Marvel Female Heroes Championship : RO16 - Captain Marvel vs Invisible Woman

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marvelfan1992

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Poll Marvel Female Heroes Championship : RO16 - Captain Marvel vs Invisible Woman (29 votes)

Captain Marvel 21%
Invisible Woman 79%

Marvel Female Heroes Championship - Round of 16 match 3 (matchups were made via random team generator )

Captain Marvel vs Invisible Woman

Rules:

No Binary form

No internal attacks

No BFR

Morals on but going all out

Location: Opposite ends of the Washington Monument. The city is empty

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Youk66

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Sue not only more powerful but also a better written character ( for me atleast )

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geekryan

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Without Binary, Sue wins

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comic_book_fan

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sue solid win

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EcstaticGrace

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What’s Sue’s speed like?

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Cruelrain

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#6 Cruelrain  Online

Even with Binary, Sue will still wins

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geekryan

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What’s Sue’s speed like?

She has reacted to Quicksilver, Human Torch, Wolverine, bullets, explosions, etc. and her powers function at the speed of thought.

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EcstaticGrace

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@geekryan said:
@ecstaticgrace said:

What’s Sue’s speed like?

She has reacted to Quicksilver, Human Torch, Wolverine, bullets, explosions, etc. and her powers function at the speed of thought.

That probably seals it on speed.

Carol has a showing where it said she beats a training course pretty fast but the only person to do it faster being QS.

Without internal attacks how does Sue beat Carol though?

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EcstaticGrace

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comic_book_fan

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@ecstaticgrace: she can pin her to the ground or lace her own body with her force field to increase her speed and strength

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EcstaticGrace

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@comic_book_fan: What has she actually done with her forcefield to actually turn that to a victory against Carol though?

Her best offensive feats without internals seems like pushing people away

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geekryan

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@ecstaticgrace: It says no BFR so KO/incap are on the table then.

From when I represented Sue in a tournament:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3Gallery image 4Gallery image 5Gallery image 6Gallery image 7Gallery image 8Gallery image 9

1) Sends Juggernaut flying backwards ***Note: Also casually shielding herself from Thing & Human Torch***

2) Sends Hulk flying backwards

3) Knocks Namor down to the floor

4) Shockwave that sends a group of Avengers back (includes Thor, Hulk, Iron Man, Luke Cage, etc.)

5) Incaps a group of Avengers, which included Hulk, She-Hulk, Captain Marvel, etc.

6) Owning Luke Cage & Iron Man

7) Owning Dr Doom

8-9) Solos a group consisting of some huge heavy-hitters like She-Hulk, Thing, Absorbing Man, and Titania

And to finish this off, a few more impressive feats:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3Gallery image 4

1) Traps both Hulk and Thing in force fields ***Note: Hulk even acknowledges he is trapped***

2) Force field around Mjolnir and sends Thor flying off

3) Threatens to kill an amped Thing

4) Tanks punches from World War Hulk

Her force fields are also strong enough to hurt and knock down Doom the Annihilating Conqueror. This is an alternate universe Dr Doom with the combined powers of Kang the Conqueror and Annihilus:

No Caption Provided

If all of this isn't enough to convince you, I can show a lot more.

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Cruelrain

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#13 Cruelrain  Online

@ecstaticgrace: Sue had stomped a team consisting of She-Hulk, Titania, Thing and Absorbing Man without internal hax

Carol can't break her shields and her durability ins't greater than Thing

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EcstaticGrace

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#14  Edited By EcstaticGrace

@geekryan said:

@ecstaticgrace: It says no BFR so KO/incap are on the table then.

From when I represented Sue in a tournament:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3Gallery image 4Gallery image 5Gallery image 6Gallery image 7Gallery image 8Gallery image 9

1) Sends Juggernaut flying backwards ***Note: Also casually shielding herself from Thing & Human Torch***

2) Sends Hulk flying backwards

3) Knocks Namor down to the floor

4) Shockwave that sends a group of Avengers back (includes Thor, Hulk, Iron Man, Luke Cage, etc.)

5) Incaps a group of Avengers, which included Hulk, She-Hulk, Captain Marvel, etc.

6) Owning Luke Cage & Iron Man

7) Owning Dr Doom

8-9) Solos a group consisting of some huge heavy-hitters like She-Hulk, Thing, Absorbing Man, and Titania

And to finish this off, a few more impressive feats:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3Gallery image 4

1) Traps both Hulk and Thing in force fields ***Note: Hulk even acknowledges he is trapped***

2) Force field around Mjolnir and sends Thor flying off

3) Threatens to kill an amped Thing

4) Tanks punches from World War Hulk

Her force fields are also strong enough to hurt and knock down Doom the Annihilating Conqueror. This is an alternate universe Dr Doom with the combined powers of Kang the Conqueror and Annihilus:

No Caption Provided

If all of this isn't enough to convince you, I can show a lot more.

A lot of those scans don’t involve characters trying to break out of her shield.

Hulk didn’t get sent flying on your 4th point I saw the full scan on Reddit. The only notable character that got pushed in that instance are Cage and Ironman and pushing someone back doesn’t constitute a victory

Knocking someone down isn’t KOing them if Incap is a win scenario I could see Sue doing that but off her respect thread limitations I could also see her tiring out trying to restraining Carol for a long period of time. No Binary might make it take long if it’s even possible

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EcstaticGrace

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@ecstaticgrace: Sue had stomped a team consisting of She-Hulk, Titania, Thing and Absorbing Man without internal hax

Carol can't break her shields and her durability ins't greater than Thing

I’d argue her offensive output at the very least is but that’s in Binary. I don’t see any instances of her shields taking repeated poundings and holding and even without Binary. Carol has feats in base of destroying 300m meteors.

So id argue there’s a possibility of tiring due out that way

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geekryan

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@ecstaticgrace: If you are basing Sue solely on her RT, then that's hardly fair. If I do the same for Carol's RT, it wouldn't look good for her either.

Sue's shields can take all of Carol's attacks, while Sue can continually smash Carol with force field constructs. Eventually Carol will go down. If incap is allowed, it's as easy as trapping Carol in a bubble. If incap isn't allowed, it will be a longer fight, but Sue would still win.

This also doesn't take into consideration Sue being able to go invisible. Although, I am not too familiar with what Carol can or can't do to counter invisibility.

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EcstaticGrace

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@geekryan said:

@ecstaticgrace: If you are basing Sue solely on her RT, then that's hardly fair. If I do the same for Carol's RT, it wouldn't look good for her either.

Sue's shields can take all of Carol's attacks, while Sue can continually smash Carol with force field constructs. Eventually Carol will go down. If incap is allowed, it's as easy as trapping Carol in a bubble. If incap isn't allowed, it will be a longer fight, but Sue would still win.

This also doesn't take into consideration Sue being able to go invisible. Although, I am not too familiar with what Carol can or can't do to counter invisibility.

I mean most of the stuff you posted are on her RT just some of it more full images.

I don’t see Sue’s shields withstanding energy output capable of destabilizing a planet, destroying an inhuman city that’s visible from the curvature of the moon in regards to non scaling feats.

If we scaled Carol off her better feats it becomes more likely she bust through her shields.

But all that’s stuff is Binary without Binary shes still able to bust city+ size meteors

Youre argument is solely off her hurting people without even putting them down or knocking them out. Alot of characters do that, it’s common in a comic book it doesn’t give you a win. With incap and this being base Carol id argue Sue probably wins though.

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Cruelrain

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#18  Edited By Cruelrain  Online

@ecstaticgrace said:

I’d argue her offensive output at the very least is but that’s in Binary. I don’t see any instances of her shields taking repeated poundings and holding and even without Binary. Carol has feats in base of destroying 300m meteors.

So id argue there’s a possibility of tiring due out that way

Well i can see it pretty well, a mind controlled Thing couldn't break her shields even when his strength is far greater than Carol, Sue can simply go invisible and stay in that way meanwhile one shot Carol with her force fields like she did with Thing and She Hulk

She was able to stop a hit from WWH and it didn't break her shield as well

No Caption Provided

And here Sue is going all out against Carol, i can see her knocking Carol meanwhile stay invisible.

No Caption Provided
@geekryan said:

@ecstaticgrace: If you are basing Sue solely on her RT, then that's hardly fair. If I do the same for Carol's RT, it wouldn't look good for her either.

Especially with Carol's low ends
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geekryan

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@geekryan said:

@ecstaticgrace: If you are basing Sue solely on her RT, then that's hardly fair. If I do the same for Carol's RT, it wouldn't look good for her either.

Sue's shields can take all of Carol's attacks, while Sue can continually smash Carol with force field constructs. Eventually Carol will go down. If incap is allowed, it's as easy as trapping Carol in a bubble. If incap isn't allowed, it will be a longer fight, but Sue would still win.

This also doesn't take into consideration Sue being able to go invisible. Although, I am not too familiar with what Carol can or can't do to counter invisibility.

I mean most of the stuff you posted are on her RT just some of it more full images.

I don’t see Sue’s shields withstanding energy output capable of destabilizing a planet, destroying an inhuman city that’s visible from the curvature of the moon in regards to non scaling feats.

If we scaled Carol off her better feats it becomes more likely she bust through her shields.

But all that’s stuff is Binary without Binary shes still able to bust city+ size meteors

Youre argument is solely off her hurting people without even putting them down or knocking them out. Alot of characters do that, it’s common in a comic book it doesn’t give you a win. With incap and this being base Carol id argue Sue probably wins though.

I have no clue why you are using Binary feats when she isn't allowed Binary in this match.

Without Binary, Carol is pretty mid-tier on a consistent basis. And you haven't provided any counter to Sue being invisible.

Here are more feats for Sue to prove that Carol couldn't break through her shields:

And lastly, one of her best feats:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3Gallery image 4

Maintains a force field around a planet for an extended period of time (after having kept the planet invisible as well), and it even tanks a few strikes from evil Sentry before she drops it.

And more:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3Gallery image 4

1) Blocks an attack described as "the full force of a living sun"

2) Blocks a strike from Terrax (Herald of Galactus)

3) Blocks a punch from a bloodlusted Thing

4) Blocks an attack from a hungry Galactus

Without Binary, Carol can't stand up to these feats.

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EcstaticGrace

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#20  Edited By EcstaticGrace

@geekryan: Impressive stuff I don’t know the context to some of that stuff

but the idea of her shielding and making a planet invisible sounds like there’s more to it where there’s an instance of her struggling to put a forcefield around a country.

The Galactus thing is hella impressive too but again I don’t know the context of it

Sue is impressive though I could see a win via incap.

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EmmaFrostXmen

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Sue 10/10

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Cruelrain

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#22 Cruelrain  Online

I don't think Carol's energy attacks in binary mode are stronger than Galactus or Celestials blasts, even with Binary mode, Sue's shields are too strong for her.

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Battle123axe

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@geekryan: Impressive stuff I don’t know the context to some of that stuff

but the idea of her shielding and making a planet invisible sounds like there’s more to it where there’s an instance of her struggling to put a forcefield around a country.

The Galactus thing is hella impressive too but again I don’t know the context of it

Sue is impressive though I could see a win via incap.

There isn't any context to the sentry feat. It's in Annihilation - Scourge Omega #1 if you're interested.

She also has a feat where she makes an area the size of a moon invisible, and the inability to make a forcefield around a country thing was a statement by someone else if we're thinking of the same feat.

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EcstaticGrace

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I don't think Carol's energy attacks in binary mode are stronger than Galactus or Celestials blasts, even with Binary mode, Sue's shields are too strong for her.

It’s a matter of how long they holdup. I don’t see a one high end being a end of debate showing.

When Carol has showings in Binary like knocking out Thor, Getting in an energy power struggle with The Phoenix Force or punching a hole through Xorn who was a combination of HOM mutants and was trading punches with the Sentry

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EcstaticGrace

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@battle123axe:If I remember I’ll give it a look. I don’t know the context of the Reddit scans either in fairness I’ll admit.

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Cruelrain

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#26 Cruelrain  Online

@ecstaticgrace: well in a battle between Sue and Binary the right thing should be her being able to use her hax, in which she can make internal attacks, suffocate or blind by turning optic nerves invisible

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Battle123axe

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#27  Edited By Battle123axe

@ecstaticgrace said:

@battle123axe:If I remember I’ll give it a look. I don’t know the context of the Reddit scans either in fairness I’ll admit.

That's fair, but Sue's shields have consistently shown to be able of dealing with damage several jumps ahead of carol's power for a good bit. Note that Carol is not allowed to go binary in this thread. If she was, it'd be arguable. Otherwise, I'm just not seeing her go through shields that take multiple blows from mjolnir, WWhulk, gladiator, restraining current namor, a sentry who's blows were seen across a hemisphere, etc etc etc

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EcstaticGrace

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@battle123axe: @cruelrain: Sue’s definitely more OP with a more versatile power no denying that from me.

Carol’s only internal hax requires her to make physical contact. What’s a forcefield classified as btw? Not trying to make an argument but are the shields energy?

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mossbeard

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Sue implodes Manvers skull

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Battle123axe

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@ecstaticgrace: I’m not sure on that one, I’m pretty sure I’ve seen scans of her ignoring energy and molecule manipulation and draining, but I’m not sure.

Scratch that, I’ve definitely seen a scan of molecule man saying that her shields draw from a source that makes him unable to effect anything inside.

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gmorto

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Going with Sue

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geekryan

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@geekryan: Impressive stuff I don’t know the context to some of that stuff

but the idea of her shielding and making a planet invisible sounds like there’s more to it where there’s an instance of her struggling to put a forcefield around a country.

The Galactus thing is hella impressive too but again I don’t know the context of it

Sue is impressive though I could see a win via incap.

There isn't any context to those feats. Sue's powers have increased significantly in the last year or so.

Binary Captain Marvel vs. Invisible Woman with no limits on internal attacks or BFR would be a closer fight. Sue would handily beat a non-Binary Carol.

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onsipin

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I favor Invisible Woman in this unless Carol can absorb her shields

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PayneInTheAss

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Susan

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Scarlet_Wiccan

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Sue has oneshotted Titania twice, and has casually drawn blood from Namor, Blastaar, Super Skrull with blunt force attacks so she'll KO Carol before Carol can break her force field.

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EcstaticGrace

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@scarlet_wiccan: Titania isn’t as strong as Carol, Drawing blood from Namor doesn’t equate to knocking Carol out. Carol has beaten a horde of Super Skrulls, and has beaten Blaastar with blunt force as well as overloading him.

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@ecstaticgrace: I know Carol is stronger than Titania. I'm saying that Sue should KO Carol after a few hits if she can casually oneshot someone as strong as Titania.

Again, If Sue can casually harm and draw blood from someone as durable as Namor or Blastaar, Sue should be able to harm and eventually KO Carol especially if she's not holding back.

Sue has actually beaten up the original Super Skrull who has all of the Fantastic Four's powers and that can fight Silver Surfer and Thor, and not the fodder/featless ones that everyone was beating in Secret Invasion.

Carol has better attack potency than a morals-on Sue, but not enough to break Sue's force field fast enough, so I don't know why Carol beating Blastaar plays a factor here.

Sue's force fields are decisively more durable than Carol, meaning Sue will KO Carol before Carol can break her force field. Sue can also blind Carol, making it hard to fight Sue or Sue could create a force field in Carol's brain to KO her, and yes she's done both in character.

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EcstaticGrace

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@ecstaticgrace: I know Carol is stronger than Titania. I'm saying that Sue should KO Carol after a few hits if she can casually oneshot someone as strong as Titania.

Again, If Sue can casually harm and draw blood from someone as durable as Namor or Blastaar, Sue should be able to harm and eventually KO Carol especially if she's not holding back.

Sue has actually beaten up the original Super Skrull who has all of the Fantastic Four's powers and that can fight Silver Surfer and Thor, and not the fodder/featless ones that everyone was beating in Secret Invasion.

Carol has better attack potency than a morals-on Sue, but not enough to break Sue's force field fast enough, so I don't know why Carol beating Blastaar plays a factor here.

Sue's force fields are decisively more durable than Carol, meaning Sue will KO Carol before Carol can break her force field. Sue can also blind Carol, making it hard to fight Sue or Sue could create a force field in Carol's brain to KO her, and yes she's done both in character.

Internal hax isn’t allowed by the OP so the forcefield in the brain thing isn’t allowed.

The rest of the stuff you stated atleast most of it is pretty fallible.

Making Namor bleed? Equates to knocking Carol out? Carol made Super Adaptoid bleed who previously beat up Sentry among some other Avengers. I wouldn’t suggest that a win scenario over Sentry

https://m.imgur.com/gallery/NOWgaOw

she casually blocked a punch from someone who in the same story arc made Skarr bleed. “Superia”



She’s oneshot Ronan who Id argue is more durable than Titania

In regards to beating up Super Skrull. Carol beat up Sindr who was beating up War Thor and it took the combined effort of Jane Thor and War Thor to beat

https://m.imgur.com/gallery/dH9mUkk

War Thor

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11124/111244877/7204767-9f1cf694-ab8e-42a9-b4f9-5c5f72fa9078.jpeg

Lady Jane

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11124/111244877/7204768-f683ca45-742d-434d-9f35-52f6d74fec34.jpeg

Regardless making someone bleed isnt the best argument to suggest a win over Carol. By that logic Gamora has made Thanos bleed so she beats Carol which by feats and showings against each other isn’t true.

Id argue a win via incap is probable and highly likely though

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Cruelrain

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#39 Cruelrain  Online

Gamora made Captain Marvel bleed as well lol, Sue is definitely capable of KO Carol if she did it with Ben Grimm aka The Thing who can fight Immortal Hulk

Also again, how is Carol breaking Sue's force fields if she encapsulates her just like this

No Caption Provided

And the she will pass out argument isn't true when she can hold her shields for an entire day under attack

No Caption Provided

When she did it with an entire planet for days without resting, you say if she can take several hits from Carol? Well she took several hits from an angry Sentry until she let it down before he could break ir after several hits also she was without resting for days

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3Gallery image 4Gallery image 5

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EcstaticGrace

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@cruelrain: You didnt even tag me. You want to pretend Ben knocking out Immortal Hulk is a consistent showing for him? The whole narrative of the story was that Ben typically doesn’t have a chance against the Hulk.

Redgardless i agree Sue wins due to incap. Her knocking Carol out with forcefield punches I’m not seeing so far.

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Cruelrain

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#41  Edited By Cruelrain  Online

@ecstaticgrace: Thing is more consistent than current Carol who was struggling with War Machine but then beat Thor and Iron Man without a clearly amp after being just a mid tier in her base form.

At least Ben has several fights with high tiers to back up his high ends feats

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EcstaticGrace

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#42  Edited By EcstaticGrace

@cruelrain said:

@ecstaticgrace: Thing is more consistent than current Carol who was struggling with War Machine but then beat Thor and Iron Man without a clearly amp after being just a mid tier in her base form.

At least Ben has several fights with high tiers to back up his high ends feats

The same War Machine took on an avengers roster with The Thing on it. Beat up Ironman and ran away when he was fighting Carol one on one suggesting he couldn’t put her down... all of this taking place in Punishers own book... yet Carol got the favorable treatment between her, Ben and Stark. It’s not a good mention to downplay her. Noone does it without bringing up the fact on how this War Machine did against Ironman.

Carol has several fights with high tiers as well. The difference is one character actually beat them and not just traded blows.

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psi-bite234

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@cruelrain:

Gamora made Captain Marvel bleed as well lol, Sue is definitely capable of KO Carol if she did it with Ben Grimm aka The Thing who can fight Immortal Hulk

This happens when Carol isn't holding back against Gamora

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GreyBoi

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Susan stomps her even if she is in Binary form. Carol is all over the place and, despite all the attempts Marvel writers make to make her look a high tier, she still struggled with Luke Cage, got visibly hurt by Bushwhaker, couldn't even scratch current Namor, was stalemated by War Machine, struggled with Black Panther and was kissing the floor after Annihilus shot her once.

Sue has absolutely stomped people much stronger than Carol (like that time when she stomped Thing, Absorbing Man, Titania and She-Hulk at the same time, or stomped Super-Skrull, or tore apart Doom's armor), has contained energy releases way more impressive than anything Carol can dish out (Torch's Supernova, blast from bloodlusted Surfer, power cosmic detonation that messed up Silver Surfer, blasts from Annihilus and Blastaar, blast from Ego, blast from Galactus that could have split the planet in two), restrained people way stronger than Carol (Thing, Doom, current Namor, Cyborg Superman) and her fields shrugged off hits from people stronger than Carol as well.

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EcstaticGrace

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#45  Edited By EcstaticGrace

@greyboi said:

Susan stomps her even if she is in Binary form. Carol is all over the place and, despite all the attempts Marvel writers make to make her look a high tier, she still struggled with Luke Cage, got visibly hurt by Bushwhaker, couldn't even scratch current Namor, was stalemated by War Machine, struggled with Black Panther and was kissing the floor after Annihilus shot her once.

Sue has absolutely stomped people much stronger than Carol (like that time when she stomped Thing, Absorbing Man, Titania and She-Hulk at the same time, or stomped Super-Skrull, or tore apart Doom's armor), has contained energy releases way more impressive than anything Carol can dish out (Torch's Supernova, blast from bloodlusted Surfer, power cosmic detonation that messed up Silver Surfer, blasts from Annihilus and Blastaar, blast from Ego, blast from Galactus that could have split the planet in two), restrained people way stronger than Carol (Thing, Doom, current Namor, Cyborg Superman) and her fields shrugged off hits from people stronger than Carol as well.

Binary is above all those bolded people.

A lot of your mentions are biasedly worded as well. Carol also put Annihilus on his knees with one shot... but no mention of that.

You mean Carol can dish out high levels of energy like destabilizing a planet causing it to get destroyed!?

Destroying an Inhuman City that was visible from space.

Knocking out Thor

Thing is only “way stronger“ by scaling a lot of those characters are only stronger via scaling you look at personal feats and Namor is the only one who has a strength edge over her.

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Scarlet_Wiccan

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@ecstaticgrace: I mentioned Sue harming Namor (Sue has harmed Namor at least three times = consistently) to prove that Sue can definitely harm Carol seeing as Namor has survived attacks from Sentry, Thanos, Hulk, ect.

Carol is not on or above Sentry's level.

I have to agree Carol is more impressive than Sue offensively hence the feats you've posted, but defensively Carol is just outclassed.

If you're using high ends (possibly outliers) then I may add that Sue has casually stomped a group of bloodlusted bricks consisting of Thing, She Hulk, Absorbing Man, Titania and Bounty all at the same time, she has stalemated a group of Avengers consisting of Thor, Hulk, Iron Man, Luke Cage, ect. These are things I honestly don't see Carol replicating even with her high end feats, and don't let me get into her defensive high-ends/outliers, Sue won't even notice Binary attacking her force fields.

Sue wins mainly because I honestly don't see Carol escaping a force field cage.

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EcstaticGrace

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#47  Edited By EcstaticGrace

@scarlet_wiccan said:

@ecstaticgrace: I mentioned Sue harming Namor (Sue has harmed Namor at least three times = consistently) to prove that Sue can definitely harm Carol seeing as Namor has survived attacks from Sentry, Thanos, Hulk, ect.

Carol is not on or above Sentry's level.

I have to agree Carol is more impressive than Sue offensively hence the feats you've posted, but defensively Carol is just outclassed.

If you're using high ends (possibly outliers) then I may add that Sue has casually stomped a group of bloodlusted bricks consisting of Thing, She Hulk, Absorbing Man, Titania and Bounty all at the same time, she has stalemated a group of Avengers consisting of Thor, Hulk, Iron Man, Luke Cage, ect. These are things I honestly don't see Carol replicating even with her high end feats, and don't let me get into her defensive high-ends/outliers, Sue won't even notice Binary attacking her force fields.

Sue wins mainly because I honestly don't see Carol escaping a force field cage.

There’s a difference between harming a character and knocking them out it’s a bad mention all together on your part is all I’m saying. Making Namor bleed isn’t equivalent to knocking Carol out.

I could list a couple of characters that Carol has taken hits from that’s above Carol as well.

I already said Carol wins via incap though so you’re last point is just restating what I already said before your post.

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GreyBoi

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@greyboi said:

Susan stomps her even if she is in Binary form. Carol is all over the place and, despite all the attempts Marvel writers make to make her look a high tier, she still struggled with Luke Cage, got visibly hurt by Bushwhaker, couldn't even scratch current Namor, was stalemated by War Machine, struggled with Black Panther and was kissing the floor after Annihilus shot her once.

Sue has absolutely stomped people much stronger than Carol (like that time when she stomped Thing, Absorbing Man, Titania and She-Hulk at the same time, or stomped Super-Skrull, or tore apart Doom's armor), has contained energy releases way more impressive than anything Carol can dish out (Torch's Supernova, blast from bloodlusted Surfer, power cosmic detonation that messed up Silver Surfer, blasts from Annihilus and Blastaar, blast from Ego, blast from Galactus that could have split the planet in two), restrained people way stronger than Carol (Thing, Doom, current Namor, Cyborg Superman) and her fields shrugged off hits from people stronger than Carol as well.

Binary is above all those bolded people.

Binary was overpowered by Colossus and was unable to do much to Cap Britain while going all out. Even in modern times she was barely able to do anything to Firelord, who is only Hercules/Thor level.

She's nowhere near current Namor who stomped Cho Hulk and manhandled Thor and Iron Man each with one arm.

A lot of your mentions are biasedly worded as well. Carol also put Annihilus on his knees with one shot... but no mention of that.

Only because she dislodged the Cosmic Rod, the same Rod that at that time gave him his power and left him weak and mortal without it. She did 0 damage to him with the blast itself.

You mean Carol can dish out high levels of energy like destabilizing a planet causing it to get destroyed!?

Via chain reaction, not with actual energy output. She's nowhere near planet level energy-wise.

Destroying an Inhuman City that was visible from space.

Not really impressive.

Knocking our Thor

Only after absorbing his energies for hours.

Thing is only “way stronger“ by scaling a lot of those characters are only stronger via scaling you look at personal feats and Namor is the only one who has a strength edge over her.

They are both significantly stronger than Carol by feats, scaling and in-universe logic, and it's not even debatable. They could go toe to toe with stronger Hulk incarnation while she got bullied by the second/third weakest, among many other things.

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EcstaticGrace

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#49  Edited By EcstaticGrace

@greyboi: The Cosmic Control Rod doesn’t amp Annihulus atleast I don’t think physically it just gives him immortality he’s afraid of dying. Reason why he fears losing it. It doesn’t change the way you tried to turn it into a low showing for her. It’s Annihilus the guy is a legit team buster. She wasn’t knocked out after he blasted her she was dazed and took more damage than he did when she retaliated but he also was in fear of his life after he lost the rod because his immortality was in question.

I don’t remember the Colossus instance but a lot of characters have low showings I don’t see it as a bad thing. Captain Britain varies in power level. It’s all on how much he believes in himself the dude took on the Phoenix Force before AvX.. I’d argue Binary’s highs outnumber her low ends. Which from your mentions sounds just to be colossus. Firelord didn’t do anything to her either in their brief encounter. It wasn’t one sided which is a good showing because like you said he’s Herc/Thor level which a base Carol admittedly isn’t. But Binary is so far above base Carol.

I cant disagree with current Namor being above base Carol because of how she performed against him. In the current Avengers title. Despite the Hydroman amp though I still think Namor is more powerful in the ocean than he is on dry land.

Chain reaction or not. It was her energy output that caused the planet to be destroyed. On top of the fact she wasn’t even directly attacking the planet to begin with she was hitting the Brood Queen and the planet couldn’t take it.

How is destroying a city that’s visible from space not impressive?

She knocked out Thor in Binary though is my point. which I believe you suggested Binary wasn’t impressive.

I don’t think Ben has any personal feats to put him above Carol strength wise. Scaling is a sketchy way to judge things cause I could also bring up the fact an amped Thing got oneshotted by Thor and Carol fought All-Father Thor for hours. You see how that works? Namor without scaling probably has better strength feats than both though I’ll admit.

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Battle123axe

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#50  Edited By Battle123axe

@ecstaticgrace: No binary as per the OP. It's been like that for the entirety of this thread.

No Binary form

Thing without scaling has feats of throwing a tree around the planet, holding together a 200000 ton bridge, casually overpowering pressure that could level a mountain, casually making weapons out of hyperdense skyscrapers, flexing down a mountain of rubble, surviving hundreds of tons per square inch of pressure, casually overpowering a machine that could push through a planet, surviving the weight of half a planet on his back. I don't think Carol has better non-scaling strength feats at all.