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#1 Edited by KJ27 (532 posts) - - Show Bio
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Rules

  • Everyone is in their prime; composite versions, with Canon taking priority
  • No one is pulling punches and is out to kill
  • Battle takes place on Ruusan
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#3 Posted by GeorgeWBush (10611 posts) - - Show Bio

Maul is a gaping weak link and costs Vader the victory.

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#4 Posted by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

team 1 though vader's the mvp

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#5 Posted by RedTool (175 posts) - - Show Bio

More like Ahsoka is the weak link here and Maul butchers her.

While Windu fights Vader.

I'd give it to team 1, but there is going to be a casualty and it's not Windu.

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#6 Posted by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

@redtool: If maul beats ahsoka(which I don't agree with), then team 2 wins because Vader>mace

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#7 Posted by FreshFlintstone (1227 posts) - - Show Bio

@kbroskywalker: So old Obi-Wan>>>>Mace since he had a Good fight with Vader?

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#8 Posted by RedTool (175 posts) - - Show Bio

@kbroskywalker: How can you not agree with that? This is prime Maul we're talking about.

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#9 Posted by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

@redtool: because ahsoka's showing vs vader was more impressive than any of tcw(prime) maul's showings.

@kbroskywalker: So old Obi-Wan>>>>Mace since he had a Good fight with Vader?

Old Obi Wan had a good fight but was losing 10/10 vs a out of form vader who is inferior to his esb version who is inferior to his rotj version who is inferior to his rebels incarnation. Furthermore Vader was never pressed into using the force where he is ahead of windu and kenobi.

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#10 Posted by KJ27 (532 posts) - - Show Bio

@redtool said:

More like Ahsoka is the weak link here and Maul butchers her.

Lol, based on what is Maul 'butchering' Ahsoka?

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#11 Posted by FreshFlintstone (1227 posts) - - Show Bio

@redtool: because ahsoka's showing vs vader was more impressive than any of tcw(prime) maul's showings.

@freshflintstone said:

@kbroskywalker: So old Obi-Wan>>>>Mace since he had a Good fight with Vader?

Old Obi Wan had a good fight but was losing 10/10 vs a out of form vader who is inferior to his esb version who is inferior to his rotj version who is inferior to his rebels incarnation. Furthermore Vader was never pressed into using the force where he is ahead of windu and kenobi.

Where is this ever stated? I always hear it but don't remember. And how much could he have improved

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#12 Posted by RedTool (175 posts) - - Show Bio

Ahsoka lasting against Vader was impressive, but Vader had the clear advantage over her, she only got a cheap shot in where he was caught off guard. She pushed him back slightly with a force push, his force push to her sent her flying.

And composite Maul actually pressed the advantage against Vader, despite it being a clone, but still it was more or less with the same capabilities as the real deal. Same knowledge, same power, etc. Vader was forced to stab himself to kill him which almost caused himself to die.

So no, composite Maul does not lose to Ahsoka.

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#13 Posted by Emperordmb (1948 posts) - - Show Bio

@kj27: Obviously based on the fact that Maul's inferior Vader butchered her, oh wait...

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#14 Posted by Greysentinel365 (5235 posts) - - Show Bio

Since Mace and Ahsoka both know Maul as the apprentice, it's possible that they could K.O Maul for a short time with a combined force blast so they could focus on Vader (Them sensing him as more powerful leading them to prioritize him)

Then it depends on whether they can eliminate Vader before he gets back up.

I'm leaning towards team one for synergy. But it's very close

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#15 Posted by RedTool (175 posts) - - Show Bio
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#16 Edited by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

@redtool: Maul gained the advantage over out of prime vader(anh vader<esb vader<rotj vader<the revels vader ahsoka faced) after the force priests goaded vader into not using force powers(where they admitted he might be able to destroy them all) and maul then had vader in an enviroment where vader had to hop on rocks surrounded by lava. Furthermore Vader ended up killing Maul anyway, through his superior durability.

Maul in his tcw prime has no showings that out him above ahsoka's performance vs vader in his prime.

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#17 Posted by LordOfTheLight (2496 posts) - - Show Bio

Vader>Mace, and Maul>=Ahsoka. Team 2 should win it for a small majority. And Vader is being underrated again.

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#18 Edited by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

@emperordmb said:

@kj27: Obviously based on the fact that Maul's inferior Vader butchered her, oh wait...

@freshflintstone said:
@kbroskywalker said:

@redtool: because ahsoka's showing vs vader was more impressive than any of tcw(prime) maul's showings.

@freshflintstone said:

@kbroskywalker: So old Obi-Wan>>>>Mace since he had a Good fight with Vader?

Old Obi Wan had a good fight but was losing 10/10 vs a out of form vader who is inferior to his esb version who is inferior to his rotj version who is inferior to his rebels incarnation. Furthermore Vader was never pressed into using the force where he is ahead of windu and kenobi.

Where is this ever stated? I always hear it but don't remember. And how much could he have improved

novelizations, and rebels being his prime is per feloni, I can;t quote of top of my head

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#19 Posted by RedTool (175 posts) - - Show Bio
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#20 Posted by RedTool (175 posts) - - Show Bio
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#21 Posted by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

@greysentinel365: Combined force blasts are rare in fights. Likely will be vader vs ahsoka and mace vs maul in 1 v 1's.

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#22 Posted by RedTool (175 posts) - - Show Bio

Nevermind, I forgot how beastly Vader is.

Team 2 takes this.

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#23 Posted by KJ27 (532 posts) - - Show Bio

@redtool said:

@kbroskywalker: Ahsoka wouldn't last ten seconds against Sidious.

You'd have a point if Sidious was actually going all out in his fight with Maul, but he wasn't.

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#24 Edited by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

@redtool said:

@kbroskywalker: Ahsoka wouldn't last ten seconds against Sidious.

Sidious wasn't going all out vs maul even when maul was rage amped(shadow conspiracy makes this clear as it states sidious kept going faster and faster meaning he was never fighting at full speed even when Maul was enraged by his brother's death.) At full speed sidious has moved faster than a non amped windu could react, maul lasted as long as he did vs sidious because sidious let him, that doesn't really prove anything.

Maul's best dueling showing in tcw was contending with pre prime kenobi with circumstantial aid. His best force showing is ragdolling season 4 tcw kenobi who was massively pre prime and featless in defending vs force attacks. neither of which suggest superiority over Ahsoka. Ahsoka force pushing vader, and contending with him are > showings imo.

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#25 Posted by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio
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#26 Posted by Emperordmb (1948 posts) - - Show Bio

@kbroskywalker: I was being sarcastic. Vader didn't butcher Ahsoka and Vader>Maul. I agree with you lol.

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#27 Posted by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

@kbroskywalker: I was being sarcastic. Vader didn't butcher Ahsoka and Vader>Maul. I agree with you lol.

I know you were, I was replying to lord of the light

Don't doubt my sarcasm skills bud, they're "most impressive"

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#28 Posted by HighAccuser (9696 posts) - - Show Bio

I'd give it to Team 2 in a good fight. With no PIS involved Maul is still one of the best Sith duelists there is.

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#29 Posted by SoImMe (296 posts) - - Show Bio

the sith. Ahsokas a weak link

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#30 Edited by WollfMyth209 (15170 posts) - - Show Bio

The Sith. Ahsoka ~ Maul; Vader > Mace.

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#31 Posted by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

@wollfmyth209: as this is likely going to be ahsoka vs vader and mace vs maul(in character rivalry), would mace get any benefits from vapaad vs maul?

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#32 Posted by deactivated-5a4a9a7745a28 (1514 posts) - - Show Bio

The Sith, Maul > Ahsoka and Vader > Mace. Even if Maul and Ahsoka would be comparable in sabers (which I disagree with) then he's still more powerful, I'll make a case for that if anyone's interested.

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#34 Posted by jumpstart55 (11025 posts) - - Show Bio
  • Good fight..Btw..Team Sith wins this one.
  • Vader barely beats Mace after a close but hard fought fight..
  • Maul beats Ashoka after a descent fight.
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#35 Posted by YousufKhan1212 (2218 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2 wins because Ahsoka is the weak link.

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#36 Posted by YousufKhan1212 (2218 posts) - - Show Bio

  • Good fight..Btw..Team Sith wins this one.
  • Vader barely beats Mace after a close but hard fought fight..
  • Maul beats Ashoka after a descent fight.

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#37 Posted by DarthFallax (1637 posts) - - Show Bio

Sith.

Vader > Mace

Maul >= Ashoka

Online
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#38 Posted by Thoromdil (1704 posts) - - Show Bio

Missmatch.

This is a stomp for team 1. Mace Windu is in top 3 most powerful Star Wars characters of all times, he held his own and arguably even defeated Sidious who is the most powerful Sith in the history and could easily defeat Maul and Savage at the same time. He was also recognised in the jedi order as more powerful then master Yoda in fighting skill and sheer power, "As wise as master Yoda, as powerful as master Windu" - he was a very SYMBOL of power in the order, he killed Jango Fett, the best bounty hunter in the galaxy and jedi master killer with extreme ease, he defeated Grievous with a single gesture, despite Grievous being in his prime and capable of fighting 6+ jedi at the same time. He defeated hundreds of droids without his lightsaber in direct combat.

In other words, Windu is a fighter on a whole different level then these three, you put him in one of the teams, he wins. His shatterpoint will let him know the weak spot immediately and the fight won't even take long. He force-crushes Vader's support systems in a second like he did with Grievous and the fight is over for him. Then he uses Vaapad to overpower Maul and the fight is over. No need for Asoka to even join this.

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Just compare these feats to how Vader fought Boba Fett and couldn't beat him, and how Maul was absolutely humiliated by Sidious even thought he had his brother with him and you will clearly see that Mace is on a whole different level. As I said. This is a missmatch.

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#39 Posted by Azronger (4205 posts) - - Show Bio

Vader > Windu > Maul > Ahsoka. The Sith win.

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#40 Posted by Thoromdil (1704 posts) - - Show Bio

@azronger: How in the world is Vader > Windu? Windu > Palpatine, who is Vaders freakin master. Please see my post. Windu stomps this alone.

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#41 Posted by bigsambino87 (1754 posts) - - Show Bio

@thoromdil: Silver has a blog on Mace v Sidious, and it leads to the conclusion that Mace's victory was VERY circumstantial, to the point that Palpatine let him get the better of him to influence Anakin. It's a really good read. Mace and Vader are very comparable here, and so are Maul and Rebels Ahsoka.

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#42 Posted by Azronger (4205 posts) - - Show Bio

@thoromdil: Your post has so much misinformation I'm not going to bither to address it. I'll simply redirect you here:

http://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/silver2467/blog/mace-windu-vs-darth-sidious-what-really-happened-r/77247/

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#43 Posted by i_like_swords (25989 posts) - - Show Bio

There aren't any weak links. I imagine it depends on where you rank Mace against Vader, which is tricky. Windu could win via Vaapad but without that I see Vader being more powerful overall, netting his side the win.

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#44 Posted by freesid_stf123 (496 posts) - - Show Bio

Missmatch.

This is a stomp for team 1. Mace Windu is in top 3 most powerful Star Wars characters of all times, he held his own and arguably even defeated Sidious who is the most powerful Sith in the history and could easily defeat Maul and Savage at the same time. He was also recognised in the jedi order as more powerful then master Yoda in fighting skill and sheer power, "As wise as master Yoda, as powerful as master Windu" - he was a very SYMBOL of power in the order, he killed Jango Fett, the best bounty hunter in the galaxy and jedi master killer with extreme ease, he defeated Grievous with a single gesture, despite Grievous being in his prime and capable of fighting 6+ jedi at the same time. He defeated hundreds of droids without his lightsaber in direct combat.

Mace isn't anywhere close to the top 3 most powerful characters in Star wars. His "victory" of Palpatine was a circumstantial one, and not a feat Windu could replicate. Windu has been consistently been stated by several sources to be inferior to Yoda, and that quote that you are using was made by Anakin to describe Obiwan, neither of which are true.

In other words, Windu is a fighter on a whole different level then these three, you put him in one of the teams, he wins. His shatterpoint will let him know the weak spot immediately and the fight won't even take long. He force-crushes Vader's support systems in a second like he did with Grievous and the fight is over for him. Then he uses Vaapad to overpower Maul and the fight is over. No need for Asoka to even join this.

Yea, he will totally force crush Vader, who is considerably more powerful than him, because he crushed Grievous? a non force sensitive, and therefore with no force wall to protect him? Not to mention, Vaapad won't help him here. He has only used it effectively once, on Sidious which was a circumstantial fight, and not applicable to any other fight.

Just compare these feats to how Vader fought Boba Fett and couldn't beat him, and how Maul was absolutely humiliated by Sidious even thought he had his brother with him and you will clearly see that Mace is on a whole different level. As I said. This is a missmatch.

This is a terrible out of context lowballing of Vader. Vader traded TK blows with the Starkiller clone, a being that manipulated a 300m Nebulon-B frigate, while maintaining a barrier that was powerful enough to repel heat that was compared to the outer layer of a star. He has soloed 1000 rebel soldiers in the new canon comics, projected a barrier to survive an explosion of the largest weapons factory in the galaxy, disintegrated Lyleks who dwarf him in size, and whose exoskeletons were strong enough to deflect blaster bolts, collapsed a cathedral while near death and almost 2 decades from his prime. Mace has nothing comparable to those force feats. The Sith win this. Vader snaps Windu's neck with TK, then he and Maul rip Ahsoka apart.

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#45 Edited by Emperor339 (2488 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm going to side with team 2.

So far there are very few unbiased arguments on this thread and considering how close this fight is, I'd hate for the thread to devolve into the wankage of 2 sides.

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#46 Edited by kbroskywalker (13397 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthduelist9:

The Sith, Maul > Ahsoka and Vader > Mace. Even if Maul and Ahsoka would be comparable in sabers (which I disagree with) then he's still more powerful, I'll make a case for that if anyone's interested.

i'd like to hear how ahsoka "isn't even comparable" in sabers and maul being more powerful

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#47 Posted by bigsambino87 (1754 posts) - - Show Bio

My official verdict is that the Sith win. @SilentBat put out a Mace v Vader video that swayed me to think that Vader would indeed defeat Mace, and as great as Ahsoka is, I don't see her being able to beat prime Maul. Stalemate, I can see that, but in that time period, Vader will defeat Mace, and then Ahsoka has absolutely no chance of surviving.

The Sith take it 8/10, with the minority victory coming from a chance killing blow to Maul by Ahsoka, and the other minority victory due to Mace being able to tap into Vaapad against Vader.

It should be noted that Mace lost against Kar Vastor, whom was weaker than Vader, while using Vaapad, so even then, it's hard to say it would work.

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#48 Posted by Emperor339 (2488 posts) - - Show Bio

@bigsambino87: I believe Silentbat has since recinded his verdict on that Video.

Though I agree with the video in general and personally believe Vader would defeat Mace in a hard fought battle, in the comments section he has stated this:

UPDATE: I'm on the fence with this verdict. While I understand what I was attempting to achieve here (establishing how effective Vader's style would be against Windu, and how inflated Windu's use of Vaapad is) there is still a solid argument that Windu would still achieve victory.

And on Comicvine he has admitted that his opinin of Vader is evolving.

Seemingly, he holds Vader to a lower standard than he did before, from what I can tell.

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#49 Posted by echostarlord117 (5447 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords said:

There aren't any weak links. I imagine it depends on where you rank Mace against Vader, which is tricky. Windu could win via Vaapad but without that I see Vader being more powerful overall, netting his side the win.

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#50 Posted by bigsambino87 (1754 posts) - - Show Bio

@emperor339: No kidding? Well, that's the great thing about SW and new material bringing in new feats. My views have changed on several characters as well, so it's understandable.