Madara vs Aizen vs Demon King vs Zeref vs Blackbeard- Read OP.

With energies equalized, Madara literally cannot lose in any way.

Madara has

- immortality

- immunity to any non-senjutsu based attacks

- TSB to negate any attack

- Preta path to absorb any attack

- Mokuton to perpetually drain them

Blackbeard would just blackhole them

@exauce said:

Blackbeard would just blackhole them

that wont even reach the others cuz they fly, that attack is basically useless here

stats equalized = Zeref is the only one than can move here

@thousandsteps:

He gave them seals because that’s how big of a threat Kaguya was and as shown they weren’t capable of putting her down by force.

Madara becoming like Kaguya (God Tree immortality, Rinnesharingan, IT, etc...) was the threat, hence the seals.

The space warping wasn’t a lasting effect and the attack almost killed him.

Keyword being "almost", and that was before absorbing the Shinju, where he claims to have obtained true immortality.

Equalization gives them the energy Madara has which is senjutsu. It would have to be specified that they only received regular chakra not the other way around.

We would need to ask OP for that, since usually energy equalization only refers to chakra in Narutoverse's case.

And having spiritual energy in Naruto never saved them from soul manipulation Naruto had to straight up grab his soul physically to resist the manipulation.

KCM Naruto resisted having his soul being pulled out for a bit, so did Orochimaru against Sarutobi. Nagato overpowering Naruto is a feat for him, same for the Death God.

To the point Madara could no longer use it effectively and thus, negged.

I thought you were referring to Night Guy. Kakashi teleported the TSB in Guy's path to another dimension. Does Kurohitsugi teleport things to other dimensions? If it could, then yeah it would be effective against TSBs.

I‘m well aware of PIS moments but Madara consistently failed to absorb their energy. An argument for that could be that it was the fact they were using Senjutsu but his opponents here would also have Senjutsu so the ability is still not relevant.

Consistently? Madara was only tagged twice by Naruto's and Sasuke's ninjutsu, first being Madara being teleported into Naruto's Rasengan/Sasuke's Chidori (where they would've used the seals), which is essentially a blitz. Second time was Sasuke straight up blitzing Madara with his Chidori sword. And yes, they were using Senjutsu. Like I said, we would have to ask OP to clarify if the rest gets Senjutsu.

@epichotflame said:

@exauce said:

Blackbeard would just blackhole them

that wont even reach the others cuz they fly, that attack is basically useless here

Then we will just suck them and black hole them

or earthquake the living body out of them

How dare you fodders copy my work ?

The only real answer. None of them have an answer for time stop. Inb4 Naruto fans bring up Adult Sasuke to try and scale Madara to when he couldn't actually move

@thousandsteps:

Madara becoming like Kaguya (God Tree immortality, Rinnesharingan, IT, etc...) was the threat, hence the seals.

He gave them the seals before Madara absorbed the God tree and stated he was immortal.

If Hagoromo gave the duo the seals before Madara even absorbed the tree, what does that tell you about his immortality pre-tree, let alone post tree?

Keyword being "almost", and that was before absorbing the Shinju, where he claims to have obtained true immortality.

Which he again didn‘t back up like the other characters on this thread though Aizen is the only one that showed the purest form of immortality.

Just like how Yamamato didn't back-up his planet destroying statements? He doesn't need to, since we have a reputable source (Unohana) telling us that he has indeed the capacity to destroy the SS given enough time. No reason to ignore this, as this would be going against Kubo's intent.

Same with Madara. Both Hagoromo and Madara boasted about their immortalities. Claiming Madara isn't immortal is going against Kishi's intent, and thus headcanon.

We would need to ask OP for that, since usually energy equalization only refers to chakra in Narutoverse's case.

The OP would specifically have to say that they didn’t get Madaras energy but the verses standard energy in which case wouldn’t be a true “equalization“.

Scratch that, they have access to Senjutsu.

KCM Naruto resisted having his soul being pulled out for a bit,

By physically grabbing his Soul not outright resisting Soul Manipulation.

I'd argue that being able to rip out a soul out of a physical body is soul manipulation, and resisting that is a feat.

so did Orochimaru against Sarutobi.

Orochimaru didn’t resist anything Sarutobi was already out of chakra, half dead and Oro ran a sword through him.

Reread the chapter, and yeah you're right. He wasn't doing anything, the wounds were stopping Sarutobi.

Nagato overpowering Naruto is a feat for him, same for the Death God.

Neither are feats of Soul Manipulation resistance.

See above.

I thought you were referring to Night Guy. Kakashi teleported the TSB in Guy's path to another dimension. Does Kurohitsugi teleport things to other dimensions? If it could, then yeah it would be effective against TSBs.

I was referring to Night Guy it completely warped Madara’s TSB rod until he couldn’t use it at all.

Night Guy bent the staff, it didn't "neg" it's functions like you are implying. Then, he got blitzed by the kick. If Guy made contact with staff, he would've been a goner, bent or not.

Consistently? Madara was only tagged twice by Naruto's and Sasuke's ninjutsu, first being Madara being teleported into Naruto's Rasengan/Sasuke's Chidori (where they would've used the seals), which is essentially a blitz. Second time was Sasuke straight up blitzing Madara with his Chidori sword. And yes, they were using Senjutsu. Like I said, we would have to ask OP to clarify if the rest gets Senjutsu.

He had time in both instances to absorb their jutsus he was evidentially not able to and you can ask the OP but a true equalization would give them Senjutsu not standard chakra.

In the first instance, Madara got teleported inbetween Naruto's Rasengan and Sasuke's Chidori (both of those hands had the seals), and he was simply shocked. He was also focused with retrieving his second Rinnegan. Why should he try to absorb their jutsus (and risk getting hit with the seals) when he can simply switch places with his Limbo?

In the second instance, Madara got simply blitzed, nothing he could've done.

@exauce said:

@epichotflame said:

@exauce said:

Blackbeard would just blackhole them

that wont even reach the others cuz they fly, that attack is basically useless here

Then we will just suck them and black hole them

or earthquake the living body out of them

it can be absorbed since energy is equalised...u dont understand how fodder bb is in this thread, quakes wont do anything to someone who survived a direct hit from a space warping kick to the tummy

@thousandsteps:

If Hagoromo gave the duo the seals before Madara even absorbed the tree, what does that tell you about his immortality pre-tree, let alone post tree?

He was almost killed..

And he regenerated, with a missing heart no less on the next panel. Hagoromo stated that Madara was trying to become like Kaguya. Becoming like her requires absorbing the Shinju, which grants immortality.

Post-Shinju Madara is the version used here.

Just like how Yamamato didn't back-up his planet destroying statements? He doesn't need to, since we have a reputable source (Unohana) telling us that he has indeed the capacity to destroy the SS given enough time. No reason to ignore this, as this would be going against Kubo's intent.

Same with Madara. Both Hagoromo and Madara boasted about their immortalities. Claiming Madara isn't immortal is going against Kishi's intent, and thus headcanon.

Those statements don’t coincide and by “not backing it up” i mean he never showed the level of his immortality not that he doesn’t have it.

The statements do coincide since both are statements without the on-panel showings, or "backing up their statements" as you put it. The point is, we know Madara has that level of immortality and that's all that matters.

Scratch that, they have access to Senjutsu.

I knew it, if they didn’t energy wouldn’t have properly been equalized.

I'd argue that being able to rip out a soul out of a physical body is soul manipulation, and resisting that is a feat.

Being able to rip a soul out of a body is soul manipulation though grabbing said soul physically and pulling it isn’t resisting anything manipulation wise.

These characters physically grab the soul to rip it. If ripping out a soul is soul manipulation like you suggested, so is pulling back physically then. I don't see the issue.

Reread the chapter, and yeah you're right. He wasn't doing anything, the wounds were stopping Sarutobi.

Yeah

Night Guy bent the staff, it didn't "neg" it's functions like you are implying. Then, he got blitzed by the kick. If Guy made contact with staff, he would've been a goner, bent or not.

Warped the staff to the point Madara couldn’t use it which means he negged it i’m not talking about it’s abilities i‘m talking about it’s use. If Aizen set up a hado 90 and Madara tried to shield himself with the TSB Korutsuhigi would tear it apart like wet tissue paper.

Except he didn't try to shield himself with his TSB like Obito did with the Juubidamas when Night Guy happened. He sticked his staff forward, the speed of Night Guy bent it out of the way, and Guy kicked him. So yes, if Madara tried the same thing with Hado 90, he would get nailed.

Plus, regardless of the outcome, Madara would regenerate, so it wouldn't amount to much other than slowing him down temporarily, assuming Madara would even stand still during the Kurohitsugi.

In the first instance, Madara got teleported inbetween Naruto's Rasengan and Sasuke's Chidori (both of those hands had the seals), and he was simply shocked. He was also focused with retrieving his second Rinnegan. Why should he try to absorb their jutsus (and risk getting hit with the seals) when he can simply switch places with his Limbo?

He didn’t know about the seals he could’ve absorbed their attacks and to amp himself left a limbo then and went for his other rinnegan to finish amping himself.

You are looking too deep into it. Madara was solely focused on acquiring his second Rinnegan to perform his lifelong ambition, after failing to retrieve Sasuke's. Why would he sit around and absorb techniques, risk getting nailed by jutsus, getting weakened and sealed when he can just dip to Kakashi to get his eye?

He knew those kids weren't messing around. He most likely noticed the seals too.

In the second instance, Madara got simply blitzed, nothing he could've done.

He had time to comment on Sasukes speed, he had time to absorb the attack.

You said it. He commented on Sasuke's speed. Meaning Sasuke was fast as shit. He got blitzed. Plus talking is a free action.

@thousandsteps:

And he regenerated, with a missing heart no less on the next panel. Hagoromo stated that Madara was trying to become like Kaguya. Becoming like her requires absorbing the Shinju, which grants immortality.

Post-Shinju Madara is the version used here.

You were talking about his “immortality“ pre shinju tree which is why i reminded you he almost died.

Immortality through regeneration. Meaning he couldn't be put down because he would keep regenerating. Hence the seals.

Post tree: Complete immortality, eternity as he says word for word (chapter 673).

The statements do coincide since both are statements without the on-panel showings, or "backing up their statements" as you put it. The point is, we know Madara has that level of immortality and that's all that matters.

One was a statement about an action backed up by more than one off statement and the feat of evaporating all moisture in the world.

Evaporating all moisture isn't even close to destroying a planet. So Yamamato's statement of destroying a planet via heat wasn't shown on-panel. That's not a reason to dismiss Unohana's statement though, is it? We know he can do it, because we've been told so. Same thing here.

Madara’s didn’t show the level of immortality he had.

He didn't show it because he wasn't pushed to those extent like Aizen getting hit with Mugetsu for instance.

If what you are getting at is that Madara did end up dying in the end, that was due to the removal of the Shinju. His immortality is tied to that, as long as he has it, he won't die in anyway possible. And none of these characters from what I know have the means to pull out the tree from him.

These characters physically grab the soul to rip it. If ripping out a soul is soul manipulation like you suggested, so is pulling back physically then. I don't see the issue.

Pulling out the soul is soul manipulation because souls while in the body aren’t tangible in the series. Simply grabbing the soul Nagato already made tangible isn’t a resistance feat.

Where did you get that Nagato makes the souls he's ripping out tangible to others? Naruto being able to grab it with his chakra is a feat for him.

Except he didn't try to shield himself with his TSB like Obito did with the Juubidamas when Night Guy happened. He sticked his staff forward, the speed of Night Guy bent it out of the way, and Guy kicked him. So yes, if Madara tried the same thing with Hado 90, he would get nailed.

Plus, regardless of the outcome, Madara would regenerate, so it wouldn't amount to much other than slowing him down temporarily, assuming Madara would even stand still during the Kurohitsugi.

Regenerate from essentially nothing? How many times? These are the questions Madara’s “immortality“ didn’t answer. Even if we take it to be of the best forms of immortality without the evidence, from what we saw with Kaguya Juubijins do exhaust their Chakra.

Again, show scans that shows regeneration requiring chakra, because I don't remember that. Plus are we really going to argue Juudara running out of chakra?

At that point it’s safe to say Madara is beaten.

But not killed.

You are looking too deep into it. Madara was solely focused on acquiring his second Rinnegan to perform his lifelong ambition, after failing to retrieve Sasuke's. Why would he sit around and absorb techniques, risk getting nailed by jutsus, getting weakened and sealed when he can just dip to Kakashi to get his eye?

He knew those kids weren't messing around. He most likely noticed the seals too.

Absorbing their attacks would have gave him more power which is what he wanted and He didn’t know of the seals at all he wasn’t risking anything that he knew about by absorbing the attacks.

What? No. What he wanted was his second Rinnegan, to launch IT. He has no business trying to absorb some technique and risk getting hit by something else/sealed when he can cleanly escape. By his own admission, Naruto and Sasuke were no ordinary kids, so yes he was at a risk.

You said it. He commented on Sasuke's speed. Meaning Sasuke was fast as shit. He got blitzed. Plus talking is a free action.

As shown when he absorbed Ohnoki’s jutsu absorbing comes easy to him.

Not sure what you are trying to get at here.

from what im reading here, u aint downplaying, so ill answer ur replies

Bending space this man has infinite gravity manip shut the hell up already. Sike. And what does space warping do ? You realize all that means is anyone with more AP than Guy and faster would do the same thing if the author decided to represent it that. That only means he was moving at lightspeed with a lot of mass.It was just a way for Kishimoto to describe the power.

yh i know, still quakes wont do shit to someone who survived a direct hit from a space warping kick without regen'ing, madara has regen (cant see what bb can do to madara tbh) was completely crushed by his shattered heaven but still regen'd after being completely crushed under it

Anypretimeskip character can do this in OP can do this, pretimeskip Zorro bended space by just focusing on an attack.

can u show me zoro doing that?...one can only bend space with speed if they moved ftl

Earthquake that can shake countries away

cool but it couldnt sink 1 city??? lololol but its impressive tho, no doubt

and create island level tsunamis casually,

cool, this isnt really impressive, whats impressive is wb destroying those 2 island sized tsunamis

pointered at your face will vape Madara to smitterens. Troll.

huh?? dont get what u said here cuz madara is immortal, has regen'd from being turned to paste, resisted death in base (edo tensei undo)...madara can soul rip bb anyways or absorb him since energy is equalised

@thousandsteps:

Eternity refers to time, that doesn’t really help your case.

"Complete immortality", and eternity. (chapter 673).

Still not the same but i digress.

Curious to know why.

That’s not the only way to display immortality more statements would’ve been useful.

Hagoromo told us he is immortal, and as such gave NaruSauce the seals. Madara told us he is immortal. Kaguya, who has the Shinju is immortal. What more do you want?

Denying it at this point is headcanon territory.

It was already tangible Naruto grabbing it meant nothing.

Nagato made it tangible for himself. The fact that Naruto could grab it with his chakra arms while Shizune was helpless against a lesser version of this proves that Naruto has resistance.

I never made that first claim and Kaguya who has more chakra than Madara ran out of Chakra so yeah we’re going to argue Madara who‘s weaker running out of chakra.

Kaguya didn't run out of chakra, she was running low on chakra because she was constantly bfr'ing her opponents and herself to various extremely far-off dimensions. Something Madara doesn't do. Claiming that Juudara will run out of chakra for the duration of the fight is a massive lowball.

He again didn’t know about the seals. Absorbing their chakra would be to his benefit.

Bro, you're reaching with this. Madara admitted these kids weren't messing around. Why would it make sense for him to try and absorb their techniques, and risk getting hit by something else (since they are right next to him)? For what? A negligible boost of chakra in his already immense reservoir? Like I said, Madara was caught off guard by being teleported.

Absorbing Chakra is done casually if he could’ve absorbed Sasuke’s he would have seeing as he could perceive and comment on the letters movement.

Trying to absorb the ninjutsu launched by two shinobis with the power of SOSP and the ability to blitz Madara, and getting hit on both sides, would not be done casually. Regardless, he hardly had the chance to absorb said ninjutsus, since he got teleported, and next thing he did was switch places with Limbo.

This thread makes no sense.