Omniscience VS Speedster

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The_Thunderer

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#1  Edited By The_Thunderer

If a guy with omniscience fought a speedster who would win. Assume that the omniscient person is of average build and strength but has invulnerability (TO the extent that Thor and Superman have)

Round 1: Quiksilver

Round 2: Flash

Round 3: Zoom

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Saren

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#2  Edited By Saren

What good is omniscience if you cannot do anything to prevent the things you see happening? And by invulnerability do you mean the way Superman etc are invulnerable?

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Strider1992

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#3  Edited By Strider1992

I'd go with the omniscient everytime as now matter how fast the opponent is the omniscient will always know where the speedster will be at any given time time. Thus all he has to do is hold out his arm at the right moment and the speedster will get KO'd by running into him as he's invulnerable.

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The_Thunderer

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#4  Edited By The_Thunderer

@CitizenBane: i.e. if they put their arm out to clothesline flash it wouldn't get ripped off.

You know what will happen pre-fight, so can move before the speedsters, its like having advanced precog..

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Killemall

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#5  Edited By Killemall

@Strider92 said:

I'd go with the omniscient everytime as now matter how fast the opponent is the omniscient will always know where the speedster will be at any given time time. Thus all he has to do is hold out his arm at the right moment and the speedster will get KO'd by running into him as he's invulnerable.

That is if he's fast enough to think, know where is and move his hand. People like flash and Zoom would tear you limb for limb before you had the time to think, let alone move ur hand.

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Killemall

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#6  Edited By Killemall

@The_Thunderer said:

@CitizenBane: i.e. if they put their arm out to clothesline flash it wouldn't get ripped off.

You know what will happen pre-fight, so can move before the speedsters, its like having advanced precog..

And someone like Zoom or Flash would be dumb enough not to see a raised arms, dodge it and punch his lights out??

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The_Thunderer

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#7  Edited By The_Thunderer

@Killemall: But they know that they will try and do that before zoom has even moved..

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Killemall

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#8  Edited By Killemall

@The_Thunderer said:

@Killemall: But they know that they will try and do that before zoom has even moved..

And zoom can see what the guy did and change his tactic afterwards.

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Pokergeist

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#9  Edited By Pokergeist
@Killemall said:


                   

@Strider92 said:

I'd go with the omniscient everytime as now matter how fast the opponent is the omniscient will always know where the speedster will be at any given time time. Thus all he has to do is hold out his arm at the right moment and the speedster will get KO'd by running into him as he's invulnerable.

That is if he's fast enough to think, know where is and move his hand. People like flash and Zoom would tear you limb for limb before you had the time to think, let alone move ur hand.



                   

               

But if your Invunerable they cant really do anything.
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The_Thunderer

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#10  Edited By The_Thunderer

@Killemall: but they would know that that tactic wouldn't work

@CadenceV2: Edited OP for more clarity on invulnerability

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Killemall

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#11  Edited By Killemall

@CadenceV2 said:

But if your Invunerable they cant really do anything.

Not completely invulnerable just superman class is what the OP said, Zoom could still hit him like a 1000 light speed punches.

@The_Thunderer said:

@Killemall: but they would know that that tactic wouldn't work

Why wouldnt it? Guy A knows what guy B is going to do, so he can put his hand where's guy's B is going to be, however it ignores the fact that if Guy B is like Zoom he can see the hand, dance for a while, go kiss a hottie next door, steal a cat from the neighbour, and still come back dodge the arm and punch his head in before Guy A could see Zoom change his tactic.

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Killemall

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#12  Edited By Killemall

@The_Thunderer said:

@Killemall: but they would know that that tactic wouldn't work

@CadenceV2: Edited OP for more clarity on invulnerability

So all they can do with the omniscience is go make peace with their relative because they know Zoom is going to kill him soon.

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The_Thunderer

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#13  Edited By The_Thunderer

@Killemall: He would know not to put his arm up too early, but at that correct oppurtunity.

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Killemall

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#14  Edited By Killemall

@The_Thunderer said:

@Killemall: He would know not to put his arm up too early, but at that correct oppurtunity.

Someone like Flash given his femptosecond reaction time, at top speed would only be inone place for 1/1,000,000,000,000 of a second, so yeah knowing he is going to there in that short spam of time doesnt help, if he puts his arms out any earlier flash can simply dodge it, and punch his head in. Now Zoom is so fast Flash cant even see.

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Killemall

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#15  Edited By Killemall

@The_Thunderer: Sorry scratch that, i missed 3 zeroes, its 1/1,000,000,000,000,000 of a second

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mgc500

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#16  Edited By mgc500

Omniscient ? Flash, Zoom, Quicksilver, et al, suffer accidents in their sleep and never wake up. Why fight them when you know literally everything about them ? Doesn't matter how fast they are if they aren't moving.

Seriously, do the speedsters also think at the speed of light ? All the time ? Because otherwise they still have to have a thought to "run". Now once they start moving, sure they are crazy fast, but their actual speed of thought is the same as anyone else.

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Killemall

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#17  Edited By Killemall

@mgc500 said:

Omniscient ? Flash, Zoom, Quicksilver, et al, suffer accidents in their sleep and never wake up. Why fight them when you know literally everything about them ? Doesn't matter how fast they are if they aren't moving. Also, how are the superspeedsters beating anyone whose powers move just as fast as they can activate theirs ?

Seriously, do the speedsters also think at the speed of light ? All the time ? Because otherwise they still have to have a thought to "run". Now once they start moving, sure they are crazy fast, but their actual speed of thought is the same as anyone else.

Can agree with the first part.

Not Quicksilver he cant use his top speed, but both flash and Zoom think at lightspeed, thats because they perceive everything at slow motion. Zoom on his introduction had time to remember his whole past, cry for a while before the glass of water that spilled from the table reached the ground. Flash has speedforce connection that lets him think and react superfast hence the femptosecond reaction time, rather than FLT travel speed.

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Pokergeist

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#18  Edited By Pokergeist
@Killemall said:


                   

@The_Thunderer said:

@Killemall: but they would know that that tactic wouldn't work

@CadenceV2: Edited OP for more clarity on invulnerability

So all they can do with the omniscience is go make peace with their relative because they know Zoom is going to kill him soon.



                   

               

Yeah if they can IMP SBP then Invun needs to be like Galactus lvl at least.
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agent9149

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#19  Edited By agent9149

An omniscient being would know how to defeat a speedster but that doesn't mean he has the ability to do it.

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justleader

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#20  Edited By justleader

no one can beat an omniscient being(except nigh omnipotents or omnipotents) since he knows everything, he knows your every move and he also knows how to prevent your move he knows your weaknesses, he knows everything about you. omniscience means all knowledgable i mean he can literally know how many atoms are in the universe or in a specifc space or planet he knows everything and all

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The_Thunderer

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#21  Edited By The_Thunderer

@justleader: yup

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terry2012

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#22  Edited By terry2012

@Killemall: I can agree

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terry2012

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#23  Edited By terry2012

@justleader: I agree as well.

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#24  Edited By terry2012

@BlueLantern1995: Huh?

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HolySerpent

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#25  Edited By HolySerpent

:

What good is omniscience if you cannot do anything to prevent the things you see happening? And by invulnerability do you mean the way Superman etc are invulnerable?

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Urbs

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#26  Edited By Urbs

This is gonna be a stretch, but what if the omniscient person knew how to gain superspeed and superreactions even with his basic build. What if knew how to gain omnipotence, with a blink of an eye, or even within a picosecond. If there's some mystic secret or way for doing that, he would know. That's a stretch, but we don't fully understand the world, he would. Maybe he could figure out how to resurect yourself. That's the type of knowledge he could have.

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Strider1992

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#27  Edited By Strider1992

@HolySerpent said:

:

What good is omniscience if you cannot do anything to prevent the things you see happening? And by invulnerability do you mean the way Superman etc are invulnerable?

But omniscience means you know absolutely everything thus no matter what happens you must know how to beat anyone simply because you know everything and every outcome. So no matter how slim the chance is be it 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 to 1 you will still know exactly what is required to pull of that 1 as you know everything.

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HolySerpent

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#28  Edited By HolySerpent

@Strider92 said:

@HolySerpent said:

:

What good is omniscience if you cannot do anything to prevent the things you see happening? And by invulnerability do you mean the way Superman etc are invulnerable?

But omniscience means you know absolutely everything thus no matter what happens you must know how to beat anyone simply because you know everything and every outcome. So no matter how slim the chance is be it 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 to 1 you will still know exactly what is required to pull of that 1 as you know everything.

no, just because you know something doesn't mean you can prevent it. the person was given prep would he "would" probably

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#29  Edited By posterser

Omniscience equals all knowledge, so the omniscient person would foresee the exact steps of the speedster and come up with a perfect plan that will work 100%.

An all knowing person never fails.

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Strider1992

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#30  Edited By Strider1992

@HolySerpent: Why not? Law of averages states that there are always multiple outcomes not matter the odds. Even if one is immensely superior to the others another outcome can still happen due to variables and outside interference.

Thus if you know everything you know exactly how to create the other outcome even if the odds of it happening are impossibly low.

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ChaosMarvel

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#31  Edited By ChaosMarvel

@posterser said:

Omniscience equals all knowledge, so the omniscient person would foresee the exact steps of the speedster and come up with a perfect plan that will work 100%.

An all knowing person never fails.

@Strider92 said:

@HolySerpent: Why not? Law of averages states that there is always multiple outcomes not matter the odds. Even if one is immensely superior to the others another can outcome can still happen due to variables and outside interference.

Thus if you know everything you know exactly how to create the other outcome even if the odds of it happening are impossibly low.

This. No matter the odds an omniscient always knows how to win.

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HolySerpent

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#32  Edited By HolySerpent

@ChaosMarvel said:

@posterser said:

Omniscience equals all knowledge, so the omniscient person would foresee the exact steps of the speedster and come up with a perfect plan that will work 100%.

An all knowing person never fails.

@Strider92 said:

@HolySerpent: Why not? Law of averages states that there is always multiple outcomes not matter the odds. Even if one is immensely superior to the others another can outcome can still happen due to variables and outside interference.

Thus if you know everything you know exactly how to create the other outcome even if the odds of it happening are impossibly low.

This. No matter the odds an omniscient always knows how to win.

speedsters like the flash moves so fast make other characters appear to be standing still. yes the omniscience person knows how to be the speedster but due to his limitations " reflex and time". he wont be able to be the flash

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bluepride1234

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#33  Edited By bluepride1234

@Strider92 said:

I'd go with the omniscient everytime as now matter how fast the opponent is the omniscient will always know where the speedster will be at any given time time. Thus all he has to do is hold out his arm at the right moment and the speedster will get KO'd by running into him as he's invulnerable.

Omniscient might have the knowledge of where they all move, but they cannot physically react to the person. You can give a human all the knowledge about flash, but the flash will kill you before you react to it, even after you knew where he moved. Your body cannot physically raise the hand to protect yourself before he punches you.

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posterser

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#34  Edited By posterser

@bluepride1234 said:

@Strider92 said:

I'd go with the omniscient everytime as now matter how fast the opponent is the omniscient will always know where the speedster will be at any given time time. Thus all he has to do is hold out his arm at the right moment and the speedster will get KO'd by running into him as he's invulnerable.

Omniscient might have the knowledge of where they all move, but they cannot physically react to the person. You can give a human all the knowledge about flash, but the flash will kill you before you react to it, even after you knew where he moved. Your body cannot physically raise the hand to protect yourself before he punches you.

Except that an omniscient will foresee the speedster long before the speedster even comes up with an idea to attack. The omniscient person will always be a step ahead of the speedster. Even if he can't harm him, he will come up with something that can, no matter what. An omniscient person knows perfectly how to deal with a situation like this. He will never fail......

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mightyzeus

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#35  Edited By mightyzeus

an omniscient can come up to with an idea how to defeat a speedster in less than a milisecond and he knows that it will work, he can know anything and at any time.

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BMEZY

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#36  Edited By BMEZY

An omniscient can know everything there is to know about zoom and flash. They can know where they are, their powers, their weaknesses. They would know the number of every strand of hair on their head. They know absolutely EVERYTHING, BUT if they aren't given the time to utilize this said knowledge, it's futile and holds little weight to these two contenders (zoom and flash). TIME is everything in this battle, not KNOWLEDGE. Having knowledge about a specific thing does not equate to having time to apply it to good use in this battle because regardless of what they know, they STILL don't have the ability to percieve, react, and effectively COUNTER Flash or Zoom...I bet an omniscient would know their inevitable death too. :D

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The Man of Yesteryear

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Luckily, the omniscient being knew this fight would be his last day on earth so he had time to say goodbye to his loved ones.

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The_Thunderer

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#38  Edited By The_Thunderer

@The Man of Yesteryear: surely he wouldnt go and fight then?

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eatmore_payless

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#39  Edited By eatmore_payless

Lets puter mister x on the line. is he omniscient?

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OmegaDynasty

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#40  Edited By OmegaDynasty
@The Man of Yesteryear said:

Luckily, the omniscient being knew this fight would be his last day on earth so he had time to say goodbye to his loved ones.

That or he knew how the fight was going to happen, so with knowing how it would go he comes up with a way of stopping the speedster. 
Would be like Midnighter, and his battle computer but on a bigger scale. 
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The_Thunderer

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#41  Edited By The_Thunderer

@OmegaDynasty said:

@The Man of Yesteryear said:

Luckily, the omniscient being knew this fight would be his last day on earth so he had time to say goodbye to his loved ones.

That or he knew how the fight was going to happen, so with knowing how it would go he comes up with a way of stopping the speedster. Would be like Midnighter, and his battle computer but on a bigger scale.

exactly, he could predict every variable, and maybe discover ways around our established laws of physics..

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#42  Edited By kingkronos

Omniscient beings can't lose since they will foresee what would happen and will create a way to defeat their opponents. Why? Because they are all-knowing beings, they know everything, they know everything that happened, everything that is happening, and everything that will happen. They can't lose as simple as that.

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YoggSaron

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#43  Edited By YoggSaron

One being all knowing does not mean they have the power or resources to stop people like the Flash and Zoom, assuming that they have no powers besides their given omniscience and invulnerability. They would know they were meeting their demise.

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kingkronos

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#44  Edited By kingkronos

@YoggSaron said:

One being all knowing does not mean they have the power or resources to stop people like the Flash and Zoom, assuming that they have no powers besides their given omniscience and invulnerability. They would know they were meeting their demise.

Except that an all knowing person will come up with a solution in no time. They would foresee Flash's step and make a trap.

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YoggSaron

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#45  Edited By YoggSaron

@kingkronos said:

@YoggSaron said:

One being all knowing does not mean they have the power or resources to stop people like the Flash and Zoom, assuming that they have no powers besides their given omniscience and invulnerability. They would know they were meeting their demise.

Except that an all knowing person will come up with a solution in no time. They would foresee Flash's step and make a trap.

Again, they lack the resources to actually create that trap. They could know how to build it, but unless they actually have something to make it out of they aren't getting away with it. Then again, with their omniscience, they could become wealthy in no time and then acquire the resources, but we don't know how long someone has been all knowing, how long they have to plan ahead, or this is just an on the spot sort of deal. Personally, I don't like debating this, as there is a seemingly infinite number of variables you would have to consider into just how the all knowing person would win.

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Mr_Ingenuity

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#46  Edited By Mr_Ingenuity

@posterser said:

Omniscience equals all knowledge, so the omniscient person would foresee the exact steps of the speedster and come up with a perfect plan that will work 100%.

An all knowing person never fails.

QFT

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kingkronos

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#47  Edited By kingkronos

@YoggSaron said:

@kingkronos said:

@YoggSaron said:

One being all knowing does not mean they have the power or resources to stop people like the Flash and Zoom, assuming that they have no powers besides their given omniscience and invulnerability. They would know they were meeting their demise.

Except that an all knowing person will come up with a solution in no time. They would foresee Flash's step and make a trap.

Again, they lack the resources to actually create that trap. They could know how to build it, but unless they actually have something to make it out of they aren't getting away with it. Then again, with their omniscience, they could become wealthy in no time and then acquire the resources, but we don't know how long someone has been all knowing, how long they have to plan ahead, or this is just an on the spot sort of deal. Personally, I don't like debating this, as there is a seemingly infinite number of variables you would have to consider into just how the all knowing person would win.

Yes but then again the omniscient person can just evade all the attacks. It's really dificult to know what a person with something "infinite" can do.....

I mean the all knowing person will know flash's weaknesses and will use that against him. And the all knowing person would come up with a perfect plan that can't be escaped or evaded since he will understand and acknowledge flash's weakness and will maximize the effects to a very high degree....

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AngryHulks

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#48  Edited By AngryHulks

If omniscient person can't physically react in time, it won't help much, they'll anticipate their certain death anyway.

Zoom and Flash has hurt Superman-level characters before, so invulnerability to Superman's degree won't help much.

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kingkronos

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#49  Edited By kingkronos

@AngryHulks said:

If omniscient person can't physically react in time, it won't help much, they'll anticipate their certain death anyway.

Zoom and Flash has hurt Superman-level characters before, so invulnerability to Superman's degree won't help much.

The omniscient being will foresee that coming....... And create a situation where he/she wins.

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AngryHulks

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#50  Edited By AngryHulks

@kingkronos said:

@AngryHulks said:

If omniscient person can't physically react in time, it won't help much, they'll anticipate their certain death anyway.

Zoom and Flash has hurt Superman-level characters before, so invulnerability to Superman's degree won't help much.

The omniscient being will foresee that coming....... And create a situation where he/she wins.

I detect several omniscient paradox while imagining the scenario. I don't know how to put this into words, but...

He/she would be only able to create a situation to win if they have prep, without it, they're limited by their physical limit. Omniscient person will only be able to achieve something that make sense.