MCU: Hydra' Helicarriers vs Thanos' Army

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NWName

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#1  Edited By NWName  Online
3 New Gen Helicarriers
3 New Gen Helicarriers

VS

Army of Thanos except Sanctuary II
Army of Thanos except Sanctuary II

Helicarriers start above the portals, 500 meters above ground

Army includes all the fodder; aliens, vehicles and Black Order. No Sanctuary II or Thanos.

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nn5

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Interesting match-up, but tbh these Helicarriers are a bit featless.

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NWName

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#3  Edited By NWName  Online

@nn5: They could kill 100 000+ targets by locking iirc and they have some powerful guns and missiles. Considering that small miniguns can blow up chitauri vehicles these carriers would shred most aliens. Im not sure what the chitauri tanks add to this, i think they are 100% featless. Leviathans and numbers might be a problem since there are about 5-10k aliens and about half of them have ranged weapons. Maw may redirect some missiles. I think both sides have a chance.

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CocaColaMan

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Leviathans solo.

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death4bunnies

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#5  Edited By death4bunnies

Insight Helicarriers and its not close

Long range precision guns can eliminate 1000 targets a minute.

88 mm Flak 37 Anti-Aircraft Guns

Phalanx Block 1B CIWS- 20x102mm

Holds 20+ Quinjets.

So three times all that^^^

A single Quinjet has a undermounted GAU-17A gatling gun.(good for shredding anyone stupid enough to try to attack the carriers from the air.)

And 20+ missiles each.

------------------

NWName says there is about 5-10 thousand alien invaders(Thanos's army felt like less to me but lets stick with that number.)

All targets eliminated in 5-10 minutes at 1000 aliens a minute.

Phalanx should handle the Leviathans I think.

QuinJets and massive amounts of AA cannons destroy any air craft that gets too close.

---------------

Black Order is useless unless they get aboard a carrier.....assuming the carriers start synced, that is not gonna happen....they will be auto locked and dropped with super large bullets.

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nn5

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@nwname: Yeah, I know these. Still not sure if their guns would take down Leviathans or Outrider ships by feats. With all the hype Helicarriers got in TWS we might assume they can tho.

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Rebake

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#7  Edited By Rebake

Helicarriers only would be as effective as described bc they'd be taking out everyone by surprise. In direct combat where they'd take damage, I can see Leviathans doing serious damage and Black Order infiltrating.

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NWName

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#8 NWName  Online

@nn5: Why would they need to take down the outrider ships? They drop once and then release fodder. They dont even have any weapons. Leviathans are likely not bulletproof and the larger rounds should be able pierce the armor but idk if tgey go all tge way through and kill the leviathans.

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death4bunnies

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#9  Edited By death4bunnies

@rebake: @nn5:

I think the Helicarriers are impressive because of some of the weapons the have IRL counterparts.

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Like know Leviathans are impressive but are they really 50+ Anti Aircraft flack cannons impressive?

------

And if the flack cannons cant do it, the insight is also equipped with a few Phalanx Block 1B CIWS- 20x102mm.....these are IRL anti aircraft superguns. Here is the internet movie fire arms database listing of the super gun.

Loading Video...

If you watch this with sound you can really get a feel for their power.^^^

---------------

General Dynamics / Raytheon Phalanx Close-In Weapon System

This weapon is used mostly by naval vessels to engage incoming missiles, aircraft, and sea-based close-range targets. It features a distinctive white-painted cylindrical weapon control group with a domed radome at the top which results in the nickname "R2-D2" being applied to the mounting.

Using tungsten armour-piercing discarding sabot rounds of the naval version --or-- the originals Mark 149 projectile, which was depleted uranium.,----or---- the land-based version uses High-Explosive Incendiary Tracer, Self-Destruct (HEIT-SD) ammunition

20x102mm -- rate of fire from 3,000 to 4,500 rpm --- self aiming with video tracker on the left side of the weapon control.

-Source

------------

The helicarriers weren't glass cannons either.

They took heavy fire and were still firing back, more importantly even under extremely heavy fire it still took time to take them down....a good 20 seconds off shooting at eachother until the repulsers failed.

No Caption Provided

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I think the Helicarrier takes it.

5-10 minutes to clear the 5,000-10,000 ground troops.

A air defense system that can deal with the Leviathans.

And can withstand more damage than I think Thanos's air defenses can put out.

------------

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Rebake

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@nwname: iron Man's mark seven would run out of energy before piercing a Leviathan shell. They should be highly bulletproof. The anti tank missile had to hit a gap created by Hulk and Iron Man was forced to attack one from the inside. These things aren't going down easily.

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@death4bunnies: how do those weapons scale to Iron Man's red laser? Bc a Leviathan no-sold it in Avengers. In fact Iron Man was forced to attack it from the inside. Their armor is seriously good. Endgame just had much more powerful Iron Man suits to be able to damage them (those suits could solo the helicarriers). But the Mark 7 was powerful and didn't have anything to get past the armor.

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#12 NWName  Online

@rebake said:

@nwname: iron Man's mark seven would run out of energy before piercing a Leviathan shell. They should be highly bulletproof. The anti tank missile had to hit a gap created by Hulk and Iron Man was forced to attack one from the inside. These things aren't going down easily.

Not really relevant to piercing resistance at least not to a high end bullet level. We saw chitauri metal get busted by lower level bullets. The problem is Leviathan armor is thick and bullets might just get stuck instead of going all the way.

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ANTHP2000

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#13 ANTHP2000  Online

Not this again.

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death4bunnies

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#14  Edited By death4bunnies

@rebake said:

@death4bunnies: how do those weapons scale to Iron Man's red laser? Bc a Leviathan no-sold it in Avengers. In fact Iron Man was forced to attack it from the inside. Their armor is seriously good. Endgame just had much more powerful Iron Man suits to be able to damage them (those suits could solo the helicarriers). But the Mark 7 was powerful and didn't have anything to get past the armor.

I would say its a laser so it doesn't scale(kinda energy based)....but I rate leviathan armor as hella strong also(based off Hulk and Thor beating on them...to some effect but it was a task).

( also kinda agree the Ironman would solo a helicarrier, but thats more because his dynamic flying and knowledge not because he has a strong laser.....Ironman is just a better counter.)

One thing to consider is Tony had a hand in designing the insight after the battle of New York.

--------

I think the ammunition of the Phalanx would be enough to bust some armor(the tungsten round would have the best shot), its rounds are anti tank and made for the job.

But it fires so crazy fast.....id imagine at least some rounds hits softs spots(face, neck, underside between the plates).

-------

Thinking about it a bit more, I nearly guarantee they hit the leviathans face.....They fly forward(leading with their face), and are kinda slow.

Assuming the rounds dont bust armor.

No Caption Provided

I think they shred a leviathans face.

----------

Here is a cool video I just watched (just how powerful is a 20mm phalanx)

I couldn't see a leviathan flying towards one off these units and not dropping from the sky.

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Noone1996

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They couldn’t even beat Falcon

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subline

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Leviathans solo.

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NWName

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#17 NWName  Online

They couldn’t even beat Falcon

The army couldn't kill him either

Not this again.

It was done before? When?

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death4bunnies

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They couldn’t even beat Falcon

Falcon is a dynamic flyer, he either beat a phalanx CWIS targeting system.

A IRL targeting system that can defeat multiple fighters jets and rockets and mortars,.

CIWS stands for close in weapons system.

Or that is a silly outlier for Falcon and shouldnt be used as a antifeat for the IRL guns the insight carries.

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#19 NWName  Online

@death4bunnies: My bad, 10k is both sides. So more like 5k for aliens.

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GodGate

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#20  Edited By GodGate

Thanos Army easily knock the helicarrier out of the sky.

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NWName

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#21 NWName  Online
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GodGate

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@nwname: with their own BMI as they should roughly weigh more than the carrier's carrying capacity.

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#23  Edited By NWName  Online

@godgate: How are they reaching the carriers? Also their total mass should be lower than the helicarriers. 5k fodder each 0.1 ton = 500 ton. Add about 10 leviathans 3k each and you get 30k. These carriers are most likely 200k or so.

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Rebake

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@death4bunnies: Leviathans use their faces to ram and attack large structures. Those are heavily armored areas except maybe the eyes. Helicarriers can do damage to the army but they are quite vulnerable to attack. Only one outrider ship needs to land on one to cause it to eventually crash when they tear up all the machinery (they dug into the Hulkbuster). There aren't enough Hydra agents onboard to stop infiltration. The Black Order, esp Cull and Maw can easily bring a helicarrier down once inside.

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GodGate

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@nwname: Multiply their weight by the gravity of titan and you get 200k.

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death4bunnies

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@rebake said:

@death4bunnies: Leviathans use their faces to ram and attack large structures. Those are heavily armored areas except maybe the eyes. Helicarriers can do damage to the army but they are quite vulnerable to attack. Only one outrider ship needs to land on one to cause it to eventually crash when they tear up all the machinery (they dug into the Hulkbuster). There aren't enough Hydra agents onboard to stop infiltration. The Black Order, esp Cull and Maw can easily bring a helicarrier down once inside.

Naw man the leviathans in both endgame and A1 had big open spots on there face armor.

Loading Video...

-----------------

I agree if Thanos army gets drops ships they win.....your breakdown of a infiltration is legit.

The Necro craft and other ships can pull off a infiltration tho.... I dont think.

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#27 NWName  Online
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@nwname: If they can't bust Outrider ships, Thanos' army can take shelter inside. And as you said, Leviathans' armor might be bit of a problem.

I'm just doubt Helicarriers can quickly destroy Thanos' ships before some of those reach them and Outriders/Chitauri board the Helicarriers.

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I'm going with Thanos. It'd be hella dumb if his army could lose to normal military ish.

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TakenStew22

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Leviathans carry.

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#31  Edited By NWName  Online

@nn5: I doubt they will take shelter inside the ships. And doing that would result in stalemate and even if they tried i think the carriers can start bombarding the entrance of the ships.

@wordmanjones said:

I'm going with Thanos. It'd be hella dumb if his army could lose to normal military ish.

Logically you would think so but his soldiers died to pistol bullets and chitauri chariots were getting blown up bu 7.62mm bullets. And Outriders got destroyed in the dozens by m249 saw. I think military attacks of sufficient power can stop them.

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nn5

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@nwname: Just saying that if the ships can take Helicarrier's fire for a while then the drop ships can even land on a Helicarriers allowing Outriders to board them.

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@nwname said:

@nn5: I doubt they will take shelter inside the ships. And doing that would result in stalemate and even if they tried i think the carriers can start bombarding the entrance of the ships.

@wordmanjones said:

I'm going with Thanos. It'd be hella dumb if his army could lose to normal military ish.

Logically you would think so but his soldiers died to pistol bullets and chitauri chariots were getting blown up bu 7.62mm bullets. And Outriders got destroyed in the dozens by m249 saw. I think military attacks of sufficient piwer can stop them.

Yeah but the leviathans tho...

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@nwname said:

@nn5: I doubt they will take shelter inside the ships. And doing that would result in stalemate and even if they tried i think the carriers can start bombarding the entrance of the ships.

@wordmanjones said:

I'm going with Thanos. It'd be hella dumb if his army could lose to normal military ish.

Logically you would think so but his soldiers died to pistol bullets and chitauri chariots were getting blown up bu 7.62mm bullets. And Outriders got destroyed in the dozens by m249 saw. I think military attacks of sufficient piwer can stop them.

Hydra agents are even weaker physically than any aliens. They aren't a military with sufficient power to take this. Also, the aliens can just wreck the helicarriers from the inside. Infiltration is what sparked their destruction in the actual movie. It may take longer without a chip, but those aliens can damage Iron Man suits and there aren't enough agents on board to prevent getting swarmed.

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#35  Edited By NWName  Online

@rebake: How are they infiltrating? Ship starts about half a kilometer or more away and half a kilometer up.

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@death4bunnies:

Thinking about it a bit more, I nearly guarantee they hit the leviathans face

If killing Leviathans by simply attacking them in the face is so easy, then why didn't Tony do this?

The fact is, that Jarvis explicitly stated that nothing in Tony's arsenal could damage it.

Thinking about it a bit more, I nearly guarantee they hit the leviathans face

They are more than fast enough to plow into those Helicarriers, which are hardly fast themselves.

Assuming the rounds dont bust armor.

Why would they? Again, Tony's suit had nothing that could damage them. A Leviathan no sold both Tony's multi-missile attack, as well as his chobham-armour busting laser. There is no evidence that the Helicarriers have more firepower than that.

IIRC, the long range guns that HYDRA were going to use to eliminate their enemies were essentially just long range sniper guns designed to target regular humans, right? So why would they be able to kill Leviathans?

The only things we have ever seen bust Leviathan armour, were Thor's lightning, the "Rain Fire" barrage from Sanctuary 2 and Valkyrie's Asgardian sword, all of which are far superior to anything the Helicarriers can dish out.

Here is a cool video I just watched (just how powerful is a 20mm phalanx)

No way in heck is a 20mm gun busting Leviathan armour if Tony's chobham-busting laser couldn't.

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@nwname said:

@rebake: How are they infiltrating? Ship starts about half a kilometer or more away and half a kilometer up.

Well, first, there will be Leviathans to deal with. They won't go down quickly and firepower isn't evenly distributed on helicarriers meaning there will be some spots more vulnerable than others. All it takes is one outrider ship or a group of chitauri to jump out of Leviathans to take down the crew. Cap pretty much solo'd an entire deck. The army engulfs the helicarriers quite frankly. There's too many targets, and too many heavily armored targets. It's in character for the alien armies to just rush the enemy. Also, the glass underneath could get rammed by a Leviathan which carries a number of Chitauri soldiers. Chitauri can also climb the sides where the guns can't reach without doing damage to each other. Helicarriers were not built to take on armies actively fighting back. They were supposed to eliminate targets while they were off-guard.

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#38 NWName  Online

@death4bunnies:

Thinking about it a bit more, I nearly guarantee they hit the leviathans face

If killing Leviathans by simply attacking them in the face is so easy, then why didn't Tony do this?

The fact is, that Jarvis explicitly stated that nothing in Tony's arsenal could damage it.

Thinking about it a bit more, I nearly guarantee they hit the leviathans face

They are more than fast enough to plow into those Helicarriers, which are hardly fast themselves.

Assuming the rounds dont bust armor.

Why would they? Again, Tony's suit had nothing that could damage them. A Leviathan no sold both Tony's multi-missile attack, as well as his chobham-armour busting laser. There is no evidence that the Helicarriers have more firepower than that.

IIRC, the long range guns that HYDRA were going to use to eliminate their enemies were essentially just long range sniper guns designed to target regular humans, right? So why would they be able to kill Leviathans?

The only things we have ever seen bust Leviathan armour, were Thor's lightning, the "Rain Fire" barrage from Sanctuary 2 and Valkyrie's Asgardian sword, all of which are far superior to anything the Helicarriers can dish out.

Here is a cool video I just watched (just how powerful is a 20mm phalanx)

No way in heck is a 20mm gun busting Leviathan armour if Tony's chobham-busting laser couldn't.

No, Jarvis said "we will lose power before we penetrate that shell" while he was using the laser. There is no indication of the effectiveness of the other weapons based solely from that quote. So not even close to explicitly static that.

When did that ever happen? Your headcanon? Or do you mean the flares he used to get its attention and call them missiles?

Laser is just heat resistance feat. Well extremely good heat resistance feat.

Again taking heat =/= taking explosions and bullets. Glass is pretty hard to melt but not tough at all why cant the armor be like that? Especially since we already saw Chitauri metal getting busted by bullets.

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#39  Edited By Scipio123

@nwname:

No, Jarvis said "we will lose power before we penetrate that shell" while he was using the laser. There is no indication of the effectiveness of the other weapons based solely from that quote. So not even close to explicitly static that.

Dude, Tony's laser has been pretty clearly established as his most powerful weapon. There's a reason why Rhodey told him that he should lead with it next time.

And that thing cut through chobham-armoured drones like nothing, so the fact that Tony's suit would run out of power before penetrating it is hugely impressive.

Not to mention, that do you really think Jarvis WOULDN'T have told Tony if his missiles could have killed the Leviathan? Especially since Jarvis really didn't want Tony to do the Tale of Jonah thing. Did Jarvis deliberately allow Tony to put his life at risk for no reason?

When did that ever happen? Your headcanon? Or do you mean the flares he used to get its attention and call them missiles?

Ok, I mistook them for missiles. But the fact that his laser couldn't penetrate it definitely means his missiles couldn't. Heck, he didn't he try using his tank missile until the armour had fallen off. That's pretty conclusive evidence to me that it couldn't penetrate it before.

Laser is just heat resistance feat. Well extremely good heat resistance feat.

There is no evidence that earthly bullets or missiles can pierce Leviathan armour, certainly not easily. The only anti-feat for piercing the Leviathans have is Valkyrie's sword cutting through it. But unfortunately, Asgardian blades have been repeatedly shown to be capable of cutting through super durable substances with ease, such as when Heimdall easily destroyed a Dark Elf ship with 2 knives that were capable of plowing through dozens of stone pillars without taking any damage.

Again taking heat =/= taking explosions and bullets. Glass is pretty hard to melt but not tough at all why cant the armor be like that? Especially since we already saw Chitauri metal getting busted by bullets.

Dude, there's an entire scene at the start of Homecoming where we see one of Vulture's men trying (and failing) to cut apart a crashed Chitauri chariot with a plasma cutter and Toomes tells him that he needs to use alien weapons to do it.

And that's just a chariot, which is FAR less heavily armoured than a Leviathan.

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#40 NWName  Online

@nwname:

No, Jarvis said "we will lose power before we penetrate that shell" while he was using the laser. There is no indication of the effectiveness of the other weapons based solely from that quote. So not even close to explicitly static that.

Dude, Tony's laser has been pretty clearly established as his most powerful weapon. There's a reason why Rhodey told him that he should lead with it next time.

And that thing cut through chobham-armoured drones like nothing, so the fact that Tony's suit would run out of power before penetrating it is hugely impressive.

Not to mention, that do you really think Jarvis WOULDN'T have told Tony if his missiles could have killed the Leviathan? Especially since Jarvis really didn't want Tony to do the Tale of Jonah thing. Did Jarvis deliberately allow Tony to put his life at risk for no reason?

When did that ever happen? Your headcanon? Or do you mean the flares he used to get its attention and call them missiles?

Ok, I mistook them for missiles. But the fact that his laser couldn't penetrate it definitely means his missiles couldn't. Heck, he didn't he try using his tank missile until the armour had fallen off. That's pretty conclusive evidence to me that it couldn't penetrate it before.

Laser is just heat resistance feat. Well extremely good heat resistance feat.

There is no evidence that earthly bullets or missiles can pierce Leviathan armour, certainly not easily. The only anti-feat for piercing the Leviathans have is Valkyrie's sword cutting through it. But unfortunately, Asgardian blades have been repeatedly shown to be capable of cutting through super durable substances with ease, such as when Heimdall easily destroyed a Dark Elf ship with 2 knives that were capable of plowing through dozens of stone pillars without taking any damage.

Again taking heat =/= taking explosions and bullets. Glass is pretty hard to melt but not tough at all why cant the armor be like that? Especially since we already saw Chitauri metal getting busted by bullets.

Dude, there's an entire scene at the start of Homecoming where we see one of Vulture's men trying (and failing) to cut apart a crashed Chitauri chariot with a plasma cutter and Toomes tells him that he needs to use alien weapons to do it.

And that's just a chariot, which is FAR less heavily armoured than a Leviathan.

His most powerful weapon is officially the uni-beam. And that crazy laser was mark 6 only and one use only. We saw the power of his newer multi-use laser in A1 and it was weaker (still pretty powerful). I agree the missiles likely cant bust the thick armor, my point was there was nothing "explicit" about the implication you got from it.

They did not use plasma cutters on the chariot iirc, only normal drills. Friction cutters or something else was cutting Leviathan armors in the background.

If a bullet can pierce the thing at all its not "bullet proof", might still be highly resistant to them tho. The bullets from the helicarrier are much larger than the 7.62s used so with comparable pressure they should penetrate and much deeper idk if deep enough to go through the armor tho.

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Rebake

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@nwname: Evidence the laser was weaker in A1? Also, the uni-beam probably wouldn't do more than dent the armor of Leviathans. Jarvis warned Stark he would run out of power before penetrating that shell, and the unibeam takes up a lot of power from the suit. Iron Man couldn't beat a Leviathan without going inside one. That was also the writer's intent. Iron Man's best was not supposed to be good enough to take down Leviathans from the outside.

The Helicarriers get overrun. Maybe even stomped by the army now that I think about it. Leviathans should soak plenty of the Helicarriers' fire while unloading troops onto the sides and decks. The human crew certainly stand little chance. Only one outrider ship needs to land on a deck and that helicarrier will eventually go down. The Black Order would tear up the insides of any Helicarrier. Helicarriers lack proper defenses if enemies get past their guns (which will happen). The Hydra agents are inferior to Chitauri and Outriders in number, strength, durability, speed, aggressiveness, and damage output.

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@nwname said:

@nn5: They could kill100 000+ targets by locking iirc and they have some powerful guns and missiles. Considering that small miniguns can blow up chitauri vehicles these carriers would shred most aliens. Im not sure what the chitauri tanks add to this, i think they are 100% featless. Leviathans and numbers might be a problem since there are about 5-10k aliens and about half of them have ranged weapons. Maw may redirect some missiles. I think both sides have a chance.

Except it was struggling and failed to bring single guy.

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death4bunnies

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@death4bunnies:

Thinking about it a bit more, I nearly guarantee they hit the leviathans face

If killing Leviathans by simply attacking them in the face is so easy, then why didn't Tony do this?

The fact is, that Jarvis explicitly stated that nothing in Tony's arsenal could damage it.

Um......Tony did find a way to 'get around the armor'......have you ever heard of the story of Jonah and the whale?? Fact is the face isnt armored, and Tony has proven twice that leviathan armor >> leviathan flesh.

Loading Video...

Thinking about it a bit more, I nearly guarantee they hit the leviathans face

They are more than fast enough to plow into those Helicarriers, which are hardly fast themselves.

They are fairly slow, and the hellicarriers each carry at least 20 quinjets, and are loaded full of IRL anti aircraft weapons.

Assuming the rounds dont bust armor.

Why would they? Again, Tony's suit had nothing that could damage them. A Leviathan no sold both Tony's multi-missile attack, as well as his chobham-armour busting laser. There is no evidence that the Helicarriers have more firepower than that.

IIRC, the long range guns that HYDRA were going to use to eliminate their enemies were essentially just long range sniper guns designed to target regular humans, right? So why would they be able to kill Leviathans?

The only things we have ever seen bust Leviathan armour, were Thor's lightning, the "Rain Fire" barrage from Sanctuary 2 and Valkyrie's Asgardian sword, all of which are far superior to anything the Helicarriers can dish out.

Here is the thing, I think you didnt read my post at all.....these aren't the anti personnel bond range guns on the bottom of the hellicarrier, these are specifically armor piercings Anti Aircraft superguns... The Phalanx weapon system was made to fend off attacks from whole fleets off fighter jets, and its targeting system is good enough to effectively protect from missiles and mortars....its bullets are made to be effective against air crafters carriers armor. The Leviathan doesn't have the feats ii don't think to resists large armor perusing rounds.

Here is a cool video I just watched (just how powerful is a 20mm phalanx)

No way in heck is a 20mm gun busting Leviathan armour if Tony's chobham-busting laser couldn't.

If you equate energy durability to resistance to armor piercing rounds resistance then I don't know what to say.

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Rebake

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@death4bunnies: We also know that the computer controlled guns on the Helicarrier are mostly meant for sniping slower moving and unsuspecting targets. Not only that, but targets selected by the algorithm. They likely won't be sniping or targeting Leviathans in any vulnerable areas ASSUMING that the flesh isn't meant to be extra tough on the head. Their main means of attack is ramming and biting after all.The computers need information on Leviathans. Leviathans will likely survive long enough to unload troops and do some damage. I'm still not convinced the Helicarriers will easily bring down Leviathans. Concentrating fire on one at a time will leave them open to other Leviathans or ships.

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death4bunnies

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@rebake said:

@death4bunnies: We also know that the computer controlled guns on the Helicarrier are mostly meant for sniping slower moving and unsuspecting targets. Not only that, but targets selected by the algorithm. They likely won't be sniping or targeting Leviathans in any vulnerable areas ASSUMING that the flesh isn't meant to be extra tough on the head. Their main means of attack is ramming and biting after all.The computers need information on Leviathans. Leviathans will likely survive long enough to unload troops and do some damage. I'm still not convinced the Helicarriers will easily bring down Leviathans. Concentrating fire on one at a time will leave them open to other Leviathans or ships.

I think the flack cannons cant take care of most the ships, agree the leviathans the major problem.

Your right about the computer targeting....its not going to be like, "aim for the non armored areas"...

I think the Leviathans leading with their faces, and the Phalanx's crazy high rate of fire shreds some faces tho.

------------

May be a close battle than I originally though, but id still put my money on insight.

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Scipio123

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@nwname:

His most powerful weapon is officially the uni-beam.

By feats, the laser is more impressive. And the unibeam's most impressive feats (killing an Extremis soldier and destroying Bucky's arm) would certainly be replicated by the laser.

And that crazy laser was mark 6 only and one use only. We saw the power of his newer multi-use laser in A1 and it was weaker

Where did you get the idea that the Mark 7's laser was weaker? Simply because it didn't pierce the Leviathan armour?

Because that's a circular argument if so.

The Mark 7 is massively more powerful than the Mark 6, and so it wouldn't make any sense for it's laser to be weaker and there is no on-screen evidence to support this.

They did not use plasma cutters on the chariot iirc, only normal drills.

Ok, but my point still stands. Toomes explicitly states that their regular equipment can't cut through the Chitauri metal.

Friction cutters or something else was cutting Leviathan armors in the background.

We have no idea what tools they are using as it is too far away. And in any case, we should remember that that Leviathan had been smashed through the skull with Thor's lightning, so it's armour was likely heavily damaged and weakened.

A tie-in comic showed that Thor's lightning is capable of melting Leviathan armour to a liquid state:

No Caption Provided

And even if those were normal tools that they were using, then that would just be PIS. Do you honestly believe that a random salvaging group have tools that are more powerful than Iron Man's weaponry?

The bullets from the helicarrier are much larger than the 7.62s used so

IIRC, it was never stated what calibre the guns on the Helicarrier were. But I'm not sure there would be much need for them to be any bigger than 7.62mm. They were designed to target regular humans with pinpoint accuracy, after all.

Not to mention that even if they were freaking 50 cal., I still can't see them penetrating the armour on the Leviathan.

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Scipio123

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#47  Edited By Scipio123

@death4bunnies:

Um......Tony did find a way to 'get around the armor'......have you ever heard of the story of Jonah and the whale?? Fact is the face isnt armored, and Tony has proven twice that leviathan armor >> leviathan flesh.

How is this relevant here? Are the Helicarriers going to try and fly down the Leviathan's throat as well?

They are fairly slow, and the hellicarriers each carry at least 20 quinjets, and are loaded full of IRL anti aircraft weapons.

None of which will be able to kill the Leviathan before it smashes into the Helicarrier.

And what the heck are Quinjets going to do? Their miniguns couldn't even scratch pre-Vibranium Ultron and their missiles are pathetic.

these aren't the anti personnel bond range guns on the bottom of the hellicarrier, these are specifically armor piercings Anti Aircraft superguns

And there is no evidence that these "superguns" are more powerful than Iron Man's arsenal, which was completely incapable of damaging the Leviathan armour.

The Phalanx weapon system was made to fend off attacks from whole fleets off fighter jets, and its targeting system is good enough to effectively protect from missiles and mortars....its bullets are made to be effective against air crafters carriers armor.

I'd LOVE to see an aircraft carrier do this:

No Caption Provided

Tony's laser cut through chobham-armoured drones like they were made out of paper, and yet it couldn't even scratch the Leviathan's armour.

If you equate energy durability to resistance to armor piercing rounds resistance then I don't know what to say.

Tony has armour piercing weapons too, and yet he didn't use any of them against the Leviathan's armour, because he knew it was too tough.

He only used his tank missile on the Leviathan that Hulk punched because it's armour had fallen off and had exposed a weak spot.