Mutant Gods Vs Avengers Team

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BigBaby

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BigBaby  Online

Poll Mutant Gods Vs Avengers Team (43 votes)

Avengers 47%
Mutants 53%

Avengers:

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Mutant Gods:

No Caption Provided

The Rules:

  • Round 1: Morals On
  • Round 2: Morals Off/Bloodlust.
  • Neutral Dimension.
  • Random Encounter.
  • Standard Power-Levels.
  • Win by any means

LOCATION:

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BigBaby

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#1  Edited By BigBaby  Online

Steals tags:

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Zetsu-San

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I feel like Legion should solo, but the more recent scans for him, that I've seen, were kinda underwhelming, so I dunno.

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@zetsu-san said:

I feel like Legion should solo, but the more recent scans for him, that I've seen, were kinda underwhelming, so I dunno.

Why, what did Legion do.

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Zetsu-San

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@zetsu-san said:

I feel like Legion should solo, but the more recent scans for him, that I've seen, were kinda underwhelming, so I dunno.

Why, what did Legion do.

Soloed 3 Elder Gods, and I think he also put a universe in a box, at one point.

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Mage101

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#5 Mage101  Online

The mutants stomp.

They are some that are susceptive to TP [Carol, thor and wanda] adding three reality warpers + hope who will mimic their abilities give the mutants too much edge.

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Mage101

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#6 Mage101  Online

I feel like Legion should solo, but the more recent scans for him, that I've seen, were kinda underwhelming, so I dunno.

Is it his fight with Uranos? To be honest, everyone jobbed to uranos, Mags couldn't even do anything more than throwing metals and forgot that he can put up shields. And i heard that uranos used legions daddy-issues against him and that legion already worked on that problem.

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BigBaby

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#7 BigBaby  Online

bump

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Alekos

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I'd bet on mutants

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Koays

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#9  Edited By Koays

Jamie alone created a small multiverse, broke into the white hot room and ressurected himself after being wiped out by the cosmic opposite of the Phoenix Force.....

Legion put the universe in a box, reset the universe without the Elder Gods of Limbo, dragged a reality creating telepath into his mind and mind wiped him and has brought himself back twice when he erased himself from existence and made it so he was never born.

Hope has the power to copy and amplify the powers of any of her teammates...

But the most troubling part of this? .....why is Magneto a mutant god?

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thedailybagel

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#10 thedailybagel  Moderator
@koays said:

Jamie alone created a small multiverse, broke into the white hot room and ressurected himself after being wiped out by the cosmic opposite of the Phoenix Force.....

Legion put the universe in a box, reset the universe without the Elder Gods of Limbo and brought himself back twice when he erased himself from existence and made it so he was never born.

Hope has the power to copy and amplify the powers of any of her teammates...

But the most troubling part of this? .....why is Magneto a mutant god?

Is that stuff from Legion and Jamie their standard power level?

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Koays

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#11  Edited By Koays

@thedailybagel: All of it is base Jamie, The only thing not explicitly base for Legion is his elder God feat which was technically done by his "true personality".

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cosmic_reign

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#12  Edited By cosmic_reign

đź‘€

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Mage101

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#13 Mage101  Online

@koays said:

Jamie alone created a small multiverse, broke into the white hot room and ressurected himself after being wiped out by the cosmic opposite of the Phoenix Force.....

Legion put the universe in a box, reset the universe without the Elder Gods of Limbo and brought himself back twice when he erased himself from existence and made it so he was never born.

Hope has the power to copy and amplify the powers of any of her teammates...

But the most troubling part of this? .....why is Magneto a mutant god?

Is that stuff from Legion and Jamie their standard power level?

Jamie operates on that level on almost all his appearance and his little appearance makes it quite consistent.

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Underfire47

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Mutants should take it fairly easily.

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Soratoumiga

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Don't know why Legion is getting all this hype, when he's nowhere near his putting-universes-in-a-box tier of power on a standard basis. Jamie is a much bigger threat when we take this into account. I take it his fight with Wanda on a reality warping level would be awesome, but Wanda eventually triumphs (she has comparable feats to him, and that WHR feat isn't as impressive as it made out to be). Furthermore, Strange has pretty good resistance for reality warping (as does Wanda), so Legion/Braddock vs Strange/Wanda cancel each other out on this specific aspect. Overall, if the pairs were to fight, I'd give an edge to the mage duo since it's standard Legion.

As for everyone else... don't think Proteus is getting a hold of Vision, same with Jean and Hulk. Carol is there to help but would ultimately go down to Magneto or Jean. Thor is a wildcard, and should be able to beat at least four of these individually. Overall, I gotta give it to Avengers.

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jaakor

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#16  Edited By jaakor

Legion vs Uranos would have turned the multiverse to paste, in the celestial judgement arc, the celestial called him a universal shaper

Jamie or legion solos this effortlessly

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rajjarsalt

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#17  Edited By rajjarsalt
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/thread

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rajjarsalt

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#18  Edited By rajjarsalt
@soratoumiga said:

Don't know why Legion is getting all this hype, when he's nowhere near his putting-universes-in-a-box tier of power on a standard basis. Jamie is a much bigger threat when we take this into account. I take it his fight with Wanda on a reality warping level would be awesome, but Wanda eventually triumphs (she has comparable feats to him, and that WHR feat isn't as impressive as it made out to be). Furthermore, Strange has pretty good resistance for reality warping (as does Wanda), so Legion/Braddock vs Strange/Wanda cancel each other out on this specific aspect. Overall, if the pairs were to fight, I'd give an edge to the mage duo since it's standard Legion.

As for everyone else... don't think Proteus is getting a hold of Vision, same with Jean and Hulk. Carol is there to help but would ultimately go down to Magneto or Jean. Thor is a wildcard, and should be able to beat at least four of these individually. Overall, I gotta give it to Avengers.

IIRC it is a plot point in Way of X that the Xorn brothers can kill Legion due to star/black hole heads. Like that was Legion's own contingency plan for himself lol.

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Soratoumiga

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IIRC it is a plot point in Way of X that the Xorn brothers can kill Legion due to star/black hole heads. Like that was Legion's own contingency plan for himself lol.

Lol, in that case Wanda just creates a black hole on him or something. Not like she didn't do something similar very recently. Don't see how Legion is impressive outside his actual peak.

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PyroFN

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@soratoumiga: ”Don't know why Legion is getting all this hype, when he's nowhere near his putting-universes-in-a-box tier of power on a standard basis”

I think you’re confusing preference to power levels.

Legion doesn’t rise and fall in power level. He just picks and chooses what powers he wants to use. You can go on the preference argument, but that only really works for short fights. Longer fights means more time for planning mid-battle, which benefits better for characters with myriads of abilities.

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PyroFN

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@soratoumiga said:

Don't know why Legion is getting all this hype, when he's nowhere near his putting-universes-in-a-box tier of power on a standard basis. Jamie is a much bigger threat when we take this into account. I take it his fight with Wanda on a reality warping level would be awesome, but Wanda eventually triumphs (she has comparable feats to him, and that WHR feat isn't as impressive as it made out to be). Furthermore, Strange has pretty good resistance for reality warping (as does Wanda), so Legion/Braddock vs Strange/Wanda cancel each other out on this specific aspect. Overall, if the pairs were to fight, I'd give an edge to the mage duo since it's standard Legion.

As for everyone else... don't think Proteus is getting a hold of Vision, same with Jean and Hulk. Carol is there to help but would ultimately go down to Magneto or Jean. Thor is a wildcard, and should be able to beat at least four of these individually. Overall, I gotta give it to Avengers.

IIRC it is a plot point in Way of X that the Xorn brothers can kill Legion due to star/black hole heads. Like that was Legion's own contingency plan for himself lol.

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Apparently, Legion pointing out that he is having them do that is something you’re dismissing, considering it implies Legion is allowing them to do that in the event that he does lose control.

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DeusCarnivoro

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Legion wins

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Mooty_Pass

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@mage101 said:

The mutants stomp.

They are some that are susceptive to TP [Carol, thor and wanda] adding three reality warpers + hope who will mimic their abilities give the mutants too much edge.

This. 100%

Mutants for the Win.

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rajjarsalt

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@pyrofn said:
@rajjarsalt said:
@soratoumiga said:

Don't know why Legion is getting all this hype, when he's nowhere near his putting-universes-in-a-box tier of power on a standard basis. Jamie is a much bigger threat when we take this into account. I take it his fight with Wanda on a reality warping level would be awesome, but Wanda eventually triumphs (she has comparable feats to him, and that WHR feat isn't as impressive as it made out to be). Furthermore, Strange has pretty good resistance for reality warping (as does Wanda), so Legion/Braddock vs Strange/Wanda cancel each other out on this specific aspect. Overall, if the pairs were to fight, I'd give an edge to the mage duo since it's standard Legion.

As for everyone else... don't think Proteus is getting a hold of Vision, same with Jean and Hulk. Carol is there to help but would ultimately go down to Magneto or Jean. Thor is a wildcard, and should be able to beat at least four of these individually. Overall, I gotta give it to Avengers.

IIRC it is a plot point in Way of X that the Xorn brothers can kill Legion due to star/black hole heads. Like that was Legion's own contingency plan for himself lol.

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Apparently, Legion pointing out that he is having them do that is something you’re dismissing, considering it implies Legion is allowing them to do that in the event that he does lose control.

Fair, but if they're helping him not go nuts it could also be that their power is keeping his in check

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#25  Edited By WastelandMan
@zetsu-san said:
@wastelandman said:

@zetsu-san said:

I feel like Legion should solo, but the more recent scans for him, that I've seen, were kinda underwhelming, so I dunno.

Why, what did Legion do.

Soloed 3 Elder Gods, and I think he also put a universe in a box, at one point.

Those are the feats you consider "underwhelming?"

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Zetsu-San

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@zetsu-san said:
@wastelandman said:

@zetsu-san said:

I feel like Legion should solo, but the more recent scans for him, that I've seen, were kinda underwhelming, so I dunno.

Why, what did Legion do.

Soloed 3 Elder Gods, and I think he also put a universe in a box, at one point.

Those are the feats you consider "underwhelming?"

Huh? No, those are the feats that I’d base him “soloing” on.

I just thought his fight with Uranos was kinda meh.

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rajjarsalt

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#27  Edited By rajjarsalt

Those Elder Gods ain't $hit lmao, about as valuable and/or worthless as Dr Strange making X'axal his doofy with Flames of Faltine, which straight up melted his goofy a$$

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@pyrofn said:
@rajjarsalt said:
@soratoumiga said:

Don't know why Legion is getting all this hype, when he's nowhere near his putting-universes-in-a-box tier of power on a standard basis. Jamie is a much bigger threat when we take this into account. I take it his fight with Wanda on a reality warping level would be awesome, but Wanda eventually triumphs (she has comparable feats to him, and that WHR feat isn't as impressive as it made out to be). Furthermore, Strange has pretty good resistance for reality warping (as does Wanda), so Legion/Braddock vs Strange/Wanda cancel each other out on this specific aspect. Overall, if the pairs were to fight, I'd give an edge to the mage duo since it's standard Legion.

As for everyone else... don't think Proteus is getting a hold of Vision, same with Jean and Hulk. Carol is there to help but would ultimately go down to Magneto or Jean. Thor is a wildcard, and should be able to beat at least four of these individually. Overall, I gotta give it to Avengers.

IIRC it is a plot point in Way of X that the Xorn brothers can kill Legion due to star/black hole heads. Like that was Legion's own contingency plan for himself lol.

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Apparently, Legion pointing out that he is having them do that is something you’re dismissing, considering it implies Legion is allowing them to do that in the event that he does lose control.

Fair, but if they're helping him not go nuts it could also be that their power is keeping his in check

That is why they make clear,

”We are ready to vaporize David’s brain IF he loses control.”

That implies it has not happened yet.

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BoutaTakeAnL

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Avengers. Legion is the biggest threat and Strange should be able to hold him off. Hulk + Thor can already give everyone else on the mutant team hell. Add in Carol, Vision, and Wanda and I'd take the Avengers pretty consistently.

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rajjarsalt

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#30  Edited By rajjarsalt
@pyrofn said:
@rajjarsalt said:
@pyrofn said:
@rajjarsalt said:
@soratoumiga said:

Don't know why Legion is getting all this hype, when he's nowhere near his putting-universes-in-a-box tier of power on a standard basis. Jamie is a much bigger threat when we take this into account. I take it his fight with Wanda on a reality warping level would be awesome, but Wanda eventually triumphs (she has comparable feats to him, and that WHR feat isn't as impressive as it made out to be). Furthermore, Strange has pretty good resistance for reality warping (as does Wanda), so Legion/Braddock vs Strange/Wanda cancel each other out on this specific aspect. Overall, if the pairs were to fight, I'd give an edge to the mage duo since it's standard Legion.

As for everyone else... don't think Proteus is getting a hold of Vision, same with Jean and Hulk. Carol is there to help but would ultimately go down to Magneto or Jean. Thor is a wildcard, and should be able to beat at least four of these individually. Overall, I gotta give it to Avengers.

IIRC it is a plot point in Way of X that the Xorn brothers can kill Legion due to star/black hole heads. Like that was Legion's own contingency plan for himself lol.

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Apparently, Legion pointing out that he is having them do that is something you’re dismissing, considering it implies Legion is allowing them to do that in the event that he does lose control.

Fair, but if they're helping him not go nuts it could also be that their power is keeping his in check

That is why they make clear,

”We are ready to vaporize David’s brain IF he loses control.”

That implies it has not happened yet.

That's true, he does keep himself in control there and then on out in Way of X.

Though he does ask them to buy him a minute of time against Onslaught, and they do, so it's not like their power is totally insignificant in comparison to his. Admittedly Onslaught was not at full power, but he was still above Legion in Onslaught Revelation.

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Mage101

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#31 Mage101  Online

Avengers. Legion is the biggest threat and Strange should be able to hold him off. Hulk + Thor can already give everyone else on the mutant team hell. Add in Carol, Vision, and Wanda and I'd take the Avengers pretty consistently.

I actually disagree with legion being the biggest threat, jamie braddock is also here and is just as big of a threat as legion. How is hulk+ thor dealing with jamie and proteus who can warp them + jean who can easily TP carol, thor and wanda+ hope who can amp their powers and literally copy all the mutants ability and make them stronger so we have the mutants times 2. You literally ignored the mutants versatility and how dangerous they are i mean what is vision and carol going to do against three omega reality warpers and two omega telepath+ magneto who can beat them one on one.

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del_torro

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Magneto deals with vision

Jean oneshots Carol. Thor could get taken out with tp too.

Dr strange and wanda are a problem, since reality warping and high level magic can go toe to toe, and strange is has skill and experience backing him.

But... they're kind of outnumbered. Legion, proteus, Jamie, and Hope who can mimic wanda, legion, proteus and jamie,and then use all their powers together at once.

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Mage101

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#33 Mage101  Online

@soratoumiga:

don't think Proteus is getting a hold of Vision

> Lol, is this a joke? How will vision counter proteus reality warping. This must be a joke.

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#34 Mage101  Online

Is vision the next person to be on the wank list?

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@mage101 said:
@boutatakeanl said:

Avengers. Legion is the biggest threat and Strange should be able to hold him off. Hulk + Thor can already give everyone else on the mutant team hell. Add in Carol, Vision, and Wanda and I'd take the Avengers pretty consistently.

I actually disagree with legion being the biggest threat, jamie braddock is also here and is just as big of a threat as legion. How is hulk+ thor dealing with jamie and proteus who can warp them + jean who can easily TP carol, thor and wanda+ hope who can amp their powers and literally copy all the mutants ability and make them stronger so we have the mutants times 2. You literally ignored the mutants versatility and how dangerous they are i mean what is vision and carol going to do against three omega reality warpers and two omega telepath+ magneto who can beat them one on one.

- Jamie doesn't have nearly as many impressive reality-warping feats as Legion, nor has he displayed the versatility that Legion has. Proteus is fine but most of the time he's dealing with fodder.

- Thor and Hulk, but Thor especially, have insane damage output. For however good Legion, Jamie, and Proteus are here, they lack the durability to withstand much of anything from Thor. And no, Jean would not easily TP Thor. He may be inconsistent but he's solid enough that she'd need time and focus.

- However, overall, yeah I concede. I failed to factor Hope in. Copying Jean's telepathy + the others on her team makes her the most dangerous here. She can bolster Jean's TP efforts which means the two would ultimately be able to drop the Avengers via TP. Magneto would not beat Carol on his own. A combined assault from Wanda (if she's not messing about), Thor, and Strange would definitely put the reality warpers down, but ofc they need to get past the telepathy, which they don't.

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@pyrofn said:

I think you’re confusing preference to power levels.

Legion doesn’t rise and fall in power level. He just picks and chooses what powers he wants to use. You can go on the preference argument, but that only really works for short fights. Longer fights means more time for planning mid-battle, which benefits better for characters with myriads of abilities.

That just reeks of inconsistency then.

I'd argue that the bolded part actually works better for Avengers team due to Strange and Wanda god tier versatility.

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#37  Edited By Soratoumiga

And frankly, Wanda alone surpasses Legion in power level (with all his personalities).

Resurrection of Magneto #1

The room that Wanda created (which Legion himself thought to be impossible) in Trial of Magneto was shown above Beyonders' realm, Overspace, etc. Even Phoenix Force! It was implied to be above death in the following issue even:

No Caption Provided

At this point in time, I don't think Legion fares well against her.

Strange can stall Braddock for an extended period of time until Wanda is done with Legion, and it's wraps up from there. Strange has dealt with powerful reality warpers before, I don't see how he would falter against Jamie. Wanda similarly has the Darkhold transformation feat (turning it into an infinite plain). But I will say if Jamie gets the opening shot, he might have a chance.

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@pyrofn said:

I think you’re confusing preference to power levels.

Legion doesn’t rise and fall in power level. He just picks and chooses what powers he wants to use. You can go on the preference argument, but that only really works for short fights. Longer fights means more time for planning mid-battle, which benefits better for characters with myriads of abilities.

That just reeks of inconsistency then.

I'd argue that the bolded part actually works better for Avengers team due to Strange and Wanda god tier versatility.

*shrug* That’s what happens when you have a character with myriads of powers that had been based on alt personalities for the longest time. This was solved though when he basically had his own series for a character arc of learning to put himself back together and control his powers and personalities.

And you can argue the time being better for the magic users. I don’t argue against that fact either. But power levels were never the issue for Legion.

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PyroFN

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And frankly, Wanda alone surpasses Legion in power level (with all his personalities).

Resurrection of Magneto #1

The room that Wanda created (which Legion himself thought to be impossible) in Trial of Magneto was shown above Beyonders' realm, Overspace, etc. Even Phoenix Force! It was implied to be above death in the following issue even:

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At this point in time, I don't think Legion fares well against her.

Strange can stall Braddock for an extended period of time until Wanda is done with Legion, and it's wraps up from there. Strange has dealt with powerful reality warpers before, I don't see how he would falter against Jamie. Wanda similarly has the Darkhold transformation feat (turning it into an infinite plain). But I will say if Jamie gets the opening shot, he might have a chance.

No, it was not above the Phoenix Forces realm. At all.

Deaths realm resides in the White Hot Room. And the Waiting Room was made clear to have been an entryway to multiple afterlifes.

Where you got the idea that meant it was above the Phoenix Force is beyond me. I don’t know about the Beyonder scaling either, but I can’t say it’s right or wrong without context.

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Soratoumiga

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@pyrofn said:

No, it was not above the Phoenix Forces realm. At all.

Deaths realm resides in the White Hot Room. And the Waiting Room was made clear to have been an entryway to multiple afterlifes.

Where you got the idea that meant it was above the Phoenix Force is beyond me. I don’t know about the Beyonder scaling either, but I can’t say it’s right or wrong without context.

First, I think you're heavily conflating what Wanda actually did. She didn't just create the Waiting Room, she also created the Tower of Judgment or according to Magneto, "another room of waiting" responsible for putting him in a place beyond death. I posted this scan already, but as seen above, Storm needs to transverse through the other dimensions(i.e. Overspace, Beyond, etc) just to reach it. Ashake further recognizes the connection the Tower of Judgment has to magic, where the number five symbolizes "magic" to which the sphere of judgment is related to; the only difference is its association and purpose (i.e. being used to judge).

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Furthermore, you just wrote my argument for me; if it's beyond death that resides in the WHR then it's arguably above the WHR. Yes, the waiting room does serve as a connection to the afterlife but it also acts as an exit to all of them. What you're saying doesn't disprove the notion that it exists on a plane above the other dimensions within the Far Shore. For instance, I can go backwards, or forwards to get somewhere. But not that it matters either way, since we know the other realm Wanda created does exist beyond that plane, and it's also not like Legion even has a feat creating an entire dimension in the Far Shore that literally signifies the seat of magic lol (that I know of anyway).

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rajjarsalt

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#41  Edited By rajjarsalt

@soratoumiga This the same Well beyond the World shown in Resurrection Magneto?

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del_torro

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@soratoumiga: "she also created the Tower of Judgment or according to Magneto, "another room of waiting" responsible for putting him in a place beyond death. "

Yeah, im not sure thats what he's saying.

Magneto is speculating where he is, wondering if he's beyond death, wondering if he's caught in a spell by wanda, wondering if he is a different kind of waiting room.

This is all speculation from Magneto, and nothing actually stating that Wanda created the Tower of Judgement

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rajjarsalt

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Mjolnir cracked the Wheel of Fate.

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Soratoumiga

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@rajjarsalt: Yes, that's the Well :)

Thor's feat is impressive too, the Avenger trio will be stomping hard, it seems.

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Mooty_Pass

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Mutant Gods for the Win.

-Jean takes out Wanda, Thor and Carol Via TP. Magneto deals with Vision. Legion or Jamie can take out Dr. Strange or together they can.

and then Everyone Jumps Hulk. Done.

I don't see no other way this can go really.

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Soratoumiga

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she also created the Tower of Judgment or according to Magneto, "another room of waiting" responsible for putting him in a place beyond death. "

Yeah, im not sure thats what he's saying.

Magneto is speculating where he is, wondering if he's beyond death, wondering if he's caught in a spell by wanda, wondering if he is a different kind of waiting room.

This is all speculation from Magneto, and nothing actually stating that Wanda created the Tower of Judgement

Why is it necessarily considered speculation if she's the one who created the waiting room, which already serves as a signifier for magic? If she can already create one signifier, creating a smaller realm of another signifier shouldn't be a problem...

I mean, the moment Magneto refers to this new, "other" room, a writer note pops up saying "Trial of Magneto". The indication here is clear. Don't think we should doubt Magneto's words and instinct, since he's the first one who went through the Tower, while the others died. Plus, Ashake emphasised the Tower of Judgement as a realm similar inherently connected to magic, through the "Number five" suggesting it was created out of it in the first place. Is Legion capable of doing anything close to this?

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dami24434

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#47  Edited By dami24434

@soratoumiga: nothing suggest that room was beyond any of the realm you mentioned lol. If anything its one of the realms in over space, but no hierarchy was given. Also you're gonna pretend Wanda didn't use the help of 2 reality warpers legion and proteus to create the realm?

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destinyman75

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#48  Edited By destinyman75

People are forgetting The Guy Who kicked the crap outta Galactus King Thor is here or what? Lol. He's gotten rather powerful not to mention Wanda. Most of legions feats aren't on the level either no slouch but not that.

You can argue round one but round two a Blooodlusted King Thor nope

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destinyman75

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@mooty_pass: You do realize this is King Thor who stomped Galactus right? TP won't be so easy given he now jas Odin levels of TP from the Odin force. Round two Blooodlusted TP won't even matter to boot. I don't see how they stop the Raging Skyfather who can break Fate itself

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Soratoumiga

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@soratoumiga: nothing suggest that room was beyond any of the realm you mentioned lol. If anything its one of the realms in over space, but no hierarchy was given. Also you're gonna pretend Wanda didn't use the help of 2 reality warpers legion and proteus to create the realm?

There was a clear hierarchy though. When Storm was hurling through, the Dominion(Phalanx) "welcomed" her to the Mystery/Beyond, and stated that they're beyond Beyonders:

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Also you're gonna pretend Wanda didn't use the help of 2 reality warpers legion and proteus to create the realm?

You're vastly overestimating their role in the creation of the realm. The two of them plus Polaris served as a conduit to channel Wanda's time-altering and time-folding powers. The narration even acknowledges them as "little assistance". It wasn't really a collective feat.