Marvel VS DC (High Tier)

DC take this

Fate MVP Dc wins

Enchantress and mephisto aren't meant for brawls like this and dormammu can't carry the team

@banecapital IMO hela would be a better pick than enchantress

Dc Team Wins

mephisto solos Apocalypse would solo if not for fate

@melkorisbeatmod: Dormammu is not a part of the fight.

Fate can solo.

@banecapital: sorry I got apocalypse and him mixed up

Team Marvel unless "Classic Fate".

If not classic Fate, then Marvel with Mephisto as MVP.

Team Marvel. Lol at Apocalypse solo'ing.

marvel

@rampagethefirst: @comic_book_fan: @soratoumiga: Neither Mephisto, Apocalypse or Doctor Fate can solo. Mephisto is slightly more powerful than Doctor Fate, Apocalypse is slightly more powerful than Martian Manhunter, Black Racer is slightly more powerful than Unstoppable Colossus and Big Barda is slightly more powerful than Enchantress. But Martian Manhunter and Black Racer have a speed advantage over Apocalypse and Unstoppable Colossus, respectively, just like Mephisto and Enchantress have a versatility advantage over Doctor Fate and Big Barda, respectively, while all the aforementioned advantages are compensated with a disadvantage in strength, durability and fighting skills.

@banecapital: When did I say they can solo? are you actually incapable of reading? holy shit don't tag me if you can't read.

DC.

Fate is definitely the MVP.

Team DC stomps.

Has the Black Racer's stock fallen that much?

fate and flash body the marvel team.

DC win this

@rampagethefirst: I tagged you because you commented on Apocalypse soloing being a ridiculous idea. And my comment was about no one being able to solo. So I didn't disagree with you and you should not have a problem being tagged.

@banecapital: Why would you tag me the 2nd time just to reiterate the same thing?

DC team.

@omnipotent94: @smokernaruto: @standardized: @estronath: @nitelite: @soratoumiga:@emmafrostxmen: @flashgreatersigneveryone: @xegod: So many comments over DC stomping but then votes are indicating otherwise.

tbh heres how this i think the fight goes

Mephisto < Dr Fate

Colossus < Barda

Apocalypse > Black Racer

Enchantress > Martian Manhunter

Apocalypse > Barda and i think that would end quickly so enchantress can hold off fate

Apocalypse and Enchantress > Fate

@melkorisbeatmod: No Doctor Fate does not beat Mephisto and Black Racer kills Apocalypse just like he killed Darkseid who is similar to Apocalypse but more powerful. Enchantress does not beat Martian Manhunter as she is severely lacking against him in strength, speed and durability. Apocalypse and Enchantress are very powerful but they could only prevail in cooperation with other characters and therefore it's unfair to split a team battle in multiple solo ones as synergy is supposed to make the real difference and define the outcome. Enchantress could severely weaken both Doctor Fate and Black Racer, who are much more powerful than Big Barda and clearly superior to Martian Manhunter but Enchantress would need aid from Colossus to finish off Doctor Fate and Black Racer. If it weren't for Apocalypse's telepathy, Black Racer would be too fast for Marvel team and he would easily solostomp but Apocalypse could predict Black Racer's moves in order to aid Mephisto accomplish the otherwise impossible feat of catching Black Racer while moving in ridiculously faster than light speed. And Big Barda would easily be overwhelmed by the incomprehensible strength of Colossus but without Apocalypse's telepathy to counter Martian Manhunter's, Big Barda would be able to crush Enchantress and Mephisto with her incredibly destructive melee combat prowess before they could utilise their magical skills needed for fighting Doctor Fate.

@banecapital: if you already know the answer why post the thread?

@melkorisbeatmod: I didn't say which team should win but since almost everyone claims that DC wins because Doctor Fate is too powerful, I needed to explain that Mephisto is superior to Doctor Fate but Black Racer can beat Apocalypse and Martian Manhunter can beat Enchantress if not for teamwork which should always be considered the most important factor in a team battle like this, although I've got the impression that it's neglected too many times for me to read comments splitting team battles into multiple solo ones without getting pissed off. Also Unstoppable Colossus can crush any individual member of DC team even if a combo of Martian Manhunter and Doctor Fate can easily curbstomp him. So because of Mephisto, Black Racer is the real trouble of Marvel and not Doctor Fate. Apocalypse is very similar to Martian Manhunter in both their specific abilities and their overall power level but Apocalypse's telepathy is the only thing to counter Black Racer's overwhelming speed advantage.

DC wins. Fate is MVP.

Fate takes the win for the team, current or golden doesn't matter.

I only needed to see one name to vote DC

Fate

@zane240: @jamespacker: @arqe: @bdelloidgrain2: @omnipotent94: @smokernaruto: @standardized: @tifalockhart: @estronath: @nitelite: @supermanthor: @emmafrostxmen: @flashgreatersigneveryone: @xegod: I'm counting that 14 out of 19 people (73.68 %) on the comments are saying that DC team wins, and half of them say that Doctor Fate is the reason Marvel loses.

@banecapital: why did you tag us for that? Anyways You didn't need to count. You could have just looked at the polls. It already tells you that 74% people voted for team DC.

@banecapital: And you are not happy because ?

@jamespacker: @arqe: @omnipotent94: I think the votes used to be over 40 % for Marvel and I feel embarassed when so many people say that DC wins but do not explain how this is the case. I believed that the Unstoppable Colossus is more powerful than Juggernaut but a Model Prime Iron Man & Unstoppable Colossus VS Thor & Magneto thread was locked because of being considered a mismatch. And how could Doctor Fate beat Mephisto? Apocalypse may be defeated by Doctor Fate because of the former being established as a jobber and the latter being overrated and buffed by PIS but is there anything where Mephisto isn't outperforming Doctor Fate?

@banecapital: Even if you don't think fate would beat mephisto (although he would) Collosus and apocalypse would be one shotted by black racer and enchantress would lose to MMH. In end it would come down to mephisto vs team DC and he isn't beating the entire team.

@banecapital: Firstly, how are we supposed to know you want an explanation. If you wanted explanation could've simply demanded it. Secondly, I'm not sure what makes you believe Mephisto is superior to Fate. He isn't beating fate especially when the fight takes place outside of his realm. Fate could literally fodderize 3/4 of the team with ease and beat Mephisto with low difficulty, let alone the black racer. Lol, I'm not sure why you included Enchantress, Colossus, Apocalypse and Big Barda in this battle, they are obviously non-factors here.

@banecapital: when fate has his helmet on he essentially becomes Nabu who's a god and a god will defeat Mephisto outside of his own realm especially when Mephisto can be bested by Dr. Strange who is foderized by Dr. Fate

@melkorisbeatmod: @estronath: @omnipotent94: It's obvious that someone's belief that either DC or Marvel wins is expressed by voting rather than writing a comment. Comments are meant for explaining why the outcome of a fight is something specific instead of anything else and that's too obvious for me to demand it. And I'm obviously not involving Nabu in the battle or his name would replace Doctor Fate's just like I'm specifically stating that Mephisto is outside his own realm. But I think that Doctor Fate is much weaker than anyone who can fight Mephisto in his own realm and even if Nabu can even defeat Mephisto in his own realm, Doctor Fate without Nabu is weakened on a greater degree that Mephisto is when outside his own realm and when I'm saying high tier I'm obviously not referring to god tier which is above Big Barda's, Martian Manhunter's and Apocalypse's. But Black Racer is the most unfair factor against Marvel and might be able to solo Mephisto if not for Apocalypse's telepathy helping the Marvel team overcome its severe disadvantage in speed against Black Racer, who's almost a tier above anyone else, including Doctor Fate without Nabu and Mephisto without his realm where he's undeniably recognised as a god, since he's not the true Satan even if he's established as such.

Black racer should solo the marvel team given he was able to bring death to darkseid's true form.

@banecapital:

It's obvious that someone's belief that either DC or Marvel wins is expressed by voting rather than writing a comment. Comments are meant for explaining why the outcome of a fight is something specific instead of anything else and that's too obvious for me to demand it.

Not everyone has the time/energy to explain and argue. Why bother explaining something when it's clearly a mismatch?

But I think that Doctor Fate is much weaker than anyone who can fight Mephisto in his own realm and even if Nabu can even defeat Mephisto in his own realm, Doctor Fate without Nabu is weakened on a greater degree that Mephisto is when outside his own realm and when I'm saying high tier I'm obviously not referring to god tier which is above Big Barda's, Martian Manhunter's and Apocalypse's.

Not sure what you're trying to imply here. But based on what I understood of your sentences, I disagree with you. Dr. Fate has consistently gone toe to toe with Modru who's at least universal in terms of power and Fate should be comparable to him. Not to mention, Mephisto has been struggling with Thor in his own realm. Heck, even child Franklin Richards has beaten him twice in his realm.

I'm not familiar with how the tiering system works here, not sure what high or god-tier is. Nonetheless, it's a mismatch.

I think you're underestimating Nabu. Nabu has put up a good fight with an Unbound Spectre who has previously slain the entire Lords of Order and Chaos during Days of Vengeance and absorbed their powers. IIRC Nabu himself stated that he was the strongest Lord of order. Via scaling and feats, one can argue one member of the Lords Of Order is at least Universal+.

But Black Racer is the most unfair factor against Marvel and might be able to solo Mephisto if not for Apocalypse's telepathy helping the Marvel team overcome its severe disadvantage in speed against Black Racer, who's almost a tier above anyone else, including Doctor Fate without Nabu and Mephisto without his realm where he's undeniably recognised as a god, since he's not the true Satan even if he's established as such.

Telepathy won't help Apocalypse especially against an avatar of death. We're talking about a "being" who is arguably as fast as the flash and has toyed with beings like PC Lightray and Superman. The Black racer has also killed Darkseid Twice, so he can definitely solo the entire team.

@estronath: Gorilla Grodd is only slightly above Batman's level and Flash who's just below Superman and Wonder Woman had a hard time fighting Gorilla Grodd, who is primarily based in telepathy. Franklin Richards was so powerful that Onslaught coveted his powers, even if he could easily stomp Doctor Strange, Thor and many other Avengers so with Doctor Fate being comparable to Doctor Strange and Martian Manhunter and Big Barda being comparable to Thor, Franklin Richards is an awful example to prove that Mephisto is defeated by Doctor Fate. And you're saying that I'm underestimating Nabu even if I'm specifically stating that he's not allowed to take part in the fight, especially since it's happening outside the DC Multiverse. And yeah lock this thread if it's a mismatch. Doctor Fate is overrated just like Dragon Ball characters who are not allowed to battle Marvel and DC superheroes according to official comicvine rules.

@banecapital: I'll just keep this short. You're literally lowballing Grodd here. He isn't just a telepath who is "only slightly" above Batman's level, he's actually a super gorilla who is multiple tiers above Batman. You just can't compare The Black Racer to Superman and Wonder Woman, The black racer is above their league and has easily killed threats that even the Justice League and the new gods fear. I was just making a point that Mephisto isn't as strong as you think. Franklin as a child could barely utilize his powers to the fullest potential and yet he was able to defeat Mephisto not once but twice. The Nabu part, I'll give it to you since I misunderstood what you typed. FYI locking threads isn't my job and I'm not sure why you mentioned a Comicvine rule that is irrelevant to our discussion.

@estronath: Let's stop prattling about irrelevant things and be specific. Don't you think Black Racer can harm the Unstoppable Colossus even if the latter's greatest ability is his durability which is a result of being the most favored avatar of Cyttorak, a god who I believe is more powerful than Mephisto or any god that Black Racer can easily stomp like Darkseid? Don't you think that Gorilla Grodd is much weaker than Flash and the former wouldn't be able to fight evenly without exploiting the latter's apparent weakness in telepathy. Don't you think that Apocalypse is as superior to Gorilla Grodd as Black Racer is to base Flash, thus able to use telepathy to avoid being at the same disadvantageous position as the otherwise superior Darkseid was? Don't you think that Mephisto's fight with Doctor Fate will become a lot easier thanks to Enchantress, thus allowing both Mephisto and Enchantress to easily beat Doctor Fate and weaken Martian Manhunter to a point that will prevent him from countering Apocalypse's telepathy with his own to protect Black Racer from Unstoppable Colossus that will be able to catch a much faster being when aided by unhampered telepathy? Don't you think that Big Barda, despite being much weaker than the rest of the characters of this team battle, is actually much important and DC's only hope as her top-notch combat skills alongside strength and speed not much inferior to Martian Manhunter's are vital in stopping the extremely dangerous magic that results from teamwork between Mephisto and Enchantress, two of the greatest sorcerors in Marvel?

DC loses.

@banecapital:

Don't you think Black Racer can harm the Unstoppable Colossus even if the latter's greatest ability is his durability which is a result of being the most favored avatar of Cyttorak, a god who I believe is more powerful than Mephisto or any god that Black Racer can easily stomp like Darkseid?

The Black racer can definitely kill him and the rest of the team with a fatal touch. Being an avatar of Cyttorak=/= Cyttorak in terms of power. I agree with you that Cyttorak is more powerful than Mephisto, but I highly doubt he is superior to Darkseid's true form that was threatening the entire multiverse and IIRC he almost destroyed the Orrey of worlds while weakened.

Don't you think that Gorilla Grodd is much weaker than Flash and the former wouldn't be able to fight evenly without exploiting the latter's apparent weakness in telepathy. Don't you think that Apocalypse is as superior to Gorilla Grodd as Black Racer is to base Flash, thus able to use telepathy to avoid being at the same disadvantageous position as the otherwise superior Darkseid was?

I wouldn't say he's much weaker, but he surely isn't stronger. I mean, Grodd has some impressive durability feats like tanking punches from Wally West and Wonder Woman, so he's definitely a force to be reckoned with. Nevertheless, IIRC Grodd has never shown to be able to successfully telepathically attack The Flash when he's moving at light speed. Apocalypse might be superior to Grood, telepathy wise I'm not sure. Telepathy won't help the opposing team when the speed gap is huge and I doubt they can react to The Black Racer who's MFTL and can kill with a touch.

As I said, you just can't compare nor base on The Black Racer as The Flash, because they are two separate entities and Racer has way impressive feats and hax compared to The Flash. Not sure why you compare racer to him when the only thing they have in common is the ability to move MFTL.

Additionally, Black Racer can bypass durability so I'm not sure how the opposing team is going to deal with that. And what is the opposing team supposed to do to put down the Black Racer who is literally the avatar of death?

I'd also like to add that Martian Manhunter's telepathy is far superior to Apocalypse's Telepathy based on stuff I've read. So Martian Manhunter could make a telepathic defense on his teammates to counter Apcoalypse's telepathic ability.

Don't you think that Mephisto's fight with Doctor Fate will become a lot easier thanks to Enchantress, thus allowing both Mephisto and Enchantress to easily beat Doctor Fate and weaken Martian Manhunter to a point that will prevent him from countering Apocalypse's telepathy with his own to protect Black Racer from Unstoppable Colossus that will be able to catch a much faster being when aided by unhampered telepathy?

Nope, Adding her into the mix won't change the outcome. She's practically fodder compared to them and there are many ways Fate can put her down i.e BFR and speed blitz. The way you propose the hypothetical scenario is like "Martian Manhunter and the rest of the team will just stay still and do nothing while letting Dr. Fate get beaten up by Mephisto and Enchantress". Even if Enchantress team-ups with Mephisto, the rest of the opposing team would be outnumbered by Black racer, MMH, etc. I'm pretty sure that Black racer alone can single-handedly kill them due to his speed and death hax before Mephisto and Enchantress can even put down Fate.

Don't you think that Big Barda, despite being much weaker than the rest of the characters of this team battle, is actually much important and DC's only hope as her top-notch combat skills alongside strength and speed not much inferior to Martian Manhunter's are vital in stopping the extremely dangerous magic that results from teamwork between Mephisto and Enchantress, two of the greatest sorcerors in Marvel?

Nope. Barda might be a more skilled combatant than Martian Manhunter, but she doesn't have the hax and speed on the level as Martian Manhunter. Combat skills won't be a factor when hax come into play.

This will be my last post. I'm not going to continue this, because you and I have better things to do than argue back and forth around each other.