Mera and Wonder Woman vs Starfire and Kyle Rayner

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samgee

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Mera & Wonder Woman

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VS Starfire & The Green Lantern -Kyle Rayner

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Rounds & Rules

-R1 In Character

-R2 Morals Off

-Win By Death/KO/Incap

-75 Feet Apart /Titans Tower

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Mooty_Pass

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#3  Edited By Mooty_Pass

Probably, Team 1 for the Win. Wonder Woman MVP.

Although, I do think a Fight between Mera vs Starfire would be more interesting.

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geekryan

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It really depends on if Mera can beat Starfire before Kyle beats Diana. If she can, then Mera can help Diana 2v1 Kyle and win. If not, Starfire and Kyle win.

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EmmaFrostXmen

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ignoring outliers mera will go back and forth with starfire for a long time

i see team 1 winning a majority though

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XD_ist

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Diana solos TBH

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ecstaticgrace

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#7  Edited By ecstaticgrace
@emmafrostxmen said:

ignoring outliers mera will go back and forth with starfire for a long time

i see team 1 winning a majority though

Lol which outliers?

beating the JL?

with the two big heavy hitters that also got dropped by Ocean Master someone Mera beat while she was weakened?

those feats people claim are outliers are pretty consistent with Mera who doesn’t have really much lowends. In terms of consistently looking good Mera probably comes on top here. Followed by Kyle.

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EmmaFrostXmen

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#8  Edited By EmmaFrostXmen

@ecstaticgrace: didn’t she react to the flash?

mera isn’t a teambuster

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Mage101

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@emmafrostxmen said:

ignoring outliers mera will go back and forth with starfire for a long time

i see team 1 winning a majority though

Lol which outliers?

beating the JL?

with the two big heavy hitters that also got dropped by Ocean Master someone Mera beat while she was weakened?

those feats people claim are outliers are pretty consistent with Mera who doesn’t have really much lowends. In terms of consistently looking good Mera probably comes on top here. Followed by Kyle.

A lot of thrown context. The only people that Mera beat were the green lanterns and batman. Wonder woman and superman didn't even want to fight in fact the justice league didn't want to fight. There were even trying to talk to her after they broke out of her water bubble and Mera outreacting flash is an outlier. The ocean master argument had context ( he was with the trident I suppose). Mera wouldn't even be able to beat only supes much less the whole justice league lol. They have better feats.

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Mage101

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#10  Edited By Mage101

Probably, Team 1 for the Win. Wonder Woman MVP.

Although, I do think a Fight between Mera vs Starfire would be more interesting.

This. Kyle hasn't been special for years and he got one shot by raven ( who wasn't fully powered). Starfire is meh.

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ecstaticgrace

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@mage101 said:
@ecstaticgrace said:
@emmafrostxmen said:

ignoring outliers mera will go back and forth with starfire for a long time

i see team 1 winning a majority though

Lol which outliers?

beating the JL?

with the two big heavy hitters that also got dropped by Ocean Master someone Mera beat while she was weakened?

those feats people claim are outliers are pretty consistent with Mera who doesn’t have really much lowends. In terms of consistently looking good Mera probably comes on top here. Followed by Kyle.

A lot of thrown context. The only people that Mera beat were the green lanterns and batman. Wonder woman and superman didn't even want to fight in fact the justice league didn't want to fight. There were even trying to talk to her after they broke out of her water bubble and Mera outreacting flash is an outlier. The ocean master argument had context ( he was with the trident I suppose). Mera wouldn't even be able to beat only supes much less the whole justice league lol. They have better feats.

Wonder Woman and Superman both got trapped in water bubbles for a considerable amount of time. Thrown out context is me leaving out the fact Mera was stated to be exhausted lol…

She didn’t even outreact Flash it’s stated she couldn’t match his speed lol.. and Flash gets tagged by characters slower then him all the time like Wonder Woman and Superman 🤷🏿‍♂️

and her feats are consistently better then the Leagues. They also have way more lowends then Mera

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ecstaticgrace

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@ecstaticgrace: didn’t she react to the flash?

mera isn’t a teambuster

What’s the point of writers putting words in comics….

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EmmaFrostXmen

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@ecstaticgrace: she reacted to the flash and tagged him before he could reach her. that’s entirely not consistent to her portrayal at least that i’ve seen.

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ecstaticgrace

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@ecstaticgrace: she reacted to the flash and tagged him before he could reach her. that’s entirely not consistent to her portrayal at least that i’ve seen.

Showings discrediting it then? It’s weird when I could do the same for every character here and she honestly probably has better feats then anyone here outside Kyle.

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EmmaFrostXmen

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@ecstaticgrace: the issue is mera just doesn’t consistently perform on this level. if she can react to flash and we use that as consistent then she should be blitzing everyone she fights with dehydration.

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Mage101

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@ecstaticgrace: the issue is mera just doesn’t consistently perform on this level. if she can react to flash and we use that as consistent then she should be blitzing everyone she fights with dehydration.

Totally agree with this take. Mera's attack speed being above Barry's speed is just insane. I personally think that Barry wasn't even trying.

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Mage101

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@ecstaticgrace:

Wonder Woman and Superman both got trapped in water bubbles for a considerable amount of time. Thrown out context is me leaving out the fact Mera was stated to be exhausted lol…

I don't think the duration of the time they were trapped was long, looking at the fight and if Diana and kal were serious they would capitalize on things like their flight, heat vision, lightning projection, gear freeze breathe. The point is that they never wanted to fight and never attacked Mera, sure Mera has the natural advantage in water but let's not act like the JL wanted to fight.

She didn’t even outreact Flash it’s stated she couldn’t match his speed lol.. and Flash gets tagged by characters slower then him all the time like Wonder Woman and Superman 🤷🏿‍♂️

She couldn't match his speed but could attack him faster than he could to her. Mera's actions betray her words. Flash getting tagged by slower people holds no comparison here and why is that? Because Mera was exhausted and was battling multiple people so she didn't just easily outshine him in terms of attack speed but did so while exhausted and quite busy.

and her feats are consistently better then the Leagues. They also have way more lowends then Mera

Can you please list her better feats. The low-end argument can easily be countered with the fact that they have far more showings and that they have far more high-end feats.

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Supreme101

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WW being here’s an automatic win con

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ecstaticgrace

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@ecstaticgrace: the issue is mera just doesn’t consistently perform on this level. if she can react to flash and we use that as consistent then she should be blitzing everyone she fights with dehydration.

This logic is so fallible.
1.) Barry doesn’t always operate at his top speed.

2.) She legitimately states that she can’t match his speed what she’s doing isn’t any different from The Rogues tagging Barry. Or someone like Grodd tagging Barry with TP. She’s not physically keeping up with him… I don’t even get how someone gets to your take.

3.) Not scaling to Barry’s high ends but Arthur has reacted to Barry as well. He’s not impossible to tag. It happens quite frequently. Wally is faster and Flashpoint Wonder Woman has reacted to Wally.

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ecstaticgrace

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#21  Edited By ecstaticgrace
@mage101 said:

@ecstaticgrace:

I don't think the duration of the time they were trapped was long, looking at the fight and if Diana and kal were serious they would capitalize on things like their flight, heat vision, lightning projection, gear freeze breathe. The point is that they never wanted to fight and never attacked Mera, sure Mera has the natural advantage in water but let's not act like the JL wanted to fight.

Mera could dodge lightning like she did with Orm. Diana doesn’t have answers to stuff like getting her lungs flooded, being dehydrated, blood clots messed with etc.

Can you please list her better feats. The low-end argument can easily be countered with the fact that they have far more showings and that they have far more high-end feats.

Probably will be my last response towards you in this thread. Cause I lose interest in these things pretty quickly but this is pretty easy.

off scaling alone

1.) There’s the fact she’s legit fought Black Lantern Wonder Woman physically with the trident and impaled her. Diana being a zombie didnt die Ofcourse

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2.) There’s the fact Orm has incapacitated Wonder Woman with hydrokinesis

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and Mera scales above him

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3.) There’s also the fact Mera has also had Wonder Woman in a bubble as well as Superman at the same time…

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I don’t even get what kind of logic is ”I don’t think they were in the water bubbles for too long” is. She legit had multiple different interactions while they were in those bubbles. This doesn’t look like the faces of people in control of the situation.

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4.) Or the fact Rebirth guidebooks stated Aquaman and Wonder Woman are physical equals and its been shown on the pages and Mera oneshotted and put Aquaman in a coma… im not even a Mera fan I’m a Aquaman fan…

Aquaman vs Wonder Woman both influenced by Spectre’s rage (Justice League v4 Issue 44-45) Writer: Robert Venditti

..

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Personal feats off the top of my head

1.) Holding up an entire ocean and manipulating it to take out an army of Xebellians

2.) Holding back a Global alien flood during Drowned Earth

3.) Causing coast obliterating tidal waves as a side effect of attacking a magically impenetrable dome

Got to be in a strong state of denial honestly. To argue Mera’s below Diana In terms of power. I mean especially consistently when Mera appears less.

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X-Lord16

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Probably, Team 1 for the Win. Wonder Woman MVP.

Although, I do think a Fight between Mera vs Starfire would be more interesting.

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Mage101

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#23  Edited By Mage101

@ecstaticgrace:

Mera could dodge lightning like she did with Orm. Diana doesn’t have answers to stuff like getting her lungs flooded, being dehydrated, blood clots messed with etc.

Mera dodged lightning from orm sceptre which wouldn't be difficult as he had to point it to her side while Diana's lightning can come from literally anywhere and she also has an aoe lightning. Diana has a healing factor if you don't know so I don't think the blood clot stuff will work, as for the rest, they might incapacitate her but I don't think that they might do much Diana has healed from her life force being drained to almost skeleton like immediately from darkseid. What defenses does Mera have against Diana's lasso hax.

1.) There’s the fact she’s legit fought Black Lantern Wonder Woman physically with the trident and impaled her. Diana being a zombie didnt die Ofcourse

Diana wasn't even fighting to her fullest and was basically playing with her food and that attack wouldn't have killed Diana. She has healed from a sword stab to the heart, from being flayed to the skeleton, her life force being almost completely drained, shots to the chest, a green lanterns spike being impaled on her face, imperiex probe burns and Donna Troy her clone has healed a cut off arm so Zombie Diana wasn't all that.

here’s the fact Orm has incapacitated Wonder Woman with hydrokinesis

Low-end feat. Diana has survived nuclear bombs, imperiex probe while weakened, the void hound, black holes, the pressure of a star etc but less than town level hydrokinesis could easily knock her out? Please, this same comic saw batman survive a shot that knocked out Diana and Clark. And wasn't aquaman defeated the same way

Mera used dehydration to beat orm. Dehydration is a form of hax she didn't overpower him via raw power but hax. It's just like saying that Xavier was above storm because he has done better against shadow king. Powers matter very well in a fight some characters have a natural advantage more than some other characters.

Like i said before Diana and Clark were caught off guard and didn't want to fight Mera and eventually broke free a moment later. You'll have to bring sufficient evidence to prove that Mera hydrokinesis is above the combined strength of Diana and supes. Which will mean that Mera was above the like of martian manhunter, all the green lanterns, doomsday etc.

Or the fact Rebirth guidebooks stated Aquaman and Wonder Woman are physical equals and its been shown on the pages and Mera oneshotted and put Aquaman in a coma… im not even a Mera fan I’m a Aquaman fan…

Diana and Arthur being physically equal doesn't mean that they are equal in feats. Aquaman has one shot Mera back in the old comics and was caught off guard in that instance and why didn't Mera one shot Diana in blackest night twice that they fought, in fact her hydrokinesis wasn't really useful and she had to resort to the trident. Diana has received more punishment than what Mera gave Arthur there.

Got to be in a strong state of denial honestly. To argue Mera’s below Diana In terms of power. I mean especially consistently when Mera appears less.

Firstly I'm not in any form of denial lol, just because I have an argument doesn't mea that I am in denial. Secondly Mera is below Diana in power.

I'll list some feats that'll push yours to shame.

• Holds back a demonic onslaught that would have destroyed the earth while weakened

• Moves the earth alongside superman and martian manhunter while weakened against the force of the earth moving to the sun. Only moving 1/3 of the earth is above Mera planetary flood feat and that is if we ignore the fact that the earth was moving towards the sun and that they had to overcome the force that the earth used to move towards the sun added with the earth's mass.

•Diana has also resisted the pull of a black hole and helped J'onn resist his own

•Moved a super dense prison that could survive a black hole and a giant star

•Helped moved the moon at superspeed

And that's only for strength, I didn't even mention the highends, her speed, lasso, lightning etc. I'm very sure you're the one who's in denial here lol. The fact that you only brought argument against Diana makes me take your argument less seriously when I mentioned Clark and Diana.

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destinyman75

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Team 1 for sure

Diana >> Kyle

Mera vs starfire Is close but Diana will ens it once she ends Kyle

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ecstaticgrace

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Mage101

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@ecstaticgrace: Wow! Ecstatic grace, is that your counter? Calling me a wack debater, I'm very sure that insulting isn't breaking a rule here but I forgive you. This is like the 5th time that I'm beating you in a debate. I have garnered praise from better debaters like you and have done better against scarlet wiccan than you. Better hold back your insults if you have no counter, whining like a child isn't helping your case. Look at the majority of everyone's post and you'll see that I'm correct. Lol at Mera being a team buster, look whose calling someone a wack debater. You're just a sore loser.

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ecstaticgrace

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#27  Edited By ecstaticgrace

@mage101: A lot of your examples are context heavy, don’t really hold any semblance of meaning or didn’t happen the way you think it happened. The whole site is filled with bias and other wack debaters I don’t get why mentioning any other users on here would make you feel like you have any reasonable credibility

Superman, Martian Manhunter and Wonder Woman didn’t move the earth for example in Obsidian Age. Thats probably one of the most misconstrued feats I’ve ever seen. I don’t even get how anyone who has read the story even comes to that conclusion. I could understand someone thinking that’s what happened if they’re just looking at the images but if you actually read the story and came to that conclusion. Your ability to comprehend is sketched.

“A demonic onslaught that would of destroyed the earth” in what capacity?

I honestly question a lot of the black hole stuff that’s done with a magical lasso but that’s its own thing.

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geekryan

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@mage101 said:
@ecstaticgrace said:
@emmafrostxmen said:

ignoring outliers mera will go back and forth with starfire for a long time

i see team 1 winning a majority though

Lol which outliers?

beating the JL?

with the two big heavy hitters that also got dropped by Ocean Master someone Mera beat while she was weakened?

those feats people claim are outliers are pretty consistent with Mera who doesn’t have really much lowends. In terms of consistently looking good Mera probably comes on top here. Followed by Kyle.

A lot of thrown context. The only people that Mera beat were the green lanterns and batman. Wonder woman and superman didn't even want to fight in fact the justice league didn't want to fight. There were even trying to talk to her after they broke out of her water bubble and Mera outreacting flash is an outlier. The ocean master argument had context ( he was with the trident I suppose). Mera wouldn't even be able to beat only supes much less the whole justice league lol. They have better feats.

I just wanted to add a few things:

1) Yes, the Justice League were holding back, but Mera was explicitly stated to be exhausted after exerting her powers for days on end. Kinda balances out IMO.

2) Flash was running on water and clearly not going at his top speeds. Plus, he had to close the distance on Mera, whereas she just had to put her hand out and dehydrate him.

3) Superman and Wonder Woman were incapacitated and out for the entire fight. Mera didn't beat them in terms of a KO, but incapping them is still a win.

4) Mera isn't a teambuster, but let's not pretend like she's a scrub. She has city and island-level feats with her hydrokinesis, and hax.

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Mage101

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@geekryan:

) Yes, the Justice League were holding back, but Mera was explicitly stated to be exhausted after exerting her powers for days on end. Kinda balances out IMO.

Holding back? There didn't want to fight at all, they never attacked her. Wonder woman and superman only wanted to talk because she's their friend.

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There was no fight between both parties only Mera. So nothing was balanced out.

Flash was running on water and clearly not going at his top speeds. Plus, he had to close the distance on Mera, whereas she just had to put her hand out and dehydrate

I can accept the flash own and say that he was holding back his speed. But some people think that Mera can team bust a serious league who want to fight and use their full powers.

) Superman and Wonder Woman were incapacitated and out for the entire fight. Mera didn't beat them in terms of a KO, but incapping them is still a win.

Entire fight? The fight was a pretty quick one and they broke out of the water bubble when they saw Mera strangling batman.

Mera isn't a teambuster, but let's not pretend like she's a scrub. She has city and island-level feats with her hydrokinesis, and hax.

Who said that she's a scrub? I respect Mera and like her more than aquaman but I'm not delusional, Mera had the advantage in that fight. The league never attacked her apart from those green lanterns and batman who Mera would beat but saying that she can beat superman, wonder woman and the flash is silly. The fight was also written poorly superman and Diana could have easily come out of those bubbles by using HV, lightning or freeze breath. I like Mera and she is no scrub and no team buster.

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geekryan

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@mage101: Literally no one claimed she is a teambuster. What’s your argument here? That Mera can’t beat Starfire or Kyle? Or are you just arguing for the sake of arguing?

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gmorto

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Team 1

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Mage101

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#32  Edited By Mage101

@geekryan: OMG!!! Read post 7 and see someone saying that Mera beating the Justice league isn't an outlier and other stuff. And I'm not arguing for the sake of arguing, do more research before you say things that you don't know. That person in post 7 also compared her to ocean master and his feat against the justice league, if that isn't implying that Mera can solo the justice league then I'm done here.

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totu

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Interesting battle, and far more balanced than some people imply.

Starfire for example had technically few fights vs WW, and she won one and was a draw between them on the others.

So she can definitely keep up with Wonder Woman, while Kyle handle Mera. Everybody will be on the air so I am not sure how much Mera water control will matter anyway, and both Starfire and I suppose Kyle have powerful ranged attacks as well.

I say it can actually go both ways, slightly favoring team 2, especially if one of them (most likely Mera, but WW was also visibly hurt and affected when it happened) will get hit by Starfire starbolts. And they will get hit more likely

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geekryan

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@mage101 said:

@geekryan: OMG!!! Read post 7 and see someone saying that Mera beating the Justice league isn't an outlier and other stuff. And I'm not arguing for the sake of arguing, do more research before you say things that you don't know. That person in post 7 also compared her to ocean master and his feat against the justice league, if that isn't implying that Mera can solo the justice league then I'm done here.

It isn't an outlier, but it has context and it's one of her highest-end feats. Mera has very few low-ends.

Ecstaticgrace thinks very highly of Aquaman, Mera, etc., and we disagree on a lot of stuff, but he isn't wrong about Mera in this case.

If you aren't arguing about this battle, and chose to go back and forth against Ecstatic and I simply because you disagree with how we view Mera, then yes you are arguing for the sake of arguing.

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Steve40L

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I'm gonna go with team two, Diana would obviously be the MVP of her team, but Starfire and a Lantern is quite a lot. Could go either way, but I'm edging out with team two.

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Mage101

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@geekryan said:
@mage101 said:

@geekryan: OMG!!! Read post 7 and see someone saying that Mera beating the Justice league isn't an outlier and other stuff. And I'm not arguing for the sake of arguing, do more research before you say things that you don't know. That person in post 7 also compared her to ocean master and his feat against the justice league, if that isn't implying that Mera can solo the justice league then I'm done here.

It isn't an outlier, but it has context and it's one of her highest-end feats. Mera has very few low-ends.

I wasn't the one that said that it was an outlier if you read my comment I clearly stated that it had context but that person thinks that that is mera's consistent level. Yes Mera has few low-end fears but that doesn't make her superior to Clark, Barry or Diana who have better feats in general.

Ecstaticgrace thinks very highly of Aquaman, Mera, etc., and we disagree on a lot of stuff, but he isn't wrong about Mera in this case.

He isn't wrong how? So you think that Mera can team bust superman and wonder woman? Ecstatic grace clearly stated that Mera could beat them and is clearly superior to them, I didn't even state that it was an outlier that was emmafrostxmen.

If you aren't arguing about this battle, and chose to go back and forth against Ecstatic and I simply because you disagree with how we view Mera, then yes you are arguing for the sake of arguing.

Did you read my argument or you are just saying things that you don't know? I was arguing with the statement of Mera being superior to Clark, Diana and Barry just because of lowends. And I didn't even argue with you, you tagged me and my comment to continue and argument that I already dropped so you are the one who is arguing for the sake of arguing. The fact that you didn't even read my comments says that.

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ecstaticgrace

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#37  Edited By ecstaticgrace
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Not even a Mera fan but can’t make this stuff up… not sure how Mera would struggle with Starfire when she physically should scale a tier above and has hax Kori has no resistance too… Post ain’t adding up.

Diana has been dropped by Ocean Master and restrained by Orm in Throne of Atlantis. 2 different instances.

1.) Being restrained by a whirlpool

2.) Being dropped by lightning

Diana also got held back by Orm’s hydrokinesis in Obsidian Age…. Mera‘s only instance of losing to Orm is being weakened… partially recovered she beat Orm while he was cheating.. Not sure how anyone could even argue on consistency Mera being below Diana… Diana doesn’t consistently operate at a planet level… and in terms of who they fought and how they performed any scaling favors Mera.

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agent41

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#38  Edited By agent41

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Not even a Mera fan but can’t make this stuff up… not sure how Mera would struggle with Starfire when she physically should scale a tier above and has hax Kori has no resistance too… Post ain’t adding up.

Diana has been dropped by Ocean Master and restrained by Orm in Throne of Atlantis. 2 different instances.

1.) Being restrained by a whirlpool

2.) Being dropped by lightning

Diana also got held back by Orm’s hydrokinesis in Obsidian Age…. Mera‘s only instance of losing to Orm is being weakened… partially recovered she beat Orm while he was cheating.. Not sure how anyone could even argue on consistency Mera being below Diana… Diana doesn’t consistently operate at a planet level… and in terms of who they fought and how they performed any scaling favors Mera.

How consistently does Diana is and should be defeated by a whirlpool and a lightning attack nased on her whole catalogue? Doesn't she has better feats than those onstances too? Diana has barely operated at planetary level anything in most of her modern hostory. But i am pretty sure mera has never operated t that level like not even once.

So mera is consistently portrayed as stronger and faster than WW Post Crisis and onwards based on feats? So she is above Aquaman too, who is said to be equal to current WW? mera has the advantage that, as a less known and used character, she has been used as a jobber less amount of times than Big IP characters like superman, WW, Flash etc. You can bet they all have more low end moments than her because of this. Doesn't mean she is more powerful than either of them overall.

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@agent41 said:
@ecstaticgrace said:
No Caption Provided

Not even a Mera fan but can’t make this stuff up… not sure how Mera would struggle with Starfire when she physically should scale a tier above and has hax Kori has no resistance too… Post ain’t adding up.

Diana has been dropped by Ocean Master and restrained by Orm in Throne of Atlantis. 2 different instances.

1.) Being restrained by a whirlpool

2.) Being dropped by lightning

Diana also got held back by Orm’s hydrokinesis in Obsidian Age…. Mera‘s only instance of losing to Orm is being weakened… partially recovered she beat Orm while he was cheating.. Not sure how anyone could even argue on consistency Mera being below Diana… Diana doesn’t consistently operate at a planet level… and in terms of who they fought and how they performed any scaling favors Mera.

How consistently does Diana is and should be defeated by a whirlpool and a lightning attack nased on her whole catalogue? Doesn't she has better feats than those onstances too?

.

Consistently enough by Atlanteans since the three times Royal Atlanteans have done it to her Diana was subdued. I’d argue that’s basis enough to credit it. Diana has a lot of antifeats in regards to lightning as well. So does Superman actually..

Diana has barely operated at planetary level anything in most of her modern hostory. But i am pretty sure mera has never operated t that level like not even once.

I don’t think I claimed Mera did, but on high ends consistently Mera’s feats outweigh Her lower end feats. the same can’t be said for Diana. Mera also does have a feat of holding back a global alien flood. So that would technically be planetary

Alot of you argue with emotions instead of logic and debates become messy because of this. A lot of the stuff your stating I never said. Last paragraph highlights that.

So mera is consistently portrayed as stronger and faster than WW Post Crisis and onwards based on feats? So she is above Aquaman too, who is said to be equal to current WW? mera has the advantage that, as a less known and used character, she has been used as a jobber less amount of times than Big IP characters like superman, WW, Flash etc. You can bet they all have more low end moments than her because of this. Doesn't mean she is more powerful than either of them overall

Never stated Mera was faster or stronger then Wonder Woman. I did however state Mera has kept up with Zombie Wonder Woman in physicals. Which is backed up with the fact it happened in the comics. A bloodlusted Diana didn’t overpower Mera and this was a Mera who didn’t do a lot of her internal hydrokinesis stuff. Which didn’t happen until after Flashpoint. The internal hydrokinesis stuff Diana has no defense or counter against. It’s as simple as that. Lightning which Diana doesn’t really use could be Dodged. Narration has stated Mera moves faster than lightning. Wonder Woman is stronger and faster? So what? Mera has shown she’s able to keep up which is backed up by multiple instances in comics

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@agent41 said:
@ecstaticgrace said:
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Not even a Mera fan but can’t make this stuff up… not sure how Mera would struggle with Starfire when she physically should scale a tier above and has hax Kori has no resistance too… Post ain’t adding up.

Diana has been dropped by Ocean Master and restrained by Orm in Throne of Atlantis. 2 different instances.

1.) Being restrained by a whirlpool

2.) Being dropped by lightning

Diana also got held back by Orm’s hydrokinesis in Obsidian Age…. Mera‘s only instance of losing to Orm is being weakened… partially recovered she beat Orm while he was cheating.. Not sure how anyone could even argue on consistency Mera being below Diana… Diana doesn’t consistently operate at a planet level… and in terms of who they fought and how they performed any scaling favors Mera.

How consistently does Diana is and should be defeated by a whirlpool and a lightning attack nased on her whole catalogue? Doesn't she has better feats than those onstances too?

.

Consistently enough by Atlanteans since the three times Royal Atlanteans have done it to her Diana was subdued. I’d argue that’s basis enough to credit it. Diana has a lot of antifeats in regards to lightning as well. So does Superman actually..

Diana has barely operated at planetary level anything in most of her modern hostory. But i am pretty sure mera has never operated t that level like not even once.

I don’t think I claimed Mera did, but on high ends consistently Mera’s feats outweigh Her lower end feats. the same can’t be said for Diana. Mera also does have a feat of holding back a global alien flood. So that would technically be planetary

Alot of you argue with emotions instead of logic and debates become messy because of this. A lot of the stuff your stating I never said. Last paragraph highlights that.

So mera is consistently portrayed as stronger and faster than WW Post Crisis and onwards based on feats? So she is above Aquaman too, who is said to be equal to current WW? mera has the advantage that, as a less known and used character, she has been used as a jobber less amount of times than Big IP characters like superman, WW, Flash etc. You can bet they all have more low end moments than her because of this. Doesn't mean she is more powerful than either of them overall

Never stated Mera was faster or stronger then Wonder Woman. I did however state Mera has kept up with Zombie Wonder Woman in physicals. Which is backed up with the fact it happened in the comics. A bloodlusted Diana didn’t overpower Mera and this was a Mera who didn’t do a lot of her internal hydrokinesis stuff. Which didn’t happen until after Flashpoint. The internal hydrokinesis stuff Diana has no defense or counter against. It’s as simple as that. Lightning which Diana doesn’t really use could be Dodged. Narration has stated Mera moves faster than lightning. Wonder Woman is stronger and faster? So what? Mera has shown she’s able to keep up which is backed up by multiple instances in comics

You seemed to be arguing that mera is a teambuster. Does WW scale to supoerman or not? What is she? Is this site still having double standard syndrome regarding scaling and ABC logic when it comes to Diana?

You know i am always honest. To me, if i have to rank current WW based on the very strange logic this site uses. Then i can't look ast mera or aquaman and say they are very powerful. What is there to rank as very powerful? Beating Diana? Too bad she hasn't been very powerul in a while. So if i have to ''accept'' that Diana is weak according to the way some people here approach me(not saying you did), then i expect this site to play fair. And use the same logic to measure everybody else.

But i will give you a more clear answer yet. If i am supposed to believe that a whirpool or a lightning bolt should be enough to end Diana or Clark. Considering how powerful they are supposed to be according to DC. Then my conclusion would be they are not really powerful. And so, mera and arthur matching them doesn't make them powerul either. Because there is nothing impressive power wise, about going down by a whirpool or a lightning attack. That is pathetically weak.

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Which version are we using? The pics look like New 52 versions

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@agent41:

You seemed to be arguing that mera is a teambuster. Does WW scale to supoerman or not? What is she? Is this site still having double standard syndrome regarding scaling and ABC logic when it comes to Diana?

Not necessarily I think teambuster is an arbitrarily term. Deathstroke is a teambuster if we go off showings. There’s no real tier for it. Mera just has abilities that allow her to take down characters physically above her. It’s as simple as that. I’ve posted multiple instances and shown several scans there’s no double standard and ABC logic honestly backs up what’s honestly been blatantly shown…

1.) Direct Showings: Mera subdued Wonder Woman in their only encounter against each other in modern continuity

2.) Scaling: Ocean Master not only subdued Wonder Woman but also knocked her out. Mera was shown to be superior to Orm regardless of his lightning or hydrokinesis. Diana simply wasn’t.

3.) Feats: I honestly think Mera just looks better here with stuff like holding back a global alien flood and indirectly threatening the entire east coast with her hydrokinesis

Ive posted all this several times over in the thread. Logic just keeps getting thrown out the window for whatever reason

But i will give you a more clear answer yet. If i am supposed to believe that a whirpool or a lightning bolt should be enough to end Diana or Clark. Considering how powerful they are supposed to be according to DC. Then my conclusion would be they are not really powerful. And so, mera and arthur matching them doesn't make them powerul either. Because there is nothing impressive power wise, about going down by a whirpool or a lightning attack. That is pathetically weak.

You’re aware hydrokinesis is as powerful as the user right? I don’t get what kind of logic that is. Lightning being artificially created doesn’t imply it’s at the same level of power as natural lightning. Those are feats for Mera and Orm’s power not feats for whirlpools and lightning

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@agent41:

You seemed to be arguing that mera is a teambuster. Does WW scale to supoerman or not? What is she? Is this site still having double standard syndrome regarding scaling and ABC logic when it comes to Diana?

Not necessarily I think teambuster is an arbitrarily term. Deathstroke is a teambuster if we go off showings. There’s no real tier for it. Mera just has abilities that allow her to take down characters physically above her. It’s as simple as that. I’ve posted multiple instances and shown several scans there’s no double standard and ABC logic honestly backs up what’s honestly been blatantly shown…

1.) Direct Showings: Mera subdued Wonder Woman in their only encounter against each other in modern continuity

2.) Scaling: Ocean Master not only subdued Wonder Woman but also knocked her out. Mera was shown to be superior to Orm regardless of his lightning or hydrokinesis. Diana simply wasn’t.

3.) Feats: I honestly think Mera just looks better here with stuff like holding back a global alien flood and indirectly threatening the entire east coast with her hydrokinesis

Ive posted all this several times over in the thread. Logic just keeps getting thrown out the window for whatever reason

But i will give you a more clear answer yet. If i am supposed to believe that a whirpool or a lightning bolt should be enough to end Diana or Clark. Considering how powerful they are supposed to be according to DC. Then my conclusion would be they are not really powerful. And so, mera and arthur matching them doesn't make them powerul either. Because there is nothing impressive power wise, about going down by a whirpool or a lightning attack. That is pathetically weak.

You’re aware hydrokinesis is as powerful as the user right? I don’t get what kind of logic that is. Lightning being artificially created doesn’t imply it’s at the same level of power as natural lightning. Those are feats for Mera and Orm’s power not feats for whirlpools and lightning

I would like to know how powerful a whirpoll or lightning is supposed to be take out WW and SM. Those things must either be very powerful. Or WW and SM simply aren't as powerful as DC says they are.

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How powerful is Kyle?

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Kyle is alone. Team women win

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#47  Edited By ecstaticgrace
@agent41 said:
@ecstaticgrace said:

@agent41:

You seemed to be arguing that mera is a teambuster. Does WW scale to supoerman or not? What is she? Is this site still having double standard syndrome regarding scaling and ABC logic when it comes to Diana?

Not necessarily I think teambuster is an arbitrarily term. Deathstroke is a teambuster if we go off showings. There’s no real tier for it. Mera just has abilities that allow her to take down characters physically above her. It’s as simple as that. I’ve posted multiple instances and shown several scans there’s no double standard and ABC logic honestly backs up what’s honestly been blatantly shown…

1.) Direct Showings: Mera subdued Wonder Woman in their only encounter against each other in modern continuity

2.) Scaling: Ocean Master not only subdued Wonder Woman but also knocked her out. Mera was shown to be superior to Orm regardless of his lightning or hydrokinesis. Diana simply wasn’t.

3.) Feats: I honestly think Mera just looks better here with stuff like holding back a global alien flood and indirectly threatening the entire east coast with her hydrokinesis

Ive posted all this several times over in the thread. Logic just keeps getting thrown out the window for whatever reason

But i will give you a more clear answer yet. If i am supposed to believe that a whirpool or a lightning bolt should be enough to end Diana or Clark. Considering how powerful they are supposed to be according to DC. Then my conclusion would be they are not really powerful. And so, mera and arthur matching them doesn't make them powerul either. Because there is nothing impressive power wise, about going down by a whirpool or a lightning attack. That is pathetically weak.

You’re aware hydrokinesis is as powerful as the user right? I don’t get what kind of logic that is. Lightning being artificially created doesn’t imply it’s at the same level of power as natural lightning. Those are feats for Mera and Orm’s power not feats for whirlpools and lightning

I would like to know how powerful a whirpoll or lightning is supposed to be take out WW and SM. Those things must either be very powerful. Or WW and SM simply aren't as powerful as DC says they are.

Again those are feats for the Atlanteans power. Not for whirlpools or lightning. Those things are as powerful as Mera or Orm is. I’m not even sure how that’s a hard concept to grasp.

equivalent of complaining about GL’s harming high tiers with light… I get hit with light everyday in the real world… You get how weird of logic that is?

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How powerful is Kyle?

Strong enough to get backhanded out of his own shield by Wonder Woman

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#49  Edited By kasya_carey

Someone’s acting like Diana has not been hurt by lightning numerous times.

Physical strength and durability does not equal immunity from the elements. It’s fiction you got Storm attacking Thor with a storm powerful enough to strip the planet to its bedrock, Thor making storms that expanded dimensions away, Iceman being able to freeze a planet fast and much more.

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