MCU John Walker Captain America (US Agent) vs MCU Batroc

MCU Batroc (Captain America: The Winter Soldier)

VS

MCU John Walker (US Agent/Captain America)

Rules:

• Standard Gear for Everyone
• Win by KO/Death/Incap
• No Prep, Random Encounter
• Location: Hell's Kitchen Streets

Round 1:

• Morals on, No Bloodlust

Round 2:

• Morals off, Bloodlust on

Who Wins and Why?

batroc scales to infinity war thanos

batroc stomps

Walker rips him in half.

Walker easily.

do John have the serum here or no

Without serum John wins with mid-high difficult.

With serum stomps.

Walker with the Serum runs right through him

Walker stomps...

@frozen said:

@rbt said:

Walker stomps...

Great clip of Cap blocking and dodging literally everything Batroc threw at him.

@rbt: Of course Cap reacts to him. He is a super soldier with superior reactions. That said, he still forced Cap on the defensive and pushed him back with his pressure style.

There's also one point during the fight where Cap hits him a few times and he takes it:

From an intent perspective, it was also said he gave him a little trouble:

My character is a French mercenary who is an expert in the martial arts and is also an Olympic weightlifting champion. He doesn’t have any superpowers, but he’s a very strong and acrobatic guy who gives a little hell to Captain America.”

George St-Pierre (Production Notes for Captain America: The Winter Soldier)

@rbt: Btw, I agree that Walker wrecks. I just wanted to post that GIF. I think Batroc would give Walker a bit more trouble than he did Cap, given that Walker is vastly less skilled.

John Walker is superior in every way, sans martial arts flashiness.

@frozen:

Of course Cap reacts to him. He is a super soldier with superior reactions. That said, he still forced Cap on the defensive and pushed him back with his pressure style.

Batroc ambushed Cap, landed a few hits because Cap was off guard, then failed to land literally anything on Cap who then proceeded to trash him the moment he recovered from the initial onslaught that followed the ambush.

Cap shits all over Batroc when it comes to skill. And well, everything else. I couldn't care less how many punches Batroc threw given not a single one of those connected.

There's also one point during the fight where Cap hits him a few times and he takes it:

Good durability feat. Still trash skill wise though.

My character is a French mercenary who is an expert in the martial arts and is also an Olympic weightlifting champion. He doesn’t have any superpowers, but he’s a very strong and acrobatic guy who gives a little hell to Captain America.”

George St-Pierre

Yes, also Walker is weaker than Cap, Nyssa only lost to Al Sah Him because of the flashbang and Captain Marvel can play football with moons.

This thread was made before Walker got the serum, in which case Batroc wins. Current Walker with the serum knocks his head off.

Batroc wins if this is non-Serum Walker.

Walker destroys otherwise.

@rbt:

1) You are over-emphaszing the ambush a bit here. An ambush isn't that big of an advantage over Cap if you're A) unarmed and B) vastly inferior in physicals.

Also, I'm not claiming that Batroc had any real chance of beating Cap or doing anything significant. He is too outclassed physically to stand a chance unarmed. However, he drove Cap back and forced him into the defensive via his skill.

Cap won via some skill and stat abuse. Against most other humans, Cap doesn't need to worry about dodging or countering. He just one shots.

2) While I mostly agree that actor statements are generally useless, this is a bit of a false equivalency. Brie Larson making a statement about Captain Marvel throwing planets or something isn't substantiated by feats. Batroc giving "a little" hell to Cap is his comment on what the intent behind their fight was. There's a sizeable number of people who think Batroc is quite skilled despite only having 1 movie appearance, so his comment is not that far fetched.

@frozen:

1) You are over-emphaszing the ambush a bit here. An ambush isn't that big of an advantage over Cap if you're A) unarmed and B) vastly inferior in physicals.

I mean, he landed three hits, one kick on his body right after the ambush, then Cap did a roll to get back on his feet and after that, Batroc failed to land even one hit out of the two dozen hits he threw. Seems like the only reason he could land a hit on Cap was because of the ambush, tbh.

Also, I'm not claiming that Batroc had any real chance of beating Cap or doing anything significant. He is too outclassed physically to stand a chance unarmed. However, he drove Cap back and forced him into the defensive via his skill.

And I'm saying that if you equalised Cap's and Batroc's stats, then Batroc still wouldn't have any real chance of landing a clean shot on Cap, let alone beating him.(of course, that's assuming Cap retains his combat speed, which I think he would).

While I mostly agree that actor statements are generally useless, this is a bit of a false equivalency. Brie Larson making a statement about Captain Marvel throwing planets or something isn't substantiated by feats. Batroc giving "a little" hell to Cap is his comment on what the intent behind their fight was.

The hell? Why would George be aware of intent behind the fight and Brie won't be aware of intent behind her character? Just seems like you're nitpicking statements.

@rbt:

As I said in my previous post, I acknowledge that he didn't land a hit. The difference is that you seem to attribute that to Cap's skill, whereas I attribute it to his physicals. He is a super soldier, and it stands to reason that he would be much faster than a human.

My point is that even pushing Cap to parry several continuous hits is a feat in and of itself. Cap usually one shots humans and ragdolls them. Whereas Batroc pushed him onto the defensive and made him counter each blow.

If stats were equalized, how would he be able to react as easily as he did? He would be considerably slower.

I think there's a difference between an actor making generalised claims of their character's abilities (which can contradict their on screen feats, intros case Captain Marvel moving planets) and an actor commenting on a specific scene which they actually performed stunts for.

Even if you want to ignore GSP's statement for whatever reason, Cap's stunt double in TWS said that Batroc was a "sufficient foe" for Cap and directly commented on how GSP's skill was intertwined into the Batroc character. Surely that should suffice for intent behind the fight? Both GSP and Cap's stunt double acknowledge he was a threat. So even if you think he didn't do anything, the actors have said otherwise.