Ned Stark vs Lurtz

• Ned has both Ice and Dawn, as well as a dagger
• Lurtz has his sword, shield, and two daggers (no bow)
• Lurtz had just beheaded Catelyn and is holding Sansa and Arya hostage
• Fight takes place at the Tower of Joy

Does Sean Bean die again?

One, why the heck would Ned have Dawn? And 2, Sean Bean dies all over again.

I think Shawn Bean does die again, but from mortal wounds. He beats Lurtz and bleeds out, having saved his kids.

Without motivation of family, Lurtz probably just straight up kills Ned.

Bump

Ned beats him.

Lurtz is trash with a sword. He doesnt even know how to hold it properly.

His strength is the only problem.

@ithemanwithoutfeari:

How is Lurtz trash with a sword? He was able to contend with Aragorn for a good bit.

@ithemanwithoutfeari

Lurts fought a superhuman Aragorn.....who trained with the elves and Dunedain rangers.....Lurtz is the only uruk to ever hold more than 2minutes against Aragorn....:

Just like your kings blood has special properties so does numenorian descent/kings blood.

@jackkira89: @freekymonkey:

No he didint. He could keep up with his skill and speed for full 2-3 seconds, when both got their swords back.

Skip to 4:19. Look how he is holding the sword and fighting. His skill is trash and he can barely keep up and gets already overwhelmed after 3 seconds against a beat up and exhausted Aragorn. The only reason the fight lasted so long to begin with his because of his strength. He managed to disarm aragorn pretty quickly, because Aragorn was a uncomfortable position right from the start. Once he had his sword back ... It was over.

@ithemanwithoutfeari: I can respect that. But another hurtle for ned would be Lurtz's endurence. His arm got chopped off and he was stabbed through the chest... but he kept going.

Why was this bumped? Lurtz wins quite easily.

@ithemanwithoutfeari: You're ignoring the fact that Lurtz had been alive for what, weeks? He's had like 0 training whatsoever.

Yeah, but lets be real he couldnt really fight back anymore. He was done at this point.

I am not really ignoring that. I am pointing that out ... Thats a huge disadvantage.

I dont think he was hindered.

It looks like he doesnt even feel it after he pulled it out of his leg. He also didint react to, when Aragorn chopped his arm off and stabbed him in the chest. It doesnt like look he felt it.

And I also dont think he training his footwork anyways.

If you're judging movie/show choreography bt RL standards then everyone in GoT is trash.

@foxerdes:

He lasted 3 seconds in a actual sword fight. The only reason he even put up a fight was because he managed to disarm Aragorn immediately, because of his superhuman strength.

If they start of in front of each other ready to fight, both with a sword in their hands he has 0 chance.

IF you think he lost that quicky afterwards was because of the knife in his leg then I dont know what to tell you. I think his technique and footwork was the definition of garbage and its not like Aragorn was going unharmed into round 2.

Even if he had training ... A few weeks training is basically nothing.

Why is that ?

Some fights have excellent choreography.

@foxerdes:

They started very close after Aragorn tackled him. Lurtz could immediately close the gap, because of the distance and threw him against a tree. That scenario favored Lurtz.

At the moment both had their sword back and started swinging it was over in 3 seconds.

Still enough to briefly fight Aragorn with leg injury. You can argue about amount of his training all day long and it will be irrelevant because his actual feats are the most important source of informations.

Still enough to stomp Lurtz with face/head injury. Its not irrelevant and his sword fighting feats are trash so the most important source is not really helping him out here.

I am not failing to read your point properly either.

Everyone in GoT uses their sword like a hammer. Smash, smash ,smash. They don't hold the grip properly, they don't parry like they should, their footwork is atrocious, and don't even get me started on their stances. Point is, Choreography isn't and shouldn't be held to RL standards for nearly anything otherwise everyone is trash.

@foxerdes:

No, not at all. They both recovered and clashed their swords. Lurtz overpowered him fair and square.

They were still very close after the tackle, which favored Lurtz. unlike the second time.

Sure, and Lurtz had a big fookin knife that pierced his artery and muscle.

Sure and Aragorn was punched repeatedly in the face by someone with legit super- strength.

I claimed that Lurtz was fighting Aragorn while hindered by injury. I never claimed that he would win otherwise, that's just you faling to read my point properly.

I clearly did not. I never said that you claimed he would win, otherwise. I said "if you think he lost that quickly", because of the knife in his leg, because I disagree with that.

I think the major problem was his technique/skill and speed. He was limping when he started pulling it out of his leg, but he was walking fine, when it was finally out.

Yes, he had brain injury and stroke on top of that.

Butthurt mode activated.

Deep stab wound is worse than taking hits, even from an Uruk. Especially since he had some time to recover, Lurtz's wound didn't.

Aragorn had no time to recover. He was still lying on the groud recovering and breathing heavy when lurtz threw that knife and started charging at him. A Human taking multiple hits in the face from a Uruk Boss with super strength is just as bad imo. Especially because Lurtz has high pain resistance/tolerance, which makes a comparison easier.

Pls back that up, because I completely disagree with that statement.

@paragonnate: I'd say Yoren in his fight against Amory Lorch's men in Season 2 was choreographed very realistically (parrying with the flat of the blade, decent footwork, and ultimately getting overwhelmed quickly by numbers). Probably the most realistic fight in the show.

@foxerdes:

There was enough space. We can only agree to disagree here.

Ok.

I misread it on my phone. Sorry.

No problem ...

He had nearly ten seconds of recovery, barring deflecting the knife. Aragorn took few hits but it's not nearly as damaging as getting stabbed with a big knife. Beside my main point was that Lurt's footwork was hindered and it's essential in a swordfight, especially against opponent with reach advantage.

10 seconds arent much. He had to deflect the knife, before he even got back up from a crawl position ... He was still recovering and staggered.

I agree that footwork is essential in a swordfight, but Lurtz has no feats in which he uses proper footwork. He is also using a two handed sword with only 1 hand, which is even worse.

Lurtz has 0 skill feats with his sword. He relies on his superior strength and thats the only reason he survived that long. He is a awful fighter (feat-wise)

Aragorn is not a normal human, he is a numenorean. He has superhuman stats, that includes durability. Sure, he was staggered in both cases but I'd argue that he is better suited to taking blunt force trauma than Lurtz is to taking knife in his leg.

Thats true. He might not be a normal human, but he is still nowhere near comparable with Lurtz in stats.

So Lurtz punches are still beyond his own species.

but I'd argue that he is better suited to taking blunt force trauma than Lurtz is to taking knife in his leg.

Agree to disagree.

Its not a good skill feat since Aragorn is injured as well as exhausted from fighting hordes of uruks before that fight.

He is shitty fighter imo, without a doubt.

I dont think 1 casual back hand/push from Olog-hai is comparable to multiple hits/headbutts from Lurtz.

Lurtz

ned stark will put up a good fight. he wants hes revenge against the one who klilled him with a bow and arrow after all from the distance.

Lurtz dines on man flesh

@foxerdes

Aragorn can run for two days long and took a hit from Olog-Hai, he wasn't exhausted and he took more powerful blows before. Giving him a brief intense fight (even if he was staggered) with a knife in leg, is still a great feat that'd but Lurtz above any average swordsmen.

Aragorn showed signs of exhaustion throughout the battle with the Uruks, especially when that one fodder tried to strangle him and Legolas had to save him.

He was not going in that fight 100%. He also had to run to Boromir after all these fights to save him. He barely made it to him in time.

Well, that's your opinion. Thanks for sharing it.

I know. You are welcome.

One blow from a fully grown troll is more than enough to match Lurt's strikes. Trolls are at least nine to eleven feet tall, with massive heavy body and freakish strenght sufficent to move around siege engines, ragdoll people and sent other creatures flying with ease. Cave Troll on the gif was using hammer but even if you half the feat or use 1/4th of it, it's still way above Lurtz's striking strenght.

It is obviously not hitting Aragorn with the same force as its hitting the orcs in this gif. You already pointed out that he was using some kind of hammer. On top of that he has more room and can use its momentum more effectively.

The hammer makes already a ridiculous difference. Thats like comparing a spinning back fist with a sledgehammer swing/blow.

Its much less than even 1/4th of it.

@foxerdes:

I don't think we will come to an agreement here.

We should probably move on ... agree to disagree :) ?

Lurtz. Hands down, no contest. Orcs are seen as equal to humans in the LOTR universe, with Boromir being a perfect example of a fully developed human soldier. An Uruk-hai is a fully developed orc / made for war. Lurtz is an even higher class of Uruk-hai. What I'm understanding here is that Lurtz >> Boromir > Ned Stark. Eddard wasn't ever a soldier, he was a commander that's why Barristan Selmy feared fighting him. Not because he's a war-born warrior but because he believed that Ned's army would easily take over his own.

Ned stomps.

In general Lurtz, but with Caitlin beheaded and his daughters hostage, I"m giving it to Ned.