Puri puri prisoner vs Kaneki

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#1 Posted by thebeyonder1 (78 posts) - - Show Bio

Kaneki kills some of puri’s prison inmates and puri confronts him battle takes place in an abandoned city.

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#2 Edited by Bearderby (1653 posts) - - Show Bio

thebeyonder1 marked this as the best answer

PPP pulverizes Ken

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he's quicker and has better reaction time since he can dodge a laser beam.

Ken is a splat of blood once PPP touches him

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#4 Posted by LichVanAstrea (1943 posts) - - Show Bio

Puri Puri stomps.

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#6 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

PPP is a lot stronger, but speed wise he can only reliably be scaled to dehydrated DSK who’s not overly fast, and even then PPP is slower. Plus, he has Kaneki’s regen to overcome and Kaneki can oneshot.

Tough one, but I’m backing the King.

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#7 Posted by LichVanAstrea (1943 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingcrimson: He one shotted a monster that was confirmed to be as strong as Deep Sea King and prior to that was tagging with Melzargard, who could tag with the likes of Bang, Metal Bat and Atomic Samurai. So scaling him with Deep Sea King isn't a good idea.

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#8 Edited by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@lichvanastrea: Far more reliable to scale him to DSK, who creamed him, rather than scaling him to other superior heroes via a monster that didn’t actually defeat them, surely?

Melzargard didn’t tag any of them except for Bang with a cheap shot when he was off guard.

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#9 Posted by LichVanAstrea (1943 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingcrimson: This is Puri Puri Prisoner as he is now in the manga. Why scale him with someone who he's confirmed to have surpassed a long time ago?

And yes he was. He was tagging Atomic Samurai, to the point where AS was getting frustrated with him.

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#10 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@lichvanastrea: Only confirmed in strength, not in speed.

Do you have the scans for that? I don’t recall.

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#11 Posted by LichVanAstrea (1943 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingcrimson: True, but there's no reason to assume why the monster's any slower than DSK.

As for the scan:

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#12 Posted by AlphaQ (6759 posts) - - Show Bio

Pretty sure Murata said Sky King was similar in strength to Deep Sea King, and he was completely humbled by Melzargard’s speed, which Puri Puri Prisoner kept up with.

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#13 Posted by Red_Ruby_Petal (8458 posts) - - Show Bio

Can Kaneki hurt this guy?

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#15 Posted by Red_Ruby_Petal (8458 posts) - - Show Bio

@valorknight: he practically did from the recent chapters, where a bunch of monsters failed to even scratch him, then later he was scratched by a dragon level threat ( higher than DSK ), then healed, developed body hair and was practically immune to damage at that point.

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#17 Posted by Red_Ruby_Petal (8458 posts) - - Show Bio

@valorknight: idk, thats why I am asking. What has Kaneki been cutting, though I am certain dragon level threats are above anything in TG.

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#18 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@red_ruby_petal: They should be by scaling, but from what I recall Nyan Nyan has no impressive feats. At the moment, he’s incomparable to Kaneki.

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#20 Posted by Red_Ruby_Petal (8458 posts) - - Show Bio

@valorknight:

He diced a weapon made from Quinque Steel (a material that's vastly harder than normal steel) in the first instance where he consciously activated his Kagune. In later arcs, he filleted the Kagune exterior of a ghoul with multi-building level durability while malnourished and severely weakened.

Fair

How could you possibly be certain of that? As I recall, you haven't read TG.

I've given a read to some respect threads and feats you guys CAV in, and some of the matchups too which gives me an idea. OPM dragon levels usually pretty insane in power going for them, and it doesn't take just being multi building level to achieve that title.

I'd also like to point out that simply being given a high threat level doesn't justify a lack of feats. If this Dragon Level character doesn't have cutting feats on the level of what Ken can do, then I see no reason why Puri Puri Prisoner won't get chopped into dozens of bite sized pieces.

It gives you an idea of how powerful they should be, so I am not buying the idea that he wouldn't able to easily cut steel or anything beyond that, when Demon levels can already punch through blast shelters like they were nothing.

@kingcrimson:

They should be by scaling, but from what I recall Nyan Nyan has no impressive feats. At the moment, he’s incomparable to Kaneki.

Doesn't the idea that he is above DSK seem clear?

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#22 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@red_ruby_petal: Eh, I suppose, but not only is that incredibly vague (just how is he above DSK for instance?) his feats really don’t measure up to be honest. Plus you have things like Beefcake only being demon level and he’d categorically stomp most Dragon levels. The scaling isn’t perfect.

Nyan Nyan’s only feats (that I recall) are cutting Puri Puri and failing to cut Saitama. Kaneki could replicate both of those, but by feats he should be able to cut Puri Puri in half, IMO. Depends how strong his hair armour is and it hasn’t been throughly tested.

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#23 Posted by Red_Ruby_Petal (8458 posts) - - Show Bio

@valorknight:

I'm aware, but "usually" isn't always enough.

In the case of OPM, it is.

Feats are still needed regardless. I think you know that arguing for a character based solely on a title isn't going to get you anywhere.

Characters with high titles but lack of feats exist, but that doesn't mean you have to think they are a level lower than what they are meant to be, simply because they haven't had anything tangible to work with.

What you "buy" is irrelevant here. If you can't prove it, then Ken dices him up in the same fashion as good ol' Jason.

Their ranks is enough proof for me. I don't care too much about what you need proved.

Punching through something doesn't equal cutting through that same thing, nor can you scale every stat upwards simply because whatever character happens to have a higher threat level.

The point is to give you an idea how powerful demon/dragon level threats are, so I am not giving you feat just so you can give a meaningless refute by saying cutting isn't equal to punching.

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#24 Edited by Red_Ruby_Petal (8458 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingcrimson:

Eh, I suppose, but not only is that incredibly vague (just how is he above DSK for instance?) his feats really don’t measure up to be honest. Plus you have things like Beefcake only being demon level and he’d categorically stomp most Dragon levels. The scaling isn’t perfect.

I wouldn't call how powerful Nyan is as vague, its just that he doesn't anything very tangible to work with. And true the scaling probably isn't perfect, but I think I recall Beefcake was supposed to be Dragon Level, but because he was taken out too fast, they had him as Demon.

And Nyan is a character that was meant to challenge PPP's limits, so it seems reasonable that he is more powerful than DSK, especially when the monster PPP one shotted should have been DSK's level.

Nyan Nyan’s only feats (that I recall) are cutting Puri Puri and failing to cut Saitama. Kaneki could replicate both of those, but by feats he should be able to cut Puri Puri in half, IMO. Depends how strong his hair armour is and it hasn’t been throughly tested.

He had the confidence to cut Saitama even after seeing what he did, so I assume he must have been a pretty strong Dragon Level threat.

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#25 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@red_ruby_petal: I mean vague in terms of stats. I have no doubt he’s intended to be above DSK, but I don’t know whether it would be by speed advantage, strength advantage, a combination of both of those or maybe some hax power. Too little information to work with.

It’s fan theory regarding Beefcakes level being increased - plausible though, I agree. In any case, the point remains that he was classified as Demon despite being stronger than most Dragons.

All monsters are overwhelmed with feelings of their own strength and confidence (see the tournament arc), so him attacking Saitama (with a cheap shot) without seeing him survive any damage doesn’t mean he was overly strong.

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#26 Posted by AlphaQ (6759 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingcrimson: ONE has confirmed that Beefcake was a Dragon level monster.

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#27 Edited by Red_Ruby_Petal (8458 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingcrimson:

I mean vague in terms of stats. I have no doubt he’s intended to be above DSK, but I don’t know whether it would be by speed advantage, strength advantage, a combination of both of those or maybe some hax power. Too little information to work with.

I just think for anyone worthy of dragon tier, he'd have to have some serious cutting power. I know I don't have a lot to work with, but there is just reason to believe he'd cut apart the likes of Genos or someone more durable with ease.

It’s fan theory regarding Beefcakes level being increased - plausible though, I agree. In any case, the point remains that he was classified as Demon despite being stronger than most Dragons.

I heard it was confirmed by ONE though. Might be wrong but idk.

All monsters are overwhelmed with feelings of their own strength and confidence (see the tournament arc), so him attacking Saitama (with a cheap shot) without seeing him survive any damage doesn’t mean he was overly strong.

I don't think a lot of monsters has seen an attack from Saitama firsthand that would factually decimate them until they do get hit. Nyan was smart enough to run away from PPP knowing he'd lose that fight, so still having the confidence to cut someone of a power level he just saw, is saying something.

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#28 Edited by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@alphaq: Do you have the source for that?

EDIT: Though really, that just illustrates my point. He was labelled a demon in verse when ONE has stated he was actually Dragon level.

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#29 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@red_ruby_petal: I don’t believe that to be the case personally, but agree to disagree.

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#31 Posted by Sy8000 (36019 posts) - - Show Bio

PPP was depicted as making 8 afterimages in a panel so I think Ken would have to get pummeled some regardless of whether he's winning.

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#32 Edited by AlphaQ (6759 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingcrimson: This is the source the link on the wiki brought me to, but I don't speak Nintendo.

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Beefcake was only called a Demon after busting a town, the Hero Association seemingly didn't witness his feats against Saitama. Even if they realized his real level after his death there would've been no reason to raise his level.

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#33 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@sy8000: In which chapter, out of curiosity?

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#34 Posted by AGrape (575 posts) - - Show Bio

This PPP downplay lol. Weaker thank DSK.....

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#35 Posted by LichVanAstrea (1943 posts) - - Show Bio

@agrape said:

This PPP downplay lol. Weaker thank DSK.....

This is not as bad as Genos or Sonic being downplayed to low supersonic speed.

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#36 Edited by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio
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#37 Posted by LichVanAstrea (1943 posts) - - Show Bio
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#38 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio
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#39 Posted by AGrape (575 posts) - - Show Bio

Gee, I wonder who? I agree that Kaneki wins I just don't understand the mental gymnastics of downplaying PPP below demon level threats.

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#40 Posted by Narutogen13 (261 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump

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#41 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@agrape: Again, who said that? And why didn’t you tag me?

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#42 Posted by DatStupidGuy (201 posts) - - Show Bio

Ends in sex

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#43 Edited by Red_Ruby_Petal (8458 posts) - - Show Bio

@valorknight:

Based on what exactly? Give me some feats.

Again with the "Give me some feats", when all you really need to know is how tiers of characters are segmented here.

Unless you can prove to me that this character is in the same tier as Ken in terms of slashing power, then why should I believe that he is simply based on a title? That's not enough and frankly never will be in a debate setting.

Its called "scaling", and it exists in every medium. Some characters don't need prerequisite feats to prove they are strong in some regards.

Then you're being incredibly disingenuous.

And you are being extremely annoying.

Is that a concession? You refuse to prove your claim with any evidence at all whatsoever, so I'll go ahead and assume that it is.

To fill in your ego like you usually do, great.

Sure, but using that to scale specific stats doesn't work. It's especially bad when said character doesn't have any feats or even scaling to suggest that he's on the same level as Ken.

Scaling is a term that exists. If in SDS you have this one character that lightning times, then every other character above them can too. You just don't seem to ever get that, and that is why I am so disinterested in debating with you.

Would you disagree with that? This is essentially you whining about how this character doesn't really have any feats to back up what you're trying to argue and it's both sad and sort of irritating for someone who wants to have an actual argument.

Its irritating enough that someone is constantly pushing for something specific in an argument when they just can't argue against what can be worked with. I've already had my fair share of a discussion here with someone else already, so I don't really want to argue pointlessly here.

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#44 Edited by LichVanAstrea (1943 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingcrimson said:

Though really, that just illustrates my point. He was labelled a demon in verse when ONE has stated he was actually Dragon level.

Keep in mind that the monsters aren't exactly consistent with the threat levels they're initially given by either the Hero Association or by someone else. Most of the time, this is due to the fact that the monsters are hiding their true potential and are only showing off what people initially see. That's why monsters like Scaledon, Rhino Wrestler and Withered Sprout were considered Wolves and Tigers before being boosted up to Demons and Dragon.

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#45 Posted by TheWatcherKing (18956 posts) - - Show Bio

I back PPP

@red_ruby_petal: Eh, I suppose, but not only is that incredibly vague (just how is he above DSK for instance?) his feats really don’t measure up to be honest. Plus you have things like Beefcake only being demon level and he’d categorically stomp most Dragon levels. The scaling isn’t perfect.

Nyan Nyan’s only feats (that I recall) are cutting Puri Puri and failing to cut Saitama. Kaneki could replicate both of those, but by feats he should be able to cut Puri Puri in half, IMO. Depends how strong his hair armour is and it hasn’t been throughly tested.

Beefcake is a bad example. Murata outright confirmed he would have been upgraded to threat level dragon but Saitama killed him before that could happen. Meaning he had the power to be on the level but was killed too early.

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#47 Posted by Lsoon23 (1062 posts) - - Show Bio

Ken wins solidly.

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#48 Edited by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@thewatcherking: @lichvanastrea: The situation with Beefcake is kind of what I was getting at. Monsters actual threat level and their assigned threat levels aren’t always perfectly harmonious. With that in mind, to instantly put Nyan Nyan over DSK in every category despite his current feats (of which there are few) being subpar is a little shaky.

Looking back at the Beefcake example, isn’t it possible that hydrated DSK could’ve had his threat level upgraded had he gone on long enough? Given that his dehydrated form was already classified as demon, and his hydrated form was much stronger and capable of stomping multiple S-Class?

Or, if you’re uncomfortable with that idea, it might be easier to imagine him as the pinnacle of a Demon level threat? Nyan Nyan might well be the weakest Dragon, so the difference between them could be negligible.

I’m all for scaling, but we don’t have enough info to say that Nyan Nyan’s cutting power is anywhere near Kaneki’s just based on threat level.

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#49 Edited by LichVanAstrea (1943 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingcrimson: I mean it's the logical thing to do, given that's how the disaster levels are established and work. The disaster levels are pretty much the power scaling in OPM. If a monster is said to be a Dragon, then it would be stronger than a Demon, since a Dragon can destroy multiple cities and take on multiple S-Class heroes while a Demon can only destroy one and requires at least one S-Class to defeat, even if the monster lacked feats.

The only reason why it's not always consistent is because again, the monsters don't always reveal their true potential. Even if that weren't the case, there hasn't been a case where the monster drops from Dragon to whatever lower diaster level.

Now you could make the argument that, featwise, DSK > Nyan, but logically speaking, Nyan should be stronger than him or any other Demon. Btw, DSK only took out two S-Classes, one of which he had to distract and the other was the weakest of the bunch (who ended up surpassing him anyways). Even in his hydrated form, Genos was able to blow him away with a blast.

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#50 Posted by KingCrimson (6393 posts) - - Show Bio

@lichvanastrea: Again, I disagree based on the reasoning I’ve just given. I agree that, generally speaking, Dragons > Demons; but we also know that Demons can be escalated to Dragons too. We also don’t know where on the respective threat tiers the two characters sit, and nor do we know what about Nyan Nyan classifies him as Dragon.

Blew him away, but didn’t do any significant damage to him. Genos only matched his dehydrated form - he would’ve got stomped had they fought in the rain and DSK hydrated again.