Neo and Smith ( Matrix) vs Superman and Zod ( man of steel)

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odstmiller

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#1  Edited By odstmiller
Neo and Smith
Neo and Smith

Vs

Superman and General Zod
Superman and General Zod

This is Neo and Smith teaming up VS Super man and Zod

Fight takes place in Mega City with harsh weather environment

This is Revolutions versions of Neo and Smith from their final battle

Smith CANNOT use his clones

100 M start

Scenario 1: Phasing is allowed for Matrix team, Laser beams allowed for Man of Steel team

Scenario 2: Phasing is not allowed for the Matrix team , Laser beans are not allowed for man of steel team

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Fallschirmjager

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#2  Edited By Fallschirmjager

Round 1: Matrix team 10/10 - phasing is too much in this scenario, heat vision isn't that much of a game changer

Round 2: Superman team 7/10. Stronger, faster, more durable. Matrix team is more skilled though so they will take some of the matches.

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HolySerpent

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Phasing? Anyway Superman solos

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odstmiller

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@holyserpent: Phasing as in Neo jumping into Smith in the first Movie and used on Trinity in Reloaded, too rub her heart to bring her back too life. So Neo could phase Superman heart out for an instance.

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Ancient_0f_Days

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#5  Edited By Ancient_0f_Days

I'm backing Neo and Smith, they seemed a little faster and obviously more skilled. But Superman definitely has them in durability when he can fly up a teraforming laser thingy.

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dorukesin

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#6  Edited By dorukesin

zod or superman either can solo

they are too fast

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RudeBomberBoy01

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#7  Edited By RudeBomberBoy01

Superman and Zod are too fast, too strong and too durable for Neo and Smith to handle.

Neo's fighting skill will only prolong the inevitable; Superman beats him down hard!

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MonsterStomp

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Round One: Matrix Team

Round Two: Matrix Team

Smith absorbed Oracle's precognition, which is why he was giving Neo a hell of a fight in the end of Revolutions. Also, people are lowballing Neo's speed.

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SirNeko

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Superman and Zod, I like Matrix but Neo is too overrated.

I don't think Neo is that fast, people say that water is almost stand still when he punches. I take it as an slow motion effect to show what is happening, not how fast he is.

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rogueshadow

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#10  Edited By rogueshadow  Moderator

Team 2. Stronger, faster & more durable.

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Bossmonster

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#11  Edited By Bossmonster

Round One: Matrix Team

Round Two: Matrix Team

Smith absorbed Oracle's precognition, which is why he was giving Neo a hell of a fight in the end of Revolutions. Also, people are lowballing Neo's speed.

No one is low balling them. Neo and Smith could not take a hit from Zod or Clark. Not even one. Clark was never even hurt during the film.

All Smith would see with his precog is himself losing if he showed up. They have no answer for heat vision.

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ghostrider2

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Team one beats team two into the ground.

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odstmiller

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Question for you guys: Do you think if the Matrix was rebooted with today's tech this would be a better fight? Through judging by films Superman and Zod do look alot better because well, there is a 10 year time grab between the movies and the tech.

Here why I think.

So in the first 2 movies fighting styles are alot different than Revolutions, In The Matrix and Reloaded, It was more of a Dojo on the ground martial arts fighting. But in Revolutions you can obviously tell the intent of the Wachowski Brothers was too make sort of a DBZ type of fight, more super hero like, hence the Flying combat , punches that sent both Neo and Smith down the streets , and The shockwaves were completely different than the fighting in the 2 previous movies. If it were too be rebooted, I'd imagine the fight on the street as seen in the pic above, would generate little sonic booms , the shockwaves destroying most faces of buildings, and pretty much like the Man of Steel.

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green_skaar

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I'm backing Neo and Smith, they seemed a little faster and obviously more skilled. But Superman definitely has them in durability when he can fly up a teraforming laser thingy.

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Emperorb777

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MonsterStomp

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@monsterstomp said:

Round One: Matrix Team

Round Two: Matrix Team

Smith absorbed Oracle's precognition, which is why he was giving Neo a hell of a fight in the end of Revolutions. Also, people are lowballing Neo's speed.

No one is low balling them. Neo and Smith could not take a hit from Zod or Clark. Not even one. Clark was never even hurt during the film.

All Smith would see with his precog is himself losing if he showed up. They have no answer for heat vision.

People are lowballing their speed. Neo flew out of a tight room, weaving in between support beams while outpacing an explosion. Neo's speed was wrecking buildings and trailing a ton of debris.

Clark was knocked out a few times during the film, same thing could happen here and both Zod and Superman barely used heat vision in the films.

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Wardemon32

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#17  Edited By Wardemon32

Flying in a tight room and outpacking an explosion doesn't mean your fast at all; a Buggati should be able to out pace explosion easily. When Neo was flying after the explosion, though it looked extremely fast, I don't think this is actually very credible. Matrix physics is no where near "our" physics. There's no way he's that high in the air and his winds pick up cars from the ground that weighs 1-2 tons. I highlu doubt something like that could happen.

Superman was only knocked out once and that shouldn't be very credible either. I'm talking about the oil rig scene. Look at the patterns though.

Gets KOd by an oil rig before he learns to fly and gets closer to the sunlight.(first flying scene)

Gets KOd by a coal cart which weighs about 20 tons and was thrown(wouldn't really consder this a KO really because they never really showed it and the after he "woke up" he had no clear signs to indicate wether he was KOd) for a less amount of time. This was after he learns how to fly and got more exposure to the sun.

Now when we see him going in space he can easily get up from falling towards Earth over Mach 100 without being hurt and can take the World Engine WHILE he was weakened. So they clearly showed development during the movie. But I doubt Neo can deliver the force to KO him. Neo also doesn't have that type of combat speed. Yes they can dodge bullets but they can't even dodge each others fist. Supermans punches move faster than bullets.

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ShadoVvlite

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IMO Neo and Smith have this, because it all comes down to who the better hacker is in the Matrix, and neither Superman nor Zod knows any hacking.

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MonsterStomp

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#19  Edited By MonsterStomp

@wardemon32 said:

Flying in a tight room and outpacking an explosion doesn't mean your fast at all; a Buggati should be able to out pace explosion easily. When Neo was flying after the explosion, though it looked extremely fast, I don't think this is actually very credible. Matrix physics is no where near "our" physics. There's no way he's that high in the air and his winds pick up cars from the ground that weighs 1-2 tons. I highlu doubt something like that could happen.

Flying in a tight room while outpacing an explosion is exceptionally fast. Especially while weaving around obstacles. That's much faster than Superman was moving around the buildings looking for Zod. Shows good reaction on Neo's behalf. In regards to the building levelling speed feat. High speeds should be able to cause that much destruction. If planes can part water or sand through sheer speed, why couldn't high speeds rip building faces off? Neo was creating a vortex that was sucking up cars and debris while pushing winds out with enough force to rip building faces off. That speed is unmatched.

Gets KOd by an oil rig before he learns to fly and gets closer to the sunlight.(first flying scene)

Gets KOd by a coal cart which weighs about 20 tons and was thrown(wouldn't really consder this a KO really because they never really showed it and the after he "woke up" he had no clear signs to indicate wether he was KOd) for a less amount of time. This was after he learns how to fly and got more exposure to the sun.

Now when we see him going in space he can easily get up from falling towards Earth over Mach 100 without being hurt and can take the World Engine WHILE he was weakened. So they clearly showed development during the movie. But I doubt Neo can deliver the force to KO him. Neo also doesn't have that type of combat speed. Yes they can dodge bullets but they can't even dodge each others fist. Supermans punches move faster than bullets.

Superman has been exposed to sunlight for 30+ years, adapting to his senses. The only high end feat was resisting the World Engine, even after that he was knocked out. Superman's fall from space didn't do much destruction. Compared to Neo and Smith free fall which punched a crater in the road while tearing building faces off. Sure Neo was wasted but Smith was unscathed.

Superman has never shown bullet-level punching speed. Neo's time stop falcon punch was portrayed better, which shows Neo is a ton faster than Superman. You're downplaying a lot off Neo's feats.

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odstmiller

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#20  Edited By odstmiller
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Wardemon32

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@monsterstomp:

Flying in a tight room while outpacing an explosion is exceptionally fast. Especially while weaving around obstacles. That's much faster than Superman was moving around the buildings looking for Zod. Shows good reaction on Neo's behalf. In regards to the building levelling speed feat. High speeds should be able to cause that much destruction. If planes can part water or sand through sheer speed, why couldn't high speeds rip building faces off? Neo was creating a vortex that was sucking up cars and debris while pushing winds out with enough force to rip building faces off. That speed is unmatched.

Alright I'll try to break this up a bit.

  1. Just because you are weaving through things it doesn't make to faster. If anything that would slow you down.
  2. That was no where near as fast as Superman moving throung buildinds. And I mean no where near. Superman was going though about 5-8 city blocks per second when he was weaving through those buildings. Neo was only right infront of the explosions and explosions dont move that fast. I already said a buggati could out pace that and it only goes about 250 MPH and thats not going faster than 5-8 city blocks per second.
  3. Neo was only moving about 150-200 MPH while he was flying away from the explosion. It shouldn't be that hard to do and thats not very impressive as in compared to what Superman did.
  4. Ofcourse it can break the buildings apart. But that whole plane thing isn't very compareable to moving sand and water. I'm not saying that it couldn't. But what was going on with the cars and stuff makes abolsutely no sense. This vortex would have to be horizontal, only a vertical vortex should be able to do this(Tornadoes). So picture this. He's about 700 feet in the air and he's moving so fast he's causing a veritcal vortex behind him. How would this vertical vortex suck up a 1-2 ton car? If the winds were THAT strong it should have crushed the cars; not pick it up, well atleast that high. Another flaw is that since he is moving so fast wouldn't the cars fly back? You used the plane to sand/water example but it pushes back the sand not move it foward. So these travel towards him? The cars would have to be going faster than him to even do this you know.
  5. Even if this feat did make any logical sense, the physics aren't the same in these worlds. That's the whole point of the Matrix. So saying just because he had that effect he's faster than Superman.
  6. At over Mach 100 you could leave a city in seconds. It took Neo live 20 secodns to reach Trinity and they were in the same city but he's faster? How does this work?

Superman has been exposed to sunlight for 30+ years, adapting to his senses. The only high end feat was resisting the World Engine, even after that he was knocked out. Superman's fall from space didn't do much destruction. Compared to Neo and Smith free fall which punched a crater in the road while tearing building faces off. Sure Neo was wasted but Smith was unscathed.

Superman has never shown bullet-level punching speed. Neo's time stop falcon punch was portrayed better, which shows Neo is a ton faster than Superman. You're downplaying a lot off Neo's feats.

And I'm talking about being KOd from teh force. The only reason he was KOd becuase he was already passing out from the atomosphere.

You keep on thinking speed+destruction. I'm thinking speed+impact+reaction. Its not about how much destruction it caused really but the impact. Superman was flying over Mach 100 pummeling to Earth, while taking hits from Zod, and he got up right afterwards.

And you keep on talking about how it blasted away buildings and what not but fail to understand that it doesn't make any sense. Maybe you can explain the whoel vortex thing? Becuase to my understanding their phyichs are MUCH different. It was already explained in the movie I believe. So saying glasses was tearing off doesn't mean much when things already have a much drastic effect in their world. So if you're putting Zod and Superman in their would they should have a much bigger enviornmental effect than Smith and Neo.

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dondave

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@ancient_0f_days said:

I'm backing Neo and Smith, they seemed a little faster and obviously more skilled. But Superman definitely has them in durability when he can fly up a teraforming laser thingy.

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MonsterStomp

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#23  Edited By MonsterStomp

@wardemon32

Alright I'll try to break this up a bit.

Just because you are weaving through things it doesn't make to faster. If anything that would slow you down.

I don't understand. Explosions can move anywhere from Mach 5 to Mach 23. So it'd cover the room in an instant, Neo was weaving around obstacles, it's a speed feat.

That was no where near as fast as Superman moving throung buildinds. And I mean no where near. Superman was going though about 5-8 city blocks per second when he was weaving through those buildings. Neo was only right infront of the explosions and explosions dont move that fast. I already said a buggati could out pace that and it only goes about 250 MPH and thats not going faster than 5-8 city blocks per second.

False. Explosions move way faster than 250MPH, I don't even know what a Buggati is.

Neo was only moving about 150-200 MPH while he was flying away from the explosion. It shouldn't be that hard to do and thats not very impressive as in compared to what Superman did.

No.

Ofcourse it can break the buildings apart. But that whole plane thing isn't very compareable to moving sand and water. I'm not saying that it couldn't. But what was going on with the cars and stuff makes abolsutely no sense. This vortex would have to be horizontal, only a vertical vortex should be able to do this(Tornadoes). So picture this. He's about 700 feet in the air and he's moving so fast he's causing a veritcal vortex behind him. How would this vertical vortex suck up a 1-2 ton car? If the winds were THAT strong it should have crushed the cars; not pick it up, well atleast that high. Another flaw is that since he is moving so fast wouldn't the cars fly back? You used the plane to sand/water example but it pushes back the sand not move it foward. So these travel towards him? The cars would have to be going faster than him to even do this you know.

Okay imagine this. A ship sinks right below you whilst you're in the water, the current the ship creates should suck you under. A plane will part sand, but it will also suck sand behind the plane. A car driving on a dirt road, will suck sand behind it. It's still a valid speed feat that you're lowballing.

Even if this feat did make any logical sense, the physics aren't the same in these worlds. That's the whole point of the Matrix. So saying just because he had that effect he's faster than Superman.

This is fiction, real world physics don't apply to any of this. The Matrix replicates real world laws, though if anything defies these laws, the Matrix will physically take over. For example, if you're a plug in, the Matrix will find you, send agents after you, etc. If someone is flying and ripping up buildings, the Matrix will be patching it which explains the waves the buildings where making.

At over Mach 100 you could leave a city in seconds. It took Neo live 20 secodns to reach Trinity and they were in the same city but he's faster? How does this work?

We don't know how far Trinity was away from Neo, also there were times where the scene was in slow motion, so you can't really say it took Neo 20 seconds.

You keep on thinking speed+destruction. I'm thinking speed+impact+reaction. Its not about how much destruction it caused really but the impact. Superman was flying over Mach 100 pummeling to Earth, while taking hits from Zod, and he got up right afterwards.

I have no idea what you're getting at here? Superman didn't pummel to the ground at Mach 100 speeds, this is clear from the lack of destruction they made.

And you keep on talking about how it blasted away buildings and what not but fail to understand that it doesn't make any sense. Maybe you can explain the whoel vortex thing? Becuase to my understanding their phyichs are MUCH different. It was already explained in the movie I believe. So saying glasses was tearing off doesn't mean much when things already have a much drastic effect in their world. So if you're putting Zod and Superman in their would they should have a much bigger enviornmental effect than Smith and Neo.

The Matrix replicates real world laws. Neo can defy them through sheer belief and will power.

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Superman and Zod can't do the same. The realism of the Matrix would be too much for them to defy it's logic and physics.

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isaac_clarke

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Matrix team - they are much faster, hit just as hard, are about as durable by revolution's end and have an assortment of powers on top of that. Smith and Neo could be staying on foot and Zod and Superman would stand zero chance of actually hitting them.

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Wardemon32

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@monsterstomp:

Alright I admit I was wrong about the explosions but that thing looks extremely slow. And what do you mean "No"? How does that compare to what Superman was moving? Just becuase he was weaving through things(which he barely did) he was moving faster?

Okay imagine this. A ship sinks right below you whilst you're in the water, the current the ship creates should suck you under. A plane will part sand, but it will also suck sand behind the plane. A car driving on a dirt road, will suck sand behind it. It's still a valid speed feat that you're lowballing.

But if a plane moves sand and its freefalling in the air it would end up moving back from the wind. I'm not low ballign anything. What he did made absolutely no sense. If he can pcik up cars 100 feet and have them moving that fast(which is faster than him) all of those building should have been swept. There's no way that could actually work out.

This is fiction, real world physics don't apply to any of this. The Matrix replicates real world laws, though if anything defies these laws, the Matrix will physically take over. For example, if you're a plug in, the Matrix will find you, send agents after you, etc. If someone is flying and ripping up buildings, the Matrix will be patching it which explains the waves the buildings where making.

How does it matter is its fiction? In Man Of Steel they try to abid by the "reasl world phyichs" besides the whole flying thing obviously. None of these add up. You have winds strong enough to pick up 2 ton cars 100 feet in the air and somehow get them to stay aflow within that vortex but you can only shatter glass? If its that powerful then the glass should have been shattered from the carts when he passed. When he's flying and he's creating this wind, the wind should have created a strong impact traveling down to the cars; similar to the World Engine.

And when the cars was flying and it hit the building...NOTHING HAPPENED. How does that make any sense? The cars should be flying faster than or the same speed being that it was able to catch up to him but when it hits a building it just deflects off? Come on.

We don't know how far Trinity was away from Neo, also there were times where the scene was in slow motion, so you can't really say it took Neo 20 seconds

Its obvious that they were in the same city. IDC how big that city is, from looking at those effects from his flying he should have been there in a second. The 20 seconds was an exaggeration. It took them 5 seconds for them to slow down. Then they sped up again and it took him another 6 seconds. And if he's traveling that fast and he basically tackles Trinity HOW DID SHE NOT DIE? She can't even take punches well enough for that and right before she was pierced be a bullet.

All you have is what happened to the enviornment though it doesn't even add up to make any sense. You don't have a distance or a specific time to how long it took him to get there so how can you say he's faster? There's literally no proof?

I have no idea what you're getting at here? Superman didn't pummel to the ground at Mach 100 speeds, this is clear from the lack of destruction they made.

There's actually calculations to back this up.

But lets go with your whole "destruction" logic. Zod and Superman travel to Earth going over Mach 100 but they didn't haev enough damage to support this. According to you Neo is traveling faster than this and he catches Trinity but no bones were cracked or he wasn't splattered around the place? Or how the cars thats moving near the same speed as him crash into buldings but are deflected meaning that it wasn't traveling that fast to have that destruction?

The Matrix replicates real world laws. Neo can defy them through sheer belief and will power.

So this changes how the cars didn't destroy the buildings, all he broke was glass, and how all he caught Trinity? Oh.

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MonsterStomp

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@wardemon32

Alright I admit I was wrong about the explosions but that thing looks extremely slow. And what do you mean "No"? How does that compare to what Superman was moving? Just becuase he was weaving through things(which he barely did) he was moving faster?

It was slow motion lol. In regards to the navigating around objects while evading an explosion. He was flying at least Mach 5+ in a small room while weaving around in short distances how isn't that an impressive speed feat? I still have no idea what you're getting at when you say "Just because he was weaving through things he was moving faster". I was just putting it out there as a speed feat. Superman moving around like 2 blocks isn't as impressive as that speed.

But if a plane moves sand and its freefalling in the air it would end up moving back from the wind. I'm not low ballign anything. What he did made absolutely no sense. If he can pcik up cars 100 feet and have them moving that fast(which is faster than him) all of those building should have been swept. There's no way that could actually work out.

The Matrix was patching itself. The machines use humans as a power source, they can't have humans knowing that they're actually in a fake world. It's why Neo exposed himself at the end of The Matrix.

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How does it matter is its fiction? In Man Of Steel they try to abid by the "reasl world phyichs" besides the whole flying thing obviously. None of these add up. You have winds strong enough to pick up 2 ton cars 100 feet in the air and somehow get them to stay aflow within that vortex but you can only shatter glass? If its that powerful then the glass should have been shattered from the carts when he passed. When he's flying and he's creating this wind, the wind should have created a strong impact traveling down to the cars; similar to the World Engine.

And when the cars was flying and it hit the building...NOTHING HAPPENED. How does that make any sense? The cars should be flying faster than or the same speed being that it was able to catch up to him but when it hits a building it just deflects off? Come on.

My point was, you're taking physics and logic way too literal. Do you question why Vibranium can absorb vibration to massive extent but can somehow bounce off items? Do you question why Adamantium is so durable? I don't.

There's actually calculations to back this up.

But lets go with your whole "destruction" logic. Zod and Superman travel to Earth going over Mach 100 but they didn't haev enough damage to support this. According to you Neo is traveling faster than this and he catches Trinity but no bones were cracked or he wasn't splattered around the place? Or how the cars thats moving near the same speed as him crash into buldings but are deflected meaning that it wasn't traveling that fast to have that destruction?

Again, you're taking it too literal.

Sheldon in The Big Bang Theory was talking about Superman saving Lois in the first film. How physics would have Lois in three different pieces when Superman caught her. This is also applicable for Man of Steel. Superman was being sucked into a black hole-like vortex while trying to save Lois. Superman was getting misty while Lois was unaffected, how does that happen? Exactly.

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MonsterStomp

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The striking force Superman and Zod dish out < Neo and Smith's durability. Just sayin'

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ShadoVvlite

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#29  Edited By ShadoVvlite

Neo and Smith wins both rounds pretty easily. People are forgetting that the way The Matrix works is by hacking and Neo was "The" major hacker and so called the "chosen one", which allows him to become a reality warper. Now, since the battle does take place in the Matrix then neither Superman nor Zod can really do much to them, unless they are better hackers themselves.

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PrinceAragorn1

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@wardemon32: I think he decelerated for catching trinity. look at his acceleration when trinity gets hit again. And he's far slower when catching trinity again. I'd say his flight control is better than superman's.

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Bossmonster

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@monsterstomp: Alright. Lets start with the fact that you said.

The striking force Superman and Zod dish out < Neo and Smith's durability. Just sayin'

No. Just now. Neo Kicked Smith and knocked Blood from his mouth. Neo was hurt after being punched through a break/stone building. And let us not forget the fact that bullets will kill either of them. Neo never got any stronger than he was in part 2 minus being able to connect with the machines.

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Even in this fight, Neo is cut but a Blade. Regardless of what happened in Man of Steel Clark never shed blood. Even after the oil rig. He did not bleed.

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Look at 1:24. Zod Throws Clark threw several buildings. Just his throw. And then right after they live though re-entering the atmosphere.

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At 2:55 Neo is Bleeding again. From a punch that didn't even put him though the wall. Not nearly as much as Superman was hitting Zod with that was causing him to travel several city blocks. You can see Blood fly from Smith at 4:10.

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1:19, when did Neo or Smith ever speed blitz that fast? When did they ever hit each other that caused that type of a knock back? 1:40 when they attack each other, massive area damage. Not just glass breaking or rain getting pushed back but solid earth and stone.

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Even though out this part of the fight, you can see the actually speed at which they are fighting covering several feet at a time in less than a second, knocking craters into the ground and shock waves off their bodies. At 1:46 their attacks destroy this building. However if we look at Neo vs Smith and watch a nearly identical instances.

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At 3:25 all that happens is the glass is shattered and the rain is distorted.


Zod and Superman fight faster, hit harder and are more durable. They have ever considerable advantage. Also, videos I posted above show that Zod was not above the heat vision and neither was Clark. Clark just didn't kill but he burned though one guys hand and used it to melt an incoming attack and Zod just wasn't good with it, but he was a very quick learned.

Zod and superman slaughter Smith and Neo in less than a few seconds. Speed Blitz plus heat vision.

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Wardemon32

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@monsterstomp:

It was slow motion lol. In regards to the navigating around objects while evading an explosion. He was flying at least Mach 5+ in a small room while weaving around in short distances how isn't that an impressive speed feat? I still have no idea what you're getting at when you say "Just because he was weaving through things he was moving faster". I was just putting it out there as a speed feat. Superman moving around like 2 blocks isn't as impressive as that speed.

Yes. He can weave through buildings going Mach 5(supposedly); does this mean he can dodge Supermans punches? Nope. Becuase in that fight scene they were moving much slower than Superman. I would mroe call that a reactionf eat than a speed feat.

And what do you mean 2 blocks?

Loading Video...

This is far more than 2 blocks...

The Matrix was patching itself. The machines use humans as a power source, they can't have humans knowing that they're actually in a fake world. It's why Neo exposed himself at the end of The Matrix.

In order to patch something it would have to be broken. When those cars were hitting those buildings nothing broke so what was there to patch?

My point was, you're taking physics and logic way too literal. Do you question why Vibranium can absorb vibration to massive extent but can somehow bounce off items? Do you question why Adamantium is so durable? I don't.

You tried to use the physics and I'm pointing out the flaws.

And thats how the made the Adamantium..

But if you're trying to make a case with this, he was destroying the buildings with his speed but the car did nothing to it? How does that make any sense? Its not like you see stuff happen like that with Adamntium.

Again, you're taking it too literal.

Sheldon in The Big Bang Theory was talking about Superman saving Lois in the first film. How physics would have Lois in three different pieces when Superman caught her. This is also applicable for Man of Steel. Superman was being sucked into a black hole-like vortex while trying to save Lois. Superman was getting misty while Lois was unaffected, how does that happen? Exactly.

How'd I know you were going to bring up Big Bang Theory? I'm not trying to make a case for the black hole. Never said it make any sense. I'm not even trying to use that as an arguement. But becuase one has a flaw it justifies bringing up flaws for the opposite character? You're saying he was going faster than Superman but you have absolutely no proof besides the inconsistent physics.

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@princearagorn1:

It looks about the same to me. Either way it should have killed her. Thats like getting hit by a Jet. You think she can survive that impact?

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MonsterStomp

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@wardemon32: I'm not getting into this. The Matrix trilogy was made in 1999 - 2003. Not everything is attention to detail and this happens in all films. That's what I'm talking about when you're taking physics and logic too literal. I never brought physics into this, I pointed out what I saw in the films, YOU brought physics into this saying that it's impossible.

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#35 JediXMan  Moderator

If Smith is capable of converting Superman and Zod, the Matrix team wins. They have no way of defending against that.

Aside from that method, team MoS wins due to greater overall feats.

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#36  Edited By mikex20

Neo and Smith would stomp Superman and Zod.

Superman and Zod would exist inside the "Matrix", Neo and Smith can control reality inside the Matrix.

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PrinceAragorn1

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#37  Edited By PrinceAragorn1

@wardemon32 said:

@princearagorn1:

It looks about the same to me. Either way it should have killed her. Thats like getting hit by a Jet. You think she can survive that impact?

Well, yeah. It should at least knock her out. But dunno, trinity's at least peak/superhuman, while lois isn't either, and still manages to withstand pull of pseudo black hole, and someone hard as steel smashing into her. I think it's better to just ignore the scientific problems sometimes. (ok, how the hell did she even fall down when cars and stuff were flying back up in the first place?)

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@monsterstomp: Yes I do agree....The time gap between the films is too great, I'm sure if the matrix were too be rebooted Neo and Smith in the final battle would be just like Man of steel's but better.

You can tell the wachowski brothers intent was too make the final battle more of a superhero/DBZ type style of fight. In the previous 2 Matrix films was more of a ground type martial arts fighting with no Arial combat , however in the last film you could tell by the Ariel combat, shockwaves and much stronger punches and kicks.

If it were too be rebooted I'd say those punches on the streets would send each other flying and the shockwaves would tear the faces of buildings and overall a better look.

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Wardemon32

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#39  Edited By Wardemon32

@monsterstomp:

Hmm so you talk about how his speeds created a vertical vortex and it completely sucked up cars and was destroying buildings but you didn't bring it up? Altight. I'm done then.

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Zod/Supes.

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Nomar

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#41  Edited By Nomar

I love how the people who are trying to debunk the Matrix flying speed feat are using real world physics as if MoS is a beacon of science. All that feat should say to you is that this guy is moving at ludicrous speeds. Enough speed to destroy everything behind him. Nobody in MoS matched that kind of speed.

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PrinceAragorn1

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#42  Edited By PrinceAragorn1

@monsterstomp: Alright. Lets start with the fact that you said.

@monsterstomp said:

The striking force Superman and Zod dish out < Neo and Smith's durability. Just sayin'

Even in this fight, Neo is cut but a Blade. Regardless of what happened in Man of Steel Clark never shed blood. Even after the oil rig. He did not bleed.

so. Are you saying that if zod used a sword on superman, he wouldn't be cut from that force? Neo bled because he was slashed by someone about strong enough to give him a fight. Like hitting clark with a pole in the head shouldn't do anything, but if zod uses the same pole, it'll have big effect alright.

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reaverlation

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Well how I see matrix team are more skilled and can possibly keep up with the kryptonians but MoS team are stronger,more durable,faster but Smith can possibly help more than neo because between neo/smith battle smith was able to keep on fighting longer than Neo in fact Smith was never able to be put down really.So unless that HV cuts him in half or punched into space Smith can possibly keep going but majority MoS team

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PrinceAragorn1

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Idk, right after rewatching man of steel, I thought clark/zod should stomp neo/smith. But after rewatching both movies, I don't think that's the case. Even if neo and smith can't win, they can at least give a good fight to them:

1. Compare this to when superman breaks through the cloud:

Loading Video...

2: A random display of speed:

Loading Video...

3. Compare this to superman moving through the giraffe herd:

Loading Video...

Though superman's feats are spread across higher area on the planet, I don't think it gives him a conclusive advantage.

Also, I'd argue that his high end striking feats are also higher. Though superman's standard hits are hands down much better:

1.

Loading Video...

though it would be cool if they had the budget to maintain these effects lol.

2. Or this:

Though it doesn't destroy the buildings, the area of shockwave is worthy of awe:

Loading Video...

Here's a better copy, and the forced drop:

Loading Video...

Though zod and superman's fall was from a far higher height, one of them must have retarded the speed in the end, as they didn't cause nearly enough damage from their fall (though they did break corner of another building while falling, perhaps when zod made weird that face yelled, after seeing the ground):

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Also, the tk could help him a bit, too:

Loading Video...

Though I have to say, if we take the black hole and world engine feats at face value, neither of team 1 are harming clark.

Otherwise, I think their overwhelming advantage in skills should give them a very close fight, if not the majority.

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Isn't this spite.

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@princearagorn1:

@bossmonster said:

@monsterstomp: Alright. Lets start with the fact that you said.

@monsterstomp said:

The striking force Superman and Zod dish out < Neo and Smith's durability. Just sayin'

Even in this fight, Neo is cut but a Blade. Regardless of what happened in Man of Steel Clark never shed blood. Even after the oil rig. He did not bleed.

so. Are you saying that if zod used a sword on superman, he wouldn't be cut from that force? Neo bled because he was slashed by someone about strong enough to give him a fight. Like hitting clark with a pole in the head shouldn't do anything, but if zod uses the same pole, it'll have big effect alright.

You are 100% right that's what I'm saying. A knife used by Zod would sooner break on superman than it would cut him. The metal would have to be made of some type of unheard of materiel that wouldn't shatter. You can drag a metal knife across a rock and the blade will chip.


Are whats more, you are acting like they are on the same levels.

Loading Video...

I've shown this before, Zod hits Superman in this clip with, not a metal pipe, but a support beam. Many times heavier, more dense and has edges. He it's him in in the face with it. Not only that, it was just Super heated by heat vision. Clark's face shows not visible damage, he does not bleed, he does not get burned. He doesn't take damage.

Think about this logically. Neo can be cut by people not as strong as he is with swords. Those swords aren't moving at Super high speeds. Why do you think that Neo stops bullets. Because they will still kill him.

Zod and Superman out class Neo and Smith in Every Single area minus martial skills. However, that doesn't really matter given that Neo and Smith Can not hurt him.

@god_spawn or whoever, this is obviously a stomp. What Chance do that actually have?

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MonsterStomp

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reaverlation

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I honestly think Neo is the weak link.He's skilled yes but lacks the physicality(along with smith),durability(mainly just Neo) seeing how the MoS team showed no injuries of the sort and Smith is the only one of the 2 who can last longer.It would almost be a stomp if Smith didn't have to carry his team.You should add more people on matrix team

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MonsterStomp

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@reaverlation: Neo's abilities only extend as far as his will and belief. Which is rather hard to crush.

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#50  Edited By Bossmonster

@monsterstomp: Yes it is.

Neo and smith are too slow, too weak, to easily hurt and too under powered. Neo can't out fight someone he can't hurt or block. Heat vision kills, two or three punches kills.