Kamijou Touma VS Ainz Ooal Gown

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COOLGUY18

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#1  Edited By COOLGUY18

VS

R1: Random encounter, Regular eqipment for ainz.

R2: Both has basic knowledge about each other. Random encounter.

R3: Invisible thing touma vs Ainz with all world class equipment, and ainz has 3 hours prep.

BONUS ROUND: entire Kamijou Faction, with fiamma vs inhabitants of Great Tomb of Nazarick, with touch me.

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COOLGUY18

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KillerQueen

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Lord Ainz takes every round.

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COOLGUY18

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KillerQueen

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@killerqueen: Do you even know anything about touma?

I wouldn't have commented if I didn't, that's your shtick.

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COOLGUY18

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#8  Edited By COOLGUY18

@killerqueen: So i guess you know that touma is low multiversal level and can negate any multiversal level magical entities or attacks in his awakaned state right?

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KillerQueen

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#9  Edited By KillerQueen

@coolguy18 said:

@killerqueen: So i guess you know that touma is low multiversal level and can negate any multiversal level entities or attacks in his awakaned state right?

Sí.

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yeimsick

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@coolguy18: IIRC he can only stop magical/esper attacks and not physical ones; what's stopping Ainz from stopping time and stabbing him?

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COOLGUY18

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@killerqueen: so how is he winning in round 3?

Offtopic: Why am i debating in my own thread?

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KillerQueen

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#12  Edited By KillerQueen

@yeimsick said:

@coolguy18: IIRC he can only stop magical/esper attacks and not physical ones; what's stopping Ainz from stopping time and stabbing him?

Nothing, really.

@coolguy18 said:

@killerqueen: so how is he winning in round 3?

Offtopic: Why am i debating in my own thread?

With his World Class items that literally break universal rules and specifically aren't affected by magic negation as far as I remember. If you knew anything about Ainz, I'd think that fact would have already been in your noggin.

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COOLGUY18

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#13  Edited By COOLGUY18

@killerqueen: @yeimsick:

@yeimsick said:

@coolguy18: IIRC he can only stop magical/esper attacks and not physical ones; what's stopping Ainz from stopping time and stabbing him?

Lol, no. His right hand cancels anything supernatural. He won't be affected by time stop.

@killerqueen said:
@coolguy18 said:

@killerqueen: so how is he winning in round 3?

Offtopic: Why am i debating in my own thread?

With his World Class items that literally break universal rules and specifically aren't affected by magic negation as far as I remember. If you knew anything about Ainz, I'd think that fact would have already been in your noggin.

At round 3,any supernatural ability around Touma is negated . Period. Ainz's items won't work, He can't cast spells, and because he is a supernatural being, he dies by staying close to touma.

I guess i made round 3 a spite. i think i have to edit.

why am i freakin' debating at my own thread?????

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CodeVein

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So Touma's bad luck vs Ainz hmmm....

Image breaker liable could stop Every thing short of Magic attacks aimed at him.

Timestop won't work Because Image Breaker.

Death spell likely kills him but if Touma Punches Ainz with Image Breaker....

Ainz actually is a human upon the vale but would it act as if he was undead and unnatural and reject his existence or turn him back into a human???

Hmmmm....

Could go either way.

Thinking Ainz kills with Death spells.

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COOLGUY18

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@yeimsick:

I guess ainz could win by stabbing him (except round 3.), but not by stopping time, it won't affect him. teleportation maybe, cuz he is an idiot.

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CodeVein

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BONUS ROUND CAN GO TO HELL.

Fiamma's holy right is too BS.

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COOLGUY18

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#17  Edited By COOLGUY18

I guess round one is a stomp for ainz. He can't tank graps heart. Why? touma has literally stated in the first chapter that magic will work on any part of his body except his right hand. This is a complete stomp with grasp heart..... At least for round one.

at round 2 i removed the prep, so that touma has a chance.

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CodeVein

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@coolguy18: Isn't Accelerator also part of Touma's faction now?

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COOLGUY18

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CodeVein

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@coolguy18: Fiamma's holy right brings the strike of extinction autohit that just kills Overlord team immediately.

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COOLGUY18

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#21  Edited By COOLGUY18

@codevein: Yes, accelerator is one of the kamijou faction, along with othinus.

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COOLGUY18

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@codevein:

@codevein said:

@coolguy18: Fiamma's holy right brings the strike of extinction autohit that just kills Overlord team immediately.

I mean, about the invinsible thing vs ainz with all world class items.

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CodeVein

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@codevein: Yes accelerator is, along with othinus.

That's too much Accelerator could grind everyone to dust on the other team besides maybe Ainz. Depends if his Aim field recognizes the Time stop magic as a vector.

Even then Fiamma and Othinus is just too damn much.

@codevein:

@codevein said:

@coolguy18: Fiamma's holy right brings the strike of extinction autohit that just kills Overlord team immediately.

I mean, about the invinsible thing vs ainz with all world class items.

I imagine it depends if his Image breaker in that state can register if Death spells that don't directly attack him get negated.

Though if you ask me. GOALD would still kill him since it has a feat of killing Air the world around and something with no concept of death.

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COOLGUY18

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#24  Edited By COOLGUY18

@codevein:

@codevein said:
@coolguy18 said:

@codevein:

@codevein said:

@coolguy18: Fiamma's holy right brings the strike of extinction autohit that just kills Overlord team immediately.

I mean, about the invinsible thing vs ainz with all world class items.

I imagine it depends if his Image breaker in that state can register if Death spells that don't directly attack him get negated.

Though if you ask me. GOALD would still kill him since it has a feat of killing Air the world around and something with no concept of death.

in this state, he ROFLstomped fiamma. And he doesn't need to touch to negate anymore. Everything around him get's negated.

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CodeVein

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@codevein:

@codevein said:
@coolguy18 said:

@codevein:

@codevein said:

@coolguy18: Fiamma's holy right brings the strike of extinction autohit that just kills Overlord team immediately.

I mean, about the invinsible thing vs ainz with all world class items.

I imagine it depends if his Image breaker in that state can register if Death spells that don't directly attack him get negated.

Though if you ask me. GOALD would still kill him since it has a feat of killing Air the world around and something with no concept of death.

in this state, he ROFLstomped fiamma. And he doesn't need to touch to negate anymore. Everything around him get's nullified.

What's the range of it?

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COOLGUY18

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@codevein: I don't really know haw far it's effect can be, but's it is definitely farther than his normal one.

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reikai

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#27  Edited By reikai

@coolguy18: Touma still loses and Time Stop will still work. The simple fact is that IB doesn't prevent AoE and he was still affected by the distortion that swapped peoples appearances based on his memories and the only one who wasn't swapped was his Dad because Touma didn't remember what he looked like. [Time Stop] is not a targeted move. It stops the flow of time for the whole world, so there's no way for IB to cancel it since he needs to come into contact with the source to do so.

We've also seen Touma be given a heart attack so ranged spells work fine on him. Touma only canceled the effect by touching his chest using IB. If Ainz uses [Grasp Heart] or any other ranged/AoE insta-death spell, Touma won't have the presence of mind or time to react before he drops to the floor dead.

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COOLGUY18

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#28  Edited By COOLGUY18

@reikai: lmao. He wasn't affected by it. Do you even watch to aru? Plus, his imagone breaker also passively defends him from spells, like defending the divine punishment from vento. Time stop is not an exception, because it also affects his arm. So, time stop is negated.

Yup i agree he dies from grapst heart.

He teleports and uses and insta death spell, or TGOLID. Just as long he dosen't use reality slash and cut touma's arm. Unless ainz wants to fight a dragon.

But that tactic won't work on round 3, due to touma can negate anything supernatural around Him.

Any thoughts about round 3?

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COOLGUY18

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#29  Edited By COOLGUY18

@reikai: Here's the proof of him blocking any AoE, world class Magical phenomena.

Imagine Breaker

Blocks the effects of a spell that changed everyone in the world.

" “Se…see? I was right, right? Kami-yan wasn‟t switched not because he was the culprit, but because the effects of Angel Fall got negated by the Imagine Breaker.” " (To Aru Majutsu no Index Volume 4, pag 44)

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Jacthripper

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I don't deny any of Touma's high end magic defense, but can't Ainz just physically kill him easily?

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COOLGUY18

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#31  Edited By COOLGUY18

@jacthripper: Yup. He could easily touma's face off. But also, touma could literally one shot ainz, because he is a supernatural being.

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Jacthripper

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@jacthripper: Yup. He could easily touma's face off. But also, touma could literally one shot ainz, because he is a supernatural being.

Is being undead considered supernatural in Ainz' verse. It's slightly NLF if you say they're automatically supernatural since they were shown to occur naturally in graveyards.

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COOLGUY18

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@jacthripper: Being undead means being unnatural. Touma could literally destroy his freind , kazakiri, if he touch her. Because her form and consciousness is made from the AIM diffusion fields.

But i don't what will happen if touma touches ainz. Either the imagine breaker rejects his existence, or the imagine breaker turns ainz back to human again.

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reikai

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#34  Edited By reikai

@coolguy18: ...You didn't show or prove anything. You just expelled a word salad from your gnarled maw and decided people will just accept it. You have literally not shown any proof at all for anything you've claimed. Whereas we can see that everytime Touma has canceled a spell, he has had to make contact with it using his Right Arm.

And we can see in his fight with Izzard, that Touma had to touch his throat to stop choking when Izzard used his Ars Magna to make him do so. Which means ranged magic works fine on Touma.

Loading Video...

Also, Ainz isn't supernatural here. Undead exist as a natural factor in the world and there are various types of undead. So, no, Touma can't just touch and kill Ainz. It's not the same thing as with Michael.

Ainz would also have no issue just bludgeoning Touma to death. He can do it in one hit, given how easily Ainz toyed with Guu.

Loading Video...

And of course him disguised as Momon and one-shotting a giant basilisk.

Loading Video...

And if Round 3 just came down to a fist fight, Touma has no way to win. Even if he can nullify all of Ainz's passive defenses, Ainz is so much stronger than him and his skeletal body so durable that Touma would shatter his hands just trying to hurt Ainz.

If he really wanted to add insult to injruy, Ainz can literally crush Touma to death.

Loading Video...

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AkshSarpanch

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Ainz can physically destroy Touma.

Also undead in Overlord are naturally occurring species so Touma isn't erasing Ainz.

This is stomp

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AkshSarpanch

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#36  Edited By AkshSarpanch

@coolguy18: undead are natural race in Overlord.

(Overlord Vol 12 Chapter 3)

"Huhu, the Sorcerer King laughed happily. It was the kind of laugh one had when reminiscing about the past.

Right now, he seemed just like a human being.

Could it be that the Sorcerer King was once human...?

Perhaps he had transformed himself into one of the undead with the power of magic, but that would be a perplexing matter. That should not have been possible. To Neia’s knowledge, the undead were naturally occurring things"

Touma can't one shot Ainz here

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COOLGUY18

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#37  Edited By COOLGUY18

@reikai:

@reikai said:

@coolguy18: ...You didn't show or prove anything. You just expelled a word salad from your gnarled maw and decided people will just accept it. You have literally not shown any proof at all for anything you've claimed. Whereas we can see that everytime Touma has canceled a spell, he has had to make contact with it using his Right Arm.

U mean this?

" “Se…see? I was right, right? Kami-yan wasn‟t switched not because he was the culprit, but because the effects of Angel Fall got negated by the Imagine Breaker.” " (To Aru Majutsu no Index Volume 4, pag 44).

Angel fall was the distortion, u said earlier at comment #27. So that's your salad.

plus He countered Vento's hax which passively causes anyone with hostility towards her to have the oxygen stripped from their lungs. And also passively blocks telepathy that doesn't go out of it's way to send signals AROUND his hand. And Accelerator's Reflection is a passive ability that he can use even in his sleep where calculations are done subconsciously.

And we can see in his fight with Izzard, that Touma had to touch his throat to stop choking when Izzard used his Ars Magna to make him do so. Which means ranged magic works fine on Touma.

Loading Video...

Range magic works on him, as long it dosen't hit his hand.

Also, Ainz isn't supernatural here. Undead exist as a natural factor in the world and there are various types of undead. So, no, Touma can't just touch and kill Ainz. It's not the same thing as with Michael.

Well, i have to agree for now. Touma never touched anything that is undead at to aru.

Ainz would also have no issue just bludgeoning Touma to death. He can do it in one hit, given how easily Ainz toyed with Guu.

Loading Video...

And of course him disguised as Momon and one-shotting a giant basilisk.

Loading Video...

And if Round 3 just came down to a fist fight, Touma has no way to win. Even if he can nullify all of Ainz's passive defenses, Ainz is so much stronger than him and his skeletal body so durable that Touma would shatter his hands just trying to hurt Ainz.

This version of touma is universal. LPSAD Fiamma , the one above god, was scared shitless after witnessing this form. Only othinus was able to destroy this thing. And i doubt ainz could ever replicate that feat. Not even counting dragon arm touma.


Waiting for response.

how about bonus round?

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COOLGUY18

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@akshsarpanch:

@coolguy18: undead are natural race in Overlord.

Only at overlord verse i suppose.

(Overlord Vol 12 Chapter 3)

"Huhu, the Sorcerer King laughed happily. It was the kind of laugh one had when reminiscing about the past.

Right now, he seemed just like a human being.

Could it be that the Sorcerer King was once human...?

Perhaps he had transformed himself into one of the undead with the power of magic, but that would be a perplexing matter. That should not have been possible. To Neia’s knowledge, the undead were naturally occurring things"

Touma can't one shot Ainz here

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AkshSarpanch

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@coolguy18: the fact that Ainz's race is naturally occurring puts him in natural category. Therefore Touma can't one shot him since his ability only work on supernatural

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COOLGUY18

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@akshsarpanch: Ok.

So what's ur oppinion about round 3 and bouns round.

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AkshSarpanch

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@coolguy18: round 3? No idea. We have never seen a single World Item at all.

If we base it on feat, Touma takes it.

Bonus round. Touma easily takes it unless Touch Me has probability manipulation which is perfect counter to Fiamma.

But yeah based on feat, r3 and bonus, Touma takes it easily

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COOLGUY18

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#42  Edited By COOLGUY18

@akshsarpanch:

@akshsarpanch said:

@coolguy18: round 3? No idea. We have never seen a single World Item at all.

lmao. here's a list.

  • Longinus: It has the power to completely remove any target from existence at the expense of the user's own existence. There was no way to restore the data of anyone deleted by the World Item, other than by using the resurrection powers of other World Items; neither cash items or resurrection spells would work. If someone were to use it on an NPC of Nazarick, it would even reduce the maximum creatable levels of NPCs — the special feature of a guild's homebase.
  • Ahura Mazda: It has a potent effect on anything with a negative karma value, and its area of effect could span an entire world.
  • Ouroboros: It has the power to alter YGGDRASIL's game mechanism, in more ways than Five Elements Overcoming. This item once prevented Ainz Ooal Gown guild members from entering a certain area.[3]
  • World Savior: A club-shaped item, which is very weak in its initiatory stage, but gets stronger with time. It can become so strong that it could even conquer Nazarick with all the members of Ainz Ooal Gown combined.
  • Unnamed World Item: May have the power to remove status effects, such as mind control, from any target. Currently stored in the Treasury of Ainz Ooal Gown.
  • Unnamed World Item: Unknown power. Currently stored in the Treasury of Ainz Ooal Gown.

Other World Items

  • Billion Blades: Currently, the ability of it is unknown. This is given to Demiurge or Cocytus from the treasury.
  • Caloric Stone: Its exact power is currently unknown. This item can only be gained by using massive amounts of rare metal from seven hidden mines. There was one that belonged to Ainz Ooal Gown. Nubo proposed to make invincible golems by using this item.[6]
  • Ginnungagap: A World item that is equipped by Albedo. It can seemingly be used to destroy large areas. Tabula Smaragdina gave it to Albedo without permission from the rest of the guild. Ainz only noticed just before the game was about to end so he let it slip by.[7]
  • Atlas: Currently, the ability of it is unknown. It once belonged to Nine's Own Goal, the precursor organization to Ainz Ooal Gown, but a guild stole it.[8]
  • Graeae: A World Item that was under the possession of World Searcher. (Web Novel only)
  • Holy Grail: Healing?-type (Web Novel only)
  • YGGDRASIL Leaf: Protection-type (Web Novel only)
  • Gjallarhorn (Gyararuhorun): A higher level version the Super-Tier Magic <(Written: Summoning of an Avatar of God) Call Avatar>? (Web Novel only)
  • Founder (Faundaa): (Web Novel only)
  • A Dove Brings An Olive Branch: (Web Novel only)[10]

Unnamed World Items

  • World Item that summon devils: An item that summons an endless legion of very strong demons, making a lot of trouble for Yggdrasil. It is unknown if it is one of the "Twenty".[11]
  • Ainz's World Item (Red Orb?): Currently, the name and its ability are unknown, however, Ainz has stated that it gets stronger the longer it's on his person. If Ainz activates this item, he will lose some levels.[12]

If we base it on feat, Touma takes it.

Bonus round. Touma easily takes it unless Touch Me has probability manipulation which is perfect counter to Fiamma.

But yeah based on feat, r3 and bonus, Touma takes it easily

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jasonhitto

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Touma stomp all round

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COOLGUY18

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@reikai: Touma has some good physical feats too.

Touma reacted and blocked all of Fiamma's Instant Laser Attacks that were instant + Fiamma stated that Touma was moving like if he was teleporting faster than his attacks.

Here's Touma punching ( K.O. ) Fiamma ( Who was so Powerfull that he could make things from the Bible into reality + when he fights Touma, he was far more powerfull than before due having Index under his control and having her "God = Omnipotent Power mixted with his own ) in the face + breaking reality around them by just punching, in the Novels.

http://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/to-aru-majutsu-no-index/images/f/f2/Fiamma_vs_Touma.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20140524104246

http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/to-aru-majutsu-no-index/images/9/96/Fiamma_defeat.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20140529103126

http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/to-aru-majutsu-no-index/images/d/d0/Ollerus_saves_fiamma.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20140529103650.

Touma got touch in the head by Index's one hit kill magic and it didnt killed him but it destroyed his memories.

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/21.html

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/22.html

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/23.html

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/24.html

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/29.html

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/30.html

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/31.html

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/35.html

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/36.html

http://mangafox.me/manga/to_aru_majutsu_no_kinsho_mokuroku/v02/c010/37.html

Tanks three lightning spears at 1 billion volts.

"That sublime spear of purple electricity that contained 1 billion volts glowed a bluish-white. [...] And that electrical spear struck Kamijou directly in the heart. [...] At that point, she could no longer control the lightning spear as it pierced the boy’s chest. There was a tremendous roar. But the boy did not die. He did not even collapse to the ground.[...] Amid that lightless and soundless flash, the sound of a direct hit resounded out like a fireworks factory exploding. Even so, the boy did not clench his right hand even in the very end." (To Aru Majutsu no Index Volume 3, pag 122/124/127)

"Kamijou thought he had just barely managed to avoid it, but the mass of steel weighed hundreds of kilograms. When it struck the ground, it sent a large amount of gravel flying into the air. It was like a meteorite striking the sea. Countless small stones stabbed into his body." (To Aru Majutsu no Index Volume 3, pag 157)

Touma sends some Necessarius magician fly

"With a punch, Kamijou Touma sends Sherry Cromwell flying far without mercy. Sherry‘s tender flesh is like paper floating in the air as it continues to roll on the floor. [...] Kamijou turns his eyes from Sherry, who was knocked 5m away, and turns to look at Ellis." (To Aru Majutsu no Index Volume 6, pag 145/146)

Easily sends Styl (a Necessarius battle magician) flying.

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AlphaQ

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#45  Edited By AlphaQ

In character Ainz might let Touma touch him, and if we assume the Imagine Breaker works on the magic of the Overlord setting, that would negate him, seeing as he is a magical being. If Ainz doesn't let him do that then he will easily win, using either physicals or magic, take your pick. A simple Aura of Despair would be all that is required.

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AeonOfOsiris

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#46  Edited By AeonOfOsiris

I'm only speaking about the Bonus Round here. Othinus would stomp alone unfortunately, she's Multiversal and can manipulate the probability of anything happening, manipulate causality, posseses acausality, manipulate time and the whole world (Referring to the infinite amount of phases/universes surrounding the pure and untouched universe at the centre) etc. She can literally do anything she wants, she's essentially nigh-omnipotent. And yes, she can Reality Warp.

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GXrevs06

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Ains aims for his legs. All of the characters in Index have Captain American syndrome. They always conveniently aim for Touma's Anti-Magic right hand instead of anywhere else on his body

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ChaosKnight75

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#48  Edited By ChaosKnight75

@gxrevs06:

Characters have gone for his legs or head plenty of times. He’s either dodged completely or moves his hand accordingly

You’d know this if you actually had any remotely decent knowledge of the series. Here’s how a spell from a grimoire going for his legs worked out:

“An unnatural red light palely glowed from the remote control spiritual item.

“Warning: Chapter 29, Verse 33. Seven seconds until complete activation of the Scarlet Stone of Pexjarva.”

(Wha—!?)

In shock, Kamijou pressed the bottom of his shoes against the ground in order to stand up and move to his next course of action.

Immediately afterwards, an intense pain crawled up from his toes, to his ankle, his shin, and his knee. The pain was similar to that of having the joints forcibly moved. Something invisible seemed to move along the floor and crawl into his body through his leg.

“Kh…Gaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh!!”

Kamijou struck his clenched fist against his own thigh.

The intense pain being transmitted from his foot suddenly disappeared.”

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DeathHero61

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#49  Edited By DeathHero61

If touma's right arm were to get ripped off by accident during the fight, that's probably GGs for Ainz, due to the "invisible thing" in otherwords the giant freaking 8 headed dragon he summons that negates supernatural powers effortlessly.

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COOLGUY18

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