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#1 Edited by Ultrra (44 posts) - - Show Bio

Orochimaru

No Caption Provided

VS.

Kakashi (War Arc)

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Conditions:

  • Orochimaru is healthy and has use of both arms
  • Win by death or KO
  • Edo Tensei is allowed
  • In character for both.
  • Fight takes place in an open field
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#2 Posted by TheDeathstroke (1478 posts) - - Show Bio

Prime Orochimaru stomps

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#3 Posted by darthjhawk (1881 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedeathstroke: How exactly does he stomp? This has always been one of my favorite what-ifs. Interested to see some arguments.

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#4 Posted by TheDeathstroke (1478 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedeathstroke: How exactly does he stomp? This has always been one of my favorite what-ifs. Interested to see some arguments.

Its all speculation of course, but Oro was said to have mastered even more justu then the 3rd hokage. I don't even see Kakashi beating him against the unmastered Edo Tensei Kages

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#5 Posted by TwentyGoodMen (1042 posts) - - Show Bio

Whoever got owned less by Itachi wins

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#6 Posted by echostarlord117 (4451 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think Oro stomps, but I'd side with him. Kakashi's trump card is Kamui, but he can only use it so many times until he's pretty much toast. Oro can just keep coming back.

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#7 Posted by Dust_Hawk (1249 posts) - - Show Bio

🤔

During the Chunin Exam Orochimaru scared the hell out of a determined Kakashi, letting him on his knees, with just the killing intent Genj.

War Arc Kakashi is completely on another tier than his Pre Time Skip version...but with Edo Tensei allowed an healty Oro can summon the Big 3 (Hashirama, Tobirama and Minato) and utterly stomp Kakashi.

War Arc Kakashi Kamui is stronger and a lot faster than before...but he needs to warp away the whole Orochimaru's body to be sure...if not Oro can just regenerate from snakes or a body part ihmo. In characters meh...🤔

Not to mention that Oro only need 1 bite from a pretty little snake to paralyze the whole Kakashi's body (Mitsuki Gaiden) and also the White Snake poison can do it.

Healty, prime, with his arms and jutsu? Orochimaru should a monster ihmo.

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#8 Posted by darthjhawk (1881 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedeathstroke:

Ah I see, I don't think he would stomp due to Kakashi's own versatility. As far as the Edo Tensei, he could always use Lightning Transmission to stop their movements as they come out as seen when he did it against the Gedo Statue in Chapter 592:

No Caption Provided

Aside from that I think his own versatility at this stage should be able to match Oro. Not saying I think either wins yet, but just looking at more arguments first.

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#9 Posted by Ultrra (44 posts) - - Show Bio

bump

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#10 Posted by Chair-Sama (2280 posts) - - Show Bio

kakashi would put up a good fight, and has a chance to win, but orochimaru has true hax at his disposal.

considering he can just form new bodies, and orochimaru has walked away from fights with Jiraiya AND 4 tail Kyuubi mode naruto.

and as far as statements go, think on this:

sasuke implied the only reason he so easily took down oro was because he was sick and weakened.

Sasuke walked all over kakashi in every single meeting the have had since he left the village. He straight up told kakashi he would kill him and was going to, right up until naruto got in-between them, multiple times. in fact, he never once even saw kakashi as a possible threat. even while being half blind and weakened after his fight with danzo.

granted War arc kakashi got his own dose of overpowered everything, but i think oro can still pull some serious wins.

id give it to orc 7/10

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#11 Posted by Zuriel-el (1491 posts) - - Show Bio

oro stomps

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#12 Posted by Zuriel-el (1491 posts) - - Show Bio

oro stomps

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#13 Posted by great_black_star (2591 posts) - - Show Bio

Oro stomp lol.

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#14 Posted by Skrskr (1878 posts) - - Show Bio

Oro stomps

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#15 Posted by great_black_star (2591 posts) - - Show Bio

Funny thing is both got eyed by Itachi, one left the Organisation after that and other got hospitalized for days.

All Hail Solo King

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#16 Posted by Valor_175 (4351 posts) - - Show Bio

Funny thing is both got eyed by Itachi, one left the Organisation after that and other got hospitalized for days.

All Hail Solo King

This, lol.

OT: Orochimaru takes it after an okay fight.

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#17 Posted by Shadow411 (466 posts) - - Show Bio

Didn't Kakashi about s*** himself when he saw Oro pre-time skip?? And Kakashi really didn't improve that much since then. He gained Kamui which he only uses like 2 or 3 times before collapsing. So, Oro takes this pretty easily. War-arc/DMS Kakashi versions are sooo overrated it's ridiculous lmfao

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#18 Posted by Chair-Sama (2280 posts) - - Show Bio

Didn't Kakashi about s*** himself when he saw Oro pre-time skip?? And Kakashi really didn't improve that much since then. He gained Kamui which he only uses like 2 or 3 times before collapsing. So, Oro takes this pretty easily. War-arc/DMS Kakashi versions are sooo overrated it's ridiculous lmfao

you obviously stopped watching after, what, episode 12 of shippuden?

1-2? sure in the beginning. thats like saying sasuke can still only use 2-3 chidori's a day.

he uses kumai almost 2 dozen times in the war arc alone(over the course of 1-2 days with almost no rest)

and at one point both pulls in and then launches out the entire 8 tails Tailed beast, in full beast form.

the dude went toe to toe With Obito, the same guy who could hold off the likes of KCM naruto

dont get me wrong, i think oro would still take it, but you are acting like Kakashi is sometime of Jonin fodder. he isn't. he's one of the single strongest ninja outside of the 5 kages(which ironically he was one of after the war) and the ootsetsuki descendants.

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#19 Posted by JdG (972 posts) - - Show Bio

Kakashi won't be able to put Orochimaru down.

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#20 Posted by Shadow411 (466 posts) - - Show Bio

@chair-sama:

SM Jiraiya would laugh at him. Prime Oro was said to be on that lvl. And Kakashi would get owned by Deidara. It took him forever to charge up an attack on Deidara just like it takes him 5 mins to charge it up in war arc. Never said he was fodder, but to compare him to prime Oro w/o his DMS is laughable. He even admitted Naruto was stronger than him when Naruto only had rasenshuriken. Also, he had his chakra amped by 9tails during war arc. So he wasn't doing it all on his own. Nor do I remember him doing it that much before the obito fight. (If he even did). I watched a little shippuden, but I mainly read the manga. So idk what you're getting at?

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#21 Posted by JdG (972 posts) - - Show Bio

@shadow411:

Kakashi was able to spam and use Kamui instantly during the war without Kyuubi's chakra...

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#22 Posted by Shadow411 (466 posts) - - Show Bio

@jdg:

He used it once against Sasuke and bout passed out

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#23 Posted by JohnPeterBanana (1153 posts) - - Show Bio

kakashi would put up a good fight, and has a chance to win, but orochimaru has true hax at his disposal.

considering he can just form new bodies, and orochimaru has walked away from fights with Jiraiya AND 4 tail Kyuubi mode naruto.

and as far as statements go, think on this:

sasuke implied the only reason he so easily took down oro was because he was sick and weakened.

Sasuke walked all over kakashi in every single meeting the have had since he left the village. He straight up told kakashi he would kill him and was going to, right up until naruto got in-between them, multiple times. in fact, he never once even saw kakashi as a possible threat. even while being half blind and weakened after his fight with danzo.

granted War arc kakashi got his own dose of overpowered everything, but i think oro can still pull some serious wins.

id give it to orc 7/10

This.

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#24 Posted by Zuriel-el (1491 posts) - - Show Bio

lol @post22

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#25 Posted by Shadow411 (466 posts) - - Show Bio

@zuriel-el:

Naruto manga chapter 484 page 15. Yea, that's hilarious, Kakashi was stumbling just from using it once. Let alone the time against Deidara he used it twice and couldn't even walk on his own. Lmfao at the Kakashi wank on this site

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#26 Edited by Beyondthestomper (92 posts) - - Show Bio

Kakashi pees his pants again

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#27 Posted by Zuriel-el (1491 posts) - - Show Bio

@Shadow411:

and war arc kakashi is superior cuz against deidara he had just mastered it. war arc is almost two years after this.

begining of shippuden naruto is fifteen, end of war arc naruto is seventeen.

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#28 Posted by HitTheAssasin (2682 posts) - - Show Bio

Orochimaru without too much difficulty. Edo Tensei makes it a stomp.

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#29 Edited by Shadow411 (466 posts) - - Show Bio

@zuriel-el:

How is he superior, when did his chakra magically increase?

I get there is a two year spam, but Kakashi went from like 27-29 or 28-30. Kakashi didn't increase nearly the same as Naruto/Sasuke. If he increased at all, it was only experience. Also, Kakashi nearly fainted using it once against Sasuke and that was well after Pain arc. Actually it was during war arc. Tobi declared war before Kakashi/Sasuke encounter.

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#30 Edited by Cosmic_Lantern (5671 posts) - - Show Bio

@shadow411: In part 1 Kakashi had not used the Sharingan regularly for years as stated when he was recovering in the wave arc. He gradually increases in its use throughout and by early shippuden we see he's back to his anbu like ways and the next time we see him in action is with kakuzu and hidan where he uses Raikiri six times on top of other jutsu.

Also Kakashi did not nearly faint, he was charging chakra in his eye since the beginning of the fight which is why Sasuke said something about it. That CiS that happened a chapter or two later just oozes utter cheese as he did absolutely nothing basically. Even In Pain arc he had a full fight and still used it twice.

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#31 Posted by ProteusXManRxis (814 posts) - - Show Bio

Orochimaru.

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#32 Posted by Chair-Sama (2280 posts) - - Show Bio

@zuriel-el:

How is he superior, when did his chakra magically increase?

umm..in the two year time span?

I get there is a two year spam, but Kakashi went from like 27-29 or 28-30.

and?

Kakashi didn't increase nearly the same as Naruto/Sasuke.

nobody is saying he increased as much as they did. thats crazy. but did he increase? oh yes.

he went from being almost beat by zabuza to standing toe to toe with the STRONGEST path of pain. and then STILL got stronger, enough to be able to hang in a battle with Bijou's AND go toe to toe against Obito.

If he increased at all, it was only experience.

umm...the fact that he gained the ability of the MS alone is a HUGE buff.

Also, Kakashi nearly fainted using it once against Sasuke and that was well after Pain arc.

so, one lowball ok. he used it more then once against pain alone lmfao. how do you explain that?

Actually it was during war arc.

actually. that was literally the beginning of the war arc.

Tobi declared war before Kakashi/Sasuke encounter.

literally right before. he declared war while sasuke was rampaging through the kage summit.

soo...going from 2 chidori's a day to almost a dozen is not an increase?

going from barely doing one kumai with almost a minute of charging, to doing almost a dozen kumasi's and with almost instant activation is not an increase? spamming lighting style jutsu's, kumai's AND keeping the basic sharingan active for almost 2 days straight(when before a few minutes would drain him)

is not a huge increase?

before he could barely kumai diedara's arm, and in war arc he kumai'd the entire 8 tails.

and we are going to go by part 1 feats for this, kakashi murderstomps, as orochimaru even struggled a little against kid sasuke, and was surprised by Kn0 naruto. something that war arc kakashi wouldn't even be phased by.

on top of that, orochimaru was almost killed by Old man third hokage, somebody that War arc kakashi would have finished off with a single Rikori clone + kumai combo lmao. and THAT was oro in prime too!

^do you see the problem with scaling a character off of Part 1 feats? the same logic then can come back and bite you too.

and not for nothing but, kakashi has shown a LOT more growth from part 1 to War arc then orochimaru did.

so far orochimaru got Stalled and crippled by old man third hokage(and he even had the first and second as backup)

he got manhandled by jiraiya(no sage mode) and tsunade(no 100 seals).

he got punked by Kn4 naruto, and punked HARD at that. if it hadn't been for yamato naruto would have went back and literally slaughtered him.

he then got owned by Pre-Hebi sasuke(lmao) (and since sasuke also owned diedara, wouldn't that mean orochimaru is under kakashi? you know, since kakashi was handling diedara pretty handedly?)

he got brought back briefly to literally get 1-shot by itachi.

he then got brought back again, to be turned into sasuke's little helper.

and now? he's a glorified baby maker.

essentially you comparing war arc kakashi to part 1 kakashi is like comparing war arc kabuto to part 1 kabuto. you know the one that got owned by a sound ninja, the one that got punked out by naruto's base level kid resengan? so much has changed since then, its ridiculous to sit here and watch you spout out some BS about kakashi in part 1.

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#33 Posted by Zuriel-el (1491 posts) - - Show Bio

@Chair-Sama:

thanks (≧∇≦)

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#34 Edited by Shadow411 (466 posts) - - Show Bio

@chair-sama:

@shadow411 said:

@zuriel-el:

How is he superior, when did his chakra magically increase?

umm..in the two year time span? How, he had no more stamina as soon as the anime started back. It was shown during his first couple of fights he talked about his low stamina

I get there is a two year spam, but Kakashi went from like 27-29 or 28-30.

and? He's not gonna increase in chakra like a 12-15 or a 13-16 year old is, without some sort of special training like SM or KCM etc

Kakashi didn't increase nearly the same as Naruto/Sasuke.

nobody is saying he increased as much as they did. thats crazy. but did he increase? oh yes. Ok, but he still didn't increas near as much as ppl are trying to say.

he went from being almost beat by zabuza to standing toe to toe with the STRONGEST path of pain. and then STILL got stronger, enough to be able to hang in a battle with Bijou's AND go toe to toe against Obito. Pain is fodder imo. Highly overrated, the only thing he usually does is hides behind his 6 paths, each of them individually aren't that impressive, besides that, God realm only used low-level attacks

If he increased at all, it was only experience.

umm...the fact that he gained the ability of the MS alone is a HUGE buff. -No one said it wasn't, but he can't spam it like Uchiha members or ppl with Senju cells. So it's only like a 1-2 time thing for him.

Also, Kakashi nearly fainted using it once against Sasuke and that was well after Pain arc.

so, one lowball ok. he used it more then once against pain alone lmfao. how do you explain that? He used it twice on pain lmfao and died Deidara he only used it twice and couldn't walk, with the Obito fight (At the beginning) he used it once on his Kunai and once on rasengan. And tried it a third time and failed. And instantly fell to the ground. He couldn't even use it more than twice in Obito/Bee/Gai/Kakashi/Naruto fight.

Actually it was during war arc.

actually. that was literally the beginning of the war arc.

Still war arc!!

Tobi declared war before Kakashi/Sasuke encounter.

literally right before. he declared war while sasuke was rampaging through the kage summit.

Yes, but still war arc

soo...going from 2 chidori's a day to almost a dozen is not an increase?

When did I ever say he couldn't use Chidori more? My apologies, if I made it seem like his chakra didn't increase at all, it did, but his chakra using hax jutsu is severely low, and chidori type jutsu ain't crap against Oro he may as well nor even use it.

going from barely doing one kumai with almost a minute of charging, to doing almost a dozen kumasi's and with almost instant activation is not an increase? spamming lighting style jutsu's, kumai's AND keeping the basic sharingan active for almost 2 days straight(when before a few minutes would drain him)

A dozen?? When?? Oh yea, after 9 tails chakra!! But he doesn't have that here bud again, he collapsed trying to do it a third time against Obito and couldn't even pull off a third one

is not a huge increase?

before he could barely kumai diedara's arm, and in war arc he kumai'd the entire 8 tails.

Tell me the chapter/episode he did that to 8 tails, haven't seen it in a while, but I feel like he had Naruto BM chakra at that time

and we are going to go by part 1 feats for this, kakashi murderstomps, as orochimaru even struggled a little against kid sasuke, and was surprised by Kn0 naruto. something that war arc kakashi wouldn't even be phased by.

No one ever said that, quit trying to demonized me as biased against Kakashi and try to debate with me like an adult not like an upset child. I only suggested he hasn't grown much since then, and then he crapped himself against Oro, why would his be any different. That is literally the only thing I've done

on top of that, orochimaru was almost killed by Old man third hokage, somebody that War arc kakashi would have finished off with a single Rikori clone + kumai combo lmao. and THAT was oro in prime too!

It was even admitted that Oro didn't take him seriously, and because of that, he was caught off guard. He was stomping lord third up to that point

^do you see the problem with scaling a character off of Part 1 feats? the same logic then can come back and bite you too.

and not for nothing but, kakashi has shown a LOT more growth from part 1 to War arc then orochimaru did.

By taming Tobirama's chakra isn't impressive compared to Oro's part one feats?? Lmfao OK

so far orochimaru got Stalled and crippled by old man third hokage(and he even had the first and second as backup)

he got manhandled by jiraiya(no sage mode) and tsunade(no 100 seals).

W/ no arms btw, don't forget to add that

he got punked by Kn4 naruto, and punked HARD at that. if it hadn't been for yamato naruto would have went back and literally slaughtered him.

I don't remember him receiving any damage do you?? Nor do I remember him running off. BTW, J-Man nearly died from that

he then got owned by Pre-Hebi sasuke(lmao) (and since sasuke also owned diedara, wouldn't that mean orochimaru is under kakashi? you know, since kakashi was handling diedara pretty handedly?)

Sasuke said time and time again that Oro was seriously weakened and sick and w/o arms at the time. And he didn't even take Kakashi seriously when they fought. At no point did Sasuke acknowledge him as worthy of an uchiha sharingan or battle.

he got brought back briefly to literally get 1-shot by itachi.

So was Kakashi

he then got brought back again, to be turned into sasuke's little helper.

Kakashi was nothing after he lost DMS

and now? he's a glorified baby maker.

Kakashi is nothing w/o a sharingan which was literally his ride to fame.

essentially you comparing war arc kakashi to part 1 kakashi is like comparing war arc kabuto to part 1 kabuto. you know the one that got owned by a sound ninja, the one that got punked out by naruto's base level kid resengan? so much has changed since then, its ridiculous to sit here and watch you spout out some BS about kakashi in part 1.

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#35 Edited by Easternwind (4490 posts) - - Show Bio

@shadow411: The increase doesnt make sense but that is what happens in fiction, everyone else got scaled up so he did too, just like Krillin going from pitiful to fighting Raditz level opponents in less than a year.

He uses Kamui dozens and dozens of times with no rest during the war arc

He pulled off dozens of Lightning Blades.

He fought with Obito

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#36 Posted by Shadow411 (466 posts) - - Show Bio

@easternwind:

@shadow411: The increase doesnt make sense but that is what happens in fiction, everyone else got scaled up so he did too, just like Krillin going from pitiful to fighting Raditz level opponents in less than a year.

Might Gai didn't increase. WHAt does DBZ have to do here? Also, why wouldn't it make sense for him to power up?

He uses Kamui dozens and dozens of times with no rest during the war arc

WHile also being amped by BM Naruto. I've literally said this 100x's, everyone's just likes to overlook this. He couldn't even use it three times in the Naruto/KAKashi/Bee/Gai vs Obito fight. He literally collapsed and failed to do it a third time. W/ Pain only used it twice and died shortly after. W/ Sasuke used it once and was stumbling. He's consistently shown having a 1-2 shot limit. Even in war arc. He doesn't start doing it more til after Kurama's chakra

He pulled off dozens of Lightning Blades.

Again, irrelevant cause those attacks will do nothing to Oro

He fought with Obito

And?

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#37 Edited by Easternwind (4490 posts) - - Show Bio

Might Gai didn't increase. WHAt does DBZ have to do here? Also, why wouldn't it make sense for him to power up?

Gai could have, Dbz has to do with being another example, it doesnt make sense for the Humans to get so strong because they never have gotten that strong before and it is just silly.

WHile also being amped by BM Naruto. I've literally said this 100x's, everyone's just likes to overlook this. He couldn't even use it three times in the Naruto/KAKashi/Bee/Gai vs Obito fight. He literally collapsed and failed to do it a third time. W/ Pain only used it twice and died shortly after. W/ Sasuke used it once and was stumbling. He's consistently shown having a 1-2 shot limit. Even in war arc. He doesn't start doing it more til after Kurama's chakra

Bull, he does it multiple times even when he is not amped.

And he is bringing in large ass objects.

Again, irrelevant cause those attacks will do nothing to Oro

Nice job missing the point

1st of all, they could definitely hurt Oro, bad, he might be able to regen though.

second of all my point was he used to get tired from like 2 of them and be out of energy

So?

Obito is a beast, so that.

And it isnt just Obito, he just fights at a higher caliber the further into the story you get.

I'm not every saying Kakashi would win, I am saying that saying he cannot get stronger doesnt make sense.

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#38 Posted by Aristeaus (145 posts) - - Show Bio

Prime Orochimaru knows as much about Sharingan as I know about asian schoolgirls.

Oro Stomps.

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#39 Posted by Zuriel-el (1491 posts) - - Show Bio

@Aristeaus:

orochimarus attraction to sharingan gets him caught in genjutsu every time.

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#40 Posted by Zuriel-el (1491 posts) - - Show Bio

@Aristeaus:

orochimarus attraction to sharingan gets him caught in genjutsu every time.

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#41 Posted by Chair-Sama (2280 posts) - - Show Bio

@shadow411: you claim kakashi was nothing after he lost his sharingan?

right there this debate is over because you are clearly ignorant of the series after that moment.

1. He went on to become the hokage. thats not "nothing" that means out of every single living ninja in the leaf village, he was the most qualified to hold the position of the strongest in the village. infact the ONLY person who was stronger then him was his replacement, naruto.

2. he was not "nothing" read the light novel about him and he's actually still pretty awesome. sure he's not naruto and sasuke level. Nobody is. Look at orochimaru after the fact, he became a glorified high school biology teacher who couldnt even control his own experiments and got punked by a 10 year old kid who mastered sage mode better then he ever could.

if we are talking after the war, after kakashi lost his Sharingan, let em ask you. what did orochimaru do after the war?

he lost most of his abilities and powers and basicly had to retire with suigetsu to help him.

he basicly became a old science teacher for the kids.

and i want you to think about something. Orochimaru had to run away from a single 4 tailed form naruto.

kakashi fought and led a war against 7 tailed beasts, the ten tails AND obito/madara/kaguya.

you know, the same battle field orochimaru was afraid to even go to? he was reluctant to even go, and when sasuke went off to go fight madara, even orochimaru stated he would only get in the way and get killed.

kakashi? nah, not only did kakashi help, but the dude went toe to toe with kaguya both with and without the sharingan. he saved naruto and sakura's lives with his quick thinking, and HE was the one that found a way around obito's jutsu. if he hadn't figured that out, they would have never been able to have finished the fight the way they did.

also ironic that you say the lightning blade wouldn't hurt orochimaru. lmao tell that to sasuke when he used his chidori spear right through orochimaru to hold him in place lmao.

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#42 Posted by Chair-Sama (2280 posts) - - Show Bio

Prime Orochimaru knows as much about Sharingan as I know about asian schoolgirls.

Oro Stomps.

yet every single sharingan users he's openly fought has single handedly beat him and made him call them Oni-Chan.

he does not really have a good track record of fighting sharingan users.

honestly, if you reallllly think about it, the ONLY one he actually is able to really fight against seems to be children and old men. everybody else he's either left mid-fight or lost or couldnt outright beat.

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#43 Posted by Cosmic_Lantern (5671 posts) - - Show Bio

Kakashi stomps.....Raikiri soundly deals with the multiplying snakes trick by splitting them in half or simply flooding the area then tracking fang. Not to mention Kakashi actually knows how to seal as well as Genjutsu.

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#44 Posted by Shadow411 (466 posts) - - Show Bio

@chair-sama:

@shadow411: you claim kakashi was nothing after he lost his sharingan?

right there this debate is over because you are clearly ignorant of the series after that moment.

1. He went on to become the hokage. thats not "nothing" that means out of every single living ninja in the leaf village, he was the most qualified to hold the position of the strongest in the village. infact the ONLY person who was stronger then him was his replacement, naruto.

- firstly, being homage is no sign whatsoever that you're the strongest in the village. It's hilarious that you didn't even know that. Ok, but Sasuke, Sakura, choji, Rock Lee, Kabuto, Oro, and arguably Shikimaru, Hinata, Hizashi, Tsunade, Yamato

2. he was not "nothing" read the light novel about him and he's actually still pretty awesome. sure he's not naruto and sasuke level. Nobody is. Look at orochimaru after the fact, he became a glorified high school biology teacher who couldnt even control his own experiments and got punked by a 10 year old kid who mastered sage mode better then he ever could.

IIRC, Kakashi got weaker after war arc while Oro kept his senju cells??

if we are talking after the war, after kakashi lost his Sharingan, let em ask you. what did orochimaru do after the war?

They don't have to do anything for us to simply analyze what happened to them. Kakashi literally lost his claim to fame "Kakashi of the sharingan eye", no longer has his sharingan. He literally lost what made him so powerful, he still has low stamina, his chidori wont be any good since now he'll get countered so easily.

he lost most of his abilities and powers and basicly had to retire with suigetsu to help him.

When was that stated/hinted?

he basicly became a old science teacher for the kids.

And Kakashi became homage to do paper work, there was no war or anything while he was homage. He was basically the village secretary.

and i want you to think about something. Orochimaru had to run away from a single 4 tailed form naruto.

When did he run away, all I remember was him stabbing Naruto with a sword. Sakura getting b**** slapped then Yamato wood style controlling him meanwhile Oro conducted Danzig business through Sai?? What TF did you watch?? Lmfao

Edit: J-Man literally almost died from 4T Naruto.

kakashi fought and led a war against 7 tailed beasts, the ten tails AND obito/madara/kaguya.

Lmfao please stop please..... OMG lmfao

Kaguya/Madara would've one-shotted Kakashi, Sasuke literally took the lead as soon as IT was activated. Naruto put up a fight about it and Kakashi agreed with Sasuke that Kakashi was no longer useful in their fight. Kakashi had 3-4 moves before Kakashi was thrown into Kamui by Kurama. Kurama even admitted Naruto was holding back so he could protect Kakashi. He was useless in Obito fight, let alone Madara/Kaguya. Come on

you know, the same battle field orochimaru was afraid to even go to? he was reluctant to even go, and when sasuke went off to go fight madara, even orochimaru stated he would only get in the way and get killed.

Again, same thing Kakashi said while he was there.

kakashi? nah, not only did kakashi help, but the dude went toe to toe with kaguya both with and without the sharingan. he saved naruto and sakura's lives with his quick thinking, and HE was the one that found a way around obito's jutsu. if he hadn't figured that out, they would have never been able to have finished the fight the way they did.

Might Gai alone was never gonna get hurt by Obito. So don't imply they'd have never won. Gai was stalemating him w/no gates open, let alone all 8. Kakashi didn't lose his sharingan til long after the Kaguya fight.

also ironic that you say the lightning blade wouldn't hurt orochimaru. lmao tell that to sasuke when he used his chidori spear right through orochimaru to hold him in place lmao.

Oh yea that's right, just like a fanboy. Let's use the weakest oro version we've seen throughout the series. You know, the one coughing up blood and couldn't even use his arms lmfao

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#45 Posted by Chair-Sama (2280 posts) - - Show Bio

- firstly, being homage is no sign whatsoever that you're the strongest in the village.

actually thats exactly what it is. thats been the role of hokage since literally chapter 1.

It's hilarious that you didn't even know that.

really?

Ok, but Sasuke(left the village and was locked up after the war) ,

Sakura--she's a healer, she had a hard punch but, come on. kakashi has decades of experience on her, and she had not even run her own squad/team yet, let alone manage a whole village.

Kakahsi has run missions with Anbu, as a jonin/chunin and as the leader of Team 7.

he lead troops in 2 great wars

choji. really? id argue that non-sharingan kaakshi would demolish Choji anyday.

Rock Lee - rock lee is physically stronger then kaakshi yes. infact arguably he is the strongest physical person in the village tied with naruto and Choji

But like any of the others. Rock Lee does not have the Expreicne to run a village. he hasn't even run his own squad up until this point. he's never been in charge of more then 1-2 people until the very end of the series. and tactically he's a blitz first and ask questions later type of character, and he's even more naive then Gai sensei.

Kabuto (glorified babysitty now, the dude was literally changed from izanami, he's not the same kabuto as he used to be. he was also a traitor to the village)

Oro (traitor to the village. Killed a hokage. and also no apart of the leaf village any longer and he never came back. in fact as of Boruto the only people who know about oro are mitsuki, naruto, sasuke, kakashi and gai, and a few other higher ups like shikimaru and such)

Shikimaru -- already said he wanted to be anruto's assistant, and id argue weaker then kakashi in a fair fight.

Hint She's brave but not very strong. She got manhandled by pain and even kakashi did better then her. she has no experience leading anybody, and she is going to be the head of the clan anyway.

, hizashi (lmao)

Tsunade (WHAT?? how could she replace herself as hokage? you do realize she would be an old lady after the war ended, and she almost died in the war. she herself said she was no longer fit to keep going as hokage)

Yamato --- this is the one personal who arguably could take on kakashi, win, and would be deserving of the title of hokage, as he would easily clear the rest of this list as well.

IIRC, Kakashi got weaker after war arc while Oro kept his senju cells??

of course oro kept his cells, the dudes body is completely made of them.

They don't have to do anything for us to simply analyze what happened to them. Kakashi literally lost his claim to fame "Kakashi of the sharingan eye", no longer has his sharingan.

except now he is known as "kakashi, the 6th hokage" an even greater claim to fame.

He literally lost what made him so powerful,

except for the fact that he was powerful BEFORE he got the sharingan. he was one of few prodigy ninjas. he was one of the youngest jonin, and the youngest chunin to pass the exams. and that was BEFORE he had his sharingan.

even orochimaru was not that Good at that young of an age. he was a genius sure, but kakashi was a jonin before orochimaru technically became a chunin.

he still has low stamina, his chidori wont be any good since now he'll get countered so easily.

if anything he gets a boost to stamina. without the drain to his sharingan. he still has mastery over all elemental styles. he still knows the jutsu's he's copied.

he lost most of his abilities and powers and basicly had to retire with suigetsu to help him.

When was that stated/hinted?

boruto. naruto gaiden. the end of naruto. he stated he was not the same as he used to be. obviously an over-exaggeration on my end by saying he has none of his abilities. but its been made very obvious he's not the same powerhouse that he used to be.

hell kabuto LITERALLY became a teacher.

And Kakashi became homage to do paper work, there was no war or anything while he was homage. He was basically the village secretary.

the difference is, IF anything happened, he is still hokage.

he is still the defender of the village and the leader of the ninja of the village hidden in the leaf. tactically he is probably the single smartest person left in the village.

he was still a prodigy ninja. he is still a master of all 5 elemental styles. he is still in possession of over 1000 known jutsu.

and i want you to think about something. Orochimaru had to run away from a single 4 tailed form naruto.

When did he run away, all I remember was him stabbing Naruto with a sword. Sakura getting b**** slapped then Yamato wood style controlling him meanwhile Oro conducted Danzig business through Sai?? What TF did you watch?? Lmfao

umm the moment he escaped in the snake body.

Edit: J-Man literally almost died from 4T Naruto.

is jiraiya in this fight?

Lmfao please stop please..... OMG lmfao

so are you saying kakashi was not in the fight with the tailed beasts?

are you saying kakashi was not there in the war? that he didn't take on the ninja swordsmen, that he didn't take on obito and fight side by side with Gai, killer bee and naruto? weird, what were YOU watching?

Kaguya/Madara would've one-shotted Kakashi,

But they didn't.

Sasuke literally took the lead as soon as IT was activated. Naruto put up a fight about it and Kakashi agreed with Sasuke that Kakashi was no longer useful in their fight.

thats not exactly what he said but ok.

Kakashi had 3-4 moves before Kakashi was thrown into Kamui by Kurama.

i thought you said he would get one-shotted?

Kurama even admitted Naruto was holding back so he could protect Kakashi. He was useless in Obito fight

really? he was the only reason they even landed a hit on obito Pre-juubito.

, let alone Madara/Kaguya. Come on

Again, same thing Kakashi said while he was there.

yet he was still there.

Might Gai alone was never gonna get hurt by Obito.

and he was never going to hurt obito with him being intangible.....

So don't imply they'd have never won.

they would have never forced his mask, off, which lead to kakashi and obito fighting which led to kakashi stabbing obito through the heart. if that had not happened, obito would have still been controlled by madara(when he stabbed obito, he cut the puppet jutsu madara had on obito) thus never had Juubito, and IT would have been used before sasuke ever got to the battlefield BEFORE sasuke had a rinnegan to use to defend form it. Karachi's fight in the kumai dimension with obito literally saved the world.

Gai was stalemating him w/no gates open, let alone all 8.

so not landing a single attack is now stalemating?

Kakashi didn't lose his sharingan til long after the Kaguya fight.

you are obviously lacking knowledge, he lost it when madara took it from him, which is how madara got to the kumai dimension for the other rinnegan. naruto even gave him a new eye. are you serious?

Oh yea that's right, just like a fanboy. Let's use the weakest oro version we've seen throughout the series. You know, the one coughing up blood and couldn't even use his arms lmfao

ok, lets used the strongest version. show me a single feat he has that shows a full powered lightning blade, rikiri Kunai or lighting clone would not effect him.

Ill wait,

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#46 Edited by AlexTheBoss (9596 posts) - - Show Bio
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maru

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#47 Posted by killers10333 (2907 posts) - - Show Bio

Kakashi wins barring edo tenseis

War arc kakashi was literally as strong as they needed him to be without making him the hero

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#48 Posted by JdG (972 posts) - - Show Bio

Soooo, how exactly does Kakashi kill Orochimaru?

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#49 Posted by Shadow411 (466 posts) - - Show Bio

@chair-sama:

actually thats exactly what it is. thats been the role of hokage since literally chapter 1.

- No, it wasn't, chapter 1, Hiruzen Sarutobi was hokage and there was a bountiful of ppl that would've smoked him in a fight effortlessly. A) Might Gai, B) Danzo (If he had izanagi at the time), C) Itachi Uchiha who was still a member of Konica, D) Jiraiya (Who was doing undercover work for the leaf,

It's hilarious that you didn't even know that.

really? -LMFAO it really is hilarious

Ok, but Sasuke(left the village and was locked up after the war) ,

You said and I quote, "Strongest member in the village"

Sakura--she's a healer, she had a hard punch but, come on. kakashi has decades of experience on her, and she had not even run her own squad/team yet, let alone manage a whole village.

Kakashi also, was no match for her with just 1 MS, he admitted they all surpassed him at that point. It wasn't until he got DMS he was over Sakura. But now, he doesn't even have MS let alone 3T sharingan. Lmfao Kakashi admitted he was no match for the Sabin through and through the series and now he's lost his sharingan and Sakura has surpassed Tsunade (Who Kakashi said he was no match for)

Kakahsi has run missions with Anbu, as a jonin/chunin and as the leader of Team 7.

Shikimaru lead a group after Sasuke, is Pre-Time skip shikimaru stronger than EoS Sakura??

he lead troops in 2 great wars

Again, how is this relevant? Shikimaru lead the entire allied shinobi force after his dad died, is he now the strongest one there?

choji. really? id argue that non-sharingan kaakshi would demolish Choji anyday.

Well you'd be deluding yourself since Choji has shown incredible speed against pain as well as unrivaled DC against gedo statue

Rock Lee - rock lee is physically stronger then kaakshi yes. infact arguably he is the strongest physical person in the village tied with naruto and Choji

He's gonna smoke Kakashi who has no means of tracking his movements now.

But like any of the others. Rock Lee does not have the Expreicne to run a village. he hasn't even run his own squad up until this point. he's never been in charge of more then 1-2 people until the very end of the series. and tactically he's a blitz first and ask questions later type of character, and he's even more naive then Gai sensei.

You simply said STONGEST

Kabuto (glorified babysitty now, the dude was literally changed from izanami, he's not the same kabuto as he used to be. he was also a traitor to the village)

Still has regen, Sage jutsu, genjutsu, precog, etc.

Oro (traitor to the village. Killed a hokage. and also no apart of the leaf village any longer and he never came back. in fact as of Boruto the only people who know about oro are mitsuki, naruto, sasuke, kakashi and gai, and a few other higher ups like shikimaru and such)

Which only proves He's better at deceiving his enemies better than Kakashi.

Shikimaru -- already said he wanted to be anruto's assistant, and id argue weaker then kakashi in a fair fight.

-How?? He's got more stamina, more hax Justu, leagues above in intellect, and a much higher lvl of determination. The only thing Kakashi has here is blood lust

Hint She's brave but not very strong. She got manhandled by pain and even kakashi did better then her. she has no experience leading anybody, and she is going to be the head of the clan anyway.

Oh, are you talking about the hinata that was scared to use 64 palms??

, hizashi (lmao)

Please tell me why that's funny?

Tsunade (WHAT?? how could she replace herself as hokage? you do realize she would be an old lady after the war ended, and she almost died in the war. she herself said she was no longer fit to keep going as hokage)

She's still leagues ahead of him. He has no way to put her down and one punch from her would nearly kill him like it did J-Man

Yamato --- this is the one personal who arguably could take on kakashi, win, and would be deserving of the title of hokage, as he would easily clear the rest of this list as well.

He's stronger, idc if their more fit to be hokage or not. Trust me, I don't think Lee or Gai would make good Kages at all. I was only showing you, that just because Kakashi is Kage doesn't mean he's the strongest in the village. I just showed you several instances of ppl that would've wrecked him or Hiruzen.

of course oro kept his cells, the dudes body is completely made of them.

- Ok, so a guy that had enough power to hold down Tobiramama's chakra and kept all his hax, is weaker than a guy that literally lost all of his hax who also has low stamina??

They don't have to do anything for us to simply analyze what happened to them. Kakashi literally lost his claim to fame "Kakashi of the sharingan eye", no longer has his sharingan.

except now he is known as "kakashi, the 6th hokage" an even greater claim to fame.

His new title only entails paper work, said so himself. His old title represented battle prowess.

He literally lost what made him so powerful,

except for the fact that he was powerful BEFORE he got the sharingan. he was one of few prodigy ninjas. he was one of the youngest jonin, and the youngest chunin to pass the exams. and that was BEFORE he had his sharingan.

Prodigy ninja is one thing, fighting Oro is another. Neji was a prodigy ninja, would you put a byakuganless neji against Oro??

even orochimaru was not that Good at that young of an age. he was a genius sure, but kakashi was a jonin before orochimaru technically became a chunin.

Naruto was weak AF at young age, yet would crush anyone in the village. Sasuke was years behind Itachi at young age and would now mop the floor with Edo Itachi. J-Man sucked as a kid and would make Kakashi Bow to him now.

he still has low stamina, his chidori wont be any good since now he'll get countered so easily.

if anything he gets a boost to stamina. without the drain to his sharingan. he still has mastery over all elemental styles. he still knows the jutsu's he's copied.

Explain how chidori doesn't get countered. Everytime someone tries to use chidori, they either have sharingan active or they've been countered. No in betweens

he lost most of his abilities and powers and basicly had to retire with suigetsu to help him.

When was that stated/hinted?

boruto. naruto gaiden. the end of naruto. he stated he was not the same as he used to be. obviously an over-exaggeration on my end by saying he has none of his abilities. but its been made very obvious he's not the same powerhouse that he used to be.

He'd still meek Kakashi via more chakra, more hax, regen, blood lust, the only thing Kakashi has is intellect

hell kabuto LITERALLY became a teacher.

And Kakashi became homage to do paper work, there was no war or anything while he was homage. He was basically the village secretary.

the difference is, IF anything happened, he is still hokage.

And Kabuto would make him into a joke

he is still the defender of the village and the leader of the ninja of the village hidden in the leaf. tactically he is probably the single smartest person left in the village.

Shikimaru ring any bells, the guy who literally lead shinobi alliance

he was still a prodigy ninja. he is still a master of all 5 elemental styles. he is still in possession of over 1000 known jutsu.

And which one of those would put down Oro

and i want you to think about something. Orochimaru had to run away from a single 4 tailed form naruto.

When did he run away, all I remember was him stabbing Naruto with a sword. Sakura getting b**** slapped then Yamato wood style controlling him meanwhile Oro conducted Danzig business through Sai?? What TF did you watch?? Lmfao

umm the moment he escaped in the snake body.

-OR maybe while Naruto was being controlled he decided to do his business with Danzo

Edit: J-Man literally almost died from 4T Naruto.

is jiraiya in this fight?

No, but he'd merk Kakashi

Lmfao please stop please..... OMG lmfao

so are you saying kakashi was not in the fight with the tailed beasts?

Please define "IN THE FIGHT" if that means sitting on the sidelines as a cheerleader to Naruto yhen yes, he was. But if you consider in he fight like everyone else here, no he wssn . The only thing he did that helped was kept Gai from opening 8 gates.

are you saying kakashi was not there in the war? that he didn't take on the ninja swordsmen, that he didn't take on obito and fight side by side with Gai, killer bee and naruto? weird, what were YOU watching?

Don't imply that he killed all the swordmen by himself, he had his hands full with weak af Zabuza

Kaguya/Madara would've one-shotted Kakashi,

But they didn't. Yea, because they were busy with Naru/saku. They didn't even perceive Kakashi as a threat. Madara 1Rinnegan technically one-shotted him. He took his MS before Kakashi even reacted.

Sasuke literally took the lead as soon as IT was activated. Naruto put up a fight about it and Kakashi agreed with Sasuke that Kakashi was no longer useful in their fight.

thats not exactly what he said but ok.

Kakashi had 3-4 moves before Kakashi was thrown into Kamui by Kurama.

i thought you said he would get one-shotted?

By Madara/Kaguya, never said Obito (SUPER OVERRATED) would've one-shorted him.

Kurama even admitted Naruto was holding back so he could protect Kakashi. He was useless in Obito fight

really? he was the only reason they even landed a hit on obito Pre-juubito. In context yes, in actuality, Gai could've done it no prob at any time.

, let alone Madara/Kaguya. Come on

Again, same thing Kakashi said while he was there.

yet he was still there.

-Playing tic-tax-toe with Sakura on the side lines.

Might Gai alone was never gonna get hurt by Obito.

and he was never going to hurt obito with him being intangible.....

So don't imply they'd have never won.

they would have never forced his mask, off, which lead to kakashi and obito fighting which led to kakashi stabbing obito through the heart. if that had not happened, obito would have still been controlled by madara(when he stabbed obito, he cut the puppet jutsu madara had on obito) thus never had Juubito, and IT would have been used before sasuke ever got to the battlefield BEFORE sasuke had a rinnegan to use to defend form it. Karachi's fight in the kumai dimension with obito literally saved the world.

Gai was stalemating him w/no gates open, let alone all 8.

so not landing a single attack is now stalemating?

When neither of you gain any ground, yes. Gai w/no gates stalemated Obito

Kakashi didn't lose his sharingan til long after the Kaguya fight.

you are obviously lacking knowledge, he lost it when madara took it from him, which is how madara got to the kumai dimension for the other rinnegan. naruto even gave him a new eye. are you serious?

I was talking about forever, he got it back eventually after mad madara took it.

Oh yea that's right, just like a fanboy. Let's use the weakest oro version we've seen throughout the series. You know, the one coughing up blood and couldn't even use his arms lmfao

ok, lets used the strongest version. show me a single feat he has that shows a full powered lightning blade, rikiri Kunai or lighting clone would not effect him.

Ill wait,

How bout the time he took a fireball jutsu head on and didn't even have a scratch under the skin of the body he was using. Not a scratch from a move that produces much more DC than chidori (Which Kakashi can't even use now).

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#50 Posted by TheSaneJoker (5 posts) - - Show Bio

Wasn't Kakashi afraid of Orichimaru? Can't we just trust his judgement?