Kishou Arima runs the OPM monster gauntlet

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KingCrimson

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#1  Edited By KingCrimson

The White Reaper

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Rules

  • Prime Arima (EoS, no health issues)
  • He has access to all 3 quinques
  • Win by death
  • No knowledge
  • Arima is morals off and going all out
  • Fights take place at an abandoned Shibuya Crossing

Gauntlet

  1. Crablante
  2. Kombu Infinity
  3. Unihorn
  4. Three Crows
  5. Rhino Wrestler
  6. Royal Ripper
  7. Pureblood
  8. Bakuzan
  9. Nyan
  10. Garou (Half-Monster)
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Futureisbest

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Stops at 1

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KingCrimson

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Delein

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a bit out of order imo. He stops at 2 with this order. Crablante isn't a challenge for Arima.

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KingCrimson

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@delein: How would you change the order, out of interest? I did kind of wing it from memory.
Why do you think Kombu stops him?

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magmacha

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I would switch some of them demon threats

First 2 are perfect and last 3 are perfect. I would switch unihorn and the crows. And I don’t see Royal ripper or Pureblood beating rhino(possible stalemate with Rhino and Pureblood because of his bat transformation).

Stops at 3 even though he’s almost featless.

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BinocularGod

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@magmacha said:

I would switch some of them demon threats

First 2 are perfect and last 3 are perfect. I would switch unihorn and the crows. And I don’t see Royal ripper or Pureblood beating rhino(possible stalemate with Rhino and Pureblood because of his bat transformation).

Stops at 3 even though he’s almost featless.

I agree with this although I would say based off feats that RR would beat Rhino becuase he was able to damage and somewhat contend with Garou who is>>>>Rhino.

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HydratedFubuki6

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I see Prime Arima w/ all quinques being close to Post-Dragon Kaneki.

I'd say he stops at Bakuzan. Some high demon level may give him 50/50 though, like HDSK and G5.

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magmacha

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@binoculargod: Yeah he has better feats but I just don't see him bypassing the durability of Rhino wrestler. I mean you have him no selling attacks that would definitely put damage on RR. but fair enough.

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KingCrimson

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@magmacha: Why do you think Unihorn stops him?

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magmacha

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@kingcrimson: speed.

Also as we saw from what Arima did to himself, his durability ain’t that good. :0

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King_Isshiki

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#13 King_Isshiki  Online

Arima clears (if Garou is pre-Darkshine)

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KingCrimson

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@magmacha: Arima is way faster than Unihorn.

Arima should only have average piercing durability, granted. But his weapons are exceedingly sharp and powerful, it’s hardly surprising they could cut him.

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magmacha

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@kingcrimson: uhhh, imma have to disagree with you on that, I have unihorn above Arima in speed. Not a quick verse at all. Unihorn is also capable of sharpening himself via transformation. So durability isn’t a problem. The only thing that Arima has going for him is amazing fight intellect/IQ. Can outsmart unihorn but stats wise he lacks imo.

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KingCrimson

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#16  Edited By KingCrimson

@magmacha: IDK whether you might need to give the series a re-read man, because Arima is hypersonic. He’s consistently moved FTE to and pretty much statued people with supersonic feats.

What speed feats does Unihorn have that I’m missing? I don’t think Arima’s durability would allow him to take many hits from anybody on this gauntlet to be fair, but his fighting style is one that tries to completely avoid damage so I don’t imagine it will be too relevant a factor.

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magmacha

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@kingcrimson: I mean he was fighting Garou in which when he transforms his shape to be a sharper speed, his speed increases significantly. And based on average his average speed should be in the hypersonic ranges. Also I did say he was basically featless but imo just those speeds allow him to possibly blitz.

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KingCrimson

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@magmacha: Garou no-diffed him, so it’s not like he scales. And what average are you referring to?

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magmacha

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@kingcrimson: average of demon level threats, there are some inconsistencies but demon level threats average at around that speed. Also Garou was like a strongggg dragon level at that time. A chapter later he withstood rovers attack.

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KingCrimson

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@magmacha: Yeah, that’s why Unihorn doesn’t scale. His only feat is getting manhandled and Garou saying he could see his attack in slow motion. I don’t think there’s any evidence he (Unihorn) was hypersonic.

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magmacha

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@kingcrimson: scaling wise lol, he’s a demon threat and they have hypersonic speed consistency, also he’s faster than your average demon threat meaning he probably hypersonic+ or something. Garou foddrizes any demon threat since he was already like a strong dragon.

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KingCrimson

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magmacha

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@kingcrimson: indeed I guess, well I mean keep the debate/scaling stuff up!

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GarouHM

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He isn't clearing. He reaches R5 at the very least. Pureblood is pretty much featless because his fight with Zombieman was off-panel. I guess he would stop at Nyan because of his unique body.

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Futureisbest

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#25  Edited By Futureisbest

@kingcrimson: I don't think Arima would be able to beat faster characters, he's hasn't shown any impressive speed feats. He beat Crabby but I don't see him going further.

To further facilitate, Arima will have to be faster than this if he wants to get pass 2

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KingCrimson

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#26  Edited By KingCrimson

@futureisbest: Arima is hypersonic, so he’s much faster than Spring Moustachio was at the time, or Kombu for that matter.

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Futureisbest

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@kingcrimson: How is he remotely hypersonic? Timing and reacting to RC cells electric attacks from Renji does not equate to being hypersonic since it's not downward lightning. And Eto hasn't shown any speed feats that suggest she's hypersonic. They're FTE but that doesn't mean anything in OPM verse.

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KingCrimson

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@futureisbest:

How is he remotely hypersonic?

He has several feats that put him minimum hypersonic. I’ll come on to them in a moment.

Timing and reacting to RC cells electric attacks from Renji does not equate to being hypersonic since it's not downward lightning.

He‘s not a lightning timer, but electrical discharge through air is minimum supersonic. I can’t find the source at the moment, but they tested a modern day Tesla Coil “gun” that would be the closest real-world equivalent of Narukami, and the velocity for the electric discharge comes out at supersonic as well (just shy of Mach 3, IIRC), so seems fairy consistent to me.

Arima was casually able to react to that (whilst blind in one eye, and vision failing in his other), as well as cutting all of Ayato’s Ukaku barrage out of the air with one hand at point blank range, whilst Ayato was flitting round him so fast he appeared to be in several places at once:

  1. Ayato deflection feat
  2. Electricity timing feat

They're FTE but that doesn't mean anything in OPM verse.

Literally every relevant character in the series has enhanced dynamic vision and reflexes, so even moving FTE to a mook is superior than your standard FTE, but Arima himself has moved FTE over large distances to people with bare minimum supersonic feats, and shit-blitzed everyone he came across with the exception of OEK Kaneki.

Here’s Arima moving FTE to Kaneki twice in one breath, the same Kaneki who was a comfortable bullet timer, and could at least perceive Amon in the Arata (Mach 5). Easily a hypersonic feat.

He easily avoids Ayato and Touka’s Ukaku again by shifting his weight, and then pretty much statues them and teleports over whilst they are still in the air. Again, Ayato was bare minimum supersonic at this point, likely faster. Touka was relative to him.

No Caption Provided

And here he is moving FTE to a full Kakuja BR Kaneki, when Kaneki in base BR form was capable of statuing the electricity from Narukami:

Ken has to be bare minimum Mach 4 to perform that in base, and that’s if you lowball the shit out of Narukami to the velocity of a speeding car. With his Kakuja amp it should be easily hypersonic, and Arima blitzes him like a low-level speedster in that fight.

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Futureisbest

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@kingcrimson:

He‘s not a lightning timer, but electrical discharge through air is minimum supersonic. I can’t find the source at the moment, but they tested a modern day Tesla Coil “gun” that would be the closest real-world equivalent of Narukami, and the velocity for the electric discharge comes out at supersonic as well (just shy of Mach 3, IIRC), so seems fairy consistent to me.

Arima was casually able to react to that (whilst blind in one eye, and vision failing in his other), as well as cutting all of Ayato’s Ukaku barrage out of the air with one hand at point blank range, whilst Ayato was flitting round him so fast he appeared to be in several places at once.

Yeah no...

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I don't think the coil gun is comparable... especially if it only follows the paths with the least resistances, Narukami's "lightning" will to have to do that, and that's not likely if it tracks. It's not even real electricity

Ayato would be hypersonic+ too, he wasn't point blink in front of it and was able to get out of the way...

Renji running up the wall with the arc following him.

Everyone will have to scale to it, which would put them massively hypersonic, relativistic to FTL. It's not consistent

Mustachio may have gotten stronger, but his weapon speed stays consistent, it's not like a zanpakuto, so I don't see reason for its growth being a rebuttal since it is never was stated to evolve like its wielder, so feats stay even if the weapon was broken before, it'll be a simple welding if anything.

It shows to be travel beyond 54 meters in the air and higher. within a blink of an eye which last about a 0.1 seconds

which would put it around 1228.078 mph after measuring the pixels of the buildings and that is assuming if those buildings are 6.1 meters as a low estimations, if they're 15, that'll easily put kombu around Hypersonic + as they were standing there with the sword striking in the reflection of his eyes, and this isn't tomboy's maximum height it is traveling.

This isn't factoring the fact that Mustachio got stomped with Kombu showing no signs of fatigue or trouble.

Even if Arima was Hypersonic, It's not like his movements will make a different to someone able to dodge blitzing attacks that can cover hundreds a meters in almost an instant, not even character with supersonic speeds would be able to register that, and he dodge that casually.

tentacles are stronger than steel which would put it around the range as kagunes.

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KingCrimson

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@futureisbest:

I don't think the coil gun is comparable... especially if it only follows the paths with the least resistances, Narukami's "lightning" will to have to do that, and that's not likely if it tracks. It's not even real electricity

What do you mean by not real? The electricity created by RC cells behaves exactly the same as normal electricity. Its conducted by metal and water, and it burns or paralyses people the way electricity does. The source of the discharge is created by the RC cells, but the result is energy in the form of electricity (or fire, in Tatara's case).

I think you're misconstruing the nature of the weapon; we don't get anymore information on the tracking feature other than the fact it exists. Logically speaking, it would make sense for the electricity to try and ground itself through a target once it reaches close enough proximity, which would also function as a "tracking feature", so to speak. You can see the same thing happen when Tesla Coil guns are shot near people. The actual bolts of Narukami can be seen branching off from one another, evidently following paths of less resistance through the air.

Ayato would be hypersonic+ too, he wasn't point blink in front of it and was able to get out of the way...

Renji running up the wall with the arc following him.

Ayato dodged a swipe from Arima (who was holding back) rather than a point blank shot. You can see the arc following the trail of the blade.

Renji gets tagged by it in the following panel, and him matching the speed of Narukami would only put him at supersonic anyway, which is perfectly consistent?

Everyone will have to scale to it, which would put them massively hypersonic, relativistic to FTL. It's not consistent

Only if you take Narukami's speed to be the same as natural lightning, which isn't what I'm saying.

It sounds like you just don't like the feats so you're throwing them out, despite them happening.

which would put it around 1228.078 mph after measuring the pixels of the buildings and that is assuming if those buildings are 6.1 meters as a low estimations, if they're 15, that'll easily put kombu around Hypersonic + as they were standing there with the sword striking in the reflection of his eyes, and this isn't tomboy's maximum height it is traveling.

Even if Arima was Hypersonic, It's not like his movements will make a different to someone able to dodge blitzing attacks that can cover hundreds a meters in almost an instant, not even character with supersonic speeds would be able to register that, and he dodge that casually.

That feat (by your own calc) would range from Mach 2 as a low end to around what? Mach 5 as a high end? That would be in the realm of Black Reaper Kaneki's base speed, (even if you lowball the speed of Narukami to as slow as 50ms-1).

Arima completely dabbed on that version of Kaneki without so much as breaking a sweat, as well as his kakuja form, so I don't see why Kombu (who is basically a discount SS rate ghoul) wouldn't be just another day at the office for Arima. He blitzes people on that level for fun.

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Futureisbest

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@kingcrimson: It seems like you don't like the answer I'm giving you, even with evidence I'm providing. You seem to not want to think that's where he stops at.

You see RC cells can take many forms, for example it can be gas-like and heat up like fire, for example take a look at Tatara's Kakuja, it's not fire but RC Cells that is in the state. RC cells not real flames, it's a kin to a very hot concentration of spores which is light like air and can resemble gas, the same property is seen there with narukami.

I think you're misconstruing the nature of the weapon; we don't get anymore information on the tracking feature other than the fact it exists. Logically speaking, it would make sense for the electricity to try and ground itself through a target once it reaches close enough proximity, which would also function as a "tracking feature", so to speak. You can see the same thing happen when Tesla Coil guns are shot near people. The actual bolts of Narukami can be seen branching off from one another, evidently following paths of less resistance through the air.

Logically it wouldn't have followed Renji upward then, logically it would have hit the wall instead of following it's target. Electricity does not track, period. It follows the path with the least resistances to reach its destination which is ground with the high amount of opposite charge.

Here's a comparable Quinque able to do the same, that's not how normal electricity should travel. It really only has the branches of lightning but that's not how it portrays what real lightning bolts travels.

No Caption Provided

It aids to the dubious nature on why I'm not 100% with the electricity speed, it's fast yes, because it's portrayed to be.

It acts like electricity especially in Renji vs Tooru fight when it conducts in water, but it doesn't not move like it which is my problem.

That feat (by your own calc) would range from Mach 2 as a low end to around what? Mach 5 as a high end? That would be in the realm of Black Reaper Kaneki's base speed, (even if you lowball the speed of Narukami to as slow as 50ms-1).

A similar feat was replicated earlier.

No Caption Provided

This is further amplified by Ayato falling downward speed decreasing frame of time to react even further, Yomo overcome that distance greater than that speed, would put him around similar or superior speeds to Black Reaper Kaneki. This is why that stuff is Iffy for me.

Also Mustachio was just under the training of Nichirin, he been was before he became a hero meaning his speeds scale around his inferior it may be but would still gain a fraction of feats Nichirin has done in then scale to others which you can since his fellow samurai above supersonic. So it's even less ambiguous and more consistent that Mustachio through years of training before becoming a hero mastered supersonic speeds as well, as he was able to strike Garou who had no choice but to block with his hand. Who was able to perceive a blitz and stomp an S rank hero. Who is hypersonic just by his showing, and like I said about the blade speed being potentially higher than supersonic, yeah... the blade will have to be moving faster than TTM who accomplished hypersonic blitzing

No Caption Provided

And here he is moving FTE to a full Kakuja BR Kaneki, when Kaneki in base BR form was capable of statuing the electricity from Narukami:

Literally every relevant character in the series has enhanced dynamic vision and reflexes, so even moving FTE to a mook is superior than your standard FTE, but Arima himself has moved FTE over large distances to people with bare minimum supersonic feats, and shit-blitzed everyone he came across with the exception of OEK Kaneki.

To clarify Kaneki was never in full kakuja in that fight, even if you used that argument he wasn't at his peak mental state at the moment that's why when he gain clarity and became white again, he was even with Arima and defeated him.

And him being FTE is not that impressive since characters FTE in opm same rules will apply no matter how much you try to wank the reactions speed of an average ghoul fodder, monsters get a increase in stats and speed above normal human too.. Even the weakest A class Hero has subsonic+ - supersonic reactions and reflexes, blitzing monsters casually.

A Low Level A rank Hero being acknowledged by a known speedster of the series.
A Low Level A rank Hero being acknowledged by a known speedster of the series.

Who did this in statue force.

No Caption Provided

This is what real massively hypersonic speeds look like. 😏

Needle Star is capable of blitzing multiple monsters casually, and he's a mere B-Class, saved another from a rush attack from Rhino Wrestler who is able to perceive bullets from a sniper and deflect them with absolutely no trouble the same bullet that can intercept another sniper bullet which would put Rhino there around massively hypersonic.

with B Class heros being able to react and avoid him means Mustachio even early series would scale above that, which would put kombu also above Mustachio.

I might be open for a CAV on this, but that will be my first, but I don't want to continue giving reason for my answer. I think it's pretty clear.

Kombu would break his quinques just like how he broke mustachio's rapier and he'll be without much options

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KingCrimson

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#32  Edited By KingCrimson

@futureisbest: I’ll take that CaV. Don’t see the point in discussing the arguments further here if you want to make it a formal debate.

And for the record, it’s not that I don’t like your answer, I just disagree with it. You‘re entitled to your opinion, and I’m entitled to challenge it; at the very least for the sake of debate.