Killer Frost vs. Aquaman

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Deranged Midget

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@deranged_midget: Yeah but is Frost invulnerable to physical damage like Iceman?

Because if she is not AQ will put her down quite easily via physical force.

Not in the same sense as Iceman no. She cannot reform herself, or at least I don't think she can.

Arthur can put her down rather easily, if he can get to her which I'm debating against. KF is too versatile with her powers. Arthur is basically a brick unless he's in water. He has some jumping feats but it's limited to exactly what jumping is, a single-directional movement. His trident gives him some range but it's not enough to put the fight in his favour, especially if KF has an entire day of prep, more than enough to gauge his strengths/weaknesses.

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comicfan11

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#52  Edited By comicfan11

@deranged_midget: I see.

Then yeah AQ can take this.

I don't know Frost's prep feats, but AQ against freeze/cold usually doesn't have any serious troubles. Pre Flashpoint he has at least 2-3 instances being frozen and breaking out. In New 52 he was shown as frozen in the end of one issue and then being free in the next one and he also broke free from Grave's magic ice.

I believe in a straight fight, he can close in on Frost rather easy and take her out (even in New 52 he has some super speed feats on land).

I'll take your word that with prep she can take him, since I have no idea about her prep feats.

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Deranged Midget

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@deranged_midget: I see.

Then yeah AQ can take this.

I don't know Frost's prep feats, but AQ against freeze/cold usually doesn't have any serious troubles. Pre Flashpoint he has at least 2-3 instances being frozen and breaking out. In New 52 he was shown as frozen in the end of one issue and then being free in the next one and he also broke free from Grave's magic ice.

I believe in a straight fight, he can close in on Frost rather easy and take her out (even in New 52 he has some super speed feats on land).

I'll take your word that with prep she can take him, since I have no idea about her prep feats.

Except New 52 Aquaman is substantially different from his Pre-52 counterpart sadly. If I recall correctly, Arthur wasn't freed under his own power but by Mera, or at least he was assisted by her to escape after her people turned on them. I could be wrong though, I'll double check later.

Arthur doesn't really have any speed feats outside of the water mate, that's the problem and that's why I favour Frost here. He's extremely inconsistent on land. Displaying an affinity to leap great distances in a single issue and almost never replicating it again. Aside from that, he doesn't have any noteworthy feats to display speed and his leaping feat wasn't even a proper representation of speed.

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comicfan11

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#54  Edited By comicfan11

@deranged_midget: No. He was frozen in the end of issue 21 and then on the start of issue 22 he is free.

Mera was trapped the whole time. He freed her later.

And the Grave's feat was on his own.

As for speed

1) Being casually faster than multiple enhanced (due the serum) Talons, who are above Frost speedwise

2) Blitzing Ocean Master

3) again

4) Blitzing Wonder Woman

5) Being fast enough to land a punch on Superman (despite Supes speed, senses)

Aquaman doesn't have many speed feats so far, but Frost is a normal human as far as physicals go. He is most certainly fast enough to take this before Frost can do any serious damage.

Also his leaping is shown nearly every single issue he is on land.

It's one of his most consistent powers. Don't know where you got the "displaying an affinity to leap great distances in a single issue and almost never replicating it again".

He does it consistently both on his own book and JL.

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Deranged Midget

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@comicfan11: Cool beans, thanks for the correction. I'll check that out again.

In regards to your scans, nice picks but the vast majority of them are in a completely flooded and overrun city. He isn't exactly on foot. I wouldn't say that immediately transfer over completely but all of your scans are represented through similar context. Speed-blitzing both Clark and Diana, which neither had neither intention to fight nor were they really harmed, is moderately impressive. Although to simply point out, despite Clark having super speed and senses nearly in the same league as the Flash, he almost never displays that in character during battles. He's almost always confrontational and being in character, as he was, he never speed blitzes or fights with super speed. That much has clearly been proven throughout any of the various titles he's in.

Fair enough, but I fail to see how that will aid him against Frost? She has almost omnidirectional control of her ice riding (or whatever you want to refer it as) not to mention being able to slow him down with attacks of her own, both offensively and defensively. I'm not stating in any regard that she's stopping him with ease but merely that I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt. I stated as much that if Arthur can get his hands on her, then he can take a large majority due to his strength being a high mid-tier (or a low high-tier at the very best) and possessing a magically endued and seemingly indestructible trident that aids him if the fight leads further into the coast.

I'd give Arthur the win easily right off the bat if this battle began in moderate range, no prep and if Arthur was of the same mindset that he was during Throne of Atlantis but the circumstances here are different. He's in character, something that is clearly not to be said the same of during TOA.

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comicfan11

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#56  Edited By comicfan11

@deranged_midget: Well my point is this.

Aquaman can tank freeze attacks much better than Frost can tank hits from a character with AQ's strength. That's not considering that a hit from the Trident would be enough to KO Frost.

Also in regards to ToA, Aquaman was most certainly also holding back. He flat out states that to Wonder Woman. She was the first to use the Lasso on Aquaman and she attacked from behind. He didn't even use the Trident because he was holding back. Heck he didn't even hit her, just tackle her.

Aquaman was fast enough to not only avoid being completely tangled but to also blitz her in one move, after she attacked first. That's some serious speed and the water was not nearly high enough to count as "swimming" (knee level at best).

He only started getting more serious when the Atlantean Army rose and he started using the Trident.

Of course Aquaman is not as fast as Superman or WW for example (on land) but he can tag them some times and land a hit. That's speed that not many characters possess, even if it's not speedster speed per se.

Also remember that AQ is usually shown as faster and having better senses than Deathstroke (in their two fights Deathstroke admits it), and I expect this to be true in the New 52. Even being cassualy faster than multiple Talons is an indication of super human reflexes / speed

It all comes down to this (in a random fight), if Frost's ice manip is strong enough to put down Aquaman before he can reach her, then she will obviously win. But I believe that even if she tags AQ with her ice, AQ can power through and close the distance. And all because AQ usually (even in New 52) does well against ice attacks. It's his durability and speed imo that give him a (maybe slight) majority in a fight.

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Deranged Midget

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@deranged_midget: Well my point is this.

Aquaman can tank freeze attacks much better than Frost can tank hits from a character with AQ's strength. That's not considering that a hit from the Trident would be enough to KO Frost.

Also in regards to ToA, Aquaman was most certainly also holding back. He flat out states that to Wonder Woman. She was the first to use the Lasso on Aquaman and she attacked from behind. He didn't even use the Trident because he was holding back. Heck he didn't even hit her, just tackle her.

Aquaman was fast enough to not only avoid being completely tangled but to also blitz her in one move, after she attacked first.

He only started getting more serious when the Atlantean Army rose and he started using the Trident.

Of course Aquaman is not as fast as Superman or WW for example (on land) but he can tag them some times and land a hit. That's speed that not many characters possess, even if it's not speedster speed per se.

Also remember that AQ is usually shown as faster and having better senses than Deathstroke (in their two fights Deathstroke admits it), and I expect this to be true in the New 52. Even being cassualy faster than multiple Talons is an indication of super human reflexes / speed

It all comes down to this (in a random fight), if Frost's ice manip is strong enough to put down Aquaman before he can reach her, then she will obviously win. But I believe that even if she tags AQ with her ice, AQ can power through and close the distance. And all because AQ usually (even in New 52) does well against ice attacks. It's his durability and speed imo that give him a (maybe slight) majority in a fight.

My point was not that Aquaman was going all out, my point was that Arthur was largely out of character, even in his own title. He was aggressively pursuing against his own team and Diana tried to restrain Arthur after he attacked Batman and assaulted Clark in an unwarranted manner. He was losing his cool because he was trying to prevent an Atlantean invasion at the hands of his brother and instead of clearly cooperating with his teammates, which consisted of two of the most powerful beings on the planet, he rebelled against them. That's not exactly in character for Arthur.

That occassions where Arthur tagged Clark had nothing to do with speed. Clark wasn't even moving nor did he have the intention to engage Arthur and the latter responded by diving headfirst at him, fists flying. I'm not saying Arthur is slow, not even remotely, but he's no where in the same league as Clark or Diana and comparing him to a couple of talons isn't exactly a feat when a critically wounded, starved and deprived Batman murdered one of the best Talons around.

As I mentioned earlier, Arthur can win if he pushes the fight towards the coast and possibly into the vicinity of water to give him the strategical advantage, but KF has a day of prep and she is largely more versatile through her powerset and while it's not as powerful as that of the original Atlantean king, whose magical powers probably outmatch that of Frosts, she is still more than capable of keeping a distance and constantly tossing attacks at him, which obviously won't be the deciding factor.

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comicfan11

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#58  Edited By comicfan11

@deranged_midget: Yeah I agree then on your points.

The only part I want to clarify is that, even if AQ was out of character in ToA (which he wasn't since he wasn't trying to hurt them, he was trying to show power to his brother) he still didn't go all out against Supes and WW. That much is clear.

Also my other point with the Talons is that he was casually faster than them. He engaged multiple at the same time while joking with Flash and GL.

Bats vs a single Talon is a fight and their stats are comparable at least. Aquaman is above that.

But apart from those I agree with your assessments.

And here's also Aquaman super leaping against Hawkman.

Notice that it takes AQ an instant to take to the air. Roughly the same time it takes Flash to dodge Vibe.

Still not speedster speed, but clearly metahuman (supported by the artwork also).

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Deranged Midget

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@deranged_midget: Yeah I agree then on your points.

The only part I want to clarify is that, even if AQ was out of character in ToA (which he wasn't since he wasn't trying to hurt them, he was trying to show power to his brother) he still didn't go all out against Supes and WW. That much is clear.

Also my other point with the Talons is that he was casually faster than them. He engaged multiple at the same time while joking with Flash and GL.

Oh no, don't get me wrong, I don't believe that Arthur was completely letting loose on Clark and Diana, but he wasn't exactly playing nice either and he was moderately ticked off. Perhaps not at the League but at this brother and Atlantis itself. And agreed in regards to the Talons. I'm just making the point that the Talons aren't all that impressive as I thought you were making them out to be. I was in no way attempting to downplay Arthur's speed, my apologies!

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comicfan11

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Bruxae

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#61  Edited By Bruxae

Killer Frost, yo.

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cameron83

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#62  Edited By cameron83

@cameron83 said:

@dondave said:

@cameron83: Has Killer Frost ice constructs hurt anyone of Aquaman's durability?

I don't know of Killer Frost's,but I think Ice constructs have proven effective against Aquaman.

The Ice Kings constructs hurt Aquaman, but they are magic ice, not normal.

This "ice" that encased the Atlanteans also had the supernatural ability to "talk" to the people trapped and transfer memories.

It should not be considered standard for all ice-wielders.

Furthermore the only time the Ice King managed to hurt AQ with the ice constructs, was when Aquaman was distracted.

The Ice King told him he was not the true king of Atlantis (during the fight) and Aquaman was staggered from the reveal. Frost can't do the same (affect AQ on a personal level during a fight to buy time).

Apart from that, if Frost is not like Iceman (meaning able to turn her entire body to actual ice to withstand and heal physical wounds) AQ can take her.

If she is made entirely of ice and is immune to physical damage, then AQ can try telepathy.

Ah,okay my mistake.

I never knew.

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comicfan11

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#63  Edited By comicfan11
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Joygirl

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*nudge*

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Blackdog2009

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AQUAMAN

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Fallschirmjager

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Aquaman healed almost immediately after getting stabbed by Dead King too.

I choose Arthur :D

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ZhuRong

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Killer Frost is a Firestorm villian

Poor Aquaman