Luffy and Katakuri ( One Piece )vs Asta ( Black Clover )

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Ulqiorraaaa

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#1  Edited By Ulqiorraaaa

Current Luffy

Current Asta

Ubication = WCI

Distance = 20 m

Fight to the death

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Ulqiorraaaa

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Luffy or Kata solo

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ManimalMan

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#3  Edited By ManimalMan

They stomp the crap out of him, BC has good speed and had but pretty lame dc and durability.

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SNBISBISBIS

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Any of Luffy or Katakuri solo the verse.

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Edgelord91

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NotTroll

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Katakuri solos alone add Luffy it will be too much

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Adi_Frost

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The OP wank has gotten out of hand nowadays. Asta cuts this duo to ribbons before any of them can blink.

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Edgelord91

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@adi_frost: not gonna help against Katakuri mochi body.

OT- I could see asta beating either 1v1 but both he gets wrecked

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Yray

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Luffy solos, he's far above asta in stats,versatility and hax ..only thing they have comparable is speed

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Gilateen

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Luffy solos

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Saxz

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@yray:

Lol they don't have comparable speeds.Asta is several times faster.

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New2this

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@saxz: what speed feats does asta have that makes him far faster than Luffy or katakuri?

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Yray

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#14  Edited By Yray

@saxz said:

@yray:

Lol they don't have comparable speeds.Asta is several times faster.

Luffy Is casually able to tag and keep on matching hybrid kaido who is a great deal FTL ..and luffy is doing this in base [base luffy<g2<g4bm<<g4sm] ..in snakeman form which keeps on increasing his speed longer the fight goes on .I would argue luffy is much faster than asta in snakeman.

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War_monger

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It's beyond me why cv keeps on underrating one piece characters speed despite numerous feats they have to support it.

OT: Luffy should solo handily.

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Saxz

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@new2this said:

@saxz: what speed feats does asta have that makes him far faster than Luffy or katakuri?

It's the other way round. What speed feats does Luffy have against Guys that have being timing light since chapter 50 , which is basically BOS

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Saxz

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@yray said:
@saxz said:

@yray:

Lol they don't have comparable speeds.Asta is several times faster.

Luffy Is casually able to tag and keep on matching hybrid kaido who is a great deal FTL ..and luffy is doing this in base [base luffy<g2<g4bm<<g4sm] ..in snakeman form which keeps on increasing his speed longer the fight goes on .I would argue luffy is much faster than asta in snakeman.

Explain how Kaido is a great deal FTL????.... And you putting greater(>>>) in front of everything isn't a feat and if I did that for Asta, it would be a far longer chain. Since Asta has being FTL since pre-TS.

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Expo7

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@saxz: Chapter 50 ain’t BOS lol

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Expo7

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Luffy statued light in the beginning of post timeskip and please don’t say he used precog as there was no such indication. Luffy or Kata solo for having overwhelming stats and hax

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Saxz

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@expo7:

Which is why i used "Basically" (not literally) in front of the sentence.. This is the series at its first year, it was still at the point of character's introduction before the series picks up its pace. It might as well be BOS.

Luffy didn't statue light, except you're using the term loosely, without knowing its meaning.... Pacifists feat is sub rel, relativistic at Best. Statuing light is a FTL feat. Which means you have to move several times faster than the light..... Asta did that in Base pre-TS, and Luffy doesn't even have any feat at that level, just some random jumps in values.

I agree The duo likely wins but it's straight up blasphemy to say Luffy and Kata are way faster than Asta.

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Expo7

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@saxz: First of all I didn’t say they were faster, I said they outstated him in almost all areas. Calling light slow and dodging it without precog is supposed to be a sub rel feat now? The pasifistas beams are ls aswell since they replicated Kizaru’s fruit successfully.

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Yray

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#22  Edited By Yray

@saxz:

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Luffys reaction to light speed beginning of post timeskip..this feat places luffys reaction speed at least relativistic+ as luffy could and had no problem reacting to LIGHT SPEED in base form this would imply that in other to move fast enough to become FTE to luffys perception or rather out right speed blitz him would require SPEED ABOVE the fastest luffy can react to which in this case is LS hence anyone or anything too fast for luffy to react to is FTL.

then we have luffy saying this even while seeing the future and gotten way much faster since his feat of dodging LS laser

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Easily FTL..now this doesn't just put kaido as barely FTL but rather many times FTL in base form ..why? You may ask well it come s from a very long chain of speed feats that's Easily longer and consistent than asta's

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Saxz

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@expo7:

The pacifista being LS is a question mark that will get confirmed down the road.... But that isn't the problem here, I am not saying they aren't LS.

The problem here is dodging LS from effectively a dozen meter out is a sub relativistic feat, not a LS feat, like you're passing it off. Luffy only had to move his head a few inches before the light travelled all 12 meters. Please show me how dodging this feat is anything other than a sub relativistic feat ,I'll wait. I mean no one is calling SPSM Naruto LS from dodging LF from a few inches, how is Luffy's suddenly LS.

The fact that he calls it slow isn't something too quantifiable, and it doesn't change the actual feat.....it just means he did it casually and is a good above sub rel, not that he is LS.

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Ayanokoji-kio

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FTL one piece? bruh

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Saxz

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#26  Edited By Saxz

@yray said:

@saxz:

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Luffys reaction to light speed beginning of post timeskip..this feat places luffys reaction speed at least relativistic+ as luffy could and had no problem reacting to LIGHT SPEED in base form

Again how is this a relativistic+ feat? How did you come by that. This is sub rel, if you consider the distance the light is coming from. If this is suddenly relativistic+, then feats like Naruto's were he dodged light from inches would be 10x above this feat hence it would be LS-FTL. The fact that it's slow means he did it casually.

this would imply that in other to move fast enough to become FTE to luffys perception or rather out right speed blitz him would require SPEED ABOVE the fastest luffy can react to which in this case is LS hence anyone or anything too fast for luffy to react to is FTL.

if we're being accurate, you'll have to be FTL to speed blitz him "FROM THAT DISTANCE*. Blitzing him from point blank isn't the same thing, except you're disregarding the factor of distance in a speed scenario. Then at this point everyone who has reacted to LS regardless of distance should have LS reactions.

then we have luffy saying this even while seeing the future and gotten way much faster since his feat of dodging LS laser

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Easily FTL..now this doesn't just put kaido as barely FTL but rather many times FTL in base form ..why? You may ask well it come s from a very long chain of speed feats that's Easily longer and consistent than asta's

again if we're being accurate, Kaido was right next to Luffy and was almost at Luffy's face before Luffy even moved, The distance would make Kaido a lot harder to dodge than a beam coming from a dozen meters out, again being accurate this would just put Kaido above the afro mentioned sub relativistic feat, since what's his last reaction feat clocked at........ but at this point it's worth considering Luffy already got stronger and is around relativistic+ (from scaling) like the other yonkou commanders which would make Kaido's thunder bagua, baseline LS- FTL either way for almost blitzing Luffy (it wasn't a complete blitz, Luffy still reacted and dodged).

i don't see a chain of speed feats in OP even close to BC, except we're including the time to time desperate speed wank that are easily debunked. but realistically, The only ones privy to relativistic+ -LS scaling are high tiers; Admirals, yonkou commanders, high end suchibukais and all that.

In contrast to that low mid tiers could already pull off high relativistic+ reaction and combat speed, by chapter 50 in black clover. That's like if Alabasta Luffy was already relativistic, how do you get a longer scaling chain that. On top of that BC actually has FTL feats to scale from since pre-TS, and again they were performed by mid tiers, FTL is something that's only become logically arguable now for one piece. So enlighten me on this chain of feats.

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Expo7

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#27  Edited By Expo7

@saxz: The pasifistas beams is ls as it is Kizaru’s lasers unless you believe Kizaru isn’t ls. Dodging light 3 times no precog in base is way above sub rel. Also you’re ignoring when he outright blitzed the laser and appeared in the sky ( i will send the scan later). Him saying light is slow is quantifiable as he sees ls as inferior which should mean he is minimum ls at that point, you can’t interpret it in any other way. Just to remind you this was many arcs ago and Luffy has gotten so strong and fast to the point he would blitz and oneshot his old self.

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Mike_Strike10

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Lol at Luffy begining of post timeskip Luffy being Sub Rel.

Team wins (I think)

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Sinbad_Hakuryuu

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Kingxix

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#30 Kingxix  Online
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Mike_Strike10

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@sinbad_hakuryuu: Current Luffy would probably be LS most likely higher considering he should be close to the Admirals and he is keeping up with Kaido who is above said admirals.

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Saxz

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@expo7 said:

@saxz: The pasifistas beams is ls as it is Kizaru’s lasers unless you believe Kizaru isn’t ls. Dodging light 3 times no precog in base is way above sub rel. Also you’re ignoring when he outright blitzed the laser and appeared in the sky ( i will send the scan later). Him saying light is slow is quantifiable as he sees ls as inferior which should mean he is minimum ls at that point, you can’t interpret it in any other way. Just to remind you this was many arcs ago and Luffy has gotten so strong and fast to the point he would blitz and oneshot his old self.

There's nothing stopping Kizaru from being LS it's stated More than once and he matched it with his feats. The pacifista didn't eat a Light Light fruit or had Kizaru lasers literally put in them, they are robots so their lasers are something recreated from studying Kizaru( since Kizaru would be the only scientific reference to lasers at This point in time when science isn't advanced) even Franky can pull it off after studying Vega punk notes.

Yeah I thought it was 3 lasers too since I was still an anime-only watcher at this point, but I got fired at on Battle forums , saying ittwas filler and non Canon and it's supposed to be a single laser. And I conceded when I checked the manga. If it were 3 lasers the feat would definitely be high relativistic+ - possibly LS so I get were you're coming from.....

I already told you, The problem isn't with the pacifista, I think they're likely LS but I'll need Kizaru to confirm this with his appearance, because there are as much argument for it, as there are against it.

Blitz the laser and appeared in the sky????? In that same scene.??.

Again are you going to ignore that the light is coming from a distance???.

Do you think observing a speeding race car coming from a distance down the road and having it come close and zap right past the observer, would appear as the same level of speeds to the observer? Even if the car speed never changed. This makes sense right? Because I can't think of a better analogy, this should be something basic.

It's like the OG matrix "dodge This' scene; The agent could easily dodge bullets from afar, but got no diffed by a single bullet from up close. Even after Trinity gave him a heads-up by daring him to dodge it.

Loading Video...

If you still don't get it then I am out of ways to make my point here, I bet you believe in calcs , it's also calced at sub rel, and if Luffy perception was 5x faster then its enough for LS to be slow to him(from that distance) but 5x faster justs him at relativistic. Not LS.

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MonkeysDkevin

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base luffy stomps

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deactivated-609e116390926

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Either beats him.

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BrickTheSiren

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How would the Anti-Magic and armament haki react to each other? I'm curious about what would counter what.

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Kingxix

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#36 Kingxix  Online

@brickthesiren: anti magic wouldn't simply work as opverse has no magic whatsoever

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BrickTheSiren

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@kingxix: For some reason I thought it was equalized so Asta could hit Katakuri without slicing Mochi.

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Kingxix

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#38 Kingxix  Online

@brickthesiren: what would you equalize it with, haki?! Even that wouldn't work as they have way better durability and AP than asta

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tagsorwhatever

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@saxz said:

@expo7:

The pacifista being LS is a question mark that will get confirmed down the road.... But that isn't the problem here, I am not saying they aren't LS.

The problem here is dodging LS from effectively a dozen meter out is a sub relativistic feat, not a LS feat, like you're passing it off. Luffy only had to move his head a few inches before the light travelled all 12 meters. Please show me how dodging this feat is anything other than a sub relativistic feat ,I'll wait. I mean no one is calling SPSM Naruto LS from dodging LF from a few inches, how is Luffy's suddenly LS.

The fact that he calls it slow isn't something too quantifiable, and it doesn't change the actual feat.....it just means he did it casually and is a good above sub rel, not that he is LS.

Luffy stomps look at his new large country level feat.

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i thought they debunked this one piece luffy destroy dressrosa since dressrosa was comparably only island level?

OT:Luffy or katakuri solo because anti magic dont affect haki and their stats largely outweight black clover

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RomeoBeta

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@tagsorwhatever: L take, "Luffy and katakuri dont have magic", Asta's stats are equal if not higher, he doesnt need anti magic to beat them... Asta was moving at ftl speeds since episode 100 and him defeating Lilith and Naamah gets him to continent level, Asta alone wins.

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tagsorwhatever

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@tagsorwhatever: L take, "Luffy and katakuri dont have magic", Asta's stats are equal if not higher, he doesnt need anti magic to beat them... Asta was moving at ftl speeds since episode 100 and him defeating Lilith and Naamah gets him to continent level, Asta alone wins.

defeating lilith and naamah would not get him to continent level

the only one who is continental in black clover is lucifero 100%

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this is the world in black clover

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the world in black clover is only 1 continent

lilith and naamah is as strong as the dark triad

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the dark triad is about small country to large country level (from feats anyways)

asta beating lilith and naamah =/= continent level

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tagsorwhatever

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@romeobeta: also if asta is really FTL then why cant he even catch up to lilith and naamah lmao

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this is because asta reaction speed is FTL from precog via ki

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luffy have the same level to higher level of precog from observation haki

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also lilith and naamah's most powerful attack is only enough to wipe out the spade kingdom which is a large country level feat

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the spade kingdom look marineford sized so ill use whitebeard as a scale

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this puts naamah and weakened whitebeard at almost the same level

luffy = kaido =prime whitebeard > weakened whitebeard

weakened whitebeard is small country-large country level and luffy is stronger so at least large country-continent level

luffy wins here and not even adding haoshoku haki

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Accels120

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asta wins

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RomeoBeta

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#44  Edited By RomeoBeta

@tagsorwhatever: I don't understand what you're trying to get at, in pointing out the size of the Black Clover world...?

The dark triad is Large Country, you said so yourself as well. Sure maybe Nacht did say that, but he clearly was wrong. 1 & 2 are two consecutive manga panels, of Nacht saying he assumed the triad were on the same level as Lilith and Naamah but as those images show, that clearly isn't the case. Lilith and Naamah as said by Nacht, are on a completely different level than the triad. This would put them individually at Large Country+. Furthermore their fusion is said to be greater than 2x their individual power, putting them at Continent.

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RomeoBeta

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@tagsorwhatever: Not too familiar with this site so I can't quote your shiz to make it easier to read so bare with me ;-;

  1. He couldn't catch up to them because they are much, MUCH faster than light. That isn't an anti feat proving Asta isn't light speed. So are you saying Lilith and Naamah are only speed of light and Asta can't catch up to them? Can you prove Lilith and Naamah are only speed of light? I don't understand how him not catching up to them means he isn't speed of light.
  2. Where does it say that the attack only would have been able to only destroy the Spade Kingdom and no more? There is nothing proving the attack would have only affected the Spade Kingdom.

Those 2 claims you made are absolutely baseless.

Asta - Ftl, Continental

Luffy - Ftl, (not sure, island?, country?)

Asta wins this.

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tagsorwhatever

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@tagsorwhatever: I don't understand what you're trying to get at, in pointing out the size of the Black Clover world...?

The dark triad is Large Country, you said so yourself as well. Sure maybe Nacht did say that, but he clearly was wrong. 1 & 2 are two consecutive manga panels, of Nacht saying he assumed the triad were on the same level as Lilith and Naamah but as those images show, that clearly isn't the case. Lilith and Naamah as said by Nacht, are on a completely different level than the triad. This would put them individually at Large Country+. Furthermore their fusion is said to be greater than 2x their individual power, putting them at Continent.

I don't understand what you're trying to get at, in pointing out the size of the Black Clover world...?

like i said again the world in black clover is only 1 continent

The dark triad is Large Country, you said so yourself as well.

no i said they were small country level because they have never destroyed something on the scale of a country before

1 & 2 are two consecutive manga panels, of Nacht saying he assumed the triad were on the same level as Lilith and Naamah but as those images show, that clearly isn't the case. Lilith and Naamah as said by Nacht, are on a completely different level than the triad.

something being stated =/= actual or i can say whitebeard is planet level because of this quote

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This would put them individually at Large Country+. Furthermore their fusion is said to be greater than 2x their individual power, putting them at Continent.

i cant really agree on both being large country+ but i can with both being large+

their largest attack could not destroy the whole world of black clover (aka the continent)

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spade kingdom roughly is the size of marineford so ill take weakened whitebeard as a measurement

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they said here its an island but marineford is an actual country (i cant find the chapter of the scan but its somewhere between 500+ to 600)

weakened whitebeard is about small-large country level and luffy and kaido is stronger than him

luffy=kaido (base)= prime whitebeard>>weakened whitebeard therefore luffy is large country minimum

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deactivated-61a94331705e8

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@romeobeta: also if asta is really FTL then why cant he even catch up to lilith and naamah lmao

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this is because asta reaction speed is FTL from precog via ki

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luffy have the same level to higher level of precog from observation haki

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also lilith and naamah's most powerful attack is only enough to wipe out the spade kingdom which is a large country level feat

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the spade kingdom look marineford sized so ill use whitebeard as a scale

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this puts naamah and weakened whitebeard at almost the same level

luffy = kaido =prime whitebeard > weakened whitebeard

weakened whitebeard is small country-large country level and luffy is stronger so at least large country-continent level

luffy wins here and not even adding haoshoku haki

pal a question ....what did you smoke? Kaido bodied luffy and he didnt even got serious...he doesnt scale to him (and for the love of god he isnt above him):

just a reminder, read chapter 1014 again: One Piece, Chapter 1014 - English Scans (one-piece.online), even luffy admits he'll find a way to beat him in the latest chapter (1017).

He aint on his level period, not even close till the end (maybe ) of Wano arc.

Also , regarding Marineford and Spade Kingdom's size comparison, you probably chose the worst picture.

ot: Asta can mid diff/high diff either , the duo together takes it with high difficulty.

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tagsorwhatever

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@tagsorwhatever: Not too familiar with this site so I can't quote your shiz to make it easier to read so bare with me ;-;

  1. He couldn't catch up to them because they are much, MUCH faster than light. That isn't an anti feat proving Asta isn't light speed. So are you saying Lilith and Naamah are only speed of light and Asta can't catch up to them? Can you prove Lilith and Naamah are only speed of light? I don't understand how him not catching up to them means he isn't speed of light.
  2. Where does it say that the attack only would have been able to only destroy the Spade Kingdom and no more? There is nothing proving the attack would have only affected the Spade Kingdom.

Those 2 claims you made are absolutely baseless.

Asta - Ftl, Continental

Luffy - Ftl, (not sure, island?, country?)

Asta wins this.

  1. He couldn't catch up to them because they are much, MUCH faster than light. That isn't an anti feat proving Asta isn't light speed. So are you saying Lilith and Naamah are only speed of light and Asta can't catch up to them? Can you prove Lilith and Naamah are only speed of light? I don't understand how him not catching up to them means he isn't speed of light

i havent read black clover for a while so this should be intrigueing

https://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/gen-discussion-1/black-clover-characters-arent-light-speed-1994894/

  1. Where does it say that the attack only would have been able to only destroy the Spade Kingdom and no more? There is nothing proving the attack would have only affected the Spade Kingdom

liek i said this is the world of black clover which is 1 continent

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both can roughly destroy about at least only spade kingdom and highball the grand magic zone which isnt continental

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tagsorwhatever

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@delein said:
@tagsorwhatever said:

@romeobeta: also if asta is really FTL then why cant he even catch up to lilith and naamah lmao

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this is because asta reaction speed is FTL from precog via ki

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luffy have the same level to higher level of precog from observation haki

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also lilith and naamah's most powerful attack is only enough to wipe out the spade kingdom which is a large country level feat

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the spade kingdom look marineford sized so ill use whitebeard as a scale

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this puts naamah and weakened whitebeard at almost the same level

luffy = kaido =prime whitebeard > weakened whitebeard

weakened whitebeard is small country-large country level and luffy is stronger so at least large country-continent level

luffy wins here and not even adding haoshoku haki

pal a question ....what did you smoke? Kaido bodied luffy and he didnt even got serious...he doesnt scale to him (and for the love of god he isnt above him):

just a reminder, read chapter 1014 again: One Piece, Chapter 1014 - English Scans (one-piece.online), even luffy admits he'll find a way to beat him in the latest chapter (1017).

He aint on his level period, not even close till the end (maybe ) of Wano arc.

Also , regarding Marineford and Spade Kingdom's size comparison, you probably chose the worst picture.

ot: Asta can mid diff/high diff either , the duo together takes it with high difficulty.

pal a question ....what did you smoke? Kaido bodied luffy and he didnt even got serious...he doesnt scale to him (and for the love of god he isnt above him):

>yeah sorry i was gona say base because its about equal to prime whitebeard

just a reminder, read chapter 1014 again: One Piece, Chapter 1014 - English Scans (one-piece.online), even luffy admits he'll find a way to beat him in the latest chapter (1017)

>this is half dragon kaido which scales over his base form which luffy equat to

Also , regarding Marineford and Spade Kingdom's size comparison, you probably chose the worst picture.

>i was too lazy to scroll back to chapter 500+ since i am at 800+ atm so i just used a photo i can find

ot: Asta can mid diff/high diff either , the duo together takes it with high difficulty.

>yeah i can agree with this statement

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