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#1 Posted by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio

Iron Man

Represented by @blackpantherisb
Represented by @blackpantherisb

VS.

Hulk

Represented by @supremegeneration
Represented by @supremegeneration

Rules

  • Marvel Cinematic Universe versions for both
  • Iron Man is a composite version with all of his suits except for the Hulkbuster
  • Hulk has all of his gear from the gladiator fight from Thor: Ragnarok
  • In character
  • Morals on
  • No prep

Location: The arena from Thor: Ragnarok

No Caption Provided

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#2 Posted by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio
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#3 Posted by GilgameshThePimpToEndAllPimps (2466 posts) - - Show Bio

TAEP

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#4 Posted by DrPepperMan (6288 posts) - - Show Bio

Tag after every single thought, involuntary movement, finger twitch, pixel, glance at a gif, and example of good debating skill related to this CaV.

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#5 Posted by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio
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#6 Posted by Subline (7022 posts) - - Show Bio
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#7 Posted by SupremeGeneration (11419 posts) - - Show Bio

@blackpantherisb: Nice. I'm working on posts for a few other CaVs, so you can go first if you get a post up before me, otherwise I'll be able to in about 2 weeks.

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#8 Posted by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio
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#9 Posted by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump for attention.

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#10 Posted by xZone (10341 posts) - - Show Bio

Tag after every single thought, involuntary movement, finger twitch, pixel, glance at a gif, and example of good debating skill related to this CaV.

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#11 Posted by Kevd4wg (12512 posts) - - Show Bio

This is gonna be so good T4V

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#12 Edited by Amcu (16242 posts) - - Show Bio

Tag after every post.

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#13 Posted by ANTHP2000 (25797 posts) - - Show Bio

Taaaaaaaaaaag

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#14 Posted by darthvaderrocks (1074 posts) - - Show Bio

TAEP

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#15 Posted by strangetales (1712 posts) - - Show Bio

T4v. This one looks fun! Will enjoy reading through it

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#16 Posted by The_Red_Devil (4471 posts) - - Show Bio

Tag after every post , a lot of people have started Repping Tony lately.

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#17 Posted by Greysentinel365 (6007 posts) - - Show Bio

T4V

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#18 Posted by ArkhamAsylum3 (3401 posts) - - Show Bio

TAEP and T4V.

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#19 Posted by Ready_4_Madness (15392 posts) - - Show Bio

TAEP

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#20 Posted by DrPepperMan (6288 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump

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#21 Posted by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio
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#22 Posted by Mr_Shazam0920 (4140 posts) - - Show Bio

TAEP

Online
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#23 Edited by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio

Iron Man

“I’m a huge fan of the way you lose control and turn into an enormous green rage monster.”
“I’m a huge fan of the way you lose control and turn into an enormous green rage monster.”

Bio

Guidebook To the Marvel Cinematic Universe – Marvel's The Avengers #1
Guidebook To the Marvel Cinematic Universe – Marvel's The Avengers #1
Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3
Guidebook To the Marvel Cinematic Universe – Marvel's Captain America: Civil War #1

Strength

Obviously, this is the category is Hulk's bread and butter: he is, after all, the strongest there is. And whilst I can't dispute that Hulk is indeed physically stronger than Tony, I can argue that the discrepancy isn't as large as many believe it to be. I'll start out on Tony's absolute lowest end:

Iron Man 2
Iron Man 2

In an impressive showing of strength, the Mark II tosses Tony in the Mark III clean through a solid concrete floor, and into another one, making a massive dent. And when Rhodey flies back up through the floor that he just hurled Tony through, we see that it is several feet thick.

Iron Man 2
Iron Man 2

With an exceedingly casual kick, Iron Man sends his multi-ton Rolls Royce limousine flying well over a dozen feet away. And again this is still incredibly low end for Iron Man. Let's start getting into some more impressive territory.

The Avengers
The Avengers

With one massive kick, Iron Man smashes Thor clean through a tree so hard that the God of Thunder's hammer is knocked clean out of his hand whilst he's in ragdoll. And this is very impressive considering the fact that in the same movie it took this much force to do the same thing:

The Avengers
The Avengers

After falling 30,000 feet and slamming to the ground, creating a massive crater/dirt explosion, Thor drops his hammer. Really only when Thor is hit with insane amounts of force like this does he drop his weapon, and Iron Man made him do so with a kick. This is a highly impressive display of physicality. But if you want something a little more quantifiable:

Iron Man Wal-Mart Custom Comic #1 - Security Measures
Iron Man Wal-Mart Custom Comic #1 - Security Measures

In this highly impressive feat from a tie-in comic Iron Man, with one fluid motion, grabs one tank and uses it like a baseball bat to bludgeon and destroy another tank. Keep in mind that the most common tank used currently, the M1 Abrams, weighs roughly 68 tons. If Tony can swing around 68 tons that casually he can certainly give Hulk some trouble in the strength department. And there's plenty of other material to support this notion:

The Avengers
The Avengers

During the famous forest fight Thor and Iron Man actually grapple midway through, and for several seconds it remains evenly matched. Granted Thor does begin to gradually overpower Tony and dent the forearms of his armor, but the fact of the matter is that Iron Man was able to grapple with Thor for roughly 5-8 seconds, and whilst towards that end he was getting overpowered, it still took effort from Thor, and Odinson never managed to fully overpower him. So while Thor is certainly above Mark VI Tony in strength, they are clearly comparable. This is especially impressive considering the fact that later on in the same movie Thor and Hulk are portrayed as peers in strength:

The Avengers
The Avengers

As you can clearly see Thor and Hulk are not far apart in terms of strength, Thor is able to block one of Hulk's hit with one arm, and then towards the end of the gif, using both arms, Thor manages to overpower Hulk's arm. So anyway just to conclude the scaling train Mark VI Iron Man is close to Thor in strength, and Thor is a near equal to Hulk (though Hulk is still slightly superior) in strength. Thus Tony isn't far off from Hulk in strength and certainly has enough physicality to contend with/hurt the Green Behemoth.

Firepower

This is a critical aspect of Iron Man's victory over Hulk, perhaps the most important category in fact. Tony simply has an enormous amount of ranged firepower/versatility, and he applies it liberally. Let's start out with his most basic ranged attack, his repulsors:

Iron Man 3
Iron Man 3

With a single blast of his repulsors, Tony sends a large grand piano flying well over 100 feet through the air, and into a helicopter hard enough to completely decimate the chopper's nose. And large grand pianos, like this, on average, weigh around 1,000 pounds. A blast that can casually ragdoll 1,000 pounds hundreds of feet is nothing to be laughed at. And this isn't the only time Tony has done something like this:

Avengers: Infinity War
Avengers: Infinity War

With a highly casual blast of his repulsors, Iron Man overpowers the momentum of Maw's telekinetically launched car to the extent that the car is actually sent hundreds of feet back down the block towards Maw. Obviously being able to treat multi-ton objects like cars like paperweights with effortless blasts is highly impressive. And similar blasts will certainly have an effect on Hulk considering that his energy durability actually isn't nearly as impressive as his blunt fore resistance.

Avengers: Age of Ultron
Avengers: Age of Ultron

With only two short blasts from his repulsors, Iron Man destroys a heavily fortified bunked and a turret. Destroying fortified military structures with single blasts is extremely impressive, certainly small building level in terms of damage output.

Now, what do all of the above three feats have in common? Tony accomplished them all with blasts that were extremely short in terms of duration. If he can accomplish such impressive feats with blasts that only take a fraction of a second to fire off imagine the damage he could do with blasts that last multiple seconds like the one he used here against Cull:

Avengers: Infinity War
Avengers: Infinity War

If a blast that lasts for 1/10th of a second can ragdoll a multi-ton object hundreds of feet and completely destroy a reinforced and highly advanced military structure, then imagine what a blast like this, which lasts for multiple seconds, could do. Certainly enough to put the Hulk on his ass.

Next up in Iron Man's arsenal: missiles. This is a category where Tony has a vast array of various warheads. But let's start out pretty basic. First off Tony has his standard missile swarm that he used against the Chitauri ships at the beginning of the battle of New York.

The Avengers
The Avengers

In this instance, Iron Man unleashes dozens of missiles of the Chitauri horde, which causes dozens of small building level explosions to occur as soon as the projectiles find their target's. If Iron Man completely concentrated all those explosions directly on Banner, he could certainly do some damage/stun Hulk. And that's just the tip of the iceberg:

The Avengers
The Avengers

Here Stark shows off the incredible payload of explosives that he keeps in his legs when he goes to destroy a Leviathan from the inside out. When the explosives are activated that produces multiple smaller explosions, and end up generating one huge, building level blast that completely obliterates the tail of the Leviathan. Again, firepower like this will prove highly dangerous to the Hulk, especially when he has so much of it.

Avengers: Infinity War
Avengers: Infinity War

With a larger, more direct missile Iron Man is able to do incredible damage, just like he does in this feat, where he blows clean open the wall to one of Thanos' O shaped ships. And keep in mind these ships are insanely durable, massively more so than anything we have on earth:

Avengers: Infinity War
Avengers: Infinity War

Ultimately the ship ends up crash landing on Titan at re-entry speeds, smashing through a huge structure and ultimately slamming to the ground. Granted the ship was damaged, but it only broke into pieces. Obviously, if it was made out of regular Earth metals the ship would've been completely destroyed and crushed. So busting clean through one of its wall is obviously highly impressive. And Tony can launch multiple of these missiles at once:

Iron Man 2
Iron Man 2

Considering the power of the missiles six of them at once, just as he used them here, would definitely do some damage to Hulk, especially since he can shoot them all in one single burst. And he has even more firepower than missiles and repulsors.

Iron Man 2
Iron Man 2

Arguably the most dangerous weapon in his arsenal is his lasers, in their debut appearance they cut through an army of solid metal heavily armored drones and through several trees, and what's so impressive about it is that they just slice through all of it like butter without ever actually being stopped. Hulk better have some insane heat resistance if he wants to tank these lasers without damage.

Durability

This is another category that is critical in Iron Man's victory, his durability is pretty insane, potentially above Hulk's. I'll start out by displaying his piercing durability and considering the fact that one of Hulk's main forms of damage output will be piercing considering the fact that he has his ax in this fight:

Iron Man
Iron Man

Here Iron Man takes repeated shots from F-22 raptors, and these things have incredibly powerful bullets. The bullets are 20 mm and have a muzzle velocity of over Mach 3, so no selling these is a highly impressive feat, and he has better:

Iron Man
Iron Man

In this instance Iron Man tanks a tank she straight to the face, and gets up seconds later completely unphased. Quite frankly I don't think that Hulk's ax can exceed the piercing output of a tank shell, so cutting/piercing Tony really doesn't seem like a viable option. Moving on to blunt force durability:

Iron Man 2
Iron Man 2

Iron Man blitzes at Whiplash, who proceeds to completely overpower his blitz and send Tony reeling back hundreds of feet and clean through a large wooden arch. Though this is still the lowest end of his durability feats:

The Avengers
The Avengers

Here Iron Man tanks a cheapshot hammer throw from Thor, and gets up seconds later completely and utterly unphased. And this is highly impressive considering just how powerful Thor's hammer throws are:

Thor: The Dark World
Thor: The Dark World

A single hammer throw from Thor sends Malekith flying hundreds of feet through two huge stone pillars, and into a car hard enough to ragdoll and completely deform it. So effectively no selling a hammer throw from Thor is highly impressive. But he has more:

The Avengers
The Avengers

Whilst restarting the Helicarrier turbine Iron Man ends up getting hit over and over and over again by the multi-hundred-ton propellers. And these propellers were moving at outright insane speeds, they outpaced Tony (which is how they tagged him) and he was moving pretty damn fast:

The Avengers
The Avengers

As you can see when Tony was pushing the propellor it was moving insanely fast, making 5+ full rotations of the massive turbine every second. And again the propellors ended up outpacing Tony, so essentially Iron Man was repeatedly battered by multi-hundred ton propellors that were moving at sub to supersonic speeds. I can't see Hulk replicating that level of damage output easily.

Avengers: Infinity War
Avengers: Infinity War

Using his powerful telekinetic abilities Ebony Maw uppercuts Iron Man hundreds upon hundreds of feet into the air using the ground beneath Tony's feet. Yet seconds later Tony reappears seemingly unharmed. A hit like this is certainly more powerful than Hulk's average blow, and Iron Man has endured attacks that Hulk simply could never replicate without a massive amount of momentum:

Avengers: Infinity War
Avengers: Infinity War

Here Iron Man endures a hammer/ax throw from Cull Obsideon that send him flying a huge distance, clean through a building, and then several hundred feet after that into a tree. And the distance that Iron Man was hit is pretty insane:

Avengers: Infinity War
Avengers: Infinity War

You can pretty clearly see that Iron Man was many blocks and several thousand feet away from the park considering the fact that large buildings were clearly visible in the distance many many blocks away (and obviously there are no buildings in the park). So Tony was hit many thousands of feet, through a building, and he still had enough momentum to fly a couple hundred feet into the park after that. I can't see Hulk replicating that level of force with a punch, and Tony got up from that hit more or less unphased.

Speed & Mobility

This is another section critical to Iron Man's victory, not only is he much faster than Hulk, but he also uses his flight and range liberally, especially against bricks, so Hulk will have a very hard time landing a hit on Tony. I'll start off with reaction speed:

Iron Man 2
Iron Man 2

Here, after Iron Man's helmet warns him that a missile has been shot at him, Tony casually dodges it. Keep in mind that he dodged the missile explicitly after it was fired. This feat already matches Hulk's most impressive speed showing which is catching a rocket that was fired at him. And this is still Tony's lowest end:

Avengers: Age of Ultron
Avengers: Age of Ultron

Whilst attacking a heavily fortified HYDRA base Iron Man dodges shots from several energy cannons after they've been fired. And this is highly impressive because this same energy was shown to move just as fast as machine gun fire:

Avengers: Age of Ultron
Avengers: Age of Ultron

I'm fairly certain that Hulk has never legitimately bullet timed, let alone dodged a barrage of machine gun speed energy blasts, so already I think we can agree that Tony holds a comfortable speed edge here. And this is clearly displayed by scaling off of characters both have fought as well:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3
The Avengers

In their fight in Avengers Iron Man is repeatedly shown outmaneuvering and blitzing Thor using his mobility and speed. We see Tony objectively outbullrushing Thor in the first GIF, and slamming him into the side of a mountain, in the second Tony outright blitzes Thor and hurls him into a tree, and in the third Iron Man uses his speed and mobility to dodge Thor/knock him down, and then to blitz him once again. Obviously, Thor landed blows throughout this fight as well, and at one point he even briefly outperformed Tony in H2H combat, however, throughout the fight Iron Man landed more attacks (Thor landed 8 and Iron Man landed 12) and clearly had the speed/mobility advantage. Now let us contrast this to Hulk's performance against the God of Thunder:

The Avengers
The Avengers

In their first fight in the Avengers, it's made clear that Hulk is simply not on Thor's level of speed, and the Thunder God repeatedly humiliates Hulk in CQC. The instances where Hulk actually manages to land hits are due to his physicality, not his speed. For example when Thor catches Hulk's punch and the two begin to grapple Hulk manages to tag him only because both of Thor's arms were occupied to keep Hulk's strength at bay. The next time Hulk actually lands a hit is when Thor jumps on the Hulk's back, at which point Hulk uses his strength to jump through the ceiling, which leads to Thor being stunned allowing Hulk to tag the God of Thunder for the third time. This GIF clearly displays that Thor is simply faster than Hulk, and keep in mind that he didn't have his hammer here, which increases his range and mobility greatly (he obviously had the hammer whilst fighting Tony). And this isn't the only time the two have fought:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3
Thor: Ragnarok

In their longer, more recent, and most famous fight we see just how large the speed gap between the two is. Over a nearly 45 second period, we see Thor land 11 blows and outmaneuver Hulk to get him into a sleeper hold. Meanwhile, Hulk swings at Thor 6 times, and the God of Thunder casually dodges all of his attempts. It is very clear that Thor is far above Hulk in speed, and again Thor didn't have his hammer here. Yet due to Iron Man's excellent reaction speed and insane maneuverability he was actually able to outperform Thor, despite the fact that Thor had much better range and maneuverability than when he fought Hulk.

And Tony loves to abuse his range and maneuverability especially when fighting bricks, just look at his fight with Cull Obsideon for example:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3Gallery image 4
Avengers: Infinity War

As you can see Iron Man only actually engages Cull Obsideon in CQC once throughout the entire fight, otherwise using his flight and range to attack Cull and dodge his blows. And Hulk's weapons don't have the range or versatility that Cull's does, it can turn into a shield, it can extend and turn into a ranged object, it can turn into a grabbing tool, and it also is durable enough to block Iron Man's attacks, whereas Hulk's weapons will just get blown to pieces or knocked out of his hands right off the bat.

So clearly Tony prefers to use his mobility/range advantages, especially against bricks, and that coupled, with his superior speed, will make it very difficult for the Hulk to tag him, but even if Tony does get forced into CQC I'm still confident that he can outmaneuver Hulk in that aspect as well:

Captain America: Civil War
Captain America: Civil War

(Bet you didn't think that a GIF from this fight scene would end up in one of my posts did ya?) Due to Iron Man's underrated and highly effective fight pattern analyzing software Stark was able to completely outmaneuver, pummel, and overall humiliate Steve in H2H combat. To the point where the super soldier was totally unable to tag Tony (until Bucky distracted him). And Banner's record against super solider's is fairly interesting:

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2
The Incredible Hulk

In this instance, Blonsky, who had recently been juiced up on the super soldier serum (and Ross explicitly stated that the dose was very small) completely humiliates and dodges 8 blows from the Hulk whilst also manages to get several clean gunshots off on Banner. And keep in mind that all of the super soldiers have been shown to be able to keep up with each other comfortably, so Cap and Blonsky should certainly be comparable, especially considering the fact that Blonsky was given a small dose of the SSS.

So Iron Man, by analyzing Hulk's fight pattern should certainly be able to outskill/outmaneuver the Green Goliath in CQC, especially considering the fact that Iron Man also holds a solid reaction speed edge.

Conclusion

Overall I just think that Hulk is a one trick pony: he smashes, that's about it. And while he is physically stronger than Tony, that's just about all he had going for him. Iron Man is just as durable (if not more so), has a plethora of versatile ranged attacks that he can use against Banner, and holds a solid speed and mobility advantage that he tends to abuse against bricks. Overall whilst Hulk's weapons do afford him some greater reach, they will get blasted to pieces by Tony's rockets, missiles, repulsors, and lasers fairly early on in the fight. Granted one of Hulk's trademark moves is his jump, but Tony could easily just outmaneuver him/blast him out of the air if he tries this.

Really Hulk is going to have a hard time just laying his hands on Tony given the fact that he is slower, less mobile, and doesn't have any ranged attacks, meanwhile, Iron Man will be bombarding him with repulsor attacks, missiles, and bullrushes. Even if Hulk does tag Stark, his durability is high enough that he can tank Hulk's blows, and Tony's striking power is definitely enough to put the hurt on Hulk.

To conclude whilst Tony can certainly compete in the physical department due to his impressive strength, insane durability, and incredible speed (plus his fight pattern analyzing software), the real reason he wins is due to his versatility, his range, and his sheer mobility, all of which he likes to abuse against Hulk-esque characters. The fact of the matter is that he could end the fight without even coming into striking distance of Hulk, and I just don't think that there's really anything that Banner can do about it.

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#25 Posted by SupremeGeneration (11419 posts) - - Show Bio

@blackpantherisb: I haven't forgotten about this, but CV recently ate a decent chunk of my post. Luckily I still have the first section and vast majority of the second.

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#26 Posted by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio
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#27 Posted by SupremeGeneration (11419 posts) - - Show Bio
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#28 Posted by deactivated-5c917f846ef0b (1264 posts) - - Show Bio

arf

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#29 Posted by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio
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#30 Posted by deactivated-5c917f846ef0b (1264 posts) - - Show Bio
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#31 Posted by Psy-Scarlet (468 posts) - - Show Bio

Tag

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#32 Posted by ANTHP2000 (25797 posts) - - Show Bio
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#33 Posted by SupremeGeneration (11419 posts) - - Show Bio

@blackpantherisb: Just some shit KOL made up to further support his bait.

No, I actually say "arf" all the time, on CV, Discord, and real life.

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#34 Posted by ANTHP2000 (25797 posts) - - Show Bio

@anthp2000 said:

@blackpantherisb: Just some shit KOL made up to further support his bait.

No, I actually say "arf" all the time, on CV, Discord, and real life.

Can't a man bait on a Tuesday night anymore?

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#35 Posted by Aqualion0 (1469 posts) - - Show Bio

Nice.

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#36 Posted by Rosa_Melano (230 posts) - - Show Bio

T4V

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#37 Posted by Ouroborik (3357 posts) - - Show Bio

T4V

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#38 Posted by SupremeGeneration (11419 posts) - - Show Bio
No Caption Provided

I see a surprising - and almost worrying - lack of Thanos feats in your opener, @blackpantherisb.

Bio

I'll take one out of my opponent's book and use the MCU Guidebooks:

Guidebook to the Marvel Cinematic Universe - The Avengers
Guidebook to the Marvel Cinematic Universe - The Avengers

Now we all know the purpose of a CaV: prove your character beats your opponent's character by having the better arguments. In order to do that, I'll address my opponent's points head on. To begin with, the biggest issue I can think of when facing Stark for the Big Green Goliath is the former's sheer amount of weaponry. Let's get on with that, shall we?

Hulk's Energy Durability vs Stark's Sheer Firepower (+ Counters)

This first feat everyone should be familiar with. It comes from the titular Thor vs Hulk fight from Thor: Ragnarok and is actually pretty insane.

No Caption Provided

Here we see a newly powered up Thor with unlocked power blast Hulk with an absolutely insane amount of electricity. Not only is the force behind the punch itself great - moving Hulk that far with a single punch despite merely budging him earlier - but we see Thor's electricity course throughout Hulk's body even after Thor put his hand down. I'm not saying this'll allow him to nosell Iron Man's arsenal since Thor's punches are kind of unquantifiable, but his cloak alone is enough to mow down undead Asgardians. I'd imagine his direct punches whose aftershock left lightning coursing through Hulk's body are insane. Getting back up from this should allow him to at least tank repulsors with minor discomfort.

Now yes, Hulk's a little groggy, but that's more of a feat for Thor than an anti-feat for Hulk. Also note that while he takes a bit to get up, immediately after the punch the movie goes into slow motion, so it's likely less time than we think it is.

This next one is from the hype-generating Hulk vs Veronica fight from Avengers: Age of Ultron.

No Caption Provided

This, I believe, is a feat that indicates that Hulk can no-sell Stark's repulsors. While he may have had some insane upgrades over time, this armor had 6 arc reactors in the back that we could see, one in each leg, and the chest one + there are likely some we don't see as I remember some source saying he had 11+. Let's call it the nine, though. He had at least nine arc reactors in one suit, and Hulk literally just walked through a sustained beam. I doubt even IW Stark is packing the level of repulsors needed to do what you described:

If a blast that lasts for 1/10th of a second can ragdoll a multi-ton object hundreds of feet and completely destroy a reinforced and highly advanced military structure, then imagine what a blast like this, which lasts for multiple seconds, could do. Certainly enough to put the Hulk on his ass.

Because even if we assume, for some reason, that the Hulkbuster's repulsors were equal in intensity to Stark's regular suits, Hulk ALREADY walked through a sustained blast. Except I don't believe that the repulsors were weaker. Literally everything indicates that they were stronger: they visually larger than even the 400% power from the forest fight fired from a suit meant to fight an opponent who's caliber was yet to be encountered in the MCU (the suit was made before Ultron was an idea) that had at least nine arc reactors.

But the IW suit isn't a regular suit, it's a clear step up. However, from what you showed, it's not that far above by feats. It sent a car flying, but an earlier model fked up a military bunker. By implication it's more powerful, but by feats it's lacking. Your only other resource lies in the IW suit's nanotech function, namely the blasts he used to send Cull flying by having parts of his suit take off and amp his repulsage power. Those would prove an issue, but I'll address them should you bring them up.

Lastly is your missiles. I do believe these may cause some discomfort, but I don't think they'll be game changing either.

Next up in Iron Man's arsenal: missiles. This is a category where Tony has a vast array of various warheads. But let's start out pretty basic. First off Tony has his standard missile swarm that he used against the Chitauri ships at the beginning of the battle of New York.

In this instance, Iron Man unleashes dozens of missiles of the Chitauri horde, which causes dozens of small building level explosions to occur as soon as the projectiles find their target's. If Iron Man completely concentrated all those explosions directly on Banner, he could certainly do some damage/stun Hulk.

What causes you to say that these are small building level? Visually, each individual one is certainly far from that and there was no indication in the movie itself that gave us a sense of how powerful these things were. While I think these may have some effect in terms of explosions around the Hulk blinding him, I don't think they're anything special in terms of genuine output. Small building is definitely a step above that, unless it's a really small building.

Here Stark shows off the incredible payload of explosives that he keeps in his legs when he goes to destroy a Leviathan from the inside out. When the explosives are activated that produces multiple smaller explosions, and end up generating one huge, building level blast that completely obliterates the tail of the Leviathan. Again, firepower like this will prove highly dangerous to the Hulk, especially when he has so much of it.

It's definitely worth noting here that he had to get inside the Leviathan to cause any damage. The insides were clearly much weaker, as Stark specifically asked Jarvis for a soft spot in the Leviathan armor and he'd still have run out of power before making a dent with his laser. Now obviously missiles =/= lasers, but it sets a precedent that Stark needed to go inside the Leviathan in order to take it out. I would also like to note that this explosion sent Stark flying a decent bit, and even gave an opening for the Chitauri to fire at him and put him down for a bit.

That type of firepower is dangerous, but also hard to aim at a single target from the legs. Even then, that explosion wasn't exactly grand:

No Caption Provided

If anything, THAT explosion is what small building level looks like. I'm not implying the Leviathans were small building either, they were clearly building/building+ level foes, but Stark had to blow them up from the inside. The small missiles you showed first were a clear step below small building level. Even if I call it building level, I do think Hulk could still survive that, albeit maybe a bit groggy. I'll showcase why in a bit.

With a larger, more direct missile Iron Man is able to do incredible damage, just like he does in this feat, where he blows clean open the wall to one of Thanos' O shaped ships. And keep in mind these ships are insanely durable, massively more so than anything we have on earth:

Ultimately the ship ends up crash landing on Titan at re-entry speeds, smashing through a huge structure and ultimately slamming to the ground. Granted the ship was damaged, but it only broke into pieces. Obviously, if it was made out of regular Earth metals the ship would've been completely destroyed and crushed. So busting clean through one of its wall is obviously highly impressive.

See now this one would actually cause some discomfort to Hulk. It's an impressive feat. However, I think you're underselling the damage they went through. Breaking into pieces shouldn't be preceded by "but it only". The insides of the ship were also thrown completely out of place from what we saw before. The damage to the ship is more than you're letting on.

Needless to say, though, that those missiles are definitely going to be felt by Hulk. I do, however, believe that he can fight through a handful of them should the need arise. I'll showcase why in a minute.

I did have another problem to address first, though...

And Tony can launch multiple of these missiles at once:

Considering the power of the missiles six of them at once, just as he used them here, would definitely do some damage to Hulk, especially since he can shoot them all in one single burst

I really, really hope you're not implying that an armor from 8 years ago is capable of shooting 6 mini-wrist rockets that have equal intensity to a shoulder-mounted rocket from an armor that was not only stated by directors to be a clear step aboveanything Stark had done before, but also just way more advanced? I mean the missiles themselves aren't even the same. The ship one is pure impact, the one on the drones actually burned them a bit before exploding.

These are NOT the same missiles as the ones on the ship. To claim otherwise is to be disingenuous. I also doubt those are gonna hurt Hulk either.

Anyways, down to the feat that I believe will allow Hulk to tank most of Iron Man's firepower and then some. The feat I've referenced can be found in THIS video. It's too long to put in gif form.

Unfortunately, it's not time stamped, but at 8:59, Hulk begins getting to get barraged by Chitauri chariot fire, at least two dozen of them, non-stop. We see him get back up two minutes later at 10:59 with nothing but a nosebleed. The Chitauri are gone in that sequence, meaning that they finally stopped blasting him. There were, however, a likely handul of cuts. In the movie he starts getting blasted at the 2:02:45 mark, and is seen getting back up at the 2:06:00 mark. That's three minutes and 15 seconds of sustained Chitauri fire tanked with just a nosebleed. However, they were gone, so it was likely less time. Even if we take the original two minute time to account for events possibly happening at the same time, that's a long-ass time to be under sustained fire from over two dozen chariots. A meager two chariots did this:

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These two Chitauri chariots were dealing insane damage, visibly destroying the concrete and blowing up a decent portion of the building. But Hulk took destruction that would be over twelve times this, given that more blasters would cause more chain reactions.

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He actually seems only pressured by the initial barraged, taken a back, maybe even in pain, but not necessarily hurt. He came out of the ordeal relatively unscathed save for that nosebleed, which given the power of these blasts is actually insanely impressive.

Arguably the most dangerous weapon in his arsenal is his lasers, in their debut appearance they cut through an army of solid metal heavily armored drones and through several trees, and what's so impressive about it is that they just slice through all of it like butter without ever actually being stopped. Hulk better have some insane heat resistance if he wants to tank these lasers without damage.

As I showed above, Hulk took that lightning from Thor in their fight. Lightning is known for being five times hotter than the sun. Other than that, I can't recall a single named foe that Stark has used lasers on. Not Ultron, not Loki, not Thanos, not any of his own villains. I don't believe lasers are going to be much of a factor in this fight. He could've used them against Hulk during his Veronica fight, but he didn't, which could at least hint at the fact that he knew they'd be useless.

So yea, I fully believe that Stark's repulsors will be annoyances at best and his missiles, while powerful, are only going to be slightly more of a factor. They might tickle Hulk, but he's gone through much worse.

Speed & Mobility

Needless to say, I disagree with a handful of things in this portion.

Independent/Generic Feats

Here, after Iron Man's helmet warns him that a missile has been shot at him, Tony casually dodges it. Keep in mind that he dodged the missile explicitly after it was fired. This feat already matches Hulk's most impressive speed showing which is catching a rocket that was fired at him. And this is still Tony's lowest end:

Well, you mention it for me, so I'll just post it and leave it there.

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These things are roughly 650mph.

Whilst attacking a heavily fortified HYDRA base Iron Man dodges shots from several energy cannons after they've been fired. And this is highly impressive because this same energy was shown to move just as fast as machine gun fire:

I'm fairly certain that Hulk has never legitimately bullet timed, let alone dodged a barrage of machine gun speed energy blasts, so already I think we can agree that Tony holds a comfortable speed edge here.

You're right, MCU Hulk has never bullet timed.

Anyways, the feat shows great mobility from Stark's part in the air, but there's really no way to apply it to a ground fight. As for the scaling, I also disagree with it. There was a keen difference between the artillery fire and the gunfire. The artillery fire was bigger and exploded, the gunfire was just that. I highly doubt they were the same speed.

Even then, I'm not going to actually contest Stark's mobility and speed edge. He definitely has it. I will, however, contest how large the edge is and a lot of the things you mentioned for counters.

Thor Scaling

And this is clearly displayed by scaling off of characters both have fought as well:

In their fight in Avengers Iron Man is repeatedly shown outmaneuvering and blitzing Thor using his mobility and speed. We see Tony objectively outbullrushing Thor in the first GIF, and slamming him into the side of a mountain, in the second Tony outright blitzes Thor and hurls him into a tree, and in the third Iron Man uses his speed and mobility to dodge Thor/knock him down, and then to blitz him once again. Obviously, Thor landed blows throughout this fight as well, and at one point he even briefly outperformed Tony in H2H combat, however, throughout the fight Iron Man landed more attacks (Thor landed 8 and Iron Man landed 12) and clearly had the speed/mobility advantage. Now let us contrast this to Hulk's performance against the God of Thunder:

In their first fight in the Avengers, it's made clear that Hulk is simply not on Thor's level of speed, and the Thunder God repeatedly humiliates Hulk in CQC. The instances where Hulk actually manages to land hits are due to his physicality, not his speed. For example when Thor catches Hulk's punch and the two begin to grapple Hulk manages to tag him only because both of Thor's arms were occupied to keep Hulk's strength at bay. The next time Hulk actually lands a hit is when Thor jumps on the Hulk's back, at which point Hulk uses his strength to jump through the ceiling, which leads to Thor being stunned allowing Hulk to tag the God of Thunder for the third time. This GIF clearly displays that Thor is simply faster than Hulk, and keep in mind that he didn't have his hammer here, which increases his range and mobility greatly (he obviously had the hammer whilst fighting Tony). And this isn't the only time the two have fought:

In their longer, more recent, and most famous fight we see just how large the speed gap between the two is. Over a nearly 45 second period, we see Thor land 11 blows and outmaneuver Hulk to get him into a sleeper hold. Meanwhile, Hulk swings at Thor 6 times, and the God of Thunder casually dodges all of his attempts. It is very clear that Thor is far above Hulk in speed, and again Thor didn't have his hammer here. Yet due to Iron Man's excellent reaction speed and insane maneuverability he was actually able to outperform Thor, despite the fact that Thor had much better range and maneuverability than when he fought Hulk.

Well obviously I'm not going to contest the fact that Thor was dancing around Hulk for a large portion of the fight. This is an objective fact that anyone who saw the movie can attest to. There are a couple gripes I have in regards to Iron Man vs Thor, though.

For instance, your first gif of Stark objectively outbullrushing Thor... I don't really see how that's relevant in terms of combat speed. Your second scan is far more combat applicable, and watching the scene on YT, I have no gripes with it. He legitimately went at Thor and grabbed him before the latter could react. Could that happen here? Possibly. I doubt it, though, given Hulk's feat of catching an RPG which should be much faster than Stark was moving in that scene.

Your third feat is the one I have gripes with, though. Stark is on the floor, and all he does is move away from getting hit. Let's look at the way you presented it:

and in the third Iron Man uses his speed and mobility to dodge Thor/knock him down, and then to blitz him once again.

I disagree with this interpretation. All Stark does is merely boost away from Thor before he himself gets hit, then comes back around to hit him again before he could get up. Hardly indicative of genuinely outspeeding someone. It shows that Stark is willing to fight dirty and has more means of escape, sure, but calling it bona fide blitzing and outspeeding is a bit duplicitous.

At best these are showings of mobility, albeit handy mobility, but not exactly pure CQC. You yourself mentioned the fact that in actual H2H, Thor was clearly the better fighter. Let's look at that:

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All of your Thor scaling gifs for Stark are merely for going in and out of combat. In actual h2h combat, something inarguably far more pertinent to this match-up, we see Stark get casually dominated. It wasn't even a surprise attack either, given that he actually threw the first punch and initiated the sequence. I'm decently sure this is the only sequence in the fight that contained actual H2H combat. The rest of the stuff Stark did is useful, but again, not bona fide CQC.

As I said earlier, I won't even try and contest Thor > Hulk in the mobility department, but I did have to address it. However, another incredibly important factor to keep in mind (something I'm surprised you don't know, or just refused to show) is that Thor was weakened. Odin mentioned in a Dark World tie-in comic that using Dark Energy to send Thor to Earth would have a "cost" to both of them, that there are risks involved (link). In fact, the tie in's final page has him looking like this, right before the confrontation with Stark (from the very next issue). This will be cited again in another interesting scaling bit of yours.

Cull Scaling

And Tony loves to abuse his range and maneuverability especially when fighting bricks, just look at his fight with Cull Obsideon for example:

As you can see Iron Man only actually engages Cull Obsideon in CQC once throughout the entire fight, otherwise using his flight and range to attack Cull and dodge his blows. And Hulk's weapons don't have the range or versatility that Cull's does, it can turn into a shield, it can extend and turn into a ranged object, it can turn into a grabbing tool, and it also is durable enough to block Iron Man's attacks, whereas Hulk's weapons will just get blown to pieces or knocked out of his hands right off the bat.

First I wanted to address the notion that Hulk's weapons will be blown to pieces off the bat. While they themselves have no durability feats, the meager fact that they're strong enough to NOT immediately break on impact with behemoths like the Hulk and Thor should more than suggest that they're at least meant to be incredibly tough. His hammer survived the impact of being thrown into an alien wall that broke into pieces when Thor-level strength sent the Hulk flying, tearing that same wall. In fact, when Hulk directly hit his hammer, it didn't break into pieces:

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It was merely knocked out of Thor's hands. Thor's shield was actually shattered completelyon impact with this hammer. His axe should at least have similar durability. Lastly, his armor wasn't damaged from Thor's first huge lightning punch which left electricity coursing throughout the Hulk, and it stands to reason his weapons are made out of a similar metal.

However, there's a stark difference see what i did there?............. okay, i'll stop :( between Cull and Hulk's weapons. Where I agree that Cull has more versatility than Hulk does with his weapons, Hulk's style of weapon was very different.

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Where Cull had a shield for defense and thus could stop to block a few blows, all the Hulk has is two giant weapons. Two giant weapons that he seems adept at using, though. In the above gif he went at Thor relentlessly until getting a hit in, no stop in between. Now sure, the Hulk is Thor's friend and Thor was holding back, but it's not like Thor wants to get hit. He knows how strong Hulk is. Contrast the above, to say this gif of Cull. Cull doesn't necessarily struggle to swing his weapon, but it takes him far longer than Hulk. He's not swinging it as easily as Hulk is. Hulk doesn't just swing them around like an idiot either:

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He missed a leap because Thor moved, but immediately turned that into a hammer-handed backhand that sent Thor flying. The damage would likely have been far more significantly if Thor didn't have his shield up, but that's aside the point for now. Hulk is just brute force. There might be slight skill here and there, but at the end of the day, all he wants to do is hit you.

While Stark may have similar success with Banner as he did with Cull, it stands to reason that he may have similar failures as well.

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The first scan shows Stark getting caught while flying around in mid-air by Cull. Granted it was with a grab from his weapon, an option Hulk doesn't have, but it is in fact a viable tag.

The second scan is, to me, the most interesting. The fight picks up just after a cut to Maw/Strange, and Stark has a shield up. By this point in time, Spidey is in the fray as well, helping Stark to combat Cull. What I most want you to note is the gear that Stark has up: a nanotech shield. Shields are, first and foremost, defensive weapons, meaning that Stark knows he can't evade forever, EVEN THOUGH he has back-up. He knew he was going to get hit. He can't evade forever.

The third is self explanatory, he gets hit by Cull mid dodge-attempt.

So yes, while Stark can play the long game for what could end up being a long time, he's not going to be doing it for long. The only difference between Cull hitting Tony and Hulk hitting Tony is that Banner's blows will have afar more powerful effect. A shield-shattering blow that still sent Thor flying dozens of feet with a meager backhammer hit is going to hit Stark pretty hard. More on that in the strength section, though.

Even then, Hulk doesn't really need the weapons. Once Stark sees that his ranged attacks are going ineffective or just not enough, he'll have to resort to CQC, which is around when you'll start bringing out those Thanos feats. I'll get to that in the physicals sections as well.

Super Soldier Scaling + Analyze Fight Pattern

Oh boy...

So clearly Tony prefers to use his mobility/range advantages, especially against bricks, and that coupled, with his superior speed, will make it very difficult for the Hulk to tag him, but even if Tony does get forced into CQC I'm still confident that he can outmaneuver Hulk in that aspect as well:

(Bet you didn't think that a GIF from this fight scene would end up in one of my posts did ya?) Due to Iron Man's underrated and highly effective fight pattern analyzing software Stark was able to completely outmaneuver, pummel, and overall humiliate Steve in H2H combat. To the point where the super soldier was totally unable to tag Tony (until Bucky distracted him). And Banner's record against super solider's is fairly interesting:

In this instance, Blonsky, who had recently been juiced up on the super soldier serum (and Ross explicitly stated that the dose was very small) completely humiliates and dodges 8 blows from the Hulk whilst also manages to get several clean gunshots off on Banner. And keep in mind that all of the super soldiers have been shown to be able to keep up with each other comfortably, so Cap and Blonsky should certainly be comparable, especially considering the fact that Blonsky was given a small dose of the SSS.

So Iron Man, by analyzing Hulk's fight pattern should certainly be able to outskill/outmaneuver the Green Goliath in CQC, especially considering the fact that Iron Man also holds a solid reaction speed edge.

First I have to emphasize: Tony Stark will not analyze Hulk's fight pattern. Now let me re-emphasize: Tony Stark will not analyze Hulk's fight pattern. Let's reiterate: Tony Stark will not analyze Hulk's fight pattern. This one is important too: Tony Stark will not analyze Hulk's fight pattern.

It's a simple matter here, really... Hulk has no skill to be analyzed. He has moments of skill (which mostly stem from experience, not actual technical ability), but for the most part, all he does is brute force his way to a victory. Moves here and there don't compare to the years of formal, actual training that Cap possesses, nor do they compare to Cap's actual, tested skill in combat. In fact, it's highly similar to Stark's own fight against Captain Rogers and Sergeant Barnes: he lands blows not due to any formal training, but just picking up moves from years on the job. Lastly, this seems like a tool that would have been insanely handy during the events of Infinity War.

Even then, the circumstances are far different as well. Against Cap, Stark had a pathetic armor, far less space than he does here, had already damaged parts (targeting system, flying, a gauntlet was already crushed by Bucky, he had... either a concussion or contusion, etc).

Let's take a look at what happens when Stark doesn't use this system:

parts cut out (Rhodey chasing Sam, Buck vs T'Challa)
parts cut out (Rhodey chasing Sam, Buck vs T'Challa)

At the beginning of the big team fight during the Airport Battle, Cap and Stark have a brief scuffle that Cap clearly dominates, easily dodging a blow and hitting the armored Avenger, then swiftly blocking and pushing Stark back, leaving him open to an arrow from Clint.

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Here, Stark has Bucky on the floor, gets hit by Cap's shield, gets up before Cap gets the shield back, and still gets rammed before having the opportunity to do anything.

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Here he seemingly trades evenly with the Super Soldier, save for the fact that only one of them is fast and skilled enough to get the other in a chokehold.

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Even Bucky was able to swiftly dodge a blow and get Iron Man in a position to be tag-teamed by the duo. While Buck does later on get punched twice, Bucky comes off looking far more skilled in that exchange, blocking many blows and getting him into position for another brutal punch that almost costs Stark his arc reactor.

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And of course, the infamous pre-"analyze his fight pattern" sequence. Note that this scene is actually a good bit longer than seen here, as I edited out all the parts that have Tony's face on them.

Let's compare the above gifs to those you showed for Blonsky:

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Out of the two combatants in this fight, only one of them was capable of fully keeping track of their opponent, pressing them defensively for a while, and actively engage in a fight. Not only this, but Hulk was using two unconventional weapons in the scenario. Here, he not only has more range, he's shown at least basic level training with his axe + hammer. Now sure, Cap is superior to Blonsky on-paper, but as I mentioned just then, there are a few factors that would make the situation far closer between Hulk and Stark.

Before I get called out for using Civil War armor feats, I do need to highlight that my opponent brought it up first. I do need to reiterate the idea that Tony Stark will not analyze Hulk's fight pattern, though. Let's recall that the ONLY time he used it was when he was already overwhelmed. It would've been handy to use before that, say during the 2v1 when he was getting the tar beat out of him. Replace Cap in the gif I posted earlier with the freaking Hulk... how do you think that's gonna go down?

So to put it bluntly, while I don't disagree that Stark is the more mobile and maneuverable of the two fighters in this debate, I do believe you overhyped him quite a bit.

  • You didn't mention that he faced off against a weakened Thor and misrepresented at least one of those gifs (the "blitz" on a recovering Thor). Stark also got demolished in pure H2H, which is likely what most of this battle will be (i.e Stark's fight with Thanos).
  • As I mentioned, I'm not going to touch Hulk vs Thanos because it's true: Thor is indeed the faster combatant in comparison to Hulk.
  • Tony Stark will not analyze Hulk's fight pattern.
  • Your Cull gifs were fair, but as I mentioned, where Stark experienced success against an inferior opponent to Hulk, it's not unlikely that he'll face even worse failure against a superior opponent to Cull.
  • Tony Stark will not analyze Hulk's fight pattern.
  • Hulk doesn't really have a fighting style to be analyzed, and it was a function Stark only used when on the brink. He also never used it again. Replace Cap with the freaking Hulk when Stark used it, and he's not gonna live to use it.
  • Tony Stark will not analyze Hulk's fight pattern.
  • Hulk also did far better against a Super Soldier than Stark did... It really wasn't even a close comparison. Stark was getting blitzed left and right, and at one point couldn't even react properly to an absolute onslaught. Hulk had enough dexterity and mobility to keep track of Blonsky and even press the offensive, something that Stark didn't do until he pulled a move he never pulled again.

Hulk's Striking & Weapons vs Stark's Durability

The Axe vs Stark's Piercing Resistance

The axe, hammer and armor were honestly more for the cool factor. The axe is, in every essence of the word, absolutely featless. The only thing I could argue is that Hulk's insane strength would be enough to pierce through to Stark, but I doubt even that.

This is another category that is critical in Iron Man's victory, his durability is pretty insane, potentially above Hulk's. I'll start out by displaying his piercing durability and considering the fact that one of Hulk's main forms of damage output will be piercing considering the fact that he has his ax in this fight:

Iron Man
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Here Iron Man takes repeated shots from F-22 raptors, and these things have incredibly powerful bullets. The bullets are 20 mm and have a muzzle velocity of over Mach 3, so no selling these is a highly impressive feat, and he has better:

Iron Man
Iron Man

In this instance Iron Man tanks a tank she straight to the face, and gets up seconds later completely unphased.

There's no caveats here, these are two of the most straightforward feats there are. That said, I do believe Hulk might have a feat that would allow the axe to cut Stark, that mainly being the following:

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Using a Leviathan's own metal, after taking it out completely he casually pierces the Leviathan armor. If you'll recall, this is something that even Stark's lasers couldn't do, as they'd run out of power before doing so. This is certainly insanely impressive, and given the durability of it's sibling weapon (I showed the hammer not breaking upon impact with a double-pound from Hulk), it wouldn't be illogical to assume it could at least dent Stark's armor.

Hulk's Fists and Hammer vs Stark's Blunt Force Durability

Moving on to blunt force durability:

Iron Man blitzes at Whiplash, who proceeds to completely overpower his blitz and send Tony reeling back hundreds of feet and clean through a large wooden arch.

Um, that's a hundred feet at worst. There is no possible way it exceeds a hundred feet... Either way, as you said, this is a lower end feat, so I'll just move on.

Here Iron Man tanks a cheapshot hammer throw from Thor, and gets up seconds later completely and utterly unphased.

I would say Stark himself was utterly unphased, but the suit's HUD display when it cut to Stark's face actually fizzled out for a bit. The suit was definitely affected by this blow.

And this is highly impressive considering just how powerful Thor's hammer throws are:

A single hammer throw from Thor sends Malekith flying hundreds of feet through two huge stone pillars, and into a car hard enough to ragdoll and completely deform it. So effectively no selling a hammer throw from Thor is highly impressive.

As I showed earlier, Thor was weakened throughout his exchange. I don't think the exact same scaling would apply, not to mention that clearly his blow against Malekith was far superior. Malekith broke two stone pillars and was sent flying, Stark broke a tree and immediately landed. It's an impressive showing to take a Mjolnir throw from Thor, but given the context, it's not what it's hyped up to be.

But he has more:

Whilst restarting the Helicarrier turbine Iron Man ends up getting hit over and over and over again by the multi-hundred-ton propellers. And these propellers were moving at outright insane speeds, they outpaced Tony (which is how they tagged him) and he was moving pretty damn fast:

As you can see when Tony was pushing the propellor it was moving insanely fast, making 5+ full rotations of the massive turbine every second. And again the propellors ended up outpacing Tony, so essentially Iron Man was repeatedly battered by multi-hundred ton propellors that were moving at sub to supersonic speeds. I can't see Hulk replicating that level of damage output easily.

Honestly, I can agree with you that this is not something Hulk can replicate casually. It's an insane feat, and those speeds are nothing to joke around with. Hulk might struggle to hurt Stark in this fight, but I do believe he can do it. I'll get into Hulk's striking feats in a bit, but it's worth noting that the Avengers script notes that Stark's armor is "heavily damaged, hardly keeping him up":

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So while it's a great durability, it's certainly nearing Stark's limit.

Using his powerful telekinetic abilities Ebony Maw uppercuts Iron Man hundreds upon hundreds of feet into the air using the ground beneath Tony's feet. Yet seconds later Tony reappears seemingly unharmed. A hit like this is certainly more powerful than Hulk's average blow, and Iron Man has endured attacks that Hulk simply could never replicate without a massive amount of momentum:

My only beef with this is that Maw's hit was most certainly not "hundreds upon hundreds" of feet into the air, that's maybe 200ft tops... Far from Hulk to surpass, let alone replicate.

Here Iron Man endures a hammer/ax throw from Cull Obsideon that send him flying a huge distance, clean through a building, and then several hundred feet after that into a tree. And the distance that Iron Man was hit is pretty insane:

You can pretty clearly see that Iron Man was many blocks and several thousand feet away from the park considering the fact that large buildings were clearly visible in the distance many many blocks away (and obviously there are no buildings in the park). So Tony was hit many thousands of feet, through a building, and he still had enough momentum to fly a couple hundred feet into the park after that. I can't see Hulk replicating that level of force with a punch, and Tony got up from that hit more or less unphased.

This one I can agree, basically fully with. Hulk isn't putting out that much damage casually. The hit is insane, and Stark tanking it is actually one insane feat. All of this said, it's time to get into what makes me believe Hulk can put down Stark eventually. First are foremost, we have the infamous Leviathan punch:

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I'm sure we've all seen this feat, so I'll only mention it briefly. Hulk, freshly transformed, managed to fully stop the momentum of a Chitauri Leviathan with a single punch. Even after being stopped, it still kept trying to move forward, and instead of moving the Hulk, it flipped over. Given that these things were casually going through skyscrapers, it's actually pretty insane.

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Having thrown a car into the monstrous Hulkbuster mark I suit, Hulk immediately follows up with a punch straight to the core of car, sending the incredibly heavily armored suit flying back a respectable distance. Note for the impact moves cars and trucks, as well as making the suit leave dents on the concrete floor.

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Here, the Hulk punches a damaged, but still heavy vibranium Ultron who goes flying so hard that we can't even see him land. While not equal to Cull's hit on Stark in the battle of New York during the events of Infinity War, it's certainly very close and repeated hits like this are going to be hard to shrug off, even for Stark.

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A feat perhaps more fitting to this situation, given Hulk has two weapons that in his hands will be devastating, Hulk using a half of a police car in each hand absolutely crushes Abomination deep into sheer asphalt, and we can (albeit barely) even see Hulk moving a bit downwards. That's how hard he's hitting Abomination.

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After entering a test of strength with Thor, Hulk punches the Thunder God clean through what appeared to be weapons crates, completely demolishing them and with Thor still having enough force to knock over more weapons crates. Not only this, but we see Thor wipe something from his face, something that the official script confirms to be blood. Of course, drawing blood from even an at-the-time weakened Thor is insane given that I don't recall Stark ever doing this, even with 400% power.

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Lastly, in an incredibly insane showing of striking, Hulk casually backhands a replacement part for the Hulkbuster Mark I suit, which not only explodes the front of the suit and sends parts of it flying in every direction, it also completely one-shots the satellite that was housing the Veronica armor. Given that both of these had to have, at the very least, similar components to the armor itself, this is not something I see Stark tanking casually. The part and the satellite may not have been as durable as the real thing because they had no inner shell (there's a regular Stark suit in this version of Hulkbuster, I believe this was in the MCU Visual Dictionary, but I'm not 100% certain), but it's still made out of the same components externally, making this feat extremely impressive.

Stark's Strength & Striking vs Hulk's Strength & Durability

There were, seemingly, two aspects to your strength section. I'll try and divide the feats, the way I believe you presented them, between a direct test of strength and striking vs durability. I'll begin with the latter.

Hulk's Durability vs Stark's Striking

In an impressive showing of strength, the Mark II tosses Tony in the Mark III clean through a solid concrete floor, and into another one, making a massive dent. And when Rhodey flies back up through the floor that he just hurled Tony through, we see that it is several feet thick.

Several feet thick is an insane overstatement, we only see a small part of it that's like a foot at most.

With an exceedingly casual kick, Iron Man sends his multi-ton Rolls Royce limousine flying well over a dozen feet away. And again this is still incredibly low end for Iron Man. Let's start getting into some more impressive territory.

With one massive kick, Iron Man smashes Thor clean through a tree so hard that the God of Thunder's hammer is knocked clean out of his hand whilst he's in ragdoll. And this is very impressive considering the fact that in the same movie it took this much force to do the same thing:

After falling 30,000 feet and slamming to the ground, creating a massive crater/dirt explosion, Thor drops his hammer. Really only when Thor is hit with insane amounts of force like this does he drop his weapon, and Iron Man made him do so with a kick. This is a highly impressive display of physicality.

You posted three feats for Stark that include damage output. To be quite frank, the first two are what you yourself called low end and I think we both know that neither will so much as tickle Hulk. Your second feat is far more up to par, but I still have quite a few gripes with it. For starters, you seem to be implying that the minimum amount of force needed for Thor to drop his hammer is a 30,000 foot fall (at least, that's the connotation I got from "it took this much force to do the same thing"). However, given that we don't know if a fall from a smaller, but still significant height (say, 20 or 25 thousand feet) would also make him drop his hammer.

Secondly, and far more importantly, that's not a fall from 30,000ft. I mean, the cage fell 30,000 feet, but Thor kicked right out of it. He applied an altogether new force, and while a being of his strength and physicality might create quite the amount of force, I don't think it's equivalent to the fall. For starters, you said that he created a "massive crater/dirt explosion", which is outright false if I'm being honest. It wasn't even larger than the one the cage made, which alone should indicate that Thor didn't tank a fall from 30,000 feet, especially since the cage hit what appears to be a rock formation, something that would be much harder to create a dust explosion on. But again the kicker of this feat is that Thor created a new force entirely separate from the fall, meaning the feat is actually far less impressive than you made it out to be.

However, even with that feat, Stark is going to find that he'll struggle immensely to hurt the Hulk. Let's take a look:

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During the battle with the Hulkbuster Mark I suit, Stark used the armor's incredible strength to grab the Hulk and dip him headfirst into concrete for several feet. Not only does it prove utterly useless, the Hulk proceeds to kick the suit right off of him. Already, this is something I see Stark replicating given he doesn't have the Hulkbuster's sheer physicality.

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Later on in the same fight, Hulk is running at a Stark in the air who hits him with a heavy kick, slams him full force with an elevator that breaks on impact with the Hulk, and finishes the combo with a momentum-adided punch that he winded up from all the way behind. What does it do? It knocks out a tooth from Hulk and prompts a swift apology from Stark, who immediately gets slammed through concrete. Again, I don't believe this is something that a regular Stark is replicating casually.

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Next we're going to take a look at one of the few attacks in the entire MCU to ever daze the Hulk. This comes from the big guy's fight with the God of Thunder himself in Ragnarok. Having kicked Thor into the wall, he rushes at him, but Thor moves, gets the hammer of out the wall, and proceeds to absolutely wallop Hulk, who demolishes dozens of feet of alien metal that's kept him locked inside of the stadium for a while. He's dazed, certainly, but far from knocked out. The only thing this does is cause him to fix his helmet, pretend to fall for Thor's "sun's getting real low" and, then beat the ever-loving crap out of him.

Given the sheer distance of travelled, we can logically assume that the force with which Thor hit Hulk had to be insane, especially given how heavy the Hulk is relative to Thor.

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Lastly, here we have Thor hitting Hulk with that giant-ass war hammer not one, not two, but three consecutive times. He utterly tanks the first three, and gets sent flying once more by the fourth, but this only serves to utterly piss him the hell off, and he goes on a new assault that sends the hammer flying right out of Thor's hands. Given the momentum we saw Thor hit Hulk with the first time (above this), even a third of that force in each of these hammer strikes is incredible to utterly tank, especially right after the initial attack.

Strength vs Strength: the Challenger vs the Challenged

But if you want something a little more quantifiable:

In this highly impressive feat from a tie-in comic Iron Man, with one fluid motion, grabs one tank and uses it like a baseball bat to bludgeon and destroy another tank. Keep in mind that the most common tank used currently, the M1 Abrams, weighs roughly 68 tons. If Tony can swing around 68 tons that casually he can certainly give Hulk some trouble in the strength department. And there's plenty of other material to support this notion:

During the famous forest fight Thor and Iron Man actually grapple midway through, and for several seconds it remains evenly matched. Granted Thor does begin to gradually overpower Tony and dent the forearms of his armor, but the fact of the matter is that Iron Man was able to grapple with Thor for roughly 5-8 seconds, and whilst towards that end he was getting overpowered, it still took effort from Thor, and Odinson never managed to fully overpower him. So while Thor is certainly above Mark VI Tony in strength, they are clearly comparable. This is especially impressive considering the fact that later on in the same movie Thor and Hulk are portrayed as peers in strength:

As you can clearly see Thor and Hulk are not far apart in terms of strength, Thor is able to block one of Hulk's hit with one arm, and then towards the end of the gif, using both arms, Thor manages to overpower Hulk's arm. So anyway just to conclude the scaling train Mark VI Iron Man is close to Thor in strength, and Thor is a near equal to Hulk (though Hulk is still slightly superior) in strength. Thus Tony isn't far off from Hulk in strength and certainly has enough physicality to contend with/hurt the Green Behemoth.

I'll try and keep this short given that you yourself admitted Stark is the clear inferior physically, but it might take a while. For starters, your logic for Stark being able to physically contend with Hulk almost literally boils down to: Stark is physically inferior to a guy who's physically inferior to the Hulk. Once again, however, I have to mention that Thor was weakened throughout the events of the Avengers movie, meaning that the gap between Thor and Stark is actually larger than originally thought.

To keep this train going, I wouldn't call getting your armor completely crushed comparable strength, and certainly not that first punch, in your gif, which Thor casually moves out of the way. To sum up this mini portion, the gap between Thor and Stark is wider than portrayed, meaning the gap between Hulk and Stark is also wider than originally let on.

However, I believe the gap between Thor and Hulk is also wider than you let on. He blocks one hit from Hulk, but he's struggling like hell and he immediately needs a second arm to halt Hulk's one arm. However, the biggest thing I have a gripe with is that Thor didn't actually overpower the Hulk. We can see in the gif that you provided that even after putting that second arm in, Thor is struggling like hell to hold off the Hulk. He does, however, then rise. That's the caveat though: he rises almost too fast, especially for a guy who was just struggling immensely to hold off said arm. I alternatively propose that Hulk lifted Thor himself, in order to punch him. Let's look here:

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Right before Hulk punches Thor, we get this shot of Thor's head above Hulk's shoulder. If we compare this to other shots of the two standing together, such as the Revengers scene or the Leviathan punch, we can see that Thor is nowhere near that tall.

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2

So unless he, while massively struggling with both arms to stop Hulk's one arm managed to find the strength to straight up jump before being punched by the Hulk, I don't believe Thor overpowered Hulk at all. Thus, the gap between this weaker Thor and Hulk is also larger than let on.

Your original scaling looked something like Hulk > A1 Thor > Stark. Given all the input I've given, I believe it looks something more like Hulk >> A1 Thor >> Stark. However, given that we know Thor was weakened against Stark, I can throw this even more off balance by proving that Hulk is superior to a healthy Thor, which is what I'll now do.

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During their fight in Thor: Ragnarok, wherein Thor was beating Hulk to the ground repeatedly, we see a moment of anger which allows him to completely and utterly stop Thor's hammer strike and casually move it out of the way with a single arm. Note that in this instance Thor had gravity (going down) and momentum (a nice jump) on his side, yet this didn't stop Hulk from casually stopping him. This brings me to my next point, which is that even if Stark can contend with Hulk for a while (and I highly doubt that), it's not going to be for long. As the battle rages on, Hulk will get madder. This is something that he's shown repeatedly, even against Stark:

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Doubling as a durability feat, where Hulk gets slammed into the ground by the Hulkbuster, he also takes an insane amount of repeated punches from the huge suit. Not only does he effectively tank these, he proceeds to get angry enough to completely stop the hand from even budging an inch, which is insanely impressive considering the speeds at which it was moving as well as the fact that each punch was powerful enough to hit Hulk in the head and move his entire body.

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He also showcased this against Abomination, a being originally stronger than him who he ended up completely overpowering, dazing with a mere headbutt, and throwing into a wall. This leads me to believe that even if I submit that Stark can contend with the Hulk physically - and I don't believe he can, based on feats presented - that said contention will not last long.

Conclusion

While it's true that the Hulk is a one-trick pony, I believe that his one trick will be more than enough to stop Stark. His firepower isn't going to bother Hulk that much, given his feats of already no-selling repulsors and being able to tank sustained Chitauri fire, and he's physically going to mess the crap out of the Hulk. While Stark possesses a speed and mobility edge, one that you yourself showed he abuses with bricks, you failed to mention that he got caught repeatedly and that when abusing said edge against a brick, that he utterly failed to damage Cull in any way. He got tagged repeatedly by a guy basically inferior to Hulk in every way aside from weaponry, and had to be saved from him not once, but twice. What happens if Hulk smacks Stark out of the sky with a hammer strike? He might not live to tell the tale.

This fight will take too long if Tony stays in the sky, and his mobility can only help so much when Hulk can basically no-sell everything that Stark sends his way. That only leaves the CQC option, an option that'll bring Stark out of the sky and into the clutches of the Hulk. This will spell disaster, because once Hulk catches Stark, he's not letting go. He can't contend physically and his durability will get eventually taxed, meanwhile Hulk can take absolutely everything that Stark can dish out.

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#40 Posted by ThEBeStOfTheBeST (10498 posts) - - Show Bio
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#41 Posted by ArkhamAsylum3 (3401 posts) - - Show Bio

Just finished reading through it.

Great post.

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#42 Edited by APEX_pretador (19693 posts) - - Show Bio
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#43 Posted by blackpantherisb (6959 posts) - - Show Bio
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#44 Posted by TonyStark6999 (2263 posts) - - Show Bio

T4V

Online
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#45 Edited by APEX_pretador (19693 posts) - - Show Bio

@blackpantherisb:

The hydra chitauri fire Vs machine gun bullet gif.

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Don't worry I am just messing with you. Just seeing this highlighted and used is good.

Just tag after every post