mirror Man dupes ever being able to connect with Spawn, or even if they do have the strength to do any real damage. Angela is the top Angel hunter of Heaven, but Spawn has tanked shots from her.

Angela is such a great sword fighter, she can even take on the likes of Gamora and the rest of the Guardians of the Galax. Gamora was trained in more fighting styles then Batman (a lot in sword fighting too) by none other then Thanos, yet Angela still is her superior. She also manages to beat Drax, Groot, Starlord and Rocket Raccoon at the same time. These are the guys who have an on again off again villain relationship with Thanos, but they couldn't hang with Angela. The only way she was put down was by Utau the Watcher blasting her.

So if Spawn can tank shots and hang in fights with someone as talented as this, I don't see what Mirror Man is going to do with that sword. I don't think there are enough sword wielding Mirror Men that can match what Angela can do.

As for your nifty mini Mirror Men in the eye trick (That one is really cool by the way! You're team has some pretty interesting powers I'm learning about)...

No Caption Provided

As you see, his duplicates are all capable of sitting in the reflection of the eyes and blinding his foes. Mirror Master may have a goofy name but he is fully capable of appearing in ANY reflective surface.

I have a simple counter to Mirror Man using this trick. Spawn is able to make objects visible and invisible. As you can see in the scan below, it requires almost none of Spawn's Hell magic to control invisibility like he does with this car. Spawn will just make the two little Mirror Men in Invincible's eyes invisible so Invincible can see (try saying this 5 times fast: Invincible's eyes invisible). If they leave his eyes, Spawn will just make them visible again so my team can kill them. Crisis averted! (I was worried about that trick he can do. lol)

No Caption Provided

Now on to your Prism trick.

No Caption Provided

See, the Prism will be sending duplicates all through the field, Mirror Master has done it before and now he has an even LARGER Prism because Captain Atom has some incredible powers & can create some pretty neat stuff with his whole 'Molecule Manipulation'.

This is also easily countered. Captain Atom is being BFR'd to Hell from Spawn. While he is BFR'd my team will be mopping up your two lesser opponents with the three powerhouses on my team. There will be no point to making a Prism, because Dr Light and Mirror Man should be dead by time Captain Atom is back to make one for them to use.

Even if he does get back in time, Spawn can open up a black hole to suck the prism to hell or have Darkness open up a portal for it to be absorbed into the darkness. Any kind of constructs your team tries to make are going to be sucked out of the battlefield in this fashion. Those abilities are really cool, but with Spawn and Darkness, my team has about a gazillion powers to use to counter any kind of trick your team uses.

  • 1st set of scans are hell portals
  • 2nd set of scans are darkness portals

I'm curious about one of your claims about Captain Atom making his BFR time shorter. Mirror Master can't bring him back, because Mirror Master has no way of traveling to Hell. How is Captain Atom going to escape Hell? He is stuck there for the 10 seconds and 10 seconds is a long time when they are in a fight with someone who has the fighting speed Invincible does.

The rest of your posts assume what I've countered above to have not been countered. I don't see how this can't come down to my entire team vs Captain Atom. I really don't see Dr Light or Mirror Man being able to hang here in a 2v3 scenario after Captain Atom is BFR'd, even if it only is 10 seconds. Invincible will be cleared of his blindness from Spawn, and he can fight at speeds no one on your team can ever hope to match. He could solo those two on his own. Spawn can simply use magic, chains, or his cape to also solo. Darkness would have the most trouble with Dr light, but he could still easily solo IMHO. It only takes a small amount of Darkness for Jackie to tap into to create giant constructs, darklings, or tendrils that are capable of tearing your team apart. Jackie can also tap into the darkness inside of your team's bodies and have Darklings or tendrils erupt from your teams bodies effectively exploding your team from the very beginning of the battle. I don't plan on Jackie resorting to that (it's kind of a cheese strategy that would make this debate a quick one shot win for Jackie and not very fun), but he has that option. So my team opens up a scenario from the start that let's any one of them solo, but they aren't going to need to try, because all three will work together to put down Dr Light and Mirror Men pretty much right off the bat. Captain Atom is going to be way too overwhelmed to deal with the entire team of Invincible, Darkness, and Spawn on his own.

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tparks

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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@tparks:

Dr Light is definitely going to be the tough for the Darkness. Dr Light can very much weaken Jackie and keep him from using some of his more extreme powers, but Dr Light still has to be able to hit him.

Alright, I mean Doctor Light doesn't need to use a focused beam of light to hit him, he can send a giant burst out from inside of him in every direction, so I don't see how Jackie would be dodging it if it's going around him in a radius.

Jackie can also open up poratals to hold Dr Light in place. Dr Light will probably be able to eventually use his light attacks to get out of the portal, but remember, Jackie is just keeping Dr Light distracted to allow Spawn to put the coup de grace on Dr Light.

Okay, you've said that Doctor Light should be able to get out of the portal, which I agree with. Jackie may be trying to distract Doctor Light until Spawn can get there, but there are plenty of other distractions on the field that should be preventing Spawn from getting to Doctor Light that you haven't really addressed.

  • Mirror Masters THOUSANDS of duplicates
  • Captain Atom
  • Mirror World versions of YOUR team

So sure, you've got distractions, and I've got distractions. In a 1 v 1 scenario I'm fairly sure that Doctor Light would be able to overpower Darkness, since Doctor Light has manifested the weakness of Darkness. With Captain Atom, Mirror Master, and the Mirror World Versions of your team on my side fighting for me I don't see Spawn getting through to help.

All of these characters do not compare with the way Spawn attacks. Spawn's magical attacks are going to be too much for anything Dr Light has ever seen.

The main purpose of that was to point out that Doctor Light has been in leagues with Heavy Hitters and is capable of fighting off teams of heroes.

I don't plan on Doctor Light being able to take on Spawn, that's the job for the Mirror Master Duplicates, Mirror World Team, and Captain Atom.

Here's a battle between Spawn and the Redeemer. The Redeemer has attacks that can actually do damage to Spawn, yet Spawn toughs it out, tanking shot after shot that can do more damage then anything your team can do. He eventually punches a whole through his head and finishes him off with a deadly Hell magic blast. I don't see how Dr Light can counter this.

Doctor Light has low durability, it's his constructs that would be taking hits. Also, you're saying that these attacks are more than ANYTHING that my team can do, which is silly. My team is capable of creating entire universes, absorbing and manipulating most if not ALL types of energy, and turning your team into glass and shattering them.

My team may not be filled with brawlers but they're fully capable of hurting and killing your team.

As for Spawn vs Doctor Light, I'll admit that Spawn would win. However my team should prevent those two from ever having to match up.

This also brings me to my next point, I don't think Mirror Master has what it takes to take on Spawn. Even if you make dupes of him, he still is not really that physically threatening to someone like Spawn. Just because he has a holy sword, doesn't mean that he is that big of a threat to Spawn. Spawn has taken on plenty of Holy characters who are much more dangerous like Redeemer or Angela and survived. I don't see any of the Mirror Man dupes ever being able to connect with Spawn, or even if they do have the strength to do any real damage. Angela is the top Angel hunter of Heaven, but Spawn has tanked shots from her.

Mirror Master isn't just taking on Spawn alone, he's got THOUSANDS of duplicates charging Spawn.

He's also got the Mirror Versions of Spawn, Invincible, and Darkness targeting Spawn.

Captain Atom is also giving Spawn a beating.

It's also true, Mirror Master isn't a character capable of benching 100+ tons or flying at light speed. He's got a normal build, some great tech/powers, and good reaction times.

Spawn may be able to fight off a few thousand of the duplicates by themselves, but I don't see him fighting off that entire team, Captain Atom alone should give him trouble.

So if Spawn can tank shots and hang in fights with someone as talented as this, I don't see what Mirror Man is going to do with that sword. I don't think there are enough sword wielding Mirror Men that can match what Angela can do.

Spawn has durability, but he can't fight infinite waves of duplicates, Captain Atom, AND Mirror World versions of your team. Eventually he'll get overwhelmed and one of the Mirror Master duplicates will get a swing in with the Sword for the kill.

I have a simple counter to Mirror Man using this trick. Spawn is able to make objects visible and invisible. As you can see in the scan below, it requires almost none of Spawn's Hell magic to control invisibility like he does with this car. Spawn will just make the two little Mirror Men in Invincible's eyes invisible so Invincible can see (try saying this 5 times fast: Invincible's eyes invisible). If they leave his eyes, Spawn will just make them visible again so my team can kill them. Crisis averted! (I was worried about that trick he can do. lol)

Nice try, but I don't think that'll work here.

Mirror Master travels through reflections due to being in a different dimension, the Mirror World. He is essentially the God of that dimension and can move freely through it. When he's in reflections he's still in that dimension, so he shouldn't be able to be targeted by Spawns magic, unless Spawn's magic works cross-dimensional.

Anyways, it should take less than 10 seconds to kill Invincible at the start of this fight, Mirror Master is quick on the draw, quick with duplicating, and quick with his movement. He'll be in and out before your team knows what happens.

This all ends with Invincible dead due to being turned into glass, he can't really counter that at all.

Now on to your Prism trick.

Ahh yes, that lovely trick!

This is also easily countered. Captain Atom is being BFR'd to Hell from Spawn. While he is BFR'd my team will be mopping up your two lesser opponents with the three powerhouses on my team. There will be no point to making a Prism, because Dr Light and Mirror Man should be dead by time Captain Atom is back to make one for them to use.

Yes, but we've got 10 seconds before anyone can fight anyone else. He's creating the Prism in that time. As for getting out of the BFR Captain Atom can Quantum Leap and appear outside of Hell & back on the Battlefield.

Even if he does get back in time, Spawn can open up a black hole to suck the prism to hell or have Darkness open up a portal for it to be absorbed into the darkness. Any kind of constructs your team tries to make are going to be sucked out of the battlefield in this fashion. Those abilities are really cool, but with Spawn and Darkness, my team has about a gazillion powers to use to counter any kind of trick your team uses.

You create a black hole and it'd count as a BFR. That means it'll only be gone for 10 seconds.

It'd also be INCREDIBLY easy for Captain Atom to just create another one. If he was able to create an entire universe in less than 10 seconds he can create a simple prism in less time than that. You've got some great powers, but so does my team ^_^

I'm curious about one of your claims about Captain Atom making his BFR time shorter. Mirror Master can't bring him back, because Mirror Master has no way of traveling to Hell. How is Captain Atom going to escape Hell? He is stuck there for the 10 seconds and 10 seconds is a long time when they are in a fight with someone who has the fighting speed Invincible does.

Quantum Leaping. I've shown several scans of it in my earlier posts and don't feel like posting the same pictures over and over again. Captain Atom could escape hell via Quantum Leap. Mirror Master could also help him out of hell if there is ANY sort of reflection within Hell. If there isn't then Captain Atom could just create a mirror, Mirror Master can appear in it, and pull Captain Atom into the Mirror World and bring him back to the battle.

As for Invincible, he's fast, but he's also dead because I haven't seen anything thus far that can counter the way that Mirror Master is killing him.

The rest of your posts assume what I've countered above to have not been countered. I don't see how this can't come down to my entire team vs Captain Atom. I really don't see Dr Light or Mirror Man being able to hang here in a 2v3 scenario after Captain Atom is BFR'd, even if it only is 10 seconds. Invincible will be cleared of his blindness from Spawn, and he can fight at speeds no one on your team can ever hope to match. He could solo those two on his own. Spawn can simply use magic, chains, or his cape to also solo. Darkness would have the most trouble with Dr light, but he could still easily solo IMHO. It only takes a small amount of Darkness for Jackie to tap into to create giant constructs, darklings, or tendrils that are capable of tearing your team apart. Jackie can also tap into the darkness inside of your team's bodies and have Darklings or tendrils erupt from your teams bodies effectively exploding your team from the very beginning of the battle. I don't plan on Jackie resorting to that (it's kind of a cheese strategy that would make this debate a quick one shot win for Jackie and not very fun), but he has that option. So my team opens up a scenario from the start that let's any one of them solo, but they aren't going to need to try, because all three will work together to put down Dr Light and Mirror Men pretty much right off the bat. Captain Atom is going to be way too overwhelmed to deal with the entire team of Invincible, Darkness, and Spawn on his own.

You're discrediting how powerful Mirror Master and Doctor Light are, as well as the Mirror World versions of your own team, you'll literally be fighting yourselves.

Captain Atom can come back from the BFR faster than the 10 seconds is up, by the time he gets back Invincible is dead. The Blindness wouldn't be cleared unless Spawns Magic is trans-dimensional and can work on different planes of existence than where he currently is. I don't believe that Spawn can do anything to damage or hurt the Mirror World, so Mirror Master and Doctor Light are still blinding Invincible and killing him.

Spawn's magic can be manipulated by Captain Atom, who has the ability to manipulate all forms of energy, even magic.

Darkness may be able to tap into the darkness inside of things, but when a being is PURE light I don't see any darkness. He can't take control of Doctor Light's constructs due to the fact that no darkness exists within them, they're all light. As for Jackie tapping into the inner darkness of my team and imploding them, he wouldn't be able to if they were in the Mirror World, or if Doctor Light eliminated the Darkness within.

You haven't addressed the fact that you're fighting Mirror World versions of yourself. You're fighting yourself here, ALONG with my own team. You're also not just fighting one version of yourself, Mirror Master is able to access millions of other worlds and pull the beings from them into the fight, so you're fighting a rather large assembly of foes.

Also, Mirror Master can send duplicates into the eyes of Jackie, he's still got reflections in his eyes, and do the same thing to him that they did to Invincible.

  • The Prism is still up
  • Captain Atom can quickly return from BFR via Quantum Leap OR Mirror World
  • Mirror Master & his duplicates can't be harmed when they're in the Mirror World
  • Your team is fighting Mirror World versions of themselves
  • Doctor Light can eliminate the darkness within my team by filling them with light energy

Your move, unless you've got nothing else left to say and you'd like to open up voting. I'm ready whenever you are ^_^

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#28  Edited By tparks

@thetruebarryallen:

Alright, I mean Doctor Light doesn't need to use a focused beam of light to hit him, he can send a giant burst out from inside of him in every direction, so I don't see how Jackie would be dodging it if it's going around him in a radius.

If Dr Light does this, It will only weaken Jackies constructs and darklings. He has become too strong to let the light weaken his armor and the physical abilities it grants him. Also Dr Light has Spawn to worry about as well. Spawn can always block light attacks with his cape. This can keep Jackie protected and surround him in Darkness, increasing his power. Or Spawn can just create a large bowl like are with his cape where no light can penetrate. Jackie doesn't even have to be inside of it to manipulate the darkness from within. Jackie can have a constant supply of Darkness to fuel his powers in this fashion. The good thing about this too is that Spawn's cape can act independently from Spawn, so Spawn will not be distracted or slowed down while doing this. Spawn's cape can stretch hundreds of feet so Spawn doesn't even have to be close by to do this.

So sure, you've got distractions, and I've got distractions. In a 1 v 1 scenario I'm fairly sure that Doctor Light would be able to overpower Darkness, since Doctor Light has manifested the weakness of Darkness. With Captain Atom, Mirror Master, and the Mirror World Versions of your team on my side fighting for me I don't see Spawn getting through to help.

Another thing you should recognize is that the Darkness has faced villains who have similar powers to Dr Light. For Example, Angelus. Her entire power set is focused on being the champion of light, yet Jackie beat her almost effortlessly. She had been perfecting her light-based powers for 999 years before Jackie fought her. Jackie had only had the Darkness powers for 2 days, and he beat her. Dr Light should not be as big of a threat to Jackie as you might think. So even if Spawn is busy killing someone else on your team, Jackie can still take on Dr Light one on one. One touch from Jackie, and Jackie can create Darkness inside of Dr Light and use the Darkness in his body to rip his skin and muscles from his bones for a one-shot kill. He has done this multiple times (there are scans in my previous posts of this).

Mirror Master isn't just taking on Spawn alone, he's got THOUSANDS of duplicates charging Spawn.

Mirror Master trying to use a sword will be cannon fodder compared to one of a character like Angela using a sword. Angela would mop the floor in a sword fight with as many Mirror Master sword fighters as you can throw at her, but Spawn is able to hang with Angela. Also, we will be BFR'ing the prism to Hell. The rules say Master Hand will bring characters back who have been BFR'd not constructs, so that should be gone for good. If Captain Atom makes another prism, we will just keep BFRing it. My team has two characters that can BFR with little effort or concentration, so they can do this continuously. Mirror Master will have to make his dupes some other way. Even if he does get his dupes out, Spawn's chains can seek out and rapidly kill all of these dupes without any concentration from Spawn as his suit can act independently from Simmons.

Nice try, but I don't think that'll work here.

Mirror Master travels through reflections due to being in a different dimension, the Mirror World. He is essentially the God of that dimension and can move freely through it. When he's in reflections he's still in that dimension, so he shouldn't be able to be targeted by Spawns magic, unless Spawn's magic works cross-dimensional.

I don't see why it wouldn't work cross-dimensional. He opens up portals to alternate dimensions such as hell. He is powered by powers from alternate dimensions. There is no reason why this shouldn't work. Spawn is definitely an inter-dimensional being.

Anyways, it should take less than 10 seconds to kill Invincible at the start of this fight, Mirror Master is quick on the draw, quick with duplicating, and quick with his movement. He'll be in and out before your team knows what happens.

This all ends with Invincible dead due to being turned into glass, he can't really counter that at all.

You must be under-estimating Invincible. I know Mirror Master has taken on Flash and appeared in mirrored surfaces on Flash, but do you have any scans of him actually hurting Flash while he is moving? Invincible is a Viltrumite capable of fighting at FTL speeds when he needs to. Below are scans of his father who has the exact same powers as Mark taking on the entire Guardians of the Globe which has identical members of the Justice League, including Flash. He is able to speed blitz all of them before they can react killing them all.

So if Viltrumites can move at this speed, I don't see Mirror Man taking out Mark in less then 10 seconds. If anything, Mark should have Mirror Man dead in less then a split second. One hit from Mark is enough to kill Mirror Man with ease. As soon as the 10 seconds are up, Mark can get to Speed Blitzing.

You're discrediting how powerful Mirror Master and Doctor Light are, as well as the Mirror World versions of your own team, you'll literally be fighting yourselves.

We can counter the mirror prism for making dupes, but even if you did make dupes of my team, why would they fight for Mirror Master? Has he ever made dupes of another character and controlled their dupes?

The rest of your claims assume what I've countered to have not been countered.

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@tparks: Alright, I had written a whole thing and posted it and then it was blank so I deleted the message, time to re-do this post.

Before I start I'd like to just post a quick guide to my strategy that way you can see all of it's parts and it doesn't get lost in counters, I feel as if I haven't really been explaining how it all works as well as I could be and it's all getting lost within counters. This is the turn of events that my team will be going by in order to obtain a victory over your own team, after I post this I will counter your posts above.

A quick guide to TTBA's strategy

  1. We're given 10 seconds before the battle starts. During this time Captain Atom will create the Prism in order to help Mirror Master create and spread out his duplicates faster and across more ground.
  2. Just before the 10th second Mirror Master will take Doctor Light with him into the Mirror World. He will be traveling through the reflective surface that is Captain Atom's outer casing.
  3. Captain Atom get's BFR'd along with the Prism due to Spawn sending the two of them to hell. Captain Atom returns before Master Hand has to come get him due to his Quantum Leaping ability. If that seems too far-fetched then Mirror Master can quickly bring him back since the Mirror World is connected to alternate dimensions, I don't see why hell wouldn't be one of them.
  4. Mirror Master & Doctor Light begin their assault on Invincible the moment the fight starts. They're not in the same dimension so they can't get blitzed by Invincible as soon as the fight starts. Mirror Master uses some of his duplicates to crowd in Invincible's eyes, thus blinding him.
  5. While Invincible can't see Mirror Master pop's his hand out of the Mirror World via a reflective surface on Invincible's costume or body, this is most likely his goggles. Mirror Master then shoots him with a point blank blast that Invincible shouldn't be able to dodge, because the blast is coming from directly in front of him while he can't see whats happening. This blast will turn Invincible into glass, there isn't anything he can do to prevent this from happening. Then he will be shattered thus killing him.
  6. Mirror Master & Doctor Light are most likely going to get brought back by Master Hand after that event, as they're only allowed to be in the Mirror World for increments of 10 seconds at a time. Mirror Master joins his duplicates and Captain Atom. Doctor Light goes off to find and fight Darkness.
  7. Mirror Master summons the Mirror World versions of Spawn, Invincible, and Darkness. These beings are willing to fight for Mirror Master and he has displayed this ability against The Flash when he created 3 Flash duplicates to fight for him.
  8. The Mirror World versions of Spawn & Invincible join Captain Atom and Mirror Master to fight the real version of Spawn. The Mirror Duplicates of Mirror Master should be enough to distract Spawn's chain attacks allowing for MW Spawn & Invincible to begin holding him down and giving him a beatdown. Spawn vs MW Spawn should be a stalemate in itself, so with the help of Captain Atom and MW Invincible he doesn't stand much of a chance.
  9. Mirror Master then appears back in the Mirror World, as he should be allowed to go back at this point in time. Since Mirror Master can kill people via their reflections he will appear in Captain Atom's chest (which is a reflective surface) and will kill the Reflection of Spawn. Spawns reflection cannot put up a fight and since Mirror Master has the Heavenly Sword he should be able to kill Spawn for good.
  10. Doctor Light has joined forces with the MW version of Darkness to take on the real world version of Darkness. The darklings and constructs that Darkness creates should be eliminated by Doctor Light's abilities. This allows for MW Darkness to fight the real Darkness and beat him down a tad, weakening him.
  11. Once the team is done with spawn they will join Doctor Light and MW Darkness to finish off the real world version of Darkness. Darkness shouldn't win in a fight against Doctor Light, MW Darkness, MW Spawn, MW Invincible, Captain Atom, Mirror Master, and 1000's of Mirror Master duplicates.
  12. Fight ends.

Now it's time for me to counter the points you brought up, or just address them if there is no counter.

If Dr Light does this, It will only weaken Jackies constructs and darklings. He has become too strong to let the light weaken his armor and the physical abilities it grants him. Also Dr Light has Spawn to worry about as well. Spawn can always block light attacks with his cape. This can keep Jackie protected and surround him in Darkness, increasing his power. Or Spawn can just create a large bowl like are with his cape where no light can penetrate. Jackie doesn't even have to be inside of it to manipulate the darkness from within. Jackie can have a constant supply of Darkness to fuel his powers in this fashion. The good thing about this too is that Spawn's cape can act independently from Spawn, so Spawn will not be distracted or slowed down while doing this. Spawn's cape can stretch hundreds of feet so Spawn doesn't even have to be close by to do this.

Doctor Light should be able to effectively weaken Darkness or make him less of a threat with his abilities. If you're admitting that the Darklings and Constructs get weakened to the possible point of destruction it allows for an opening to be made by another member on my team. In this case I've stated that the MW version of Darkness will be joining Doctor Light so Darkness will be fighting himself. This should be quite the stalemate, though Doctor Light should give an edge to the MW Darkness to overcome the real Darkness.

Spawn is incredibly powerful but will be busy fighting Captain Atom, MW Spawn, MW Invincible, 1000's of MM Clones, and MM who should be able to kill Spawns reflection when he travels into the mirror world again and catches the reflection in Captain Atom's outer plating. Since Spawns reflection can't fight back MM will be able to decapitate him with the Heavenly Sword.

If for some reason that doesn't work Spawn can also get BFR'd into the Mirror World allowing for the Mirror Worlds twisted inhabitants to attack Spawn and weaken him. With Spawn BFR'd for 10 seconds it'd allow the team to go help Doctor Light and MW Darkness kill Darkness.

Your team is outnumbered by my team in this fight, and it's not just cannon fodder on my team.

Another thing you should recognize is that the Darkness has faced villains who have similar powers to Dr Light. For Example, Angelus. Her entire power set is focused on being the champion of light, yet Jackie beat her almost effortlessly. She had been perfecting her light-based powers for 999 years before Jackie fought her. Jackie had only had the Darkness powers for 2 days, and he beat her. Dr Light should not be as big of a threat to Jackie as you might think. So even if Spawn is busy killing someone else on your team, Jackie can still take on Dr Light one on one. One touch from Jackie, and Jackie can create Darkness inside of Dr Light and use the Darkness in his body to rip his skin and muscles from his bones for a one-shot kill. He has done this multiple times (there are scans in my previous posts of this).

Okay, he's faced villains with similar powers which is understandable. Doctor Light is able to manipulate all forms of light energy, not just visible light. Angelus doesn't function the same way from what I've seen, she is really weak when facing the powers of darkness. Her constructs turn to dust and her powers begin to drain when in darkness. That is not the case of Doctor Light, he can still function in darkness and can take light from pretty much anything and everything. He can control all forms of light, so while they seem similar they're not entirely the same.

I'd also like to point out that a simple Magnesium Flare was able to stun Darkness for a limited amount of time. Doctor Light is much more powerful than a simple 'man-made' flare. His light blasts should do more damage to Darkness and stun him for a longer amount of time, even if they don't kill him it'll keep him away from Doctor Light long enough for Light to survive the encounter.

Doctor Light will also be fighting alongside the Mirror World version of Darkness, so that'd be a stalemate. However since Doctor Light is aiding the MW version it should tip the scales in their favor.

Mirror Master trying to use a sword will be cannon fodder compared to one of a character like Angela using a sword. Angela would mop the floor in a sword fight with as many Mirror Master sword fighters as you can throw at her, but Spawn is able to hang with Angela. Also, we will be BFR'ing the prism to Hell. The rules say Master Hand will bring characters back who have been BFR'd not constructs, so that should be gone for good. If Captain Atom makes another prism, we will just keep BFRing it. My team has two characters that can BFR with little effort or concentration, so they can do this continuously. Mirror Master will have to make his dupes some other way. Even if he does get his dupes out, Spawn's chains can seek out and rapidly kill all of these dupes without any concentration from Spawn as his suit can act independently from Simmons.

Mirror Master is no master swordsman, though he was an assassin/hitman before he became Mirror Master and probably knows how to swing a blade at a basic level. That being said the flood of Mirror Master duplicates may not be powerful, but they're incredibly distracting, if one just so happens to slice at Spawn and make contact he'll be hurting. The weapon was given to me because it is the ONE way to kill Spawn in this fight, so it will kill him if it slices his head off.

Angela is skilled but she's only one person. It's much easier to defend yourself against one person instead of thousands of people.

As for the Prism, you may BFR it but Captain Atom will just make another one, he can transmute matter just fine. I also have a character who can BFR with ease, Mirror Master. He can send anyone to the Mirror World as long as he has a reflective surface. It also appears that he can pick and choose what gets taken and what get's left behind.

Both of these scans display his ability to BFR into the Mirror World.

If Spawn's chains to seek out the Mirror Master duplicates it just means that Spawn will be wasting his time. More duplicates can be made with ease and Spawn still has to fight back against the MW Spawn, MW Invincible, and Captain Atom.

I don't see why it wouldn't work cross-dimensional. He opens up portals to alternate dimensions such as hell. He is powered by powers from alternate dimensions. There is no reason why this shouldn't work. Spawn is definitely an inter-dimensional being.

I just don't know if Spawn can make something invisible that exists within a reflective surface outside of his own dimension, even if Spawn is an inter-dimensional being. Also, if he DOES make the Mirror Master duplicates invisible within Invincible's eyes he won't be doing Invincible any good. Just because an object is invisible doesn't mean that it's gone. The object is still within his eyes and since Invisibility means that light bends around that object it means that light will be trying to bend around the Mirror Master duplicates. If they're taking up all the space within Invincible's eyes, which they will be, that means the light won't be able to bend into his eyes, thus preventing him from seeing, thus he's still blind.

You must be under-estimating Invincible. I know Mirror Master has taken on Flash and appeared in mirrored surfaces on Flash, but do you have any scans of him actually hurting Flash while he is moving? Invincible is a Viltrumite capable of fighting at FTL speeds when he needs to. Below are scans of his father who has the exact same powers as Mark taking on the entire Guardians of the Globe which has identical members of the Justice League, including Flash. He is able to speed blitz all of them before they can react killing them all.

I am not under-estimating Invincible, and I'm sorry if it seems that I am. He is incredibly powerful which is why he's the target of such a brutal attack.

I myself don't have any scans of Mirror Master coming out of a reflective surface on the body of Flash and hurting him, however I do have a scan of him popping his hand of out a reflective surface to shoot a Police Officer with his gun. The gun then turned the officer into a glass version of himself, then it killed him.

Invincible can move fast but he can't hurt Mirror Master while he's in the Mirror World, so there is NOTHING he can do. Once he's blinded he won't be able to see where the attack is coming from and it'll catch him off guard, he won't be ready to counter. He may be fast but if he can't see what he's fighting then how can he fight it?

Mirror Master just has to pop his gun out of the Mirror World and fire it at Invincible. This is easily done since his Goggles are reflective surfaces for the gun to pop out of. If it pops out and is facing Invincible (point blank while blind) I don't see him dodging it, nor do I see him surviving the assault. There is no way for him to fight Mirror Master in this situation. Invincible is going to die.

Invincible won't be able to blitz Mirror Master due to the fact that before the fight begins he'll be entering the Mirror World with Doctor Light. The only one you can attack are the duplicates and Captain Atom, and that's if you get to do something before he gets blinded, yet he's getting blinded RIGHT as the fight begins so I don't see him being a useful asset.

So if Viltrumites can move at this speed, I don't see Mirror Man taking out Mark in less then 10 seconds. If anything, Mark should have Mirror Man dead in less then a split second. One hit from Mark is enough to kill Mirror Man with ease. As soon as the 10 seconds are up, Mark can get to Speed Blitzing.

Mirror Master & Doctor Light can easily finish this before Mark can count to 10 Mississippi's.

Mark doesn't get the chance to hurt Mirror Master before Mirror Master kills him.

We can counter the mirror prism for making dupes, but even if you did make dupes of my team, why would they fight for Mirror Master? Has he ever made dupes of another character and controlled their dupes?

Mirror Master doesn't need the prism to create duplicates. He just needs a reflective surface, the prism is nice because it allows him to duplicate on a larger scale more quickly, thus creating an army in split seconds.

Mirror Master has made duplicates and summoned them from the Mirror World. He can control duplicates of other characters since they come from the Mirror World, which Mirror Master rules over.

He did so against 'The Flash' when he controlled 3 different versions of 'The Flash' that he summoned from the Mirror World.

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It should also be known that Mirror Master can create duplicates on the spot and incredibly quickly, like he did against Wildcat.

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See here that Mirror Master has Mirrors that can come from his owl over his eyes in order to help him create duplicates. He's also able to duplicate his weapon so the duplicates have a means of attack. That same weapon can turn people into glass within seconds to kill them. He also comments that fighting someone who doesn't have super speed is like fighting someone in slow motion, a nod to his reaction time that has increased due to his constant battles with the Fastest Man Alive.

Your move, like I said, I'm ready for voting whenever you are.

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tparks

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@indiecomicsftw: @thetruebarryallen:
@cadencev2

I'm good for voting. I think we're getting to where we're repeating ourselves. If I was to post counters to that last post, it would be pretty much the same counters I've already said. Nice match, I had a lot of fun!

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Pokergeist

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@tparks said:

@indiecomicsftw: @thetruebarryallen: @cadencev2

I'm good for voting. I think we're getting to where we're repeating ourselves. If I was to post counters to that last post, it would be pretty much the same counters I've already said. Nice match, I had a lot of fun!

Cool. Voting will be open Wednesday.

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#33  Edited By Pokergeist
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AllStarSuperman

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@tparks: ill read it soon. i already had this book marked.

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@tparks and @thetruebarryallen

I have been following this for some time and this was a really god debate I look forward to sparing with the winner

that said there can only be one

in the end I have to give the slightest edge to

@thetruebarryallen you had an elemental advantage and you exploited it for all it was worth

@tparksYou put up a great fight but you had bad luck getting this team

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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Jokergeist

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Might get to this later. I'm a hella busy right now (`・ω・´)

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@jokergeist: No rush, wanted you to know that I value your opinion and wanted the chance to see if you'd offer it :)

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@dondave: Thanks for voting!

TTBA - 2

tparks - Goose Egg

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@cjdavis103: @dondave: Thank you both for voting!

Also I'd like to thank @tparks for such a great debate. I've been absent from the Battle Forums for a bit of time and this was a nice introduction back into the forums :)

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@thetruebarryallen: For sure. I had a lot of fun and learned a lot about all of the characters involved. Thanks to you as well.

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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@jwalser3: Thank you for voting :)

Current Score

TheTrueBarryAllen - 3

Tparks - 0

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tparks

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#47  Edited By tparks
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TheTrueBarryAllen

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@indiecomicsftw:

Would you be able to put 'voting' in the title of the thread? That sometimes lures some wandering Viners :)

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#50  Edited By tparks