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#1 Edited by Silverrings (5452 posts) - - Show Bio
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  • MCU Luke and David from Unbreakable
  • They are both in character
  • No prep or prior knowledge
  • Takes place in an empty gym, equipment lying around
  • They start ten feet apart facing each other
  • They are fighting to the death or total incapacitation
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#2 Posted by Gotoucanario (2985 posts) - - Show Bio

Do we really know the full extent of Davids abilities? By feats I guess Luke takes it rather easily

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#3 Posted by Silverrings (5452 posts) - - Show Bio

@gotoucanario: I guess we don't really know the fullest extent of either of their abilities, at least not in every way, but what makes you think Luke can damage David enough to win this?

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#4 Posted by DementorDad (107 posts) - - Show Bio

Dunn lacks the capacity to inflict any substantive harm on Cage imo. Dunn is strong but it's more like Wolverine where he doesn't have to worry about being injured by his own strength. I think Dunn's greatest strength feat is ripping a car door off. It is likely Luke's superior strength will allow him to manhandle Dunn until he eventually asphyxiates him. It is wholly possible both men are exhausted before this occurs though as Cage is unlikely to go for such an attack until much later.

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#5 Posted by SPYDA-MAN (1339 posts) - - Show Bio

I think cage takes this and rather easily too.

in that movie we don't really get a depth of bruce willis powers.

all we know is he doesn't get sick, can recover from injuries faster than normal people, and he can lift a good chunk.

but he never showed any striking power (he would need to damage somebody like cage at least) or any real demonstration of durability just stories of him surviving a train derailment (yes impressive but taking a punch to the skull by somebody with super strength is a bit different lol)

I say cage takes it.

nice unbreakable thread tho.

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#6 Edited by Gotoucanario (2985 posts) - - Show Bio

@silverrings: I don't know if Luke can damage him since he was never harmed Luke he seems to be stronger and have more striking power than David.

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#7 Posted by Silverrings (5452 posts) - - Show Bio

@spyda-man: @dementordad: Thanks for the detailed responses guys, good points all around, glad this match is appreciated :)

@gotoucanario: Fair points, thanks for the input dude.

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#8 Posted by Green_Tea (10529 posts) - - Show Bio

@silverrings:you should make a Luke Cage vs The Beast thread, I heard impressive things about the latter.

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#9 Posted by Silverrings (5452 posts) - - Show Bio

@solid_snake97: I thought about it, having seen Split, but as impressive as he was this is definitely the more fair of those two fight options. I'm not knocking the film, I actually had a lot of fun watching it, it's just that the Beast isn't as much as a match for Luke as David is. Although it seems like he's pretty decisively lost this one anyway :P

(Also I totally have other ideas for fights with the Beast)

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#10 Edited by DieHard200904 (592 posts) - - Show Bio

Luke doesn't have that problem with being made weak by water like David does. Although whether or not Luke would know about that weakness or do something such as turn on sprinklers, I have no idea. Also no idea as to David's strength levels, since Glass might show David performing even stronger feats.

Unless David does something crazy. I am pretty sure this is a KO scored by Luke.

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#11 Edited by Picallo3798 (439 posts) - - Show Bio

@diehard200904: This is a common misconception. David is not hurt or drained by water. He can just drown like the rest of us whereas other things dont hurt him, like sickness or physical damage. So turning on a sprinkler wont do anything to him. Luke does have pretty good hand to hand skills though and we dont see nothing impressive from David. Now we do know Luke can be hurt by folks with high strength like bushmaster and Jessica so David could probably hurt Luke, but Im not sure he has the skills to hang with him in H2H. We dont know if Luke can hurt David though, as its ambiguous. So far he's been pretty impregnable, the car crash didnt KO him and its not really shown if the train wreck actually knocked him out for a long time or if it was just a few seconds. If it was the latter Luke is gonna have a hard time knocking David out. I think this would good to re-address after 'Glass' drops so we can be more educated on Davids limits.

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#12 Posted by AllStarSuperman (43234 posts) - - Show Bio

David wins with Glass trailer feats

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#13 Posted by KingOfWakanda (2570 posts) - - Show Bio

We'll have to wait for Glass to officially release but as of now, Luke should win.

We truly don't know David's strength or durability limits. But Luke should definitely be the more skilled combatant. Police/military/boxing background > security guard.

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#15 Edited by rogueshadow (29360 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not seeing what makes this particularly close. With or without trailer feats Luke would surely dominate him, unless I missed something significant in said trailers. Interested to see arguments against this position.

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#16 Posted by KingLouie (3567 posts) - - Show Bio

Luke Wins, in a mismatch.

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#17 Posted by Emperorb777 (11280 posts) - - Show Bio

Mismatch, Luke is on a different level.

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#18 Posted by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio

David has shown that he cannot be injured. So far he has no upper limit.

Luke however, while demonstrating superior feats of strength does indeed have limits to his durability.

If David can get Luke Cage in a headlock, he wins.

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#19 Edited by rogueshadow (29360 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderfan130666 said:

David has shown that he cannot be injured. So far he has no upper limit.

Luke however, while demonstrating superior feats of strength does indeed have limits to his durability.

If David can get Luke Cage in a headlock, he wins.

This isn't how logical inference works. That he has shown no upper limit to his durability does not mean we can assume he is completely invulnerable, he has not been tested to the same extent as Luke, who has shown far greater strength and durability than Dunn. It was never even suggested or implied that Dunn is completely invincible or even absurdly so, just superhumanly durable and strong on a low-ish level relatively speaking.

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#20 Edited by uugieboogie (13187 posts) - - Show Bio

Luke takes a solid majority, maybe things could change after Glass comes out.

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#21 Edited by Mee09 (5765 posts) - - Show Bio

Right now I think David Dunn is far more durable than Luke. We've never seen him truly harmed by anything. I think Glass is going to push those limits even further in the new movie. For now I say stalemate but both are more than physically strong enough to hurt each other. David Dunn was trading blows with The Beast which is no easy feat. He's hitting harder than a Rhino.

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#22 Posted by KingOfWakanda (2570 posts) - - Show Bio

@mee09 said:

Right now I think David Dunn is far more durable than Luke. We've never seen him truly harmed by anything. I think Glass is going to push those limits even further in the new movie. For now I say stalemate but both are more than physically strong enough to hurt each other. David Dunn was trading blows with The Beast which is no easy feat. He's hitting harder than a Rhino.

Dunn has done literally nothing to prove this. He survived a car accident and train derailment. Both occurred off screen. We don't know if he was knocked out or in any pain. We can revisit Dunn's durability after Glass is released, but until I see him on screen tanking bullets made from alien metal or bombs or speeding SUVs like Luke, I'm going with Luke as more durable.

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#23 Posted by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio

@rogueshadow: @kingofwakanda:The car accident was not offscreen. The train wreck was not off-screen. We saw the scale of the wreckage for both. In both instances, Dunn suffered no injury whatsoever. He also strangled the Orange Man to death and he was pretty tough.

This isn't how logical inference works. That he has shown no upper limit to his durability does not mean we can assume he is completely invulnerable, he has not been tested to the same extent as Luke, who has shown far greater strength and durability than Dunn.

The train wreck is above most of Luke's showings. And David ripped off a car door in the same way that Luke Cage does. He lifted 200 lbs and then lifted twice that. And that was before he realized the extent of his power.

It was never even suggested or implied that Dunn is completely invincible or even absurdly so, just superhumanly durable and strong on a low-ish level relatively speaking.

Not low level. Not even close.

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#24 Posted by KingOfWakanda (2570 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderfan130666: They're literally both off-screen. We do not see them occur. Only the aftermath.

Beating the man in orange has nothing on beating Bushmaster.

Luke and David are on two different levels. Glass may change that but as of right now he hasn't done anything Luke can't do in his sleep.

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#25 Posted by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio

@kingofwakanda:

We do not see them occur. Only the aftermath.

That's not off-screen. That would imply we only hear about it. But we get the context. Everyone else DIED on the train. We see the cars thrown everywhere.

Beating the man in orange has nothing on beating Bushmaster.

True. But Luke got knocked out three times as well.

Luke and David are on two different levels. Glass may change that but as of right now he hasn't done anything Luke can't do in his sleep.

We've never seen David Dunn get remotely injured. We have no idea what his limits are. So you cannot logically place him on a different level.

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#26 Posted by hyiena (5340 posts) - - Show Bio

Was the man in orange super strong or something?

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#27 Posted by KingOfWakanda (2570 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderfan130666: Bruh, that's off screen. On screen means we see it happen. Off screen means we don't. We don't see either accident happen.

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#28 Posted by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio

The aftermath is enough to gauge the level of the feat.

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#29 Edited by rogueshadow (29360 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderfan130666 said:

@rogueshadow: @kingofwakanda:The car accident was not offscreen. The train wreck was not off-screen. We saw the scale of the wreckage for both. In both instances, Dunn suffered no injury whatsoever. He also strangled the Orange Man to death and he was pretty tough.

This isn't how logical inference works. That he has shown no upper limit to his durability does not mean we can assume he is completely invulnerable, he has not been tested to the same extent as Luke, who has shown far greater strength and durability than Dunn.

The train wreck is above most of Luke's showings. And David ripped off a car door in the same way that Luke Cage does. He lifted 200 lbs and then lifted twice that. And that was before he realized the extent of his power.

It was never even suggested or implied that Dunn is completely invincible or even absurdly so, just superhumanly durable and strong on a low-ish level relatively speaking.

Not low level. Not even close.

Honestly there's no argument to be made here.

Surviving a train wreck uninjured is not above being unmoved an inch by a speeding SUV and having a grenade go off in the palm of your hands without so much as flinching, or backhanding a bike thrown by the superhuman Diamondback, or tanking an explosion and standing in the middle of it like your sunbathing.

You're really going to compare strangling the Orange Man (a regular human) and lifting a few hundred lbs to tossing a 400lb tire like it's a frisbee?

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#30 Posted by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio

@rogueshadow:

Honestly there's no argument to be made here.

Anyone who says that does not know how to argue

Surviving a train wreck uninjured is not above being unmoved an inch by a speeding SUV and having a grenade go off in the palm of your hands without so much as flinching,or backhanding a bike thrown by the superhuman Diamondback, or tanking an explosion and standing in the middle of it like your sunbathing.

It's above at least the bike. And

You're really going to compare strangling the Orange Man (a regular human) and lifting a few hundred lbs to tossing a 400lb tire like it's a frisbee?

No I'm going to compare it to him, shrugging off multiple riot policemen on his own (2:03) bending steel, (2:06) and fighting head to head with The Beast, who is strong enough to shrug off shotgun blasts, as well as breaking down a 1-inch- thick steel door (2:29) and so on.

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#31 Edited by rogueshadow (29360 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderfan130666: Again, there's no comparison, the feats provided are just massively beneath Luke's level. Being visibly wounded and bearing a scar from a shotgun blast vs tanking Judas bullets, grenades, SUVs, explosions etc. with zero injury? Bending steel? Luke bends steel like it's putty, he kicks down steel gates in one shot and throws 200 lbs men and 400 lbs tires like pillowcases, this is low-tier stuff for him. He destroys Dunn.

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#32 Edited by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio

@rogueshadow:

Again, there's no comparison, the feats provided are just massively beneath Luke's level.

Now you are lowballing to the extreme.

Being visibly wounded and bearing a scar from a shotgun blast vs tanking Judas bullets, grenades, SUVs, explosions etc. with zero injury?

I'm sorry, that's the BEAST, not David. And he pried open prison bars, AFTER getting shot. And in the new trailer, he's seen flipping over a police car, which is above anything Luke has done so far. (2:17)

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Bending steel? Luke bends steel like it's putty, he kicks down steel gates in one shot and throws 200 lbs men and 400 lbs tires like pillowcases, this is low-tier stuff for him.

Yeah, and David did not show any effort beating those guards. As for the Steel door, it's far more sturdy that a GATE.

And in this new video, David is seen throwing a heavy table which the Beast catches. 0:05-0:07. He clearly takes out a riot squad of six 0:39, 0:49. And at 0:51 Dunn slams against an armoured vehicle hard enough to dent it.

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He destroys Dunn.

No he doesn't. Because he has no means of physically harming Dunn. He struggled against Bushmaster who was about as strong as the Beast. He struggled against Elektra, failing to land a single blow. We've seen his upper limit. So far, Dunn is virtually unbreakable.

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#33 Edited by rogueshadow (29360 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderfan130666: I brought up the Beast because you referenced him fighting the beast as a noteworthy feat in this battle. Even ignoring the fact that trailer feats should not be used as they lack context, struggling to tip over a vehicle like that is just not impressive relative to Luke.

You say that he was prying apart bars after getting shot as though that would do anything to Luke, post-amp grenades don't so much as tickle his palms or make him flinch:

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The guy tanked an Iron Fist to the chest. He's way above Dunn.

Luke (pre-amp) could overpower Jessica Jones with one arm in a struggle:

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This being the woman who could stop a speeding car with one hand:

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Denting a vehicle is nothing, Diamondback, using just a punch/jab, sends Luke flying so hard he absolutely trashes the side of a van half a dozen feet away:

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Dunn and the Beast haven't done anything remotely on par with these feats. Bending a steel bar is child's play, steel is putty in Luke's hands:

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Overpowering the Orange Man? A regular human? Try overpowering 6 men at once with a causal raise of the arms:

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Even peak humans can't tickle Luke. There's no comparison.

No he doesn't. Because he has no means of physically harming Dunn. He struggled against Bushmaster who was about as strong as the Beast. He struggled against Elektra, failing to land a single blow. We've seen his upper limit. So far, Dunn is virtually unbreakable.

  • The Beast being as strong as Bushmaster is baseless. Bushmaster hurting Luke is just a feat for Bushmaster, evidencing how strong he is, it doesn't nullify Luke's other durability feats.
  • He didn't land blows on Elektra because she's infinitely faster and more skilled than anybody in Unbreakable and superhumanly strong herself. And he did manage to disarm her.
  • That Dunn hasn't shown limits... doesn't mean he doesn't have them. And in strength he clearly struggled to lift a few hundred lbs, though that was likely psychosomatic in my opinion. This isn't how reason works. The burden of proof is on you to prove how strong and durable he is using evidence at hand, what you're applying is a no-limits fallacy. Dunn is not literally unbreakable, it isn't even suggested that he truly can't be hurt in the films, just that his limits are well beyond humans. Would you apply the same logic to suggest that MCU Hulk can't hurt him?
  • Based on feats he has displayed he is drastically beneath Luke Cage who can walk through explosions, tank Iron Fists, grenades, mini-gun fire, SUVs at high speeds, lift huge stone slabs on one shoulder, overpower Jessica Jones, hurl 400lbs tires like pillows etc.
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#34 Posted by Lan_Fan (14720 posts) - - Show Bio

Going with Luke Cage here.

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#35 Posted by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio

@rogueshadow:

I brought up the Beast because you referenced him fighting the beast as a noteworthy feat in this battle. Even ignoring the fact that trailer feats should not be used as they lack context, struggling to tip over a vehicle like that is just not impressive relative to Luke.

Yes it is. And he was NOT struggling. He was angry.

You say that he was prying apart bars after getting shot as though that would do anything to Luke, post-amp grenades don't so much as tickle his palms or make him flinch:

Yet I am talking not of the Beast,

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The guy tanked an Iron Fist to the chest. He's way above Dunn.

Why is that? Elektra tanked the Iron Fist. Not a good measuring stick.

Luke (pre-amp) could overpower Jessica Jones with one arm in a struggle:

So what? Luke did not get any stronger. His skin merely got tougher.

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This being the woman who could stop a speeding car with one hand:

Yes and yet, when she got hit by a car, she suffered broken ribs.

Also, she was still able to stalemate Cage for a considerable amount of time

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Denting a vehicle is nothing, Diamondback, using just a punch/jab, sends Luke flying so hard he absolutely trashes the side of a van half a dozen feet away:

I'm sorry, since when is a van as durable as an armoured vehicle? And Dunn, while not smashing the windows is clearly rattling the vehicle with the force of his blows. Also the side got smashed after REPEATED punches.

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Dunn and the Beast haven't done anything remotely on par with these feats.

WRONG AGAIN. You are lowballing extremely. How is what you saw not remotely on par? That vehicle is twice as heavy as that van? And the Beast is CLEARLY seen throwing Dunn into water tower.

Bending a steel bar is child's play, steel is putty in Luke's hands:

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Wow, crumpling a gun is somehow more impressive.

Overpowering the Orange Man? A regular human? Try overpowering 6 men at once with a causal raise of the arms:

Did he just get soaked in acid or water? Did he just get psychologically weakened? No.

Also, why are you using the Orange Man? David clearly does something much more impressive right here.

Animated GIF

I count at least five ARMOURED guards which he knocks over at once with a shove. Pathetic

Even peak humans can't tickle Luke. There's no comparison.

Are you willfully ignorant? Luke at least flinched when he got punched in the gut. And a regular was able to get him in a headlock, regardless of how briefly. Also, when has Dunn been REMOTELY injured?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJEkF7hKluU

1:23

  • The Beast being as strong as Bushmaster is baseless. Bushmaster hurting Luke is just a feat for Bushmaster, evidencing how strong he is, it doesn't nullify Luke's other durability feats.

And yet Bushmaster was not bulletproof.

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I assure you, shotgun shells are fare more painful, and have MUCH greater kickback.

  • He didn't land blows on Elektra because she's infinitely faster and more skilled than anybody in Unbreakable and superhumanly strong herself. And he did manage to disarm her.

That was it. She was not as strong as the Beast, though, yet she managed to knock him around.

That Dunn hasn't shown limits... doesn't mean he doesn't have them. And in strength he clearly struggled to lift a few hundred lbs, though that was likely psychosomatic in my opinion. This isn't how reason works.

No that's how self-justification works. Dunn struggled at first because of his mental limitations. He then lifted twice that amount with the same effort. If he truly pushes himself, there's no telling what he could do.

The burden of proof is on you to prove how strong and durable he is using evidence at hand, what you're applying is a no-limits fallacy.

So-far, David Dunn's upper limit is surviving a train-wreck completely unharmed. And it was not luck that saved him.

Dunn is not literally unbreakable, it isn't even suggested that he truly can't be hurt in the films, just that his limits are well beyond humans.

Actually he IS literally Unbreakable. And his limits are ever expanding.

Would you apply the same logic to suggest that MCU Hulk can't hurt him?

Hulk is on an entirely different level. His strength has no upper limit. He's already a thousand times stronger than Cage and not even worth mentioning. If you have to go that far up the ladder, you are desperate.

Based on feats he has displayed he is drastically beneath Luke Cage who can walk through explosions, tank Iron Fists, grenades, mini-gun fire, SUVs at high speeds, lift huge stone slabs on one shoulder, overpower Jessica Jones, hurl 400lbs tires like pillows etc.

Yeah, except the new feats show he is NOT below him AT ALL.

You ignored several of the feats and worse, you completely lowballed the rest.

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#36 Edited by rogueshadow (29360 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderfan130666: You aren't really addressing the superiority of Luke's feats that I have referenced, nothing you're showing is on that level.

In regards to some of your points:

  • Elektra took a significantly weaker Iron Fist. The Iron Fist Luke took created a shockwave that ragdolled people and objects in the surrounding environment. When Danny hit her with a more powerful Iron Fist at Midland Circle, Elektra was out of the fight.
  • Luke became stronger, which was why he was testing himself with the tire and the like on the American Football circuit.
  • She was hit by a truck when she wasn't expecting it.
  • I only referenced the Orange Man because you used it as a feat. I only referenced the Beast because you used him as a metric for Dunn.
  • Don't refer to others as "willfully ignorant" and the like; be civil.
  • Using the headlock example is poor form, it is the definition of PIS. Even worse than the often used 2x4 against JJ.
  • Bushmaster not being bulletproof is not evidence against his strength... not sure what the point of this is.
  • "There's no telling what he can do" -- "he is unbreakable" - Your arguments for Dunn winning is basically reliant on a NLF. By feats he is outstripped by Cage. He has no feats comparable to tanking grenades, being unmoved by SUVs, easily crushing, compressing and snapping steel, tanking getting punched 40 feet away and punched so hard he wrecks a van (many times), lifting huge stone slabs on one shoulder, tanking Iron Fists, bullets, sending cars flying with a kick, overpowering Jessica Jones (who can herself catch free-falling elevators and stop speeding car with one hand) etc.
  • Rather than going back and forth, just post some of Dunn's feats you think compare, his best feats that you think showcase his superiority to Cage. Specifically from Unbreakable, since generally trailer feats should not be used as they lack context and are frowned upon.
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#37 Posted by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio

@rogueshadow:

  • Elektra took a significantly weaker Iron Fist. The Iron Fist Luke took created a shockwave that ragdolled people and objects in the surrounding environment. When Danny hit her with a more powerful Iron Fist at Midland Circle, Elektra was out of the fight.

And what about when they were underground? Danny hit her full force and she got right back up. Also, it didn't look like the fist that he used on Luke was any more powerful. Just that the Chi was distributed in all directions.

  • Luke became stronger, which was why he was testing himself with the tire and the like on the American Football circuit.

No evidence that he wasn't already that strong. I don't think he'd ever tested his limits before.

  • She was hit by a truck when she wasn't expecting it.

That doesn't change the fact that she got injured.

I only referenced the Orange Man because you used it as a feat.

That's not the only feat, though. You used the weaker of two feats. So that is an illogical explanation unless you were trying to lowball again.

I only referenced the Beast because you used him as a metric for Dunn.

Yes and somehow that makes you right?

  • Don't refer to others as "willfully ignorant" and the like; be civil.

How about you don't ignore what I say then?

  • Using the headlock example is poor form, it is the definition of PIS. Even worse than the often used 2x4 against JJ.

Why is PIS? Luke was apparently overpowered by eight grown men in that same episode.

Bushmaster not being bulletproof is not evidence against his strength...not sure what the point of this is.

It is evidence against his durability. THAT's what the point of this is,

  • "There's no telling what he can do" -- "he is unbreakable" - Your arguments for Dunn winning is basically reliant on a NLF. By feats he is outstripped by Cage.

No not really. In terms of amount of feats, yes. But in terms of upper limits at least in strength, it's closer than you admit.

  • He has no feats comparable to tanking grenades, being unmoved by SUVs, easily crushing, compressing and snapping steel,

And Dunn has already done two of those things.

  • tanking getting punched 40 feet away and punched so hard he wrecks a van (many times),

And what do you call the above image of Dunn wrecking a much larger vehicle with a single strike?

  • lifting huge stone slabs on one shoulder,

With considerable effort, I might add.

  • tanking Iron Fists, bullets, sending cars flying with a kick, overpowering Jessica Jones (who can herself catch free-falling elevators and stop speeding car with one hand) etc.

Iron Fist attacks are severely overrated. Luke never sent a car flying, Jessica Jones is effectively as strong as the Beast who Dunn overpowered or at least matched. Also Jones was not trying to hurt Cage.

  • Rather than going back and forth, just post some of Dunn's feats you think compare, his best feats that you think showcase his superiority to Cage.

I thought I have. You seem to disagree. I'm not going to bother reposting.

  • Specifically from Unbreakable, since generally trailer feats should not be used as they lack context and are frowned upon.

To hell with context. Believe what you see or don't. There is nothing to discredit with what you see. Unless you assume an adrenaline rush is in effect

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#38 Posted by rogueshadow (29360 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderfan130666 We're just going in circles now, but:

  • Danny blatantly hit Luke harder. The shockwaves sent chairs all over the large room and people in it hurtling through the air. More powerful Iron Fists dropped Elektra cold and that one wasn't on par with the one Luke took to the chest.
  • Luke had tested himself at junkyards, as he said in JJS1.
  • Yes, she was injured, and? What exactly is Jessica getting injured by a speeding truck meant to prove in regards to Luke? Luke was hit by a speeding truck and was fine. Dunn doesn't have the output of a speeding truck, or an SUV, or an Iron Fist.
  • I initially addressed both feats, Orange Man and the train feat. Struggling to choke out the Orange Man is not a good feat no matter how you slice it, it wasn't worth bringing up.
  • Right about what? You used the Beast's feats to boost Dunn, but neither the Beast or Dunn have feats on par with Luke's.
  • Don't make this some personal grudge-match, you're already on a final warning for insults.
  • Evidence against his durability against piercing weapons? How is this relevant to him being able to hurt Luke? Dunn hasn't even proven he is bulletproof yet.
  • He's outpaced in sheer quality of feats, not just quantity. Grenades, SUVs, bullets, mini-guns, tossing tires, overpowering Jess etc. are all simply more impressive than anything Dunn has done. And Luke also overpowered Jessica very easily earlier in the season, both times Jessica was trying as hard as she could to stop him and simply couldn't. He is significantly stronger than her, the woman who can catch a multi-ton elevator and stop a car with one hand. Both feats are above what Dunn has shown.
  • Luke kicked a car and sent it into a tailspin in S2.
  • I'm really not seeing how the stuff you've posted compares with Luke's feats. He's done nothing on par with launching people 40 feet with a punch or not being moved so much as a mm by an SUV. Pushing somebody into the side of a vehicle and wrecking it is not as impressive as doing the same thing with a punch when they are several feet away. Dunn's feats flat out aren't as good. A literal grenade can't even phase him point-blank.
  • Trailers are often misleading and often scenes in them are cut. But even if you want to use them Luke is stronger.
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#39 Edited by SupremeGeneration (11922 posts) - - Show Bio

lol

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#40 Posted by SupremeGeneration (11922 posts) - - Show Bio

Alright went and saw the movie. Disregarding Glass trailer feats, Luke spitestomps lol. Dunn showed no strength/striking that Luke can’t easily outdo and we can’t NLF his durability.

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#41 Posted by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio

@rogueshadow:

  • Danny blatantly hit Luke harder. The shockwaves sent chairs all over the large room and people in it hurtling through the air. More powerful Iron Fists dropped Elektra cold and that one wasn't on par with the one Luke took to the chest.

I don't need to remind you that the shockwaves are Chi dispersed in all directions. It doesn't matter what else was destroyed.

  • Luke had tested himself at junkyards, as he said in JJS1.

Means nothing. He's not any stronger.

  • Yes, she was injured, and? What exactly is Jessica getting injured by a speeding truck meant to prove in regards to Luke?

I pray you are not asking but you are. Jessica was able to match him at the very least.

  • Luke was hit by a speeding truck and was fine. Dunn doesn't have the output of a speeding truck, or an SUV, or an Iron Fist.

You don't know that. You are just guessing.

I initially addressed both feats, Orange Man and the train feat.

And you ignored the guard feat

Struggling to choke out the Orange Man is not a good feat no matter how you slice it, it wasn't worth bringing up.

Yet you brought it back up even when I brought in a better one. This was just after David had escaped the water. Also, he killed the Orange Man, not just choked him out.

  • Right about what? You used the Beast's feats to boost Dunn, but neither the Beast or Dunn have feats on par with Luke's.

Dude, they totally do. Luke never flipped over a police car or rattled a vehicle that heavy

  • Don't make this some personal grudge-match, you're already on a final warning for insults.

Don't bring that up. That was years ago, and it's really not your place to tell me unless you're a Mod. Also, this is not a Grudge Match.

  • Evidence against his durability against piercing weapons? How is this relevant to him being able to hurt Luke? Dunn hasn't even proven he is bulletproof yet.

If the Beast is Bullet resistant, I am going to assume for now that he is.

  • He's outpaced in sheer quality of feats, not just quantity. Grenades, SUVs, bullets, mini-guns, tossing tires, overpowering Jess etc. are all simply more impressive than anything Dunn has done.

No the train feat is already above half of those and fighting the Beast is already enough to line up

  • And Luke also overpowered Jessica very easily earlier in the season, both times Jessica was trying as hard as she could to stop him and simply couldn't.

She wasn't trying to hurt him. Not that she could necessarily, but she incap'd him twice.

  • He is significantly stronger than her, the woman who can catch a multi-ton elevator and stop a car with one hand. Both feats are above what Dunn has shown.

Not significantly stronger. You're thinking of Alisa.

Luke kicked a car and sent it into a tailspin in S2.

That's not the same as "sending it flying"

  • I'm really not seeing how the stuff you've posted compares with Luke's feats. He's done nothing on par with launching people 40 feet with a punch or not being moved so much as a mm by an SUV.

The Beast through David at least that distance through a Water Tower. He was shown matching his strength.

  • Pushing somebody into the side of a vehicle and wrecking it is not as impressive as doing the same thing with a punch when they are several feet away.

No, it is actually because that van is nowhere near as durable and more importantly it was several hits that smashed it, not just one.

  • Dunn's feats flat out aren't as good. A literal grenade can't even phase him point-blank.

And yet a shotgun blast dislocated his arm.

  • Trailers are often misleading and often scenes in them are cut. But even if you want to use them Luke is stronger.

I'd argue they're on similar tiers but I'm going to wait until Glass comes out.

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#42 Posted by solo788 (842 posts) - - Show Bio

Was leaning towards luke but not casually but seeing the solid argument put out by rogueshadow I now think he could take this comfortably

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#43 Posted by deactivated-5c830d4e319e6 (4952 posts) - - Show Bio

Luke wins comfortably.

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#44 Edited by rogueshadow (29360 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderfan130666: Ack, we're still doing this? Well, agree to disagree. I've made my points and you've made yours, no point going in circles, the arguments speak for themselves at this point. Readers/observers can decide for themselves whose argument is stronger based on the evidence presented.

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#45 Posted by Pierpat (5855 posts) - - Show Bio

Let's debate this after glass comes out.

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#46 Posted by SpiderFan130666 (795 posts) - - Show Bio
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#47 Edited by morgadc1887 (389 posts) - - Show Bio

@rogueshadow: seems like you are lowballing the crap out of dunn, this fight seems like a total toss up honestly. Luke is a little bit of a jobber also, knocked out several times by bushmaster who seems like a very similar character to the beast as far as strength, durability, and speed - hell the beast honestly seems to have better durability, bushmaster took more damage from a handgun at a distance than the beast did from a shotgun point blank - the same thing that knocked out luke cage mind you, might have even killed him without medical assistance.

The fight is a split (pun intended)

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#48 Posted by assemblesquad (2918 posts) - - Show Bio

@morgadc1887: Luke was knocked out by Bushmaster during their first fight because he use his prep and knowledges to analyse Luke's fighting style, and Luke became consistent against him in the second, third, and fourth fight.

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#49 Posted by morgadc1887 (389 posts) - - Show Bio

@assemblesquad: luke was also almost killed by a shotgun - just saying he is a bit of a jobber, doesn't matter if bushmaster analyzed his fighting style, he still knocked him out, it was a knock on lukes durability, not his fighting skill.

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#50 Posted by morgadc1887 (389 posts) - - Show Bio

@assemblesquad: he also did not win in all those, if anything, he CONSISTENTLY lost