TBH, with both at their prime and bloodlusted, I could see Ban winning a very slight majority. Ban can regen from Kamui and drain Kakashi's stats while invisible to make his intangibility run out, making Kakashi easy work after that point.
It all depends on whether Kakashi can erase Ban completely before he runs out of chakra imo.
TBH, with both at their prime and bloodlusted, I could see Ban winning a very slight majority. Ban can regen from Kamui and drain Kakashi's stats while invisible to make his intangibility run out, making Kakashi easy work after that point.
It all depends on whether Kakashi can erase Ban completely before he runs out of chakra imo.
TBH, with both at their prime and bloodlusted, I could see Ban winning a very slight majority. Ban can regen from Kamui and drain Kakashi's stats while invisible to make his intangibility run out, making Kakashi easy work after that point.
It all depends on whether Kakashi can erase Ban completely before he runs out of chakra imo.
How’s Ban regenerating from being sent to another dimension?
How‘s Ban even going to be able to perceive Kakashi?
TBH, with both at their prime and bloodlusted, I could see Ban winning a very slight majority. Ban can regen from Kamui and drain Kakashi's stats while invisible to make his intangibility run out, making Kakashi easy work after that point.
It all depends on whether Kakashi can erase Ban completely before he runs out of chakra imo.
How’s Ban regenerating from being sent to another dimension?
Ban could easily regenerate from anything a puddle or above, but if Kakashi BFR'd Ban to his dimension, Kakashi would have to actually kill or KO him after that to constitute a win, which is virtually impossible with Ban's regeneration. Kamui is literally Kakashi's only way to win here, but he can't keep Ban down.
How‘s Ban even going to be able to perceive Kakashi?
He doesn't have to. Ban turns invisible, soaks Kakashi's stats until he is weak and slow from lack of chakra while becoming stronger himself, and then kills him. Even if Kakashi does tag Ban with Kamui, he has nothing to kill or incapacitate him after that point.
Hasn't Ban never actually used his invisibility in a fight? For all we know he is unable to use it for long periods of time or can only activate the ability when people are already unaware of his presence.
Even if Kakashi can't put Ban down physically he can knock him out with genjutsu. Although I could see Ban potentially breaking out with sheer willpower.
The only way i see kakashi winning is if he sends bans entire body into another dimension, a feat we havent seen him do with dms tbh. Not saying its not possible though. But Ban was literally nothing but blood mist in the air, not even. And he came back, so my money is on Ban
Ban could easily regenerate from anything a puddle or above, but if Kakashi BFR'd Ban to his dimension, Kakashi would have to actually kill or KO him after that to constitute a win, which is virtually impossible with Ban's regeneration. Kamui is literally Kakashi's only way to win here, but he can't keep Ban down.
I just saw the win by "Death/KO" in the OP.
He doesn't have to. Ban turns invisible, soaks Kakashi's stats until he is weak and slow from lack of chakra while becoming stronger himself, and then kills him. Even if Kakashi does tag Ban with Kamui, he has nothing to kill or incapacitate him after that point.
We don't know how that ability works, he obviosuly would've used it against DK Mel and Kakashi should be able to vape him with a Raikiri or a Raikiri variant.
Ban could easily regenerate from anything a puddle or above, but if Kakashi BFR'd Ban to his dimension, Kakashi would have to actually kill or KO him after that to constitute a win, which is virtually impossible with Ban's regeneration. Kamui is literally Kakashi's only way to win here, but he can't keep Ban down.
I just saw the win by "Death/KO" in the OP.
Yeah, and Ban's moveset hard counters kamui.
He doesn't have to. Ban turns invisible, soaks Kakashi's stats until he is weak and slow from lack of chakra while becoming stronger himself, and then kills him. Even if Kakashi does tag Ban with Kamui, he has nothing to kill or incapacitate him after that point.
We don't know how that ability works, he obviosuly would've used it against DK Mel
Ban only used zero sign once while bloodlusted against Melascula cuz she was about to eat Mel's soul. Ban wasn't actually fighting to kill DK either, otherwise he could have killed Mel in the process. It's confirmed that they weren't out to kill DK in Mel's body by the sins having to restrain DK to keep him from dragging Mel down with him. There's also PIS.
Kakashi should be able to vape him with a Raikiri or a Raikiri variant.
Kakashi's raikiri doesn't have the feats to keep Ban down. Ban easily tanked this:
The red are rises in the landscape presumed to be mountains and the blast is visually massive from the coast of Brittania(blue line).
The attack expands so far out of Camelot that it engulfs other towns/cities across Brittania.
Ban nosells island level attacks, so raikiri isn't doing more damage than Ban can casually regenerate from.
Ban honestly doesn't even need zero sign with his stat stealing+immortality. Kakashi eventually gets drained and punched to death with his own strength.
Ban only used zero sign once while bloodlusted against Melascula cuz she was about to eat Mel's soul. Ban wasn't actually fighting to kill DK either, otherwise he could have killed Mel in the process. It's confirmed that they weren't out to kill DK in Mel's body by the sins having to restrain DK to keep him from dragging Mel down with him. There's also PIS.
It would have been useful many times throughout the series and he was trying to beat DK Mel into submission becoming invisible would have made that considerably easier.
Kakashi's raikiri doesn't have the feats to keep Ban down. Ban easily tanked this:
.....
Kakashi's Raikiri hurt Kaguya. Are you really telling me a Raikiri variant wouldn't completely vaporize Ban?
There is no version of this fight that's really fair. DMS Kakashi stomps any version of Ban, and regular Kakashi gets bodied by any relevant version of Ban.
Prime Ban is current ban and he lost his immortality so what are yall talking about?? He gets kamui sniped/kamui raikiri'ed/genjutsu'ed. And kakashi can kamui ban's whole body with kamui snipe/kamui shuriken. And if you want to question his ability to do so, lemme point out instances where kamui was used to bfr whole bodies.
- (long range kamui) kakashi kamui'ed naruto's clone to kamui dimension to attack obito.
- (short range kamui) literally every time obito tried using kamui on his opponent it was bfr.
So yea kakashi can warp ban from all ranges, and i'm pretty sure we all know he has the speed considering he fought the ultimate god tier of the verse and did well.
It does tho. It would help if Ban was faster, but he can soak stats for that. Eventually Ban becomes faster than Kakashi and oneshots him when his chakra runs dry.
Ban only used zero sign once while bloodlusted against Melascula cuz she was about to eat Mel's soul. Ban wasn't actually fighting to kill DK either, otherwise he could have killed Mel in the process. It's confirmed that they weren't out to kill DK in Mel's body by the sins having to restrain DK to keep him from dragging Mel down with him. There's also PIS.
It would have been useful many times throughout the series and he was trying to beat DK Mel into submission becoming invisible would have made that considerably easier.
Plot bro, but Ban is bloodlusted here, so he's bound to use it. He doesn't need it tho.
Kakashi's raikiri doesn't have the feats to keep Ban down. Ban easily tanked this:
.....
........
Kakashi's Raikiri hurt Kaguya. Are you really telling me a Raikiri variant wouldn't completely vaporize Ban?
Shows how much you know about Naruto. Kakashi used the Kamui raikiri, which sends the part cut by Kakashi to another dimension just like kamui. That still wouldn't constitute a win cuz Ban would just regen. Kakashi literally doesn't have a single useful attack that doesn't incorporate kamui. Ban eventually kills him once he's weak and Ban is amped by Kakashi's own power.
@uchihaghost: @hittheassasin: Just wondering, how is Kakashi supposed to keep Ban down? All of Kakashi's moves in this form are used to bfr, but that won't actually work on Ban to constitute a win. Ban can just soak Kakashi until he's no longer intangible. Maybe I'm missing something, but I wouldn't mind hearing your reasoning.
@uchihaghost: @hittheassasin: Just wondering, how is Kakashi supposed to keep Ban down? All of Kakashi's moves in this form are used to bfr, but that won't actually work on Ban to constitute a win. Ban can just soak Kakashi until he's no longer intangible. Maybe I'm missing something, but I wouldn't mind hearing your reasoning.
Ban can be incapitated for a short while if you vaporise his entire body. If you don't count that or BFR as a win here, only Death or KO, Ban would indeed win since Kakashi's DMS would eventually run out, at which point Ban could stomp him. However, DMS Kakashi >> Ban in raw power normally.
Ban ain't immortal anymore guys. If he gets tagged, it's over.
Ban does have the striking advantage and can oneshot, but unfortunately, DMS Kakashi is intangible and his attacks can also oneshot. So Kakashi wins imo.
@antonio_1996: OP says both at their prime, which would mean pot purgatory Ban with immortality. You can't assume Kakashi gets his most powerful form and Ban doesn't.
@uchihaghost: @hittheassasin: Just wondering, how is Kakashi supposed to keep Ban down? All of Kakashi's moves in this form are used to bfr, but that won't actually work on Ban to constitute a win. Ban can just soak Kakashi until he's no longer intangible. Maybe I'm missing something, but I wouldn't mind hearing your reasoning.
Ban can be incapitated for a short while if you vaporise his entire body.
Except Kakashi doesn't have any attacks that can completely vaporize Ban. Kakashi is a one trick pony with his whole moveset revolving around kamui, which isn't very effective against immortals.
If you don't count that or BFR as a win here, only Death or KO, Ban would indeed win since Kakashi's DMS would eventually run out, at which point Ban could stomp him. However, DMS Kakashi >> Ban in raw power normally
This is really my only reasoning for Ban winning. Kakashi's only means of victory is brf, but OP states death or KO. Kakashi would curbstomp Ban without immortality. I feel like people just aren't considering how Ban's immortality counters kamui snipe and how his stat stealing counters kamui intangibility.
@worldofruin6: I did, ban is no longer immortal bro, he sacrificed his immortality to save Elaine, so any attack will be lethal if its strong enough, kakashi now has a PS empowered by rikudou chakra, meaning its way stronger than madara's EMS PS, kamui raikiri is also a oneshot, genjutsu is a oneshot, kamui shuriken/kamui snipe are all oneshots.
He’d be getting ripped apart and then vaped all before he has time to use physical hunt.
How‘s that a fanfic the reason is most likely due to it having a weakness. Until we learn why he doesn’t regularly use it you can’t use it in a debate. Are we even sure it’s his ability isn’t possible for that it to be a spell used by the girl who teleported him?
Raikiri Harmed Kaguya and the kamui part came after that so yeah Bans getting vaped.
@antonio_1996: A huge if as Ban isn't slow and he's physically on par with Meliodas, who can split mountains in half with sword swings. In all honestly, a backhand slap from Ban and Kakashi turns into bloody mist. Ban outclasses Kakashi so greatly in physical ability that it's not funny. Ban can also rip Kakashi apart without having to touch him. That's what Fox Hunt is for.
Remember, Ban was so fast in his first appearance that he not only dodged Jericho's sword, but gave himself a shave and cut his hair without her even seeing it. And this is pretty much Ban at his weakest.
@uchihaghost: Ban isn’t immortal anymore but Kakashi doesn’t have his sharingan anymore either so what’s your point? The OP says prime for both, so prime Ban would be right before he gave up his immortality. So unless the OP clarifies Ban should be immortal here.
@uchihaghost: Prime Ban would be Ban at his strongest, which would mean post purgatory Ban with immortality. Kakashi borrowed his power for DMS and lost it after 1 fight. Should we assume Kakashi only has 1 MS for this battle?
He’d be getting ripped apart and then vaped all before he has time to use physical hunt.
You are not understanding. Ban can activate physical hunt mid battle and it drains stats steadily after that point. It's not like he has to do some kind of ritual or charge it up. Name a single attack of Kakashi's that can vape Ban. I'll wait.....
How‘s that a fanfic the reason is most likely due to it having a weakness. Until we learn why he doesn’t regularly use it you can’t use it in a debate.
If you state something happened that was never even insinuated, it's fanfic.
Are we even sure it’s his ability isn’t possible for that it to be a spell used by the girl who teleported him?
The scan literally shows the dark panel for a spell that insinuates that Ban used the move. You are reaching.
Raikiri Harmed Kaguya and the kamui part came after that so yeah Bans getting vaped.
Raikiri hurt kaguya cuz it ignores durability via kamui. You are reaching.
@alextheboss: @worldofruin6: okay I get what yyou mean now, I took prime ban as the current Ban who was facing the DK forgetting its the same ban.
Eitherway, kakashi can bfr him whole or genjutsu him. We all know kakashi is smart and has fought against immortals so he is defo smart enough to attempt what I stated to win.
@alextheboss: @worldofruin6: okay I get what yyou mean now, I took prime ban as the current Ban who was facing the DK forgetting its the same ban.
Eitherway, kakashi can bfr him whole or genjutsu him. We all know kakashi is smart and has fought against immortals so he is defo smart enough to attempt what I stated to win.
kakashi can't bfr him in this fight its win by death or ko.
@uchihaghost: As OP states, bfr is not an option, so genjustu is Kakashi's only chance at victory. Genjustu GG is obviously possible, but he can't use it if he can't see his opponent and it's possible that Ban could just resist it when it's been stated twice now that characters in NnT resist TP via pure willpower(spirit). Much weaker characters such as Gowther, Escanor, Dreyfus, and Merlin have all shown basic TP resistance.
The only TP that has caught powerful characters in NnT was original Gowther's which actually completely changed the memories of characters more powerful than himself for thousands of years, some of which have TP resistance feats like Merlin.
Kakashi's basic genjustu shouldn't be a problem tbh. It would take the higher tier genjustu to down Ban imo.
Kakashi solos the verse. Get this mismatch off here.
also 'Prime' Ban doesn't exist. If anything Post-purgatory Ban is 'prime' Ban which means he isn't immortal so why are we arguing that Ban is immortal here?
Ban wins here.Ban can simply snatch kakaahi speed and strenght and blitz and one shot him. Even if kakashi try to blitz ban it would be pointless, because he is immortal at his prime. I can only see Kakashi winning by KO if he survive enough time to exhaust ban. If it was DMS Kakashi vs Ban with no immortality Kakashi would've won in a good fight
@worldofruin6: Genjutsu will indeed work on ban, DMS kakashi has double MS powered by rikudou chakra which makes his genjutsu more potent, Ban isn't resisting even 3 tomoe sharingan genjutsu when he doesn't have the feats to do so.
Those characters you listed all resisted tp attacks in their own way, dreyfus had a second mind (greyroad), escanor resisted a type of mind manipulation by accepting who he was, it wasn't really like he fought and beat the illusion. He used the illusion to jump start his power, something ban can't do. So either give me feats of ban resisting or he gets oneshot.
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