Defenders. Matt and Danny are the co-MVP's. Luke is no slouch in skill, even if they are more skilled, and combined with his physicals and pain tolerance, he could pull his own weight in this fight. Jessica isn't really needed.
Luke gets stabbed by any of them and it's over. Jessica gets stabbed by any of them and it's over. Okoye can take either Mathew or Danny in a tough fight, then Ayo and everyone else gang up on the other.
Luke Cage has shown the ability to have wounds as grievous as an internal explosion in the abdomen, and was still fighting hard enough to rag doll humans when they specifically targeted his wounds. It’ll take more than one stab to down him, and with all the punishment he’s known for taking, it’s hard for me to understand how someone would believe one stab would do it.
I also notice that people don’t take into account the Dora Milaje wear Vibranium weave armor (which allowed Okoye to get ragdolled well over 50 feet by Killmonger’s kinetic energy blast and pretty much get up right afterwards).That said, Doras win slight more often than not with Okoye as MVP.
Defenders win. Iron Fist and Daredevil are the best fighters here. Luke Cage and Jessica Jones may lack high levels of skill, but make up for it with their strength and durability.
Luke and Jess get skewered the moment the fight starts. Matt or Danny ain't beating Okoye, and if they do, they ain't fighting a bunch of Doras at all. A team worse than this would have outright defeated Killmonger without the upgrades of the Panther suit. The Defenders can't hope to reach that level of efficiency.
Killmonger with a rocket launcher knocked down T'Challa, which is a better showing than the Dora the Explorers briefly restraining Killmonger. Honestly, T'Challa's biggest mistake is trusting Shuri's tech over American firearms. Let's just say that if he had been wearing an Iron Man suit, none of that BS that T'Challa and Shuri were conspiring would have worked. Unfortunately for the Dora Explorers, Danny Rand has finally stopped pretending to be an anime character and has learned the value of the 2nd amendment. Anyways, the Defenders make short work of the Doras, with Danny shooting anyone that even twitches a muscle towards Luke and Jessica. Matt then challenges T'Challa for kingship, and literally embarasses the guy by putting on a blindfolded. Rand Corp becomes a distributor of vibranium. Stark Industries buys vibranium, and then maybe the world can finally have smart people handling their most valuable resource. :)
Killmonger with a rocket launcher knocked down T'Challa, which is a better showing than the Dora the Explorers briefly restraining Killmonger. Honestly, T'Challa's biggest mistake is trusting Shuri's tech over American firearms. Let's just say that if he had been wearing an Iron Man suit, none of that BS that T'Challa and Shuri were conspiring would have worked. Unfortunately for the Dora Explorers, Danny Rand has finally stopped pretending to be an anime character and has learned the value of the 2nd amendment. Anyways, the Defenders make short work of the Doras, with Danny shooting anyone that even twitches a muscle towards Luke and Jessica. Matt then challenges T'Challa for kingship, and literally embarasses the guy by putting on a blindfolded. Rand Corp becomes a distributor of vibranium. Stark Industries buys vibranium, and then maybe the world can finally have smart people handling their most valuable resource. :)
Luke and Jess get skewered the moment the fight starts. Matt or Danny ain't beating Okoye, and if they do, they ain't fighting a bunch of Doras at all. A team worse than this would have outright defeated Killmonger without the upgrades of the Panther suit. The Defenders can't hope to reach that level of efficiency.
Luke and Jessica can fight Elektra (physically superior by a large margin to any Dora Miljae and vastly more skilled) so they aren't gonna struggle with these ladies. Luke tagged Bushmaster. Okoye has no advantages over Matt or Danny. Matt is better in every way, and Danny can legitimately bullet time meaning he won't be tagged at all. Why do you just ignore all their feats and act like Luke and Jess are slow and unskilled? And all Okoye has fought is fodder, show me one skilled human she has beaten.
And you do know that the Panther suit is part of Killmonger's abilities right? That's like saying Superman would die from bullets if he weren't bulletproof. Him being bulletproof is part of what's hard to beat him. Also, there is nothing to say Killmonger would have actually lost either way.
The only good feats the Dora Miljae have are from fighting one man in a group giving themselves a huge numbers advantage (they still lost anyway) and fighting aliens with no IQ points and a deathwish (Outriders literally run right into their deaths, not just against Dora MIljae but against Thor as well)
Jess propably dies but the rest of Defenders win handily.
Skillwise Matt and Danny trump Okoye and co, honestly the two of them are enough to win this. Cage was able to disarm Elektra so him getting killed by a random Dora Milaje is utterly laughable.
Luke and Jessica can fight Elektra (physically superior by a large margin to any Dora Miljae and vastly more skilled) so they aren't gonna struggle with these ladies. Luke tagged Bushmaster. Okoye has no advantages over Matt or Danny. Matt is better in every way, and Danny can legitimately bullet time meaning he won't be tagged at all. Why do you just ignore all their feats and act like Luke and Jess are slow and unskilled? And all Okoye has fought is fodder, show me one skilled human she has beaten.
Elektra was demolishing the entirety of the Defenders at once without her weapons in the finale. 1 on 1, she has legitimate stomped both Luke and Jessica. Fighting her is far from a good feat for them, and far from 2 street fighters with no real training beating warriors trained since birth that can fight off entire groups of savage beasts running at them from every direction, who also have an amazing reach and range advantage on both of them, which given their lack of formidable levels of skill they can't overcome.
Okoye has an unimaginable gear advantage over Matt. She wears vibranium weave (the same material T'Challa's suit is made of) waist up, so all his his hits might as well not land in her torso, chest etc. She also has a solid reach advantage over Matt, with a 5.5 feet long spear that can blast canons, electrify people (which will one shot Matt given he got knocked out by Fisk's old dude with a random taser) and cut through solid vibranium like butter.
The only way you can argue for Matt beating Okoye is if he manages to stay completely untagged by someone with an enormous reach advantage to him whilst landing a series of very direct hits on her face or her legs, which I simply do not see happening to someone stated by the second person in command in Marvel Studios in a canonical statement to be an unrivalled master martial artist in Wakanda, which basically implies she's also more skilled than T'Challa himself.
Danny is noticably below Matt in regards to fighting ability so this applies to him way more, and bullet timing is reaction speed, doesn't matter much in a melee encounter like this.
And you do know that the Panther suit is part of Killmonger's abilities right? That's like saying Superman would die from bullets if he weren't bulletproof. Him being bulletproof is part of what's hard to beat him. Also, there is nothing to say Killmonger would have actually lost either way.
The point is that we're discussing a melee fight here - the ranged abilities of the suit that Shuri upgraded in 2018 can be disregarded in this scenario because in a cut clean melee exchange, Okoye and 2 random Doras alone managed to incapacitate Killmonger in his suit and he would've absolutely lost that fight if it wasn't for the kinetic blast IMO. He was helpless and kneeling, they were about to take off his helmet and cut his head off.
Defenders. Seriously Luke Cage isn't a simple street fighter he's a trained boxer with Force Recon training and had the reactions and skills to maintain an upperhand against Bushmaster, someone with impressive skill/agility on top of having enhanced stats himself. Is Luke as technically skilled as the Dora Milaje, no, but he's skilled enough to the point where he could react/block the spears at the shaft and even tag one of them.
Danny and Matt are better than anyone on the opposing side and have the agility to effectively dodge the spears (not their first time fighting at a range disadvantage i.e. Bakuto,Elektra, and Nobu). Matt's billy club can also extend to attack people from a small distance so even he's not completely disadvantaged by the spears' range.
Jessica is the only black sheep in the group but even then I feel a little uneasy saying that she's useless as I think her lower showings are due to her holding back so she doesn't hurt people too badly. Morals on does limit her though so moot point I guess.
There was a scene I remembered where Black Panther was getting dogpiled by wakandans hitting him with vibranium weapons and none of them pierced his suit. So it's pretty clear by now that the piercing ability of vibranium is inconsistent, or at least dependent on the strength of its wielder. Meaning the Dora will never pierce Luke.
@sy8000: Lmao did you even watch the movie? T'Challa's suit is indestructible because it's pure vibranium. Nothing is getting through it, that's not an indicator that the fodder weren't strong enough, there is literally a plot point made in the film about this when the Black Panther suits needed to be destabilized in order to damage the user.
The only times vibranium has pierced vibranium was when it was Cap's shield which is unspecified amount of vibranium mixed with other metals and was cut by BP's pure claws, a car laced with weak layer of vibranium stabbed through with a pure spear, and vibranium weapons going through vibranium weave. Vibranium weave >>> Luke Cage skin.
Dora Milaje stomp tbh. They're all 5× more skilled than Luke or Jones and turn them into fodder. A random individual Dora can give Corvus Glaive trouble and plow through Outriders like mowing the grass
Lol at this, Dora aren't shit, all they did was beat Outriders lol.
Defenders stomp.
2 Dora Milaje shitstomp Matt lmao
The Dora stomp. Individually they can briefly exchange blows with skilled mid tiers and in small groups can eventually overwhelm them. (Corvus and Killmonger)
I already mentioned this feat, it's not great. Firstly the Outriders are mindless brutes, and it does help to have around 4 Feat of Extra Reach and a one shot weapon.
The Dora stomp. Individually they can briefly exchange blows with skilled mid tiers and in small groups can eventually overwhelm them. (Corvus and Killmonger)
It's funny how you cut out the part where they lose. The fight lasted around 5 seconds, Corvus stomped. Dora aren't really comparable.
Matt on the other hand has already fought opponents with superior reach like Black Sky, who is far superior in skill to anyone here.
Danny can disarm them with Chi punches like he did to Elektra's sword.
I already mentioned this feat, it's not great. Firstly the Outriders are mindless brutes, and it does help to have around 4 Feat of Extra Reach and a one shot weapon.
The Dora stomp. Individually they can briefly exchange blows with skilled mid tiers and in small groups can eventually overwhelm them. (Corvus and Killmonger)
It's funny how you cut out the part where they lose. The fight lasted around 5 seconds, Corvus stomped. Dora aren't really comparable.
Matt on the other hand has already fought opponents with superior reach like Black Sky, who is far superior in skill to anyone here.
Danny can disarm them with Chi punches like he did to Elektra's sword.
Still skill
It's funny how you can't read because I never said she won and I clearly said they could briefly hold their own with mid tiers like Corvus
Corvus Glaive would stomp Daredevil. Okoye would beat him in a decent fight
Elektra was demolishing the entirety of the Defenders at once without her weapons in the finale. 1 on 1, she has legitimate stomped both Luke and Jessica.
Jessica beat Elektra by throwing her into a wall in the finale. Jessica also has no super durable skin and yet she managed to not get cut by Elektra when she was fighting Luke and Jess with a SWORD in the restaurant fight scene. You are trying to make them out to be unskilled, slow brutes when they have shown they can fight high level fighters even with weapons
Fighting her is far from a good feat for them, and far from 2 street fighters
with no real training beating warriors trained since birth that can fight off entire groups of savage beasts
You don't need training when you are super strong and super durable. Savage beasts are just that. They have no intelligence and were beaten like the animals they were. Not comparable to fighting a human who won't just run into the edge of their spear.
running at them from every direction, who also have an amazing reach and range advantage on both of them, which given their lack of formidable levels of skill they can't overcome.
Why can't they just grab the spears and take it from them? Luke disarmed Elektra with her reach advantage. Yes, he did it by hitting the blade because he is durable, and if he tried that with vibranium if would cut him. But, only a small part of the spear is sharp and I see no reason he can't disarm them by grabbing that part if he did it to Elektra.
Okoye has an unimaginable gear advantage over Matt. She wears vibranium weave (the same material T'Challa's suit is made of) waist up, so all his his hits might as well not land in her torso, chest etc. She also has a solid reach advantage over Matt, with a 5.5 feet long spear that can blast canons, electrify people (which will one shot Matt given he got knocked out by Fisk's old dude with a random taser) and cut through solid vibranium like butter.
Okoye is inferior to Matt in every way. There is nothing to suggest she can tag him. There is nothing to suggest she can resist him taking the spear from her. A spear, one that can be disarmed or dodged, does not nullify all of Matt's advantages.
Leland tasered Matt when he had his season 1 black suit on. We don't know how electricity affects his new suit.
The only way you can argue for Matt beating Okoye is if he manages to stay completely untagged by someone with an enormous reach advantage to him
Yup and he will have no trouble with that given his speed, strength and skill advantages
whilst landing a series of very direct hits on her face or her legs
I don't agree but either way Matt can tag her in the face
, which I simply do not see happening to someone stated by the second person in command in Marvel Studios in a canonical statement to be an unrivalled master martial artist in Wakanda, which basically implies she's also more skilled than T'Challa himself.
Ok and Matt was stated to be the best fighter Stick had ever seen, and he is part of an ancient ninja cult specializing in martial arts. Elektra said the same about Matt and we know how good she is. Every good fighter has statements like these.
T'Challa's skill is nothing special himself, he got outskilled by Hawkeye considering Hawkeye had an advantage in their fight while having no physical advantages (meaning he had to be more skilled to do so).
Danny is noticably below Matt in regards to fighting ability
You must be talking about pure skill (because Danny is obviously far better with chi) and in that case what you said is true for everyone in the MCU, Dora Miljae included
so this applies to him way more, and bullet timing is reaction speed, doesn't matter much in a melee encounter like this.
It's part of the explanation that he is also better than Dora Miljae every way, surely his speed will help him dodge their attacks.
The point is that we're discussing a melee fight here - the ranged abilities of the suit that Shuri upgraded in 2018 can be disregarded in this scenario because in a cut clean melee exchange, Okoye and 2 random Doras alone managed to incapacitate Killmonger in his suit and he would've absolutely lost that fight if it wasn't for the kinetic blast IMO. He was helpless and kneeling, they were about to take off his helmet and cut his head off.
They used the electrical blasts in their staffs to get him down, so not it's not pure melee.
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