MCU Avengers Vs X-men 97

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joshua755

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Takes place In Upstate New York both teams going all out win by any means perfect Teamwork on both teams who wins

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EdisonLee2023

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Jean solos, no Avenger is immune to TP except for Vision and maybe Wanda

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EmmaFrostXmen

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jean and rogue carry their team to victory (mostly jean due to tp)

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Straight-Fire

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#4 Straight-Fire  Online

Star level Carol solos tf is this?

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SAR_Annihilator

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Galerion

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MCU easily

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PlatinumChalice

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#7  Edited By PlatinumChalice

Jean and Wanda clashes their TP while Carol make her way to solo.

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monkey_d_joe

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Magneto solos

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PimpKingMegasus

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X-men.

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SupremeGeneration

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They all have metal on them I think

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BigBaby

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#11  Edited By BigBaby
@emmafrostxmen said:

jean and rogue carry their team to victory (mostly jean due to tp)

How is Jean handling Wanda, Vision, or Carol? One literally negged telepaths entering her mind, and fought on the astral plane with a witch. The other is a literal robot, whereas Carol broke out of the Supreme Intelligence Control. And this is literally based on the fact that she barely even used TP offensively in the series. Carol, Wanda, or Thor could literally solo the team.

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BigBaby

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Star level Carol solos tf is this?

It's a literal mismatch in all conceivable ways lol.

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PimpKingMegasus

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X-men 97 is a continuation not a new series. They just get more feats. Jean has psi blasts feats that knock people out. Vision aside none of them have psi bolt/blast protection feats.

X-men

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KryptonianKing88

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TP isn’t an instant win against characters without TP. Jean (nor anyone on her team) really has no answer to Thor’s speed, or Wanda just erasing them from existence

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PimpKingMegasus

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Straight-Fire

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#16 Straight-Fire  Online

MCU team has too much firepower be fr guys. If you wanna talk about hax they have Wanda who can literally make the X-Men disappear any time she wants to.

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Soratoumiga

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Star level Carol stomps them. Wanda turns them into clowns. Thor beheads them. Take your pick, Avengers stomp any way.

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skywalker95

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MCU stomps. The only issue is Jean's telepathy, but she hardly uses it offensively.

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PimpKingMegasus

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X-men. Star level Carol doesn't fight at star level. It's not a thing. She isn't blowing up the planet and killing her team. Wanda is not going to be in the center of her hex to expand it to turn anything. Those are not battle applicable feats. Thor is getting trolled by Morphsilver the way Quicksilver did it.

X-men

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justneedhelp

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#20 justneedhelp  Online

Carol solos

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PimpKingMegasus

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Carol gets trapped in a cage in the mindscape like Jean did her in the early 90s

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Straight-Fire

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PimpKingMegasus

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😆😆

X-men

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Straight-Fire

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#24 Straight-Fire  Online

Would love to see Jean dropping seven powerhouses with TP LMAO. Is the rest of her team that useless to the point we're playing make-believe?

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PimpKingMegasus

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#25  Edited By PimpKingMegasus

@straight-fire: why can't she? Being physically strong doesn't give you tp protection, thus Juggernaut and Magneto wearing psi proof helmets. Without them they get dropped by tp, just like the Avengers minus the robot.

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BigBaby

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@soratoumiga said:

Star level Carol stomps them. Wanda turns them into clowns. Thor beheads them. Take your pick, Avengers stomp any way.

Or Wanda could TP them because the X-men showed no resistance to "mind control". Jean isn't exactly much faster or competent on the draw either based on her "consistency" ;)

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Straight-Fire

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#27 Straight-Fire  Online

@pimpkingmegasus: Wanda and Carol literally have TP resistance feats, and you acknowledge Jean can't harm Vision with TP so what's stopping him from taking Jean out?

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XD_ist

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What’s stopping Carol from blitzing and 1 shotting everyone here

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nassergrant19

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Star level Carol stomps them. Wanda turns them into clowns. Thor beheads them. Take your pick, Avengers stomp any way.

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PyroFN

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The MCU supporters need to calm down. It is not that serious.

OT: Either Carol or Thor speed-blitzes or they all get dropped by Jean and Magneto. Wanda has the hax to beat the X-Men, but her tp experience is not good enough to handle Jean who has been in multiple psychic battles. A good chunk of the entire team are vulnerable to magnetism. This would really depend on Carol and Thor immediately knowing which targets to take out first on the draw, since both Jean and Magneto have feats reacting to things like Apocalypse’s energy blasts and Sentinel beams.

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Soratoumiga

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@pimpkingmegasus: Wanda and Carol literally have TP resistance feats, and you acknowledge Jean can't harm Vision with TP so what's stopping him from taking Jean out?

Even if Jean is the most powerful one (debatable due to Storm), she can't drop seven of them at the same time, much less when you realise MCU team is leaps and bounds ahead of 97 in every department.

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Straight-Fire

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#32  Edited By Straight-Fire  Online

@pyrofn: This is a battle thread and we're stating our opinion. I don't see how we're taking things too seriously and ignoring the Pimp King guy literally spamming X-Men wins every other post.

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Straight-Fire

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#33 Straight-Fire  Online

@soratoumiga: Exactly. I asked him to show me Jean dropping MULTIPLE POWERHOUSES at the same time and he didn't because it's bullshit.

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PimpKingMegasus

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😒

X-men, still

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BBNakedSnake

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#35  Edited By BBNakedSnake

Carol, Thor, or Wanda can solo. Lol at Jean or Rogue doing anything here

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PimpKingMegasus

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They are defenseless to tp, even Wanda.

X-men

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BigBaby

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#37  Edited By BigBaby

@soratoumiga: Pretty sure Storm's confidently above Jean without Phoenix, and even if we pretend that Jean's miles ahead of her too, she has no feats on a TP level above Wanda passively mind-controlling an entire town, snapping telepaths in weaker variants while dream walking(when being nerfed), and busting through Agatha's control in the astral realm without knowing any magic:

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Alternatively, she can fight Jean in the astral realm, and then kill her in the physical realm since she can still control her physical body. Jean hasn't shown that level of skill in 97:

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LaserBeak1

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Carol with her star feat should solo. Wanda gets blitzed lol

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Soratoumiga

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@bigbaby: Her feat of controlling an entire town is more impressive since it has more minds than anything Jean ever did in 97. Not only that, she also rewrote their memories as well not just current mind state. Honestly, her being able to control her physical body while doing astral stuff alone is enough to solidify her soloing here.

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Enzvi

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#40 Enzvi  Online

Avengers.

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PyroFN

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@pyrofn: This is a battle thread and we're stating our opinion. I don't see how we're taking things too seriously and ignoring the Pimp King guy literally spamming X-Men wins every other post.

If I’m not correct, you said,

Star level Carol solos tf is this?

And you went back and forth with Pimp, so you did not help the situation by posting copium memes with BigBaby posting ‘consistency’ that holds no bearing beyond them just mocking the user.

As for Pimp, I have seen Raj do this kind of debating before where he posts multiple responses against different users and brought up with ET before. ET told me it was an acceptable form of debating, so I can’t really say anything about it. But, hey, I did say before that people had issue with this sort of posting, but they are the bosses at the end of the day.

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Straight-Fire

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#42  Edited By Straight-Fire  Online

@pyrofn:

If I’m not correct, you said,

Star level Carol solos tf is this?

How is that taking things too seriously? Nothing I said is against the rules nor did I mock anyone.

And you went back and forth with Pimp, so you did not help the situation by posting copium memes

I thought it was harmless. Are we not allowed to do stuff like that now?

As for Pimp, I have seen Raj do this kind of debating before where he posts multiple responses against different users and brought up with ET before. ET told me it was an acceptable form of debating, so I can’t really say anything about it.

I never said I had a problem with what Pimp was doing. I mentioned his tactics because you were quick to call out MCU supporters while ignoring what he's doing. If we're taking things too seriously, then so is he.

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PyroFN

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#43  Edited By PyroFN
@bigbaby said:

@soratoumiga: Pretty sure Storm's confidently above Jean without Phoenix, and even if we pretend that Jean's miles ahead of her too, she has no feats on a TP level above Wanda passively mind-controlling an entire town, snapping telepaths in weaker variants while dream walking(when being nerfed), and busting through Agatha's control in the astral realm without knowing any magic:

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Alternatively, she can fight Jean in the astral realm, and then kill her in the physical realm since she can still control her physical body. Jean hasn't shown that level of skill in 97:

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Controlling an entire town is a good power feat. It was also a very slow feat, so I can’t see it working in combat.

Xavier is featless in MoM, so not impressive, especially since she kills him by catching off-guard from behind.

Her Agatha feat is much better, but it doesn’t tell use anything we don’t already know. That Wanda is more powerful than Agatha. There was no skill to be shown about Wanda blasting through the binds of Agatha’s illusion.

Jean was also literally up and around in Goblin Queen’s illusion with barely any control over her powers, tired from an journey, and while having amnesia. She is more than capable of multitasking her powers in the mental and physical plane.

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PyroFN

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#44  Edited By PyroFN
@straight-fire said:

@pyrofn:

If I’m not correct, you said,

Star level Carol solos tf is this?

How is that taking things too seriously? Nothing I said is against the rules nor did I mock anyone.

And you went back and forth with Pimp, so you did not help the situation by posting copium memes

I thought it was harmless. Are we not allowed to do stuff like that now?

As for Pimp, I have seen Raj do this kind of debating before where he posts multiple responses against different users and brought up with ET before. ET told me it was an acceptable form of debating, so I can’t really say anything about it.

I never said I had a problem with what Pimp was doing. I mentioned his tactics because you were quick to call out MCU supportwrs while ignoring what he's doing. If we're taking things too seriously, then so is he.

1) It means you were getting quickly defensive over something minor to the point where you went to openly mocking them. There is no reason to resort to meme’ing on someone else’s opinion. Period.

I don’t agree with Pimp’s debating tactics personally, but I literally already went over why I can’t do anything about that.

2) Saying someone is huffing copium is harmless? I would say that is a quick way to piss someone off.

I made a comment that MCU fans need to calm down. I stand by that. Whether you or anyone else does is your prerogative.

3) There is a gap of difference between meme’ing on someone and persistently answering other people.

You’re basically asking me to call out Pimp in equal measure when I already told you I can’t. ET already told me the sort of debating tactics Pimp and Raj use are fine. I literally can’t say anything about it.

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AngelJax

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@bigbaby said:

@soratoumiga: Pretty sure Storm's confidently above Jean without Phoenix, and even if we pretend that Jean's miles ahead of her too, she has no feats on a TP level above Wanda passively mind-controlling an entire town, snapping telepaths in weaker variants while dream walking(when being nerfed), and busting through Agatha's control in the astral realm without knowing any magic:

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Alternatively, she can fight Jean in the astral realm, and then kill her in the physical realm since she can still control her physical body. Jean hasn't shown that level of skill in 97:

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Wanda’s no scrub in the Telepathy department. I know it subdued from CW-IW, but she’s always been a capable TP. Wanda has also shown the capability to manipulate/dispel those under influence over the Mind Stone and read the thoughts of Ultron who shouldn’t even be able to have thoughts to sense. WV/MoM gave her, her best (TP but in general) feats as of yet. Being able to defeat telepaths more experienced than her in Agatha and an alternate Charles Xavier. She can at least hold Jean off in a mindscape battle with the superior and more potent power set to boot.

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AngelJax

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#46  Edited By AngelJax

Dont get me wrong I love that Jean’s finally getting some support around here but I think she’s being highly oversold for this fight. Vision can’t be affected by her TP. Wanda can combat her on the astral plane, and can break her teammates out of her telepathic hold, given at her least powerful she was able to casually release Helen Choi from the Mind Stone’s control. Furthermore, if simple metal helmets can block TP, doesn’t that mean Tony and Rhodey would be safe? There’s just too many factors to say Jean is carrying with TP, especially when it’s not usually a power she leads with offensively. No mutant here can take Thor, Vision, Carol or Wanda.

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BigBaby

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#47  Edited By BigBaby

@pyrofn:

Controlling an entire town is a good power feat. It was also a very slow feat, so I can’t see it working in combat.

Her controlling Westview in WandaVision, and erasing Eastview's memories passively, without even knowing, took immediate effect. I'm not talking about the Sokovia feat. I'm talking about the feats that happened in WandaVision, which Jean unfortunately can't compete with as what Wanda performed is much more complex than anything Jean performed.

Jean has nothing against mind-controlling an entire town passively and rewriting the memories of an entirely different town subconsciously.

Xavier is featless in MoM,

So is Madelyne Pryor who didn't do anything notable in 97 other than cast an illusion on the X-men. Something even AOU Wanda did to an even more impressive roaster containing Thor, so drop the double standards. It was a weaker variant of Wanda that killed him regardless.

so not impressive, especially since she kills him by catching off-guard from behind.

Xavier was not caught off guard. He engaged first before she could fully call upon her powers when looking for Chavez. His hand is raised in the 0.03 mark and Wanda's watching before realizing he's about to attack her. Xavier knew he was in battle despite having the advantage while Wanda was momentarily caught off guard. And he ultimately did realize that she was coming at the 1.24 mark(we see him stop pulling 838 Wanda and get scared with realization), but didn't do anything. Again, this is literally a weaker variant of Wanda arguably scaling at AOU

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Her Agatha feat is much better, but it doesn’t tell use anything we don’t already know. That Wanda is more powerful than Agatha. There was no skill to be shown about Wanda blasting through the binds of Agatha’s illusion.

Wanda's insanely more powerful than Jean so if she can replicate the feat against Agatha, she can do it against Jean without a doubt.

Jean was also literally up and around in Goblin Queen’s illusion. She is more than capable of multitasking her powers in the mental and physical plane.

No, she was not. That was Jean's physical body, not her astral form. We later see Scott catch her body, and then once she faints, the team is with her while she's in bed. When she later engages Madelye with her astral form, her physical body isn't shown to be active at all. Wanda can maintain consciousness while astral projecting, so Jean is getting killed even if she decides to fight Wanda on the astral plane, whether she likes it or not.

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BigBaby

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#48  Edited By BigBaby

@angeljax: The feat that shows her breaking Helen from the mind-stone solidifies how useless telepathy will be in these scenarios, ignoring that Jean doesn't even use it offensively at all. From my honest perspective, I don't see Jean's telepathy coming close comparatively to Wanda's provided that she's affected thousands of minds without even knowing, prior to MOM's release. I see Jean getting negged by Wanda if she even thinks of approaching the mental route as its been clearly established that those types of attacks don't work on her. Additionally, if they fight in the astral realm, Wanda still has control over her physical body, so Jean's dead no matter how many ways we cut the bread. This is ignoring Thor and Carol too.

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PyroFN

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@bigbaby: 1) “Her controlling Westview in WandaVision, and erasing Eastview's memories passively, without even knowing, took immediate effect

No, it didn’t. It took effect once everyone was in the Hex, which took time to travel. Much faster than the Sokovia feat, granted, but it still took time.

I already acknowledged the previous feat as a good power feat. This is no different.

2) “So is Madelyne Pryor who didn't do anything notable in 97 other than cast an illusion on the X-men

If I’m not correct, she might have also been the one who fought Shadow King, though it’s hard to say who did what with them never answering when Jean was switched. Not to mention Madelyne has Jean’s memories anyways, so she would fundamentally have the same level of training Jean does

All that is to say, Jean would be scaling against a character who is fundamentally as strong as she is and still managing to succeed in freeing them. That’s an impressive amount of skill.

3) “Xavier was not caught off guard. He engaged first before she could fully call upon her powers when looking for Chavez

Engaging first does not mean he can’t be caught off-guard. The mind is not a simple place and Wanda did not engage him in combat immediately. He saw alt Wanda trapped, so his focus is on her. Not 616 Wanda.

4) “Wanda's insanely more powerful than Jean so if she can replicate the feat against Agatha

I don’t doubt that. But having an answer for one telepathic maneuver does not mean she has answer for all of them.

That would be like me saying I can perform surgery because I know how to perform first aid.

5) “No, she was not. That was Jean's physical body, not her astral form

That is not a refute. The illusion is happening in the minds of the X-Men. Jean is in their minds while moving her body physically which directly debunks your claim that Jean is completely incapable of moving her body when astral projecting.

Retorting Jean’s body was not moving when she engaged Madelyne is not correct.

First, we don’t see Jean’s body after she astral projects to say she was not moving. Second, Madelyne is not in the same household, so it would require more concentration to project to that distance for Jean than it would if she were in the same room.

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BigBaby

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#50  Edited By BigBaby

@pyrofn:

No, it didn’t. It took effect once everyone was in the Hex, which took time to travel. Much faster than the Sokovia feat, granted, but it still took time.

The people in Eastview were outside the hex and their memories were rewritten with no idea Westview existed. It's not just a matter of the hex. Some of what she did there was completely isolated from the hex. And the mind-control she did through the hex took mere seconds. You argued that what she did was a very "slow" feat. It took Wanda seconds to warp the entire town within the blast radius just by slightly moving. This is not the definition of something slow in effect, and it's not something Jean will outmaneuver.

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And current Wanda doesn't need to manifest a tangible hex to affect people, so whether you argue that she needs a hex to do it or not, Multiverse of Madness shows that the hex doesn't need to touch them to warp them. Hence, Strange sees no physical hex despite Wanda having warped reality before his arrival. Now we're talking about the time it takes Wanda to warp an entire town, but Jean is only one person, so imagine how much time that would take, and how much power would be focused on her. She isn't surviving a concentrated assault on that level.

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I already acknowledged the previous feat as a good power feat. This is no different.

Jean doesn't have anything on that level, so we agree Wanda's scope in telepathy is greater.

Engaging first does not mean he can’t be caught off-guard.

And as I posted previously, Xavier realized that Wanda approached him from behind even before she killed him and didn't do anything because he couldn't. Again, this is also neutralized by Xavier catching Wanda off-guard first. Wanda was literally looking at Chavez when he started delving into her mind. This is in addition to 838 being a weaker version than main Wanda.

If I’m not correct, she might have also been the one who fought Shadow King, though it’s hard to say who did what with them never answering when Jean was switched. Not to mention Madelyne has Jean’s memories anyways, so she would fundamentally have the same level of training Jean does

We don't know when they switched so we can't attribute the Shadow King feat as you pointed out. I agree that Madelyne scales to Jean, but the point is that Jean's best feat is fighting against Madelyne, and Jean is pretty featless in feats otherwise. She has no offensive feats other than fighting Madelyne who also happens to be featless too. So why is it considered impressive that she fought someone as strong as her when current Jean is pretty much "featless" too? Therefore, this feat is just as much invalidated as you wanted to say about " featless Xavier".

I don’t doubt that. But having an answer for one telepathic maneuver does not mean she has answer for all of them.

Jean's only telepathic maneuver thus far is engaging someone in the astral plane. Something that Wanda casually broke out of. Until she gets other "telepathic maneuvers" she's not beating Wanda by fighting her in the astral plane when Wanda can just use her physical body to also beat up Jean while she engages her mentally.

First, we don’t see Jean’s body after she astral projects to say she was not moving.

And neither is that evidence to say it was moving either, though.

That is not a refute. The illusion is happening in the minds of the X-Men. Jean is in their minds while moving her body physically which directly debunks your claim that Jean is completely incapable of moving her body when astral projecting.

That's assuming Jean herself isn't in the illusion. Nowhere was it shown in 97 that Jean entered their minds at all, and if she did enter their minds, why were all of them in the same illusion? Even if I did agree with this logic that suggests Jean's physical body moves with her astral form, Wanda can summon two distinct bodies in the astral plan that would beat Jean to a pulp.

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