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Posted by EyeDCyou (7512 posts) 4 years, 7 months ago

Poll: Martian Manhunter vs. OF Thor (118 votes)

Martian Manhunter 31%
OF Thor 65%

This sparked some debate over on a Justice League v. Avengers thread, so I decided to bring it out as it's own question.

Rules

  • No BFR
  • Pre-52 MMH
  • Win by any means (other than BFR)
  • Fight takes place in New York City

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#51 Posted by Sy8000 (35230 posts) - - Show Bio

Telepathy ftw.

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#52 Posted by random_nerd (849 posts) - - Show Bio

@jmarshmallow: ive seen u in a couple other threads, u seem to get around, i gotta ask why u always end ur comments with ur name.

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#53 Posted by iDude (1148 posts) - - Show Bio

Looked at OF Thor's feats, and I gotta go with Thor here.

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#54 Posted by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@jmarshmallow: ive seen u in a couple other threads, u seem to get around, i gotta ask why u always end ur comments with ur name.

Good question! Funny enough, I actually have a valid reason, depending on how you look at it.

The short answer is: It's my signature, makes me stand out.

The real reason, with actual substance to it was explained here.

Check Post #54, I explain it in pretty good depth.

Hope that helped!

Jmarshmallow

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#55 Posted by okayalright_44 (1524 posts) - - Show Bio
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#56 Posted by Z___ (1003 posts) - - Show Bio

Each to their own. Both are arguably close in stats, they both have a versatile assortment of powers of which combined can equate to a stalemate for a debate imo.

Z'

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#57 Posted by lol (5441 posts) - - Show Bio
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#58 Posted by lol (5441 posts) - - Show Bio

@z___ said:

Each to their own. Both are arguably close in stats, they both have a versatile assortment of powers of which combined can equate to a stalemate for a debate imo.

Z'

who is your avatar?

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#59 Edited by BlueBeetle1 (1331 posts) - - Show Bio

Regardless of the version of Thor, MMH's TP is enough to handle him.

Jmarshmallow

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#60 Posted by Homer_X (2387 posts) - - Show Bio

MM

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#62 Edited by BlueBeetle1 (1331 posts) - - Show Bio

@kangconquers: ...he has solar system telepathy feats...or was it galaxy wide tp? I cant rememeber. But since of thor has no tp feats, he still wins.

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#63 Posted by termiteone4ever (12795 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor loses . Lets not talk about lesser people with Tp than martain control Thor.

This fight is over before Thor make the first Spin of his hammer. Thor is just not fast enough and would a rough time even Hitting the martain. I have not seen Thor resisted or met any body on martian level and was aiming to control his mind that he resisted

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#64 Posted by deactivated-5a7a162f64fe5 (776 posts) - - Show Bio

I think OF Thor takes most encounters. Some writers seem to think Thor has some degree of TP resistance, but other times he is clearly seen as under telepathic influence.

The one that Martian Manhunter wins is the one where he uses his telepathy first.

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#66 Posted by Kangconquers (1189 posts) - - Show Bio

I think OF Thor takes most encounters. Some writers seem to think Thor has some degree of TP resistance, but other times he is clearly seen as under telepathic influence.

The one that Martian Manhunter wins is the one where he uses his telepathy first.

Thor's inherent TP resistance doesn't matter. The Odin Force is a major amp. Aunt May or Alfred Pennyworth wielding the Odin Force could potentially solo MMH.

Thor loses . Lets not talk about lesser people with Tp than martain control Thor.

This fight is over before Thor make the first Spin of his hammer. Thor is just not fast enough and would a rough time even Hitting the martain. I have not seen Thor resisted or met any body on martian level and was aiming to control his mind that he resisted

This isn't Thor though. This is Odin Force Thor. They aren't equal. That's like using things that have happened to Captain Atom and arguing they can happen to Monarch, or Standard Superman and Superman Prime. It's not an apples to apples conversation.

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#67 Edited by HAMMER_OF_J2 (2738 posts) - - Show Bio

@jmarshmallow said:

Regardless of the version of Thor, MMH's TP is enough to handle him.

Jmarshmallow

The version of Thor kinda does matter I don't think MMH TP can affect RKT (I know this isnt RKT, but still), and maybe warriors madness Thor

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#68 Posted by BlueBeetle1 (1331 posts) - - Show Bio

Of thor doesn't have tp resistance feats

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#69 Posted by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@hammer_of_j2: RKT has no TP resistance feats as far as I know.

Warrior Madness Thor may or may not, I don't know.

Jmarshmallow

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#70 Edited by Noone301994 (22169 posts) - - Show Bio

OF Thor.

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#71 Posted by Kangconquers (1189 posts) - - Show Bio

@hammer_of_j2: RKT has no TP resistance feats as far as I know.

Warrior Madness Thor may or may not, I don't know.

Jmarshmallow

Shouldn't matter. Rune King Thor's power level split the difference between Odin and Galactus. He could solo the entire Martian Race, MMH included. Just completely different power levels.

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#72 Posted by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@jmarshmallow said:

@hammer_of_j2: RKT has no TP resistance feats as far as I know.

Warrior Madness Thor may or may not, I don't know.

Jmarshmallow

Shouldn't matter. Rune King Thor's power level split the difference between Odin and Galactus. He could solo the entire Martian Race, MMH included. Just completely different power levels.

It doesn't matter what his power level is if he doesn't have TP Resistance feats. Especially with a character as ambiguous as RKT.

Jmarshmallow

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#73 Posted by Kangconquers (1189 posts) - - Show Bio

@kangconquers said:

@jmarshmallow said:

@hammer_of_j2: RKT has no TP resistance feats as far as I know.

Warrior Madness Thor may or may not, I don't know.

Jmarshmallow

Shouldn't matter. Rune King Thor's power level split the difference between Odin and Galactus. He could solo the entire Martian Race, MMH included. Just completely different power levels.

It doesn't matter what his power level is if he doesn't have TP Resistance feats. Especially with a character as ambiguous as RKT.

Jmarshmallow

Wouldn't Rune King Thor presumably have any TP feats that any lower level Thors have, since he's Thor with a massive power boost?

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#74 Posted by dondave (41752 posts) - - Show Bio

@kangconquers

This isn't Thor though. This is Odin Force Thor. They aren't equal. That's like using things that have happened to Captain Atom and arguing they can happen to Monarch, or Standard Superman and Superman Prime. It's not an APPLES to apples conversation.

Even with amps it has to be shown that things that affected them previously don't anymore. For example Superman Prime 1 Million still had a weakness for Kryptonite despite all the amps he had. Monarch and Superboy Prime would be assumed to have the same weaknesses as the originals unless proven otherwise.

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#75 Posted by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@jmarshmallow said:

@kangconquers said:

@jmarshmallow said:

@hammer_of_j2: RKT has no TP resistance feats as far as I know.

Warrior Madness Thor may or may not, I don't know.

Jmarshmallow

Shouldn't matter. Rune King Thor's power level split the difference between Odin and Galactus. He could solo the entire Martian Race, MMH included. Just completely different power levels.

It doesn't matter what his power level is if he doesn't have TP Resistance feats. Especially with a character as ambiguous as RKT.

Jmarshmallow

Wouldn't Rune King Thor presumably have any TP feats that any lower level Thors have, since he's Thor with a massive power boost?

Yup. And all of those other TP feats suggest that RKT gets mindraped.

Jmarshmallow

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#76 Posted by TheKing47 (1346 posts) - - Show Bio

@jmarshmallow:

By your logic Abstracts, LT and Celestials get mindraped by MMH too.

OF Thor stomps.

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#77 Edited by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@theking47: LT, Abstracts, and Celestials are universe level.

MMH doesn't have TP feats to suggest that he can use telepathy on a universal scale.

At best his TP is like galaxy+, since he was able to use TP on Dr. Fate and Spectre.

Jmarshmallow

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#78 Edited by eternityx (3000 posts) - - Show Bio

@jmarshmallow:

What? How is this not contradicting what you said to @theking47?

So now you're saying that power levels do matter now, that if you are at a certain level you automatically have TP resistance?

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#79 Posted by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@jmarshmallow:

What? How is this not contradicting what you said to @theking47?

So now you're saying that power levels do matter now, that if you are at a certain level you automatically have TP resistance?

No, I'm saying that MMH doesn't have the TP feats to suggest he can affect characters on a universal scale, unlike RKT who isn't on that level.

Jmarshmallow

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#80 Posted by lordraiden (9663 posts) - - Show Bio

Now how the F%^$ isn't this locked??

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#81 Edited by utkanflash (2396 posts) - - Show Bio

MM with these
regenarate
Invisibilty
integrability

Shap Shiftin
TP and TK
Speed blitzs..

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#82 Posted by TheMagicStik (2552 posts) - - Show Bio

@kangconquers: Having the OF doesn't mean you can utilize it well. Take a look at OKT who had the OF longer than Odin and was barely planetary and got curbed by a guy who was no more than star level. Odin casually destroyed galaxies and had battles that shook the multiverse, he would have no troubles with Gorr.

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#83 Posted by BlackJudas (238 posts) - - Show Bio

Don't know what to say, OF feats are incredible but then again can't MM just go intangible ?

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#84 Posted by Perethorn (6291 posts) - - Show Bio

OF Thor could one shot MMH assuming that he can resist TP.

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#85 Posted by Twix_Right_Side (2406 posts) - - Show Bio

What advantages or changes does OF Thor have that doesn't make this the same as MM vs Thor?

In other words, what are his feats?

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#86 Posted by Dondarrion (62 posts) - - Show Bio

@themagicstik said:

@uugieboogie: Odin has had fights that were casually destroying Galaxies and shaking the entire Multiverse. King Thor with 2 extra Thors lost to Gorr and none of them displayed power much above planetary let alone solar system or Galaxy.

If King Thor was classic Odin level you could throw in 1000 Thors and it wouldn't have been a deciding factor when he obliterated Gorr.

  • The fight with Gorr was different, the weapon he had was made specifically to kill Gods.
  • OKT hasn't had enough showings. He did a lot better against Galactus than Odin did. Odin KO'd himself & went into the Odin sleep. Thor fought a lot longer before getting KO'd & having to get the necrosword
  • The King Thor I think dailybagal was referring to is the non canon one that killed The Thing & Hulk at the sametime while having his connection to the OF temporarily cut by Dr Strange. The same King Thor that took over earth.
  • The part of your post doesn't make sense

Pretty sure it's canon. Just an unrealised future. It all happened in 616.

@dondave said:

@uugieboogie He only shook himself off Moondragon's TP after she'd forced him to have sex with her and had him fight the Avengers. It wasn't after they continually insulted him that he broke free. DSS had no problem getting into Thor's mind, Thor was instead telling him to get out of his mind. He didn't resist Glory either, it was Donald Blake and the other woman praying that that stopped Glory.

As for P5 Emma Frost, her telepathy was terrible. She couldn't even make Red Hulk kills himself while he was still in his human form.

I think he's referring to the sonic bee screams/cries or whatever. They worked in a telepathic sort of manner and Thor resisted them IIRC.

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#87 Posted by Kangconquers (1189 posts) - - Show Bio

MM with these

regenarate

Invisibilty

integrability

Shap Shiftin

TP and TK

Speed blitzs..

The only thing on the table is TP and TK. That's MMH's only leg up on OF Thor, who can tank anything MMH does physically.

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#88 Posted by DarkRaiden (15466 posts) - - Show Bio

Base Thor wins, OF Thor stomps.

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#89 Posted by Z___ (1003 posts) - - Show Bio

@lol: The bad-ass Shinigami from Death Note, Ryuk.

Z'

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#90 Posted by RealityWarper (12333 posts) - - Show Bio

STOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOP !
If I read one more "SPEEDBLITZ" in that thread I lock it by my Force Of Will ! :o

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#91 Posted by lol (5441 posts) - - Show Bio

@theking47: LT, Abstracts, and Celestials are universe level.

MMH doesn't have TP feats to suggest that he can use telepathy on a universal scale.

At best his TP is like galaxy+, since he was able to use TP on Dr. Fate and Spectre.

Jmarshmallow

Spectre is > Universal level

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#92 Posted by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@lol: Sometimes. Other times he can get beat up by powerhouses.

Jmarshmallow

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#93 Posted by reaverlation (25869 posts) - - Show Bio

J'onn

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#94 Posted by dondave (41752 posts) - - Show Bio
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#95 Posted by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave: When what? When does Spectre get beat up powerhouses, or when did Manhunter use TP on him?

Jmarshmallow

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#96 Posted by dondave (41752 posts) - - Show Bio
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#97 Posted by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave: The characters that come to mind are Azmodus, the Shadowpact, Eclipso, Captain Marvel (amped by Enchantress), a couple of minions of Darkseid (who Spectre apparently can't affect due to them being under Anti-Life? I don't get it either), and Vandal Savage/Cain with the Spear of Destiny.

All powerful characters, but none are universal to my knowledge.

Jmarshmallow

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#98 Posted by dondave (41752 posts) - - Show Bio

@jmarshmallow Spectre defeated Azmodus.

When did Shadowpact defeat the Spectre? If they could, why did they run to Black Alice and steal his powers instead of just defeating him themselves.

Eclipso isn't your random powerhouse, he was the Spirit of Wraith before the Spectre was the Spirit of Wrath. Not a low showing.

Captain Marvel was amped by the magic of every magician, demon and god on Earth. Not a low showing.

The Spear of Destiny is one of the few weapons that can kill the Spectre. Vandal Savage using it agaisnt him isn't a low showing.

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#99 Posted by Doctor_Fate500 (251 posts) - - Show Bio

@eyedcyou said:

@jmarshmallow said:

Regardless of the version of Thor, MMH's TP is enough to handle him.

Jmarshmallow

That's basically how I felt.

No his TP is not enough that is stupid in every way shape and form. OF thor with time manipulation is to much for him plus everything else.

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#100 Posted by Jmarshmallow (13840 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave

@jmarshmallow Spectre defeated Azmodus.

Yeah when he ripped him apart and sent him to hell, but IIRC Azmodus trapped Spectre inside Corrigan and gave him amnesia or something like that.

When did Shadowpact defeat the Spectre? If they could, why did they run to Black Alice and steal his powers instead of just defeating him themselves.

Because they couldn't permanently put him down IIRC, but they were still overpowering him I believe.

Eclipso isn't your random powerhouse, he was the Spirit of Wraith before the Spectre was the Spirit of Wrath. Not a low showing.

Does Eclipso have any actual feats besides the Great Flood? Because that's the only one I can think of, and it makes him planetary at best.

Captain Marvel was amped by the magic of every magician, demon and god on Earth. Not a low showing.

Amped to an unknown degree, and basically featless besides that one encounter!

The Spear of Destiny is one of the few weapons that can kill the Spectre. Vandal Savage using it agaisnt him isn't a low showing.

While the Spear of Destiny is one of the few weapons that can actually kill the Spectre, it doesn't mean that any old Joe walking by that happens to pick it up should be able to hurt Spectre! From what I know about him, Vandal Savage should have just been wiped out with a whim, despite him having the Spear.

Jmarshmallow