Kaido vs Byakuya, Ban and Mercphobia

Tbf the Seireitei size argument is a valid one though not something I'm fond of as it's so tiring to debate.

Seireitei's size being "debunked" is your own personal assessment. Not that it would take much to convince you, you're Woodward, someone could go "ahhdjdjduydjdjysjmdjdjjd" and you could consider Seireitei debunked. That being said Mevbi made an argument, you should wait for the counter from faraday before making any conclusions

Well if a 150m object falling at a certain height can annihilate a a landmass claimed to be as large as texas then something is wrong somewhere 🤔

So much for countrylvl kenny not being questionable

@the_lost_cleric:

Yeah it's tiring, which is why I personally scale bleach without the need of their sizes, both Seireitei and Las noches. The 2 major feats that can be gotten from sizes, that's Lanza and Gremmy's meteor can yield the same value even without the size arguments, Gremmy's meteor has K.E and Lanza potency is speaks for itself when its shockwave can pulverize mountain sized pilllars from kilometers apart.

@yray: @yray:

Well if you're going that angle, please ignore that a meteor the size of several mountains was said to achieve that same feat.and the Gerard scan never said it would destroy the entire Seireitei or turn it into a crater, the shockwave from the impact can take out most if not all of the buildings, which would also count as destruction in Toshiro's book.

Kaido three-shots.

Honestly so much foddery.

I can see Byakuya vs Kaido going either way, Merc gets blitz and Ban gets blitzed

^^^

Post 156

Animefreak/Undre gang.

Merc drowns him

@saxz:when its shockwave can pulverize mountain sized pilllars

Pre timeskip franky has a feat of tanking an explosion that can pulverize mountain parts and send same parts flying with its shockwave,so if thats all lanza has to support its Ap then its not really that impressive.

Gerard scan never said it would destroy the entire Seireitei or turn it into a crater, the shockwave from the impact an take out most of not all of the buildings, which would also count as destruction in Toshiro's book.

The explanation is as clear as day

He wasn't trying to say it would partially destroy seireitei when he used the word annihilate.

@yray:

I wasn't really comparing that explosion to Franky, I have no reason to, that post wasn't directed at you, infact. However comparing Lanza to vegapunk's explosion is an atrocity I won't dignify with a counter, except you're actually serious.

Again, if you're going to use that to determine the size, wouldn't it be pretentious for you not to do the same with the meteor? I see you ignored that. Destroying all the structures in Seireitei would count as annihilation at least on Toshiro's part, which is what the shockwave from the impact would be capable of

Secondly I didn't want to spoil the CAV as this is an ongoing argument, but that scan can be easily debunked. The calc was made using Gerard's current size. But that's rendered inaccurate by Toshiro saying, "if we make him bigger," which means Toshiro was talking about when Gerard eventually becomes way bigger, probably bigger than the city and falls off.

The same scan debunks this, you don't even have to look far, so this argument never had any legs to run on.

If you're seriously basing that off of Mevbi's lack of knowledge and comprehension of reading calcs then that's a massive lol. You can continue to live this fantasy until I drop my post.

Anyway, yes, a "150m object following at a certain height canannihilate a landmass that is claimed to be nearTexas, and it's not wrong at all if you actually knew what you were talking about in terms of how fast these characters move + how terminal velocity works.

Gremmy's meteor size being that of several mountains?

The black figure in the middle is Kenpachi, a human. The meteor is large building sized at most so there's that...

And no, Toshiro wasn't saying Gerard would destroy Seireitei if they only made him bigger. He clearly states "If a guy of his mass falls from this heigh that alone would annihilate Seireitei"

@mevbi said:

Gremmy's meteor size being that of several mountains?

The black figure in the middle is Kenpachi, a human. The meteor is large building sized at most so there's that...

That meteor is 1/3 the size of the seireitei and if you are calling it large building sized would be imply the seireitei is town sized???

@yungbaby said:

@mevbi said:

Gremmy's meteor size being that of several mountains?

The black figure in the middle is Kenpachi, a human. The meteor is large building sized at most so there's that...

That meteor is 1/3 the size of the seireitei and if you are calling it large building sized would be imply the seireitei is town sized???

Yes, I am implying that.

@mevbi: interesting.

@mevbi said:

@yungbaby said:

@mevbi said:

Gremmy's meteor size being that of several mountains?

The black figure in the middle is Kenpachi, a human. The meteor is large building sized at most so there's that...

That meteor is 1/3 the size of the seireitei and if you are calling it large building sized would be imply the seireitei is town sized???

Yes, I am implying that.

that is baby meteor

Well im not picking any sides [because I don't care that much for whatever size it is]and I don't want to do anything more to interfere with the ongoing cav.

But from what I've seen from this Seireitei controversial size argument

There's at least as much evidence supporting city sized Seireitei as that of country sized Seireitei..if this wasn't the case it wouldn't sill be argued till this day so it all depends on which you want to believe.

City sized Seireitei has the manga Visuals and statements to support it being consistent especially Visuals/scans.

All country sized Seireitei has supporting it is statements..nothing from the manga Visually supports this claim [I've not seen one panel where Seireitei is drawn to be as big as an actual country]

So you can choose to believe a claim with scans and statements supporting it or another with just statements to support it

I'll leave it at that.

@mevbi: And you crop the upper part of the scan why??? Largely dishonest. Toshiro was obviously talking about when he gets bigger, otherwise there was no need of the first part of that statement. You're ignoring the context that caused Toshiro's worry in the first place.

Follow the conversation and don't take things out of context

Toshiro : what do you think will happen if we make him any bigger and he falls down (Gerard is big, but at his current size he could literally flip around that city and not fall of the edge)

Kenpachi : what about it ( it being the incident Toshiro just referenced),I 'll fall with him and cut him up)

Toshiro : (continues his warning about the same incident): if a Guy of his mass falls. From this high, that alone will Annihilate Seireitei. (This wasn't a fresh warning by any means it refers to the incident Toshiro referenced before ).

Why would uld he suddenly start talking about the current Gerard,when he made a point of the incident of him getting bigger and falling off. Take a look at that context and that tells you everything.

His intent is to stop Kenpachi from attacking current Gerard so he wouldn't get any bigger not to stop current Gerard from falling

• , he is Trying to stop Kenpachi from attacking, why?.
• Because Gerard would get bigger and fall off
• There's no way he is talking about current Gerard, because Gerard is in the middle of the city and can't fall off even if he tried.

But mevbi Even you have to realize that the kenpachi/meteor scan, has its point of view from below kenpachi ,which would make Kenpachi appear bigger, because perspective. Why would you even make that argument, next time hold your hand to the moon and assume your hand is bigger than the moon.

@saxz said:

@mevbi: And you crop the upper part of the scan why??? Largely dishonest. Toshiro was obviously talking about when he gets bigger, otherwise there was no need of the first part of that statement. You're ignoring the context that caused Toshiro's worry in the first place.

Follow the conversation and don't take things out of context

Toshiro : what do you think will happen if we make him any bigger and he falls down (Gerard is big, but at his current size he could literally flip around that city and not fall of the edge)

Kenpachi : what about it ( it being the incident Toshiro just referenced),I 'll fall with him and cut him up)

Toshiro : (continues his warning about the same incident): if a Guy of his mass falls. From this high, that alone will Annihilate Seireitei. (This wasn't a fresh warning by any means it refers to the incident Toshiro referenced before ).

Why would uld he suddenly start talking about the current Gerard,when he made a point of the incident of him getting bigger and falling off. Take a look at that context and that tells you everything.

His intent is to stop Kenpachi from attacking current Gerard so he wouldn't get any bigger not to stop current Gerard from falling

• , he is Trying to stop Kenpachi from attacking, why?.
• Because Gerard would get bigger and fall off
• There's no way he is talking about current Gerard, because Gerard is in the middle of the city and can't fall off even if he tried.

This is why your debatting skills are bad, you've said a lot of headcanon without any proof, when toshiro re-confirms that he refers to gerard with that size, in this scene.

Also...

Talking about gerard´s shield

@yray:

All country sized Seireitei has supporting it is statements..nothing from the manga Visually supports this claim [I've not seen one panel where Seireitei is drawn to be as big as an actual country

The thing is kubo is known to be extremely lazy with background. Even the Visuals that you say supports it show me 3 consistent scans that draws Seireitei the same size, sometimes it is drawn city block size and many of its structure are missing, which is why the statement are more consistent.

As for scan that shows Seireitei as big as an actual country, here goes,

you can see Seireitei extend well beyond the horizon, from a really high point of view and this is taken close to the center. Now when I say country sized, I don't mean the size of America or Turkey , nope I am talking about large island countries like Iceland

@saxz:

Lol reconfirmed what exactly.

That gerard falling with that size would destroy the sereitei.

But gerard with that size cant destroy something thats is supposedly to be "country sized"

@omnihater:

he didn't confirm anything, where's the statement in that scan saying entire Seireitei is about to be destroyed. Toshiro made an attempt to stop everything from falling, from his shields to random buildings, if you know how K.E impacts work, you would know that Gerrard falling from such height non stop would notably damage Seireitei and the shockwave it would send out will do the rest of the job. Watch a meteor video.

@saxz:

he didn't confirm anything, where's the statement in that scan saying entire Seireitei is about to be destroyed.

He said it a chapter ago, his worried face says it all, I don't want to hear your excuses and lies anymore, that is only you are.

@saxz said:

@yray:

All country sized Seireitei has supporting it is statements..nothing from the manga Visually supports this claim [I've not seen one panel where Seireitei is drawn to be as big as an actual country

The thing is kubo is known to be extremely lazy with background. Even the Visuals that you say supports it show me 3 consistent scans that draws Seireitei the same size, sometimes it is drawn city block size and many of its structure are missing, which is why the statement are more consistent.

As for scan that shows Seireitei as big as an actual country, here goes,

you can see Seireitei extend well beyond the horizon, from a really high point of view and this is taken close to the center. Now when I say country sized, I don't mean the size of America or Turkey , nope I am talking about large island countries like Iceland

Good thing you said large island sized because franky all I see is island+ sized there ..and is that picture not anime only?

@yray:

Seireitei is large island to small country, it's not as big as your average country but it's not that smaller either, and true that picture is anime only but it's way more reliable than any of kubo's scans as they(anime team) know what they are doing with the background and more consistent with the size, I'll take their interpretation over some fanboys.

Secondly that picture is not from just any anime, I think its from memories of nobody, the canon movie, but don't quote me on that. I know I had a screenshot of Seireitei from memories of nobody saved somewhere, I am not 100% sure if that's it. But if you really want that canon screenshot, I could take the time to look for it.

@saxz: This:

Ain't no country mate.

@exauce: What are you scaling that too, to say it's not a country? You could zoom out on England, and it would show the overall surface as it does here. Nothing dictates it's, not a "country" or whatever you believe.

@highmantra_x0sp: The buildings.

Lol. Any of them solos here. Also Mercy still stomps entire OP when we scaled with Aldoron.

@exauce: So your entire belief is on "buildings" despite contradictory evidence. Using that logic from the pictures, the sereiteis multi-building in height. Scan failed to show the horizon, the entire sereitei, Sokyoku hill is massive in height, on the lower left side we can see a mountain and compare it to the height of the sereitei, etc.

What he said a chapter ago "if he got bigger" (why are you ignoring that) And Gerard hasn't gotten any bigger. I don't know what you mean but worried face is not proof of anything, it's not like Seireitei would be unscathed if Gerard falls at that current size, so of course he's worried. you just can't ignore the statement that specifically referenced him getting bigger in order to annihilate Seireitei it was put there for a reason. I know " scans" and "proof" are not your thing, but if you don't have a scan that talks about Gerard annihilating Seireitei At his current size " Then you don't have an argument.

@exauce:

From that scan and perspective? No it ain't mate, I can do you one better and bring a large building sized Seireitei scan. This is something that's supposed to contain massive forest and several city blocks and even some mountains and a small sea. I can also bring scans that would make you feel you can fit 20 of that into Seireitei.

This argument isn't new, you can keep using that or you can acknowledge the very known fact that Kubo is lazy with backgrounds and use the consistent statement of sizes he regularly gives. I don't know why this is so hard, it's popularly known that when it comes to sizes word of author > inconsistent visuals.

Yea, you want it to be in the clouds? and there is no contradictory evidence from anything. Yea I don'tsee why not. Then either there is no horizon or the scan drawn from far away, What u mean by "massive in height" building can also be massive in Height Lol, I don't see no mountain in the scan Lol.

It ain't small country in size, get over it.

@saxz:

From that scan and perspective? No it ain't mate, I can do you one better and bring a large building sized Seireitei scan. This is something that's supposed to contain massive forest and several city blocks and even some mountains and a small sea. I can also bring scans that would make you feel you can fit 20 of that into Seireitei.

Yep it ain't, go ahead be guest. I don't recall any forest inside Seiretei, a city blocks sure of course, I also don't recall mountains in there (maybe hills) but not mountain, or sea. Then bring it.

It has to do Manga please since I only take source material interpretation over fanboys and anime (ur own word).

This argument isn't new, you can keep using that or you can acknowledge the very known fact that Kubo is lazy with backgrounds and use the consistent statement of sizes he regularly gives. I don't know why this is so hard, it's popularly known that when it comes to sizes word of author > inconsistent visuals.

was it supposed to be new? as I said before if there scan u want to show me be my guest cuz I'm using what I see not what I think I see. Of course but nowhere did He give any size of the place.

@exauce:

1. In the novel, it's confirmed the Sereitei has mountainous terrain and forests.

“Uncle gave us cloth to hide our faces, so we wore that and walked through Rukongai for several days……we were then concealed inside a wooden box and loaded onto a cart before a huge gate.”

“We were taken in swiftly without being exposed but, we were told we couldn’t be unloaded in a place where there were people watching, so we went to uncle’s delivery destination! It was a very big workshop called 'Omaeda Jewels’.”

“The Omaedas’ company buy gems from our werewolf clan……!“

'Omaeda Jewels’ is one of soul society’s Jewelers run by the Omaeda clan. The second division’s vice captain Omaeda Marechiyo serves as the manager of the precious metals department; it was a familiar company Iba thought, but he’s never heard of there being any relation to the werewolf clan before.

"To start with, we thought we should meet Tetsu san, we asked uncle about the location of the 7th division. In order to not be discovered by people, we only traveled at night time, we passed through mountainous terrain and forests……on the night of the third day, in the middle of the forest we detected the scent of a fellow wolf……!”

1. Mountain
2. Sokyoku hill is massive. Refer to the SS arc or read Chapters 97-113.
3. Infamous Scan. 40 days to walk around the entire Sereitei.
4. Japan has 475 Districts whilst the Sereitei has over 600

Also, of course, there's no horizon. It's from a picture that's taken in the outside of the Sereitei, not an aerial view. It's like looking straight at a house and trying to figure its dimensions, and then seeing its partial dimension from an aerial view and learning it extends to the horizon.

@saxz:

No, your convenient analysis is embarrassing, Toshiro clearly speaks of his current size and way worse if Gerard gets bigger, what he tells to Kenpachi, is to stop attacking him because he will get bigger and he does not know what will happen if someone with that mass falls down.

Then he says that someone with gerard's actual size falling from where they are would destroy the sereitei

This is later confirmed by Toshiro's expression upon seeing that Gerard is about to fall, because that means the destruction of the sereitei.

Is not that hard, or are you going to keep in denial as always?

@iamplanet said:

@mevbi said:

@yungbaby said:

@mevbi said:

Gremmy's meteor size being that of several mountains?

The black figure in the middle is Kenpachi, a human. The meteor is large building sized at most so there's that...

That meteor is 1/3 the size of the seireitei and if you are calling it large building sized would be imply the seireitei is town sized???

Yes, I am implying that.

that is baby meteor

even pre-time skip luffy can oneshot this

@iamplanet said:

@iamplanet said:

@mevbi said:

@yungbaby said:

@mevbi said:

Gremmy's meteor size being that of several mountains?

The black figure in the middle is Kenpachi, a human. The meteor is large building sized at most so there's that...

That meteor is 1/3 the size of the seireitei and if you are calling it large building sized would be imply the seireitei is town sized???

Yes, I am implying that.

that is baby meteor

even pre-time skip luffy can oneshot this

Interesting.

That's a new one bro. Care to explain how you've come to this conclusion?

@highmantra_x0sp:

1. In the novel, it's confirmed the Sereitei has mountainous terrain and forests.

I have my doubt but sure, I don't mind some mountains in the place.

1. Mountain

Bruh that "mountain" is smaller than trees Lol, it either a hill or just a landscape.

1. Sokyoku hill is massive. Refer to the SS arc or read Chapters 97-113.

How massive, The biggest hill in the world only goes high up 609 m.

1. Infamous Scan. 40 days to walk around the entire Sereitei.

Bruh you a ten day walk?

1. Japan has 475 Districts whilst the Sereitei has over 600

The size of the district is also a thing.

Also, of course, there's no horizon. It's from a picture that's taken in the outside of the Sereitei, not an aerial view. It's like looking straight at a house and trying to figure its dimensions, and then seeing its partial dimension from an aerial view and learning it extends to the horizon.

I can't seem to find anything to say about this Lol.

@exauce: Wait, you think kaido can actually win this? Lol.

@the_amongus: I thought I was pretty clear about that.

@saxz: Okay then, following that logic you have proof Toshiro would know exactly how much Gerard's height and weight would increase if he's cut an unspecified amount of times, I presume? Of course, you don't have. And as others have pointed out Toshiro was worried about Gerard falling off even before he made his statement. You're arguing from disbelief.

And Kenpachi was right next to the meteor, therefore he shouldn't have even been visible if it was the size of multiple mountains.

I have my doubt but sure, I don't mind some mountains in the place.

Mountainous terrain throughout a small part and I have a backup scan of mountainous terrain.

Bruh that "mountain" is smaller than trees Lol, it either a hill or just a landscape.

Is that some way of debunking something? It's funny how trees don't have a set height. We can also assume that the trees are closer than the mountains which adds to the illusion of it being larger than a mountain. Spatial awareness.

How massive, The biggest hill in the world only goes high up 609 m.

Don't compare Sokyoku hill to an obese tree. It's not a decided height just because it's named hill. I could claim all of Ichigo's Getusugas are moon level because Getsuga Tenshou means " 月牙天衝, Moon Fang Heaven-Piercer". Name in fiction doesn't always illustrate size. Same with the term worlds. That doesn't limit itself to planetary in size. Vatican city is a country but it's small. It's 109 acres.

Bruh you a ten day walk?

It states a Ten-Day walk to the other gate. They are at Jidabos gate. Each Gate is a 10-day walk. We have 4 gates in total. You can do the math 🤷🏾‍♂️

The size of the district is also a thing.

True but we can use 2 methods. Averaging size by average or averaging size by smallest.

• Mean average size of Japan's Districts and there you go. It's surely relative to Japan in size at the least.
• I did something somewhat random. I picked the Akita Prefecture and divided it's size by 6 since it has 6 districts. That gave me 1939.59 square miles. Times 600 = 1163754 square miles. Assuming the districts are constant in size which makes it relative to India in size.

  India

  3,287,263 (1,269,219)

  2,973,190 (1,147,960)

Yep it ain't, go ahead be guest. I don't recall any forest inside Seiretei, a city blocks sure of course, I also don't recall mountains in there (maybe hills) but not mountain, or sea. Then bring it.

Mountains is from a novel statement(Canon material) but there were somewhat a scan of mountains in Seireitei in the manga(canon material) but because Kubo is lazy with backgrounds, you can make the argument its outside Seireitei.

Forest, like the large forest were youruichi and soifon had their first fight.?? It's kinda popular. You might miss this because it's usually drawn as a black smudge near Sogyouku hill,if at all, yep lazy background drawing. I don't blame you for missing it.

Sea is actually from Royal Palace, equivalent with Seireitei. And I said small sea.

It has to do Manga please since I only take source material interpretation over fanboys and anime (urown word).

Yeah and don't you forget it.

was it supposed to be new? as I said before if there scan u want to show me be my guest cuz I'm using what I see not what I think I see.

I showed someone a Scan above check it out. But just in case you're going to judge everything from visual acuity, I respect your standard. And I hope you keep it up, even when someone decides to scale Onigashiima size off thousand sunny.

Of course but nowhere did He give any size of the place.

40 days walking statement exist. I believe he wouldn't give that for no reason. There's Toshiro releasing a 7.3 miles attack, and not even bothering the next division, there are 13 divisions in Seireitei. There's a direct 200 spirit miles in the movie fade to black, it's not canon, but Kubo had a hand in its preparation so I think something like Seireitei's size wouldn't escape him and like it or not the anime team are probably more closer to Kubo than us, so when in doubt I'll think I'll follow their statement of size over fanboys ramblings.

@exauce:

Forgot to tag you, post 195