Michael Demiurgos runs a gauntlet.

1)DS Sentry.

2)RK Thor.

3)HOG Ion and Parahal.

4)Fully fed Galan.

5)COIE Anti Monitor.

6)Multiversal Death.(MARVEL)

7)Morpheus.

8)Living Tribunal.

9)Ivory Kings.

10)Pre ret Molecule man.

11)Pre ret Beyonder.

12)Lucifer Morningstar.

*win by death or incap.

*battle starts in a abandoned Multiverse.

Round 1: In Character.

Round 2: Bloodlusted.

Stops at 11

The Gauntlet is out of order. Anyhow he beats Lucifer. They have fought. and he won.

Clears. Michael is the only one with limitless God given power, not some self made claims that get contradicted left and right

@skyroid:

I wanna say he clears. Michael was second to God himself.

@super_sayian_beyonder: Are you the same guy as BeyonderGod? The guy that got banned? Just wondering

@chimeroid: lucy won that and lucy can control and shape anything even the limitless power of god.

@skyroid: No I am not the owner of battle omniverse or whatever, and if we go by statements, it stops at beyonder.

@super_sayian_beyonder: If we go by statements Galactus is omnipotent thus Galactus stomps everyone.

We DON'T go by statements.

By FEATS Michael stomps

@parichithayerakala: Didnt michael throw Lucy out of the heavens?

@skyroid: This debate was literally yesterday. Anyways I don't see how Michael could defeat Beyonder and I believe Jim Shooter intended him to be omnipotent.

@chimeroid: Yes Michael has God's given Limitless power.

@super_sayian_beyonder: That's the thing beyonder is claims, hypes and statements which also gets contradicted.

@chimeroid: yeah he was the one i thought you were talking about the fight at yaggdrasil.

obviously stops at 11. Demiurgos can't beat beyonder

This is ridiculous...micheal curbstomps this whole gauntlet...with difficulty from lucy...and really...ds sentry...don't get me wrong...i love the character...absolutely love the character...in my top 10...but against the likes of micheal...i have my doubts...

Stops at Anti Monitor who shall be just under Beyonder

Stops at 8.

Bump

Stops at Living Tribunal.

Stops at Lucifer or clears.

Stalemates at 11

I too would say this gauntlet is out of order. He certainly clears most of it.

I doubt he can defeat beyonder.

I would say he stalemates both Lucifer and LT.

@oblivionknight: Lucifer is above Beyonder Feats.

@parichithayerakala: Is that so? How?

@oblivionknight: beyonder struggled to destroy and recreate mistress death, Lucifer created a whole new multiverse with ease. Lucifer took a creation ending blast to the face and came out without a scratch, Beyonder did not do anything to suggest he can take that and come out unharmed if not alive.

Stops at living tribunal, who should be a bit above.

@parichithayerakala: wells let's look at a few things.

1) Death is an aspect located within most marvel universes. So, a small amount of his power killed a multiversal entity. Even IF he couldn't retrieve that power, it's impressive and speaks to the volume of power he holds. It places him above death, just like Lucifer and Michael.

2) You don't need to reference Lucifers feat, when its Michaels power that provided the fuel. You may as well just point out Michael provided the fuel for the creation of a multiverse- just friendly advice.

Beyonder has taken a blast that could destroy billions of dimensions (I believe I'm making the correct reference here.) He's stated to have been feared by multiversal entities such as the living tribunal and all others- to say that we're dealing with multiversal beings in this fight is very clear.

3) Were not sure how large Lucifers multiverse is. We know Yahwehs is a universe. I think Beyonder has shown more than enough to survive an explosion of Michaels calibre.

At the very least, this is a stalemate. But if I had to place bets on one of them, I'd probably bet on Beyonder- Michael certainly doesn't have his brothers way with words.

Lucifer did not create a multiverse with any ease. In fact there is disagreement on whether or not what he created is even a multiverse. Not to mention we see him shaping individual planet.

Creation blast from Michael? It was a contained detonation. When Micheal used his powers destructibly against Lucifer during The Wolf Beneath the three Lucifer was hurt rather badly. Think of it this way, L and M are 2 people fighting, M unleashes all his powers while L is not even harm. Wouldnt you then say L is so much more powerful than M?

That's what you are arguing with creation blast, when Micheal and Lucifer are peers.

That being said the creation blast thing has happened so many times in marvel its not even funny.

Alien Entity goes bang in front of Reed Richards starting all of creation

Gallery

Genis Vell was in point blank when entrophy went bang and re-created the multiverse.

Gallery

Dr. Strange, and Mordu were point blank during the creation event as well, they road the big bang to their respective timeline.

Gallery

This is an alternate reality, Thanos goes big bang against Adam Warlock

Gallery

There is a difference between taking a creation blast, in a void where nothing existed, from taking that kind of powers in a fight. Unless you are saying Pr Beyonder is weaker than Reen Richards, Genis Vell, Dr. Strange, Maron Mordo, and Adam Warlock, I dont know what to say.

@oblivionknight:

1)But the thing is that Death of the Endless is greater than Lady/Mistress Death.

2)Yeah but Lucifer has shown that he is more than capable of molding that much of power with ease.

3)Yaweh's is a multiverse not just a universe, its clearly evident in events such as COIE.

4)Lucifer completly annihilated purgotory(a place with countless realities) with just his presence IIRC.

LT was also defeated by Ivory Kings who are clearly not Multiversal.

@killemall said:

That being said the creation blast thing has happened so many times in marvel its not even funny.

Alien Entity goes bang in front of Reed Richards starting all of creation

Gallery

Genis Vell was in point blank when entrophy went bang and re-created the multiverse.

Gallery

Dr. Strange, and Mordu were point blank during the creation event as well, they road the big bang to their respective timeline.

Gallery

This is an alternate reality, Thanos goes big bang against Adam Warlock

Gallery

There is a difference between taking a creation blast, in a void where nothing existed, from taking that kind of powers in a fight. Unless you are saying Pr Beyonder is weaker than Reen Richards, Genis Vell, Dr. Strange, Maron Mordo, and Adam Warlock, I dont know what to say.

1. There is nothing to suggest Alien Entity started all of creation in those scans. Heck, that was a galaxy-level blast.
2. Again, nothing to suggest Entropy recreated the multiverse. All that was shown was a "BANG!".
3. HOTU Thanos isn't even canon.

@parichithayerakala: 1) What's your basis for that?

2) Yes, I get that. But the Beyonder has shown himself at least taking that much power and shrugging it off.

3) Nope, incorrect. If anything, by the time of COIE, it would be Elaine's creation, not Yahwehs. Yahwehs is referred to many times by many characters as a universe.

4) And just by thinking, the Beyonder was causing widespread destruction.

I don't know the story behind the LT death, so I can't comment on it.

Your proof for that is what exactly?

2)Yeah but Lucifer has shown that he is more than capable of molding that much of power with ease.

Based on what him manipulating Micheal's power. I wonder , manipulating HOTU where does that put Thanos at? Beyond Lucifer?

3)Yaweh's is a multiverse not just a universe, its clearly evident in events such as COIE.

Yeah right other than COIE # 06 clearly showing it was Krona's action that created the multiverse.

There are other creation stories just as well.

Lucifer completly annihilated purgotory(a place with countless realities) with just his presence IIRC.

And? Countless realities, heck Thor has nearly destroyed that. That's minor feats, given how stacked together pocket dimensions are not so resilant.

LT was also defeated by Ivory Kings who are clearly not Multiversal.

Depends on how you see it. Dr. Doom channeling their power combined the multiverse into a planet, stomped Phoenix force. Ivory King also defeated all the abstracts and Celestials, how they are not multiversal again?

Michael is Universal. Michael Carey confirmed it in his twitter. Everybody above Universal stomps his ass (STOPS AT 1 ! XD)

A cosmos = One Universe

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/cosmos

1. the world or universe regarded as an orderly, harmonious system.

@killemall: Lucifer did create a multiverse with what I think I fair to call ease. This is especially true since he never created his very own one before this event. The only thing that seemed relatively uneasy was creating life he felt could pass his own little test, but that's arbitrary in itself.

I also don't think there's any confusion on his creation of a multiverse. He says it himself. There are clear boundaries between a universe and multiverse, with either one being capable of being called a creation.

Ok let's look at it like this then. I give you a nuke. Instead of holding the nuke in the open to affect everyone on earth, you decide to set it off in space. Does this controlled detonation change the power the nuke holds? No, it doesn't. So him bringing Michael into the void did nothing to change the power behind it.

And many people are incorrect in who is more powerful between the two brothers. Yes, out of the 3 (Yahweh, Lucifer, Michael), Lucifer is the only one incapable of generating something from nothing. However, the brothers are equal in that they can't destroy each other, but can essentially destroy everything else. We've seen it twice already- both times mentioned in your post. Lucifer kills Michael- Michael reforms. Michael kills Lucifer- Lucifer just reforms.

Would help if you even pretend to correct scans from the stories you have read.

Reed and Alien Entity had travelled before all of creation, to a void that preceeded creation. All this in search of spark that created all of reality. That's what Alien entity finds

The detonation that shows on panel isnt a galaxy level event, its the big bang

Alien Entity that bring forth the big bang

And you call it a galaxy level, Reed is in dead center when all of reality is remade.

1. Again, nothing to suggest Entropy recreated the multiverse. All that was shown was a "BANG!"

Again would be good to try and criticise if you had read the story.

Genis had made a pact with Entrophy to kill Eternity and destroy all the multiverse\

Alright lets see if i can post scans now\

@realitywarper: That entire exchange is simply vague, especially when all that has to be said is "yes, it's a___". He replies yes without specifying anything. So until he says either or, Michael provides sufficient enough power for a multiverse.

@the_caped_crusader:

After everything was destroyed Entrophy didnt know what to do, so he decides to re-create it all over again.

Then comes the big bang, the one you saw on panel and everything is re-created.

Gallery

@killemall: Would help if your scans were bigger. (Post #38)

@killemall:

1)Death of the Endless being the only one for the Multiverse and Lady Death being one for every Universe also Endless being atleast on par with Morpheus whose tiny fraction of power was enough to create many universes.

2)HoTU is a universal power not a multiversal and it is not canon.

3)Regardless Yahweh's creation is a Multiverse not a Universe.

4)That was not a statement ment to say Lucifer was more powerful, I was merely stating that because oblivionknight said that beyonder destroyed many dimensions.

5)Yet Thor and the like were giving them a fight, Starbrands self detonation was enough to kill one of them.

In the comics they said that it's a Universe and Mike Carey said it's a Cosmos and a Cosmos is a Universe. That solves the question in my opinion.

Update :

He uses the term of Creation too :

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/creation?s=ts

creation

1.

the act of producing or causing to exist; the act of creating; engendering.

2.

the fact of being created.

3.

something that is or has been created.

4.

the Creation, the original bringing into existence of the universe by God.

5.

the world; universe.

Creation = Universe

Stops at Beyonder

@realitywarper: If we are going with exact meanings then The Universe means everything AKA Multiverse, Megaverse and Omniverse are still part of The Universe.

Its not that clear. Three references in the book saying its universal vs 1 saying its multiversal even then by Lucifer himself.

This is especially true since he never created his very own one before this event.

He created one universe and he has had training for that.

The only thing that seemed relatively uneasy was creating life he felt could pass his own little test, but that's arbitrary in itself.

You dodged my question completely. How long would it take Lucifer to create a multiverse shaping one planet at a time, for a prolongued period.

I also don't think there's any confusion on his creation of a multiverse. He says it himself.

I think that's the problem. He says it himself its a multiverse in one story. Lucifer Nirvana. The feat when addressed by anyone else is called universe.

There are clear boundaries between a universe and multiverse, with either one being capable of being called a creation.

Abstract concept without panel verification, I am just glossing over this.

Ok let's look at it like this then. I give you a nuke. Instead of holding the nuke in the open to affect everyone on earth, you decide to set it off in space. Does this controlled detonation change the power the nuke holds? No, it doesn't. So him bringing Michael into the void did nothing to change the power behind it.

That would hold true if they were real characters, they are not. The idea was the show creation. Thats why I posted the instance with Reed, Strange, Genis, and Adam Warlock to show they have gone through the same without a scratch.

When Micheal and Lucifer actually fought, granted they were both weakened, by the same amount, Lucifer was charred.

Lucifer essentially has never been powerful enough to completely no sell a full on onslaught from Micheal. The reason that did not happen in the said issue was likely because they wanted to show the creation story.

Should stop at round 8.

Definitely stops at round 9.

Nope.

DC Universe = Megaverse

http://www.marvunapp.com/ohotmu/appendixes/omnapp.htm

The Cosmos refers to the universe as an ordered and integrated whole.

A Dimension in this sense refers to a realm containing space, time, matter, and energy. A dimension may be a universe (a virtually infinite amount of space) or a "pocket dimension" (a clearly finite and often relatively small realm). In addition, dimensions are further divided into "essentially Earth-like" realms, with similar makeup, physical properties, and laws of physics; alien dimensions, with differing physical properties and laws than Earth dimensions; and magic realms, alien dimensions governed primarily by magic.

A Realm is a location or an area of interest. It is often used interchangeably with "dimension," though it can also refer to physical locations within a dimension, such as a planet, nation, city-state, etc.

A Reality is the collection of an Earth-like universe and all other realms associated with that universe. For example, in general, there is one Negative Zone, one Asgard, and one Dark Dimension associated with each Earth universe. The collection of all associated realms is a Reality. Further changes to the history of a realm will alter its reality. In most cases, this actually involves overlapping or merging one reality with another. See below for further discussion on altered realities.

A Universe is a single dimension, such as Earth-616 (or, more appropriately, Universe-616), the mainstream Marvel Universe. See below for further discussion in Earth-616 and numbering realities. Uni - "one"

The Multiverse is the collection of alternate dimensions with a similar nature and universal hierarchy. Earth-616, plus pretty much all of the What if? and Exiles worlds, as well as the vast bulk of the alternate Earths seen in the MU (which include a certain hierarchy of comics beings like the Watcher, Eternity, Infinity, etc) are within the same Multiverse. The myriad realms of Earth-616's Multiverse are overseen by the immensely powerful Living Tribunal. Those realms that lack this hierarchy of power are outside of the Multiverse, but within the larger Omniverse. Further, the realms with a multiverse are divided into divergent earths, who share a common history and diverge at a specific ("What If") point, and alternate Earths, who are similar, but possess many inherent differences. Multi - "many"

The Omniverse is the collection of every single universe, dimension, etc. This includes the real world (right outside of your window - get outside and check it out!!), but it also includes every single universe, realm, etc., ever mentioned in any of Marvel Comics, as well as any other company. It includes every single literary work, television show, movie, urban legend, universe, realm, etc. ever. It includes everyone from Popeye to Rocky Balboa to Ronald Reagan to Romeo and Juliet to Luke Skywalker to Snoopy to Jay and Silent Bob, etc.

EVERYTHING is in the Omniverse, and there is only one Omniverse. Period. Omni - "all"

A Megaverse is a separate sub-set of the Omniverse that includes realms associated with a particular line of comics, etc., but outside of the Multiverse. This would include such realms as the New Universe, Ultraverse, Earth-Shadowline, etc. These realms lack the cosmic beings of the mainstream Multiverse, yet they are still more closely tied to other Marvel Universes than those of other comic lines. Thus they are included within the Marvel Megaverse.

Mega - "big" (used to imply a larger grouping than the Multiverse).

You want me to upload again. Even the ones that are big already have most of the details anyways.

Its meant to be a debate, I don't really have to spoon feed you all the details.

And?

Mistress Death is one of the cosmic compass, and sister to Eternity. The similarlity between Death and Etenrity is the same as similarities between Death of Endless and Morpheus.

Here is Eternity in his full glory

Gallery

Says you? Despite the fact that it defeated Akenthenan who had merged universes into his sanctuary. That was with a fraction of HOTU's powers. Thanos with full power defeated Eternity, Living Tribunal and everyone else.

If you are going to argue around it, what do you have to show Lucifer is multiverse?

Presence creation is a multiverse, doesn't change the fact that when creation is referred to in Vertigo they just talk about the 1st universe. 1 universe unless Lucifer leave outside the reality. Its always been 1 universe.

Okay, but Beyonder's greatest power wasnt destroying countless dimension but being single handedly more powerful than all the abstracts combined.

Same reason Fenris, a herald level character at least, nearly cause Lucifer to die, Micheal was killed in process.

What;s your point? Lowball characters?

@realitywarper said:

@oblivionknight said:

@realitywarper: That entire exchange is simply vague, especially when all that has to be said is "yes, it's a___". He replies yes without specifying anything. So until he says either or, Michael provides sufficient enough power for a multiverse.

In the comics they said that it's a Universe and Mike Carey said it's a Cosmos and a Cosmos is a Universe. That solves the question in my opinion.

Update :

He uses the term of Creation too :

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/creation?s=ts

creation

1.

the act of producing or causing to exist; the act of creating; engendering.

2.

the fact of being created.

3.

something that is or has been created.

4.

the Creation, the original bringing into existence of the universe by God.

5.

the world; universe.

Creation = Universe

He also says "A creation is all-encompassing".

all-encompassing

1. including or covering everything or everyone; comprehensive.

This means he was referring to literally everything. And, as far as we know, DC is a multiverse.