MCU : John Pilgrim VS Wilson Fisk

H2H

Fisk

Fisk in a tough fight. Pilgrim fights dirty and his durabilty & pain tolerance would allow him to win some rounds. He is just like Frank.

John Pilgrim. He was basically Frank's equal. While Fisk had the upper hand on Frank in their brief encounter, Frank had also taken quite a beating immediately prior. John was almost a perfect match for Frank in combat, and both were equally messed up.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@floopay: Frank wasn’t exactly utilising his skill to the max in that fight. If they were both in perfect condition, Frank would destroy him.

People should stop using Fisk and Frank's "fight" to try and say Fisk is better. Frank was half dead and chained down and he still landed more hits that dealt more damage before Fisk fully abused the restraints to knock him down.

That's pretty much exactly what I was saying...

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@floopay: @kingcrimson:

Pilgrim was in a worse condition and they were still almost evenly matched.

Pilgrim is tough but not Fisk tough.

I don't know if worse condition is necessarily true. Even Rock Salt and rubber bullets can do some pretty extensive physical damage, especially at close range. Plus the beatings and lacerations he took. I'm not saying Frank had it worse; but he took a lot of blunt force injuries. So while he may not have been as damaged on the outside; he was physically in pieces on the inside. And this was stated a few times by the people around him after he went to the hospital iirc.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@floopay:

Yea true, but he was in a hospital in which he at least got some professional help and rest. Pilgrim had none of that. He was suffering from so many injuries at this point... he got stabbed, shot and beaten up and never had professional help or any rest to recover from his wounds. Like I don’t even know how is leg was still functional. He got shot by Amy with a shotgun ... he pulled out the slugs by himself and kept fighting.

Amy even told John that it’s suicide to fight frank in his current condition at that time.

It was birdshot from the looks of it, and it looked like soft tissue damage.

Frank may have gotten professional help; but he was also in a car accident immediately afterwards (granted, Pilgrim got shot in the same encounter). Again, I'm just saying neither was that much worse than the other. Even with professional help; broken and fractured bones aren't gonna be much better on 24 hour rest.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Fisk

Fisk ragdolls

A birdshot is still lethal. It might take minutes or hours before the victim succumbs to their wounds, but it can be lethal nonetheless.

May hit him in the leg from point blank range. His whole leg was fucked up. On top of that he got sliced through the stomach and got his face smashed in by multiple men with brass knuckles in the restaurant. The Car accident is not comparable IMO.

Frank wasn't at his best, but Pilgrim was in a miserable condition.

Pilgrim wins 6/10

Not fair.

piligrim would win

I don't recall any striking or durability feats John displayed that would allow him to last more than a couple minutes against Fisk.

@juiceboks: I dont like to berate you bc you are one of the few nice mods but just so you know John ^ did not have the brass knucles to start with ^okay, can you prove to me that mcu mr fisk can beat more than 6 or 7 guys with weapons !? all at one time ?just bc you went the distance with DD or beat a worn-out , bleeding Dare devil .. I mean like for example the guy who makes Dare devils suits and weapons the autistic -guy who has a female police officer as a girl friend .. he was able to go the distance with dare devil twice ! does that make him a professional killer or prof fighter ? .. I mean I have been in a street fight once and yeah beating someone bigger than me is not really hard , you just need good -conditioning but beating more than one guys at a time who weigh more , beating three guys at one time with weapons is just almost impossible unless they are fighting you fair ( by attacking one at a time with no weapons ) .. and don't forget John is kind old , I mean look at him ! the bar -guy even said " saw a ghost" also, John did not use brass knuckles to win at the beginning , he got them from the last guy who attacked ( the Italian fancy suit mafia guy) I honestly think piligrim was taking it easy on the punisher bc like he said" he did nothing bad to me" and piligrim yeah his younger -self would've destroyed punisher in H2H but seriously mr fisk is good at manipulating people with his money and power but he still has no feats even after three seasons

kingpin just has size ,that is about it .. maybe in season 4 we can see mr fisk fight more than one guy at a time .. I mean dex beat a healthy dare devil twice and some people on the vine think 5'6 150 lb Nobu can beat 6'2 230 lb dex.. its all a matter of perception! weight and size

wait a freaking minute . holy crap .. the guy playing John Piligrim is not Sean Penn ?wow lol freaking dopplageaner

@anthp3000 ???? ?? I don't understand.. I could literally chew up four plastic straws watching agents of shield out of boredom .. the Arrow is okay well its good show but kind of just not practical - i mean arrows vs people with tommy guns .. and the last episode was hilarious with rene saying to a girl who shoots arrows "you could've killed that guy when he shoots bullets at people "… no matter how great a bow man you are a amateur can beat you with a gun .. you didn't like Netflix MCU shows ? I am marvel fan and I absolutely love gotham

Wilson Fisk / The Kingpin.

It can go either way. I would go with Pilgrim for a majority due to his pain tolerance, which is damn near on par with Punisher's. It would be a brutal fight but Pilgrim would take it

Fisk.

Pilgrim's only advantage is his pain tolerance. If he had a knife than maybe that would be enough to give him a chance but in this situation he's not winning. Fisk is massively superior physically and a tank himself.

Goes about the same as Dex v Fisk.

People are still using out of context fights for Fisk.

Anyway, they are both horrible in combat, so the winner is no one.

@pastepotpete1:

can you prove to me that mcu mr fisk can beat more than 6 or 7 guys with weapons !? all at one time

I'm not seeing what's so impressive about beating 5 guys (3 of them with weapons) and coming out in the condition John did. Black suit Matt beat twice as many thugs armed with more lethal weapons and while starting the encounter in a worse condition and still came out better in the end.

just bc you went the distance with DD or beat a worn-out , bleeding Dare devil .. I mean like for example he guy DD's suits and weapons the autistic -guy who has a female police officer as a girl friend .. he was able to go the distance with dare devil twice

S1 Matt consistently performed better against groups of enemies multiple times with handicaps John didn't have, and yet despite his armored suit and blunt weapons was still on the losing end of their S1 fight at some points. Fast forward to S3 and we see Bullseye in that same armor get his spine shattered after Kingpin tackled him into a brick wall.

Is there a reason why John would fair better in this scenario?

does that make him a professional killer or prof fighter

Poindexter is an Army veteran and a member of the FBI who was renowned enough to send on a one mission to retrieve possibly the most wanted man in the U.S from a squad of armed terrorists. He is a professional killer in every sense of the word.

I mean I have been in a street fight once and yeah beating someone bigger than me is not really hard

Irrelevant. Fisk clearly isn't just some big dude.

you just need good -conditioning but beating more than one guys at a time who weigh more , beating three guys at one time with weapons is just almost impossible unless they are fighting you fair

Maybe in real life, but in the MCU where unenhanced people can fight after dozens of clean blows to their heads this becomes less and less true. Let's not pretend like John was untouched in that fight, quite the opposite. Him beating those 5 guys is more a testament to his tenacity rather than h2h skill, tenacity that won't help tank repeated blows like this..

kingpin just has size ,that is about it

He has size, strength and durability to noticeable degree. He's shown the capacity to tag someone significantly faster, more skilled and agile than John which is more than what Pilgrim can say for himself. I'm struggling to see what exactly John is bringing to this fight that Fisk would have trouble with.

maybe in season 4 we can see mr fisk fight more than one guy at a time

Why are you so sure he can't? Fisk has shown an almost inhuman degree of strength and durability even relative to people who have demonstrated physical stats well above MCU fodder. There's no reason why he wouldn't be able to oneshot any regular person if he really wanted to, and given his durability feats he's certainly not going to be reeling from any blows.

I mean dex beat a healthy dare devil twice and some people on the vine think 5'6 150 lb Nobu can beat 6'2 230 lb dex

Because Nobu has h2h skill Dex doesn't despite his size advantage which you are clearly exaggerating with those inaccurate measurements.

Fisk

Oof

Just finished Punisher Season 2. Fisk takes this comfortably, his physicals are just way better and John's skill is nothing special.

Fisk.

@pastepotpete1: Melvin has other good feats, he beat up a portion of a swat team. In the comics he's a supervillain named Gladiator. So he should be a good fighter.

Pilgrim is smarter, he will pick up improvised weapons, and he fights dirtier. Is that enough to give him the win? Idk.

Fisk murders him, he gave Matt a really good fight twice. Frank is about equal to a concussed Matt, and an injured Frank beat Pilgrim

@superduperbumpe: Pilgrim was also injured, he recently took a shot gun to the leg.

Pilgrim probably does about as well as Frank did, they're at the weight class they can hurt him a bit but they're getting wrecked after any initial success.

I think it could go either way, depends where the fight take place and why they are fighting

Fisk in a close fight