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#1 Posted by daak1212 (8404 posts) - - Show Bio

Which of these omiversal powers shall win?!?!

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#2 Posted by ssejllenrad (13112 posts) - - Show Bio

PR Beyonder.

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#3 Posted by daak1212 (8404 posts) - - Show Bio
@ssejllenrad said:
"PR Beyonder. "

Whoa there steed.  I might inquire for you to give an explanation.
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#4 Posted by Primmaster64 (21668 posts) - - Show Bio
@daak1212:GEB
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#5 Posted by Cubey. (107 posts) - - Show Bio

Pre-Retcon Beyonder wins 10/10. He's just on a whole nother level from GEB.

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#6 Posted by daak1212 (8404 posts) - - Show Bio

 
 

@Cubey.
said:
"Pre-Retcon Beyonder wins 10/10. He's just on a whole nother level from GEB. "

Now now thats not true.  GEB=Anti Pressence.  He is his total opposite and equal in power.  He took on Etrigan, a Silver Age Doc Fate, and Full power Spectre and shit stomped all of them plus an army of angels. 
 
Here is some pics. 

 
 

 
 


 
 
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#7 Posted by OmegaDynasty (10500 posts) - - Show Bio

Hm well GEB is the opposite of the Presence. The Spectre was only the size of it's thumb. Hm not sure.
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#8 Posted by Cubey. (107 posts) - - Show Bio

I know all that and I read the actual comics too. But Beyonder not only owned the entire MU, he did it casually, and his reality warping makes GEB's powers a non-factor. LT, Multi-Eternity, Death, Galactus etc. 
 
He was a way wanked character.

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#9 Posted by daak1212 (8404 posts) - - Show Bio
@Cubey. said:
"I know all that and I read the actual comics too. But Beyonder not only owned the entire MU, he did it casually, and his reality warping makes GEB's powers a non-factor. LT, Multi-Eternity, Death, Galactus etc.  He was a way wanked character. "

The only way GEB was stoped was because him and Prescence struck up perfect union and accordance in the Omniverse.  If the only way to stop you is by having the Prescence come to a comprimise with you that means your Effing strong.  Silverage Fate also has done Universal feats and I believe multiversal. 
 

 
 



 
 

GEB also owned these guys quite casually to.  Infact it was a one way door.  they walk in he spits them out and they lose.
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#10 Posted by OmegaDynasty (10500 posts) - - Show Bio
@Cubey. said:
"I know all that and I read the actual comics too. But Beyonder not only owned the entire MU, he did it casually, and his reality warping makes GEB's powers a non-factor. LT, Multi-Eternity, Death, Galactus etc.  He was a way wanked character. "

True, Beyonder was just ridlicliously powerful. GEB equals the Presence, and the Presence is equal to TOAA who is more powerful then the Beyonder despite how powerful he is.
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#11 Posted by daak1212 (8404 posts) - - Show Bio
@OmegaDynasty said:
"@Cubey. said:
"I know all that and I read the actual comics too. But Beyonder not only owned the entire MU, he did it casually, and his reality warping makes GEB's powers a non-factor. LT, Multi-Eternity, Death, Galactus etc.  He was a way wanked character. "
True, Beyonder was just ridlicliously powerful. GEB equals the Presence, and the Presence is equal to TOAA who is more powerful then the Beyonder despite how powerful he is. "

Yes but beating the Second strongest thing in the Marvel Omniverse must account for something.  I am willing to say he was equal to TOAA
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#12 Posted by Cubey. (107 posts) - - Show Bio

Damn. That's fucking impressive. Still though, my opinion remains unchanged. Just think about it. The Presence created the multiverse, and the GEB was = to him. Beyonder was millions of times more powerful than the Marvel multiverse as per the famous scan, and the MU is at least = the DCU if not >>>>> than it. 
 
So simple math will tell you that the Beyonder should be able to wipe the floor with 99% of fiction lol. If I remember correctly, he was contemplating ending all existence sitting in a hotel room, and also complained that nothing was fun for him since his every thought became reality.

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#13 Posted by OmegaDynasty (10500 posts) - - Show Bio
@daak1212 said:
"@OmegaDynasty said:
"@Cubey. said:
"I know all that and I read the actual comics too. But Beyonder not only owned the entire MU, he did it casually, and his reality warping makes GEB's powers a non-factor. LT, Multi-Eternity, Death, Galactus etc.  He was a way wanked character. "
True, Beyonder was just ridlicliously powerful. GEB equals the Presence, and the Presence is equal to TOAA who is more powerful then the Beyonder despite how powerful he is. "
Yes but beating the Second strongest thing in the Marvel Omniverse must account for something.  I am willing to say he was equal to TOAA "

He defeated the celestials, LT, etc. Lucifer and Archangel michael are said to be LT as they have been shown giving a beat down the Spectre. The comic stated that the GEB is even stronger then Lucifer who represnets God's Will.
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#14 Posted by ssejllenrad (13112 posts) - - Show Bio

GEB is not equal to TOAA. Both GEB and the Presence were said to be omnipotent but it makes no sense that two beings are omnipotent. It contradicts logic. Plus, what's the point of them joining together if they are already both omnipotent? Again, it makes no sense. I believe they only equal TOAA's power when combined.

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#15 Posted by Cubey. (107 posts) - - Show Bio

Wait wait the Presence is not = TOAA at all. He is not a true omnipotent as he himself was created, and the Primal Monitor is also questionably as powerful as him. He was unable to stop Lucifer who is definitely not omnipotent. I think that must be where the confusion's coming from. 
 
I also dislike the misconception that the Spectre = LT just because of their positions during DC vs Marvel. Spectre jobs a lot, whereas LT is the omniversal judge and has only ever been defeated like 2 or 3 times. Spectre was getting owned by DoV Captain Marvel.

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#16 Posted by Theworldbreaker (1681 posts) - - Show Bio
@daak1212: Dc should slap them selfs for making a chaacter like that in temrs of power no Dc should slap them selfs for approving of him.
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#17 Posted by OmegaDynasty (10500 posts) - - Show Bio
@ssejllenrad said:
"GEB is not equal to TOAA. Both GEB and the Presence were said to be omnipotent but it makes no sense that two beings are omnipotent. It contradicts logic. Plus, what's the point of them joining together if they are already both omnipotent? Again, it makes no sense. I believe they only equal TOAA's power when combined. "

Hm, something doesn't seem right here. Unless ABC order doesn't work here. The GEB is stronger then the Spectre, and is stated to be stronger then Lucifer who is said to be equal to his brother Michaeal. So  the GEB is stronger then beings that embody the Presence's wrath, will, and power. Although you say the GEB is half the power of the Presence which would make him less powerful the Archangel Michael because Mikey represents the Presnece's power.  I think I might be reading to much into this.
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#18 Posted by Warlord (354 posts) - - Show Bio

LMAO , that Swamp Thing is bold !!!
Uh , I think Over-void is above Presence , and Beyonder is not equal to TOAA , he is just a cosmic cube , LMAO !

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#19 Posted by Cubey. (107 posts) - - Show Bio

Did you miss the Pre-Retcon part, lol? Though I'm not sure if TOAA was even around during Marvel's classic age, I'll have to check up on that.

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#20 Posted by OmegaDynasty (10500 posts) - - Show Bio
@Warlord said:
"LMAO , that Swamp Thing is bold !!! Uh , I think Over-void is above Presence , and Beyonder is not equal to TOAA , he is just a cosmic cube , LMAO !"

Yeah, probably thinking : I'm a giant grotesque walking plant, what do I have to lose?
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#21 Posted by Warlord (354 posts) - - Show Bio

LMAO , he was retconned , and guess who did that ? XD

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#22 Posted by Cubey. (107 posts) - - Show Bio

The writers (not their in-comic respresentation of TOAA) the actual writers.

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#23 Posted by Warlord (354 posts) - - Show Bio

After all , all that Beyonder did during his "rumble in the jungle" was just a result of his imagination - in fact , he has never beaten Celestials , LMAO !!!

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#24 Posted by Cubey. (107 posts) - - Show Bio

This is PRE-Retcon Beyonder, you know, before LT could do shit to him and pulled out that asswipe explanation. How the fuck does a "millions of times stronger than the multiverse" Beyonder become an Inhuman, then a Cosmic Cube?  
 
So yeah, it's that guy vs GEB, a polar opposite and equal to a nigh-supreme being. Like I said, I'm going with Beyonder 10/10.

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#25 Posted by ssejllenrad (13112 posts) - - Show Bio
@OmegaDynasty said:
" @ssejllenrad said:
"GEB is not equal to TOAA. Both GEB and the Presence were said to be omnipotent but it makes no sense that two beings are omnipotent. It contradicts logic. Plus, what's the point of them joining together if they are already both omnipotent? Again, it makes no sense. I believe they only equal TOAA's power when combined. "
Hm, something doesn't seem right here. Unless ABC order doesn't work here. The GEB is stronger then the Spectre, and is stated to be stronger then Lucifer who is said to be equal to his brother Michaeal. So  the GEB is stronger then beings that embody the Presence's wrath, will, and power. Although you say the GEB is half the power of the Presence which would make him less powerful the Archangel Michael because Mikey represents the Presnece's power.  I think I might be reading to much into this. "
GEB is not really half cause its power cannot be measured. But it's still not fully omnipotent cause it needs the Presence to be whole. Like imperfect but infinite. I dunno. What I said was just my take on things.  Honestly, DC powerlevels make me dizzy. I still believe the Presence and GEB on their own is weaker than TOAA.
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#26 Posted by MarvelJackAss433 (12774 posts) - - Show Bio
@daak1212: if i may ask which issue is that?and what happened to swamp thing?
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#27 Posted by daak1212 (8404 posts) - - Show Bio
@ssejllenrad said:
"GEB is not equal to TOAA. Both GEB and the Presence were said to be omnipotent but it makes no sense that two beings are omnipotent. It contradicts logic. Plus, what's the point of them joining together if they are already both omnipotent? Again, it makes no sense. I believe they only equal TOAA's power when combined. "

They combined to fix the omniverse.  Its like TOAA and why he created the heart of the universe.
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#28 Posted by daak1212 (8404 posts) - - Show Bio
@Cubey. said:
"Wait wait the Presence is not = TOAA at all. He is not a true omnipotent as he himself was created, and the Primal Monitor is also questionably as powerful as him. He was unable to stop Lucifer who is definitely not omnipotent. I think that must be where the confusion's coming from.  I also dislike the misconception that the Spectre = LT just because of their positions during DC vs Marvel. Spectre jobs a lot, whereas LT is the omniversal judge and has only ever been defeated like 2 or 3 times. Spectre was getting owned by DoV Captain Marvel. "
Prescence is equal to TOAA.  Lucifer was able to do half the things he has done because big P allowed it.  He allowed him hell, acutally he made hell for him.
 
 


@OmegaDynasty said:
"@ssejllenrad said:
"GEB is not equal to TOAA. Both GEB and the Presence were said to be omnipotent but it makes no sense that two beings are omnipotent. It contradicts logic. Plus, what's the point of them joining together if they are already both omnipotent? Again, it makes no sense. I believe they only equal TOAA's power when combined. "
Hm, something doesn't seem right here. Unless ABC order doesn't work here. The GEB is stronger then the Spectre, and is stated to be stronger then Lucifer who is said to be equal to his brother Michaeal. So  the GEB is stronger then beings that embody the Presence's wrath, will, and power. Although you say the GEB is half the power of the Presence which would make him less powerful the Archangel Michael because Mikey represents the Presnece's power.  I think I might be reading to much into this. "

Lucifer is way stronger than the Spectre and the Spectre aware of this.  Spectre is usually shown to be a fluctuating entity because DC dosent really have an established Cosmic panthenon.  They usually make Spectre do everything because trying to use an old or new creation would seem awkward in the comic.
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#29 Posted by Pr_Beyonder (2528 posts) - - Show Bio
@OmegaDynasty said:
"@Cubey. said:
"I know all that and I read the actual comics too. But Beyonder not only owned the entire MU, he did it casually, and his reality warping makes GEB's powers a non-factor. LT, Multi-Eternity, Death, Galactus etc.  He was a way wanked character. "
True, Beyonder was just ridlicliously powerful. GEB equals the Presence, and the Presence is equal to TOAA who is more powerful then the Beyonder despite how powerful he is. "


You're hurting my feelings >;o
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#30 Posted by texasdeathmatch (13673 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow, these Dr. Fate scans just look like wild acid trips.

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#31 Posted by ckal (1116 posts) - - Show Bio
@texasdeathmatch said:
" Wow, these Dr. Fate scans just look like wild acid trips. "
Haha that's what I was thinking. I can't even tell what's going on there.
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#32 Posted by Freefa11 (2488 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't really know much about the GEB, but on the topic of omnipotence, I can say that it is an either/or thing. Either you're omnipotent, or you're not. Anything that isn't omnipotent is infinitely weaker than anything that is omnipotent. The term "nigh-omnipotent" gets thrown around a lot, but it doesn't actually mean anything; no matter how powerful something is, if it isn't infinitely powerful, then its infinitely far away from being infinitely powerful. 
 
And, as mentioned, two omnipotent beings simultaneously existing is a logical contradiction.

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#33 Posted by Thor's hammmer (7186 posts) - - Show Bio

pre retcon beyonder slaughter stomp
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#34 Posted by Cubey. (107 posts) - - Show Bio
@daak1212 said:
" @Cubey. said:
"Wait wait the Presence is not = TOAA at all. He is not a true omnipotent as he himself was created, and the Primal Monitor is also questionably as powerful as him. He was unable to stop Lucifer who is definitely not omnipotent. I think that must be where the confusion's coming from.  I also dislike the misconception that the Spectre = LT just because of their positions during DC vs Marvel. Spectre jobs a lot, whereas LT is the omniversal judge and has only ever been defeated like 2 or 3 times. Spectre was getting owned by DoV Captain Marvel. "
Prescence is equal to TOAA.  Lucifer was able to do half the things he has done because big P allowed it.  He allowed him hell, acutally he made hell for him.
No Caption Provided
He still said that he himself was created by external forces. And there's still the Primal Monitor to compete with. Presence is not = TOAA.
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#35 Posted by daak1212 (8404 posts) - - Show Bio
@Cubey. said:
" @daak1212 said:
" @Cubey. said:
"Wait wait the Presence is not = TOAA at all. He is not a true omnipotent as he himself was created, and the Primal Monitor is also questionably as powerful as him. He was unable to stop Lucifer who is definitely not omnipotent. I think that must be where the confusion's coming from.  I also dislike the misconception that the Spectre = LT just because of their positions during DC vs Marvel. Spectre jobs a lot, whereas LT is the omniversal judge and has only ever been defeated like 2 or 3 times. Spectre was getting owned by DoV Captain Marvel. "
Prescence is equal to TOAA.  Lucifer was able to do half the things he has done because big P allowed it.  He allowed him hell, acutally he made hell for him.
 
 
He still said that he himself was created by external forces. And there's still the Primal Monitor to compete with. Presence is not = TOAA. "

Find me a scan because I've been looking for them and I cant find them.  He's inside the Overmonitor, I think thats the compition you speak of.  Primal Monitor is the original Monitor
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#36 Posted by texasdeathmatch (13673 posts) - - Show Bio
@ckal said:
" @texasdeathmatch said:
" Wow, these Dr. Fate scans just look like wild acid trips. "
Haha that's what I was thinking. I can't even tell what's going on there. "
haha I think these were the type of comics I avoided as a kid, to avoid imploding my mind with wild magical fantasies
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#37 Posted by ckal (1116 posts) - - Show Bio
@texasdeathmatch said:
" @ckal said:
" @texasdeathmatch said:
" Wow, these Dr. Fate scans just look like wild acid trips. "
Haha that's what I was thinking. I can't even tell what's going on there. "
haha I think these were the type of comics I avoided as a kid, to avoid imploding my mind with wild magical fantasies "
Feel like I'm in Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas
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#38 Posted by Cubey. (107 posts) - - Show Bio
@daak1212 said:
" @Cubey. said:
" @daak1212 said:
" @Cubey. said:
"Wait wait the Presence is not = TOAA at all. He is not a true omnipotent as he himself was created, and the Primal Monitor is also questionably as powerful as him. He was unable to stop Lucifer who is definitely not omnipotent. I think that must be where the confusion's coming from.  I also dislike the misconception that the Spectre = LT just because of their positions during DC vs Marvel. Spectre jobs a lot, whereas LT is the omniversal judge and has only ever been defeated like 2 or 3 times. Spectre was getting owned by DoV Captain Marvel. "
Prescence is equal to TOAA.  Lucifer was able to do half the things he has done because big P allowed it.  He allowed him hell, acutally he made hell for him.
 
 
He still said that he himself was created by external forces. And there's still the Primal Monitor to compete with. Presence is not = TOAA. "
Find me a scan because I've been looking for them and I cant find them.  He's inside the Overmonitor, I think thats the compition you speak of.  Primal Monitor is the original Monitor "
Ask and you shall receive:  http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/3605/77983118mw3.jpg 
 
And yeah, Primal Monitor = Overmonitor/Overvoid all the same shit. The original Monitor never had a name other than... Monitor.
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#39 Posted by King Saturn (223065 posts) - - Show Bio
stalemate
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#40 Posted by primebonnick (4291 posts) - - Show Bio
@Warlord :  over void is like beyonder but not top dog the presence is still above him
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#41 Edited by TheSpeed (11 posts) - - Show Bio

Beyonder is on the level with The Spectre who takes orders for the presence. The Great Evil Beast is on the level with The Presence. And to the other people bringing up TOAA, he is basically The Presence and The Great Evil Beast. TOAA is the strongest Marvel character but God is with DC. Even though TOAA is leveled with The Presence and The Great Evil Beast he isn't the strongest.

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#42 Posted by jeanroygrant (20442 posts) - - Show Bio

Pre Recton Beyonder.

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#43 Posted by lordraiden (9664 posts) - - Show Bio

@Warlord said:

LMAO , that Swamp Thing is bold !!! Uh , I think Over-void is above Presence , and Beyonder is not equal to TOAA , he is just a cosmic cube , LMAO !

They're talking bout pre-retcon Beyonder, who was omnipotent, not the retconned version, but the one from Secret Wars I & II

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#44 Posted by Metalslash (182 posts) - - Show Bio

GEB is slightly below presence and presence is infinitely above beyonder.

GEB stomps.

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#45 Posted by Scoop316 (173 posts) - - Show Bio

The Great Evil Beast should win, not easily of course.

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#46 Posted by rolldestroyer (3543 posts) - - Show Bio

tough call, i'll probably go with PR beyonder on this one, seeing how the multiverse was a droplet of water compared to his realm.

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#48 Edited by spiderbuck1 (2768 posts) - - Show Bio

Beyonder.

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#49 Posted by MrMaster (53 posts) - - Show Bio

It's quite simple ... nothing short of a Supreme being stalemates Beyonder. (CIS off)

By "Supreme" I mean the Presence or whatever the heck is the absolute "Supreme power" over at DC, cause that's what Beyonder was.

Of course, one could argue that since Marvelverse's totality was like a drop of water next to Beyonder, and the Marvelverse totality would be = to DC's totality, logic demands for us to say that Beyonder was far more vast/grand that the creation power behind either Totalities.

The only character that imo is something akin to what Beyonder was, is the Primal Monitor. (heck, it's almost a rip off)

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#50 Edited by ShadowHuntR (766 posts) - - Show Bio

@mrmaster said:

It's quite simple ... nothing short of a Supreme being stalemates Beyonder. (CIS off)

By "Supreme" I mean the Presence or whatever the heck is the absolute "Supreme power" over at DC, cause that's what Beyonder was.

Of course, one could argue that since Marvelverse's totality was like a drop of water next to Beyonder, and the Marvelverse totality would be = to DC's totality, logic demands for us to say that Beyonder was far more vast/grand that the creation power behind either Totalities.

The only character that imo is something akin to what Beyonder was, is the Primal Monitor. (heck, it's almost a rip off)

Beyonder isn't and wasn't TOAA so he's not on the Presence's level. Which means that he's not on GEB level either.

Concerning the ''overmonitor'' it was stated in one panel and we've never seen anything else. I've seen Silver Surfer getting knocked out by a brick and Thor by a mortar round. Does that mean it is part of the character? Bring me more proof about the Overmonitor and other proof that the Presence isn't the God of the DC Universe and then maybe we can agree on something. But there's more proof right now showing that the Presence is indeed the God of DC.

So GEB > Beyonder.

By the way, of course two omnipotent characters in the same Universe shouldn't exist. The funny thing is that many people think Beyonder was omnipotent. What about TOAA? Both of them were Omnipotent then. Same for the Presence and the Great Evil Beast.

Anyway, they are comics after all...